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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. " It's worth trying. I'm skeptical that we won't get any positive changes and we're stuck with five more years of the same bullshit self serving, division. | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. It's worth trying. I'm skeptical that we won't get any positive changes and we're stuck with five more years of the same bullshit self serving, division." Thats how I feel, but with the knowledge of independents making a stand I may well vote for one of them. | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. It's worth trying. I'm skeptical that we won't get any positive changes and we're stuck with five more years of the same bullshit self serving, division." We will, particularly if Labour get in. | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. It's worth trying. I'm skeptical that we won't get any positive changes and we're stuck with five more years of the same bullshit self serving, division. We will, particularly if Labour get in." I don't think Labour are doing to offer much improvement. Maybe less self servicing and corrupt, but policy-wise they will support big corporations, oil companies, and they seem to be joining in blaming immigrants. | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. It's worth trying. I'm skeptical that we won't get any positive changes and we're stuck with five more years of the same bullshit self serving, division. We will, particularly if Labour get in. I don't think Labour are doing to offer much improvement. Maybe less self servicing and corrupt, but policy-wise they will support big corporations, oil companies, and they seem to be joining in blaming immigrants. " less self serving and corrupt lol yea there all less self serving and corrupt when in opposition, once in power they cant help themselves tory or labour, lets not forget new labour mandleson and his dodgy mortgages, selling peerages,in it up to there necks with the torys on the expenses and how can we forget smilling tony and his illegal war, these people dont ever do whats best for the country, they just wait till they get power and see how they can make there own lives better, you me or anyone else is way down there list of priorities | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. It's worth trying. I'm skeptical that we won't get any positive changes and we're stuck with five more years of the same bullshit self serving, division. We will, particularly if Labour get in. I don't think Labour are doing to offer much improvement. Maybe less self servicing and corrupt, but policy-wise they will support big corporations, oil companies, and they seem to be joining in blaming immigrants. less self serving and corrupt lol yea there all less self serving and corrupt when in opposition, once in power they cant help themselves tory or labour, lets not forget new labour mandleson and his dodgy mortgages, selling peerages,in it up to there necks with the torys on the expenses and how can we forget smilling tony and his illegal war, these people dont ever do whats best for the country, they just wait till they get power and see how they can make there own lives better, you me or anyone else is way down there list of priorities " Can't disagree with you there. I don't believe the system is set up to serve the country. | |||
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"Says who ? " If you are referring to my above post, that will answer the question | |||
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"I was ignoring you, I was asking the guy above" I see, if you used the quote function we could have avoided this. | |||
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"I was ignoring you, I was asking the guy above" I'll take it (if I'm wrong of course just say) that you meant me - this guy is a girl bty. In the last 5 years alone extreme right and populist parties have significantly polarized political thinking all over the world. PR is well known to lend support to such 'parties' getting a foothold in western democracies. This would change significantly our ways of government. For example: If the 2015 UK general election had been held under a PR system, UKIP would have been the third-largest party in Parliament, with 83 seats instead of one. Good news for its supporters but worrying for those who linked the party’s popularity with a resurgence of xenophobia and nationalism. “It is undoubtedly true that PR allows for higher numbers of MPs from ‘non-mainstream’ parties,” said Dylan Difford on the Electoral Reform Society site." Local important issues could become watered down, because the majority support for particular issues could well become a minor support because the spread of voter base. and on and on it goes. | |||
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" “It is undoubtedly true that PR allows for higher numbers of MPs from ‘non-mainstream’ parties,” said Dylan Difford on the Electoral Reform Society site." Local important issues could become watered down, because the majority support for particular issues could well become a minor support because the spread of voter base. and on and on it goes. " Exactly, too many voices nothing gets done, and blocking for concessions. PR is wanted by minority politic views | |||
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" Exactly, too many voices nothing gets done, and blocking for concessions. PR is wanted by minority politic views" "Talk of a so-called “coalition of chaos” made up of Labour, the Lib Dems and SNP was a feature of the Conservatives’ 2015 election campaign and fears of something similar are driving the current Labour leadership to shy away from backing PR." | |||
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" Exactly, too many voices nothing gets done, and blocking for concessions. PR is wanted by minority politic views "Talk of a so-called “coalition of chaos” made up of Labour, the Lib Dems and SNP was a feature of the Conservatives’ 2015 election campaign and fears of something similar are driving the current Labour leadership to shy away from backing PR." "Labour would crumble under PR as you mentioned. Going back to the OP, I find it incredible that a person would vote for a party regardless of their manifesto or beliefs. I would rather spoil my paper than play a part in putting a person in charge of a local community who was potentially not fit for the job. | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. " I’m following on X. These Transphobes need removing from government, but Labour are useless. God knows ! | |||
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" Exactly, too many voices nothing gets done, and blocking for concessions. PR is wanted by minority politic views "Talk of a so-called “coalition of chaos” made up of Labour, the Lib Dems and SNP was a feature of the Conservatives’ 2015 election campaign and fears of something similar are driving the current Labour leadership to shy away from backing PR."
