FabSwingers.com forum: Palestine

By *rabness92 OP Man
over a year ago

Netherlands

If Hamas was hiding in Isreal. Would they take the same approach?

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

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By *egoMan
over a year ago

Preston

Been listening to LBC?

The ultra right wing govt are criminal.

Im glad the world is finally waking up and not succumbing simply to accusations of antisemitism the moment Isreal receives any criticism.

They are carpet bombing civilian areas, then annoyed their actions were being viewed by the world, cut the internet to Palestine. Isreal controls all the resources to Palestine and cuts them frequently, they see land they want and simply take it. Then wonder why they get stones thrown at them and olay victim.

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By *rabness92 OP Man
over a year ago

Netherlands

"Been listening to LBC?

The ultra right wing govt are criminal.

Im glad the world is finally waking up and not succumbing simply to accusations of antisemitism the moment Isreal receives any criticism.

That’s right, I think James O’ Brian is actually right! Just wanted to see what everyone else thinks.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

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By *enSiskoMan
over a year ago

Cestus 3

I think hostages should be swopped as both sides hold hostages.

Stop the murders of civilians.

Let aid in unfettered.

Stop the stealing of land.

Discuss a two state solution as this has been attempted in the past.

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By *rabness92 OP Man
over a year ago

Netherlands

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel."

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

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By *ndycoinsMan
over a year ago

Whaley Bridge,Nr Buxton,

"Been listening to LBC?

The ultra right wing govt are criminal.

Im glad the world is finally waking up and not succumbing simply to accusations of antisemitism the moment Isreal receives any criticism.

Israel are not carpet bombing,they do not have the aerial capability to carpet bomb,they are using precision weapons.91% of Palestine's water is controlled by Palestine.The fuel shortage is because Hamas are stealing fuel to run the generators for their tunnel network.Interesting you Haven't called Hamas criminal for murder torture k1dnap.

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

Politics forum

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

No, that’s what special forces are for. I think Israel would accept a level of theirs own civilian casualties to get rid of Hamas. Indiscriminate rocket attacks are more Hamas style. Even those they like to launch from behind their own innocents. Israel has blood on it’s hands too. It’s a shit sandwich.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

"Politics forum "

Politics forum.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Politics forum

Politics forum. "

Definitely this. Go talk about this there. All you’re doing is wanting to cause friction

Between those that support and don’t

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

Hamas will never accept anything but the total destruction of Israel.

And currently Israel are doing that exact thing to Gaza.

This conflict will cause a deeper schism than before. Just as Israel will remember the day the terrorist slaughtered innocents Gaza will remember how they have been pounded into dust because of the actions of Hamas.

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By *eeperscreepersMan
over a year ago

Tipp & Dublin

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

The Samson option says they might

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

All that's happening is they are creating martyr's on both sides and adding more fuel to the fire.

They have been killing each other for a very long time and no peaceful resolution has ever come about.

Ceasefire after ceasefire that always ends up getting broken.

I don't think we are going to solve the problems on a swinger's forum.

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

Since we have the blessedly sanguine topic of "Palestine - Israel", here's a question:

Why does this topic, more so than many others, elicit such strong feelings from people with no skin in the game, who have never been to either Israel or Palestine, to the point of vitriol on a swingers' forum and demonstrations that can get extraordinarily heated?

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

"If Hamas was hiding in Isreal. Would they take the same approach?

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm"

This is happening on a small scale with their hostages. Hamas claims they've killed some of their own in strikes. Israel is taking the approach that they cannot allow Hamas's control of hostages to hold power over Israel's actions, to make the future prospect of taking hostages less appealing.

But the question could be asked "Would Britain have done to their own people what they did to Dresden" - it kind of makes no sense (not that there is an equivalence at all, just to illustrate a point).

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

"Since we have the blessedly sanguine topic of "Palestine - Israel", here's a question:

Because 'society' tells us we must pick a side. We seen the same with Russia-Ukraine last time round.

We see the same with trans debates too.

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Lots of what if scenarios.

What if Hamas simply returned tbe hostages?

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?"

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Since we have the blessedly sanguine topic of "Palestine - Israel", here's a question:

Because some people have empathy for all the civilian loss of life.

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

"If Hamas was hiding in Isreal. Would they take the same approach?

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm"

Crucially, were Hamas hiding in Israel, the population would not tolerate them and would expel them. By contrast, the population of Gaza tolerates Hamas. Moreover some, if not many, Gazans actively support them. So the situation on the ground, given your question, makes absolutely no sense.

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

"Since we have the blessedly sanguine topic of "Palestine - Israel", here's a question:

Because some people have empathy for all the civilian loss of life."

Especially here, more than the rest of the world?

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By *oversfunCouple
over a year ago

city centre

"Been listening to LBC?

The ultra right wing govt are criminal.

Im glad the world is finally waking up and not succumbing simply to accusations of antisemitism the moment Isreal receives any criticism.

And you know for certain hamas is stealing the fuel ? How do you know?

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Since we have the blessedly sanguine topic of "Palestine - Israel", here's a question:

Because some people have empathy for all the civilian loss of life.

Especially here, more than the rest of the world?"

For sure, the media play a huge role. For example how much do we hear about the various conflicts in Africa? Not much. A cynical person might suggest that if they were reported more heavily, we'd all feel guilty about using products with cobalt and other mineral resources that fuel these atrocities. And maybe slow down our collective rate of consumerism.

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings."

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict."

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?"

Their Govt (Hamas) are doing nothing to protect them. Isn't the first priority of Govt to protect its citizens?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hamas isn’t hiding in Israel.

It is hiding deliberately in the midst of Palestinian civilians, and beneath civilian buildings.

With the obvious aim that when the Israelis attack Palestinian civilians unavoidably get killed and Hamas can feed the images to a sympathetic and gullible Western liberal media.

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

"
yep they would because BN is a blood thirsty ultra right zealot and so are most of his goverment, you think all the damage in the kibbutz was caused by hammas, not a chance, lots of those buildings were hit by tank shells, whole buildings blown to pieces

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Lots of what if scenarios.

What if Hamas simply returned tbe hostages?"
what if Israel returned the land they have taken and stop illegally building on it

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Hamas isn’t hiding in Israel.

It is hiding deliberately in the midst of Palestinian civilians, and beneath civilian buildings.

