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"On BBC Thoughts on that?" Is that what they have just said? I will have to look. I will be to old but my kids won’t be. Gearing up for war by the sounds of it. Are you in age category? | |||
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"On BBC Thoughts on that? Is that what they have just said? I will have to look. I will be to old but my kids won’t be. Gearing up for war by the sounds of it. Are you in age category?" To summarise conservative promise for 18 year olds in 2025 to choose between community service or a year in military. And I'm not in that age bracket. | |||
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"On BBC Thoughts on that? Is that what they have just said? I will have to look. I will be to old but my kids won’t be. Gearing up for war by the sounds of it. Are you in age category? To summarise conservative promise for 18 year olds in 2025 to choose between community service or a year in military. And I'm not in that age bracket. " I just looked. Seems a strange thing to announce just before an election. I’m not big on politics tbh but seems odd to say the least. This will be an interesting post to follow. | |||
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"On BBC Thoughts on that? Is that what they have just said? I will have to look. I will be to old but my kids won’t be. Gearing up for war by the sounds of it. Are you in age category? To summarise conservative promise for 18 year olds in 2025 to choose between community service or a year in military. And I'm not in that age bracket. I just looked. Seems a strange thing to announce just before an election. I’m not big on politics tbh but seems odd to say the least. This will be an interesting post to follow. " They've announced it literally *because* of the election... | |||
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"On BBC Thoughts on that?" A ridiculous policy announcement. My Dad, almost 85, is the age group who last did mandatory national service. It's barely in living memory and certainly no member of the Govt has done it. It's a load of rose-tinted wanking for the "good old days", when we'd just fought the most destructive war in history; rationing was in force and we were having a toss off with the Soviet Union as to who would blink on the nuke button first. Oh, the good old days! 
What utter codswallop. | |||
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"On BBC Thoughts on that? A ridiculous policy announcement. My Dad, almost 85, is the age group who last did mandatory national service. It's barely in living memory and certainly no member of the Govt has done it. It's a load of rose-tinted wanking for the "good old days", when we'd just fought the most destructive war in history; rationing was in force and we were having a toss off with the Soviet Union as to who would blink on the nuke button first. Oh, the good old days!
What utter codswallop. "Tomorrow's announcement: reversing decimalisation! | |||
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"Anyone younger than 81 did not face mandatory national service, so unless it's an 82 year old putting the law into place then they need to be politely reminded that they didn't face it, so they shouldn't even be making the suggestion." Anyone born after 01 Oct 1939, so you'd have to be 84, nearly 85 to have been required to do mandatory NS. | |||
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"On BBC Thoughts on that? A ridiculous policy announcement. My Dad, almost 85, is the age group who last did mandatory national service. It's barely in living memory and certainly no member of the Govt has done it. It's a load of rose-tinted wanking for the "good old days", when we'd just fought the most destructive war in history; rationing was in force and we were having a toss off with the Soviet Union as to who would blink on the nuke button first. Oh, the good old days!
What utter codswallop.
Tomorrow's announcement: reversing decimalisation!"Oh. I don't have two brass farthings to rub together  | |||
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"Is this like a gap year?" If the gap is a trench and you shoot people who come into it, then yes 
Unclear if we will expect all 18yos to abandon uni, jobs, apprenticeships etc for a year 
It's such nonsense and so far from anything that's actually important! And shows what our overlords think about young people. | |||
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"Is this like a gap year? If the gap is a trench and you shoot people who come into it, then yes
Unclear if we will expect all 18yos to abandon uni, jobs, apprenticeships etc for a year
It's such nonsense and so far from anything that's actually important! And shows what our overlords think about young people. "Well said. | |||
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"Is this like a gap year? If the gap is a trench and you shoot people who come into it, then yes
Unclear if we will expect all 18yos to abandon uni, jobs, apprenticeships etc for a year
It's such nonsense and so far from anything that's actually important! And shows what our overlords think about young people. "Only some young people. According to the BBC, only those who are "unemployed or not in education or training, and those disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system..." - so, one can assume, very few children of Tory MPs. | |||
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"It’s hardly a progressive policy. Nothing more than a dog whistle policy designed to appeal to the reactionary elements of society. Aimed at the old gits, by that I mean anyone no matter their age who lives in the past. The Tory party needs to wake up …. This is 2024 not 1946…" I think you have hit the nail on the head there. That’s got to be the only reason. Trying to get the vote of the old folk or old fashioned idiots that will say “that would do them good. Always on snack chap and tit tocks/rinsa gran” | |||
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"Is this like a gap year? If the gap is a trench and you shoot people who come into it, then yes
Unclear if we will expect all 18yos to abandon uni, jobs, apprenticeships etc for a year
It's such nonsense and so far from anything that's actually important! And shows what our overlords think about young people.
Only some young people. According to the BBC, only those who are "unemployed or not in education or training, and those disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system..." - so, one can assume, very few children of Tory MPs."Obviously, training those "disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system" to be violent and use weapons, sounds like exactly what is needed. Great idea. Brilliant. Btw, the BBC news article doesn't mention anything about exemption for education or work. It implies all 18yos would join the military FT or do voluntary work every weekend for a year. | |||
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"It’s hardly a progressive policy. Nothing more than a dog whistle policy designed to appeal to the reactionary elements of society. Aimed at the old gits, by that I mean anyone no matter their age who lives in the past. The Tory party needs to wake up …. This is 2024 not 1946… I think you have hit the nail on the head there. That’s got to be the only reason. Trying to get the vote of the old folk or old fashioned idiots that will say “that would do them good. Always on snack chap and tit tocks/rinsa gran” " The older folk who, for almost the whole psrt, did not have to do national service, yet they talk like they did! Dad did national service (both June 1939), one of the final intakes. I don't think he remembers HOW to vote, fortunately. | |||
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"Is this like a gap year? If the gap is a trench and you shoot people who come into it, then yes
Unclear if we will expect all 18yos to abandon uni, jobs, apprenticeships etc for a year
It's such nonsense and so far from anything that's actually important! And shows what our overlords think about young people.
Only some young people. According to the BBC, only those who are "unemployed or not in education or training, and those disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system..." - so, one can assume, very few children of Tory MPs.
Obviously, training those "disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system" to be violent and use weapons, sounds like exactly what is needed. Great idea. Brilliant.
Btw, the BBC news article doesn't mention anything about exemption for education or work. It implies all 18yos would join the military FT or do voluntary work every weekend for a year."I'd worry more how they are going to decide who is "disproportionately represented". I think I know what that is code for. But it does say it would be aimed at those who are unemployed or not in education or training. | |||
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"Is this like a gap year? If the gap is a trench and you shoot people who come into it, then yes
Unclear if we will expect all 18yos to abandon uni, jobs, apprenticeships etc for a year
It's such nonsense and so far from anything that's actually important! And shows what our overlords think about young people.
Only some young people. According to the BBC, only those who are "unemployed or not in education or training, and those disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system..." - so, one can assume, very few children of Tory MPs.
Obviously, training those "disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system" to be violent and use weapons, sounds like exactly what is needed. Great idea. Brilliant.
Btw, the BBC news article doesn't mention anything about exemption for education or work. It implies all 18yos would join the military FT or do voluntary work every weekend for a year.
I'd worry more how they are going to decide who is "disproportionately represented". I think I know what that is code for.
But it does say it would be aimed at those who are unemployed or not in education or training."Obviously much fairer of it's all 18 year olds. But no less stupid. | |||
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"Is this like a gap year? If the gap is a trench and you shoot people who come into it, then yes
Unclear if we will expect all 18yos to abandon uni, jobs, apprenticeships etc for a year
It's such nonsense and so far from anything that's actually important! And shows what our overlords think about young people.
Only some young people. According to the BBC, only those who are "unemployed or not in education or training, and those disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system..." - so, one can assume, very few children of Tory MPs.
