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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? 1 BBC 37.7m 2 Mail Online 24.5m 3 The Sun 24.3m 4 Mirror 22.9m 5 The Independent 21.1m 6 The Guardian 20.5m 7 Sky News 18.4m 8 ITV 15.5m 9 The Telegraph 14.6m 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m There is a purpose to this. Its often said that the vast majority of media in this country so hopefully this helps to either confirm or deny that assumption. " My personal opinion: BBC- Neutral Daily Mail - Right The Sun - Right Mirror - Left Independent- Left Guardian - Left Sky - Left ITV - Neutral The Telegraph- Right MSE - Neutral | |||
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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? 1 BBC 37.7m 2 Mail Online 24.5m 3 The Sun 24.3m 4 Mirror 22.9m 5 The Independent 21.1m 6 The Guardian 20.5m 7 Sky News 18.4m 8 ITV 15.5m 9 The Telegraph 14.6m 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m There is a purpose to this. Its often said that the vast majority of media in this country so hopefully this helps to either confirm or deny that assumption. " 1left 2right 3right or left depending on prevailing winds 4left 5left 6left 7left 8 no clue 9 right 10 not a clue | |||
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"Pat is going to be devestated how this thread is going. Is he on the wrong side of public opinion ?" I honestly think Pat is the only person in the UK who may think the DM isn't right-wing. | |||
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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? 1 BBC 37.7m 2 Mail Online 24.5m 3 The Sun 24.3m 4 Mirror 22.9m 5 The Independent 21.1m 6 The Guardian 20.5m 7 Sky News 18.4m 8 ITV 15.5m 9 The Telegraph 14.6m 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m There is a purpose to this. Its often said that the vast majority of media in this country so hopefully this helps to either confirm or deny that assumption. My personal opinion: BBC- Neutral Daily Mail - Right The Sun - Right Mirror - Left Independent- Left Guardian - Left Sky - Left ITV - Neutral The Telegraph- Right MSE - Neutral" I think this evaluation is correct. But the post reminded me of this wonderful scene from Yes, Prime Minister https://youtu.be/DGscoaUWW2M | |||
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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? 1 BBC 37.7m. Left wing , should be privatised and made to compete on the open market 2 Mail Online 24.5m. Right wing. 3 The Sun 24.3m. Right wing . 4 Mirror 22.9m. Left wing . 5 The Independent 21.1m. Left wing . 6 The Guardian 20.5m. Left wing . 7 Sky News 18.4m Left wing 8 ITV 15.5m. Impartial 9 The Telegraph 14.6m. Right wing 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m. Nothing to do with pitics There is a purpose to this. Its often said that the vast majority of media in this country so hopefully this helps to either confirm or deny that assumption. " | |||
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" 1 BBC 37.7m neutral/slight left 2 Mail Online 24.5m tory 3 The Sun 24.3m tory 4 Mirror 22.9m labour 5 The Independent 21.1m none/anti tory 6 The Guardian 20.5m labour 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral/slight right 8 ITV 15.5m neutral/slight right 9 The Telegraph 14.6m tory 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m??? I've had an attempt at party based on (newspapers) who they supported on 2019 and (tv) public sentiment in 2018. I suspect we also have times (tory) if we switch out MSE. " The Times sits in 12th place. I'm nod gonna switch it out for MSE so we can 'add another right-wing paper', that kind of deal feats the object. | |||
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" 1 BBC 37.7m neutral/slight left 2 Mail Online 24.5m tory 3 The Sun 24.3m tory 4 Mirror 22.9m labour 5 The Independent 21.1m none/anti tory 6 The Guardian 20.5m labour 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral/slight right 8 ITV 15.5m neutral/slight right 9 The Telegraph 14.6m tory 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m??? I've had an attempt at party based on (newspapers) who they supported on 2019 and (tv) public sentiment in 2018. I suspect we also have times (tory) if we switch out MSE. The Times sits in 12th place. I'm nod gonna switch it out for MSE so we can 'add another right-wing paper', that kind of deal feats the object." what was 11 then ? | |||
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" 1 BBC 37.7m neutral/slight left 2 Mail Online 24.5m tory 3 The Sun 24.3m tory 4 Mirror 22.9m labour 5 The Independent 21.1m none/anti tory 6 The Guardian 20.5m labour 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral/slight right 8 ITV 15.5m neutral/slight right 9 The Telegraph 14.6m tory 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m??? I've had an attempt at party based on (newspapers) who they supported on 2019 and (tv) public sentiment in 2018. I suspect we also have times (tory) if we switch out MSE. The Times sits in 12th place. I'm nod gonna switch it out for MSE so we can 'add another right-wing paper', that kind of deal feats the object.what was 11 then ? " Metro | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre." That's because you think that you are a centrist, but you're actually on the left, aligned with The Independent. | |||
