FabSwingers.com forum: Left wingers & foreigners

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?"

Depends what you define as "British values".

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *valiceslutTV/TS
over a year ago

London

“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”

FIRST THEY CAME By Martin Niemöller

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oubleswing2019Man
over a year ago

Colchester

I'm scratching my head at this one. "British Values". Nope, drawing up blanks on that one. There is no such thing.

Perhaps you meant the "Amsterdam Declaration of 1952" ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?"

I get your point with the hard left, I don’t think they have much time for those of a certain hue from these shores. As for British values, they are fluid and will mean different things to each of us. Bear this in mind, our heroes from the past will vary from Brit to Brit, but probably gives a clue on which way that individual will lean. The Left and the Right are absolutely needed, we get brave ideas from the Left, we get necessary caution from the right. We operate best in the UK with a sprinkling of both. I’m not sure you’ll get much positive feedback on this thread, I think there is a strong lean to the left on these Forums

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

no ... and not just due to the fact that there is no such thing as 'british values' other than being a far-righty trope trotted out by the paranoid when they feel too ranty after reading the garbage in the daily mail or a number of other newspapers. hope this helps

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"I'm scratching my head at this one. "British Values". Nope, drawing up blanks on that one. There is no such thing.

Perhaps you meant the "Amsterdam Declaration of 1952" ?

I think you’ll find that British values go back a bit further than 70 years. Easy to mock and knock of course, actually that’s something Brits are good at. It’s healthy.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"no ... and not just due to the fact that there is no such thing as 'british values' other than being a far-righty trope trotted out by the paranoid when they feel too ranty after reading the garbage in the daily mail or a number of other newspapers. hope this helps "

No help at all. Just the tired old cliche rant.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

" Just the tired old cliche rant."

i knew you would come round to realise that when i showed you the facts.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

" Just the tired old cliche rant.

i knew you would come round to realise that when i showed you the facts.

No facts shown? You must feel very clever.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

" Just the tired old cliche rant.

i knew you would come round to realise that when i showed you the facts.

No facts shown? You must feel very clever."

that's ok chap, no need for the thanks, i'm happy to school you for free.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

" Just the tired old cliche rant.

i knew you would come round to realise that when i showed you the facts.

No facts shown? You must feel very clever.

that's ok chap, no need for the thanks, i'm happy to school you for free.

How strange? Takes all sorts I guess.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I imagine OP you are proud of Britain, if so, me too. We are a wonderful people with a fantastic (but sometimes dark) history. My suggestion is ignore the mouthpieces on the left that do the country down and enjoy the culture

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

British values include tolerance and being fair minded. Neither the far left or far (and not so far) right display these values. There are plenty of non-British people who also respect and display these values and many British who don't. So it's not as black and white as you suggest OP.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

yes, the culture where we have an american whos lineage is a mixture of turkish and german, who is prime minister ... or a education minister who is an iraqi-kurd and so-on and so-forth

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"yes, the culture where we have an american whos lineage is a mixture of turkish and german, who is prime minister ... or a education minister who is an iraqi-kurd and so-on and so-forth

I’m not sure what you are driving at, the OP hasn’t suggested that those with lineage elsewhere should be discounted. We are multi-cultural for sure and there are those with a heritage elsewhere 2 or 3 generations down the line, a wonderful example of our tolerance as it shows as long as you have talent and can get things done, then all is good.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

The left?

What is wrong with the left? they are the ones fighting to expand peoples rights.

The Left: Want more rights for everyone

The Right: Want less rights for all except a select few.

The greatest trick the right ever pulled was convincing people they actually gave a shit about them

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”

FIRST THEY CAME By Martin Niemöller"

There is a lesson to be learned from targeting those who are seen as troublesome, however any pushback of the far left and far right is legit and does not involve eliminating people as the Third Reich did. The OP isn’t advocating a cull

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The left?

What is wrong with the left? they are the ones fighting to expand peoples rights.

The Left: Want more rights for everyone

The Right: Want less rights for all except a select few.

The greatest trick the right ever pulled was convincing people they actually gave a shit about them"

The left are not the sole defenders of rights, the Tories have adjusted legislation whilst in power to protect the rights of those from minority groups. I think the greatest trick the Labour Party have ever produced is to convince the working classes outside of London that they care about their concerns. By the way, none of our current political parties are pure in thought and deed. No one has the monopoly on virtue and certainly on both sides of the House.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”

FIRST THEY CAME By Martin Niemöller

How do we know what the OP advocates? Just because he hasn't posted it ( maybe because it would get deleted and him a 24hr ban )doesn't mean he's not in favour of a cull.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

"yes, the culture where we have an american whos lineage is a mixture of turkish and german, who is prime minister ... or a education minister who is an iraqi-kurd and so-on and so-forth

i'm just pointing out the fact that several of the government are foreigners, which is relevant to the notion presented by the op that foreigners represent a danger to the non-existant idea of collective british values that have never been established in any form.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 03/07/22 11:39:21]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”

FIRST THEY CAME By Martin Niemöller

How do we know what the OP advocates? Just because he hasn't posted it ( maybe because it would get deleted and him a 24hr ban )doesn't mean he's not in favour of a cull."