Obviously, training those "disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system" to be violent and use weapons, sounds like exactly what is needed. Great idea. Brilliant.
Btw, the BBC news article doesn't mention anything about exemption for education or work. It implies all 18yos would join the military FT or do voluntary work every weekend for a year.
I'd worry more how they are going to decide who is "disproportionately represented". I think I know what that is code for.
But it does say it would be aimed at those who are unemployed or not in education or training."Yes, it all sounds very dodgy
Imagining for one minute that there's an even distribution of the demographics, what could be more logical than "put down your zombie knife, son. Now here's a rifle...."? | |||
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"Is this like a gap year? If the gap is a trench and you shoot people who come into it, then yes
Unclear if we will expect all 18yos to abandon uni, jobs, apprenticeships etc for a year
It's such nonsense and so far from anything that's actually important! And shows what our overlords think about young people.
Only some young people. According to the BBC, only those who are "unemployed or not in education or training, and those disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system..." - so, one can assume, very few children of Tory MPs.
Obviously, training those "disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system" to be violent and use weapons, sounds like exactly what is needed. Great idea. Brilliant.
Btw, the BBC news article doesn't mention anything about exemption for education or work. It implies all 18yos would join the military FT or do voluntary work every weekend for a year.
I'd worry more how they are going to decide who is "disproportionately represented". I think I know what that is code for.
But it does say it would be aimed at those who are unemployed or not in education or training."I think that will mean anyone that is receiving some sort of financial aid from the government. I agree what does disproportionately represented actually mean??! | |||
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"^^^Being on benefits and being "disproportionately represented in the criminal justice system" are two very different things "I totally agree, I have absolutely no clue as to what disproportionately represented means to be honest. What does that mean? Or what’s everyone’s interpretation of that. ? | |||
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"Is it such a bad thing to give a bit back to the country that gives you so much?" Are you happy to give up a weekend a month because the government decides you must? | |||
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"Is it such a bad thing to give a bit back to the country that gives you so much?" How is serving in a peace time military for a year, giving back? NS only happened in the 40s and 50s due to the Cold War and our real fear of imminent further conflict with the Soviet Union. | |||
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"Has anyone said 'old fashioned values' or 'it never did me any harm' yet?" Give it time (to be said by those who didn't have to do it, obvs). Also waiting for "teach 'em some respect" to crop up... | |||
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"Lot of left leaning in the chat. Expected of fab I guess. " Never mind left and right, it's a gimmick. An unworkable one at that. But if you're in favour, perhaps you could explain why it's a good idea? | |||
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"Is it such a bad thing to give a bit back to the country that gives you so much? How is serving in a peace time military for a year, giving back? NS only happened in the 40s and 50s due to the Cold War and our real fear of imminent further conflict with the Soviet Union. " It is compulsory in many countries around the world . | |||
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"Is it such a bad thing to give a bit back to the country that gives you so much? How is serving in a peace time military for a year, giving back? NS only happened in the 40s and 50s due to the Cold War and our real fear of imminent further conflict with the Soviet Union. It is compulsory in many countries around the world . " And it has many caveats and many young people seek to avoid it. I've written many a letter for our students to inform the relevant national body that they are exempt due to studying etc. It's not liked in many of the countries where it is mandatory. | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy .. "I've often heard this argument. Do you think the military want 'offenders'? Do you feel they're equipped to deal with them? | |||
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"Is it such a bad thing to give a bit back to the country that gives you so much? How is serving in a peace time military for a year, giving back? NS only happened in the 40s and 50s due to the Cold War and our real fear of imminent further conflict with the Soviet Union. It is compulsory in many countries around the world . And it has many caveats and many young people seek to avoid it. I've written many a letter for our students to inform the relevant national body that they are exempt due to studying etc. It's not liked in many of the countries where it is mandatory. " I never said ppl like it. I guess it's classed as and I quote from a south African friend .It shapes you as a man you know right from wrong . His words did not do me any harm .I learnt new skills . Times have changed 20 years ago are different from the beliefs and general feelings now . Same as 1940s hopefully times ppl and opinions change | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy .. ""The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers" A quote attributed to Socrates. 470–399 BC | |||
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"Is it such a bad thing to give a bit back to the country that gives you so much? How is serving in a peace time military for a year, giving back? NS only happened in the 40s and 50s due to the Cold War and our real fear of imminent further conflict with the Soviet Union. It is compulsory in many countries around the world . And it has many caveats and many young people seek to avoid it. I've written many a letter for our students to inform the relevant national body that they are exempt due to studying etc. It's not liked in many of the countries where it is mandatory. I never said ppl like it. I guess it's classed as and I quote from a south African friend .It shapes you as a man you know right from wrong . His words did not do me any harm .I learnt new skills . Times have changed 20 years ago are different from the beliefs and general feelings now . Same as 1940s hopefully times ppl and opinions change " Didn't he know right from wrong before he did national service? 
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC"I love this. Bloody smartphones, eh.  | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC"The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ? I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's  | |||
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"Is this like a gap year?" More like a crap three years, according to many who had to endure it! | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
I've often heard this argument. Do you think the military want 'offenders'? Do you feel they're equipped to deal with them?"I'd imagine they are better equiped than the current system we have. They arent joining the military but entering into a disciplined service that might teach them respect and give a purpose. To be honest my issue isnt national service, i very much doubt that will ever happen. But as a society there is a much bigger problem around youth offending that needs addressed. Again, just my opinion | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC
The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ?
I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's "Don't we have a criminal justice system for that tiny majority? | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC
The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ?
I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's
Don't we have a criminal justice system for that tiny majority? "Its maybe not that tiny and from a Scottish perspective wee Nicky and her SNP pals are pretty opposed to doing anything with offenders under 25. | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC
The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ?
I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's "Don't you think some Ancient Greek youths carried knives or vandalised carts/carriages? I've not had issues with groups of youths at night myself, no. We had an issue last night with a large group of actual proper adults who appeared to be dealing drugs on my father's driveway. Obviously we called the police and kept watching them via the doorbell cam. I don't think national service would alleviate such things at all. | |||
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"Where did it come from though this idea? Just out of the blue like this. Is there any more narrative on the reasoning? I need to find out a bit more as it seems strange plus unless they are on self destruct why would the tories think this would help them in the election ? " They are probably thinking back to previous electoral success from warmongering. | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC
The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ?
I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's
Don't we have a criminal justice system for that tiny majority?
Its maybe not that tiny and from a Scottish perspective wee Nicky and her SNP pals are pretty opposed to doing anything with offenders under 25. "What do you want to "do" with them? I'd they get caught and go to court and get sentenced. I hope they then get access to rehabilitation programmes and services. I'm not sure what the military are supposed to do with them - it's not their job. | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC
The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ?
I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's
Don't you think some Ancient Greek youths carried knives or vandalised carts/carriages? I've not had issues with groups of youths at night myself, no. We had an issue last night with a large group of actual proper adults who appeared to be dealing drugs on my father's driveway. Obviously we called the police and kept watching them via the doorbell cam. I don't think national service would alleviate such things at all. "Yeah, i've no ancient Greek crime stats to compare.. its just my opinion, there is very little to no deterrant for kids/youths and they know this, so feel they can act and do whatever they like.. like dealing on your dads drive, whats the deterrant ? Did the police come ? | |||
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"Is it such a bad thing to give a bit back to the country that gives you so much? How is serving in a peace time military for a year, giving back? NS only happened in the 40s and 50s due to the Cold War and our real fear of imminent further conflict with the Soviet Union. It is compulsory in many countries around the world . And it has many caveats and many young people seek to avoid it. I've written many a letter for our students to inform the relevant national body that they are exempt due to studying etc. It's not liked in many of the countries where it is mandatory. I never said ppl like it. I guess it's classed as and I quote from a south African friend .It shapes you as a man you know right from wrong . His words did not do me any harm .I learnt new skills . Times have changed 20 years ago are different from the beliefs and general feelings now . Same as 1940s hopefully times ppl and opinions change Didn't he know right from wrong before he did national service?