With the obvious aim that when the Israelis attack Palestinian civilians unavoidably get killed and Hamas can feed the images to a sympathetic and gullible Western liberal media.

Why is it that only the "gullible western liberal media" are opposed to mass murdering women and children?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

yep they would because BN is a blood thirsty ultra right zealot and so are most of his goverment, you think all the damage in the kibbutz was caused by hammas, not a chance, lots of those buildings were hit by tank shells, whole buildings blown to pieces "
Hamas was carrying RPGs that blow up tanks. What do you think it would do to a unarmored building? Conspiracy much ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

yep they would because BN is a blood thirsty ultra right zealot and so are most of his goverment, you think all the damage in the kibbutz was caused by hammas, not a chance, lots of those buildings were hit by tank shells, whole buildings blown to pieces Hamas was carrying RPGs that blow up tanks. What do you think it would do to a unarmored building? Conspiracy much ?"
They used HE ammo designed to take out buildings troops ( Civilians ) and unarmored vehicles.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Maybe Hamas weren’t involved at all. Maybe it is all just a Zionist psyop.

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Lots of what if scenarios.

What if Hamas simply returned tbe hostages?what if Israel returned the land they have taken and stop illegally building on it"

You could go round on 'what ifs' all do really. Is that land more important than human lives?

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Lots of what if scenarios.

What if Hamas simply returned tbe hostages?what if Israel returned the land they have taken and stop illegally building on it

You could go round on 'what ifs' all do really. Is that land more important than human lives?"
tell you wat i will come throw you out your house knock it down and build my own in its place and i expect you to toddle off and do nothing about it?

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Lots of what if scenarios.

What if Hamas simply returned tbe hostages?what if Israel returned the land they have taken and stop illegally building on it

You could go round on 'what ifs' all do really. Is that land more important than human lives?tell you wat i will come throw you out your house knock it down and build my own in its place and i expect you to toddle off and do nothing about it? "

I didn't say that they shouldn't do anything about it.

What happened is you stole some of my land so I attacked your brother, sister and daughter.

And you're telling you'd be cool with that?

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Maybe Hamas weren’t involved at all. Maybe it is all just a Zionist psyop. "
so the isrealis didnt do anything while hammas were holding them hostage in the houses in the kibbutz? Or did it take the army so long to show up there were all gone by the time the milatary decided to rock up,is funny how whenever BN isnt the president the violence is no where near as bad but in the two or three times he has been leader the violence and death is on another level from both sides

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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago

West Wales

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

yep they would because BN is a blood thirsty ultra right zealot and so are most of his goverment, you think all the damage in the kibbutz was caused by hammas, not a chance, lots of those buildings were hit by tank shells, whole buildings blown to pieces Hamas was carrying RPGs that blow up tanks. What do you think it would do to a unarmored building? Conspiracy much ?"

Really? So they use up their RPG’s on building when a little boring dynamite or C4 would do knowing full well the IDF are likely to bring tanks into Gaza itself. Somewhere where tanks are more vulnerable?

I’d be saving those RPG’s for then personally. Have the IDF lost any tanks yet as I’ve not heard of any which is strange if Hamas have multiple RPG’s to lob at buildings isn’t it ??

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?"

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Maybe Hamas weren’t involved at all. Maybe it is all just a Zionist psyop. "

What is Israel is actually in control of hamas.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

yep they would because BN is a blood thirsty ultra right zealot and so are most of his goverment, you think all the damage in the kibbutz was caused by hammas, not a chance, lots of those buildings were hit by tank shells, whole buildings blown to pieces Hamas was carrying RPGs that blow up tanks. What do you think it would do to a unarmored building? Conspiracy much ?

I’d be saving those RPG’s for then personally. Have the IDF lost any tanks yet as I’ve not heard of any which is strange if Hamas have multiple RPG’s to lob at buildings isn’t it ??

S"
You do know they shoot different rounds for different targets. HE and HEAT. You can carry both.

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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago

West Wales

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Maybe Hamas weren’t involved at all. Maybe it is all just a Zionist psyop. so the isrealis didnt do anything while hammas were holding them hostage in the houses in the kibbutz? Or did it take the army so long to show up there were all gone by the time the milatary decided to rock up,is funny how whenever BN isnt the president the violence is no where near as bad but in the two or three times he has been leader the violence and death is on another level from both sides"

It took the IDF 6 hours to respond to the initial attacks in a country covered by a 45 minute helicopter ride or 5 minute fighter jet ride.

Work the rest out yourselves.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Perhaps you need to educate yourself more about events on October 7th as your ramblings suggest that you are quite ignorant.

There is no shortage of coverage of the terrorist attacks and the responses of the Israeli citizens and military, both in video and written narrative. All widely available online.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

But it seems that by and large the same people who think Brexit was a good idea, think the Tories care about British people, and who think climate science is a conspiracy are also the same making any excuse under the sun to avoid saying that it's as bad to kill Palestinian civilians as it is to kill Israeli civilians.

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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago

West Wales

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

yep they would because BN is a blood thirsty ultra right zealot and so are most of his goverment, you think all the damage in the kibbutz was caused by hammas, not a chance, lots of those buildings were hit by tank shells, whole buildings blown to pieces Hamas was carrying RPGs that blow up tanks. What do you think it would do to a unarmored building? Conspiracy much ?

I’d be saving those RPG’s for then personally. Have the IDF lost any tanks yet as I’ve not heard of any which is strange if Hamas have multiple RPG’s to lob at buildings isn’t it ??

S You do know they shoot different rounds for different targets. HE and HEAT. You can carry both."

So how many tanks have the IDF lost in Gaza itself?

If the answer is none it tells me they haven’t.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure."

I don't know if you've seen the news. But there's currently a conflict between Israel and Palestine. Have a look.

Of course that was a silly answer to your silly question.

Absolutely no one is suggesting that Palestinians aren't being mass murdered.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hamas isn’t hiding in Israel.

It is hiding deliberately in the midst of Palestinian civilians, and beneath civilian buildings.

With the obvious aim that when the Israelis attack Palestinian civilians unavoidably get killed and Hamas can feed the images to a sympathetic and gullible Western liberal media.

Why is it that only the "gullible western liberal media" are opposed to mass murdering women and children?"

The only people murdering children is Hamas.

Both in Israel and Gaza.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Hamas isn’t hiding in Israel.

