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An independent Scotland

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth

** not wanting to start a name calling argument just an honest question **

Should Scotland be granted a referendum and secure independence I’m assuming that there will be the need for a hard boarder between Scotland and the rest of the uk.

And this being the case and that there is only just word of a freight ferry service returning to rosyth and that it’ll take around 17hrs to reach mainland Europe.

Is this going to cause a huge problem with the import and export of Scottish goods (all goods will with have a long sea journey or have to clear customs at point of entry. to enter the rest of uk and then clear the boarder at either Berwick or Carlisle.surely this will lead to huge delays and tail backs that will make the m20 operations look tame and the Northern Ireland agreement Childs play. And should Scotland be granted eu membership then this will make maters a whole lot worse as Scotland will be an eu member surrounded by a non eu country. the country is relying on exports for the basis of the future of the countries economy.

This isn’t intended as a snp bashing post just genuine interest in how people think this problem will be resolved. Seeing how the eu is treating the uk. Over the Northern Ireland situation. I can’t see the rest of the uk bending over backwards to help an independent Scotland.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"** not wanting to start a name calling argument just an honest question **

Should Scotland be granted a referendum and secure independence I’m assuming that there will be the need for a hard boarder between Scotland and the rest of the uk.

And this being the case and that there is only just word of a freight ferry service returning to rosyth and that it’ll take around 17hrs to reach mainland Europe.

Is this going to cause a huge problem with the import and export of Scottish goods (all goods will with have a long sea journey or have to clear customs at point of entry. to enter the rest of uk and then clear the boarder at either Berwick or Carlisle.surely this will lead to huge delays and tail backs that will make the m20 operations look tame and the Northern Ireland agreement Childs play. And should Scotland be granted eu membership then this will make maters a whole lot worse as Scotland will be an eu member surrounded by a non eu country. the country is relying on exports for the basis of the future of the countries economy.

This isn’t intended as a snp bashing post just genuine interest in how people think this problem will be resolved. Seeing how the eu is treating the uk. Over the Northern Ireland situation. I can’t see the rest of the uk bending over backwards to help an independent Scotland. "

How long does it currently take for Scottish goods to arrive in mainland Europe

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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago

near ipswich

yes of course they should,im all for them having another referendum.Would they be considered to join the EU? i doubt it, there are plenty of countries ahead in the queue and cannot see any reason they would jump it even if they could meet the fiscal requirements.

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth

You can currently drive from Glasgow to France in 9hrs a journey done by many trucks in the fish industry on a nightly basis currently. Also will all goods originating in the rest of uk have to clear customs resulting in every truck crossing the border have I g to go through customs check

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth


"yes of course they should,im all for them having another referendum.Would they be considered to join the EU? i doubt it, there are plenty of countries ahead in the queue and cannot see any reason they would jump it even if they could meet the fiscal requirements. "

I agree but the quote was just intended as a counter to the “we’ll gain automatic European membership and that’ll solve all problems “ answers

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields


"yes of course they should,im all for them having another referendum.Would they be considered to join the EU? i doubt it, there are plenty of countries ahead in the queue and cannot see any reason they would jump it even if they could meet the fiscal requirements. "

Would be worth trying though.

There's a lot of good reasons all those countries are desperately trying to join the EU.

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth

And as per the original post how will this effect Scottish exports?

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields


"And as per the original post how will this effect Scottish exports?"

Likely will be able to difficulties.

They key would really be gaining EU membership.

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth

It’s I’m struggling to see how eu membership will be beneficial being that other than a long and expensive sea journey the country will be surrounded by a non eu country that will have its own customs and transit restrictions

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By *rDiscretionXXXMan
over a year ago

Gilfach


"Would they be considered to join the EU? i doubt it, there are plenty of countries ahead in the queue and cannot see any reason they would jump it even if they could meet the fiscal requirements. "

I don't think there is a queue, just a lot of countries trying to meet all of the complex requirements. Scotland already meets all of the political and legal requirements, so it's just the financial ones to worry about, and the EU has shown that it has no problem waiving those if it wants to.

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By *ohnnyTwoNotesMan
over a year ago

golden fields


"It’s I’m struggling to see how eu membership will be beneficial being that other than a long and expensive sea journey the country will be surrounded by a non eu country that will have its own customs and transit restrictions "

I'm sure not all goods would need to go through England. Just ship directly.