"I can not answer that as he is not me . However he had a very religious up bringing, so if you believe then yes he did | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC
The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ?
I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's
Don't we have a criminal justice system for that tiny majority?
Its maybe not that tiny and from a Scottish perspective wee Nicky and her SNP pals are pretty opposed to doing anything with offenders under 25.
What do you want to "do" with them? I'd they get caught and go to court and get sentenced. I hope they then get access to rehabilitation programmes and services. I'm not sure what the military are supposed to do with them - it's not their job."Reoffending stats for under 25s is very high, so makes me think the current system isn't working. Very few will be sentenced but given community service, tags etc. as well as wait years to actually go to court in which time they are free to do as they please. Its not the military's job but could be a good divertion to stop youths reoffending or escalating to more serious crime. Maybe i'm idealistic, but the current syatem is broke and it sounds like a viable option to divert youths away from offending into a disciplined organisation that can make a difference | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC
The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ?
I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's
Don't we have a criminal justice system for that tiny majority?
Its maybe not that tiny and from a Scottish perspective wee Nicky and her SNP pals are pretty opposed to doing anything with offenders under 25.
What do you want to "do" with them? I'd they get caught and go to court and get sentenced. I hope they then get access to rehabilitation programmes and services. I'm not sure what the military are supposed to do with them - it's not their job.
Reoffending stats for under 25s is very high, so makes me think the current system isn't working. Very few will be sentenced but given community service, tags etc. as well as wait years to actually go to court in which time they are free to do as they please.
Its not the military's job but could be a good divertion to stop youths reoffending or escalating to more serious crime. Maybe i'm idealistic, but the current syatem is broke and it sounds like a viable option to divert youths away from offending into a disciplined organisation that can make a difference "So they'd join the forces instead of going to prison? Community Service sounds very much like the 2nd (less headline grabbing) bit of the announcement, so we're already doing it! I guess it depends on the crime but the most serious offenders would be held on remand before trial so I don't think they'd be 'free to do what they want'? I'm no expert though. | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC
The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ?
I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's
Don't we have a criminal justice system for that tiny majority?
Its maybe not that tiny and from a Scottish perspective wee Nicky and her SNP pals are pretty opposed to doing anything with offenders under 25.
What do you want to "do" with them? I'd they get caught and go to court and get sentenced. I hope they then get access to rehabilitation programmes and services. I'm not sure what the military are supposed to do with them - it's not their job.
Reoffending stats for under 25s is very high, so makes me think the current system isn't working. Very few will be sentenced but given community service, tags etc. as well as wait years to actually go to court in which time they are free to do as they please.
Its not the military's job but could be a good divertion to stop youths reoffending or escalating to more serious crime. Maybe i'm idealistic, but the current syatem is broke and it sounds like a viable option to divert youths away from offending into a disciplined organisation that can make a difference
So they'd join the forces instead of going to prison?
Community Service sounds very much like the 2nd (less headline grabbing) bit of the announcement, so we're already doing it! I guess it depends on the crime but the most serious offenders would be held on remand before trial so I don't think they'd be 'free to do what they want'? I'm no expert though."Im not either, just basing it on my own opinion, what i see day to day. Again, as an idealist we should be looking for prevention and diversion before the offending escalated to a crime that would lead to a remand and if national service was an option it might be worth considering. In saying that its the Tories and nothing they say is worth considering 
Who knew joining this would lead to a good chat about National Service and youth offending on a Saturday night  I was hoping to meet girls !
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers"
A quote attributed to Socrates.
470–399 BC
The difference now is some, a very small percentage, are violent or carry weapons or steal cars .. would you pass a group of kids or youths at night ?
I though Socrates played for Brazil in the 70's
Don't you think some Ancient Greek youths carried knives or vandalised carts/carriages? I've not had issues with groups of youths at night myself, no. We had an issue last night with a large group of actual proper adults who appeared to be dealing drugs on my father's driveway. Obviously we called the police and kept watching them via the doorbell cam. I don't think national service would alleviate such things at all.
Yeah, i've no ancient Greek crime stats to compare.. its just my opinion, there is very little to no deterrant for kids/youths and they know this, so feel they can act and do whatever they like.. like dealing on your dads drive, whats the deterrant ? Did the police come ? "The police did not come out, no. They put "an alert" out to patrols in the area. That was all. Fortunately, they cleared off and went back into the pub nearby. | |||
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"NS is NEVER going to happen." Not compulsory anyway, but an incentivised scheme might work, and have many benefits too. | |||
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"Next week they'll announce that everyone will have to wear a trilby. " I rock a hat lol | |||
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"NS is NEVER going to happen. Not compulsory anyway, but an incentivised scheme might work, and have many benefits too." I could see them going down the US model. Giving healthcare and paying for education etc. But the first steps would need to be dismantling the NHS and continuing to make further and higher education inaccessible for working class people. | |||
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"I think it has its good intentions but a bad idea. Turn a potential bad kid into a trained killer sounds like a recipe for disaster. A lot of the kids will probably pull the mental health card and be exempt. If it’s a way to try and improve society, teach the young some discipline and life skills, do it through education in schools and make sure everyone does it." It's not just pointing a gun tho. The military is hi-tech with many skilled jobs. | |||
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"I'm all for it. However our country is far too soft for it to ever happen and if it did the do-gooder brigade would ensure that the little darlings aren't treated like soldiers but wrapped up in cotton wool and probably allow their mummy's to come and tuck them in at night. " When did you do national service? | |||
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"The problem with kids today is .. shit, i sound like my dad .. the lack of respect for any authority; parents, teachers, police etc. and the lack of any actual deterrant from courts has led to youths thinking, and doing, whatever they want. So if national service for repeat offenders is an option i'd consider it, it might teach them some discipline, respect and divert then from reoffending or escalating to more serious crimes. Just my opinion. If its for everyone thats insane and to be fair its a Tory policy ..
I've often heard this argument. Do you think the military want 'offenders'? Do you feel they're equipped to deal with them?
I'd imagine they are better equiped than the current system we have. They arent joining the military but entering into a disciplined service that might teach them respect and give a purpose.
To be honest my issue isnt national service, i very much doubt that will ever happen. But as a society there is a much bigger problem around youth offending that needs addressed.