Work on the basis that the vast majority of people on both sides of the political spectrum are reasonable and don’t think in extreme terms.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?"

Which are the British values being threatened?

What is best for the country?

We'd need to agree on this before saying that lefties and foreigners are a threat

(We probably also need to define foreigners. Is a DNA test needed?)

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”

FIRST THEY CAME By Martin Niemöller

How do we know what the OP advocates? Just because he hasn't posted it ( maybe because it would get deleted and him a 24hr ban )doesn't mean he's not in favour of a cull.

Work on the basis that the vast majority of people on both sides of the political spectrum are reasonable and don’t think in extreme terms. "

you asked me to cut the op some slack until you deleted that post. cutting some slack to extremist far-righty ideology such as that displayed in the op's opening gambit that talks of foreigeners and socialists being a danger to british values is the sort of sickening extremist nonsense that has damaged the fabric of society so irreprabaly.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”

FIRST THEY CAME By Martin Niemöller

How do we know what the OP advocates? Just because he hasn't posted it ( maybe because it would get deleted and him a 24hr ban )doesn't mean he's not in favour of a cull.

Work on the basis that the vast majority of people on both sides of the political spectrum are reasonable and don’t think in extreme terms.

I never deleted a post mate

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”

FIRST THEY CAME By Martin Niemöller

How do we know what the OP advocates? Just because he hasn't posted it ( maybe because it would get deleted and him a 24hr ban )doesn't mean he's not in favour of a cull.

Work on the basis that the vast majority of people on both sides of the political spectrum are reasonable and don’t think in extreme terms.

I never deleted a post mate"

By thosepeoplex2Find posts by thosepeoplex2 Couple 22 minutes ago

Lincoln

[Removed by poster at 03/07/22 11:39:21]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

That might of been the wife, I never deleted anything personally and have only done that on other threads when my typing has been bad

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

"That might of been the wife, I never deleted anything personally and have only done that on other threads when my typing has been bad"

it may have been, however your profile deleted a post made by your profile, which is what i responded to for the record, despite the censorship attempt.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"That might of been the wife, I never deleted anything personally and have only done that on other threads when my typing has been bad

it may have been, however your profile deleted a post made by your profile, which is what i responded to for the record, despite the censorship attempt.

Censorship attempt? Do you recall what was posted prior to deletion? I can assure you I have no views that I wouldn’t be comfortable putting in print

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"The left?

What is wrong with the left? they are the ones fighting to expand peoples rights.

The Left: Want more rights for everyone

The Right: Want less rights for all except a select few.

The greatest trick the right ever pulled was convincing people they actually gave a shit about them

The implication that Labour are left?

Nope, none of the three major parties in the UK are left.

Lib Dem Centre-Right

Labour Centre-Right

Conservative Right-Right and getting further right daily.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What are ‘British values’ it’s difficult to comment on a vague statement with no real meaning

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What are ‘British values’ it’s difficult to comment on a vague statement with no real meaning "

Having seen Roe V Wade, having seen discussion on sl@very, thinking about our attitude to LGBT+ issues versus some other parts of Europe, I'd say a British value is the willingness to change our attitudes for the better, and not get hung up on what our forefathers believed.

We have our dark history for sure. Maybe I have a bias here, but I think we also are as good as anyone at leading the way in making improvements to lead ourselves out or the darkness.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What are ‘British values’ it’s difficult to comment on a vague statement with no real meaning

We have our dark history for sure. Maybe I have a bias here, but I think we also are as good as anyone at leading the way in making improvements to lead ourselves out or the darkness. "

I agree, is this opinion shared by the OP?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"What are ‘British values’ it’s difficult to comment on a vague statement with no real meaning

We have our dark history for sure. Maybe I have a bias here, but I think we also are as good as anyone at leading the way in making improvements to lead ourselves out or the darkness.

I agree, is this opinion shared by the OP? "

Indeed it is. An openness to adapt and change, welcoming new ways and not being rigid to an old dogma could be seen as a good British value.

A am a little taken aback that people that I am assuming grew up in the UK and have reached an age have very little idea of British values. Maybe they are just taken for granted.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What are ‘British values’ it’s difficult to comment on a vague statement with no real meaning

We have our dark history for sure. Maybe I have a bias here, but I think we also are as good as anyone at leading the way in making improvements to lead ourselves out or the darkness.

I agree, is this opinion shared by the OP?

Indeed it is. An openness to adapt and change, welcoming new ways and not being rigid to an old dogma could be seen as a good British value.

A am a little taken aback that people that I am assuming grew up in the UK and have reached an age have very little idea of British values. Maybe they are just taken for granted."