Being in the EU will remove all the red tape and restrictions on trade that Brexit introduced. And Scotland would be able to trade with the rest of the world through the EU negotiated trade deals.

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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago

near ipswich


"Would they be considered to join the EU? i doubt it, there are plenty of countries ahead in the queue and cannot see any reason they would jump it even if they could meet the fiscal requirements.

I don't think there is a queue, just a lot of countries trying to meet all of the complex requirements. Scotland already meets all of the political and legal requirements, so it's just the financial ones to worry about, and the EU has shown that it has no problem waiving those if it wants to."
Well im only quoting the EU when they said the Ukraine would be considered to join but would have to join the queue like the others waiting.

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By *otMe66Man
over a year ago

Terra Firma

Independence, from what restraints?

Is it all about power and ego, or is Scotland heavily repressed?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Some form of "hard border" will be needed unless Scotland and ruK sign an FTA/customs agreement.

The CU bit would then make joining the EU (or forming a CU with the EU) hard/impossible.

Be interesting to see if the SNP throw out a tech solution ... And if rUK walk towards it.

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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago

near ipswich


"Some form of "hard border" will be needed unless Scotland and ruK sign an FTA/customs agreement.

The CU bit would then make joining the EU (or forming a CU with the EU) hard/impossible.

Be interesting to see if the SNP throw out a tech solution ... And if rUK walk towards it.

"
It seems to work between Norway and Sweden.

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth

Sorry guys this post isn’t meant as a Scotland as an eu v non eu membership post. more how an independent Scotland relent on import/export can resolve the issues around the required custom delay’s

I only ask this as I posted a similar question on a different forum and was met with replies saying why would it be an issue and why would I think that there would be a hard border and that I need to take off my unionist glasses

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By *hybloke67Man
over a year ago

ROMFORD


"Some form of "hard border" will be needed unless Scotland and ruK sign an FTA/customs agreement.

The CU bit would then make joining the EU (or forming a CU with the EU) hard/impossible.

Be interesting to see if the SNP throw out a tech solution ... And if rUK walk towards it.

It seems to work between Norway and Sweden."

For arguments sake, if another independence referendum is held and the Scottish people decide again no. Will that be the end of the argument for a generation or will the SNP ask for a third referendum in a couple of years time?

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth

I don’t think that the leader of Norway is directly calling out the government of Sweden as the cause for all Norway's issues.

I can’t imagine that there will be a great deal of good will between Scotland and the rest of the uk should they get independence. Much like the lack of good will at present between the uk and Europe just now

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Some form of "hard border" will be needed unless Scotland and ruK sign an FTA/customs agreement.

The CU bit would then make joining the EU (or forming a CU with the EU) hard/impossible.

Be interesting to see if the SNP throw out a tech solution ... And if rUK walk towards it.

It seems to work between Norway and Sweden."
Norway is in eea. So it's not quite the same starting point.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I don’t think that the leader of Norway is directly calling out the government of Sweden as the cause for all Norway's issues.

I can’t imagine that there will be a great deal of good will between Scotland and the rest of the uk should they get independence. Much like the lack of good will at present between the uk and Europe just now "

Why? This shambles of a government won’t be around much longer.

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth


"It’s I’m struggling to see how eu membership will be beneficial being that other than a long and expensive sea journey the country will be surrounded by a non eu country that will have its own customs and transit restrictions

I'm sure not all goods would need to go through England. Just ship directly.

Being in the EU will remove all the red tape and restrictions on trade that Brexit introduced. And Scotland would be able to trade with the rest of the world through the EU negotiated trade deals."

I’m unsure Scotland has the port capability to handle that much import export by sea it’s approx 17hrs from rosyth to zeebrugge adding half a day at least on to the equivalent road journey. If your to utilise the ports on the west coast that would be an even longer journey. Delays like this don’t do fresh produce like meat or fish any good

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth


"I don’t think that the leader of Norway is directly calling out the government of Sweden as the cause for all Norway's issues.

