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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants." Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off  | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off "So break another international treaty | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off
So break another international treaty"Of course the EU would never break a treaty or international law | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off
So break another international treaty
Of course the EU would never break a treaty or international law"What ones have they broken, it is a genuine question? | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off
So break another international treaty
Of course the EU would never break a treaty or international law
What ones have they broken, it is a genuine question?"The UK is often cited by the EU for CONSIDERING the push back option. Greece does it, Poland is doing it. France has blatantly broken international maritime law and is threatening to do it again. I suggest you stop believing the ideal that the EU is faultless and accept the reality which is entirely e | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off
So break another international treaty
Of course the EU would never break a treaty or international law
What ones have they broken, it is a genuine question?
The UK is often cited by the EU for CONSIDERING the push back option. Greece does it, Poland is doing it. France has blatantly broken international maritime law and is threatening to do it again. I suggest you stop believing the ideal that the EU is faultless and accept the reality which is entirely e"No-one in the U.K. military, Coastguard or RNLI would put innocent people at risk whilst at sea. It is ghastly to even suggest that any British person would risk drowning an innocent person simply because they were taking a chance on getting an asylum claim. | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off
So break another international treaty
Of course the EU would never break a treaty or international law
What ones have they broken, it is a genuine question?
The UK is often cited by the EU for CONSIDERING the push back option. Greece does it, Poland is doing it. France has blatantly broken international maritime law and is threatening to do it again. I suggest you stop believing the ideal that the EU is faultless and accept the reality which is entirely e
No-one in the U.K. military, Coastguard or RNLI would put innocent people at risk whilst at sea.
It is ghastly to even suggest that any British person would risk drowning an innocent person simply because they were taking a chance on getting an asylum claim."But the french are ok with letting them set out in little boats to risk thier lives
The police were there right on camera chanel 4 news  | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off
So break another international treaty
Of course the EU would never break a treaty or international law
What ones have they broken, it is a genuine question?
The UK is often cited by the EU for CONSIDERING the push back option. Greece does it, Poland is doing it. France has blatantly broken international maritime law and is threatening to do it again. I suggest you stop believing the ideal that the EU is faultless and accept the reality which is entirely e"But what actual examples do you have? | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off
So break another international treaty
Of course the EU would never break a treaty or international law
What ones have they broken, it is a genuine question?
The UK is often cited by the EU for CONSIDERING the push back option. Greece does it, Poland is doing it. France has blatantly broken international maritime law and is threatening to do it again. I suggest you stop believing the ideal that the EU is faultless and accept the reality which is entirely e
No-one in the U.K. military, Coastguard or RNLI would put innocent people at risk whilst at sea.
It is ghastly to even suggest that any British person would risk drowning an innocent person simply because they were taking a chance on getting an asylum claim.
But the french are ok with letting them set out in little boats to risk thier lives
The police were there right on camera chanel 4 news "Blaming will not solve the issue, according to the covention as I understand it, refugees have a right to safe passage to the country of their choice ....again I refer to refugees not economic migrants | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off
So break another international treaty
Of course the EU would never break a treaty or international law
What ones have they broken, it is a genuine question?
The UK is often cited by the EU for CONSIDERING the push back option. Greece does it, Poland is doing it. France has blatantly broken international maritime law and is threatening to do it again. I suggest you stop believing the ideal that the EU is faultless and accept the reality which is entirely e
No-one in the U.K. military, Coastguard or RNLI would put innocent people at risk whilst at sea.
It is ghastly to even suggest that any British person would risk drowning an innocent person simply because they were taking a chance on getting an asylum claim.