Why don’t you list them?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

[Removed by poster at 03/07/22 13:56:26]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"I think there is a strong lean to the left on these Forums spot in there and it’s a very strong lean to the left "

This is the best joke I have read in at least a month

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"I think there is a strong lean to the left on these Forums spot in there and it’s a very strong lean to the left

This is the best joke I have read in at least a month"
are you nee in here pmsl

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"I think there is a strong lean to the left on these Forums spot in there and it’s a very strong lean to the left

This is the best joke I have read in at least a monthare you nee in here pmsl"

In the time here I have seen a constant slew of right wing talking points being promoted

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

Stick around then you will soon see the loonie lefties lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Stick around then you will soon see the loonie lefties lol"

You must have a list of ‘British Values ‘ ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Stick around then you will soon see the loonie lefties lol

You must have a list of ‘British Values ‘ ?

Why the inverted commas? Do you scoff at the thought?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Stick around then you will soon see the loonie lefties lol

You must have a list of ‘British Values ‘ ?

Why the inverted commas? Do you scoff at the thought? "

The quotation marks? To highlight what you said, anyway, this list?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"The left?

What is wrong with the left? they are the ones fighting to expand peoples rights.

The Left: Want more rights for everyone

The Right: Want less rights for all except a select few.

The greatest trick the right ever pulled was convincing people they actually gave a shit about them

Maybe browsing the voting record of the Tory MPs would correct this misperception you have.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Stick around then you will soon see the loonie lefties lol

You must have a list of ‘British Values ‘ ?

Why the inverted commas? Do you scoff at the thought? "

I'm fairness. This debate is pointless without defining what British values are.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Stick around then you will soon see the loonie lefties lol"

The fab definition of "Loonie lefties" is anyone who questions anything and thinks that Britain deserves better than the shower of wankers in charge at the moment.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

I agree , they are all great values to adhere to, who teaches these ? Which of these are under threat from the left and foreigners?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."
I don't see the erosion of these (if indeed that is happening) being solely the responsibility of left wing or foreigners.

What examples do you have ?

And, I'd ask, can you see any examples of the right also being as bad ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values.

I agree , they are all great values to adhere to, who teaches these ? Which of these are under threat from the left and foreigners? "

Well i can tell you the right not the left is attempting to erode what little democracy we actually have. (Anti protest Bill, Voting laws to disenfranchise marginalised voters)

The Rule of law only applies to the poor. If you are rich in this country it rarely affects you for anything but the most egregious crimes. And that is thanks to right wing politicians

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

And you're blaming the left (not in power) for something being amiss with these?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values.

I agree , they are all great values to adhere to, who teaches these ? Which of these are under threat from the left and foreigners?

Well i can tell you the right not the left is attempting to erode what little democracy we actually have. (Anti protest Bill, Voting laws to disenfranchise marginalised voters)

The Rule of law only applies to the poor. If you are rich in this country it rarely affects you for anything but the most egregious crimes. And that is thanks to right wing politicians"
when have the rich ever been effected? Does matter which party is in power it’s been same for hundreds of years

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values.

And you're blaming the left (not in power) for something being amiss with these?"

I’m not blaming anyone.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values.

I agree , they are all great values to adhere to, who teaches these ? Which of these are under threat from the left and foreigners?

Well i can tell you the right not the left is attempting to erode what little democracy we actually have. (Anti protest Bill, Voting laws to disenfranchise marginalised voters)

The Rule of law only applies to the poor. If you are rich in this country it rarely affects you for anything but the most egregious crimes. And that is thanks to right wing politicians"

I don't believe its unique to the right wing. Left wing politicians in other countries can be equally guilty. Its a power thing. When one has too much power it inevitably leads to abuse of that power.

Animal Farm is a story for all ages.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values.

And you're blaming the left (not in power) for something being amiss with these?

I’m not blaming anyone."

What about "Left wingers & foreigners"?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values.

And you're blaming the left (not in power) for something being amiss with these?

I’m not blaming anyone.

What about "Left wingers & foreigners"?"
cue "I'm just asking questions"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"I don't believe its unique to the right wing. Left wing politicians in other countries can be equally guilty. Its a power thing. When one has too much power it inevitably leads to abuse of that power.

Animal Farm is a story for all ages."

I would argue that if they are curtailing rights and leaving them to the rich that is not in fact left wing.

More appropriate to this conversation though, we are talking about the UK. And as we don;t have Left wing politicians in power here, it can only be right wing ones causing the problems.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My take.

Democracy

Im not sure if out system is truly democratic. Fptp means many voices aren't heard. Whips mean it isn't clear if I'm voting for the person or the party. Should an MP follow it's constituenta views or the party? I've been more worried the past few governments are taking us the wrong way... But we have anough controls.

The rule of law

Lack of spend probably means this has fallen as people are less worried they will face consequences.

Individual liberty

Not sure much has changed. We probably have more liberty to be ourselves now. It's still a journey ...

Mutual respect

Media and social media echo chambers is possibly polarising here. It also gives a voice without encouraging to listen.