It is hiding deliberately in the midst of Palestinian civilians, and beneath civilian buildings.

With the obvious aim that when the Israelis attack Palestinian civilians unavoidably get killed and Hamas can feed the images to a sympathetic and gullible Western liberal media.

Why is it that only the "gullible western liberal media" are opposed to mass murdering women and children?

The only people murdering children is Hamas.

Both in Israel and Gaza."

A. This is factually incorrect.

B. Even if this was true, why wouldn't you suggest killing women and children is wrong?

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

The same people whomuse logic and take in all facts take time to assess a situation and ask for evidence yet to be provided by certain individual who care more about emotive language than facts

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

I don't know if you've seen the news. But there's currently a conflict between Israel and Palestine. Have a look.

Of course that was a silly answer to your silly question.

Absolutely no one is suggesting that Palestinians aren't being mass murdered."

Please some simple facts.

No emotive language.

Just a number confirmed by independent sources.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"Been listening to LBC?

The ultra right wing govt are criminal.

Im glad the world is finally waking up and not succumbing simply to accusations of antisemitism the moment Isreal receives any criticism.

Just want to point out something with regards to the water and fuel shortage thing

1) to get the water plants to work, you need desalination plants the operational for drinking water… for that you need the generators to work… for that you need fuel …. Isreal is not allowing in any fuel as part of the blockade

2) Isreal is claiming the UN plant that has minimal supplies of fuel left is being used by Hamas… a) UNRWA and UNICEF are saying that is not true,… b) even with the amount that Israel claims Hamas are hoarding, under normal circumstances that supply would only last 12hrs

Again……. Israel is not allowing any fuel in as part of the blockade….

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

"Absolutely no one is suggesting that Palestinians aren't being mass murdered."

Killed, yes. Murder is a debatable topic. While it may be clear to you, others have might a reasonable argument about the use of the word.

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By *estivalMan
over a year ago

borehamwood

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Perhaps you need to educate yourself more about events on October 7th as your ramblings suggest that you are quite ignorant.

There is no shortage of coverage of the terrorist attacks and the responses of the Israeli citizens and military, both in video and written narrative. All widely available online.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hamas isn’t hiding in Israel.

It is hiding deliberately in the midst of Palestinian civilians, and beneath civilian buildings.

With the obvious aim that when the Israelis attack Palestinian civilians unavoidably get killed and Hamas can feed the images to a sympathetic and gullible Western liberal media.

Why is it that only the "gullible western liberal media" are opposed to mass murdering women and children?

The only people murdering children is Hamas.

Both in Israel and Gaza.

A. This is factually incorrect.

B. Even if this was true, why wouldn't you suggest killing women and children is wrong?"

A isn’t incorrect. As we all know the reason why children are being killed in Gaza (if indeed they are - you have yet to verify) is that Hamas deliberately places them in harm’s way. The logical conclusion that we have to draw from your view is that Israel can never defend itself because the terrorists will hide behind children so Israel cannot do anything.

Which of course is your point. You don’t care whether children die or not. You just want Israel not to be able to defend itself. Only you know why that is, but I’m sure we can all “guess”.

As for women, many women fight in the military, including in our military. I am not a misogynist so I don’t take the view that women engaged in military action cannot be legitimate targets.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

The Israeli government and the IDF have setting up the civilian excuses all week

Case in point…. The airstrike of the UN school which had been turned into a civilian shelter yesterday

Israel have the coordinates for every UN building they use in Gaza, be that hospitals, schools, food delivery operations ect….

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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago

West Wales

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Perhaps you need to educate yourself more about events on October 7th as your ramblings suggest that you are quite ignorant.

There is no shortage of coverage of the terrorist attacks and the responses of the Israeli citizens and military, both in video and written narrative. All widely available online.

There were attacks of that there is little doubt, but the size of said attack, the truth of said attacks, the numbers given of Hamas killed in said attacks (1500-2000 UDF figure after two days, when we witnessed none but a few here & there). & the lack of initial response to said attack (6hrs really?) I could almost walk from Tel Aviv to Gaza in that time!

Well tbh, all that is to be taken with a large pillar of salt.

Add in “The largest attack in Israel's history coming just in time to save BN & his hokey Government & the only provable fact is that people are dying & on that score the Palestinians are “Winning” hands down, or probably up some of the time.

So on that front nothing has changed.

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

"It took the IDF 6 hours to respond to the initial attacks in a country covered by a 45 minute helicopter ride or 5 minute fighter jet ride.

Work the rest out yourselves."

Work the rest out yourselves = "Do your own research"?

If Israel were treating this like an invasion, Israel had to assume that up to 10,000 fighters had breached and were establishing offensive and defensive positions. They had no idea in the first few hours.

Sending in anything less than 20K troops would be suicide and 5-1 ratio is a rule of thumb for an assured victory. Imagine sending in 2000 troops to an unknown situation - there could simply be more hostages, deaths and a total rout. Israel would not have that many combat-ready soldiers ready to go - the logistics are just not there. Simply because nobody expected this level of infiltration/invasion. There was the added fear that this could be a decoy for the Northern border, so taking troops from there or even the West Bank was a massive risk. This was all down to the political/intelligence/planning failure.

Responding to a mass-kid-napping operation, fighter jets are borderline useless. Attack helicopters, maybe a bit. Again, Israel had no idea what they were dealing with.

6 hours was shambolic, but certainly not unreasonable from a practical point of view. And much faster than most countries could manage.

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

"As for women, many women fight in the military, including in our military. I am not a misogynist so I don’t take the view that women engaged in military action cannot be legitimate targets. "

You might not be a misogynist, but Hamas are. While women are certainly used, sometimes, in terrorist activities, they are not currently known to be active military members. While some women might be legitimate targets for other reasons, this particular point does not stand to scrutiny.

Article 17 of the 1988 Hamas Covenant stipulates that the role of women in the battle to liberate Palestine is limited to the education of children and support for men.

It's a good read. Eye opening.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure."

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point….

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

"As for women, many women fight in the military, including in our military. I am not a misogynist so I don’t take the view that women engaged in military action cannot be legitimate targets.

Article 17 of the 1988 Hamas Covenant stipulates that the role of women in the battle to liberate Palestine is limited to the education of children and support for men.

It's a good read. Eye opening."

The very same covenant which states:

Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences, are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"As for women, many women fight in the military, including in our military. I am not a misogynist so I don’t take the view that women engaged in military action cannot be legitimate targets.