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" 1 BBC 37.7m neutral/slight left 2 Mail Online 24.5m tory 3 The Sun 24.3m tory 4 Mirror 22.9m labour 5 The Independent 21.1m none/anti tory 6 The Guardian 20.5m labour 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral/slight right 8 ITV 15.5m neutral/slight right 9 The Telegraph 14.6m tory 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m??? I've had an attempt at party based on (newspapers) who they supported on 2019 and (tv) public sentiment in 2018. I suspect we also have times (tory) if we switch out MSE. The Times sits in 12th place. I'm nod gonna switch it out for MSE so we can 'add another right-wing paper', that kind of deal feats the object.what was 11 then ? Metro" Where the rot started, facebook, twitter, Youtube et al. Twitter has been allowed to have a wider spectrum of views, the left wing radicals have their opposites firing on all cylinders. This where a lot of views are formed directly and indirectly. A huge impact on the way people consume information | |||
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" 1 BBC 37.7m neutral/slight left 2 Mail Online 24.5m tory 3 The Sun 24.3m tory 4 Mirror 22.9m labour 5 The Independent 21.1m none/anti tory 6 The Guardian 20.5m labour 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral/slight right 8 ITV 15.5m neutral/slight right 9 The Telegraph 14.6m tory 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m??? I've had an attempt at party based on (newspapers) who they supported on 2019 and (tv) public sentiment in 2018. I suspect we also have times (tory) if we switch out MSE. The Times sits in 12th place. I'm nod gonna switch it out for MSE so we can 'add another right-wing paper', that kind of deal feats the object.what was 11 then ? Metro Where the rot started, facebook, twitter, Youtube et al. Twitter has been allowed to have a wider spectrum of views, the left wing radicals have their opposites firing on all cylinders. This where a lot of views are formed directly and indirectly. A huge impact on the way people consume information " Unchecked ‘news’ that allows lies to become truths if they get enough clicks. | |||
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"I still can't believe that anyone considers Money Saving Expert to be a 'news brand'. But then Hello! magazine is listed in 19th, and even BBC Gardeners' World gets into the top 50. For those who missed the source from the other thread, you need to scroll down to the third bar graph on https://pressgazette.co.uk/media-audience-and-business-data/media_metrics/most-popular-websites-news-uk-monthly-2/" This is what people are consuming as news. If everyone agrees that MSE isn't a news brand we could replace it with Metro (11) - Left. | |||
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"I still can't believe that anyone considers Money Saving Expert to be a 'news brand'. But then Hello! magazine is listed in 19th, and even BBC Gardeners' World gets into the top 50. For those who missed the source from the other thread, you need to scroll down to the third bar graph on https://pressgazette.co.uk/media-audience-and-business-data/media_metrics/most-popular-websites-news-uk-monthly-2/ This is what people are consuming as news. If everyone agrees that MSE isn't a news brand we could replace it with Metro (11) - Left." The metro is not left - it’s owned by the same group as the Mail. It is, at best, very centrist. | |||
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"I still can't believe that anyone considers Money Saving Expert to be a 'news brand'. But then Hello! magazine is listed in 19th, and even BBC Gardeners' World gets into the top 50. For those who missed the source from the other thread, you need to scroll down to the third bar graph on https://pressgazette.co.uk/media-audience-and-business-data/media_metrics/most-popular-websites-news-uk-monthly-2/ This is what people are consuming as news. If everyone agrees that MSE isn't a news brand we could replace it with Metro (11) - Left. The metro is not left - it’s owned by the same group as the Mail. It is, at best, very centrist. " This is all about opinion. You're welcome to give yours on the list. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. That's because you think that you are a centrist, but you're actually on the left, aligned with The Independent." Interesting. Possibly. But where you view the centre line to be very much depends on where you yourself sit on the spectrum (generally because few people, especially Brits, want to admit to themselves how extreme they may be, as we all think of Britain as a balanced moderate country/society). I find it interesting how almost everyone assigned either left or right to all those news sources demonstrating the binary, tribalist, polarised view of politics that now prevails. | |||
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" 1 BBC 37.7m neutral/slight left 2 Mail Online 24.5m tory 3 The Sun 24.3m tory 4 Mirror 22.9m labour 5 The Independent 21.1m none/anti tory 6 The Guardian 20.5m labour 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral/slight right 8 ITV 15.5m neutral/slight right 9 The Telegraph 14.6m tory 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m??? I've had an attempt at party based on (newspapers) who they supported on 2019 and (tv) public sentiment in 2018. I suspect we also have times (tory) if we switch out MSE. The Times sits in 12th place. I'm nod gonna switch it out for MSE so we can 'add another right-wing paper', that kind of deal feats the object.what was 11 then ? Metro" thank you. didn't support a party. | |||
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"I still can't believe that anyone considers Money Saving Expert to be a 'news brand'. But then Hello! magazine is listed in 19th, and even BBC Gardeners' World gets into the top 50. For those who missed the source from the other thread, you need to scroll down to the third bar graph on https://pressgazette.co.uk/media-audience-and-business-data/media_metrics/most-popular-websites-news-uk-monthly-2/ This is what people are consuming as news. If everyone agrees that MSE isn't a news brand we could replace it with Metro (11) - Left. The metro is not left - it’s owned by the same group as the Mail. It is, at best, very centrist. This is all about opinion. You're welcome to give yours on the list. " Aye, that’s fair  | |||