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

I'd say better than we used to be. Tbh it's not something that jumps out that we were ever great at. But as a above, the need for 247 news stories and echo chambers means we may focus on the bad apples which means we are less tolerant of the whole at times.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *resh_FantasyCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

I would add ' the sovereignty of the individual' which for me dovetails with individual responsibility . Group identity and identity politics are the most destructive and devisive modern social phenomenon which are undoubtedly promoted and accentuated by certain social media. I personally have no political affiliation as neither party represents my thoughts on where this nation should be. As an addendum I would add the pursuit of excellence

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I imagine that 'foreigners' seeking British citizenship will have a better understanding of what 'British values'are than many Brits, as they have to study them.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 03/07/22 18:00:47]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”

FIRST THEY CAME By Martin Niemöller"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"I would add ' the sovereignty of the individual' which for me dovetails with individual responsibility . Group identity and identity politics are the most destructive and devisive modern social phenomenon which are undoubtedly promoted and accentuated by certain social media. I personally have no political affiliation as neither party represents my thoughts on where this nation should be. As an addendum I would add the pursuit of excellence "
where do you think this nation should be then ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

Out of Tory hands is the most pressing place it needs t be

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

Out of Tory hands is the most pressing place it needs t be"
well we have general election’s for that

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

Out of Tory hands is the most pressing place it needs t bewell we have general election’s for that "

In the last election 60% of the country voted for candidates centre parties (the furthest left we have in this country) and only 40% for the conservatives.

More people didn't want the Tories in power than did.

First Past the Post is Bullshit

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

Out of Tory hands is the most pressing place it needs t bewell we have general election’s for that

In the last election 60% of the country voted for candidates centre parties (the furthest left we have in this country) and only 40% for the conservatives.

More people didn't want the Tories in power than did.

First Past the Post is Bullshit"
its only bullshit when you loose tho it’s fantastic if you win lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?"

A Conservative Prime Minister was censured by the Supreme Court for illegally proroguing Parliament. He also liked to the Queen.

The Conservative government is restricting the right to strike and to protest.

The conservative party has tried to interfere with independent judicial appointments.

Where is the equivalent threat from "the left" and from " foreigners".

Where do you see it?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

You believe that this is unique to the United Kingdom?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

A Conservative Prime Minister was censured by the Supreme Court for illegally proroguing Parliament. He also liked to the Queen.

The Conservative government is restricting the right to strike and to protest.

The conservative party has tried to interfere with independent judicial appointments.

Where is the equivalent threat from "the left" and from " foreigners".

Where do you see it?"

Then there is Tory MPs breaking the law and facing no consequences. Boris Johnson even changed ministerial code so that MPs wouldn't need to resign when caught.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *amish SMan
over a year ago

Eastleigh

"The left?

What is wrong with the left? they are the ones fighting to expand peoples rights.

The Left: Want more rights for everyone

The Right: Want less rights for all except a select few.

The greatest trick the right ever pulled was convincing people they actually gave a shit about them"

All we ever hear 'rights' but most spout this rights agenda without any consideration of responsibilities to go with them.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham

How about people forget the tribalism of left and right and we just apply some good old fashioned decency and common sense? I'm sure that'll get twisted too which merely serves to highlight the overall problem

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"How about people forget the tribalism of left and right and we just apply some good old fashioned decency and common sense? I'm sure that'll get twisted too which merely serves to highlight the overall problem "

Pragmatism and the humility of governing for the entire country regardless of who won seems to have disappeared. This government more than any other seems to be displaying this attitude.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

Problem is the definition of "decency" and "common sense"

I'm sure people who voted for UKIP think they are decent and have common sense. While the rest of us are horrified by their far right bullshit hate based politics.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"The left?

What is wrong with the left? they are the ones fighting to expand peoples rights.

The Left: Want more rights for everyone

The Right: Want less rights for all except a select few.

The greatest trick the right ever pulled was convincing people they actually gave a shit about them

All we ever hear 'rights' but most spout this rights agenda without any consideration of responsibilities to go with them. "

An example of this could be equal rights for the LGBTQ+ community. That most Tories consistently vote against. Can you give an example of the worries you have around the responsibilities that go with equality?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Out of Tory hands is the most pressing place it needs t bewell we have general election’s for that

In the last election 60% of the country voted for candidates centre parties (the furthest left we have in this country) and only 40% for the conservatives.

More people didn't want the Tories in power than did.

First Past the Post is Bullshitits only bullshit when you loose tho it’s fantastic if you win lol"

Obviously fantastic for the winners, but hardly a representative voice for the people.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

The problem with "old fashioned decency" being invoked is that it falls into the problem of the paradox of tolerance.

The paradox of tolerance states that if a society is tolerant without limit, its ability to be tolerant is eventually seized or destroyed by the intolerant.

So in order to have a progressive, inclusive and better country for all, you can't simply just be nice to EVERYONE

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham

And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully "

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully "
can you explain why?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?"

Did we find out which British values were being eroded ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?

Did we find out which British values were being eroded ? "

The OP suggests

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

But no further explanation.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?

Did we find out which British values were being eroded ?

The OP suggests

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

But no further explanation. "

I see, so it’s still a bit vague? Hopefully someone can clarify what this thread is all about.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?

Did we find out which British values were being eroded ?

The OP suggests

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

But no further explanation.