Article 17 of the 1988 Hamas Covenant stipulates that the role of women in the battle to liberate Palestine is limited to the education of children and support for men.

It's a good read. Eye opening.

The very same covenant which states:

Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences, are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement."
No body would read it. I mentioned it before.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

I don't know if you've seen the news. But there's currently a conflict between Israel and Palestine. Have a look.

Of course that was a silly answer to your silly question.

Absolutely no one is suggesting that Palestinians aren't being mass murdered.

Please some simple facts.

No emotive language.

Just a number confirmed by independent sources."

A. Why don't you find out the exact number yourself

B. Is there a threshold of women and kids being killed that would tip the balance of your opinion from it being cool, to it being unacceptable?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I was raised on the values of the US constitution.

Palestinians are raised on the Hamas covenant that is thier values.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

The same people whomuse logic and take in all facts take time to assess a situation and ask for evidence yet to be provided by certain individual who care more about emotive language than facts "

The be honest. The other stuff is laughable. People arguing brexit was a good idea or science isn't real.

But when you stray into the territory that it's okay to kill some civilians but not others. It's abhorrent.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"The Israeli government and the IDF have setting up the civilian excuses all week

Case in point…. The airstrike of the UN school which had been turned into a civilian shelter yesterday

Israel have the coordinates for every UN building they use in Gaza, be that hospitals, schools, food delivery operations ect…. "

I need to make an apology here… I was misinformed… there wasn’t an IDF air strike on a UN school turned civilian shelter yesterday……..

There were 4……….

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

"The Israeli government and the IDF have setting up the civilian excuses all week

Case in point…. The airstrike of the UN school which had been turned into a civilian shelter yesterday

Israel have the coordinates for every UN building they use in Gaza, be that hospitals, schools, food delivery operations ect….

I need to make an apology here… I was misinformed… there wasn’t an IDF air strike on a UN school turned civilian shelter yesterday……..

There were 4……….

Are we due to get photos similar to the hospital?

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"The Israeli government and the IDF have setting up the civilian excuses all week

Case in point…. The airstrike of the UN school which had been turned into a civilian shelter yesterday

Israel have the coordinates for every UN building they use in Gaza, be that hospitals, schools, food delivery operations ect….

I need to make an apology here… I was misinformed… there wasn’t an IDF air strike on a UN school turned civilian shelter yesterday……..

There were 4……….

Are we due to get photos similar to the hospital?"

Nope… IDF admitted theses ones…… expressed “sorrow” then claimed they were being held as human shields ect ect….

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The Israeli government and the IDF have setting up the civilian excuses all week

Case in point…. The airstrike of the UN school which had been turned into a civilian shelter yesterday

Israel have the coordinates for every UN building they use in Gaza, be that hospitals, schools, food delivery operations ect….

I need to make an apology here… I was misinformed… there wasn’t an IDF air strike on a UN school turned civilian shelter yesterday……..

There were 4……….

Are we due to get photos similar to the hospital?

Nope… IDF admitted theses ones…… expressed “sorrow” then claimed they were being held as human shields ect ect…. "
Then they probably were being used. It is a known tactic of Hamas. The IDF have said that repeatedly so have others.

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

"Nope… IDF admitted theses ones…… expressed “sorrow” then claimed they were being held as human shields ect ect…. "

"Ect ect... [sic]" is a very callous way to belittle the war crime and lives of people held as human shields. The reason that embedding military positions amongst civilians is a war crime is because it directly leads to the death of said civilians.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"The Israeli government and the IDF have setting up the civilian excuses all week

Case in point…. The airstrike of the UN school which had been turned into a civilian shelter yesterday

Israel have the coordinates for every UN building they use in Gaza, be that hospitals, schools, food delivery operations ect….

I need to make an apology here… I was misinformed… there wasn’t an IDF air strike on a UN school turned civilian shelter yesterday……..

There were 4……….

Are we due to get photos similar to the hospital?

Nope… IDF admitted theses ones…… expressed “sorrow” then claimed they were being held as human shields ect ect…. Then they probably were being used. It is a known tactic of Hamas. The IDF have said that repeatedly so have others.

So what you are saying is that the UN specifically open them up as civilian shelters solely because the IDF were bombing the shit leaving people with nowhere else to go… only for Hamas to say “we are taking these over and you are human shields!”

And remember UNRWA personnel have also been killed in these shelter air strikes

Total number of UNRWA/Unicef personnel killed so far…73

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By *otMe66Man
over a year ago

Terra Firma

[Removed by poster at 03/11/23 13:14:53]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Also around 30% of those rockets fail and fall back on Gaza...

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By *otMe66Man
over a year ago

Terra Firma

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point…. "

I assume those figures don’t include the number killed on October 7th by Hamas?

If they don’t, Hamas are responsible for the deaths of approx 3900 people.

Do you think they would do things differently in future, or repeat a similar attack knowing the consequences?

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"Nope… IDF admitted theses ones…… expressed “sorrow” then claimed they were being held as human shields ect ect….

So is bombing hospitals specifically… and collective punishing and entire population! What part of the blockade isn’t collective punishment?

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point….

I assume those figures don’t include the number killed on October 7th by Hamas?

If they don’t, Hamas are responsible for the deaths of approx 3900 people.

Do you think they would do things differently in future, or repeat a similar attack knowing the consequences?"

They don't care about the consequences, we can be sure if that.

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point…. "

Can we get the amount of Palestinians directly killed by Israel please.

I feel this isn't a hard question to understand. But this isnthe 3rd time of asking now.

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

The same people whomuse logic and take in all facts take time to assess a situation and ask for evidence yet to be provided by certain individual who care more about emotive language than facts

The be honest. The other stuff is laughable. People arguing brexit was a good idea or science isn't real.

But when you stray into the territory that it's okay to kill some civilians but not others. It's abhorrent."

To be honest. When you want to make a coherent factual point come back.

Until then you have bothing to offer the discussion but emotive language.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Since we have the blessedly sanguine topic of "Palestine - Israel", here's a question:

This is a really poigant question one in which I have considered my self multiple times over the years..

No one really cares about the Muslims in concentration camps in China. No one cares about what's happening in Burma. The list goes on.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point….

Can we get the amount of Palestinians directly killed by Israel please.

I feel this isn't a hard question to understand. But this isnthe 3rd time of asking now."