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" 1 BBC 37.7m neutral/slight left 2 Mail Online 24.5m tory 3 The Sun 24.3m tory 4 Mirror 22.9m labour 5 The Independent 21.1m none/anti tory 6 The Guardian 20.5m labour 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral/slight right 8 ITV 15.5m neutral/slight right 9 The Telegraph 14.6m tory 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m??? I've had an attempt at party based on (newspapers) who they supported on 2019 and (tv) public sentiment in 2018. I suspect we also have times (tory) if we switch out MSE. The Times sits in 12th place. I'm nod gonna switch it out for MSE so we can 'add another right-wing paper', that kind of deal feats the object.what was 11 then ? Metro Where the rot started, facebook, twitter, Youtube et al. Twitter has been allowed to have a wider spectrum of views, the left wing radicals have their opposites firing on all cylinders. This where a lot of views are formed directly and indirectly. A huge impact on the way people consume information " 100%. Social media has skewed thinking, created echo chambers, and changed the way people access/consume “news”. If not already done so. I would recommend people watch The Social Dilemma on Netflix. | |||
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"This is what people are consuming as news.." I'm going to disagree. The Press Gazette is only considering those types of organisation that it represents. It's ignoring the elephant in the room which is the social media companies. Ofcom's 'News Consumption in the UK: 2023' report lists BBC1 and ITV as the most viewed news sites, followed by Facebook. After all the other BBC operations, it then lists Sky, Twitter, Channel 4, Instagram, Daily Mail, then WhatsApp. The report makes very depressing reading. | |||
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"This is what people are consuming as news.. I'm going to disagree. The Press Gazette is only considering those types of organisation that it represents. It's ignoring the elephant in the room which is the social media companies. Ofcom's 'News Consumption in the UK: 2023' report lists BBC1 and ITV as the most viewed news sites, followed by Facebook. After all the other BBC operations, it then lists Sky, Twitter, Channel 4, Instagram, Daily Mail, then WhatsApp. The report makes very depressing reading." Does it also factor “push communications”? What I mean by that is things like Apple News on my phone which curates what news items it thinks I should be interested in. An echo chamber self fulfilling prophecy. | |||
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"Does it also factor “push communications”? What I mean by that is things like Apple News on my phone which curates what news items it thinks I should be interested in. An echo chamber self fulfilling prophecy." The research was done to find out where people got their news from. That would include both active searching and 'push communications', but the report doesn't attempt to break that down. I suspect that 'push' is one of the main reasons that the social media companies are so high up on the list. | |||
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"This is what people are consuming as news.. I'm going to disagree. The Press Gazette is only considering those types of organisation that it represents. It's ignoring the elephant in the room which is the social media companies. Ofcom's 'News Consumption in the UK: 2023' report lists BBC1 and ITV as the most viewed news sites, followed by Facebook. After all the other BBC operations, it then lists Sky, Twitter, Channel 4, Instagram, Daily Mail, then WhatsApp. The report makes very depressing reading." I'm assuming ofcoms figures are talking about how many people click through from social media? Or do those sites actually have 'news articles'? | |||
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"I'm assuming ofcoms figures are talking about how many people click through from social media? Or do those sites actually have 'news articles'?" It's from Ofcom carrying out a survey, asking people where they get their news from. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it." Because they're very left wing? | |||
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" 1 BBC 37.7m neutral/slight left 2 Mail Online 24.5m tory 3 The Sun 24.3m tory 4 Mirror 22.9m labour 5 The Independent 21.1m none/anti tory 6 The Guardian 20.5m labour 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral/slight right 8 ITV 15.5m neutral/slight right 9 The Telegraph 14.6m tory 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m??? I've had an attempt at party based on (newspapers) who they supported on 2019 and (tv) public sentiment in 2018. I suspect we also have times (tory) if we switch out MSE. The Times sits in 12th place. I'm nod gonna switch it out for MSE so we can 'add another right-wing paper', that kind of deal feats the object.what was 11 then ? Metro Where the rot started, facebook, twitter, Youtube et al. Twitter has been allowed to have a wider spectrum of views, the left wing radicals have their opposites firing on all cylinders. This where a lot of views are formed directly and indirectly. A huge impact on the way people consume information 100%. Social media has skewed thinking, created echo chambers, and changed the way people access/consume “news”. If not already done so. I would recommend people watch The Social Dilemma on Netflix. " Why I stopped believing headlines and went straight to the data sources as I recommend others do. I cottoned on to the media as a teenager when reading the daily mail the headline for the 2007 democrat primaries " Hilary white vote in (insert American state) proves America is still racist. There was a 2 page full report on tbe democrat primaries between hilary and Obama. Where the author essentially tried using vote turnout as a reason America was still racist the crux being that Hilary received 75% of the white vote. But Obama won the state and was saved because he won 80% of tbe back vote. And this proved white Americans were still racist. This was the day I " woke up" on media sources and their headlines , and decided tk read full articles then check the data myself. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing?" Who? The posters here or the Independent? | |||