Again, just my opinion "I agree that offending needs to be addressed, especially among the younger age group. If they're not entering military service what it national service? Whatever it is it isn't currently set up to deal with young people who don't necessarily want to be there, some with social and other issues. | |||
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"If it's volunteer work, what's to stop them saying they don't want to do it? Mrs x" Nothing. | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? What will they do in the NHS? Who will train them? If they go into national service where will they live?" let's not pick holes in their plans. A completely unworkable plan that will cost shit loads to go nowhere is better than no plan....  | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? What will they do in the NHS? Who will train them? If they go into national service where will they live?let's not pick holes in their plans. A completely unworkable plan that will cost shit loads to go nowhere is better than no plan.... "
DOH! Me and my damn silly questions. | |||
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"If it's volunteer work, what's to stop them saying they don't want to do it? Mrs x" It is mandatory to do the national service but they get to choose which part: military or uniformed public sector (special constable, fire fighter, emergency responder, environmental protection). It's about bringing people together, and is funded with 2.5 billion. Am watching Cleverly on LK. The tories like to choose inappropriate words for issues. | |||
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"Funded by tax avoidance" 1 billion of it 1.5 from the shared prosperity fund (supposed to be for deprived areas, you know, levelling up... remember that? | |||
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"Considering the NHS currently refuses to offer any kind of work experience or shadowing pretty much across the board, to highly motivated young people applying for medicine, nursing, allied health professions, is it going to have just anyone rocking up and volunteering? What can volunteers do in the NHS? Do we want unwilling 18yos on our wards? " They can make tea and clean up hazardous substances. If a surgeon is off sick they can do a spot of surgery, I'm sure there's a Dorling Kindersley book that'll take them through it step by step. | |||
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"Funded by tax avoidance 1 billion of it 1.5 from the shared prosperity fund (supposed to be for deprived areas, you know, levelling up... remember that?" Sunak meddled with levelling up metrics, taking money from poor constituencies in favour of new bus shelters in Tunbridge Wells. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-64321755.amp | |||
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"I have more questions. What happens when all the 18 year olds are taken out of the jobs market? Who covers the late weekend shift in the supermarket, gets your McDonald's at the drive through on Saturday night? What if you're already training to be a care worker, do you have to turn up on Saturday and work for nothing? How about the 18 year olds who have children, who'll look after them while they're taking grandad a cup of tea at Leafy Meadows care facility? " How about those millions of highly skilled jobs that brexit was supposed to deliver Youth clubs closed, two years extra maths and now mandatory national service for the workshy youth | |||
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"I'm all for it. However our country is far too soft for it to ever happen and if it did the do-gooder brigade would ensure that the little darlings aren't treated like soldiers but wrapped up in cotton wool and probably allow their mummy's to come and tuck them in at night. " is this a self burn ? As no generation for a long time has supported NS. Must mean we are all mummy boy snowflakes. | |||
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"I'm all for it. However our country is far too soft for it to ever happen and if it did the do-gooder brigade would ensure that the little darlings aren't treated like soldiers but wrapped up in cotton wool and probably allow their mummy's to come and tuck them in at night. is this a self burn ? As no generation for a long time has supported NS. Must mean we are all mummy boy snowflakes. " I don’t think so Over flowing jails Record knife crime up 22% 900,000 violent crime cases last year Prisoners to be let out early to free up prison cells Uk is full of wannabe gangsters. Send them to the Russian front. | |||
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"I'm all for it. However our country is far too soft for it to ever happen and if it did the do-gooder brigade would ensure that the little darlings aren't treated like soldiers but wrapped up in cotton wool and probably allow their mummy's to come and tuck them in at night. is this a self burn ? As no generation for a long time has supported NS. Must mean we are all mummy boy snowflakes. I don’t think so Over flowing jails Record knife crime up 22% 900,000 violent crime cases last year Prisoners to be let out early to free up prison cells Uk is full of wannabe gangsters. Send them to the Russian front. " Or, we could try to make more opportunities for young people to make something of their lives? | |||
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"Total puff designed to appeal to the base and floating Reform voters. Succeeded in having all the sunday political shows talking about it and that's it" Drug testing is mandatory in the British Armed Forces. The 18 year old cohort, would probably not make it through the door, plenty will be loaded up on , , ket and the other things | |||
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"And whilst their at it, bring back Pounds, Shillings and Pence .... that's when the rot set in." What happened to the government proposals to return to imperial measurements? | |||
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"I'm all for it. However our country is far too soft for it to ever happen and if it did the do-gooder brigade would ensure that the little darlings aren't treated like soldiers but wrapped up in cotton wool and probably allow their mummy's to come and tuck them in at night. is this a self burn ? As no generation for a long time has supported NS. Must mean we are all mummy boy snowflakes. I don’t think so Over flowing jails Record knife crime up 22% 900,000 violent crime cases last year Prisoners to be let out early to free up prison cells Uk is full of wannabe gangsters. Send them to the Russian front. Or, we could try to make more opportunities for young people to make something of their lives?" Plenty to address here Manufacturing halved since 70’s Record student debt is not an opportunity Housing is unaffordable 26.3 percent of people aged 16 to 17 were unemployed in the United Kingdom in March 2024 | |||
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"And whilst their at it, bring back Pounds, Shillings and Pence .... that's when the rot set in. What happened to the government proposals to return to imperial measurements? " Wine in pint bottles from September. The renaissance of a nation. | |||
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"And whilst their at it, bring back Pounds, Shillings and Pence .... that's when the rot set in. What happened to the government proposals to return to imperial measurements? Wine in pint bottles from September. The renaissance of a nation." Another day another Sunak gaffe They cannot be taken seriously as a government. | |||
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"And whilst their at it, bring back Pounds, Shillings and Pence .... that's when the rot set in. What happened to the government proposals to return to imperial measurements? Wine in pint bottles from September. The renaissance of a nation." | |||
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"And whilst their at it, bring back Pounds, Shillings and Pence .... that's when the rot set in." nah that was giving women the vote countrys gone soft since then bloody scandalous geeves wheres my breakfast kippers pah just cant get the staff anymore bloody slackers flog the lot of them | |||
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"I'm all for it. However our country is far too soft for it to ever happen and if it did the do-gooder brigade would ensure that the little darlings aren't treated like soldiers but wrapped up in cotton wool and probably allow their mummy's to come and tuck them in at night. is this a self burn ? As no generation for a long time has supported NS. Must mean we are all mummy boy snowflakes. I don’t think so Over flowing jails Record knife crime up 22% 900,000 violent crime cases last year Prisoners to be let out early to free up prison cells Uk is full of wannabe gangsters. Send them to the Russian front. Or, we could try to make more opportunities for young people to make something of their lives? Plenty to address here Manufacturing halved since 70’s Record student debt is not an opportunity Housing is unaffordable 26.3 percent of people aged 16 to 17 were unemployed in the United Kingdom in March 2024" Your last statement? How can that be when it's supposed to be mandatory to have children in school until 18 or doing an apprenticeship? | |||
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"And whilst their at it, bring back Pounds, Shillings and Pence .... that's when the rot set in.nah that was giving women the vote countrys gone soft since then bloody scandalous geeves wheres my breakfast kippers pah just cant get the staff anymore bloody slackers flog the lot of them " Nah it's when they gave working men the vote, innit. | |||
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"And whilst their at it, bring back Pounds, Shillings and Pence .... that's when the rot set in. What happened to the government proposals to return to imperial measurements? Wine in pint bottles from September. The renaissance of a nation." I'd forgotten about the wine by the pint. Like as if the wine producing nations are going to tool up for non-standard bottles in order to sell about 200 a year to half a dozen strange tory voters in the home counties. This is what happens when nutters that are completely out of touch with reality end up running the country. | |||
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"I'm all for it. However our country is far too soft for it to ever happen and if it did the do-gooder brigade would ensure that the little darlings aren't treated like soldiers but wrapped up in cotton wool and probably allow their mummy's to come and tuck them in at night. is this a self burn ? As no generation for a long time has supported NS. Must mean we are all mummy boy snowflakes. I don’t think so Over flowing jails Record knife crime up 22% 900,000 violent crime cases last year Prisoners to be let out early to free up prison cells Uk is full of wannabe gangsters. Send them to the Russian front. Or, we could try to make more opportunities for young people to make something of their lives? Plenty to address here Manufacturing halved since 70’s Record student debt is not an opportunity Housing is unaffordable 26.3 percent of people aged 16 to 17 were unemployed in the United Kingdom in March 2024 Your last statement? How can that be when it's supposed to be mandatory to have children in school until 18 or doing an apprenticeship?" https://www.statista.com/statistics/974421/unemployment-rate-uk-by-age/#:~:text=Approximately%2026.3%20percent%20of%20people,had%20the%20highest%20unemployment%20rate. | |||