That is the number that the international Red Cross have been at as a result of IDF air strikes

That is why I specifically used that number as opposed to the one given by that Gaza health ministry or the Israeli government

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Nope… IDF admitted theses ones…… expressed “sorrow” then claimed they were being held as human shields ect ect….

So is bombing hospitals specifically… and collective punishing and entire population! What part of the blockade isn’t collective punishment? "

So. Can we get a source corroborating that israelmhas bombed multiple hospitals please?

I am aware of the 1 a likely hamas rocket hit the car park of

I am.nkt aware of Israel Bombing multiple hosptials

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point….

Can we get the amount of Palestinians directly killed by Israel please.

I feel this isn't a hard question to understand. But this isnthe 3rd time of asking now.

That is the number that the international Red Cross have been at as a result of IDF air strikes

That is why I specifically used that number as opposed to the one given by that Gaza health ministry or the Israeli government "

OK so we are not getting an answer on how many civilian Palestinians Israel has killed.

Thank you.

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

I have found this.

https://donate.redcross.org.uk/appeal/israel-and-occupied-palestinian-territory-appeal

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Probably, only it would be a lot easier because Hamas couldn’t hide behind an innocent population in Israel.

What if they used Israelis as ‘human shields’ would they still bomb their own children en men and woman? Hospitals, schools, refuge camps etc.

Lots of what if scenarios.

What if Hamas simply returned tbe hostages?what if Israel returned the land they have taken and stop illegally building on it"

Nothing would happen as that's still not good enough for hammas

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

Years ago I would have been surprised Brexit could have got squeezed into a thread like this…….

Not anymore.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point…. "

Red Cross and the Red Cross get there information from the Palestinian ministry of health so not a reliable source... although I do not doubt deaths now are in multiple 1000s

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

""Ect ect... [sic]" is a very callous way to belittle the war crime and lives of people held as human shields. The reason that embedding military positions amongst civilians is a war crime is because it directly leads to the death of said civilians.

So is bombing hospitals specifically… and collective punishing and entire population! What part of the blockade isn’t collective punishment? "

That is, indeed, a valid point to investigate and argue.

It does not take away from the dismissiveness of those used as shields or the crime behind that.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 03/11/23 13:52:48]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

For some their political ideology supersedes their humanity.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

The same people whomuse logic and take in all facts take time to assess a situation and ask for evidence yet to be provided by certain individual who care more about emotive language than facts

The be honest. The other stuff is laughable. People arguing brexit was a good idea or science isn't real.

But when you stray into the territory that it's okay to kill some civilians but not others. It's abhorrent."

It's pretty abhorrent you labeling brexit voters as supporting the mass deaths of Palestinian civilians.

There are loads of left wing lune, ramoner boot lickers who will not condem hammas or the atrocities but it would not be right for me to start labeling all socialist ramain voters as supporters of burning children alive.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

For any Jew angered by the Hamas attack, there is a great option to take out your anger on a Palestinian.

Go to the West Bank and shoot a few Palestinians there.

Ben Gvir Israeli Minister of National Security will not only provide you with the weapons to do so. But will also provide the help of IDF and Israeli Police to round them up for you.

You will not have to worry about any judicial action. Just say they are terrorists or looked funny.

This activity is becoming so popular, they may open it up has a holiday package to non Jews, boosting the economy at the same time.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

The same people whomuse logic and take in all facts take time to assess a situation and ask for evidence yet to be provided by certain individual who care more about emotive language than facts

The be honest. The other stuff is laughable. People arguing brexit was a good idea or science isn't real.

But when you stray into the territory that it's okay to kill some civilians but not others. It's abhorrent.

It's pretty abhorrent you labeling brexit voters as supporting the mass deaths of Palestinian civilians.

I didn't say this. You made it up.

None of this is happening in this thread. So not sure why you're trying to make this comparison.

The loony left (and other standard insulting terms we get called) on here, have all condemned Hamas and their actions. However the same can't be said for those who are coming up with every excuse under the sun to avoid condemning the deaths of Palestinian civilians.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point….

Can we get the amount of Palestinians directly killed by Israel please.

I feel this isn't a hard question to understand. But this isnthe 3rd time of asking now.

That is the number that the international Red Cross have been at as a result of IDF air strikes

That is why I specifically used that number as opposed to the one given by that Gaza health ministry or the Israeli government

OK so we are not getting an answer on how many civilian Palestinians Israel has killed.

Thank you."

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By *ob198XaMan
over a year ago

teleford

"I think hostages should be swopped as both sides hold hostages.

Stop the murders of civilians.

Let aid in unfettered.

Stop the stealing of land.

Discuss a two state solution as this has been attempted in the past."

No two state solution can be discussed whist Palestinians remain committed to a charter that calls for Israel to be destroyed, a charter backed by most Palestinian “civilians”.

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By *ob198XaMan
over a year ago

teleford

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point….

Can we get the amount of Palestinians directly killed by Israel please.

I feel this isn't a hard question to understand. But this isnthe 3rd time of asking now.

That is the number that the international Red Cross have been at as a result of IDF air strikes

That is why I specifically used that number as opposed to the one given by that Gaza health ministry or the Israeli government

OK so we are not getting an answer on how many civilian Palestinians Israel has killed.

Thank you."

Is Gaza surrendering, handing over its weapons, denouncing its ambitions for the destruction of Israel, no, well clearly not enough then.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

The same people whomuse logic and take in all facts take time to assess a situation and ask for evidence yet to be provided by certain individual who care more about emotive language than facts

The be honest. The other stuff is laughable. People arguing brexit was a good idea or science isn't real.

But when you stray into the territory that it's okay to kill some civilians but not others. It's abhorrent.

It's pretty abhorrent you labeling brexit voters as supporting the mass deaths of Palestinian civilians.

I didn't say this. You made it up.

None of this is happening in this thread. So not sure why you're trying to make this comparison.

So all the left wing condemn hammas and all the right wing brecit voters will not condem civilian deaths in Gaza? You are deluded...

The scale of civilian deaths in gaza is disgusting and I am happy to call it out.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"For any Jew angered by the Hamas attack, there is a great option to take out your anger on a Palestinian.

Go to the West Bank and shoot a few Palestinians there.

Ben Gvir Israeli Minister of National Security will not only provide you with the weapons to do so. But will also provide the help of IDF and Israeli Police to round them up for you.