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" 1 BBC 37.7m neutral/slight left 2 Mail Online 24.5m tory 3 The Sun 24.3m tory 4 Mirror 22.9m labour 5 The Independent 21.1m none/anti tory 6 The Guardian 20.5m labour 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral/slight right 8 ITV 15.5m neutral/slight right 9 The Telegraph 14.6m tory 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m??? I've had an attempt at party based on (newspapers) who they supported on 2019 and (tv) public sentiment in 2018. I suspect we also have times (tory) if we switch out MSE. The Times sits in 12th place. I'm nod gonna switch it out for MSE so we can 'add another right-wing paper', that kind of deal feats the object.what was 11 then ? Metro Where the rot started, facebook, twitter, Youtube et al. Twitter has been allowed to have a wider spectrum of views, the left wing radicals have their opposites firing on all cylinders. This where a lot of views are formed directly and indirectly. A huge impact on the way people consume information 100%. Social media has skewed thinking, created echo chambers, and changed the way people access/consume “news”. If not already done so. I would recommend people watch The Social Dilemma on Netflix. Why I stopped believing headlines and went straight to the data sources as I recommend others do. I cottoned on to the media as a teenager when reading the daily mail the headline for the 2007 democrat primaries " Hilary white vote in (insert American state) proves America is still racist. There was a 2 page full report on tbe democrat primaries between hilary and Obama. Where the author essentially tried using vote turnout as a reason America was still racist the crux being that Hilary received 75% of the white vote. But Obama won the state and was saved because he won 80% of tbe back vote. And this proved white Americans were still racist. This was the day I " woke up" on media sources and their headlines , and decided tk read full articles then check the data myself. " *tries to work out State via maths*... District of Columbia ? | |||
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"Mostly right wing and/or government supporting." You'll find all media is 'government supporting'. They wouldn't be allowed to operate if they stepped too far out of line. Too many folks on here argue over which puppets are put infront of TV screens. All the real decisions are done behind closed doors by unelected powerful groups and individuals. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing?" In fairness. 99.99999999999% of the population are "very left wing" to those who sit very far to the right, such as yourself (only going off what you post here. In reality, I've no idea where you sit/stand). | |||
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"Mostly right wing and/or government supporting. You'll find all media is 'government supporting'. They wouldn't be allowed to operate if they stepped too far out of line. Too many folks on here argue over which puppets are put infront of TV screens. All the real decisions are done behind closed doors by unelected powerful groups and individuals." Well indeed. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent?" The Independent is left of centre. By some way | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way" By what measure? I really cannot agree. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree." I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/" From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me." You're quoting a 'charity' who has one officer and is also dissolved? Come on mate, you're better than that. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me. You're quoting a 'charity' who has one officer and is also dissolved? Come on mate, you're better than that. " Aren't you always banging on about ignoring the source and believing the data regardless? In anycase. I agree with you on this tack. The source isn't as accurate as it could be. The independent isn't left leaning on every subject. It also largely depends on if you consider left in socio-economic terms or as in tofu eating wokerati, don't blame immigrants or the "trans agenda" for everything. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me. You're quoting a 'charity' who has one officer and is also dissolved? Come on mate, you're better than that. Aren't you always banging on about ignoring the source and believing the data regardless? In anycase. I agree with you on this tack. The source isn't as accurate as it could be. The independent isn't left leaning on every subject. It also largely depends on if you consider left in socio-economic terms or as in tofu eating wokerati, don't blame immigrants or the "trans agenda" for everything. " What data? You're quoting a single person's opinion. | |||