Labour would crumble under PR as you mentioned.
Going back to the OP, I find it incredible that a person would vote for a party regardless of their manifesto or beliefs.
I would rather spoil my paper than play a part in putting a person in charge of a local community who was potentially not fit for the job."I'm claiming anyone with the exception of maybe reform would be more fit for the job the Tories | |||
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" Exactly, too many voices nothing gets done, and blocking for concessions. PR is wanted by minority politic views "Talk of a so-called “coalition of chaos” made up of Labour, the Lib Dems and SNP was a feature of the Conservatives’ 2015 election campaign and fears of something similar are driving the current Labour leadership to shy away from backing PR."
Labour would crumble under PR as you mentioned.
Going back to the OP, I find it incredible that a person would vote for a party regardless of their manifesto or beliefs.
I would rather spoil my paper than play a part in putting a person in charge of a local community who was potentially not fit for the job.
I'm claiming anyone with the exception of maybe reform would be more fit for the job the Tories"You can't surely agree with everyone other than the tories? Voting for me isn't about keeping out it is about promoting in, making your voice heard for what you believe in. You might live in an area that is a strong hold tory seat, voting for your preferred candidate shows your intentions along with the community, if you have enough voting labour the party will be more inclined to fight for more votes in your area than leave it as a stronghold. | |||
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"I get what you are saying, but that's the voting system we have and the Tories use it there advantage, hopefully (although no actual faith that it will happen) if we end up with a labour government they will look to bring in proportional representation and we won't ever have to vote tactically again " labour or the torys wont bring in p.r why would they bring in a system that would more than likley cost them votes | |||
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"If a person would vote for any other party or person than tory, I'm not sure that voter should really be voting. " How would you enforce that? Check to see who has voted not-Tory and remove them from the voting register for next time. Until 100% of the votes are for the Conservatives? | |||
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"But is it democracy? Let's say we have a constituency with 10 voters and 3 candidates, A, B & C. Voter's natural preference is A=4, B=3, C=2 and 1 can't be arsed to vote. But C decide to vote tactically for B, who then wins with 5 votes. So A are disenfranchised by a rigged vote, no?" I think the point is to get the Tories out regardless of anything else. Not sure it is needed this time around as Labour are set to walk it with or without such help. Then we have at least another 5 years of the same stuff just announced by different people. | |||
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"But is it democracy? Let's say we have a constituency with 10 voters and 3 candidates, A, B & C. Voter's natural preference is A=4, B=3, C=2 and 1 can't be arsed to vote. But C decide to vote tactically for B, who then wins with 5 votes. So A are disenfranchised by a rigged vote, no? I think the point is to get the Tories out regardless of anything else. Not sure it is needed this time around as Labour are set to walk it with or without such help. Then we have at least another 5 years of the same stuff just announced by different people." I live in the west of Dorset, the very definition of a safe Conservative seat, as such we have been ignored for decades, tactical voting is pretty much our only chance | |||
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"If a person would vote for any other party or person than tory, I'm not sure that voter should really be voting. How would you enforce that? Check to see who has voted not-Tory and remove them from the voting register for next time. Until 100% of the votes are for the Conservatives?" It is not meant to be a suggestion of enforcement, it was my musings on such an activity. As previously mentioned, switching the vote to a party that stands a better chance of winning even if that party is a party I have never voted for or neither tend too agree with, purely to remove a sitting party seems to be a strange choice. I would not vote at all, or continue to vote for the party manifesto I support for my area, that would show intent even in a stronghold area. This tactic is an example of cancel culture. | |||
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" This tactic is an example of cancel culture." I think you will find that in the abysmal governance of the incumbent party, they have effectively cancelled themselves. . This government are finished. You know it, I know it, everyone knows it. It is a dead man walking. . It just need a general election for voters to pull the life-support plug and end the misery. . If it was a patient in a hospital, it'd be the only one, but it's causing the rest of the hospital and the staff to fall down around it. At this stage it hardly matters who the next patient is, because they are not here yet. But that one festering over there still is, and an awful lot of people are fed up. . Change is coming, and it is about time. | |||
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" This tactic is an example of cancel culture. I think you will find that in the abysmal governance of the incumbent party, they have effectively cancelled themselves. . This government are finished. You know it, I know it, everyone knows it. It is a dead man walking. . It just need a general election for voters to pull the life-support plug and end the misery. . If it was a patient in a hospital, it'd be the only one, but it's causing the rest of the hospital and the staff to fall down around it. At this stage it hardly matters who the next patient is, because they are not here yet. But that one festering over there still is, and an awful lot of people are fed up. . Change is coming, and it is about time." Not disputing that the tories will be out at the GE. I’m calling into question the idea that people should vote for any party other than Tory. It smacks of social media influence in its presentation and does not allow for a full and clear picture that would include the mood of the country and their preferences. | |||