But the french are ok with letting them set out in little boats to risk thier lives
The police were there right on camera chanel 4 news
Blaming will not solve the issue, according to the covention as I understand it, refugees have a right to safe passage to the country of their choice ....again I refer to refugees not economic migrants "Of corse they don’t want to stay in France, France gives them nothing because they know that will make them move on to the uk. So now it seems we have to as a country open up a route to the uk paid for by the uk and then support them until a application for asylum which may or may not be successful after ing out economic migrants and then trying to send them back to a country who does not want them back. The French just break up their camps and make them homeless. | |||
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"It is about time we managed the refugee programme instead of trying to blame the world for our failings. Ps Dont give me the full up nonsense, we have a labour shortage and a refugee status is not economic migrants. Yup and stop paying money to France for them to just stand there waving the migrants off
So break another international treaty
Of course the EU would never break a treaty or international law
What ones have they broken, it is a genuine question?
The UK is often cited by the EU for CONSIDERING the push back option. Greece does it, Poland is doing it. France has blatantly broken international maritime law and is threatening to do it again. I suggest you stop believing the ideal that the EU is faultless and accept the reality which is entirely e
No-one in the U.K. military, Coastguard or RNLI would put innocent people at risk whilst at sea.
It is ghastly to even suggest that any British person would risk drowning an innocent person simply because they were taking a chance on getting an asylum claim.
But the french are ok with letting them set out in little boats to risk thier lives
The police were there right on camera chanel 4 news
Blaming will not solve the issue, according to the covention as I understand it, refugees have a right to safe passage to the country of their choice ....again I refer to refugees not economic migrants
Of corse they don’t want to stay in France, France gives them nothing because they know that will make them move on to the uk.
So now it seems we have to as a country open up a route to the uk paid for by the uk and then support them until a application for asylum which may or may not be successful after ing out economic migrants and then trying to send them back to a country who does not want them back.
The French just break up their camps and make them homeless.
"But according to statistics and basically fact, most seek refuge in France ...and again your answering is blaming not solving | |||
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"France accept about three times more refugees than the UK. Anyone seeing the news about 30/31 human beings/people dying in the channel whose first thought was “illegal migrants” or some such rather than “OMG those poor people” needs to give their head a wobble. What on earth has happened to the world? We need to look at the reasons WHY people are prepared to risk their lives. What conditions were they subject to that were so awful they took such enormous risks. And why so keen to come to the UK? Let’s not talk about pure economic reasons let’s also look at history and the factors that in these refugee’s minds makes them aim for the UK. Those factors include historical colonialism, the widespread use of the English language, UK sponsored wars and their after effects. Then we need to ask ourselves what we would do in their shoes? Would we want to protect our families (and ourselves) from war? Famine? Would we prefer to go to a country that you have some affinity to through language or historical colonial connections? Go somewhere that you may already have relatives? This is a highly complex issue and one the west (inc UK) are complicit in creating. So we do need to find a solution. " Exactly, take Iraq. The RAF has been dropping bombs on that country, off and on, since before it was named the RAF. | |||
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"France accept about three times more refugees than the UK. Anyone seeing the news about 30/31 human beings/people dying in the channel whose first thought was “illegal migrants” or some such rather than “OMG those poor people” needs to give their head a wobble. What on earth has happened to the world? We need to look at the reasons WHY people are prepared to risk their lives. What conditions were they subject to that were so awful they took such enormous risks. And why so keen to come to the UK? Let’s not talk about pure economic reasons let’s also look at history and the factors that in these refugee’s minds makes them aim for the UK. Those factors include historical colonialism, the widespread use of the English language, UK sponsored wars and their after effects. Then we need to ask ourselves what we would do in their shoes? Would we want to protect our families (and ourselves) from war? Famine? Would we prefer to go to a country that you have some affinity to through language or historical colonial connections? Go somewhere that you may already have relatives? This is a highly complex issue and one the west (inc UK) are complicit in creating. So we do need to find a solution. Exactly, take Iraq. The RAF has been dropping bombs on that country, off and on, since before it was named the RAF." Correct. Churchill had a policy of bombing in that neck of the woods. | |||
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"Doesn't the UK have Embassy and/or Consular facilities in every EU country? " you are being sensible now and everyone will ignore it!  | |||
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"Doesn't the UK have Embassy and/or Consular facilities in every EU country? you are being sensible now and everyone will ignore it! "Well yes, but looking further into it today, you can't claim asylum at an embassy anymore. You have to claim upon arrival at your country of destination, where a claim will be started. Which poses a question. If these migrants are paying people smugglers several tbousand euros a time, why don't they just book a flight and arrive at a UK airport? | |||
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"Doesn't the UK have Embassy and/or Consular facilities in every EU country? you are being sensible now and everyone will ignore it!