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"From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me." The sentences immediately before that quote say "It was intended to be a centrist newspaper. However, it is now seen as left wing, with its main competition being The Guardian". Did you miss that bit? | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree." Their stance on brexit, being anti free market, anti stopping boats How they report the " pig culling" How they reported " trussnomics" They are certainly not independent. They fall I to the same category as FT for me. Once seen as a unbiased and simply focusing on the news and market. They are now a laughing stock to most. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me." And apparently the dialy mail was right wing . Then it hired a lefty editor and lost a great deal kf it's readership. You can call yourself whatever you want. But I'll judge you on your headlines and analysis | |||
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"Ironically any eocnomist calling themselves free marketeers wouldn't have been pro remain." could they be pro leave either? Both sides seem to want to have a tent that you're either in or out of. | |||
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"I'm assuming ofcoms figures are talking about how many people click through from social media? Or do those sites actually have 'news articles'? It's from Ofcom carrying out a survey, asking people where they get their news from." I'd be inclined to take the Press Gazette figures over a survey where people who 'think' they consume news via Facebook. The reason for this is Facebook et al, are just intermediaries, they're not actually providing news. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me. You're quoting a 'charity' who has one officer and is also dissolved? Come on mate, you're better than that. Aren't you always banging on about ignoring the source and believing the data regardless? In anycase. I agree with you on this tack. The source isn't as accurate as it could be. The independent isn't left leaning on every subject. It also largely depends on if you consider left in socio-economic terms or as in tofu eating wokerati, don't blame immigrants or the "trans agenda" for everything. What data? You're quoting a single person's opinion." So the source is suddenly now important? Interesting. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me. You're quoting a 'charity' who has one officer and is also dissolved? Come on mate, you're better than that. Aren't you always banging on about ignoring the source and believing the data regardless? In anycase. I agree with you on this tack. The source isn't as accurate as it could be. The independent isn't left leaning on every subject. It also largely depends on if you consider left in socio-economic terms or as in tofu eating wokerati, don't blame immigrants or the "trans agenda" for everything. What data? You're quoting a single person's opinion. So the source is suddenly now important? Interesting." You spoke of data. There is no data. I'm not complaining about the source but it's an opinion website. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me. You're quoting a 'charity' who has one officer and is also dissolved? Come on mate, you're better than that. Aren't you always banging on about ignoring the source and believing the data regardless? In anycase. I agree with you on this tack. The source isn't as accurate as it could be. The independent isn't left leaning on every subject. It also largely depends on if you consider left in socio-economic terms or as in tofu eating wokerati, don't blame immigrants or the "trans agenda" for everything. What data? You're quoting a single person's opinion. So the source is suddenly now important? Interesting. You spoke of data. There is no data. I'm not complaining about the source but it's an opinion website." The exact same as the horse shit from the Daily Mail or The Critic which gets defended tooth and nail. Shrug emoji. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me. You're quoting a 'charity' who has one officer and is also dissolved? Come on mate, you're better than that. Aren't you always banging on about ignoring the source and believing the data regardless? In anycase. I agree with you on this tack. The source isn't as accurate as it could be. The independent isn't left leaning on every subject. It also largely depends on if you consider left in socio-economic terms or as in tofu eating wokerati, don't blame immigrants or the "trans agenda" for everything. What data? You're quoting a single person's opinion. So the source is suddenly now important? Interesting. You spoke of data. There is no data. I'm not complaining about the source but it's an opinion website. The exact same as the horse shit from the Daily Mail or The Critic which gets defended tooth and nail. Shrug emoji. " You seem angry. You said you were interested in the media yet you're not showing it here. | |||
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"Do people really think The Independent is “left”? I would say centre. The rest pretty much as most have it. Because they're very left wing? Who? The posters here or the Independent? The Independent is left of centre. By some way By what measure? I really cannot agree. I wouldn't say by 'some way' but left nonetheless. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-independent/ From the website I mentioned above. "The Independent takes a liberal, pro market stance on economic issues meaning it supports free market policies (competition, no/little government control)." Doesn't seem very lefty to me. You're quoting a 'charity' who has one officer and is also dissolved? Come on mate, you're better than that. Aren't you always banging on about ignoring the source and believing the data regardless? In anycase. I agree with you on this tack. The source isn't as accurate as it could be. The independent isn't left leaning on every subject. It also largely depends on if you consider left in socio-economic terms or as in tofu eating wokerati, don't blame immigrants or the "trans agenda" for everything. What data? You're quoting a single person's opinion. So the source is suddenly now important? Interesting. You spoke of data. There is no data. I'm not complaining about the source but it's an opinion website. The exact same as the horse shit from the Daily Mail or The Critic which gets defended tooth and nail. Shrug emoji. You seem angry. You said you were interested in the media yet you're not showing it here. " I'm not angry. But of this is going to descend into the standard bashing the poster instead of the post. Then I'm out. | |||