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"If people really want real change in government thats fine by me because I want that too but please dont think voting Labour is the answer because they just the same if not worse. People need to make a bold decision and vote for either Reform, Lib Dems, Greens, Workers Party or any other independent parties because quite frankly the 2 party system suck" Why do YOU think Labour are worse than the Conservatives? What leads you to that conclusion? | |||
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"To date Starmer has walked-back (the new term for u-turned) 27 times, and he's not had a day in power yet. That's not a good indicator of what is to come. " I agree it isn’t. That points to flip flopping which is not exactly unique to Starmer. But not sure how that is “worse”? Still keen to know what CK thinks? BTW what were the 27 times/things? | |||
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"If people really want real change in government thats fine by me because I want that too but please dont think voting Labour is the answer because they just the same if not worse. People need to make a bold decision and vote for either Reform, Lib Dems, Greens, Workers Party or any other independent parties because quite frankly the 2 party system suck Why do YOU think Labour are worse than the Conservatives? What leads you to that conclusion?" As someone has just stated if the Labour leader seems to flip flop on a lot of things its not a quality in leadership to be indecisive and also Labour seems to be on this weird woke agenda to a point where they can't even tell you what a woman is because they too concerned about offending anyone who isn't a woman | |||
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"To date Starmer has walked-back (the new term for u-turned) 27 times, and he's not had a day in power yet. That's not a good indicator of what is to come. I agree it isn’t. That points to flip flopping which is not exactly unique to Starmer. But not sure how that is “worse”? Still keen to know what CK thinks? BTW what were the 27 times/things?" Just google starmer and u-turns | |||
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"To date Starmer has walked-back (the new term for u-turned) 27 times, and he's not had a day in power yet. That's not a good indicator of what is to come. I agree it isn’t. That points to flip flopping which is not exactly unique to Starmer. But not sure how that is “worse”? Still keen to know what CK thinks? BTW what were the 27 times/things? Just google starmer and u-turns" Fair enough Politico does provide a sorry list. So Starmer joins Johnson and Sunak in a long list of uTurns. Seems par for the course. Maybe they are the flip flop political generation? | |||
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"To date Starmer has walked-back (the new term for u-turned) 27 times, and he's not had a day in power yet. That's not a good indicator of what is to come. I agree it isn’t. That points to flip flopping which is not exactly unique to Starmer. But not sure how that is “worse”? Still keen to know what CK thinks? BTW what were the 27 times/things? Just google starmer and u-turns Fair enough Politico does provide a sorry list. So Starmer joins Johnson and Sunak in a long list of uTurns. Seems par for the course. Maybe they are the flip flop political generation?" I suppose they could argue: 'We're listening'. lol | |||
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"To date Starmer has walked-back (the new term for u-turned) 27 times, and he's not had a day in power yet. That's not a good indicator of what is to come. I agree it isn’t. That points to flip flopping which is not exactly unique to Starmer. But not sure how that is “worse”? Still keen to know what CK thinks? BTW what were the 27 times/things? Just google starmer and u-turns Fair enough Politico does provide a sorry list. So Starmer joins Johnson and Sunak in a long list of uTurns. Seems par for the course. Maybe they are the flip flop political generation? I suppose they could argue: 'We're listening'. lol" I do honestly believe this is “focus group politics” where politicians announce things, see the reaction, then keep those that seem popular and ditch the rest. It feels leas about political conviction and ideology and more about simply getting elected. | |||
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"But is it democracy? Let's say we have a constituency with 10 voters and 3 candidates, A, B & C. Voter's natural preference is A=4, B=3, C=2 and 1 can't be arsed to vote. But C decide to vote tactically for B, who then wins with 5 votes. So A are disenfranchised by a rigged vote, no? I think the point is to get the Tories out regardless of anything else. Not sure it is needed this time around as Labour are set to walk it with or without such help. Then we have at least another 5 years of the same stuff just announced by different people. I live in the west of Dorset, the very definition of a safe Conservative seat, as such we have been ignored for decades, tactical voting is pretty much our only chance " I can understand your frustration though I'm not sure the incoming Labour government will change your experiences. We can live in hope though | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. " . Why would anyone want to remove the current government?. All that will happen is increased taxation , greater power to the unions and a failure to tackle illegal immigration . . I prefer to live in a society that awards hard work and responsibility . | |||
