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"Fake news alert: Luton is of course conveniently close to Luton Airport.🤦" Is the airport woke? | |||
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"Fake news alert: Luton is of course conveniently close to Luton Airport.🤦 Is the airport woke?" no just the goverment | |||
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"Fake news alert: Luton is of course conveniently close to Luton Airport.🤦 Is the airport woke?no just the goverment " Which definition of woke are we on now? The OP suggests at the moment it means to do something to tackle climate change. Which would indicate the government are barely woke. | |||
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"It is possible to run a car on Hydrogen and Oxygen ie elements of water. Zero emissions. So when the oil runs out or stopped used for transport there is an alternative to ev's. Ev's are a waist of time." Are you suggesting steam engines  | |||
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"It is possible to run a car on Hydrogen and Oxygen ie elements of water. Zero emissions. So when the oil runs out or stopped used for transport there is an alternative to ev's. Ev's are a waist of time." Yes it is but for years it was unsupported due to the fossil fuel industry. | |||
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"Didn't Gordon Brown tell everyone to buy diesel cars the last time Labour were in Govt ?" And when people did, he put the price up. | |||
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"Didn't Gordon Brown tell everyone to buy diesel cars the last time Labour were in Govt ?" Oh yes. I remember that, "the dash for diesel". In those days they were telling us that diesel was less harmful to the environment than petrol. Seems to have been conveniently forgotten. | |||
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"Speaking as a petrol head, the sound of an ev is enough to put me off buying one even if they were cheap. Sounds like a wet fart." With you on that one.  | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap." So you think that if Reform win the 2029 elections in a first past the post system they will change the system to proportional representation. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap." "ultra pc liberal types" 
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. So you think that if Reform win the 2029 elections in a first past the post system they will change the system to proportional representation. "Yes, it is one of there major policies. Part of the reason they are called Reform is because they believe that the UK need political reform. An end to the LibLabCon can only be permanently implemented with an end to fptp. It’s time is long overdue. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
"If you can ague with that, then please do… | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
If you can ague with that, then please do…"Honestly, arguing with people who claim the moon is made of cheese is going to be fruitless. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
If you can ague with that, then please do…
Honestly, arguing with people who claim the moon is made of cheese is going to be fruitless."In other words, you have got nothing. No change there then. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. So you think that if Reform win the 2029 elections in a first past the post system they will change the system to proportional representation.
Yes, it is one of there major policies. Part of the reason they are called Reform is because they believe that the UK need political reform. An end to the LibLabCon can only be permanently implemented with an end to fptp. It’s time is long overdue."I hardly think any political party will inflict electoral harm on themselves. They are all the same that’s why we have the current system. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
If you can ague with that, then please do…
Honestly, arguing with people who claim the moon is made of cheese is going to be fruitless.
In other words, you have got nothing. No change there then."Nope, feel free to continue your beliefs. But when they're so outlandish and detached from reality. Can still point that out. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. So you think that if Reform win the 2029 elections in a first past the post system they will change the system to proportional representation.
Yes, it is one of there major policies. Part of the reason they are called Reform is because they believe that the UK need political reform. An end to the LibLabCon can only be permanently implemented with an end to fptp. It’s time is long overdue.
I hardly think any political party will inflict electoral harm on themselves. They are all the same that’s why we have the current system.
"The last Tory government did inflict harm upon themselves with blatant dishonesty, and Labour have already done the same with blatant disregard for the truth. The current system is on borrowed time. Because it is showing itself to be totally corrupt. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
If you can ague with that, then please do…
Honestly, arguing with people who claim the moon is made of cheese is going to be fruitless.
In other words, you have got nothing. No change there then.
Nope, feel free to continue your beliefs. But when they're so outlandish and detached from reality. Can still point that out. "So the belief that Labour are ultra pc liberals is ‘outlandish?’ Akin to believing that the ‘moon is made out of cheese?’ Nah, you are going to have to expand upon those comments. Sorry and all that… | |||
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"Because it is showing itself to be totally corrupt." I agree with this. But then it's even more confusing why you're a Reform party enthusiast. They accepted millions in donations from fossil fuel investors. They're just the Tories on steroids. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
If you can ague with that, then please do…
Honestly, arguing with people who claim the moon is made of cheese is going to be fruitless.
In other words, you have got nothing. No change there then.
Nope, feel free to continue your beliefs. But when they're so outlandish and detached from reality. Can still point that out.
So the belief that Labour are ultra pc liberals is ‘outlandish?’ Akin to believing that the ‘moon is made out of cheese?’ Nah, you are going to have to expand upon those comments. Sorry and all that…"Because they're not pc, they're not ultra pc, and they're partly liberal (they aren't that good on social welfare, and they're average on rights, civil liberties etc). | |||
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"Because it is showing itself to be totally corrupt. I agree with this. But then it's even more confusing why you're a Reform party enthusiast. They accepted millions in donations from fossil fuel investors. They're just the Tories on steroids. " Reform is led by a former member of the Tory party who left when John Major signed the Maastricht Treaty. He has stayed true to his convictions since then. He is a Conservative, but not a Tory in today’s definition. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
If you can ague with that, then please do…
Honestly, arguing with people who claim the moon is made of cheese is going to be fruitless.
In other words, you have got nothing. No change there then.
Nope, feel free to continue your beliefs. But when they're so outlandish and detached from reality. Can still point that out.
So the belief that Labour are ultra pc liberals is ‘outlandish?’ Akin to believing that the ‘moon is made out of cheese?’ Nah, you are going to have to expand upon those comments. Sorry and all that…
Because they're not pc, they're not ultra pc, and they're partly liberal (they aren't that good on social welfare, and they're average on rights, civil liberties etc).