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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? 1 BBC 37.7m 2 Mail Online 24.5m 3 The Sun 24.3m 4 Mirror 22.9m 5 The Independent 21.1m 6 The Guardian 20.5m 7 Sky News 18.4m 8 ITV 15.5m 9 The Telegraph 14.6m 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m There is a purpose to this. Its often said that the vast majority of media in this country so hopefully this helps to either confirm or deny that assumption. " . The figure for the BBC is very disturbing as we have no choice but to pay a licence fee. We live in a free society and no one should be compelled to buy a licence. It should be a pay to view channel. It is repulsive to think tbat the licence fee money is used to pay Gary Lineker in excess of £ 1.5 million. An individual with no sense of shame and an inflated idea of his own self importance . | |||
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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? 1 BBC 37.7m 2 Mail Online 24.5m 3 The Sun 24.3m 4 Mirror 22.9m 5 The Independent 21.1m 6 The Guardian 20.5m 7 Sky News 18.4m 8 ITV 15.5m 9 The Telegraph 14.6m 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m There is a purpose to this. Its often said that the vast majority of media in this country so hopefully this helps to either confirm or deny that assumption. " . With the exception of the BBC we should all recognise how hard all the employees of these organisations work in order to maintain their readership. In addition we should express our appreciation to the owners or shareholders for the funding provided . | |||
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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? 1 BBC 37.7m 2 Mail Online 24.5m 3 The Sun 24.3m 4 Mirror 22.9m 5 The Independent 21.1m 6 The Guardian 20.5m 7 Sky News 18.4m 8 ITV 15.5m 9 The Telegraph 14.6m 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m There is a purpose to this. Its often said that the vast majority of media in this country so hopefully this helps to either confirm or deny that assumption. . The figure for the BBC is very disturbing as we have no choice but to pay a licence fee. We live in a free society and no one should be compelled to buy a licence. It should be a pay to view channel. It is repulsive to think tbat the licence fee money is used to pay Gary Lineker in excess of £ 1.5 million. An individual with no sense of shame and an inflated idea of his own self importance . " Maybe fact check your claim that "we have no choice but to pay a licence fee"! | |||
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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? 1 BBC 37.7m 2 Mail Online 24.5m 3 The Sun 24.3m 4 Mirror 22.9m 5 The Independent 21.1m 6 The Guardian 20.5m 7 Sky News 18.4m 8 ITV 15.5m 9 The Telegraph 14.6m 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m There is a purpose to this. Its often said that the vast majority of media in this country so hopefully this helps to either confirm or deny that assumption. . With the exception of the BBC we should all recognise how hard all the employees of these organisations work in order to maintain their readership. In addition we should express our appreciation to the owners or shareholders for the funding provided ." Dan Wootton accepts your gratitude. | |||
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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? " 1 BBC 37.7m - Neutral, but sometimes skewed by Westminster bubble groupthink 2 Mail Online 24.5m - right 3 The Sun 24.3m - whatever serves Rupert Murdoch's commercial interests 4 Mirror 22.9m - left 5 The Independent 21.1m - haven't read it for ages so don't know. 6 The Guardian 20.5m - left 7 Sky News 18.4m - as the sun 8 ITV 15.5m - as the BBC 9 The Telegraph 14.6m - right 10 Money Saving Expert 13 - done know | |||
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"I've listed the top 10 media sources in terms of reach in June 2023. Which of these would you say is right wing, left wing, neutral? 1 BBC 37.7m neutral 2 Mail Online 24.5m right leaning 3 The Sun 24.3m right leaning 4 Mirror 22.9m left leaning 5 The Independent 21.1m neutral 6 The Guardian 20.5m left leaning 7 Sky News 18.4m neutral 8 ITV 15.5m neutral 9 The Telegraph 14.6m right leaning 10 Money Saving Expert 13.3m communist!!! There is a purpose to this. Its often said that the vast majority of media in this country so hopefully this helps to either confirm or deny that assumption. " | |||
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"I still can't believe that anyone considers Money Saving Expert to be a 'news brand'. But then Hello! magazine is listed in 19th, and even BBC Gardeners' World gets into the top 50. For those who missed the source from the other thread, you need to scroll down to the third bar graph on https://pressgazette.co.uk/media-audience-and-business-data/media_metrics/most-popular-websites-news-uk-monthly-2/" I actually think its interesting that media for the purpose of saving money sits higher in the list that wider more general media sources. Its likely because he is seen to provide the “well what does this all mean for me” angle that the click bait articles tend to sensationalise instead | |||