Well yes, but looking further into it today, you can't claim asylum at an embassy anymore.
You have to claim upon arrival at your country of destination, where a claim will be started.
Which poses a question. If these migrants are paying people smugglers several tbousand euros a time, why don't they just book a flight and arrive at a UK airport?
"Where is it that they will board that plane? Not sure there are that many commercial flights from warzones. Could be wrong. Plus passports? Actually being given access to the airport in Iraq, Syria etc. After all that, will airlines carry them? | |||
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"Doesn't the UK have Embassy and/or Consular facilities in every EU country? you are being sensible now and everyone will ignore it!
Well yes, but looking further into it today, you can't claim asylum at an embassy anymore.
You have to claim upon arrival at your country of destination, where a claim will be started.
Which poses a question. If these migrants are paying people smugglers several tbousand euros a time, why don't they just book a flight and arrive at a UK airport?
Where is it that they will board that plane? Not sure there are that many commercial flights from warzones. Could be wrong.
Plus passports?
Actually being given access to the airport in Iraq, Syria etc.
After all that, will airlines carry them?"They've come across many countries, not all in a war zone. No passport will lengthen any asylum claim, as identities need to be established. I've heard (unverified) reports of migrants ditching passports and identity cards on arrival in the UK, so that the process gets lengthened. | |||
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"Doesn't the UK have Embassy and/or Consular facilities in every EU country? you are being sensible now and everyone will ignore it!
Well yes, but looking further into it today, you can't claim asylum at an embassy anymore.
You have to claim upon arrival at your country of destination, where a claim will be started.
Which poses a question. If these migrants are paying people smugglers several tbousand euros a time, why don't they just book a flight and arrive at a UK airport?
Where is it that they will board that plane? Not sure there are that many commercial flights from warzones. Could be wrong.
Plus passports?
Actually being given access to the airport in Iraq, Syria etc.
After all that, will airlines carry them?
They've come across many countries, not all in a war zone.
No passport will lengthen any asylum claim, as identities need to be established. I've heard (unverified) reports of migrants ditching passports and identity cards on arrival in the UK, so that the process gets lengthened.
"So you accept that your point on “why don’t they just book a flight” was a bit naive? Yes of course they have crossed several countries, either smuggled or once within the EU because of Schengen able to move freely as no border checks. Not sure what point you are trying to make? I *think* you are trying to say they should stop/stay in first safe country but the law is that they can seek to request asylum in the country of their choosing if they can get into that country. Clearly a fair few want to come to the UK (although far far less than have ended up in various EU countries inc Germany or France) but only they can tell you why? I would guess language, potential relatives, historical connections all play a part. Possibly benefits too but then we need to do a comparison with the EU countries. Your unsubstantiated story about losing passports - again what point are you trying to make? You seem to be trying to imply they are all lying cheats who are not really genuine refugees or asylum seekers? Is that your point? | |||
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"Doesn't the UK have Embassy and/or Consular facilities in every EU country? you are being sensible now and everyone will ignore it!
Well yes, but looking further into it today, you can't claim asylum at an embassy anymore.
You have to claim upon arrival at your country of destination, where a claim will be started.
Which poses a question. If these migrants are paying people smugglers several tbousand euros a time, why don't they just book a flight and arrive at a UK airport?
Where is it that they will board that plane? Not sure there are that many commercial flights from warzones. Could be wrong.
Plus passports?
Actually being given access to the airport in Iraq, Syria etc.
After all that, will airlines carry them?