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"If a person would vote for any other party or person than tory, I'm not sure that voter should really be voting. How would you enforce that? Check to see who has voted not-Tory and remove them from the voting register for next time. Until 100% of the votes are for the Conservatives? It is not meant to be a suggestion of enforcement, it was my musings on such an activity. As previously mentioned, switching the vote to a party that stands a better chance of winning even if that party is a party I have never voted for or neither tend too agree with, purely to remove a sitting party seems to be a strange choice. I would not vote at all, or continue to vote for the party manifesto I support for my area, that would show intent even in a stronghold area. This tactic is an example of cancel culture." Lol. Love that not voting Tory is now "cancel culture". Amazing  | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. . Why would anyone want to remove the current government?. All that will happen is increased taxation , greater power to the unions and a failure to tackle illegal immigration . . I prefer to live in a society that awards hard work and responsibility . "
Genuinely laughing hard. Absolutely amazing. | |||
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"Time for real change vote Reform" ive tried to follow these guys. But I have no readñ idea of their plans. Other than fund raising. And having issues in doing research into their potential candidates. What do you see in them ? Why are they not the hole between the two cheeks of the same arse ? | |||
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"Time for real change vote Reform" Why? What are they offering that will make a tangible difference to the man in the street? | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. . Why would anyone want to remove the current government?. All that will happen is increased taxation , greater power to the unions and a failure to tackle illegal immigration . . I prefer to live in a society that awards hard work and responsibility . " So when are you leaving the UK? And where is this society you speak of? Fancy some of that! | |||
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"If a person would vote for any other party or person than tory, I'm not sure that voter should really be voting. How would you enforce that? Check to see who has voted not-Tory and remove them from the voting register for next time. Until 100% of the votes are for the Conservatives? It is not meant to be a suggestion of enforcement, it was my musings on such an activity. As previously mentioned, switching the vote to a party that stands a better chance of winning even if that party is a party I have never voted for or neither tend too agree with, purely to remove a sitting party seems to be a strange choice. I would not vote at all, or continue to vote for the party manifesto I support for my area, that would show intent even in a stronghold area. This tactic is an example of cancel culture. Lol. Love that not voting Tory is now "cancel culture". Amazing "If that is what you took away from the post I made, yes it is truly amazing...  | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? " . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. " What success? Give is a clue? I'm not without reservations about a Labour government, but after 13 years of bickering, in-fighting and incompetence, do the Tories deserve another chance? | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. " I suspect many will vote for the lawyer and the deputy. And would not be surprised if that 80 majority swings massively. If that happens we will have to embrace the glorious success of labour and the will of the people. I assume that is how it works. | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. " my point exactly | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. " You forgot the generous motorbility scheme you normally talk about! | |||
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"Reform got policies that I agree to most of them that are common sense which is needed" Can you name a few of these so we can discuss? | |||
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"Reform got policies that I agree to most of them that are common sense which is needed Can you name a few of these so we can discuss?" These have been discussed here many times.... The usual retorts are pipe dreams, populist, racist, not costed. Sounds very much like Labour  | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. You forgot the generous motorbility scheme you normally talk about!" . I think you will find that this government are committed to looking after the less well off in society. | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. You forgot the generous motorbility scheme you normally talk about!. I think you will find that this government are committed to looking after the less well off in society. " Agree - this Govt has been one of the most benevolent, almost socialist, in post-war history. So much so, we are in severe debt, that even the next Labour government will not want to make it any worse. And don't forget when they left office last, that infamous note 'no money left' - it tells you all you need to know. Once again as in 97, the Tories will leave office with a good record, but people just want a change. They care little for record employment, very low unemployment, falling inflation, falling crime, record investment in public service, vaccine success, stop the dinghies, levelling up etc and they have forgotten about record sleaze under 'New' Labour from 97 to 10. Indeed, new new Labour has even begun with Beergate and Angelagate before taking office! That's after you consider Starmers anti-democratic stitch-ups after the widespread blocking of local left wing candidates from selection contests and the sleazefest that was the antisemitism row that engulfed Labour. In the words of Bachman–Turner Overdrive, You Ain't Seen Nothin' Yet Not 'Arf mate! | |||
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"I think you will find that this government are committed to looking after the less well off in society." You might as well just declare you are a Marxist plant, encouraging intentional vitriol towards the tory party. It's a good ruse, stating fanciful things like that to antagonise hostility towards the tory party, but you'd get more support wearing your true colours. | |||