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"I'm assuming ofcoms figures are talking about how many people click through from social media? Or do those sites actually have 'news articles'? It's from Ofcom carrying out a survey, asking people where they get their news from. I'd be inclined to take the Press Gazette figures over a survey where people who 'think' they consume news via Facebook. The reason for this is Facebook et al, are just intermediaries, they're not actually providing news. " Perhaps not officially, but if people read something and believe it to be news, wether that be an article from a media source posting on facebook, or senga down the road giving her 2 pence on the events of the day, they still received it as “news”. And that is worth trying to measure because its consumption of 2nd hand, chinese whisper, biased or even just fake news that is dangerous | |||
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"So can we now say that we don't have a vastly right wing media in this country going by the responses here? I think it's a bit of a shame that there's a few notable names who have refused to give there opinion. Maybe I shouldn't be so surprised." It’s not that we don’t have a right wing media.. I think especially in the newspapers section we do…. For example, the times isn’t there… the express isn’t there.. the FT isn’t there …. Probably because those 3 are primarily hidden behind paywalls! It’s that the because they are owned by so few… murdoch owns the sun, the times, the ft and did own sky news…that it amplified the space | |||
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"So can we now say that we don't have a vastly right wing media in this country going by the responses here? I think it's a bit of a shame that there's a few notable names who have refused to give there opinion. Maybe I shouldn't be so surprised. It’s not that we don’t have a right wing media.. I think especially in the newspapers section we do…. For example, the times isn’t there… the express isn’t there.. the FT isn’t there …. Probably because those 3 are primarily hidden behind paywalls! It’s that the because they are owned by so few… murdoch owns the sun, the times, the ft and did own sky news…that it amplified the space " They aren't there because they aren't in the top 10 in terms of views. If any publication is hidden behind a paywall then obviously only people interested in that viewpoint is gonna be reading it. As far as I'm aware The Express isn't behind a pay wall. Also, FT is neutral. By your own opinion, you had 3 right, 3 left and 4 centre/neutral. How does that help you decide we have a right leaning media? | |||
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"So can we now say that we don't have a vastly right wing media in this country going by the responses here? I think it's a bit of a shame that there's a few notable names who have refused to give there opinion. Maybe I shouldn't be so surprised. It’s not that we don’t have a right wing media.. I think especially in the newspapers section we do…. For example, the times isn’t there… the express isn’t there.. the FT isn’t there …. Probably because those 3 are primarily hidden behind paywalls! It’s that the because they are owned by so few… murdoch owns the sun, the times, the ft and did own sky news…that it amplified the space They aren't there because they aren't in the top 10 in terms of views. If any publication is hidden behind a paywall then obviously only people interested in that viewpoint is gonna be reading it. As far as I'm aware The Express isn't behind a pay wall. Also, FT is neutral. By your own opinion, you had 3 right, 3 left and 4 centre/neutral. How does that help you decide we have a right leaning media?" Top 10 in terms of views.. meaning online views You are talking about right wing media…but excluding the physical element of the newspapers You see the FT as neutral… I don’t, I see it as right wing… and the bbc and itv have impartially provisions with licenses as free to air providers where there have to be neutral… sky news doesn’t but I think since the Murdoch sale it’s doing a better job at neutrality The problem is people mistake being neutral with not allowed to criticise | |||
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"So can we now say that we don't have a vastly right wing media in this country going by the responses here? I think it's a bit of a shame that there's a few notable names who have refused to give there opinion. Maybe I shouldn't be so surprised. It’s not that we don’t have a right wing media.. I think especially in the newspapers section we do…. For example, the times isn’t there… the express isn’t there.. the FT isn’t there …. Probably because those 3 are primarily hidden behind paywalls! It’s that the because they are owned by so few… murdoch owns the sun, the times, the ft and did own sky news…that it amplified the space They aren't there because they aren't in the top 10 in terms of views. If any publication is hidden behind a paywall then obviously only people interested in that viewpoint is gonna be reading it. As far as I'm aware The Express isn't behind a pay wall. Also, FT is neutral. By your own opinion, you had 3 right, 3 left and 4 centre/neutral. How does that help you decide we have a right leaning media? Top 10 in terms of views.. meaning online views You are talking about right wing media…but excluding the physical element of the newspapers You see the FT as neutral… I don’t, I see it as right wing… and the bbc and itv have impartially provisions with licenses as free to air providers where there have to be neutral… sky news doesn’t but I think since the Murdoch sale it’s doing a better job at neutrality The problem is people mistake being neutral with not allowed to criticise " I'm not excluding them. They are excluded because there are nowhere near as many physical copies sold as there once was. The Internet has taken over in that sense. If you'd like to go add up the physical copies we can add them to the figures and see if it changes things, I doubt it will. You see Sky News as Neutral, FT as Right. Where as I see Left and Neutral respectively. I guess that's indicative where we sit ourselves. | |||