"I use the abbreviation PC (politically correct), because there is so many definitions of the word woke. I believe the two are the same, others don’t. Witch ever way you put it, the Islington mob that call themselves Labour these days are just that. | |||
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"Because it is showing itself to be totally corrupt. I agree with this. But then it's even more confusing why you're a Reform party enthusiast. They accepted millions in donations from fossil fuel investors. They're just the Tories on steroids. Reform is led by a former member of the Tory party who left when John Major signed the Maastricht Treaty. He has stayed true to his convictions since then. He is a Conservative, but not a Tory in today’s definition. " The point I was making is that the Reform party are equally, or even less, interested in running the country for the benefit of the people here than say the Tories, or the current Labour party. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
If you can ague with that, then please do…
Honestly, arguing with people who claim the moon is made of cheese is going to be fruitless.
In other words, you have got nothing. No change there then.
Nope, feel free to continue your beliefs. But when they're so outlandish and detached from reality. Can still point that out.
So the belief that Labour are ultra pc liberals is ‘outlandish?’ Akin to believing that the ‘moon is made out of cheese?’ Nah, you are going to have to expand upon those comments. Sorry and all that…
Because they're not pc, they're not ultra pc, and they're partly liberal (they aren't that good on social welfare, and they're average on rights, civil liberties etc).
I use the abbreviation PC (politically correct), because there is so many definitions of the word woke. I believe the two are the same, others don’t. Witch ever way you put it, the Islington mob that call themselves Labour these days are just that."Firstly I don't see them being especially politically correct, and if they were, and they were less overly offensive to minority groups, would that be a bad thing? "Woke" is just a complete joke word on these forums. Everyone has their own personal definition. | |||
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"The current system of FPTP will never change, because it works for those it keeps in power .. No matter what anyone says in order to dupe voters again .." I agree that it works for those it keeps in power. My argument is that it didn’t work for the people of this country. We are constantly being lied to be the so called ‘big three.’ They are the ones always attempting, and always seemingly able to, dupe us all. Over and over, like a stuck record. | |||
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"The current system of FPTP will never change, because it works for those it keeps in power .. No matter what anyone says in order to dupe voters again .. I agree that it works for those it keeps in power. My argument is that it didn’t work for the people of this country. We are constantly being lied to be the so called ‘big three.’ They are the ones always attempting, and always seemingly able to, dupe us all. Over and over, like a stuck record." It's not designed to work for the people, it's there to give a semblance of accountability to the public if those in power when in reality the system is bent and in the back pockets of newspapers owners and big corporations with the financial clout to lobby for what they want.. Again if you think anyone else would do it differently that's fine that's your view but if you think they aren't the same as the ones they seek to replace then that's naive.. | |||
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"Because it is showing itself to be totally corrupt. I agree with this. But then it's even more confusing why you're a Reform party enthusiast. They accepted millions in donations from fossil fuel investors. They're just the Tories on steroids. Reform is led by a former member of the Tory party who left when John Major signed the Maastricht Treaty. He has stayed true to his convictions since then. He is a Conservative, but not a Tory in today’s definition. The point I was making is that the Reform party are equally, or even less, interested in running the country for the benefit of the people here than say the Tories, or the current Labour party. " You are always ‘making the point’ but never with any kind of explanation. I believe that Farage will make an excellent prime minister, much like Trump is going to be a great President in the USA. I look forward to the small boats being turned away, the £20,000 income tax allowance, and of course the advent of proportional representation in the UK. See, that is how you can start to explain yourself… | |||
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"The current system of FPTP will never change, because it works for those it keeps in power .. No matter what anyone says in order to dupe voters again .. I agree that it works for those it keeps in power. My argument is that it didn’t work for the people of this country. We are constantly being lied to be the so called ‘big three.’ They are the ones always attempting, and always seemingly able to, dupe us all. Over and over, like a stuck record. It's not designed to work for the people, it's there to give a semblance of accountability to the public if those in power when in reality the system is bent and in the back pockets of newspapers owners and big corporations with the financial clout to lobby for what they want.. Again if you think anyone else would do it differently that's fine that's your view but if you think they aren't the same as the ones they seek to replace then that's naive.." As much as you might think me naive, I believe that Reform UK would be like a new dawn to the UK. PR would have to be one round only, so that we don’t have to go down the same road as France or Germany. As soon as they get a candidate in my ward, I will continually vote for them. | |||
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"The current system of FPTP will never change, because it works for those it keeps in power .. No matter what anyone says in order to dupe voters again .. I agree that it works for those it keeps in power. My argument is that it didn’t work for the people of this country. We are constantly being lied to be the so called ‘big three.’ They are the ones always attempting, and always seemingly able to, dupe us all. Over and over, like a stuck record. It's not designed to work for the people, it's there to give a semblance of accountability to the public if those in power when in reality the system is bent and in the back pockets of newspapers owners and big corporations with the financial clout to lobby for what they want.. Again if you think anyone else would do it differently that's fine that's your view but if you think they aren't the same as the ones they seek to replace then that's naive.. As much as you might think me naive, I believe that Reform UK would be like a new dawn to the UK. PR would have to be one round only, so that we don’t have to go down the same road as France or Germany. As soon as they get a candidate in my ward, I will continually vote for them. " It's good to have faith.. | |||