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"I think you will find that this government are committed to looking after the less well off in society. You might as well just declare you are a Marxist plant, encouraging intentional vitriol towards the tory party. It's a good ruse, stating fanciful things like that to antagonise hostility towards the tory party, but you'd get more support wearing your true colours." I am not voting labour, I am going independent. But to those who want to get the tories out like me and will vote labour, I say beware of the party that gets a majority so overwhelming that there is virtually no opposition. Remember what Boris did with his majority the prorogation of parliament among other things, just did what he wanted really due to no opposition. | |||
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"Time for real change vote Reform" They are like the Tories but even more Tory. Vote Reform for even more Torying. | |||
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"Reform got policies that I agree to most of them that are common sense which is needed" Their policies are like the crazy ranting of the d*unk bloke on the bus who won't shut up. There is no sense to their insane ramblings. They think science isn't real and they want teachers to be more hateful, racist and exclusionary. | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. You forgot the generous motorbility scheme you normally talk about!. I think you will find that this government are committed to looking after the less well off in society. Agree - this Govt has been one of the most benevolent, almost socialist, in post-war history. So much so, we are in severe debt, that even the next Labour government will not want to make it any worse. And don't forget when they left office last, that infamous note 'no money left' - it tells you all you need to know. Once again as in 97, the Tories will leave office with a good record, but people just want a change. They care little for record employment, very low unemployment, falling inflation, falling crime, record investment in public service, vaccine success, stop the dinghies, levelling up etc and they have forgotten about record sleaze under 'New' Labour from 97 to 10. Indeed, new new Labour has even begun with Beergate and Angelagate before taking office! That's after you consider Starmers anti-democratic stitch-ups after the widespread blocking of local left wing candidates from selection contests and the sleazefest that was the antisemitism row that engulfed Labour. In the words of Bachman–Turner Overdrive, You Ain't Seen Nothin' Yet Not 'Arf mate! " Lol. Trying to out-Pat Pat? On a serious note, i genuinely believe there are enough people out there who either believe this kind of rhubarb, or will fall for the slick Tory PR machine propaganda to give us five more years of brutal Tory rule. | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. You forgot the generous motorbility scheme you normally talk about!. I think you will find that this government are committed to looking after the less well off in society. Agree - this Govt has been one of the most benevolent, almost socialist, in post-war history. So much so, we are in severe debt, that even the next Labour government will not want to make it any worse. And don't forget when they left office last, that infamous note 'no money left' - it tells you all you need to know. Once again as in 97, the Tories will leave office with a good record, but people just want a change. They care little for record employment, very low unemployment, falling inflation, falling crime, record investment in public service, vaccine success, stop the dinghies, levelling up etc and they have forgotten about record sleaze under 'New' Labour from 97 to 10. Indeed, new new Labour has even begun with Beergate and Angelagate before taking office! That's after you consider Starmers anti-democratic stitch-ups after the widespread blocking of local left wing candidates from selection contests and the sleazefest that was the antisemitism row that engulfed Labour. In the words of Bachman–Turner Overdrive, You Ain't Seen Nothin' Yet Not 'Arf mate! Lol. Trying to out-Pat Pat? On a serious note, i genuinely believe there are enough people out there who either believe this kind of rhubarb, or will fall for the slick Tory PR machine propaganda to give us five more years of brutal Tory rule." Brutal, really? The Conservatives are the most successful political party in the world. No party could achieve that through brutality. So evil, cruel and brutal are the Tories apparently, we have people literally dying to get here on flimsy boats from war-torn France. I thought it was the circumstances they're leaving which are brutal, cruel and evil. Which is it? | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. . Why would anyone want to remove the current government?. All that will happen is increased taxation , greater power to the unions and a failure to tackle illegal immigration . . I prefer to live in a society that awards hard work and responsibility . " Whoever forms the next government will have to increase taxes or reduce spending or both. The Tories are still adding to our £2.6 Billion of national debt on a daily basis. Debt that they increased from £1 Billion in 2010. Legal immigration is nearly 20 times larger that illegal boat crossings, and 75% of those refugees are granted asylum. I will vote to get the Tories out to stop the abuse of workers, stop the croynism in business and give people hope of a better life under a fairer government with decent prospects for everyone, not just for a few priviledged millionaires. | |||
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Nothing Great anymore ...pitiful sums it up. | |||