I see, so it’s still a bit vague? Hopefully someone can clarify what this thread is all about. "

The OP is worried about left wingers and foreigners. I think that's all. Nothing more than that.

The big question is, what about foreigners who are right wingers. What happens then?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 03/07/22 23:34:35]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?

Did we find out which British values were being eroded ?

The OP suggests

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

But no further explanation.

I see, so it’s still a bit vague? Hopefully someone can clarify what this thread is all about.

The OP is worried about left wingers and foreigners. I think that's all. Nothing more than that.

The big question is, what about foreigners who are right wingers. What happens then?"

That is a good point, maybe being foreign and right wing cancels out the threat ? I have to say, his list of British values does seem a bit woke, good to see

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?

Did we find out which British values were being eroded ?

The OP suggests

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

But no further explanation.

I see, so it’s still a bit vague? Hopefully someone can clarify what this thread is all about.

The OP is worried about left wingers and foreigners. I think that's all. Nothing more than that.

The big question is, what about foreigners who are right wingers. What happens then?"

What about us Citizens who are Left wing (actually left wing, not centre like labour), are we ok?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?

Did we find out which British values were being eroded ?

The OP suggests

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

But no further explanation.

I see, so it’s still a bit vague? Hopefully someone can clarify what this thread is all about.

The OP is worried about left wingers and foreigners. I think that's all. Nothing more than that.

The big question is, what about foreigners who are right wingers. What happens then?

What about us Citizens who are Left wing (actually left wing, not centre like labour), are we ok?"

We need to clarify what is ment by left wing? Is it anything left of centre or is it communism ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?

Did we find out which British values were being eroded ?

The OP suggests

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

But no further explanation.

I see, so it’s still a bit vague? Hopefully someone can clarify what this thread is all about.

The OP is worried about left wingers and foreigners. I think that's all. Nothing more than that.

The big question is, what about foreigners who are right wingers. What happens then?

What about us Citizens who are Left wing (actually left wing, not centre like labour), are we ok?

We need to clarify what is ment by left wing? Is it anything left of centre or is it communism ? "

By communism do you mean actual communism, or what the right wing says communism is?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully

The issue of "left wingers and foreigners" causing the OP to worry about "British values"?

Did we find out which British values were being eroded ?

The OP suggests

"Democracy

The rule of law

Individual liberty

Mutual respect

Tolerance of those with different faiths & beliefs.

These are the basics - but there’s a whole raft of softer values."

But no further explanation.

I see, so it’s still a bit vague? Hopefully someone can clarify what this thread is all about.

The OP is worried about left wingers and foreigners. I think that's all. Nothing more than that.

The big question is, what about foreigners who are right wingers. What happens then?

What about us Citizens who are Left wing (actually left wing, not centre like labour), are we ok?

We need to clarify what is ment by left wing? Is it anything left of centre or is it communism ?

By communism do you mean actual communism, or what the right wing says communism is?"

Good question, but a difficult one to answer, I am afraid the OP is the only person who can help . I would like to ask him who he thinks is a ‘foreigner’ , the thread started out vague and got steadily more confusing .

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

do British values go back to when Rome was in charge of us? That's the really important question. Or is it?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"do British values go back to when Rome was in charge of us? That's the really important question. Or is it?"

It may have started with the beaker people?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"do British values go back to when Rome was in charge of us? That's the really important question. Or is it?

It may have started with the beaker people?

The ones who invented tupperware? You can't trust em for shit.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"do British values go back to when Rome was in charge of us? That's the really important question. Or is it?

It may have started with the beaker people?

The ones who invented tupperware? You can't trust em for shit."

Yes, bloody foreigners coming over here with their drinking vessels , or maybe it started with the vikings ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"do British values go back to when Rome was in charge of us? That's the really important question. Or is it?

It may have started with the beaker people?

The ones who invented tupperware? You can't trust em for shit.

Yes, bloody foreigners coming over here with their drinking vessels , or maybe it started with the vikings ? "

don't get me started on how many of our fish they r*ped + pillaged! They even skipped queues at Ye olde poste office!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?"

Comical post lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *mynclMan
over a year ago

Newcastle

What do class as a foreigner, I was born here 46 years ago, British Pakistani, would you class me as foreigner, please explain British values,

I been brought up to respect all religions, genders, cultures,

You probably don’t even know British values are and just trying to sprout out a racially charged conversion. And if that’s what British values are then well hope it disappears

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"do British values go back to when Rome was in charge of us? That's the really important question. Or is it?

It may have started with the beaker people?

The ones who invented tupperware? You can't trust em for shit.

Yes, bloody foreigners coming over here with their drinking vessels , or maybe it started with the vikings ?

don't get me started on how many of our fish they r*ped + pillaged! They even skipped queues at Ye olde poste office!"

Bastards, never trust a man wearing a horny helmet

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"do British values go back to when Rome was in charge of us? That's the really important question. Or is it?

It may have started with the beaker people?

The ones who invented tupperware? You can't trust em for shit.