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"Because it is showing itself to be totally corrupt. I agree with this. But then it's even more confusing why you're a Reform party enthusiast. They accepted millions in donations from fossil fuel investors. They're just the Tories on steroids. Reform is led by a former member of the Tory party who left when John Major signed the Maastricht Treaty. He has stayed true to his convictions since then. He is a Conservative, but not a Tory in today’s definition. The point I was making is that the Reform party are equally, or even less, interested in running the country for the benefit of the people here than say the Tories, or the current Labour party. You are always ‘making the point’ but never with any kind of explanation. " I mean, there was an explanation, and an example. It's right there. " I believe that Farage will make an excellent prime minister, much like Trump is going to be a great President in the USA. " Back to moon cheese. It really is as ridiculous to that that Trump is going to be excellent, he was a fucking disaster last time. In every category. And Farage is pretty open about not giving a fuck about taking the job seriously. He spends more time doing more jobs, making more money than any other sitting MP. He doesn't give a shit. " I look forward to the small boats being turned away, the £20,000 income tax allowance, and of course the advent of proportional representation in the UK. See, that is how you can start to explain yourself…" Yeah, I'm also looking forward to all these amazing things Farage is going to pull out of his arse, just like all the Brexit benefits he promised. | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap." I really want to agree with you but sorry I can't. While, in theory at least, PR seems to be the more democratic option. In reality you finish up with backroom deals (usually dirty) where minor party's hold much more sway than their vote share warrants. One look at the dogs breakfast governments in Germany and Spain is all the evidence you need. FPTP is far from perfect and in the last election is was not the result I would have wanted, but I still think it is the "least worst" option. | |||
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"Global EV sales are reported to be falling ZEM obsession in uk is another problem. Hard up Uk households can’t afford overpriced ev’s with the tax incentives removed by the tories And the £300m plug-in car grant scheme to new orders back in 2022 was cancelled the Department for Transport said. The main industry body said the move will leave the UK as the only big European country without any incentives for electric cars Reap what u sow " Thank you for addressing the subject of the thread | |||
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"There you are. Anti Trump, anti Farage, and most of all anti BREXIT, the best thing ever to happen in British politics. " You see realistic view of Trump as "anti-Trump". And a realistic view of Brexit as "anti-Brexit". " Before you ask, we will not see the benefits of BREXIT, until we get a party in who actually believes in it. But the French and Germans are doing no better than we are right now, although I’m certain that there will be links on the internet that would ‘prove’ me totally and utterly wrong, lol." I don't need to ask where the non-existent benefits are. As you mentioned, there are none. Meanwhile the list of problems it causes is as long as your arm. Saying it's the best "best thing ever to happen in British politics" is just the same as claiming the moon is made of cheese. It's literally not, we know it's not, we can measure it's not, and yet some people still believe in it. | |||
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"Just to go on from above. Think about this. You have an election with no clear majority. Labour are the largest party but cannot form a government without say the SNP. To get the deal done you end up with Scottish nationalists in ministerial jobs governing England. Recipe for chaos." I lived in countries with versions of PR. And the governments were no more or less chaotic, and no more or less adept at achieving things. | |||
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"Just to go on from above. Think about this. You have an election with no clear majority. Labour are the largest party but cannot form a government without say the SNP. To get the deal done you end up with Scottish nationalists in ministerial jobs governing England. Recipe for chaos. I lived in countries with versions of PR. And the governments were no more or less chaotic, and no more or less adept at achieving things. " Hmmmm. But maybe better the devil you know. | |||
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"Just to go on from above. Think about this. You have an election with no clear majority. Labour are the largest party but cannot form a government without say the SNP. To get the deal done you end up with Scottish nationalists in ministerial jobs governing England. Recipe for chaos. I lived in countries with versions of PR. And the governments were no more or less chaotic, and no more or less adept at achieving things. Hmmmm. But maybe better the devil you know." Only based on my experiences, but I'm fairly indifferent to PR. | |||
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"Just to go on from above. Think about this. You have an election with no clear majority. Labour are the largest party but cannot form a government without say the SNP. To get the deal done you end up with Scottish nationalists in ministerial jobs governing England. Recipe for chaos. I lived in countries with versions of PR. And the governments were no more or less chaotic, and no more or less adept at achieving things. " Can you please stop derailing these threads, thank you. | |||
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"Just to go on from above. Think about this. You have an election with no clear majority. Labour are the largest party but cannot form a government without say the SNP. To get the deal done you end up with Scottish nationalists in ministerial jobs governing England. Recipe for chaos. I lived in countries with versions of PR. And the governments were no more or less chaotic, and no more or less adept at achieving things. Can you please stop derailing these threads, thank you." I was responding to someone else's point. But I appreciate the wokeness of your request. Maybe you could layout the rules for who can say what in which thread? | |||
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"Vauxhall has announced 1100 job losses with the closure of its plant in Luton, an English Town known for its convenient proximity to Stansted Airport. The owners have partly blamed the rules on EV production and other manufacturers such as Ford and Nissan have given similar warnings. Should the EV targets be scrapped and we let the market decide, or should the Govt press on with the green woke agenda and destroy what's left of the British car industry? 🤷♂️ " Allow the market to decide with their wallets and personal consciences. This means no trade tariffs in either direction between the UK and other countries. It's supposed to be a Global Market after all. | |||
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"Tory leader Kemi Badenoch is blaming the Vauxhall job losses on the electric vehicle mandate introduced by Tory business secretary Kemi Badenoch. I wonder if the two of them are related?" | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
If you can ague with that, then please do…
Honestly, arguing with people who claim the moon is made of cheese is going to be fruitless.
In other words, you have got nothing. No change there then.
Nope, feel free to continue your beliefs. But when they're so outlandish and detached from reality. Can still point that out.
So the belief that Labour are ultra pc liberals is ‘outlandish?’ Akin to believing that the ‘moon is made out of cheese?’ Nah, you are going to have to expand upon those comments. Sorry and all that…
Because they're not pc, they're not ultra pc, and they're partly liberal (they aren't that good on social welfare, and they're average on rights, civil liberties etc).
I use the abbreviation PC (politically correct), because there is so many definitions of the word woke. I believe the two are the same, others don’t. Witch ever way you put it, the Islington mob that call themselves Labour these days are just that.
Firstly I don't see them being especially politically correct, and if they were, and they were less overly offensive to minority groups, would that be a bad thing?