They've come across many countries, not all in a war zone.
No passport will lengthen any asylum claim, as identities need to be established. I've heard (unverified) reports of migrants ditching passports and identity cards on arrival in the UK, so that the process gets lengthened.
So you accept that your point on “why don’t they just book a flight” was a bit naive?
Yes of course they have crossed several countries, either smuggled or once within the EU because of Schengen able to move freely as no border checks. Not sure what point you are trying to make? I *think* you are trying to say they should stop/stay in first safe country but the law is that they can seek to request asylum in the country of their choosing if they can get into that country.
Clearly a fair few want to come to the UK (although far far less than have ended up in various EU countries inc Germany or France) but only they can tell you why?
I would guess language, potential relatives, historical connections all play a part. Possibly benefits too but then we need to do a comparison with the EU countries.
Your unsubstantiated story about losing passports - again what point are you trying to make? You seem to be trying to imply they are all lying cheats who are not really genuine refugees or asylum seekers? Is that your point?"I'm exploring the whys and wherefores, of why migrants travel several thousand miles, to then pay several thousand euros, to then try and make an illegal crossing into the UK. Legitimate ways of claiming asylum are available to them, probably not at point of exit, but certainly along the way. One of which, if circumstances dictate, using some of their "people smuggler" money to take a flight to the UK, walking upto immigration and asking for asylum. I'm well aware of the asylum conventions, so no need to try and tell me what I think. I'm also quite ok with controlled migration. I'm less ok with the criminality that surrounds this odious trade, and the "blind eyes" of many politicians. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not?" Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. | |||
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"Doesn't the UK have Embassy and/or Consular facilities in every EU country? you are being sensible now and everyone will ignore it!
Well yes, but looking further into it today, you can't claim asylum at an embassy anymore.
You have to claim upon arrival at your country of destination, where a claim will be started.
Which poses a question. If these migrants are paying people smugglers several tbousand euros a time, why don't they just book a flight and arrive at a UK airport?
Where is it that they will board that plane? Not sure there are that many commercial flights from warzones. Could be wrong.
Plus passports?
Actually being given access to the airport in Iraq, Syria etc.
After all that, will airlines carry them?
They've come across many countries, not all in a war zone.
No passport will lengthen any asylum claim, as identities need to be established. I've heard (unverified) reports of migrants ditching passports and identity cards on arrival in the UK, so that the process gets lengthened.
So you accept that your point on “why don’t they just book a flight” was a bit naive?
Yes of course they have crossed several countries, either smuggled or once within the EU because of Schengen able to move freely as no border checks. Not sure what point you are trying to make? I *think* you are trying to say they should stop/stay in first safe country but the law is that they can seek to request asylum in the country of their choosing if they can get into that country.
Clearly a fair few want to come to the UK (although far far less than have ended up in various EU countries inc Germany or France) but only they can tell you why?
I would guess language, potential relatives, historical connections all play a part. Possibly benefits too but then we need to do a comparison with the EU countries.
Your unsubstantiated story about losing passports - again what point are you trying to make? You seem to be trying to imply they are all lying cheats who are not really genuine refugees or asylum seekers? Is that your point?
I'm exploring the whys and wherefores, of why migrants travel several thousand miles, to then pay several thousand euros, to then try and make an illegal crossing into the UK.
Legitimate ways of claiming asylum are available to them, probably not at point of exit, but certainly along the way. One of which, if circumstances dictate, using some of their "people smuggler" money to take a flight to the UK, walking upto immigration and asking for asylum.
I'm well aware of the asylum conventions, so no need to try and tell me what I think.