You will not have to worry about any judicial action. Just say they are terrorists or looked funny.

This activity is becoming so popular, they may open it up has a holiday package to non Jews, boosting the economy at the same time."

Wtf?

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

The same people whomuse logic and take in all facts take time to assess a situation and ask for evidence yet to be provided by certain individual who care more about emotive language than facts

The be honest. The other stuff is laughable. People arguing brexit was a good idea or science isn't real.

But when you stray into the territory that it's okay to kill some civilians but not others. It's abhorrent.

It's pretty abhorrent you labeling brexit voters as supporting the mass deaths of Palestinian civilians.

I didn't say this. You made it up.

None of this is happening in this thread. So not sure why you're trying to make this comparison.

So all the left wing condemn hammas and all the right wing brecit voters will not condem civilian deaths in Gaza? You are deluded...

I didn't say that. You made that up.

It's certainly a trend on here. And it genuinely surprised me.

The scale of civilian deaths in gaza is disgusting and I am happy to call it out."

Good to see. I have no comment on you personally, or anyone personally. I was commenting on a trend within the political forum.

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

The amount of word gymnastics on subject is unreal

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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago

West Wales

"For any Jew angered by the Hamas attack, there is a great option to take out your anger on a Palestinian.

Go to the West Bank and shoot a few Palestinians there.

Ben Gvir Israeli Minister of National Security will not only provide you with the weapons to do so. But will also provide the help of IDF and Israeli Police to round them up for you.

You will not have to worry about any judicial action. Just say they are terrorists or looked funny.

This activity is becoming so popular, they may open it up has a holiday package to non Jews, boosting the economy at the same time.

Wtf?"

No WTF, Fact. Settlers in the West Bank have been told to arm themselves, if they cannot then arms will be provided. The IDF are running the West Bank like Apartheid in South Africa. Complain -Arrested, protest the war -Arrested, So far about 140 Palestinian have been snatched in night raids on top of the ones arrested during protests. To dates IDF have killed two twenty somethings while in custody, though apparently they died of natural causes. Israeli settlers have killed at least four of their Palestinian neighbours in the last three days or so.

In total Palestinian dead outside of the Gaza war zone is close or by now over 100.

But Hamas are the enemy & target. You know that Hamas lot who are not in the West Bank ??

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By *resesse_MelioremCouple
over a year ago

Border of London

"But Hamas are the enemy & target. You know that Hamas lot who are not in the West Bank ??"

What makes you so sure about that?

Hamas, themselves, refer to their own operatives there.

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

"For any Jew angered by the Hamas attack, there is a great option to take out your anger on a Palestinian.

Go to the West Bank and shoot a few Palestinians there.

Ben Gvir Israeli Minister of National Security will not only provide you with the weapons to do so. But will also provide the help of IDF and Israeli Police to round them up for you.

You will not have to worry about any judicial action. Just say they are terrorists or looked funny.

This activity is becoming so popular, they may open it up has a holiday package to non Jews, boosting the economy at the same time.

Wtf?

In total Palestinian dead outside of the Gaza war zone is close or by now over 100.

But Hamas are the enemy & target. You know that Hamas lot who are not in the West Bank ??

Hamas are in the West Bank.

Hezbollah are involved in this conflict, as confirmed earlier.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think hostages should be swopped as both sides hold hostages.

Stop the murders of civilians.

Let aid in unfettered.

Stop the stealing of land.

Discuss a two state solution as this has been attempted in the past.

No two state solution can be discussed whist Palestinians remain committed to a charter that calls for Israel to be destroyed, a charter backed by most Palestinian “civilians”. "

You forget to mention Benjamin Netanyahu and his coalition partner Ben Gvir also are not interested in a 2 state solution.

Mr Ben Gvir leads the ultranationalist Otzma Yehudit or "Jewish Power" party which espouses racist, anti-Arab policies. He has previous convictions for inciting racism and supporting terrorism.

So I guess because they are the elected government of Israel, you will agree Israel is not interested in a 2 state solution.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

For some their political ideology supersedes their humanity. "

Sorry missed this, this is what I was getting at.

It did genuinely suprise me.

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

For some their political ideology supersedes their humanity.

Sorry missed this, this is what I was getting at.

It did genuinely suprise me."

As stated to you.

Political ideologubisnt to do with this.

It's about getting facts right

Not using emotions.

Now I don't beleive claims were made of multiple bombings kn hospitals and many children dying and civilians dead in Palestine

I did ask for the independent sources on this a fair few posts back.

Are we any closer?

Or should we chalk this 1 down to

" emotions getting the better of logical discussion" again?

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By *orleymanMan
over a year ago

Leeds

Remember only 1 person inexplicably brought up brexit into this discussion some how.

Truly astounding work.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

For some their political ideology supersedes their humanity.

Sorry missed this, this is what I was getting at.

It did genuinely suprise me.

As stated to you.

Yep

Political ideologubisnt to do with this.

No idea

It's about getting facts right

Not using emotions.

You appear to be the only person in the world disputing what's going on.

Now I don't beleive claims were made of multiple bombings kn hospitals and many children dying and civilians dead in Palestine

Indeed. Even Israel and the IDF have admitted the civilians are being killed.

I did ask for the independent sources on this a fair few posts back.

Okay, what does it prove if a randomer on a swingers site can't give you some exact figures, you already said you don't believe the reality of what's happening.

Are we any closer?

Closer to what?

Or should we chalk this 1 down to

" emotions getting the better of logical discussion" again?"

Whatever works for your denial of the number of civilians being killed.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The amount of word gymnastics on subject is unreal

Like caesfire and pause?

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By *astandFeistyCouple
over a year ago

Bournemouth

"The amount of word gymnastics on subject is unreal

Like caesfire and pause?"

No I didn't say that, you made it up

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Something that genuinely surprised me is that the split in the politics forum has remained the same on this issue.

I genuinely thought there would be universal condemnation of civilians being mass murdered.

For some their political ideology supersedes their humanity.

Sorry missed this, this is what I was getting at.

It did genuinely suprise me.

As stated to you.

Political ideologubisnt to do with this.

It's about getting facts right

Not using emotions.

Now I don't beleive claims were made of multiple bombings kn hospitals and many children dying and civilians dead in Palestine

I did ask for the independent sources on this a fair few posts back.

Are we any closer?