"Woke" is just a complete joke word on these forums. Everyone has their own personal definition. "exactly woke is a complete joke finally we agree | |||
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"Just to go on from above. Think about this. You have an election with no clear majority. Labour are the largest party but cannot form a government without say the SNP. To get the deal done you end up with Scottish nationalists in ministerial jobs governing England. Recipe for chaos. I lived in countries with versions of PR. And the governments were no more or less chaotic, and no more or less adept at achieving things. Can you please stop derailing these threads, thank you. I was responding to someone else's point. But I appreciate the wokeness of your request. Maybe you could layout the rules for who can say what in which thread? " From Forum Rules: Deliberate or malicious disruption of the forum. If you deliberately or maliciously try to interrupt everyone else's enjoyment of the forums, for example by trying to fill up the forum with your own content (just one example), it's not fair and we'll take action. | |||
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"Just to go on from above. Think about this. You have an election with no clear majority. Labour are the largest party but cannot form a government without say the SNP. To get the deal done you end up with Scottish nationalists in ministerial jobs governing England. Recipe for chaos. I lived in countries with versions of PR. And the governments were no more or less chaotic, and no more or less adept at achieving things. Can you please stop derailing these threads, thank you. I was responding to someone else's point. But I appreciate the wokeness of your request. Maybe you could layout the rules for who can say what in which thread? From Forum Rules: Deliberate or malicious disruption of the forum. If you deliberately or maliciously try to interrupt everyone else's enjoyment of the forums, for example by trying to fill up the forum with your own content (just one example), it's not fair and we'll take action." Does replying to someone else's point fall under this category? | |||
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"Labour has not been the party of the working class for a long time. Kinnock was probably the last chance they had. What we have had since, is a series of ultra pc liberal types, who don’t give a flying fuck for working people. The Tories can make themselves look like a respectable alternative, until of course, they get elected. There will be no political fairness in the UK, until of course, we get proportional representation. YES we will get hung parliaments. But if we can avoid political alliances, it will make all the parties competitive, not just at election times. I’m still hopeful for Reform 2029, and if it happens then we will get PR. The stalemate has to be broken. The parliamentary game of musical chairs has to stop. Only radical change can put a stop to all this, and the British public will need to be brave, asap. "ultra pc liberal types"
If you can ague with that, then please do…
Honestly, arguing with people who claim the moon is made of cheese is going to be fruitless.
In other words, you have got nothing. No change there then.
Nope, feel free to continue your beliefs. But when they're so outlandish and detached from reality. Can still point that out.
So the belief that Labour are ultra pc liberals is ‘outlandish?’ Akin to believing that the ‘moon is made out of cheese?’ Nah, you are going to have to expand upon those comments. Sorry and all that…
Because they're not pc, they're not ultra pc, and they're partly liberal (they aren't that good on social welfare, and they're average on rights, civil liberties etc).
I use the abbreviation PC (politically correct), because there is so many definitions of the word woke. I believe the two are the same, others don’t. Witch ever way you put it, the Islington mob that call themselves Labour these days are just that.
Firstly I don't see them being especially politically correct, and if they were, and they were less overly offensive to minority groups, would that be a bad thing?
"Woke" is just a complete joke word on these forums. Everyone has their own personal definition. exactly woke is a complete joke finally we agree "
Especially the versions people use on here. | |||
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"Speaking as a petrol head, the sound of an ev is enough to put me off buying one even if they were cheap. Sounds like a wet fart." Plus so quiet, 3 pinched down my road in a week | |||
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"Some great points, thanks. One thing I don't think was mentioned is that EVs are only as green as the electricity they use, which in most cases is not that green. Also if the demand for EV ever got close to current petrol/diesel usage this would place massive new demand on the National Grid, much of which would be filled by fossil fuels." Read 43% of uk electricity is from renewable sources. Odds are low charging from grid is from renewable. | |||
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"Driven my 2006 Ford through flood water, bit of steam, worked fine. Try that in an electric car. You can disable an ev with an emp generator, and your locked in when the car malfunctions. " Actually... Any modern EV should generally perform as well as, if not better than, an ICE, in water. An EMP will do as much damage to a modern ICE as an electric car. All modern cars have multiple ECUs, the failure of which will prevent a car from operating. | |||
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"Some great points, thanks. One thing I don't think was mentioned is that EVs are only as green as the electricity they use, which in most cases is not that green. Also if the demand for EV ever got close to current petrol/diesel usage this would place massive new demand on the National Grid, much of which would be filled by fossil fuels. Read 43% of uk electricity is from renewable sources. Odds are low charging from grid is from renewable. " Less than 4% of UK vehicles are EV. Imagine the demand on the Grid if that was 100% ! Would be very hard to fill that with renewables at the moment. | |||
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"Driven my 2006 Ford through flood water, bit of steam, worked fine. Try that in an electric car. You can disable an ev with an emp generator, and your locked in when the car malfunctions. Actually... Any modern EV should generally perform as well as, if not better than, an ICE, in water. An EMP will do as much damage to a modern ICE as an electric car. All modern cars have multiple ECUs, the failure of which will prevent a car from operating." A friend of my sister has a BMW ev in 2 ft of water in Northampton, it's not going anywhere at the moment. | |||
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"Vauxhall has announced 1100 job losses with the closure of its plant in Luton, an English Town known for its convenient proximity to Stansted Airport. The owners have partly blamed the rules on EV production and other manufacturers such as Ford and Nissan have given similar warnings. Should the EV targets be scrapped and we let the market decide, or should the Govt press on with the green woke agenda and destroy what's left of the British car industry? 🤷♂️ " It is very concerning seeing so many loose their jobs and of course the impact will be felt across the local community. The targets definitely need looking at and modifying though maybe not abandoned altogether. Hopefully the government will not wait for even more closures before acting | |||