Yes, bloody foreigners coming over here with their drinking vessels , or maybe it started with the vikings ?

don't get me started on how many of our fish they r*ped + pillaged! They even skipped queues at Ye olde poste office!

Bastards, never trust a man wearing a horny helmet

Especially if they get pissed + start headbutting people after an all nighter at Ye Olde Spoone of Wethers.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What are British values? Freedom certainly isn't one of them, or diversity of thought for that matter.

The stooges in Whitehall are more middle and upper-middle class than they've ever been. Sadly they're the ones that set the direction and pace of the country.

Best way to be is pay no mind to this nonsense and focus on adapting to changes that best suit yourself and your family.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"And the previous 5 comments highlight the issue beautifully "

I guess you know what you're talking about as you seem to be claiming some sort of a "gotcha", but nobody understands what.

What "issue" has "highlighted"?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ustintime69Man
over a year ago

london

I blame it on those bloody French coming over here and conquering us! Just wait until we have Brexit done in 2066, that’ll show them!!!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

Comical post lol "

Comical why?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

Comical post lol

Comical why?"

Because it made people laugh

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke "

Tbh, I think it was

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke "

Charming, and you don’t even live here. Mind you from what I’m hearing Ireland has its own challenges.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

Tbh, I think it was "

A well known tactic of fifth columnists is to laugh things off as a joke.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

Tbh, I think it was

A well known tactic of fifth columnists is to laugh things off as a joke."

No it isn’t.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago

Manchester

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

Tbh, I think it was

A well known tactic of fifth columnists is to laugh things off as a joke."

You’ve been watching too many black and white films.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

Charming, and you don’t even live here. Mind you from what I’m hearing Ireland has its own challenges."

Yeah and we had plenty of trouble with foreigners too actually....for about 800 years

We called them the British

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

Tbh, I think it was

A well known tactic of fifth columnists is to laugh things off as a joke.

No it isn’t.

Denial- another one.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

Charming, and you don’t even live here. Mind you from what I’m hearing Ireland has its own challenges.

Yeah and we had plenty of trouble with foreigners too actually....for about 800 years

We called them the British "

You love us really.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

Tbh, I think it was

A well known tactic of fifth columnists is to laugh things off as a joke.

No it isn’t.

Denial- another one."

Another one that isn’t true?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

Tbh, I think it was

A well known tactic of fifth columnists is to laugh things off as a joke."
like saying people look like letterboxes ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yeah I laughed too. I thought the post was a joke

Tbh, I think it was

A well known tactic of fifth columnists is to laugh things off as a joke.like saying people look like letterboxes ?"

A well known tactic of fifth columnists are to try and convince people(usually the simple minded) that they are foreigners and the ‘left’ .

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?"

Would you mind explaining how they are a threat please. I guess you may be thinking that the foreigners will not integrate and just stick to their own values, maybe not respect the host country. Although that may be true for some, I think one of the big attractions of the UK is its values, so would expect those coming to be respectful of the vault that attract them. For left wingers I am mostly lost for the reason. The only thing that springs to mind is perhaps they are seen as more immigrant friendly but that may not be fair. Anyway, an explanation would help

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ustintime69Man
over a year ago

london

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

I am not sure the OP has thought out his post in great depth so I imagine an explanation might be a bit unlikely!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As others have mentioned, it depends on what you call British values. If you are talking about liberal values like freedom of expression, right to criticise religion, freedom of women, freedom for LGBT community, I kind of get your point. Most left wingers are pro-immigration. For that reason, they will support immigrants even if they did something that goes against liberal values.

When some communities protest in front of schools against LGBT education, they will keep mum. But JK Rowling makes a tweet? They will go all guns blazing. They claim to support women's rights but even making a joke about face veil for women is considered Islamophobia. I have even seen liberals resort to victim blaming in the Hebdo case and any other case where someone was killed because they drew a picture.

It's not just Britain. It has happened in most Western countries and even in India. Denmark is probably the only country where the left wing party got it right. It's hard for immigrants to live there unless they learn to assimilate.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

the opening gambit by the OP sounds very like part of the lexicon of the early-mid twentieth century nazism/fascism/falangism movements. it's horrifying to think that this kind of toxic language is still being spoken.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"the opening gambit by the OP sounds very like part of the lexicon of the early-mid twentieth century nazism/fascism/falangism movements. it's horrifying to think that this kind of toxic language is still being spoken."

Unfortunately Populism and Nationalism are on the rise again, across the world.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *TDHGentMan
over a year ago

Worcs

Firstly establish the term democracy! It was inventented in Greece for the extreme wealthy there were no goat herders or common folk in the forum. Fake democracy! Cromwell was fooled or a fool or both?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?"

Do people who sow discord and mistrust based on arbitrary differences a threat to British values?

Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This is widespread on fab and in the UK unfortunately.

I'm still waiting for OP to explain how left wingers and scary forrinerz are a threat to British values

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Oh, same OP as the thread about Iranian asylum seekers

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"As others have mentioned, it depends on what you call British values. If you are talking about liberal values like freedom of expression, right to criticise religion, freedom of women, freedom for LGBT community, I kind of get your point. Most left wingers are pro-immigration. For that reason, they will support immigrants even if they did something that goes against liberal values.