Or should we chalk this 1 down to

" emotions getting the better of logical discussion" again?"

I would say you seem highly emotional. Many have posted once, maybe twice, yet this is at least the 6th time you ask.

I would assume no one is replying as you would ridicule the source or call it fake news, or question if the number came from Hamas.

As another poster said, some peoples ideology comes before their humanity, you seem to be one of them

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Remember only 1 person inexplicably brought up brexit into this discussion some how.

Truly astounding work.

Well on the bright side, brexit has not been blamed for causing the current situation in Israel and Gaza. Yet

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Remember only 1 person inexplicably brought up brexit into this discussion some how.

Truly astounding work.

Well on the bright side, brexit has not been blamed for causing the current situation in Israel and Gaza. Yet "

No but alot of brexitiers "apparently" don't condem the large number of civilian deaths in Gaza and the hands of Isreal..

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

Do you know that thing we said about civilians casualties

Well the IDF just about 30 minutes ago admitted that they were behind the airstrikes on the ambulance convoy leaving the shifa hospital this afternoon…..

That convoy was agreed with the international Red Cross/Red Crescent (you know… that organisation that Morley doesn’t believe is actually impartial) it was supposed to be taking some of the people who were on the emergency support systems to the Rafah crossing for agreed treatment in Egypt

It made it as far as the gates of the hospital before it was attacked

Isreal announced its “regrettable” and “sorrow” for what’s happened…..

And there my friends is a slam dunk “war crime”…..

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By *0shadesOfFilthMan
over a year ago

nearby

All the global politicians currently supporting both Israel or Hamas should be made to do a few days work experience as a porter in a Gazan hospital.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Remember only 1 person inexplicably brought up brexit into this discussion some how.

Truly astounding work.

Well on the bright side, brexit has not been blamed for causing the current situation in Israel and Gaza. Yet "
Give it time. There has been a lot of UK transport aircraft flying in and out of RAF Akrotiri. Seems your government is moving alot of equipment.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"All the global politicians currently supporting both Israel or Hamas should be made to do a few days work experience as a porter in a Gazan hospital. "
why?

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Do you know that thing we said about civilians casualties

Well the IDF just about 30 minutes ago admitted that they were behind the airstrikes on the ambulance convoy leaving the shifa hospital this afternoon…..

It made it as far as the gates of the hospital before it was attacked

Isreal announced its “regrettable” and “sorrow” for what’s happened…..

And there my friends is a slam dunk “war crime”….."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do you know that thing we said about civilians casualties

Well the IDF just about 30 minutes ago admitted that they were behind the airstrikes on the ambulance convoy leaving the shifa hospital this afternoon…..

It made it as far as the gates of the hospital before it was attacked

Isreal announced its “regrettable” and “sorrow” for what’s happened…..

And there my friends is a slam dunk “war crime”…..

This highlights the difference between Israel that as you just confirmed, Israel announces regret and sorrow when innocent civilians are victims where as Hamas openly celebrate killing innocent civilians"
Exactly. Israel stated thier intentions to the Palestinians By texts leaflets and other sources. We are going to bomb here . Move!. Where was Israeli citizens warning?

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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago

West Wales

"Remember only 1 person inexplicably brought up brexit into this discussion some how.

Truly astounding work.

Well on the bright side, brexit has not been blamed for causing the current situation in Israel and Gaza. Yet Give it time. There has been a lot of UK transport aircraft flying in and out of RAF Akrotiri. Seems your government is moving alot of equipment."

We live on one of the routes from the south to the Mach Loop training area. Last few nights we’ve had fighters over in the pitch black. It’s usually only the big transports that practice at night. Sometimes they are low enough the pilots are the same height as we are as we are up on the Cambrians overlooking the Teifi Valley. Bad weather has put a stop to it atm though.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Remember only 1 person inexplicably brought up brexit into this discussion some how.

Truly astounding work.

S"
Mach loop is a pilots dream to do. My husband was a 47 pilot. The closest I got to there was wattisham.

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By *al kalMan
over a year ago

london

"91% of Palestine's water is controlled by Palestine."

Where is the source of this information?

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By *oversfunCouple
over a year ago

city centre

"Do you know that thing we said about civilians casualties

Well the IDF just about 30 minutes ago admitted that they were behind the airstrikes on the ambulance convoy leaving the shifa hospital this afternoon…..

It made it as far as the gates of the hospital before it was attacked

Isreal announced its “regrettable” and “sorrow” for what’s happened…..

And there my friends is a slam dunk “war crime”….."

Il say what i reckon a lot are thinking,isreal are acting like nazis and western goverments are sitting on their arses watching and doing nothing

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do you know that thing we said about civilians casualties

Well the IDF just about 30 minutes ago admitted that they were behind the airstrikes on the ambulance convoy leaving the shifa hospital this afternoon…..

It made it as far as the gates of the hospital before it was attacked

Isreal announced its “regrettable” and “sorrow” for what’s happened…..

And there my friends is a slam dunk “war crime”…..

Il say what i reckon a lot are thinking,isreal are acting like nazis and western goverments are sitting on their arses watching and doing nothing "
Well Jews are one of the one of the most persecuted people on the planet. So yes Americans will sit on their asses. Remember the response to Nazis? A ideology where there was only 1 true race. It's kind of like Hamas ideology. There is only 1 true religion. It's in Hamas's covenant. Thier constitution basically that they indoctrinate generations to accept. It's kind of like me loving my 2A rights and others from others countries disagree.I am not going to change and neither would they. So to enact change it has to be done by force.

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By *oversfunCouple
over a year ago

city centre

"Do you know that thing we said about civilians casualties

Well the IDF just about 30 minutes ago admitted that they were behind the airstrikes on the ambulance convoy leaving the shifa hospital this afternoon…..

It made it as far as the gates of the hospital before it was attacked

Isreal announced its “regrettable” and “sorrow” for what’s happened…..

And there my friends is a slam dunk “war crime”…..

Il say what i reckon a lot are thinking,isreal are acting like nazis and western goverments are sitting on their arses watching and doing nothing Well Jews are one of the one of the most persecuted people on the planet. So yes Americans will sit on their asses. Remember the response to Nazis? A ideology where there was only 1 true race. It's kind of like Hamas ideology. There is only 1 true religion. It's in Hamas's covenant. Thier constitution basically that they indoctrinate generations to accept. It's kind of like me loving my 2A rights and others from others countries disagree.I am not going to change and neither would they. So to enact change it has to be done by force."