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"Actually Boris tried to prorogate parlimant months before he won the election with the majority " Correct, but why let the facts get in the way of the predictable Boris bashers! | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. . Why would anyone want to remove the current government?. All that will happen is increased taxation , greater power to the unions and a failure to tackle illegal immigration . . I prefer to live in a society that awards hard work and responsibility . Whoever forms the next government will have to increase taxes or reduce spending or both. The Tories are still adding to our £2.6 Billion of national debt on a daily basis. Debt that they increased from £1 Billion in 2010. Legal immigration is nearly 20 times larger that illegal boat crossings, and 75% of those refugees are granted asylum. I will vote to get the Tories out to stop the abuse of workers, stop the croynism in business and give people hope of a better life under a fairer government with decent prospects for everyone, not just for a few priviledged millionaires. " Why go along with the predictable Tory bashing, what 'abuse of workers'? The Conservatives introduced the National Living Wage in 2016 and have significantly increased it since and recently announced a 2% NI cut!! You know pensioners are protected by the triple lock on top of many other benefits. Introduced in 2011 by the 'cruel' Tories, the lock, which guarantees that the state pension will rise by the highest of inflation, wage growth or 2.5pc, means that the full new state pension is on track to hit £11,502!! The increase in payments is expected to cost the Treasury an extra £2bn. How evil and brutal! | |||
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"Dangerous topic this as people might just vote for more of the same ! 14 Years and nothing to show for it at all except they've turned the clock back to another Victorian era ... Doff your caps to wealthy for they are the masters
Nothing Great anymore ...pitiful sums it up."You also know pensioners are protected by the triple lock on top of many other benefits. Introduced in 2011 by the 'evil' Tories, the lock guarantees that the state pension will rise by the highest of inflation, wage growth or 2.5pc - it means that the full new state pension is now £11,502!! How is that 'nothing to show for it'? How harsh, brutal and uncaring those dastardly Tories are! When Starmer sweeps in, give it 2 or 3 years and people will be already looking to the Tories to clean up a new mess. Has the pandemic cost been forgotten as well as Russia's invasion of Ukraine? Who thinks dealing with the pandemic would have been cost-free under the nightmare of Corbyn's hoped-for 2017 and 2019 victories? Which Starmer vigorously campaigned for! | |||
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"Actually Boris tried to prorogate parlimant months before he won the election with the majority " So if he had that majority he could have, but he didn't lucky miss that. Thanks for the correction. | |||
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"Actually Boris tried to prorogate parlimant months before he won the election with the majority Correct, but why let the facts get in the way of the predictable Boris bashers! " Predictable. | |||
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"Sorry are you claiming a Tory government of 14 years who have led the country into terminal decline, whose achievements can listed as Austerity, Brexit, Liz Truss and uncountable scandles are fit to lead anything ? . A lot of people recognise the success of the Tory Government . The last election was won with an 80 seat majority. Extensive support is given to Ukraine and generous payments were made to those unable to work during Covid . If looks like 14 years of non stop success to me. Why would anyone vote for a lawyer who is unable to define what a women is and a deputy who is under investigation for not paying capital gains tax on the sale of her council house. You forgot the generous motorbility scheme you normally talk about!. I think you will find that this government are committed to looking after the less well off in society. Agree - this Govt has been one of the most benevolent, almost socialist, in post-war history. So much so, we are in severe debt, that even the next Labour government will not want to make it any worse. And don't forget when they left office last, that infamous note 'no money left' - it tells you all you need to know. Once again as in 97, the Tories will leave office with a good record, but people just want a change. They care little for record employment, very low unemployment, falling inflation, falling crime, record investment in public service, vaccine success, stop the dinghies, levelling up etc and they have forgotten about record sleaze under 'New' Labour from 97 to 10. Indeed, new new Labour has even begun with Beergate and Angelagate before taking office! That's after you consider Starmers anti-democratic stitch-ups after the widespread blocking of local left wing candidates from selection contests and the sleazefest that was the antisemitism row that engulfed Labour. In the words of Bachman–Turner Overdrive, You Ain't Seen Nothin' Yet Not 'Arf mate! Lol. Trying to out-Pat Pat? On a serious note, i genuinely believe there are enough people out there who either believe this kind of rhubarb, or will fall for the slick Tory PR machine propaganda to give us five more years of brutal Tory rule. Brutal, really? The Conservatives are the most successful political party in the world. No party could achieve that through brutality. So evil, cruel and brutal are the Tories apparently, we have people literally dying to get here on flimsy boats from war-torn France. I thought it was the circumstances they're leaving which are brutal, cruel and evil. Which is it? " | |||
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"Dangerous topic this as people might just vote for more of the same ! 14 Years and nothing to show for it at all except they've turned the clock back to another Victorian era ... Doff your caps to wealthy for they are the masters
Nothing Great anymore ...pitiful sums it up.
You also know pensioners are protected by the triple lock on top of many other benefits. Introduced in 2011 by the 'evil' Tories, the lock guarantees that the state pension will rise by the highest of inflation, wage growth or 2.5pc - it means that the full new state pension is now £11,502!! How is that 'nothing to show for it'? How harsh, brutal and uncaring those dastardly Tories are! When Starmer sweeps in, give it 2 or 3 years and people will be already looking to the Tories to clean up a new mess.
Has the pandemic cost been forgotten as well as Russia's invasion of Ukraine? Who thinks dealing with the pandemic would have been cost-free under the nightmare of Corbyn's hoped-for 2017 and 2019 victories?