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"I think this is tribalism unfortunately if one party announced it then the other would think its bad. I think it's a good policy announcement but drastically fucked up the actual announcement and not because the military side, which alot of people are focussing on. Only 30k spots for that side of it. That would be disastourous. There's enough wasters in the military as it stands anyway. But the other side of community service and introducing 25 days a year could be a good way of gaining experience and opening different doors and different outlooks to other jobs. It's just work experience at an older age imo. Also frees up other people whose actual jobs are to help a broader spectrum of people. Plenty of countries you have to do some form of service even if you're overseas." The tories have ruined life chances of young people. Tell them to fuck off Real jobs needed. | |||
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"Funded by tax avoidance 1 billion of it 1.5 from the shared prosperity fund (supposed to be for deprived areas, you know, levelling up... remember that? Sunak meddled with levelling up metrics, taking money from poor constituencies in favour of new bus shelters in Tunbridge Wells. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-64321755.amp " Wasn't he filmed at a mates BBQ laughing that he'd taken money allocated for the poorer communities and given it to the affluent? I'm fairly sure there was something like this doing the rounds a while back. He's a twat and so are all the Tories. Mrs x | |||
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"Funded by tax avoidance 1 billion of it 1.5 from the shared prosperity fund (supposed to be for deprived areas, you know, levelling up... remember that? Sunak meddled with levelling up metrics, taking money from poor constituencies in favour of new bus shelters in Tunbridge Wells. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-64321755.amp Wasn't he filmed at a mates BBQ laughing that he'd taken money allocated for the poorer communities and given it to the affluent? I'm fairly sure there was something like this doing the rounds a while back. He's a twat and so are all the Tories. Mrs x" Exactly this. No “working class mates “ Turns up in a rented Kia Rio for a petrol station photoshoot amidst the fuel price rise then on bbc lies he owns a golf while he has four luxury cars on his drive Introduces highest taxes in 70 years while his wife enjoys eight years of non dom tax privilege Now he wants national service for the shirkers He is looking a bigger wanker every day. | |||
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"Next week they'll announce that everyone will have to wear a trilby. " Bringing back hanging and the Watney 7 | |||
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"No your all right let's not embrace it. Let's continue to encourage this age group to go to university and rack up tens of thousands of debt to end up with a useless degree and be over qualified to serve at McDonald's. Let's encourage them to have ridiculous dreams of all becoming influencers when infact it's a ridiculously small percentage who actually does. Let's continue to create the laziest children to adults on the planet a fact as reported last week. Our society has become morbidly obese with type 2 diabetes at epidemic status. I'm not saying all kids are lazy far from it but what we have done is make it easier for people to become lazy and blame everyone else for their health issues. National service may or may not be a good idea but at least if it's done correctly would certainly bridge the gap for many with little to no prospects, and allow those who don't want to go to university breathing time to consider their future. In the meantime it will create adults who can use the time to train in many different areas whilst serving get a trade, medical training the list goes on... As well as this it's gonna encourage and create healthier adults going forward means less likely hood of lifestyle created conditions, it will install a sense of routine that is going to be vital when job hunting. Discipline,self worth and comradeship. Your all seeing negativity . " No comradeship in Britain Aristocracy and non doms first Tax rises and benefit cuts for everyone else. | |||
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"No your all right let's not embrace it. Let's continue to encourage this age group to go to university and rack up tens of thousands of debt to end up with a useless degree and be over qualified to serve at McDonald's. Let's encourage them to have ridiculous dreams of all becoming influencers when infact it's a ridiculously small percentage who actually does. Let's continue to create the laziest children to adults on the planet a fact as reported last week. Our society has become morbidly obese with type 2 diabetes at epidemic status. I'm not saying all kids are lazy far from it but what we have done is make it easier for people to become lazy and blame everyone else for their health issues. National service may or may not be a good idea but at least if it's done correctly would certainly bridge the gap for many with little to no prospects, and allow those who don't want to go to university breathing time to consider their future. In the meantime it will create adults who can use the time to train in many different areas whilst serving get a trade, medical training the list goes on... As well as this it's gonna encourage and create healthier adults going forward means less likely hood of lifestyle created conditions, it will install a sense of routine that is going to be vital when job hunting. Discipline,self worth and comradeship. Your all seeing negativity . " Can you link this reported fact from last week that says we’re seeing the laziest children to adults. | |||
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"No your all right let's not embrace it. Let's continue to encourage this age group to go to university and rack up tens of thousands of debt to end up with a useless degree and be over qualified to serve at McDonald's. Let's encourage them to have ridiculous dreams of all becoming influencers when infact it's a ridiculously small percentage who actually does. Let's continue to create the laziest children to adults on the planet a fact as reported last week. Our society has become morbidly obese with type 2 diabetes at epidemic status. I'm not saying all kids are lazy far from it but what we have done is make it easier for people to become lazy and blame everyone else for their health issues. National service may or may not be a good idea but at least if it's done correctly would certainly bridge the gap for many with little to no prospects, and allow those who don't want to go to university breathing time to consider their future. In the meantime it will create adults who can use the time to train in many different areas whilst serving get a trade, medical training the list goes on... As well as this it's gonna encourage and create healthier adults going forward means less likely hood of lifestyle created conditions, it will install a sense of routine that is going to be vital when job hunting. Discipline,self worth and comradeship. Your all seeing negativity . Can you link this reported fact from last week that says we’re seeing the laziest children to adults. " BBC in the last week, there's a thread on here relating to it. | |||
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"No your all right let's not embrace it. Let's continue to encourage this age group to go to university and rack up tens of thousands of debt to end up with a useless degree and be over qualified to serve at McDonald's. Let's encourage them to have ridiculous dreams of all becoming influencers when infact it's a ridiculously small percentage who actually does. Let's continue to create the laziest children to adults on the planet a fact as reported last week. Our society has become morbidly obese with type 2 diabetes at epidemic status. I'm not saying all kids are lazy far from it but what we have done is make it easier for people to become lazy and blame everyone else for their health issues. National service may or may not be a good idea but at least if it's done correctly would certainly bridge the gap for many with little to no prospects, and allow those who don't want to go to university breathing time to consider their future. In the meantime it will create adults who can use the time to train in many different areas whilst serving get a trade, medical training the list goes on... As well as this it's gonna encourage and create healthier adults going forward means less likely hood of lifestyle created conditions, it will install a sense of routine that is going to be vital when job hunting. Discipline,self worth and comradeship. Your all seeing negativity . " This sounds great! How do we ensure it's done correctly and who's going to decide what correct is? Where do I sign? | |||
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"No your all right let's not embrace it. Let's continue to encourage this age group to go to university and rack up tens of thousands of debt to end up with a useless degree and be over qualified to serve at McDonald's. Let's encourage them to have ridiculous dreams of all becoming influencers when infact it's a ridiculously small percentage who actually does. Let's continue to create the laziest children to adults on the planet a fact as reported last week. Our society has become morbidly obese with type 2 diabetes at epidemic status. I'm not saying all kids are lazy far from it but what we have done is make it easier for people to become lazy and blame everyone else for their health issues. National service may or may not be a good idea but at least if it's done correctly would certainly bridge the gap for many with little to no prospects, and allow those who don't want to go to university breathing time to consider their future. In the meantime it will create adults who can use the time to train in many different areas whilst serving get a trade, medical training the list goes on... As well as this it's gonna encourage and create healthier adults going forward means less likely hood of lifestyle created conditions, it will install a sense of routine that is going to be vital when job hunting. Discipline,self worth and comradeship. Your all seeing negativity . This sounds great! How do we ensure it's done correctly and who's going to decide what correct is? Where do I sign? " Dunno me and Dave from the pub will scribble something on the back of a cigarette packet and come back to you 
Seriously this really is a pie in the sky topic as it's never going to happen,the government would probably take years to thrash out the details obviously making sure that upper classes manage to swerve it,that said many of them go to officers school as part of their education.
Sandhurst and Wilton park.