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"Vauxhall has announced 1100 job losses with the closure of its plant in Luton, an English Town known for its convenient proximity to Stansted Airport. The owners have partly blamed the rules on EV production and other manufacturers such as Ford and Nissan have given similar warnings. Should the EV targets be scrapped and we let the market decide, or should the Govt press on with the green woke agenda and destroy what's left of the British car industry? 🤷♂️ It is very concerning seeing so many loose their jobs and of course the impact will be felt across the local community. The targets definitely need looking at and modifying though maybe not abandoned altogether. Hopefully the government will not wait for even more closures before acting" I agree. The current timetable is clearly not viable. | |||
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"It is possible to run a car on Hydrogen and Oxygen ie elements of water. Zero emissions. So when the oil runs out or stopped used for transport there is an alternative to ev's. Ev's are a waist of time." It is possible to run a car on hydrogen, however it's not trivial to store or transport hydrogen in bulk. It requires chilling to very low temperatures, and specialist insulated containers to store it. It can't be piped from place to place as it's quite capable of passing through steel, and most other materials. This makes it difficult and dangerous to handle. That's before we consider the fact that the only green way to make hydrogen is to use vast quantities of electricity to crack water apart. We're already running short of electrical capacity, and adding extra for hydrogen generation would be ludicrously expensive. | |||
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"Vauxhall has announced 1100 job losses with the closure of its plant in Luton, an English Town known for its convenient proximity to Stansted Airport. The owners have partly blamed the rules on EV production and other manufacturers such as Ford and Nissan have given similar warnings. Should the EV targets be scrapped and we let the market decide, or should the Govt press on with the green woke agenda and destroy what's left of the British car industry? 🤷♂️ It is very concerning seeing so many loose their jobs and of course the impact will be felt across the local community. The targets definitely need looking at and modifying though maybe not abandoned altogether. Hopefully the government will not wait for even more closures before acting" The unintended consequences of government policies (ZEM) “Landlords selling up leaving 2,000 households a month in England facing homelessness, due to (Tory) government tax increases and proposed rent reforms. “ | |||
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"All this talk of EV and charging. To me the step forward is Hybrid in creasing the efficiency of a ice engine. EV is OK round town but for long journeys it's hard. And as for going green lol, so you buy an EV. Still fly on holiday, and buy god knows what on line to be transport round the world in diesel lorrys and vans. Lol " And shipping, the world’s largest cruise ship the supersized Harmony, owned by Royal Caribbean, has two four-storey high 16-cylinder Wärtsilä engines which would, at full power, each burn 1,377 US gallons of fuel an hour, or about 66,000 gallons a day of some of the most polluting diesel fuel in the world. The Guardian article drew pollution examples for this ship which show pollution equivalent to Co2 - 83,376 cars Sulphur dioxide 475M cars Particle emissions equivalent to 1.05M cars NOX equivalent to 421,153 cars I read another example of a docked liner which while parked up uses fuel equivalent to 688 diesel lorry’s just to keep the ships light on. In another article written that 16 ships create as much pollution as all the cars in the world The public have swallowed the ridiculous narrative that electric cars will save the planet. | |||
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"All this talk of EV and charging. To me the step forward is Hybrid in creasing the efficiency of a ice engine. EV is OK round town but for long journeys it's hard. And as for going green lol, so you buy an EV. Still fly on holiday, and buy god knows what on line to be transport round the world in diesel lorrys and vans. Lol And shipping, the world’s largest cruise ship the supersized Harmony, owned by Royal Caribbean, has two four-storey high 16-cylinder Wärtsilä engines which would, at full power, each burn 1,377 US gallons of fuel an hour, or about 66,000 gallons a day of some of the most polluting diesel fuel in the world. The Guardian article drew pollution examples for this ship which show pollution equivalent to Co2 - 83,376 cars Sulphur dioxide 475M cars Particle emissions equivalent to 1.05M cars NOX equivalent to 421,153 cars I read another example of a docked liner which while parked up uses fuel equivalent to 688 diesel lorry’s just to keep the ships light on. In another article written that 16 ships create as much pollution as all the cars in the world The public have swallowed the ridiculous narrative that electric cars will save the planet. " I wonder how many of those ships are transporting EV's from China. | |||
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"All this talk of EV and charging. To me the step forward is Hybrid in creasing the efficiency of a ice engine. EV is OK round town but for long journeys it's hard. And as for going green lol, so you buy an EV. Still fly on holiday, and buy god knows what on line to be transport round the world in diesel lorrys and vans. Lol And shipping, the world’s largest cruise ship the supersized Harmony, owned by Royal Caribbean, has two four-storey high 16-cylinder Wärtsilä engines which would, at full power, each burn 1,377 US gallons of fuel an hour, or about 66,000 gallons a day of some of the most polluting diesel fuel in the world. The Guardian article drew pollution examples for this ship which show pollution equivalent to Co2 - 83,376 cars Sulphur dioxide 475M cars Particle emissions equivalent to 1.05M cars NOX equivalent to 421,153 cars I read another example of a docked liner which while parked up uses fuel equivalent to 688 diesel lorry’s just to keep the ships light on. In another article written that 16 ships create as much pollution as all the cars in the world The public have swallowed the ridiculous narrative that electric cars will save the planet. " Amazing figures !  | |||
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"Oh the fake narrative that little old Britain can save the planet by going green. But the fact is that we are making these cuts to emissions, but simply moving our worse problems abroad. With our emissions being moved to places like China, we are saving nothing and nobody. Net zero is a rip off, seriously!!" No one said we *alone* can save the planet. But we hold responsibility to do our bit, as other nations should do theirs as well. I suggest you do not worry about what others do, as that's out of your hands. Worry about what we do, and how we can support and effect change. And if it's all for nought and the world burns anyway...at least you can hold your head high and say, "I did my bit." | |||
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"Oh the fake narrative that little old Britain can save the planet by going green. But the fact is that we are making these cuts to emissions, but simply moving our worse problems abroad. With our emissions being moved to places like China, we are saving nothing and nobody. Net zero is a rip off, seriously!! No one said we *alone* can save the planet. But we hold responsibility to do our bit, as other nations should do theirs as well. I suggest you do not worry about what others do, as that's out of your hands. Worry about what we do, and how we can support and effect change. And if it's all for nought and the world burns anyway...at least you can hold your head high and say, "I did my bit." " So you will stop buying anything that is imported and stop your air travel to reduce you carbon footprint. | |||
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"Oh the fake narrative that little old Britain can save the planet by going green. But the fact is that we are making these cuts to emissions, but simply moving our worse problems abroad. With our emissions being moved to places like China, we are saving nothing and nobody. Net zero is a rip off, seriously!! No one said we *alone* can save the planet. But we hold responsibility to do our bit, as other nations should do theirs as well. I suggest you do not worry about what others do, as that's out of your hands. Worry about what we do, and how we can support and effect change. And if it's all for nought and the world burns anyway...at least you can hold your head high and say, "I did my bit." " I agree we should concentrate on what we are doing, and that should mean strengthening the economy, not undermining it by discarding our energy requirements in the name of going green too quickly. A stable economy is the foundation for any longterm sustainability efforts. Without reliable energy, we risk economic decline, which would make it impossible to invest in the very technologies and infrastructure needed to properly reduce emissions. Going green is important, but it must be balanced with ensuring we have the energy and resources to build a resilient economy first. Otherwise, we’re setting ourselves up for failure, both environmentally and economically. | |||
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"Oh the fake narrative that little old Britain can save the planet by going green. But the fact is that we are making these cuts to emissions, but simply moving our worse problems abroad. With our emissions being moved to places like China, we are saving nothing and nobody. Net zero is a rip off, seriously!! No one said we *alone* can save the planet. But we hold responsibility to do our bit, as other nations should do theirs as well. I suggest you do not worry about what others do, as that's out of your hands. Worry about what we do, and how we can support and effect change. And if it's all for nought and the world burns anyway...at least you can hold your head high and say, "I did my bit." I agree we should concentrate on what we are doing, and that should mean strengthening the economy, not undermining it by discarding our energy requirements in the name of going green too quickly. A stable economy is the foundation for any longterm sustainability efforts. Without reliable energy, we risk economic decline, which would make it impossible to invest in the very technologies and infrastructure needed to properly reduce emissions. Going green is important, but it must be balanced with ensuring we have the energy and resources to build a resilient economy first. Otherwise, we’re setting ourselves up for failure, both environmentally and economically. " Perfectly put. | |||
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"Oh the fake narrative that little old Britain can save the planet by going green. But the fact is that we are making these cuts to emissions, but simply moving our worse problems abroad. With our emissions being moved to places like China, we are saving nothing and nobody. Net zero is a rip off, seriously!! No one said we *alone* can save the planet. But we hold responsibility to do our bit, as other nations should do theirs as well. I suggest you do not worry about what others do, as that's out of your hands. Worry about what we do, and how we can support and effect change. And if it's all for nought and the world burns anyway...at least you can hold your head high and say, "I did my bit." I agree we should concentrate on what we are doing, and that should mean strengthening the economy, not undermining it by discarding our energy requirements in the name of going green too quickly. A stable economy is the foundation for any longterm sustainability efforts. Without reliable energy, we risk economic decline, which would make it impossible to invest in the very technologies and infrastructure needed to properly reduce emissions. Going green is important, but it must be balanced with ensuring we have the energy and resources to build a resilient economy first. Otherwise, we’re setting ourselves up for failure, both environmentally and economically. " "Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly? | |||
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""Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly?" Maybe until it's actually possible? The current plan is to ban ICE vehicle sales in 2030. Lots more electric vehicles will require lots more electricity to charge them. I don't see planning applications for any new power stations to supply that electricity. Yes, there are applications for new wind farms, but we'll be wanting to charge our cars every day, not just when the wind is favourable. | |||
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""Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly? Maybe until it's actually possible? The current plan is to ban ICE vehicle sales in 2030. Lots more electric vehicles will require lots more electricity to charge them. I don't see planning applications for any new power stations to supply that electricity. Yes, there are applications for new wind farms, but we'll be wanting to charge our cars every day, not just when the wind is favourable." Electric vehicles are only one small piece of the _uzzle. In reality, nothing will be allowed to happen that will endanger fossil fuels companies profits. This is the single reason why we haven't been moving quickly on this since the 80s. | |||
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""Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly? Maybe until it's actually possible? The current plan is to ban ICE vehicle sales in 2030. Lots more electric vehicles will require lots more electricity to charge them. I don't see planning applications for any new power stations to supply that electricity. Yes, there are applications for new wind farms, but we'll be wanting to charge our cars every day, not just when the wind is favourable." It's not just ICE vehicles, don't forget every home should also run on electricity alone. Where is that coming from? | |||
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""Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly? Maybe until it's actually possible? The current plan is to ban ICE vehicle sales in 2030. Lots more electric vehicles will require lots more electricity to charge them. I don't see planning applications for any new power stations to supply that electricity. Yes, there are applications for new wind farms, but we'll be wanting to charge our cars every day, not just when the wind is favourable. It's not just ICE vehicles, don't forget every home should also run on electricity alone. Where is that coming from?" Coal fired power stations lol.. | |||
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""Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly? Maybe until it's actually possible? The current plan is to ban ICE vehicle sales in 2030. Lots more electric vehicles will require lots more electricity to charge them. I don't see planning applications for any new power stations to supply that electricity. Yes, there are applications for new wind farms, but we'll be wanting to charge our cars every day, not just when the wind is favourable. Electric vehicles are only one small piece of the _uzzle. In reality, nothing will be allowed to happen that will endanger fossil fuels companies profits. This is the single reason why we haven't been moving quickly on this since the 80s." So why not ban all new ice engines across the board not just for cars but for vans, lorrys, boats, ships, and planes, yes its a jet engine but still burns fossil fule. Why ban the small ones that produce the least first. 🤔 | |||
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"In reality, nothing will be allowed to happen that will endanger fossil fuels companies profits. This is the single reason why we haven't been moving quickly on this since the 80s." The reason that we haven't already gone net zero is the green lobby. Back in the 60s the UK was intending to build a vast fleet of nuclear power stations, which would have produced plentiful carbon-free power. But the green lobby thought that nuclear was dangerous and polluting, and campaigned to get them all stopped. Even now, when it's clear that nuclear can solve all of our carbon problems if we just start building, the green lobby is still opposing any attempt to build nuclear power stations. Instead they insist that we must abandon all developed technologies, and push forward with something that doesn't yet work. | |||