Yes what happened to the jews was unbeleivable and wrong so you would think they would know its wrong to kill innocent ppl,and you say remember the response to the nazis?yes the world reacted in shock and horror as they should be now reacting to what is happening in gaza ,and as for hamas they are the lowest of the low but it should be remembered it was hamas who murdered on the 7th oct and not innocent palestinians

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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago

West Wales

"Remember only 1 person inexplicably brought up brexit into this discussion some how.

Truly astounding work.

S Mach loop is a pilots dream to do. My husband was a 47 pilot. The closest I got to there was wattisham."

Ha, Wattisham was relatively only “Up the toad” from where we moved here from

You realise rural North Essex isn’t rural at all once you move to mid Wales. No rush hours & we can drive twenty miles sometimes & not see another car or walk on the Forestry land “Up Top” & not see another soul all day.

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By *otMe66Man
over a year ago

Terra Firma

"Not quite sure what you're saying.

You think hamas can hide in Israel?

Youth think Israel should care not to destroy buildings harbouring terrorists?

I think people are more concerned by the mass murder of civilians, women and children, than they care concerned about destroyed buildings.

Yes as they should be. The mass murder of many Israelis started this conflict.

What about the Palestinian civilians getting mass murdered?

Are they? Do we have independent confirmation of this. Have you got a rough figure.

If you don’t believe Hamas or the IDF for civilian death figures… let’s use a 3rd party source

The international Red Cross/ Red Crescent organisation say that as of last Wednesday they had been present at just over 2500 civilian deaths… and just over 7500 serious injuries…..

How is that as a starting point….

I assume those figures don’t include the number killed on October 7th by Hamas?

If they don’t, Hamas are responsible for the deaths of approx 3900 people.

Do you think they would do things differently in future, or repeat a similar attack knowing the consequences?"

bump....

The number of deaths and injuries that Hamas are responsible for is rising by the hour...

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By *al kalMan
over a year ago

london

"Do you know that thing we said about civilians casualties

Well the IDF just about 30 minutes ago admitted that they were behind the airstrikes on the ambulance convoy leaving the shifa hospital this afternoon…..

It made it as far as the gates of the hospital before it was attacked

Isreal announced its “regrettable” and “sorrow” for what’s happened…..

And there my friends is a slam dunk “war crime”…..

You talk of indoctrination, but there is a ton going on with relation to Israel. So let’s flip the script here, and get some perspective on the other side.

It feels more and more that the Zionism regime, including far right wing Israeli government are the ones that are acting Nazi like. The occupation and persecution and displacement and down right murder of the Palestinian people has been occurring way before the 7th October. 75 years worth of genocide, if people choose to look at the full history, rather than start from

October onwards.

Zionist believe they are “Gods chosen people”and have biblical rights to the land.

The chosen-ness has an angle of ethnic supremacy. This is not the case of all Jewish folk I will add.

This ideology is taught from a young age. Read into the criticism of Birthright organisation.

The Palestinians have been shown to have Caaninite dna, who were the original inhabitants of the land going back to beyond the Abrahamic period.

There is a generally racist attitude towards people of colour also. It was discovered that Ethiopian Jewish woman living in Israel were secretly sterilised by the government, given contraceptive medication without knowledge and consent. So they don’t produce offspring. Doesn’t that sound Nazi like?

Minister of National security Itamar Ben-Gvir, has said it's not a crime for Israeli Jews to spit on Christians. It’s just a tradition. How is that right?

Each year approx 600 Palestinian children are detained by Israeli Military detention, where they are subjected to brutal treatment, sick levels of abuse and lack of care. Some of the children as are young as 12. Often there are no real crimes, just a mechanism to exert fear and enact control on the Palestinians.

Save the Children says these practices are a major and long-standing human rights concern. In the Military courts there is a conviction rate of over 95%, and the fairness is known to be highly questionable.

All the evidence that is being uncovered about the practices of the Israel regime are showing a lot of people what a big charade they have been playing to the western world. Folks are wisening up fast now, even if their governments are slow to, or even even admit to the atrocities that are occurring against the Palestinians.

The end game has always been to annihilate Gaza (then WB), displace the people and take over their lands.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do you know that thing we said about civilians casualties

Well the IDF just about 30 minutes ago admitted that they were behind the airstrikes on the ambulance convoy leaving the shifa hospital this afternoon…..

It made it as far as the gates of the hospital before it was attacked

Isreal announced its “regrettable” and “sorrow” for what’s happened…..

And there my friends is a slam dunk “war crime”…..

You talk of indoctrination, but there is a ton going on with relation to Israel. So let’s flip the script here, and get some perspective on the other side.

October onwards.

Zionist believe they are “Gods chosen people”and have biblical rights to the land.

The chosen-ness has an angle of ethnic supremacy. This is not the case of all Jewish folk I will add.

This ideology is taught from a young age. Read into the criticism of Birthright organisation.

The Palestinians have been shown to have Caaninite dna, who were the original inhabitants of the land going back to beyond the Abrahamic period.

Minister of National security Itamar Ben-Gvir, has said it's not a crime for Israeli Jews to spit on Christians. It’s just a tradition. How is that right?

The end game has always been to annihilate Gaza (then WB), displace the people and take over their lands. "

Why did the Jews choose Israel as their new homeland post WW2? What connection do they have to the land?

Does this Israeli mistreatment of “Palestinian children” extend to beheading them, cutting off limbs, r aping them, burning them alive, murdering their parents in front of them?

Did the Hamas terrorists discriminate about who they killed on October 7th or did they just kill anyone they found regardless of their ethnicity? What efforts did they make to protect the innocent and forewarn them of the attacks?

Why do the Hamas terrorists hide behind children?

What I find quite shocking, and I expect that many others in this country will be the same, is how rife anti semitism clearly is in this country and indeed across the West. The West has imported a massive problem which is just going to get worse. We can now see how easily anti semitism spread across Europe and Germany previously with very little difficulty.

And indeed if I were Israel I’d be looking at the rising anti semitism across the West and thinking that if they don’t deal with the terrorists Hamas now then it’s just going to get more difficult for them in the future.

Hopefully Egypt, Saudi etc will open their hearts and borders and take the Palestinians in. That’s a joke by the way.