I'm also quite ok with controlled migration. I'm less ok with the criminality that surrounds this odious trade, and the "blind eyes" of many politicians. "You reference “legitimate ways if claiming asylum are available to them”. So what are they? I think some people believe you can claim asylum at a British Embassy. You can’t! “An asylum application for this status can only be made when they arrive in the UK, or if they are already in the UK when it becomes clear they cannot safely return home. This can mean coming to the UK and claiming asylum at port of entry, or applying when they are already in the country. You cannot apply from outside the UK.” | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. " You may have missed the news report last night. Mayor of a French town, police no longer able to respond to local police issues as all on the beach trying to arrest migrants. Lorries carrying inflatables from factory to beach being stopped. So already doing what you asked for. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. " So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. " No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. " They are | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. " O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem." Where is the "failed" border policy? | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? " The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats." Thats criminality, not policy. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. " Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK?" What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. " what do you mean "by criminal means"? | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. what do you mean "by criminal means"? " Sailing across the channel in a dinghy! Paying people smugglers to do it. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. what do you mean "by criminal means"? Sailing across the channel in a dinghy! Paying people smugglers to do it. " It is not illegal to cross the channel by dinghy. If the payment took place out side the UK we have no jurisdiction. So where is the illegality? | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. what do you mean "by criminal means"? Sailing across the channel in a dinghy! Paying people smugglers to do it. It is not illegal to cross the channel by dinghy. If the payment took place out side the UK we have no jurisdiction. So where is the illegality?" Its not illegal to cross the channel by dhingy, providing it conforms to maritime law. That involves aspects such as seaworthiness and innocent passage. Quite obviously these don't. Then we have section 24 of the Immigration Act 1971. And criminality has no borders. Its criminal, whether on the English side or the French side. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. what do you mean "by criminal means"? Sailing across the channel in a dinghy! Paying people smugglers to do it. It is not illegal to cross the channel by dinghy. If the payment took place out side the UK we have no jurisdiction. So where is the illegality? Its not illegal to cross the channel by dhingy, providing it conforms to maritime law. That involves aspects such as seaworthiness and innocent passage. Quite obviously these don't. Then we have section 24 of the Immigration Act 1971. And criminality has no borders. Its criminal, whether on the English side or the French side. " Section 24 deals with illegal entry. It is not illegal to enter to claim asylum. Yes criminality does have borders, somethings are illegal in the UK which are not illegal in other countries and vice versa. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. what do you mean "by criminal means"? Sailing across the channel in a dinghy! Paying people smugglers to do it. It is not illegal to cross the channel by dinghy. If the payment took place out side the UK we have no jurisdiction. So where is the illegality? Its not illegal to cross the channel by dhingy, providing it conforms to maritime law. That involves aspects such as seaworthiness and innocent passage. Quite obviously these don't. Then we have section 24 of the Immigration Act 1971. And criminality has no borders. Its criminal, whether on the English side or the French side. Section 24 deals with illegal entry. It is not illegal to enter to claim asylum. Yes criminality does have borders, somethings are illegal in the UK which are not illegal in other countries and vice versa." Section 24 would apply if the entrant didn't apply for asylum on entry to the UK. It appears that most entrants are being advised to disembark and wait on the beach for Border Force officials to arrive, rather than just melt away. I'm assuming that people smuggling is illegal in France, as the French police are making arrests for that offence. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. what do you mean "by criminal means"? Sailing across the channel in a dinghy! Paying people smugglers to do it. It is not illegal to cross the channel by dinghy. If the payment took place out side the UK we have no jurisdiction. So where is the illegality? Its not illegal to cross the channel by dhingy, providing it conforms to maritime law. That involves aspects such as seaworthiness and innocent passage. Quite obviously these don't. Then we have section 24 of the Immigration Act 1971. And criminality has no borders. Its criminal, whether on the English side or the French side. Section 24 deals with illegal entry. It is not illegal to enter to claim asylum. Yes criminality does have borders, somethings are illegal in the UK which are not illegal in other countries and vice versa. Section 24 would apply if the entrant didn't apply for asylum on entry to the UK. It appears that most entrants are being advised to disembark and wait on the beach for Border Force officials to arrive, rather than just melt away. I'm assuming that people smuggling is illegal in France, as the French police are making arrests for that offence. " If they catch them I hope they are charged, people smugglers that is. Bit like drugs in a way, picking off drug addicts does little to stop the trade. The king pins are safe and sound behind many layers. Nice we established that arriving in the UK to claim asylum is legal. | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. what do you mean "by criminal means"? Sailing across the channel in a dinghy! Paying people smugglers to do it. It is not illegal to cross the channel by dinghy. If the payment took place out side the UK we have no jurisdiction. So where is the illegality? Its not illegal to cross the channel by dhingy, providing it conforms to maritime law. That involves aspects such as seaworthiness and innocent passage. Quite obviously these don't. Then we have section 24 of the Immigration Act 1971. And criminality has no borders. Its criminal, whether on the English side or the French side. Section 24 deals with illegal entry. It is not illegal to enter to claim asylum. Yes criminality does have borders, somethings are illegal in the UK which are not illegal in other countries and vice versa. Section 24 would apply if the entrant didn't apply for asylum on entry to the UK. It appears that most entrants are being advised to disembark and wait on the beach for Border Force officials to arrive, rather than just melt away. I'm assuming that people smuggling is illegal in France, as the French police are making arrests for that offence. If they catch them I hope they are charged, people smugglers that is. Bit like drugs in a way, picking off drug addicts does little to stop the trade. The king pins are safe and sound behind many layers. Nice we established that arriving in the UK to claim asylum is legal." As I am quite sure you know illegal entry to claim asylum is only permitted when someone is coming from a country where their life or freedom is threatened and they present themselves without delay to the relevant authorities | |||
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"We’re in agreement on the criminality of what is going on. With all the law enforcement capability available to UK and EU you’d think they could come down hard on them! Is there an Interpol task force? If not why not? Exactly. Has it taken a tragedy to galvanise things? Northern France should be swamped with police trying to stop and disrupt this trade. These large ribs that they make the crossing in. These are specialised and there's a starting point. Anyone trying to buy one, should have a 48 hour wait, so police can check them out. So the French should let crime in their country run rampant, just to support Johnstones inaction on refugees on the English borders. No, I expect the French to use all the resources that they have, to clamp down on the criminality occuring in their country. They could also call on the resources of other agencies should they feel inclined to. O..you an Englishman from Grantham expects the French taxpayer to pay for the Uk's failed border policy. Herin lies the problem. Where is the "failed" border policy? The failed border policy is currently coming across the channel in small boats. Thats criminality, not policy. Nice try Please can you quote me the bit of legislation that prevents people claiming asylum in the UK? What? You are trying to conflate two different issues there. Uk asylum legislation is rightly in place, and forms part of our border policy. Arriving here via criminal means is a totally different issue. Its the same the world over. I cannot just go to any country, without due consideration to that country's border policy. what do you mean "by criminal means"? Sailing across the channel in a dinghy! Paying people smugglers to do it. It is not illegal to cross the channel by dinghy. If the payment took place out side the UK we have no jurisdiction. So where is the illegality? Its not illegal to cross the channel by dhingy, providing it conforms to maritime law. That involves aspects such as seaworthiness and innocent passage. Quite obviously these don't. Then we have section 24 of the Immigration Act 1971. And criminality has no borders. Its criminal, whether on the English side or the French side. Section 24 deals with illegal entry. It is not illegal to enter to claim asylum. Yes criminality does have borders, somethings are illegal in the UK which are not illegal in other countries and vice versa. Section 24 would apply if the entrant didn't apply for asylum on entry to the UK. It appears that most entrants are being advised to disembark and wait on the beach for Border Force officials to arrive, rather than just melt away. I'm assuming that people smuggling is illegal in France, as the French police are making arrests for that offence. If they catch them I hope they are charged, people smugglers that is. Bit like drugs in a way, picking off drug addicts does little to stop the trade. The king pins are safe and sound behind many layers. Nice we established that arriving in the UK to claim asylum is legal." I've never said it wasn't. My debate centered around the modus operandi of the migrant. | |||
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