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""Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly? Maybe until it's actually possible? The current plan is to ban ICE vehicle sales in 2030. Lots more electric vehicles will require lots more electricity to charge them. I don't see planning applications for any new power stations to supply that electricity. Yes, there are applications for new wind farms, but we'll be wanting to charge our cars every day, not just when the wind is favourable. Electric vehicles are only one small piece of the _uzzle. In reality, nothing will be allowed to happen that will endanger fossil fuels companies profits. This is the single reason why we haven't been moving quickly on this since the 80s. So why not ban all new ice engines across the board not just for cars but for vans, lorrys, boats, ships, and planes, yes its a jet engine but still burns fossil fule. Why ban the small ones that produce the least first. 🤔 " For motorcycles the zem plan was to ban 125CC and under first, but still be able to purchase a Harley or 2.5L triumph rocket for another five years. | |||
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"Vauxhall has announced 1100 job losses with the closure of its plant in Luton, an English Town known for its convenient proximity to Stansted Airport. The owners have partly blamed the rules on EV production and other manufacturers such as Ford and Nissan have given similar warnings. Should the EV targets be scrapped and we let the market decide, or should the Govt press on with the green woke agenda and destroy what's left of the British car industry? 🤷♂️ " Governments believe they need to take legislative and/or fiscal actions to help transitions towards new better/safer technologies. Examples like low energy lamps, unleaded petrol, heat pumps,vacuum cleaners, asbestos etc will always impact existing suppliers/vested interests, but in most cases the result is eventually benefical for consumers. But when the "new" technology is inferior to existing alternatives for example the early low-energy lamps/bulbs were expensive, dim and full of pollutants, consumer reaction is negative. In that case better LED technology was developed and successfully adopted. With regard to their Luton factory, Stellantis said in 2023 that its future was in doubt due to Brexit, but the failed materialisation of EV van sales was the final nail in the coffin. We should also remember that the European vehicle manufacturers will have signed up to these ZE vehicle targets in the first place. Now the targets have become too onerous governments are reviewing them. No doubt EV battery performance is improving all the time and EVs may become the obvious choice but we certainly aren't yet there. | |||
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""Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly? Maybe until it's actually possible? The current plan is to ban ICE vehicle sales in 2030. Lots more electric vehicles will require lots more electricity to charge them. I don't see planning applications for any new power stations to supply that electricity. Yes, there are applications for new wind farms, but we'll be wanting to charge our cars every day, not just when the wind is favourable. It's not just ICE vehicles, don't forget every home should also run on electricity alone. Where is that coming from?" Looking out of my flat window, grade 2 listed on Plymouth hoe, one of 288 Victorian buildings in the conservation area, not a solar panel in sight. Most buildings converted into 4/5 flats, no on street EV charging facilities. Then go out to suburbia full of better insulated modern homes, residents of these car bound homes drive to the supermarket and on Sundays cut their grass with a petrol lawnmower, driving the garden waste to the tip. On Mondays the local authority diesel powered refuse wagon collects the bins, including the carefully recycled rubbish returning it to the incinerator where 70% of household recycling is burnt. This agenda is total nonsense. | |||
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""Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly? Maybe until it's actually possible? The current plan is to ban ICE vehicle sales in 2030. Lots more electric vehicles will require lots more electricity to charge them. I don't see planning applications for any new power stations to supply that electricity. Yes, there are applications for new wind farms, but we'll be wanting to charge our cars every day, not just when the wind is favourable. It's not just ICE vehicles, don't forget every home should also run on electricity alone. Where is that coming from? Looking out of my flat window, grade 2 listed on Plymouth hoe, one of 288 Victorian buildings in the conservation area, not a solar panel in sight. Most buildings converted into 4/5 flats, no on street EV charging facilities. Then go out to suburbia full of better insulated modern homes, residents of these car bound homes drive to the supermarket and on Sundays cut their grass with a petrol lawnmower, driving the garden waste to the tip. On Mondays the local authority diesel powered refuse wagon collects the bins, including the carefully recycled rubbish returning it to the incinerator where 70% of household recycling is burnt. This agenda is total nonsense. " Great Post. | |||
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""Not going green too quickly." We've dragged out heals for about 40 odd years, how much longer should we wait before moving quickly? Maybe until it's actually possible? The current plan is to ban ICE vehicle sales in 2030. Lots more electric vehicles will require lots more electricity to charge them. I don't see planning applications for any new power stations to supply that electricity. Yes, there are applications for new wind farms, but we'll be wanting to charge our cars every day, not just when the wind is favourable. It's not just ICE vehicles, don't forget every home should also run on electricity alone. Where is that coming from? Looking out of my flat window, grade 2 listed on Plymouth hoe, one of 288 Victorian buildings in the conservation area, not a solar panel in sight. Most buildings converted into 4/5 flats, no on street EV charging facilities. Then go out to suburbia full of better insulated modern homes, residents of these car bound homes drive to the supermarket and on Sundays cut their grass with a petrol lawnmower, driving the garden waste to the tip. On Mondays the local authority diesel powered refuse wagon collects the bins, including the carefully recycled rubbish returning it to the incinerator where 70% of household recycling is burnt. This agenda is total nonsense. " Love this brake down of the broken green dream. | |||
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"In reality, nothing will be allowed to happen that will endanger fossil fuels companies profits. This is the single reason why we haven't been moving quickly on this since the 80s. The reason that we haven't already gone net zero is the green lobby. Back in the 60s the UK was intending to build a vast fleet of nuclear power stations, which would have produced plentiful carbon-free power. But the green lobby thought that nuclear was dangerous and polluting, and campaigned to get them all stopped. Even now, when it's clear that nuclear can solve all of our carbon problems if we just start building, the green lobby is still opposing any attempt to build nuclear power stations. Instead they insist that we must abandon all developed technologies, and push forward with something that doesn't yet work." Do you remember Nick Clegg in 2010 saying we can't build nuclear because 10 years is too long to wait for them to be built.🤦♂️ | |||