Which Starmer vigorously campaigned for! "triple lock was a lib dem policy irrc. Linking increases to earnings was labour (again irrc) but they lost power before it was all finalised. | |||
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"Dangerous topic this as people might just vote for more of the same ! 14 Years and nothing to show for it at all except they've turned the clock back to another Victorian era ... Doff your caps to wealthy for they are the masters
Nothing Great anymore ...pitiful sums it up.
You also know pensioners are protected by the triple lock on top of many other benefits. Introduced in 2011 by the 'evil' Tories, the lock guarantees that the state pension will rise by the highest of inflation, wage growth or 2.5pc - it means that the full new state pension is now £11,502!! How is that 'nothing to show for it'? How harsh, brutal and uncaring those dastardly Tories are! When Starmer sweeps in, give it 2 or 3 years and people will be already looking to the Tories to clean up a new mess.
Has the pandemic cost been forgotten as well as Russia's invasion of Ukraine? Who thinks dealing with the pandemic would have been cost-free under the nightmare of Corbyn's hoped-for 2017 and 2019 victories?
Which Starmer vigorously campaigned for! triple lock was a lib dem policy irrc.
Linking increases to earnings was labour (again irrc) but they lost power before it was all finalised. "I wouldn't go crowing about Labour. It was after the backlash over the abysmal 75p pension increase in April 2000 (inflation was 1.1%) that Gordon Brown brought in 2 years later the inflation or 2.5% commitment. The Tories then added the earnings link in 2010 when in coalition with Lib Dems who had about 50 seats. Tories had 306 so whoever's idea this was, it was going nowhere without the Tory votes! Trust you're not one of those who says '14 years of Tory cruelty and chaos' when they have been in solo power just 9 years. | |||
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"Dangerous topic this as people might just vote for more of the same ! 14 Years and nothing to show for it at all except they've turned the clock back to another Victorian era ... Doff your caps to wealthy for they are the masters
Nothing Great anymore ...pitiful sums it up.
You also know pensioners are protected by the triple lock on top of many other benefits. Introduced in 2011 by the 'evil' Tories, the lock guarantees that the state pension will rise by the highest of inflation, wage growth or 2.5pc - it means that the full new state pension is now £11,502!! How is that 'nothing to show for it'? How harsh, brutal and uncaring those dastardly Tories are! When Starmer sweeps in, give it 2 or 3 years and people will be already looking to the Tories to clean up a new mess.
Has the pandemic cost been forgotten as well as Russia's invasion of Ukraine? Who thinks dealing with the pandemic would have been cost-free under the nightmare of Corbyn's hoped-for 2017 and 2019 victories?
Which Starmer vigorously campaigned for! triple lock was a lib dem policy irrc.
Linking increases to earnings was labour (again irrc) but they lost power before it was all finalised.
I wouldn't go crowing about Labour. It was after the backlash over the abysmal 75p pension increase in April 2000 (inflation was 1.1%) that Gordon Brown brought in 2 years later the inflation or 2.5% commitment.
The Tories then added the earnings link in 2010 when in coalition with Lib Dems who had about 50 seats. Tories had 306 so whoever's idea this was, it was going nowhere without the Tory votes!
Trust you're not one of those who says '14 years of Tory cruelty and chaos' when they have been in solo power just 9 years. "Based in some quick googling Tories removed the earnings link way back when. Labour introduced a price link. Yes, that resulted in a small increase in 2000. So labour committed to at least 2.5pc and eventually introducing earning increase by 2011. (Pension act 2008) Lib dem manifesto had triple lock. Tory only earnings link (eg not undo 2008 legislation) Yes, Tories had the majority so couldn't have introduced without them. But they also would have had to agree to supporting some lib dem policies to get a coalition. I've not said anything about Tory cruelty here. I'm just pointing out that a stringer example would have been a Tory policy from when they had outright power. Not a lib dem policy from the coalition. It wasnt my example to counteract accusations of 'evil'! | |||
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"What's a stringer example? " stronger. Apols for the typo. Albeit not my worst ! | |||
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"What's a stringer example? stronger. Apols for the typo. Albeit not my worst !" . Anyone who cares about the elderly should continue to vote Conservative . Rachel Reeves has stated that the treatment of pensioners is too generous. Hardly a caring individual with a callous disregard for the elderly. | |||
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"What's a stringer example? stronger. Apols for the typo. Albeit not my worst !. Anyone who cares about the elderly should continue to vote Conservative . Rachel Reeves has stated that the treatment of pensioners is too generous. Hardly a caring individual with a callous disregard for the elderly. " context for this ? | |||
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"What's a stringer example? stronger. Apols for the typo. Albeit not my worst !. Anyone who cares about the elderly should continue to vote Conservative . " Some of your finest material. Real laugh out loud moment. " Rachel Reeves has stated that the treatment of pensioners is too generous. Hardly a caring individual with a callous disregard for the elderly. " Daily Express? | |||