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"No your all right let's not embrace it. Let's continue to encourage this age group to go to university and rack up tens of thousands of debt to end up with a useless degree and be over qualified to serve at McDonald's. Let's encourage them to have ridiculous dreams of all becoming influencers when infact it's a ridiculously small percentage who actually does. Let's continue to create the laziest children to adults on the planet a fact as reported last week. Our society has become morbidly obese with type 2 diabetes at epidemic status. I'm not saying all kids are lazy far from it but what we have done is make it easier for people to become lazy and blame everyone else for their health issues. National service may or may not be a good idea but at least if it's done correctly would certainly bridge the gap for many with little to no prospects, and allow those who don't want to go to university breathing time to consider their future. In the meantime it will create adults who can use the time to train in many different areas whilst serving get a trade, medical training the list goes on... As well as this it's gonna encourage and create healthier adults going forward means less likely hood of lifestyle created conditions, it will install a sense of routine that is going to be vital when job hunting. Discipline,self worth and comradeship. Your all seeing negativity . Can you link this reported fact from last week that says we’re seeing the laziest children to adults. BBC in the last week, there's a thread on here relating to it. " I can’t find anything on the BBC but the thread on here has an article from the Daily Mail and when read actually explains that children from lower socioeconomic backgrounds are getting less day to day exercise and have a higher BMI because they have a lack of access to vigorous activities like sports and are not getting as much healthy food like fresh fruits and vegetables in their diets in comparison to wealthier families that were also surveyed. They are also disproportionately more likely to go without breakfast each morning. | |||
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"No your all right let's not embrace it. Let's continue to encourage this age group to go to university and rack up tens of thousands of debt to end up with a useless degree and be over qualified to serve at McDonald's. Let's encourage them to have ridiculous dreams of all becoming influencers when infact it's a ridiculously small percentage who actually does. Let's continue to create the laziest children to adults on the planet a fact as reported last week. Our society has become morbidly obese with type 2 diabetes at epidemic status. I'm not saying all kids are lazy far from it but what we have done is make it easier for people to become lazy and blame everyone else for their health issues. National service may or may not be a good idea but at least if it's done correctly would certainly bridge the gap for many with little to no prospects, and allow those who don't want to go to university breathing time to consider their future. In the meantime it will create adults who can use the time to train in many different areas whilst serving get a trade, medical training the list goes on... As well as this it's gonna encourage and create healthier adults going forward means less likely hood of lifestyle created conditions, it will install a sense of routine that is going to be vital when job hunting. Discipline,self worth and comradeship. Your all seeing negativity . This sounds great! How do we ensure it's done correctly and who's going to decide what correct is? Where do I sign? " They could send conscripts to Rwanda for their military training. Maybe as prison guards or something. | |||
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"No your all right let's not embrace it. Let's continue to encourage this age group to go to university and rack up tens of thousands of debt to end up with a useless degree and be over qualified to serve at McDonald's. Let's encourage them to have ridiculous dreams of all becoming influencers when infact it's a ridiculously small percentage who actually does. Let's continue to create the laziest children to adults on the planet a fact as reported last week. Our society has become morbidly obese with type 2 diabetes at epidemic status. I'm not saying all kids are lazy far from it but what we have done is make it easier for people to become lazy and blame everyone else for their health issues. National service may or may not be a good idea but at least if it's done correctly would certainly bridge the gap for many with little to no prospects, and allow those who don't want to go to university breathing time to consider their future. In the meantime it will create adults who can use the time to train in many different areas whilst serving get a trade, medical training the list goes on... As well as this it's gonna encourage and create healthier adults going forward means less likely hood of lifestyle created conditions, it will install a sense of routine that is going to be vital when job hunting. Discipline,self worth and comradeship. Your all seeing negativity . " Tell you what people aren't seeing is the current lengths of time to train military personnel, firefighters and Rnli volunteers etc.. Plus the lack of the actual trainers to take this extra influx on top of the those they do now.. Or the infrastructure etc.. It's a crock of deflection.. | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? " The DBS service will.  | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? The DBS service will. "Good. They'll provide the funding for extra staff then | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? The DBS service will.
Good. They'll provide the funding for extra staff then "If that's what they want, then that's what they will have to do. | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? The DBS service will.
Good. They'll provide the funding for extra staff then
If that's what they want, then that's what they will have to do. "Exactly! This funding is going to have to go a long way. | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? The DBS service will.
Good. They'll provide the funding for extra staff then
If that's what they want, then that's what they will have to do.
Exactly!
This funding is going to have to go a long way. "It's OK, vat on Eton fees. Covers everything! | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? The DBS service will.
Good. They'll provide the funding for extra staff then
If that's what they want, then that's what they will have to do.
Exactly!
This funding is going to have to go a long way.
It's OK, vat on Eton fees. Covers everything! "is this a new Tory policy too ... | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? The DBS service will.
Good. They'll provide the funding for extra staff then
If that's what they want, then that's what they will have to do.
Exactly!
This funding is going to have to go a long way.
It's OK, vat on Eton fees. Covers everything! "VAT on private school fees is a stupid idea that will backfire with a reduced net VAT take (especially once the schools start reclaiming VAT on services and goods) and increases pressure on state school funding as substantial numbers of pupils move across. Oversubscribed good state schools will end up with house prices shooting up further pricing out poorer people. Money saved on school fees paying for bigger mortgage and 1-on-1 tuition so little Johnny still gets their advantage. This is pure punitive politics of envy. | |||
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"Who's going to DBS check all the 18 year olds going to volunteer in care homes? The DBS service will.
Good. They'll provide the funding for extra staff then
If that's what they want, then that's what they will have to do.
Exactly!
This funding is going to have to go a long way.
It's OK, vat on Eton fees. Covers everything!
VAT on private school fees is a stupid idea that will backfire with a reduced net VAT take (especially once the schools start reclaiming VAT on services and goods) and increases pressure on state school funding as substantial numbers of pupils move across.
Oversubscribed good state schools will end up with house prices shooting up further pricing out poorer people. Money saved on school fees paying for bigger mortgage and 1-on-1 tuition so little Johnny still gets their advantage.