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"In reality, nothing will be allowed to happen that will endanger fossil fuels companies profits. This is the single reason why we haven't been moving quickly on this since the 80s. The reason that we haven't already gone net zero is the green lobby. Back in the 60s the UK was intending to build a vast fleet of nuclear power stations, which would have produced plentiful carbon-free power. But the green lobby thought that nuclear was dangerous and polluting, and campaigned to get them all stopped. Even now, when it's clear that nuclear can solve all of our carbon problems if we just start building, the green lobby is still opposing any attempt to build nuclear power stations. Instead they insist that we must abandon all developed technologies, and push forward with something that doesn't yet work. Do you remember Nick Clegg in 2010 saying we can't build nuclear because 10 years is too long to wait for them to be built.🤦♂️" Or is it no wone wants nuculer on there Doror step. | |||
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"It is possible to run a car on Hydrogen and Oxygen ie elements of water. Zero emissions. So when the oil runs out or stopped used for transport there is an alternative to ev's. Ev's are a waist of time." It's possible in the same way that controlled nuclear fusion is possible. But it's completely impracticable to use hydrogen as a raw fuel. It's expensive (in energy costs) to produce, transport and store. It will leak like crazy at the slightest chance (laws of physics old chap, and they are immutable). | |||
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"I know friends who I go fishing with that work in Portsmouth , IOW ferries. Recently on local news . The ferry company need to upgrade their ferries. From news. Company have got quotes etc for electric ferries . But cannot buy, so going to use diesel until can use electric. The reason being there is insufficient electrical supply at ferry terminal. The best date to do if supply possible will be 2037. So like a many places there is not the supply or will be for years to go fully electric. Yet everyone is expected to have electric cars by 2030 ? " So could the ferry not be built with a reactor on board to power it. | |||
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"I know friends who I go fishing with that work in Portsmouth , IOW ferries. Recently on local news . The ferry company need to upgrade their ferries. From news. Company have got quotes etc for electric ferries . But cannot buy, so going to use diesel until can use electric. The reason being there is insufficient electrical supply at ferry terminal. The best date to do if supply possible will be 2037. So like a many places there is not the supply or will be for years to go fully electric. Yet everyone is expected to have electric cars by 2030 ? So could the ferry not be built with a reactor on board to power it. " Same answer as my post further up about using hydrogen to fuel ICE vehicles. You COULD power a ferry using a small nuclear reactor. But it's never going to happen in any realistic time frame in this country at least. Not for technical reasons, there are no technical barriers to achieving it. Just the endless bureaucracy, prevarication and blether which seem to accompany any genuine attempt actually to DO something. | |||
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"I know friends who I go fishing with that work in Portsmouth , IOW ferries. Recently on local news . The ferry company need to upgrade their ferries. From news. Company have got quotes etc for electric ferries . But cannot buy, so going to use diesel until can use electric. The reason being there is insufficient electrical supply at ferry terminal. The best date to do if supply possible will be 2037. So like a many places there is not the supply or will be for years to go fully electric. Yet everyone is expected to have electric cars by 2030 ? " Everyone is not expected to have electric cars by 2030. You can still buy a second hand petrol or diesel vehicle. | |||
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"I know friends who I go fishing with that work in Portsmouth , IOW ferries. Recently on local news . The ferry company need to upgrade their ferries. From news. Company have got quotes etc for electric ferries . But cannot buy, so going to use diesel until can use electric. The reason being there is insufficient electrical supply at ferry terminal. The best date to do if supply possible will be 2037. So like a many places there is not the supply or will be for years to go fully electric. Yet everyone is expected to have electric cars by 2030 ? Everyone is not expected to have electric cars by 2030. You can still buy a second hand petrol or diesel vehicle." If you can afford to. As demand outstrips supply the prices will rise sharply. If you're looking for a good 5 years investment, go for 2nd hand car companies. | |||
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"Seems to have slipped under the radar but it appears that Nissan are in deep trouble. Some analysts think that the company could go under in a year or so. Even if it survives there will be big cuts to the workforce. Not good news for Sunderland." Terrible news. They don't seem to have recovered from that dodgy Spanish CEO they had. | |||
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"after watching a documentary on India and seeing that the workforce in a a Toyota car plant is happy to work for $300 a month, why do you think the car plants are closing. There is more regulations over here, more environmental standards, laws to abide by, etc." There was a big spike in the investment into U.K. vehicle manufacturing when the U.K. had a seamless border with the EU. - particularly Nissan and Toyota back in the day. It can’t be a surprise to anyone that the border issue is now magnified when there are other secondary issues at play like the EU rules of origin and the current apathy of U.K. motorists to wholly buy into the concept of wholly electric vehicles. | |||
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"after watching a documentary on India and seeing that the workforce in a a Toyota car plant is happy to work for $300 a month, why do you think the car plants are closing. There is more regulations over here, more environmental standards, laws to abide by, etc. There was a big spike in the investment into U.K. vehicle manufacturing when the U.K. had a seamless border with the EU. - particularly Nissan and Toyota back in the day. It can’t be a surprise to anyone that the border issue is now magnified when there are other secondary issues at play like the EU rules of origin and the current apathy of U.K. motorists to wholly buy into the concept of wholly electric vehicles. " The change to EV has hit all motor manufacturers hard and could well cause serious damage to the Sunderland plant. It's not a British only thing though as its happening all over Europe. VW closing 3 plants in Germany is huge. Before in just the last few years there has been very large investment in the UK like the battery plant Nissan are building. The rules of origin have increased the investment in the UK as more parts are made here than before to meet the rule of origin requirements | |||
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"Vauxhall has announced 1100 job losses with the closure of its plant in Luton, an English Town known for its convenient proximity to Stansted Airport. The owners have partly blamed the rules on EV production and other manufacturers such as Ford and Nissan have given similar warnings. Should the EV targets be scrapped and we let the market decide, or should the Govt press on with the green woke agenda and destroy what's left of the British car industry? 🤷♂️ " | |||
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