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"So can we now say that we don't have a vastly right wing media in this country going by the responses here? I think it's a bit of a shame that there's a few notable names who have refused to give there opinion. Maybe I shouldn't be so surprised. It’s not that we don’t have a right wing media.. I think especially in the newspapers section we do…. For example, the times isn’t there… the express isn’t there.. the FT isn’t there …. Probably because those 3 are primarily hidden behind paywalls! It’s that the because they are owned by so few… murdoch owns the sun, the times, the ft and did own sky news…that it amplified the space They aren't there because they aren't in the top 10 in terms of views. If any publication is hidden behind a paywall then obviously only people interested in that viewpoint is gonna be reading it. As far as I'm aware The Express isn't behind a pay wall. Also, FT is neutral. By your own opinion, you had 3 right, 3 left and 4 centre/neutral. How does that help you decide we have a right leaning media? Top 10 in terms of views.. meaning online views You are talking about right wing media…but excluding the physical element of the newspapers You see the FT as neutral… I don’t, I see it as right wing… and the bbc and itv have impartially provisions with licenses as free to air providers where there have to be neutral… sky news doesn’t but I think since the Murdoch sale it’s doing a better job at neutrality The problem is people mistake being neutral with not allowed to criticise " The BBC are far from neutral, recent stories and how they have conducted themselves is there for all to see. | |||
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"So can we now say that we don't have a vastly right wing media in this country going by the responses here? I think it's a bit of a shame that there's a few notable names who have refused to give there opinion. Maybe I shouldn't be so surprised. It’s not that we don’t have a right wing media.. I think especially in the newspapers section we do…. For example, the times isn’t there… the express isn’t there.. the FT isn’t there …. Probably because those 3 are primarily hidden behind paywalls! It’s that the because they are owned by so few… murdoch owns the sun, the times, the ft and did own sky news…that it amplified the space They aren't there because they aren't in the top 10 in terms of views. If any publication is hidden behind a paywall then obviously only people interested in that viewpoint is gonna be reading it. As far as I'm aware The Express isn't behind a pay wall. Also, FT is neutral. By your own opinion, you had 3 right, 3 left and 4 centre/neutral. How does that help you decide we have a right leaning media? Top 10 in terms of views.. meaning online views You are talking about right wing media…but excluding the physical element of the newspapers You see the FT as neutral… I don’t, I see it as right wing… and the bbc and itv have impartially provisions with licenses as free to air providers where there have to be neutral… sky news doesn’t but I think since the Murdoch sale it’s doing a better job at neutrality The problem is people mistake being neutral with not allowed to criticise The BBC are far from neutral, recent stories and how they have conducted themselves is there for all to see. "
The BBC always supports whomever is in government.
Far from neutral. | |||
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"So can we now say that we don't have a vastly right wing media in this country going by the responses here? I think it's a bit of a shame that there's a few notable names who have refused to give there opinion. Maybe I shouldn't be so surprised. It’s not that we don’t have a right wing media.. I think especially in the newspapers section we do…. For example, the times isn’t there… the express isn’t there.. the FT isn’t there …. Probably because those 3 are primarily hidden behind paywalls! It’s that the because they are owned by so few… murdoch owns the sun, the times, the ft and did own sky news…that it amplified the space They aren't there because they aren't in the top 10 in terms of views. If any publication is hidden behind a paywall then obviously only people interested in that viewpoint is gonna be reading it. As far as I'm aware The Express isn't behind a pay wall. Also, FT is neutral. By your own opinion, you had 3 right, 3 left and 4 centre/neutral. How does that help you decide we have a right leaning media? Top 10 in terms of views.. meaning online views You are talking about right wing media…but excluding the physical element of the newspapers You see the FT as neutral… I don’t, I see it as right wing… and the bbc and itv have impartially provisions with licenses as free to air providers where there have to be neutral… sky news doesn’t but I think since the Murdoch sale it’s doing a better job at neutrality The problem is people mistake being neutral with not allowed to criticise The BBC are far from neutral, recent stories and how they have conducted themselves is there for all to see. " If both sides always complain about their perceived coverage then they can’t be that far away from being in the middle… Call it the “equal opportunity pissing off people” approach | |||
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