This is pure punitive politics of envy."100% Even if 10% take their child/ren out if private that's close to 65k extra students ti find in oversubscribed state schools circling the drain. Not to mention catchment areas going through the rough price wise. | |||
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"It's telling that of all the kick off that officially all Labour is attacking on this scheme is where the funding will come from. Not the scheme itself outside of twitterland. Even David lammy wanted and proposed a scheme like this. " what funding is needed ? | |||
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"What utter nonsense. Do you really think a parent paying £50k a year at Eton is going to move their child to a state school for the sake of an extra £10k. The fees aren't for the boarding and tuition it's for the CV and school tie" Not every private school is Eton. They will have no problem with the 20%. It's the smaller private schools. I know of 2 families that are sending their kids to private schools and he's doing extra work out of the forces and shes being a barmaid at weekends to cover the charge. | |||
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"It's telling that of all the kick off that officially all Labour is attacking on this scheme is where the funding will come from. Not the scheme itself outside of twitterland. Even David lammy wanted and proposed a scheme like this. " Will labour also introduce compulsory national service I wonder? | |||
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"What utter nonsense. Do you really think a parent paying £50k a year at Eton is going to move their child to a state school for the sake of an extra £10k. The fees aren't for the boarding and tuition it's for the CV and school tie" And you went straight to Eton to make your argument. THAT is the issue here. People don’t understand. Of course it won’t affect Eton or Harrow and that top echelon. Those parents are seriously very wealthy and can absorb the 20% increase (in fact many pre-pay or have offshore trust funds covering the cost). The average school fees are c.£15k. A significant majority of parents are high middle income that have made huge sacrifices to pay for this. All from net post tax income. Their kids are not taking state school places saving the tax payer c.£8k per year per kid. A £3k increase will cause up to 25% to leave (four independent studies have now concluded). That means the tax collected via VAT will be lower than Labour’s model AND the schools will become CAT registered so will start claiming back VAT on all services and goods they buy AND all those extra kids in state will now need funding. Bursaries for low income families and scholarships for talented kids will stop meaning ONLY the very wealthy can still afford to attend making it even more elite than now! | |||
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"What utter nonsense. Do you really think a parent paying £50k a year at Eton is going to move their child to a state school for the sake of an extra £10k. The fees aren't for the boarding and tuition it's for the CV and school tie And you went straight to Eton to make your argument. THAT is the issue here. People don’t understand. Of course it won’t affect Eton or Harrow and that top echelon. Those parents are seriously very wealthy and can absorb the 20% increase (in fact many pre-pay or have offshore trust funds covering the cost). The average school fees are c.£15k. A significant majority of parents are high middle income that have made huge sacrifices to pay for this. All from net post tax income. Their kids are not taking state school places saving the tax payer c.£8k per year per kid. A £3k increase will cause up to 25% to leave (four independent studies have now concluded). That means the tax collected via VAT will be lower than Labour’s model AND the schools will become CAT registered so will start claiming back VAT on all services and goods they buy AND all those extra kids in state will now need funding. Bursaries for low income families and scholarships for talented kids will stop meaning ONLY the very wealthy can still afford to attend making it even more elite than now!" was one of these reports the saltus one ? | |||
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"83 actually. So no on here has done it and of the 83 year plus alive few did too. Miners, farmers, merchant seamen, apprentices, anyone in education, anyone with a medical condition, conscientious objectors, clergy, and those with learning difficulties did not do it. If you refused the fine was £5. " My Dad will be 85 in a couple of weeks. He did mandatory national service from 1956, for two years. He joined just as the Suez Crisis was underway. The last DOB for whom NS was compulsory in its previous guise, was 01/10/1939. So anyone 4 months younger than my Dad. Because some people could defer service and complete it at a later date, the last national serviceman was demobbed in 1963. However, they will not have been born after October 1939. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. " If people want to volunteer in charity shops or whatever, they can do that right now. They don't need to wait for the Govt to invite/instruct them. The Govt refers to placements in the NHS, fire or ambulance sectors. These sectors do not have the staff capacity to supervise unqualified "volunteers". Indeed, these sectors currently almost completely ban unpaid work experience (aka volunteering) because they don't have any capacity. Motivated young people looking to shadow medics, nurses, physios etc before applying for uni in these areas are currently turned away or required to enter very competitive application processes just for a few days of shadowing. And I mean shadowing - they sit there and watch. Nothing more. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. " What's the cost of all of this pie in the sky fantasy from the losers? The cons aren't going anywhere but to the unemployment line | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. " They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? " Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? " They know it's not going to happen, they can say what they like. It's not thought out because it doesn't have to be. You are spot on. Mrs x | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown." So these 18yos are just going to hang about and watch in the NHS, fire, ambulance services etc? I wonder what they will be allowed to watch? I know that scrubbing them into a spot of surgery or having them watch as fires are extinguished, is unlikely. More likely they will be watching someone do admin or empty the bins or something of that ilk (if they're allowed on site at all). I couldn't think of any better way to inspire the next generation. I've been to medical appointments where the room is so small that my manual wheelchair does not fit within. Where/how on earth is all this shadowing of over 700,000 young people going to take place?! And at weekends, the NHS runs a skeleton service with barely any routine activity. Perhaps standing in the corner of A&E handing out cups of water, during the 18h waits will be their deployment? | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. So these 18yos are just going to hang about and watch in the NHS, fire, ambulance services etc? I wonder what they will be allowed to watch? I know that scrubbing them into a spot of surgery or having them watch as fires are extinguished, is unlikely. More likely they will be watching someone do admin or empty the bins or something of that ilk (if they're allowed on site at all). I couldn't think of any better way to inspire the next generation. I've been to medical appointments where the room is so small that my manual wheelchair does not fit within. Where/how on earth is all this shadowing of over 700,000 young people going to take place?! And at weekends, the NHS runs a skeleton service with barely any routine activity. Perhaps standing in the corner of A&E handing out cups of water, during the 18h waits will be their deployment? " I'm a little lost with your response, you are making stuff up on how things could work and getting angry about it. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. So these 18yos are just going to hang about and watch in the NHS, fire, ambulance services etc? I wonder what they will be allowed to watch? I know that scrubbing them into a spot of surgery or having them watch as fires are extinguished, is unlikely. More likely they will be watching someone do admin or empty the bins or something of that ilk (if they're allowed on site at all). I couldn't think of any better way to inspire the next generation. I've been to medical appointments where the room is so small that my manual wheelchair does not fit within. Where/how on earth is all this shadowing of over 700,000 young people going to take place?! And at weekends, the NHS runs a skeleton service with barely any routine activity. Perhaps standing in the corner of A&E handing out cups of water, during the 18h waits will be their deployment? I'm a little lost with your response, you are making stuff up on how things could work and getting angry about it. " I'm pointing out that without a wholesale change in how all of these services operate, there's absolute no way huge numbers of 18yos could do anything like meaningful voluntary work or national service. That's all. I'm not angry. I'm not 18. I'd be exempt anyway (cynical of me, I know). My son is older than 18. My daughter probably would be impacted in the future but that's sufficiently far in the future either for something sensible to be enacted or for a subsequent Govt to scrap the idea. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. So these 18yos are just going to hang about and watch in the NHS, fire, ambulance services etc? I wonder what they will be allowed to watch? I know that scrubbing them into a spot of surgery or having them watch as fires are extinguished, is unlikely. More likely they will be watching someone do admin or empty the bins or something of that ilk (if they're allowed on site at all). I couldn't think of any better way to inspire the next generation. I've been to medical appointments where the room is so small that my manual wheelchair does not fit within. Where/how on earth is all this shadowing of over 700,000 young people going to take place?! And at weekends, the NHS runs a skeleton service with barely any routine activity. Perhaps standing in the corner of A&E handing out cups of water, during the 18h waits will be their deployment? I'm a little lost with your response, you are making stuff up on how things could work and getting angry about it. I'm pointing out that without a wholesale change in how all of these services operate, there's absolute no way huge numbers of 18yos could do anything like meaningful voluntary work or national service. That's all. I'm not angry. I'm not 18. I'd be exempt anyway (cynical of me, I know). My son is older than 18. My daughter probably would be impacted in the future but that's sufficiently far in the future either for something sensible to be enacted or for a subsequent Govt to scrap the idea. " The end of next Parliament was mentioned, 2029. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown." Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. So these 18yos are just going to hang about and watch in the NHS, fire, ambulance services etc? I wonder what they will be allowed to watch? I know that scrubbing them into a spot of surgery or having them watch as fires are extinguished, is unlikely. More likely they will be watching someone do admin or empty the bins or something of that ilk (if they're allowed on site at all). I couldn't think of any better way to inspire the next generation. I've been to medical appointments where the room is so small that my manual wheelchair does not fit within. Where/how on earth is all this shadowing of over 700,000 young people going to take place?! And at weekends, the NHS runs a skeleton service with barely any routine activity. Perhaps standing in the corner of A&E handing out cups of water, during the 18h waits will be their deployment? I'm a little lost with your response, you are making stuff up on how things could work and getting angry about it. I'm pointing out that without a wholesale change in how all of these services operate, there's absolute no way huge numbers of 18yos could do anything like meaningful voluntary work or national service. That's all. I'm not angry. I'm not 18. I'd be exempt anyway (cynical of me, I know). My son is older than 18. My daughter probably would be impacted in the future but that's sufficiently far in the future either for something sensible to be enacted or for a subsequent Govt to scrap the idea. The end of next Parliament was mentioned, 2029." Child 2 would not be 18 then. We're talking the Parliament after that, I think, for it to affect us. I'm alright, Jack. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. " It seems you and others are linking insights as I mentioned to fully trained jobs. All areas mentioned will have multiple roles to support the organisation, IT, HR, facilities, finance, logistics and so on. It isn't all about putting out a fire or surgery.... Providing 18 year olds who maybe a little lost the insights to the real world of work is not a bad thing. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. It seems you and others are linking insights as I mentioned to fully trained jobs. All areas mentioned will have multiple roles to support the organisation, IT, HR, facilities, finance, logistics and so on. It isn't all about putting out a fire or surgery.... Providing 18 year olds who maybe a little lost the insights to the real world of work is not a bad thing. " I got that with a job | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. It seems you and others are linking insights as I mentioned to fully trained jobs. All areas mentioned will have multiple roles to support the organisation, IT, HR, facilities, finance, logistics and so on. It isn't all about putting out a fire or surgery.... Providing 18 year olds who maybe a little lost the insights to the real world of work is not a bad thing. I got that with a job" I'm not getting your point, who will this be aimed at, will they be employed or unemployed? | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. It seems you and others are linking insights as I mentioned to fully trained jobs. All areas mentioned will have multiple roles to support the organisation, IT, HR, facilities, finance, logistics and so on. It isn't all about putting out a fire or surgery.... Providing 18 year olds who maybe a little lost the insights to the real world of work is not a bad thing. I got that with a job I'm not getting your point, who will this be aimed at, will they be employed or unemployed? " As I understand it all 18 year olds. 30,000 may apply for a year in the military and everyone else must do voluntary work one weekend a month for a year. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. It seems you and others are linking insights as I mentioned to fully trained jobs. All areas mentioned will have multiple roles to support the organisation, IT, HR, facilities, finance, logistics and so on. It isn't all about putting out a fire or surgery.... Providing 18 year olds who maybe a little lost the insights to the real world of work is not a bad thing. I got that with a job I'm not getting your point, who will this be aimed at, will they be employed or unemployed? As I understand it all 18 year olds. 30,000 may apply for a year in the military and everyone else must do voluntary work one weekend a month for a year. " From the BBC: The Tories have not announced a fully fledged plan. Instead, they have put forward a broad outline and said they would set up a royal commission - a type of public inquiry - tasked with coming up with the details if they win the election. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. It seems you and others are linking insights as I mentioned to fully trained jobs. All areas mentioned will have multiple roles to support the organisation, IT, HR, facilities, finance, logistics and so on. It isn't all about putting out a fire or surgery.... Providing 18 year olds who maybe a little lost the insights to the real world of work is not a bad thing. I got that with a job I'm not getting your point, who will this be aimed at, will they be employed or unemployed? As I understand it all 18 year olds. 30,000 may apply for a year in the military and everyone else must do voluntary work one weekend a month for a year. From the BBC: The Tories have not announced a fully fledged plan. Instead, they have put forward a broad outline and said they would set up a royal commission - a type of public inquiry - tasked with coming up with the details if they win the election. " Yep the BBC is also where I got my information. | |||
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" I got that with a job I'm not getting your point, who will this be aimed at, will they be employed or unemployed? " It will be aimed at all 18 year olds, apparently. Irrespective of whether they have jobs or are attending or will be attending any form of education or training. However, the fact that the party who came up with the idea don't even know what it will mean, means none of us do. Team Manifesto didn't seem to discuss this with the wider Cons party, before unleashing it upon the nation. Interesting as an electoral strategy, certainly. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. It seems you and others are linking insights as I mentioned to fully trained jobs. All areas mentioned will have multiple roles to support the organisation, IT, HR, facilities, finance, logistics and so on. It isn't all about putting out a fire or surgery.... Providing 18 year olds who maybe a little lost the insights to the real world of work is not a bad thing. I got that with a job I'm not getting your point, who will this be aimed at, will they be employed or unemployed? As I understand it all 18 year olds. 30,000 may apply for a year in the military and everyone else must do voluntary work one weekend a month for a year. From the BBC: The Tories have not announced a fully fledged plan. Instead, they have put forward a broad outline and said they would set up a royal commission - a type of public inquiry - tasked with coming up with the details if they win the election. Yep the BBC is also where I got my information. " The actual detail is unknown, would you agree? I have been simply saying that if this scheme was a reality and it offered 18 year olds insights into work and professions they didn't have access to, that is a good thing. The devil is in the detail, which is missing, but the pushback seems to be people assuming a hell of a lot. | |||
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" I got that with a job I'm not getting your point, who will this be aimed at, will they be employed or unemployed? It will be aimed at all 18 year olds, apparently. Irrespective of whether they have jobs or are attending or will be attending any form of education or training. However, the fact that the party who came up with the idea don't even know what it will mean, means none of us do. Team Manifesto didn't seem to discuss this with the wider Cons party, before unleashing it upon the nation. Interesting as an electoral strategy, certainly." It wont in my opinion see the light of day under the tories, it might show up as a rebranded idea though for unemployed 18 year olds as an example | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. It seems you and others are linking insights as I mentioned to fully trained jobs. All areas mentioned will have multiple roles to support the organisation, IT, HR, facilities, finance, logistics and so on. It isn't all about putting out a fire or surgery.... Providing 18 year olds who maybe a little lost the insights to the real world of work is not a bad thing. I got that with a job I'm not getting your point, who will this be aimed at, will they be employed or unemployed? As I understand it all 18 year olds. 30,000 may apply for a year in the military and everyone else must do voluntary work one weekend a month for a year. From the BBC: The Tories have not announced a fully fledged plan. Instead, they have put forward a broad outline and said they would set up a royal commission - a type of public inquiry - tasked with coming up with the details if they win the election. Yep the BBC is also where I got my information. The actual detail is unknown, would you agree? I have been simply saying that if this scheme was a reality and it offered 18 year olds insights into work and professions they didn't have access to, that is a good thing. The devil is in the detail, which is missing, but the pushback seems to be people assuming a hell of a lot." The detail is certainly unknown. | |||
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"Actually it's very hard to get opportunities at young ages, especially those that do rubbish in their gcses. Learning cyber security defence / engineering is great. Not sure why you think serving tea is the only opportunity for volunteering. There are charity shops/ civic pride organisations / etc. Surely it will open up more volunteering ideas/ posts which is better for communities than there is at the moment due to such low uptake. They specifically refer to NHS, fire and ambulance. What opportunities would you give to an untrained, unskilled 18 year old in those fields apart from fairly mundane tasks? Overviews and insights are a valuable commodity that could spark an interest unknown. Look at the training required for the military, fire and Rnli.. Fire used to be 20 weeks basic then you weren't deemed 'competent' till you did a yearly and then a four yearly assessment.. It's now 13 weeks and up to 18 months ongoing assessment on development before deemed competent and if not it's extended.. It seems you and others are linking insights as I mentioned to fully trained jobs. All areas mentioned will have multiple roles to support the organisation, IT, HR, facilities, finance, logistics and so on. It isn't all about putting out a fire or surgery.... Providing 18 year olds who maybe a little lost the insights to the real world of work is not a bad thing. " It's yet another example of the desperation they are in that they can't even coffee together something more definitive on what could be (with funding and more work from the professionals in the various areas) a good alternative to zero hours etc.. But they're so scared of reform they botched it.. | |||
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"The total planning and intention of this "policy" was merely the words "National Service", "mandatory" and "18 year olds". Dog whistles to the gammons. No more, no less. There might or might not be a place for a seriously considered scheme with the intention to provide extra opportunities for young people, however this announcement was not that. Any serious scheme would (a) do everything it could to avoid identification with a 70 year old system that was designed to destroy individualism through a regime of bullying and punishment, (b) be entirely voluntary not mandatory, selling itself to the people taking part in it because they could see it helping them in their career and future life, instead of it being somethng enforced upon them by angry old folk, (c) be something desirable that was open to say anybody under 25 years old to take advantage of at whatever point fitted best within their life plan, rather than being "you will do this at the precise time we say you will do this". Sunak's announcement was deliberately worded as an appeal to angry older men, promising to victimise those on the cusp of adulthood. A nasty policy for nasty people." | |||
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"The total planning and intention of this "policy" was merely the words "National Service", "mandatory" and "18 year olds". Dog whistles to the gammons. No more, no less." I think it was exactly the opposite. It seems to me it was intended to inflame the left and make them jump up and down talking about forced labour, and victimisation of the young. That way when people actually learnt the details it sounded pretty innocuous, with the opposition looking like they are making a fuss over nothing. | |||
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