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"What's a stringer example? stronger. Apols for the typo. Albeit not my worst !. Anyone who cares about the elderly should continue to vote Conservative . Some of your finest material. Real laugh out loud moment. Rachel Reeves has stated that the treatment of pensioners is too generous. Hardly a caring individual with a callous disregard for the elderly. Daily Express?" Yes, this is when she appointed an adviser who suggested “codger” pensioners should face higher taxes and be stripped of free TV licences. This was no less than Sir Edward Troup, a former head of HMRC! With the triple lock and Rishi's condemnation of the above, the elderly will only be safe under Conservatives. | |||
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" With the triple lock and Rishi's condemnation of the above, the elderly will only be safe under Conservatives. " Didn't Boris Johnson suggest pensioners should be left to die from Covid? Perhaps in your view he isn't a Conservative? | |||
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" With the triple lock and Rishi's condemnation of the above, the elderly will only be safe under Conservatives. Didn't Boris Johnson suggest pensioners should be left to die from Covid? Perhaps in your view he isn't a Conservative?" . Boris Johnson was PM during the Covid crisis and had to priorities those to whom help should be given should three be a shortage of medical staff staff. Who else would you have preferred to die instead. The remarks made by the adviser to Rachel Reeves were not made during a crisis , they indicated contempt towards the elderly. Boris Johnson was managing the economy during a national crisis and had no choice but to make immediate decisions . | |||
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"With our archaic voting system in certain seats if you want to remove the conservative party you're going to need to vote tactically www.stopthetories.vote Is an independent website that gives you the best candidate to beat the the conservative candidate in your area, it also gives you the history of who won last time and by how much. "  | |||
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" With the triple lock and Rishi's condemnation of the above, the elderly will only be safe under Conservatives. Didn't Boris Johnson suggest pensioners should be left to die from Covid? Perhaps in your view he isn't a Conservative?. Boris Johnson was PM during the Covid crisis and had to priorities those to whom help should be given should three be a shortage of medical staff staff. Who else would you have preferred to die instead. The remarks made by the adviser to Rachel Reeves were not made during a crisis , they indicated contempt towards the elderly. Boris Johnson was managing the economy during a national crisis and had no choice but to make immediate decisions . " That's right, don't worry about the prime minister saying old people should be left to die of Covid, while presumably on his way to a lockdown party. Look over there at someone else who's advisor said something. | |||
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" With the triple lock and Rishi's condemnation of the above, the elderly will only be safe under Conservatives. Didn't Boris Johnson suggest pensioners should be left to die from Covid? Perhaps in your view he isn't a Conservative?. Boris Johnson was PM during the Covid crisis and had to priorities those to whom help should be given should three be a shortage of medical staff staff. Who else would you have preferred to die instead. The remarks made by the adviser to Rachel Reeves were not made during a crisis , they indicated contempt towards the elderly. Boris Johnson was managing the economy during a national crisis and had no choice but to make immediate decisions . " so to confirm: not made by Rachel reeves. Just someone on a panel. Should politicians only apoint yes men to panels ? | |||
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" With the triple lock and Rishi's condemnation of the above, the elderly will only be safe under Conservatives. Didn't Boris Johnson suggest pensioners should be left to die from Covid? Perhaps in your view he isn't a Conservative?. Boris Johnson was PM during the Covid crisis and had to priorities those to whom help should be given should three be a shortage of medical staff staff. Who else would you have preferred to die instead. The remarks made by the adviser to Rachel Reeves were not made during a crisis , they indicated contempt towards the elderly. Boris Johnson was managing the economy during a national crisis and had no choice but to make immediate decisions . so to confirm: not made by Rachel reeves. Just someone on a panel. Should politicians only apoint yes men to panels ? " The point Pat is making, is that people who vote Tory are very easily distracted with a "what about something else". | |||
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" With the triple lock and Rishi's condemnation of the above, the elderly will only be safe under Conservatives. Didn't Boris Johnson suggest pensioners should be left to die from Covid? Perhaps in your view he isn't a Conservative?. Boris Johnson was PM during the Covid crisis and had to priorities those to whom help should be given should three be a shortage of medical staff staff. Who else would you have preferred to die instead. The remarks made by the adviser to Rachel Reeves were not made during a crisis , they indicated contempt towards the elderly. Boris Johnson was managing the economy during a national crisis and had no choice but to make immediate decisions . That's right, don't worry about the prime minister saying old people should be left to die of Covid, while presumably on his way to a lockdown party. Look over there at someone else who's advisor said something. " Priceless! Following a run of posts about the deeply concerning views of Reeves' new advisor, what do you shriek? "Prefer you look at that bloke diverting about something Boris is supposed to have said 4 years ago" | |||
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"No one tells a lie like a dude with a tie "Oh, I don't know. Tony Bliar was often in chinos and a jumper! | |||
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