I can’t imagine that there will be a great deal of good will between Scotland and the rest of the uk should they get independence. Much like the lack of good will at present between the uk and Europe just now

Why? This shambles of a government won’t be around much longer. "

This government has only been in power for 12yrs Scotland has been seeking independence a lot longer than that so don’t think that a change of government will make much difference

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby


"I don’t think that the leader of Norway is directly calling out the government of Sweden as the cause for all Norway's issues.

I can’t imagine that there will be a great deal of good will between Scotland and the rest of the uk should they get independence. Much like the lack of good will at present between the uk and Europe just now

Why? This shambles of a government won’t be around much longer. "
i wouldn’t put money in that mate

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I don’t think that the leader of Norway is directly calling out the government of Sweden as the cause for all Norway's issues.

I can’t imagine that there will be a great deal of good will between Scotland and the rest of the uk should they get independence. Much like the lack of good will at present between the uk and Europe just now

Why? This shambles of a government won’t be around much longer. i wouldn’t put money in that mate "

I can guarantee they won’t be around if and when there is another vote for Scottish independence

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I don’t think that the leader of Norway is directly calling out the government of Sweden as the cause for all Norway's issues.

I can’t imagine that there will be a great deal of good will between Scotland and the rest of the uk should they get independence. Much like the lack of good will at present between the uk and Europe just now

Why? This shambles of a government won’t be around much longer.

This government has only been in power for 12yrs Scotland has been seeking independence a lot longer than that so don’t think that a change of government will make much difference "

Tbh, i ment this ‘version’ of the Tory government, who have been by far the worst we have had in the last 12 years

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby


"I don’t think that the leader of Norway is directly calling out the government of Sweden as the cause for all Norway's issues.

I can’t imagine that there will be a great deal of good will between Scotland and the rest of the uk should they get independence. Much like the lack of good will at present between the uk and Europe just now

Why? This shambles of a government won’t be around much longer. i wouldn’t put money in that mate

I can guarantee they won’t be around if and when there is another vote for Scottish independence "
nothings a guarantee in politics bj and trump proved that

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby


"I don’t think that the leader of Norway is directly calling out the government of Sweden as the cause for all Norway's issues.

I can’t imagine that there will be a great deal of good will between Scotland and the rest of the uk should they get independence. Much like the lack of good will at present between the uk and Europe just now

Why? This shambles of a government won’t be around much longer.

This government has only been in power for 12yrs Scotland has been seeking independence a lot longer than that so don’t think that a change of government will make much difference

Tbh, i ment this ‘version’ of the Tory government, who have been by far the worst we have had in the last 12 years "
or right I agree with that 100% mate

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By *heBirminghamWeekendMan
over a year ago

here


" How long does it currently take for Scottish goods to arrive in mainland Europe "

Depends on mode of transport….

Never…. If it involves ScotGov built ferries and/or ScotGov run trains

(Thank you, I’ll get my coat )

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By *iman2100Man
over a year ago

Glasgow


"Some form of "hard border" will be needed unless Scotland and ruK sign an FTA/customs agreement.

The CU bit would then make joining the EU (or forming a CU with the EU) hard/impossible.

Be interesting to see if the SNP throw out a tech solution ... And if rUK walk towards it.

It seems to work between Norway and Sweden.

For arguments sake, if another independence referendum is held and the Scottish people decide again no. Will that be the end of the argument for a generation or will the SNP ask for a third referendum in a couple of years time?"

The SNP will continue to demand an independence referendum on a regular basis until they get it. That is their main aim.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Some form of "hard border" will be needed unless Scotland and ruK sign an FTA/customs agreement.

The CU bit would then make joining the EU (or forming a CU with the EU) hard/impossible.

Be interesting to see if the SNP throw out a tech solution ... And if rUK walk towards it.

It seems to work between Norway and Sweden.

For arguments sake, if another independence referendum is held and the Scottish people decide again no. Will that be the end of the argument for a generation or will the SNP ask for a third referendum in a couple of years time?"

The SNP has seeking Independence in thier mandate so no thats the whole intention of the party so it would actually be a betrayal of their members if they stopped pushing for one.

So they will keep seeking independence day 1 after a referendum fails,cause that is thier purpose

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By *ighlandguy007 OP   Man
over a year ago

Bournemouth

[Removed by poster at 23/06/22 12:48:39]

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