Why can't people express a view that a joke is islamophobic ? (I don't think it was. Just in poor taste and not even funny).

Is asking someone if they are gay, when they talk about being grooed victim shaming.

I don't think it's (just) the lefties that are causing values to be eroded. Funnily enough I look through the list and it feels more left than right leaning ....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

English folk who live abroad in places like Spain or Cyprus make little effort to assimilate. They create little communities among themselves and rarely mix with locals.

They are also mostly right wing.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Why can't people express a view that a joke is islamophobic ? (I don't think it was. Just in poor taste and not even funny).

Is asking someone if they are gay, when they talk about being grooed victim shaming.

I don't think it's (just) the lefties that are causing values to be eroded. Funnily enough I look through the list and it feels more left than right leaning .... "

But the right wing never said they stood for LGBT rights. It's the left wing that claims to be the torch holder of LGBT rights. When they find easy targets like celebrities on twitter, they do as much as possible to destroy them for a tweet they made. But when serious real life issues like protests against LGBT education happen, they don't even open their mouths.

People have the right to express their opinions. But not all opinions are right. Islamophobia is discriminating or treating someone differently because Muslims. When did criticising a religious practice become bigotry? The foundations of liberalism were built by questioning and criticising religion. It just doesn't make sense for someone who claims to be liberal but doesn't like a joke being made on religion.

I agree that right wingers aren't saints either. As things stand, I don't see that much of a difference between lefties and right wingers. None of them believe in rationality anymore. I rant more about liberals because I used to call myself one for many years. Now I have to keep my distance from them of the aforementioned behaviour. Now I see myself as a moderate.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

English folk who live abroad in places like Spain or Cyprus make little effort to assimilate. They create little communities among themselves and rarely mix with locals.

They are also mostly right wing."

And that's wrong too. You are right to criticise them.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

Why can't people express a view that a joke is islamophobic ? (I don't think it was. Just in poor taste and not even funny).

Is asking someone if they are gay, when they talk about being grooed victim shaming.

I don't think it's (just) the lefties that are causing values to be eroded. Funnily enough I look through the list and it feels more left than right leaning ....

Issues like support for the LGBTQ+ community shouldn't be related to left/right.

Sadly it is, look at the voting record for any top Tory, and you'll see very clearly what they think.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

This is widespread on fab and in the UK unfortunately.

I'm still waiting for OP to explain how left wingers and scary forrinerz are a threat to British values"

‘Forrinerz’???

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

English folk who live abroad in places like Spain or Cyprus make little effort to assimilate. They create little communities among themselves and rarely mix with locals.

They are also mostly right wing."

You are making a huge assumption there.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values. "

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Oh, same OP as the thread about Iranian asylum seekers"

And? Are we not allowed to discuss these matters?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values? "

Can't answer that without a precise definition of British values. From the high level stuff you put earlier, yes, there is, but it's not coming from left wingers or foreigners. It's coming from the current government. Lying, cheating, breaking the law, fast tracking PPE contracts for Tory party donors etc etc.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 04/07/22 22:49:48]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values? "

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Why can't people express a view that a joke is islamophobic ? (I don't think it was. Just in poor taste and not even funny).

Is asking someone if they are gay, when they talk about being grooed victim shaming.

I don't think it's (just) the lefties that are causing values to be eroded. Funnily enough I look through the list and it feels more left than right leaning ....

Maybe we need to define lefties. B

But if britsih values are as described above, I see moderate lefts as having more British values than moderate rights.

With the protest changes, sign posting of human right changes, the rwanda approach, the various allegations, resignations and criminal convictions, today's government would appear very "unbritish". And it seems many people still support them.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

No "

Wasn’t asking you.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 04/07/22 22:53:48]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

Wasn’t asking you."

No, but I was telling you, is that allowed on here

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

We are getting close. Perhaps the high level of ‘non British’ members of the current cabinet are the real problem?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

Wasn’t asking you.

No, but I was telling you, is that allowed on here

Not tonight I’m afraid

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

Wasn’t asking you."

Who were you asking then?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

We are getting close. Perhaps the high level of ‘non British’ members of the current cabinet are the real problem? "

Boris is the PM, and probably does the most damage to the values you listed.

Why do you keep suggesting it's foreigners?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

Wasn’t asking you.

Who were you asking then?"

I was responding to a specific question. Too late for me to scroll back and see who.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

Wasn’t asking you.

No, but I was telling you, is that allowed on here

Not tonight I’m afraid "

I’m afraid it is, did we find out who is a ‘foreigner’ ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

We are getting close. Perhaps the high level of ‘non British’ members of the current cabinet are the real problem? "

Who are they?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

We are getting close. Perhaps the high level of ‘non British’ members of the current cabinet are the real problem?

Boris is the PM, and probably does the most damage to the values you listed.

Why do you keep suggesting it's foreigners?"
exactly!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

We are getting close. Perhaps the high level of ‘non British’ members of the current cabinet are the real problem?

Boris is the PM, and probably does the most damage to the values you listed.

Why do you keep suggesting it's foreigners? exactly! "

Exactly what?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

We are getting close. Perhaps the high level of ‘non British’ members of the current cabinet are the real problem? "

Are they left wingers?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's amused me jumping from this thread to the Lounge, where there is a whole thread off the back of a police joke from a "lefty".

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"It's amused me jumping from this thread to the Lounge, where there is a whole thread off the back of a police joke from a "lefty".

*takes a bow*

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *V-AliceTV/TS
over a year ago

Ayr

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?"

People who think like you do - simply and without any real appreciation for the concept of freedom of speech - are more of a threat to British values (whatever they are) than anyone prepared to voice dissent against the current government. Or any government.

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can."

Well put

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can."

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there. Again, I’m amazed that someone of your age has no comprehension of British values.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"This thread is properly funny. Well done OP for confusing yourself and providing us with a chuckle.

Any update on foreigners and lefties eroding British values.

No confusion here thanks. Do you think there is an erosion of British values?

We are getting close. Perhaps the high level of ‘non British’ members of the current cabinet are the real problem?

Are they left wingers? "
No

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *asyukMan
over a year ago

West London

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?"

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there.

I’m amazed that someone of your age seems to believe that British values are that of prejudice, intolerance and unfairness.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ustintime69Man
over a year ago

london

Seems to me that the OP is getting a buzz out of all the attention but is unwilling to explain his original post in any greater detail which leads me to the conclusion that it’s all a bit shallow tbh

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there.

I’m amazed that someone of your age seems to believe that British values are that of prejudice, intolerance and unfairness."

Why on earth would you say that? How rude! You have no idea what I believe.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can.

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there. Again, I’m amazed that someone of your age has no comprehension of British values."

Do you have to be ‘British’ to have these values?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can.

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there. Again, I’m amazed that someone of your age has no comprehension of British values.

Do you have to be ‘British’ to have these values? "

You and a few others would so like me to answer yes. Of course you don’t have to be British to have these values. Everyone should have them and I do know that a number of British people don’t give a fuck about values.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can.

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there. Again, I’m amazed that someone of your age has no comprehension of British values.

Do you have to be ‘British’ to have these values?

I see, Boris?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can.

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there. Again, I’m amazed that someone of your age has no comprehension of British values.

Do you have to be ‘British’ to have these values?

I see, Boris? "
the absolute root cause! Aided by the people that support him in cabinet, and the weasels - about 200 I think? MPs that didn’t have the conviction to enforce decency ( a vital value) and vote against him recently. Through misplaced loyalty I assume as they can’t all be that ignorant?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can.

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there. Again, I’m amazed that someone of your age has no comprehension of British values.

Do you have to be ‘British’ to have these values?

Then why did you start a thread about lefties and foreigners?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can.

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there. Again, I’m amazed that someone of your age has no comprehension of British values.

Do you have to be ‘British’ to have these values?

Then why did you start a thread about lefties and foreigners?"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

this thread reads as an exact sample of some of the antisemitic posters displayed in the imperial war museum. it's alarming to see the OP regurgitating his personal ideology which he appears to share with nazism.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *heNerdyFembyWoman
over a year ago

Eastbourne (she/they)

"this thread reads as an exact sample of some of the antisemitic posters displayed in the imperial war museum. it's alarming to see the OP regurgitating his personal ideology which he appears to share with nazism.

I think it is even more scary that starting at least a decade ago, its a thought and mentality thats been on the rise. or at the very least a group thats felt it can be vocal more and more.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"
ideology? What are you on about?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ebjonnson OP Man
over a year ago

Maldon

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can.

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there. Again, I’m amazed that someone of your age has no comprehension of British values.

Do you have to be ‘British’ to have these values?

Then why did you start a thread about lefties and foreigners?"

Well, I thought it could lead to an interesting debate. How wrong can one be!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do they represent a threat to British values? Particularly those in a position of some power, perhaps not always having what’s best for the country in mind. Almost like ‘fifth columnists’?

You're clearly part of the 40 to 45% the Tories rely on to make the FPTP system work for them.

Sadly, they can.

Wow, you’ve made some incredible ( and boringly cliche) assumptions there. Again, I’m amazed that someone of your age has no comprehension of British values.

Do you have to be ‘British’ to have these values?

Then why did you start a thread about lefties and foreigners?

Well, I thought it could lead to an interesting debate. How wrong can one be! "

How can there be a debate when your OP was so vague, you failed to tell us who you think are these foreigners and lefties. At one point you suggested it might be the ‘foreigners’ in the cabinet who are responsible, they are all British (although I do think it is the PM and the entire cabinet who have done the most to erode these ‘British values’ )

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

ideology? What are you on about? "

to be clear and so that there is no confusion, your ideology which you displayed in your opening gambit. an ideology with which you appear to share with nazism. clear enough?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

hopefully this thread and it's conotations to nazism has expired.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately