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" does anyone else feel like there is such a gap in the middle for a party that can find the balance between reality and compassion? " Wasn't that called the Liberal Party? SDP? et-al. The problem is that most electorates want a slightly right or slightly left party as suits their own 'feelings for political justice'. The middle parties failures have always been demonstrated in the moniker 'wishy washy liberals'. I suppose it's the feeling you get when you taste a bland tasting meal - neither this nor that. To pretend that people actually do care about each other on a mass scale is social naivety. We have tried middle ground parties only a few times in our history and while they sound like a solution the truth has ever delivered. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like." We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever." not on government maybe lionel but we definitely have alot of very left naively hoping for full equality public opinions , i feel its bad to say but also factual that many of these are people to young too have any sense of reality hit them and show them their utopia vision isn’t actually possible | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever." To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either." Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. not on government maybe lionel but we definitely have alot of very left naively hoping for full equality public opinions , i feel its bad to say but also factual that many of these are people to young too have any sense of reality hit them and show them their utopia vision isn’t actually possible " There is a lot of idealism on the left certainly, definitely amongst young people,we saw that in 2017. But when reality bites, its not pretty. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale?" Dont get me wrong, I am no fan of BoJo and his clowns, just as I wasn't about May, Cameron, Major or Twatcher (spelling error intended), but none of them have gone as far right as our cousins across the pond. They may seem far right, but in reality they are right of centre. None of them culled the services to such a degree that the only way to stay alive was by paying for it...even Tawtcher. And that's my definition of far right....where money is everything and if you dont have it you die. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale?" Centre | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Centre " Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Out. Standing. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Centre Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Out. Standing." That's why they're in government with a large majority ha ha | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Centre Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Out. Standing. That's why they're in government with a large majority ha ha" How exactly do you come to that conclusion? | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Centre Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Out. Standing. That's why they're in government with a large majority ha ha How exactly do you come to that conclusion?" ? Well what do you think happened? Hundreds of thousands of former Labour voters suddenly turned far right? You need to get a grip on reality | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Centre Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Out. Standing. That's why they're in government with a large majority ha ha How exactly do you come to that conclusion? ? Well what do you think happened? Hundreds of thousands of former Labour voters suddenly turned far right? You need to get a grip on reality " Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple." Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out." They voted for brexit Simple | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple" And you will stay out of power while you keep believing that.  | |||
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"Oh and the unbelievable: We are giving free this and free that and free this and free that and free this and . . . " Good point All that money can go to boris and his chums whilst unicef has to feed hungry kids. Applauds | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple And you will stay out of power while you keep believing that. "It is fact Go and do some research on why the red wall voted the way they did. Brexit Pure and simple. | |||
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"Oh and the unbelievable LABOUR: "We are giving free this and free that and free this and free that and free this and . . . " . . . and the sat-on-the-fence gibbering Brexit statements. " So it was about brexit? | |||
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"Corbyn went into the campaign with the lowest net satisfaction ratings of any opposition leader since the late 1970s (Ipsos Mori)." And? | |||
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"Corbyn went into the campaign with the lowest net satisfaction ratings of any opposition leader since the late 1970s (Ipsos Mori). And?" And people chose a centre party, a party who appealed to the widest cross section of the public instead | |||
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"Corbyn went into the campaign with the lowest net satisfaction ratings of any opposition leader since the late 1970s (Ipsos Mori). And?" hahahaha hilarious. It was like fielding a Penguin against the all-blacks in a final. And? hahahahaha. | |||
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"Corbyn went into the campaign with the lowest net satisfaction ratings of any opposition leader since the late 1970s (Ipsos Mori). And? And people chose a centre party, a party who appealed to the widest cross section of the public instead " Right..so what you are saying..is in every since election..the people have voted in a centre gmnt? | |||
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"Corbyn went into the campaign with the lowest net satisfaction ratings of any opposition leader since the late 1970s (Ipsos Mori). And? hahahaha hilarious. It was like fielding a Penguin against the all-blacks in a final. And? hahahahaha." Isnt it a bit early to be drinking? | |||
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"Corbyn went into the campaign with the lowest net satisfaction ratings of any opposition leader since the late 1970s (Ipsos Mori). And? hahahaha hilarious. It was like fielding a Penguin against the all-blacks in a final. And? hahahahaha. Isnt it a bit early to be drinking?" I always reach for a glass when politicking with you lol. I'll raise one to you and your family and (sincerely) wish you a merry and safe Christmas. | |||
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"Corbyn went into the campaign with the lowest net satisfaction ratings of any opposition leader since the late 1970s (Ipsos Mori). And? hahahaha hilarious. It was like fielding a Penguin against the all-blacks in a final. And? hahahahaha. Isnt it a bit early to be drinking? I always reach for a glass when politicking with you lol. I'll raise one to you and your family and (sincerely) wish you a merry and safe Christmas. "You too | |||
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"Corbyn went into the campaign with the lowest net satisfaction ratings of any opposition leader since the late 1970s (Ipsos Mori). And? And people chose a centre party, a party who appealed to the widest cross section of the public instead Right..so what you are saying..is in every since election..the people have voted in a centre gmnt?"  have we had one since Corbyn? | |||
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"I actually cant get over boris and co being labelled as centre...no one can be that delusional so I'll take it as a wind up. Presumably Hitler was centre right." Few weeks back someone on here claimed Boris was a socialist. | |||
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"I actually cant get over boris and co being labelled as centre...no one can be that delusional so I'll take it as a wind up. Presumably Hitler was centre right. Few weeks back someone on here claimed Boris was a socialist." | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Dont get me wrong, I am no fan of BoJo and his clowns, just as I wasn't about May, Cameron, Major or Twatcher (spelling error intended), but none of them have gone as far right as our cousins across the pond. They may seem far right, but in reality they are right of centre. None of them culled the services to such a degree that the only way to stay alive was by paying for it...even Tawtcher. And that's my definition of far right....where money is everything and if you dont have it you die." i tend to agree , not a fan of current govt but you cant describe whats going on now with furlough etc as far right i think personal opinion of voters may be further right than the govt themselves maybe i have my own utopia dream, i would love cross party working together and politicians that actually wanted to make a difference rather than further their own career running a country in 4 year slots then back peddling to win or because of the result of an election doesn't ever help us progress (not suggesting dictatorship is better just pondering out loud) a girl can dream of something different  | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Dont get me wrong, I am no fan of BoJo and his clowns, just as I wasn't about May, Cameron, Major or Twatcher (spelling error intended), but none of them have gone as far right as our cousins across the pond. They may seem far right, but in reality they are right of centre. None of them culled the services to such a degree that the only way to stay alive was by paying for it...even Tawtcher. And that's my definition of far right....where money is everything and if you dont have it you die. i tend to agree , not a fan of current govt but you cant describe whats going on now with furlough etc as far right i think personal opinion of voters may be further right than the govt themselves maybe i have my own utopia dream, i would love cross party working together and politicians that actually wanted to make a difference rather than further their own career running a country in 4 year slots then back peddling to win or because of the result of an election doesn't ever help us progress (not suggesting dictatorship is better just pondering out loud) a girl can dream of something different "Personally I'd say proposing shipping migrants into islands,8 years of austerity.umprecendented levels of homelessness and poverty was quite right wing. Lending money which will be more than paid back in full hardly makes them centrists | |||
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" i tend to agree , not a fan of current govt but you cant describe whats going on now with furlough etc as far right i think personal opinion of voters may be further right than the govt themselves maybe i have my own utopia dream, i would love cross party working together and politicians that actually wanted to make a difference rather than further their own career running a country in 4 year slots then back peddling to win or because of the result of an election doesn't ever help us progress (not suggesting dictatorship is better just pondering out loud) a girl can dream of something different "Cross party gvmt has the benefit of having to include ALL social/political beliefs in proportion to there mix in society...i.e. proportional representation, which has been poo poo'd by both main parties.....now I wonder why  | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Dont get me wrong, I am no fan of BoJo and his clowns, just as I wasn't about May, Cameron, Major or Twatcher (spelling error intended), but none of them have gone as far right as our cousins across the pond. They may seem far right, but in reality they are right of centre. None of them culled the services to such a degree that the only way to stay alive was by paying for it...even Tawtcher. And that's my definition of far right....where money is everything and if you dont have it you die. i tend to agree , not a fan of current govt but you cant describe whats going on now with furlough etc as far right i think personal opinion of voters may be further right than the govt themselves maybe i have my own utopia dream, i would love cross party working together and politicians that actually wanted to make a difference rather than further their own career running a country in 4 year slots then back peddling to win or because of the result of an election doesn't ever help us progress (not suggesting dictatorship is better just pondering out loud) a girl can dream of something different
Personally I'd say proposing shipping migrants into islands,8 years of austerity.umprecendented levels of homelessness and poverty was quite right wing.
Lending money which will be more than paid back in full hardly makes them centrists "So the EU are right wing in your eyes then? | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Dont get me wrong, I am no fan of BoJo and his clowns, just as I wasn't about May, Cameron, Major or Twatcher (spelling error intended), but none of them have gone as far right as our cousins across the pond. They may seem far right, but in reality they are right of centre. None of them culled the services to such a degree that the only way to stay alive was by paying for it...even Tawtcher. And that's my definition of far right....where money is everything and if you dont have it you die. i tend to agree , not a fan of current govt but you cant describe whats going on now with furlough etc as far right i think personal opinion of voters may be further right than the govt themselves maybe i have my own utopia dream, i would love cross party working together and politicians that actually wanted to make a difference rather than further their own career running a country in 4 year slots then back peddling to win or because of the result of an election doesn't ever help us progress (not suggesting dictatorship is better just pondering out loud) a girl can dream of something different
Personally I'd say proposing shipping migrants into islands,8 years of austerity.umprecendented levels of homelessness and poverty was quite right wing.
Lending money which will be more than paid back in full hardly makes them centrists
So the EU are right wing in your eyes then? "This isnt about the eu The fact that you see boris,jrm,priti parel etc as 'cemtrisists 'is hugely comical Anyway it's going off topic. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Dont get me wrong, I am no fan of BoJo and his clowns, just as I wasn't about May, Cameron, Major or Twatcher (spelling error intended), but none of them have gone as far right as our cousins across the pond. They may seem far right, but in reality they are right of centre. None of them culled the services to such a degree that the only way to stay alive was by paying for it...even Tawtcher. And that's my definition of far right....where money is everything and if you dont have it you die. i tend to agree , not a fan of current govt but you cant describe whats going on now with furlough etc as far right i think personal opinion of voters may be further right than the govt themselves maybe i have my own utopia dream, i would love cross party working together and politicians that actually wanted to make a difference rather than further their own career running a country in 4 year slots then back peddling to win or because of the result of an election doesn't ever help us progress (not suggesting dictatorship is better just pondering out loud) a girl can dream of something different
Personally I'd say proposing shipping migrants into islands,8 years of austerity.umprecendented levels of homelessness and poverty was quite right wing.
Lending money which will be more than paid back in full hardly makes them centrists
So the EU are right wing in your eyes then?
This isnt about the eu
The fact that you see boris,jrm,priti parel etc as 'cemtrisists 'is hugely comical
Anyway it's going off topic."I'm just pointing out that you don't understand what right wing is | |||
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"i don't normally venture into the politics forum but was thinking about something off the back of a few virus threads ... one about money and one about safeguarding people does anyone else in this country think we have too hard a split between left and right wing? my general experience is (yes i am 100% generalising) left is all heart and flowers and everyone deserves everything and nobody should ever suffer anything in their life and its all the governments fault as they should have something in place to solve all of lives problems and tax the rich to pay for it all they think entirely with their emotions (and get referred to as snowflakes) and you cant run a country like that then the right are all stiff upper lip suck it up , the poor cause their own problems, work hard to get what you want, government handouts shouldnt be a thing, everything costs money, economy economy economy they think almost entirely money based (and get called monsters) and you shouldn’t run a country like that but actually if people could get off their soap boxes for 5 minutes they might realise we have this huge glaring gap in the middle where it would all work much better ... yes you cannot give everything to everyone for free, because things cost money (and no just firing up taxes doesn’t work ... it pushes high earners abroad and just removes the extra you hoped to gain in a different way) , likewise we can’t protect everyone from everything because life just happens, shit happens, we can try and put things in place to ease the struggle of some situations but at the end of the day not everyone will have the same easy life experience, equality will never fully exist and thats just common sense flip side being we shouldnt have people living on foodbanks , its outrageous we have so many public services that need more funding, we have people struggling with physical and mental health not getting the help they need ... these things cost money yea but its money we should be spending, the same for affordable housing , etc etc does anyone else feel like there is such a gap in the middle for a party that can find the balance between reality and compassion? " Anne Applebaum wrote a very interesting book called The Twilight of Democracy. She discusses the weakening of democratic institutions and the resurgence of populist politics. In Europe she discusses this happening in Hungary, Poland and the UK. Nativism and nationalism are back with a bang. If there's one positive in Johnson's favour its that it is just a means to an end, he's just after power. Given the structure of the UK parliamentary system (and media) , the centre ground is not a safe position to be in. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Dont get me wrong, I am no fan of BoJo and his clowns, just as I wasn't about May, Cameron, Major or Twatcher (spelling error intended), but none of them have gone as far right as our cousins across the pond. They may seem far right, but in reality they are right of centre. None of them culled the services to such a degree that the only way to stay alive was by paying for it...even Tawtcher. And that's my definition of far right....where money is everything and if you dont have it you die. i tend to agree , not a fan of current govt but you cant describe whats going on now with furlough etc as far right i think personal opinion of voters may be further right than the govt themselves maybe i have my own utopia dream, i would love cross party working together and politicians that actually wanted to make a difference rather than further their own career running a country in 4 year slots then back peddling to win or because of the result of an election doesn't ever help us progress (not suggesting dictatorship is better just pondering out loud) a girl can dream of something different
Personally I'd say proposing shipping migrants into islands,8 years of austerity.umprecendented levels of homelessness and poverty was quite right wing.
Lending money which will be more than paid back in full hardly makes them centrists
So the EU are right wing in your eyes then?
This isnt about the eu
The fact that you see boris,jrm,priti parel etc as 'cemtrisists 'is hugely comical
Anyway it's going off topic.
I'm just pointing out that you don't understand what right wing is "As evidently dont you | |||
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"i don't normally venture into the politics forum but was thinking about something off the back of a few virus threads ... one about money and one about safeguarding people does anyone else in this country think we have too hard a split between left and right wing? my general experience is (yes i am 100% generalising) left is all heart and flowers and everyone deserves everything and nobody should ever suffer anything in their life and its all the governments fault as they should have something in place to solve all of lives problems and tax the rich to pay for it all they think entirely with their emotions (and get referred to as snowflakes) and you cant run a country like that then the right are all stiff upper lip suck it up , the poor cause their own problems, work hard to get what you want, government handouts shouldnt be a thing, everything costs money, economy economy economy they think almost entirely money based (and get called monsters) and you shouldn’t run a country like that but actually if people could get off their soap boxes for 5 minutes they might realise we have this huge glaring gap in the middle where it would all work much better ... yes you cannot give everything to everyone for free, because things cost money (and no just firing up taxes doesn’t work ... it pushes high earners abroad and just removes the extra you hoped to gain in a different way) , likewise we can’t protect everyone from everything because life just happens, shit happens, we can try and put things in place to ease the struggle of some situations but at the end of the day not everyone will have the same easy life experience, equality will never fully exist and thats just common sense flip side being we shouldnt have people living on foodbanks , its outrageous we have so many public services that need more funding, we have people struggling with physical and mental health not getting the help they need ... these things cost money yea but its money we should be spending, the same for affordable housing , etc etc does anyone else feel like there is such a gap in the middle for a party that can find the balance between reality and compassion? Anne Applebaum wrote a very interesting book called The Twilight of Democracy. She discusses the weakening of democratic institutions and the resurgence of populist politics. In Europe she discusses this happening in Hungary, Poland and the UK. Nativism and nationalism are back with a bang. If there's one positive in Johnson's favour its that it is just a means to an end, he's just after power. Given the structure of the UK parliamentary system (and media) , the centre ground is not a safe position to be in. " I'm not sure there is much centre ground in this country left. | |||
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"BoJo and friends are NOT center.....they are center right. No Conservative gvmt has EVER been center, not one. Some are closer to center, some are further from center but again......NOT ONE SINGLE CONSERVATIVE GVMT HAS BEEN CENTER. To add balance, no Labour gvmt has been center, they have been left of center. Closest they came to center was under Blair." New Labours policies were all centre right. Blair himself was too. The current Tory government are firmly to the right and nowhere near the centre. To address the OP, it's a case of 'feed the poor' Vs 'fuck the poor'. With the exception of Brexit being a huge victory for the right wing, only incremental changes happen as a result of a change in ruling party. As soon as anyone offers any kind of alternative to the establishment, the establishment controlled media destroys them. | |||
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"BoJo and friends are NOT center.....they are center right. No Conservative gvmt has EVER been center, not one. Some are closer to center, some are further from center but again......NOT ONE SINGLE CONSERVATIVE GVMT HAS BEEN CENTER. To add balance, no Labour gvmt has been center, they have been left of center. Closest they came to center was under Blair. New Labours policies were all centre right. Blair himself was too. The current Tory government are firmly to the right and nowhere near the centre. To address the OP, it's a case of 'feed the poor' Vs 'fuck the poor'. With the exception of Brexit being a huge victory for the right wing, only incremental changes happen as a result of a change in ruling party. As soon as anyone offers any kind of alternative to the establishment, the establishment controlled media destroys them. " With that post you have clearly demonstrated your lack of knowledge with regards to politics | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple" They voted for Brexit in 2016. They voted for Johnson or against Corbyn ( whichever) just over a year ago. If it was a Brexit vote, why did May see her majority disappear in 2017? | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple They voted for Brexit in 2016. They voted for Johnson or against Corbyn ( whichever) just over a year ago. If it was a Brexit vote, why did May see her majority disappear in 2017?" Because the 2017 election was nothing to do with Brexit | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple They voted for Brexit in 2016. They voted for Johnson or against Corbyn ( whichever) just over a year ago. If it was a Brexit vote, why did May see her majority disappear in 2017? Because the 2017 election was nothing to do with Brexit " Brexit was assured in 2016. It was a massive vote against Corbyn. Simple | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple They voted for Brexit in 2016. They voted for Johnson or against Corbyn ( whichever) just over a year ago. If it was a Brexit vote, why did May see her majority disappear in 2017? Because the 2017 election was nothing to do with Brexit Brexit was assured in 2016. It was a massive vote against Corbyn. Simple" What are you going on about? | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple They voted for Brexit in 2016. They voted for Johnson or against Corbyn ( whichever) just over a year ago. If it was a Brexit vote, why did May see her majority disappear in 2017? Because the 2017 election was nothing to do with Brexit Brexit was assured in 2016. It was a massive vote against Corbyn. Simple What are you going on about?" Was that too complex for you? | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple They voted for Brexit in 2016. They voted for Johnson or against Corbyn ( whichever) just over a year ago. If it was a Brexit vote, why did May see her majority disappear in 2017? Because the 2017 election was nothing to do with Brexit Brexit was assured in 2016. It was a massive vote against Corbyn. Simple What are you going on about? Was that too complex for you?" No you were just talking shite as per. The 2019 election was about Brexit (let's get brexit done) If you cant see that you either taking the piss or a clueless simpleton who knows nothing about politics. Take your pick | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple They voted for Brexit in 2016. They voted for Johnson or against Corbyn ( whichever) just over a year ago. If it was a Brexit vote, why did May see her majority disappear in 2017? Because the 2017 election was nothing to do with Brexit Brexit was assured in 2016. It was a massive vote against Corbyn. Simple What are you going on about? Was that too complex for you? No you were just talking shite as per. The 2019 election was about Brexit (let's get brexit done) If you cant see that you either taking the piss or a clueless simpleton who knows nothing about politics. Take your pick " Ha ha ha. Clueless simpleton, that’s rich coming from the one track pony! | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple They voted for Brexit in 2016. They voted for Johnson or against Corbyn ( whichever) just over a year ago. If it was a Brexit vote, why did May see her majority disappear in 2017? Because the 2017 election was nothing to do with Brexit Brexit was assured in 2016. It was a massive vote against Corbyn. Simple What are you going on about? Was that too complex for you? No you were just talking shite as per. The 2019 election was about Brexit (let's get brexit done) If you cant see that you either taking the piss or a clueless simpleton who knows nothing about politics. Take your pick Ha ha ha. Clueless simpleton, that’s rich coming from the one track pony!" I guessed right. | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple They voted for Brexit in 2016. They voted for Johnson or against Corbyn ( whichever) just over a year ago. If it was a Brexit vote, why did May see her majority disappear in 2017? Because the 2017 election was nothing to do with Brexit Brexit was assured in 2016. It was a massive vote against Corbyn. Simple What are you going on about? Was that too complex for you? No you were just talking shite as per. The 2019 election was about Brexit (let's get brexit done) If you cant see that you either taking the piss or a clueless simpleton who knows nothing about politics. Take your pick Ha ha ha. Clueless simpleton, that’s rich coming from the one track pony! I guessed right." I don’t have to guess about you | |||
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"I think left and right is a very out dated concept anyway, based on two very different but very narrow views of the world. When I vote, I vote on the basis of who I think will be most competent and least corrupt. Which is very difficult in recent years. Rather than left and right, I prefer to think in terms of “greater good”. As far as I can see, having met customers across Europe, somewhere like Holland has a much higher proportion of people living a decent quality of life than we do. The gap between rich and poor is much less but it’s still a market driven economy. Seems to make more people happier. " The concept of who is less corrupt is irrevilent as polititions are all corrupt as are most people in society. This is a silly term invented by people trying to take a moral high ground that does not exist. | |||
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"I think left and right is a very out dated concept anyway, based on two very different but very narrow views of the world. When I vote, I vote on the basis of who I think will be most competent and least corrupt. Which is very difficult in recent years. Rather than left and right, I prefer to think in terms of “greater good”. As far as I can see, having met customers across Europe, somewhere like Holland has a much higher proportion of people living a decent quality of life than we do. The gap between rich and poor is much less but it’s still a market driven economy. Seems to make more people happier. The concept of who is less corrupt is irrevilent as polititions are all corrupt as are most people in society. This is a silly term invented by people trying to take a moral high ground that does not exist." Blimey, what a bleak view of humanity you have! | |||
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"I think left and right is a very out dated concept anyway, based on two very different but very narrow views of the world. When I vote, I vote on the basis of who I think will be most competent and least corrupt. Which is very difficult in recent years. Rather than left and right, I prefer to think in terms of “greater good”. As far as I can see, having met customers across Europe, somewhere like Holland has a much higher proportion of people living a decent quality of life than we do. The gap between rich and poor is much less but it’s still a market driven economy. Seems to make more people happier. The concept of who is less corrupt is irrevilent as polititions are all corrupt as are most people in society. This is a silly term invented by people trying to take a moral high ground that does not exist. Blimey, what a bleak view of humanity you have!" i think to an extent they are right even if it is bleak ... i don’t think all politicians start out corrupt and i don’t think they all end up at the level where its criminal but i do think even the ones that set out all blue eyed hoping to make a difference sooner or later get eaten up and spat out by the machine, realise all the back channel dealings , the impossible bureaucracy and that they will probably be responsible for very little positive change and then just care about keeping themselves in a job | |||
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"I think left and right is a very out dated concept anyway, based on two very different but very narrow views of the world. When I vote, I vote on the basis of who I think will be most competent and least corrupt. Which is very difficult in recent years. Rather than left and right, I prefer to think in terms of “greater good”. As far as I can see, having met customers across Europe, somewhere like Holland has a much higher proportion of people living a decent quality of life than we do. The gap between rich and poor is much less but it’s still a market driven economy. Seems to make more people happier. The concept of who is less corrupt is irrevilent as polititions are all corrupt as are most people in society. This is a silly term invented by people trying to take a moral high ground that does not exist. Blimey, what a bleak view of humanity you have! i think to an extent they are right even if it is bleak ... i don’t think all politicians start out corrupt and i don’t think they all end up at the level where its criminal but i do think even the ones that set out all blue eyed hoping to make a difference sooner or later get eaten up and spat out by the machine, realise all the back channel dealings , the impossible bureaucracy and that they will probably be responsible for very little positive change and then just care about keeping themselves in a job " It was more the moral high ground not existing and the rest of society being as corrupt as politicians. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg." The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country." Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories " You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. | |||
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"I think left and right is a very out dated concept anyway, based on two very different but very narrow views of the world. When I vote, I vote on the basis of who I think will be most competent and least corrupt. Which is very difficult in recent years. Rather than left and right, I prefer to think in terms of “greater good”. As far as I can see, having met customers across Europe, somewhere like Holland has a much higher proportion of people living a decent quality of life than we do. The gap between rich and poor is much less but it’s still a market driven economy. Seems to make more people happier. The concept of who is less corrupt is irrevilent as polititions are all corrupt as are most people in society. This is a silly term invented by people trying to take a moral high ground that does not exist. Blimey, what a bleak view of humanity you have! i think to an extent they are right even if it is bleak ... i don’t think all politicians start out corrupt and i don’t think they all end up at the level where its criminal but i do think even the ones that set out all blue eyed hoping to make a difference sooner or later get eaten up and spat out by the machine, realise all the back channel dealings , the impossible bureaucracy and that they will probably be responsible for very little positive change and then just care about keeping themselves in a job " Well I did say it was difficult to find someone incorruptible to vote for yes. But I did as a student hear an old left labour MP speak, Dave Nellist, and he only took as an MP the average salary of his constituents, donated the rest to charity. I didn’t agree with his politics, he defined himself as a Trotskyist lol, but he wasn’t a loon, and I admired him immensely as someone who lived by his principles. He was expelled by labour in 1991 obviously. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre." It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost" It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio." make that 2. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio." No, I'm not. If you think a multi cultural government who provide benefits, health care, is soft on crime etc is somehow right wing then your head is so far to the left or so ignorant of politics it's unbelievable | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio. No, I'm not. If you think a multi cultural government who provide benefits, health care, is soft on crime etc is somehow right wing then your head is so far to the left or so ignorant of politics it's unbelievable " No one person on this thread has backed you up. Someone who thinks the likes of Priti patel,jrb,mark Francis,ids and boris johnson are centrists is utterly deluded or just taking the piss. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2. "Make that 3 
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2. "Standard Funny you have never referred to them as centrists before | |||
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"I think left and right is a very out dated concept anyway, based on two very different but very narrow views of the world. When I vote, I vote on the basis of who I think will be most competent and least corrupt. Which is very difficult in recent years. Rather than left and right, I prefer to think in terms of “greater good”. As far as I can see, having met customers across Europe, somewhere like Holland has a much higher proportion of people living a decent quality of life than we do. The gap between rich and poor is much less but it’s still a market driven economy. Seems to make more people happier. The concept of who is less corrupt is irrevilent as polititions are all corrupt as are most people in society. This is a silly term invented by people trying to take a moral high ground that does not exist. Blimey, what a bleak view of humanity you have!" Yes I do just realistic the proof is all around Merry Christmas | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer. "What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist? | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?"I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio. No, I'm not. If you think a multi cultural government who provide benefits, health care, is soft on crime etc is somehow right wing then your head is so far to the left or so ignorant of politics it's unbelievable No one person on this thread has backed you up. Someone who thinks the likes of Priti patel,jrb,mark Francis,ids and boris johnson are centrists is utterly deluded or just taking the piss." If you think they are not on the middle ground you know nothing about politics,Boris is a virtually a socialist. Those more to the left are scared by this so put out propaganda that is total lies and people like you swallow it. The actions of the current Tory party prove you 100% wrong but you shut your eyes | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?
I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor."They seem to both think that boris johnson ,priti patel et all represent the centre ground in British politics. Labour lost because of brexit. Simple. It doesnt matter who was kn charge..they would have followed the same policy and lost. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio. No, I'm not. If you think a multi cultural government who provide benefits, health care, is soft on crime etc is somehow right wing then your head is so far to the left or so ignorant of politics it's unbelievable No one person on this thread has backed you up. Someone who thinks the likes of Priti patel,jrb,mark Francis,ids and boris johnson are centrists is utterly deluded or just taking the piss.If you think they are not on the middle ground you know nothing about politics,Boris is a virtually a socialist. Those more to the left are scared by this so put out propaganda that is total lies and people like you swallow it. The actions of the current Tory party prove you 100% wrong but you shut your eyes" Boris is virtually a socialist
I'm getting that framed. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio. No, I'm not. If you think a multi cultural government who provide benefits, health care, is soft on crime etc is somehow right wing then your head is so far to the left or so ignorant of politics it's unbelievable " Wow. Holy fuck. Imagine thinking that the current government isn't horrific enough. Do people watch The Handmaid's Tale and think, "yes that's what we need". | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio. No, I'm not. If you think a multi cultural government who provide benefits, health care, is soft on crime etc is somehow right wing then your head is so far to the left or so ignorant of politics it's unbelievable Wow. Holy fuck. Imagine thinking that the current government isn't horrific enough. Do people watch The Handmaid's Tale and think, "yes that's what we need"." There's a few here that probably masturbate to the Handmaid's Tale. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?
I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor.
They seem to both think that boris johnson ,priti patel et all represent the centre ground in British politics.
Labour lost because of brexit.
Simple.
It doesnt matter who was kn charge..they would have followed the same policy and lost."So you're saying labour is out of touch with the majority of the voting population? | |||
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"I think left and right is a very out dated concept anyway, based on two very different but very narrow views of the world. When I vote, I vote on the basis of who I think will be most competent and least corrupt. Which is very difficult in recent years. Rather than left and right, I prefer to think in terms of “greater good”. As far as I can see, having met customers across Europe, somewhere like Holland has a much higher proportion of people living a decent quality of life than we do. The gap between rich and poor is much less but it’s still a market driven economy. Seems to make more people happier. The concept of who is less corrupt is irrevilent as polititions are all corrupt as are most people in society. This is a silly term invented by people trying to take a moral high ground that does not exist." This is quite a common thing you see from right wing people - they're desperate to believe every else one is as morally bankrupt as they are. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?
I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor.
They seem to both think that boris johnson ,priti patel et all represent the centre ground in British politics.
Labour lost because of brexit.
Simple.
It doesnt matter who was kn charge..they would have followed the same policy and lost.
So you're saying labour is out of touch with the majority of the voting population?"The majority of the people voted for labour,liberal and snp who were all broadly remain parties. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio. No, I'm not. If you think a multi cultural government who provide benefits, health care, is soft on crime etc is somehow right wing then your head is so far to the left or so ignorant of politics it's unbelievable Wow. Holy fuck. Imagine thinking that the current government isn't horrific enough. Do people watch The Handmaid's Tale and think, "yes that's what we need". There's a few here that probably masturbate to the Handmaid's Tale." They probally think Gilead was ran by liberals. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?
I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor.
They seem to both think that boris johnson ,priti patel et all represent the centre ground in British politics.
Labour lost because of brexit.
Simple.
It doesnt matter who was kn charge..they would have followed the same policy and lost.
So you're saying labour is out of touch with the majority of the voting population?
The majority of the people voted for labour,liberal and snp who were all broadly remain parties."Well does that just confirm how dim they are for not backing one horse or that some remainers voted lib dems or SNP because they couldn't stomach the thought of Corbyn in charge either? | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?
I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor.
They seem to both think that boris johnson ,priti patel et all represent the centre ground in British politics.
Labour lost because of brexit.
Simple.
It doesnt matter who was kn charge..they would have followed the same policy and lost.
So you're saying labour is out of touch with the majority of the voting population?
The majority of the people voted for labour,liberal and snp who were all broadly remain parties.
Well does that just confirm how dim they are for not backing one horse or that some remainers voted lib dems or SNP because they couldn't stomach the thought of Corbyn in charge either? "Aa someone who cant tell the difference between priti Patel and a liberal Democrat..I'd be wary about calling other people dim. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?
I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor.
They seem to both think that boris johnson ,priti patel et all represent the centre ground in British politics.
Labour lost because of brexit.
Simple.
It doesnt matter who was kn charge..they would have followed the same policy and lost.
So you're saying labour is out of touch with the majority of the voting population?
The majority of the people voted for labour,liberal and snp who were all broadly remain parties.
Well does that just confirm how dim they are for not backing one horse or that some remainers voted lib dems or SNP because they couldn't stomach the thought of Corbyn in charge either?
Aa someone who cant tell the difference between priti Patel and a liberal Democrat..I'd be wary about calling other people dim."What is a Liberal democrat? Hardly democratic to try to overturn the result of a referendum just because you don't like it is it? And I'm so dim yet funnily enough always end up on the winning side. Something you will never experience | |||
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"I actually cant get over boris and co being labelled as centre...no one can be that delusional so I'll take it as a wind up. Presumably Hitler was centre right." Heres the thing Hitler saw himself as left wing, | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio. No, I'm not. If you think a multi cultural government who provide benefits, health care, is soft on crime etc is somehow right wing then your head is so far to the left or so ignorant of politics it's unbelievable No one person on this thread has backed you up. Someone who thinks the likes of Priti patel,jrb,mark Francis,ids and boris johnson are centrists is utterly deluded or just taking the piss.If you think they are not on the middle ground you know nothing about politics,Boris is a virtually a socialist. Those more to the left are scared by this so put out propaganda that is total lies and people like you swallow it. The actions of the current Tory party prove you 100% wrong but you shut your eyes Boris is virtually a socialist
I'm getting that framed."Well it is true FACT | |||
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"I actually cant get over boris and co being labelled as centre...no one can be that delusional so I'll take it as a wind up. Presumably Hitler was centre right. Heres the thing Hitler saw himself as left wing, " Hitler was left wing there is no difference between extreme right and extreme left,Corbyn is right wing as is Stalin there is no difference | |||
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"I actually cant get over boris and co being labelled as centre...no one can be that delusional so I'll take it as a wind up. Presumably Hitler was centre right. Heres the thing Hitler saw himself as left wing, " Probally why he had all the communists killed | |||
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"I actually cant get over boris and co being labelled as centre...no one can be that delusional so I'll take it as a wind up. Presumably Hitler was centre right. Heres the thing Hitler saw himself as left wing, Hitler was left wing there is no difference between extreme right and extreme left,Corbyn is right wing as is Stalin there is no difference" Boyd johnson is a socialist and jc is tight wing Outstanding work | |||
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"I actually cant get over boris and co being labelled as centre...no one can be that delusional so I'll take it as a wind up. Presumably Hitler was centre right. Heres the thing Hitler saw himself as left wing, Hitler was left wing there is no difference between extreme right and extreme left,Corbyn is right wing as is Stalin there is no difference" Amazing. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?
I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor.
They seem to both think that boris johnson ,priti patel et all represent the centre ground in British politics.
Labour lost because of brexit.
Simple.
It doesnt matter who was kn charge..they would have followed the same policy and lost.
So you're saying labour is out of touch with the majority of the voting population?
The majority of the people voted for labour,liberal and snp who were all broadly remain parties."The large majority of the voting population voted for Brexit | |||
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| |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?
I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor.
They seem to both think that boris johnson ,priti patel et all represent the centre ground in British politics.
Labour lost because of brexit.
Simple.
It doesnt matter who was kn charge..they would have followed the same policy and lost.
So you're saying labour is out of touch with the majority of the voting population?
The majority of the people voted for labour,liberal and snp who were all broadly remain parties.
The large majority of the voting population voted for Brexit"Go and check your figures. | |||
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"You can't take politics seriously in this country when people refer to the current government as centre but that's the dangerous territory we're in. "Centre" ground has been claimed by the Tories over the last decade. But the problem is the country's struggle with its sense of identity, not left and right. It's become an insidious kind of politics. Left, right and centre are distractions from deeper rooted problems. Some of these problems have surfaced and have had a negative effect and we're only dealing with the tip of the iceberg. The entire system is rotten.. peerage,the lords,advisory jobs..it will take something to drastic to change it. The fact that anyone considers this lot as centrists just shows how far we have moved as a country. Percepction of left and right will vary slightly over the years but by definition the centre will always be where the votes are and for now that is with the Tories You are clearly in the minority of 1 if you think this lot are remotely near the centre. It doesn't matter what I think. They are the party who are furthest from the far left and the far right in other words in the centre and that's why they won. Labour under Corbyn and McDonnell were too far to the left and that's why they lost It doesn't matter you are the only person who believes that nonsense? Rightio.make that 2.
Make that 3
McDonnell in particular was quite a good speaker but utterly incapable of demonstrating a coherent economic plan, and managed to split with Corbyn as a remainer.
What's that got to do with jrb being a centrist?
I was answering as to why labour lost, and having their top two disagreeing on Brexit was also a factor.
They seem to both think that boris johnson ,priti patel et all represent the centre ground in British politics.
Labour lost because of brexit.
Simple.
It doesnt matter who was kn charge..they would have followed the same policy and lost.
So you're saying labour is out of touch with the majority of the voting population?
The majority of the people voted for labour,liberal and snp who were all broadly remain parties.
The large majority of the voting population voted for Brexit
Go and check your figures.
"52/48 last time i checked | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale?" More central than labour at the moment thought the Labour Party have started to come back from the far left for the moment. See easy Lionel | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? More central than labour at the moment thought the Labour Party have started to come back from the far left for the moment. See easy Lionel " The likes of priti Patel and jrb are contrists? Riiiight Which would make the liberals far left? Out of curiosity can you give me 5 far left policies labour had,? | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? More central than labour at the moment thought the Labour Party have started to come back from the far left for the moment. See easy Lionel The likes of priti Patel and jrb are contrists? Riiiight Which would make the liberals far left? Out of curiosity can you give me 5 far left policies labour had,?" Free bus travel for under-25s Abolish private schools' charitable status Scrap Universal Credit Nationalise key industries Raise minimum wage by over 20% | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? More central than labour at the moment thought the Labour Party have started to come back from the far left for the moment. See easy Lionel The likes of priti Patel and jrb are contrists? Riiiight Which would make the liberals far left? Out of curiosity can you give me 5 far left policies labour had,? Free bus travel for under-25s Abolish private schools' charitable status Scrap Universal Credit Nationalise key industries Raise minimum wage by over 20% " The fact that you consider lifting people out of poverty as 'far left 'speaks volumes. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase " £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase " They were going to raise the minimum to £10 per hour for everyone over 16. That’s a 21% increase from the prevailing 25 and over rate at the time of the election. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation?" Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase They were going to raise the minimum to £10 per hour for everyone over 16. That’s a 21% increase from the prevailing 25 and over rate at the time of the election." | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase They were going to raise the minimum to £10 per hour for everyone over 16. That’s a 21% increase from the prevailing 25 and over rate at the time of the election." Its £8.21 now. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase They were going to raise the minimum to £10 per hour for everyone over 16. That’s a 21% increase from the prevailing 25 and over rate at the time of the election. Its £8.21 now. " Is it not £8.72? | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. " You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. " The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons " Jobs may have increased but not necessarily because of the increase in the minimum wage. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons " What makes you think I’ve not work through all of this, maybe me & my colleagues shouldn’t go in to work tomorrow, the power stations have worked all through this have you Lionel have you even got a job? & I don’t care what you think you know, you know nothing about me who I help in society & how often, come for a walk with me I’ll show you the hostel where I volunteer when not working & under normal circumstances, I’ll even let you meet the homeless guy I put up last year for a week. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons Jobs may have increased but not necessarily because of the increase in the minimum wage." Before the minimum wage was introduced the tories opposed it saying it would mean jobs would be lost. This didn't happen. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons Jobs may have increased but not necessarily because of the increase in the minimum wage. Before the minimum wage was introduced the tories opposed it saying it would mean jobs would be lost. This didn't happen." The jobs where supported by working tax credits | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons What makes you think I’ve not work through all of this, maybe me & my colleagues shouldn’t go in to work tomorrow, the power stations have worked all through this have you Lionel have you even got a job? & I don’t care what you think you know, you know nothing about me who I help in society & how often, come for a walk with me I’ll show you the hostel where I volunteer when not working & under normal circumstances, I’ll even let you meet the homeless guy I put up last year for a week." Where did I say anything about you working? The inequality in this country is utterly obscene and trying to combat that is not remotely left wing. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons Jobs may have increased but not necessarily because of the increase in the minimum wage. Before the minimum wage was introduced the tories opposed it saying it would mean jobs would be lost. This didn't happen. The jobs where supported by working tax credits" Working tax credits didnt come in till 2003 The minimum wage was brought in..in the 90s. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons What makes you think I’ve not work through all of this, maybe me & my colleagues shouldn’t go in to work tomorrow, the power stations have worked all through this have you Lionel have you even got a job? & I don’t care what you think you know, you know nothing about me who I help in society & how often, come for a walk with me I’ll show you the hostel where I volunteer when not working & under normal circumstances, I’ll even let you meet the homeless guy I put up last year for a week. Where did I say anything about you working? The inequality in this country is utterly obscene and trying to combat that is not remotely left wing." Creating jobs worth having is the answer, not making people to expensive to employ. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons Jobs may have increased but not necessarily because of the increase in the minimum wage. Before the minimum wage was introduced the tories opposed it saying it would mean jobs would be lost. This didn't happen. The jobs where supported by working tax credits Working tax credits didnt come in till 2003 The minimum wage was brought in..in the 90s." WTC replaced other similar schemes which had been in operation since mid 80s | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons Jobs may have increased but not necessarily because of the increase in the minimum wage. Before the minimum wage was introduced the tories opposed it saying it would mean jobs would be lost. This didn't happen. The jobs where supported by working tax credits Working tax credits didnt come in till 2003 The minimum wage was brought in..in the 90s." 1999 & 2003 is not that far apart in fiscal terms, but also in that time didn’t Tony Blair bring in zero hour contracts to run along side the minimum wage? | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons What makes you think I’ve not work through all of this, maybe me & my colleagues shouldn’t go in to work tomorrow, the power stations have worked all through this have you Lionel have you even got a job? & I don’t care what you think you know, you know nothing about me who I help in society & how often, come for a walk with me I’ll show you the hostel where I volunteer when not working & under normal circumstances, I’ll even let you meet the homeless guy I put up last year for a week. Where did I say anything about you working? The inequality in this country is utterly obscene and trying to combat that is not remotely left wing. Creating jobs worth having is the answer, not making people to expensive to employ. " As stated previously..that argument was proved to be flawed in the past. When you give people more money they spend more..creating more money in the economy and consequently more jobs. Look at the countries where wages are high..Germany for example..they have one of the strongest economies in the world. We had 8 years of austerity and what happened.. the economy has flat lined. We live in a rich country..people shouldnt be ekeing out their existence in the breadline whilst others live a life of total luxury. Addressing that inequality is not left wing..its humane. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons Jobs may have increased but not necessarily because of the increase in the minimum wage. Before the minimum wage was introduced the tories opposed it saying it would mean jobs would be lost. This didn't happen. The jobs where supported by working tax credits Working tax credits didnt come in till 2003 The minimum wage was brought in..in the 90s. WTC replaced other similar schemes which had been in operation since mid 80s" The fact remains.. the minimum wage didnt lead to large scale unemployment. | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons Jobs may have increased but not necessarily because of the increase in the minimum wage. Before the minimum wage was introduced the tories opposed it saying it would mean jobs would be lost. This didn't happen. The jobs where supported by working tax credits Working tax credits didnt come in till 2003 The minimum wage was brought in..in the 90s. 1999 & 2003 is not that far apart in fiscal terms, but also in that time didn’t Tony Blair bring in zero hour contracts to run along side the minimum wage?" Who was in gmnt in may 2015? | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons Jobs may have increased but not necessarily because of the increase in the minimum wage. Before the minimum wage was introduced the tories opposed it saying it would mean jobs would be lost. This didn't happen. The jobs where supported by working tax credits Working tax credits didnt come in till 2003 The minimum wage was brought in..in the 90s. WTC replaced other similar schemes which had been in operation since mid 80s The fact remains.. the minimum wage didnt lead to large scale unemployment. " I never said it did. Keep up! | |||
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"https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-48234398 I know my maths isnt great but increasing a wage by £1.20 a hour is not a 20%increase £8.21 to £10 is just over a 21% increase your right I’m wrong. But if you are putting theirs wages up by 21% & so everyone else needs to go up by just as much to pay for the goods & services they buy. Or don’t you understand inflation? Like I said the fact that you consider lifting the most deprived sectors out of poverty..as 'far left ' says a lot. As for renationslisation..something the tories have actually done themselves..with some railway franchises..means they are also far left. You can’t even do simple maths, so do you think an employer will keep all those staff on & not get rid of any. A 21% increase to their biggest cost in a single go would shut businesses or put up prices that then stops people buying off them. Unemployment would increase & so would poverty. Don’t say it wouldn’t cause people already do shop round for the best price & most of the time that’s from places with little over heads due to low staff numbers. Now if they had said we will increase it inline with inflation plus 2% for 5 years that may of got people out of poverty. The tories used that line when they opposed the mimimum wage coming in,in the 1st place.It will lose jobs.. Guess what..it didnt.in fact the opposite. I'll say it one more time..the fact that you think those on the bottom rungs of society, those that worked all the way through the crises,should not have a proper pay rise,quite frankly says it all. No wonder we are governed by a gang of corrupt buffoons What makes you think I’ve not work through all of this, maybe me & my colleagues shouldn’t go in to work tomorrow, the power stations have worked all through this have you Lionel have you even got a job? & I don’t care what you think you know, you know nothing about me who I help in society & how often, come for a walk with me I’ll show you the hostel where I volunteer when not working & under normal circumstances, I’ll even let you meet the homeless guy I put up last year for a week. Where did I say anything about you working? The inequality in this country is utterly obscene and trying to combat that is not remotely left wing. Creating jobs worth having is the answer, not making people to expensive to employ. As stated previously..that argument was proved to be flawed in the past. When you give people more money they spend more..creating more money in the economy and consequently more jobs. Look at the countries where wages are high..Germany for example..they have one of the strongest economies in the world. We had 8 years of austerity and what happened.. the economy has flat lined. We live in a rich country..people shouldnt be ekeing out their existence in the breadline whilst others live a life of total luxury. Addressing that inequality is not left wing..its humane." You can not compare Germany with the Uk, they got rebuilt after the war, don’t spend as much on defence, got given or let of money owed when reunited. Decent jobs earnings because their products are in demand. Yes austerity doesn’t work but the money has to come from somewhere & why should my great grandchildren be paying off our debt. Even China realises that the left ways don’t work they are an idea from the past but you won’t get rich by them. | |||
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"I think left and right is a very out dated concept anyway, based on two very different but very narrow views of the world. When I vote, I vote on the basis of who I think will be most competent and least corrupt. Which is very difficult in recent years. Rather than left and right, I prefer to think in terms of “greater good”. As far as I can see, having met customers across Europe, somewhere like Holland has a much higher proportion of people living a decent quality of life than we do. The gap between rich and poor is much less but it’s still a market driven economy. Seems to make more people happier. " Bollocks is it! | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? More central than labour at the moment thought the Labour Party have started to come back from the far left for the moment. See easy Lionel The likes of priti Patel and jrb are contrists? Riiiight Which would make the liberals far left? Out of curiosity can you give me 5 far left policies labour had,? Free bus travel for under-25s Abolish private schools' charitable status Scrap Universal Credit Nationalise key industries Raise minimum wage by over 20% " Too right. We need more common sense centre policies like. -using poor people as coffee tables -healthcare and education only for the elite ultra rich -legalise hunting poor people. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? More central than labour at the moment thought the Labour Party have started to come back from the far left for the moment. See easy Lionel The likes of priti Patel and jrb are contrists? Riiiight Which would make the liberals far left? Out of curiosity can you give me 5 far left policies labour had,? Free bus travel for under-25s Abolish private schools' charitable status Scrap Universal Credit Nationalise key industries Raise minimum wage by over 20% Too right. We need more common sense centre policies like. -using poor people as coffee tables -healthcare and education only for the elite ultra rich -legalise hunting poor people." Under normal circumstances when have you been refused medical treatment? My education went well so has that of my older children having all state provided education. You do realise the last few leaders of labour all had private educations don’t you? Would you really lower yourself to be someone else table? Or is it you just want others to be your table? Where does the hunting poor people come into it? X | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? More central than labour at the moment thought the Labour Party have started to come back from the far left for the moment. See easy Lionel The likes of priti Patel and jrb are contrists? Riiiight Which would make the liberals far left? Out of curiosity can you give me 5 far left policies labour had,? Free bus travel for under-25s Abolish private schools' charitable status Scrap Universal Credit Nationalise key industries Raise minimum wage by over 20% Too right. We need more common sense centre policies like. -using poor people as coffee tables -healthcare and education only for the elite ultra rich -legalise hunting poor people. Under normal circumstances when have you been refused medical treatment? My education went well so has that of my older children having all state provided education. You do realise the last few leaders of labour all had private educations don’t you? Would you really lower yourself to be someone else table? Or is it you just want others to be your table? Where does the hunting poor people come into it? X" My post was satire. I wasn't genuinely suggesting that we should lobby for these policies. I was making fun of your perception of "far left policy". | |||
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"for those who are unfamiliar with the radio programme "The Peoples Manifesto", where the audience are invited to suggest policies which are then voted on, then here's some of the legislation that succeeded ... That Windsor be renamed Lower Slough. If it pisses down with rain on a bank holiday, it will be considered a rollover. There should be a public referendum before going to war. Government to reclaim the buildings that have been sold ‘offshore’ in ownership under the Private Finance Initiative (and then we invade Jersey) Deem elections void if a political party breaks over 50% of their election pledges Every citizen to be given £10,000 worth of vouchers to spend over six months rather than giving the money to the banks as part of quantitive easing – the argument being that we would actually spend it and the banks would not Any profits made by MPs who have interest in private heathcare companies to be given to patients on the NHS waiting list. The House of Lords should be elected by a public lottery with everyone able to ‘have a go’ if one of the 2,000 strong members selected. "some of these are so stupid it’s unbelievable... people who sit on the couch with no concept of how complex the world really is (no matter what side their politics fall on) | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple And you will stay out of power while you keep believing that.
It is fact
Go and do some research on why the red wall voted the way they did.
Brexit
Pure and simple."sorry lionel your wrong im from a old mining village not one of my friends family or children voted for labour not because of brexit but because they have offered nothing new in yrs.we nearly had are first conservative mp and when we talk nothing as changed even sks does nothing for them I can easily see labour loosing here next may they are not for working class anymore im afraid. | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple And you will stay out of power while you keep believing that.
It is fact
Go and do some research on why the red wall voted the way they did.
Brexit
Pure and simple. sorry lionel your wrong im from a old mining village not one of my friends family or children voted for labour not because of brexit but because they have offered nothing new in yrs.we nearly had are first conservative mp and when we talk nothing as changed even sks does nothing for them I can easily see labour loosing here next may they are not for working class anymore im afraid."hopefully not going to have people jump on me here cause its just a genuine question.., if not for working class, what do you think they are for now? | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple And you will stay out of power while you keep believing that.
It is fact
Go and do some research on why the red wall voted the way they did.
Brexit
Pure and simple. sorry lionel your wrong im from a old mining village not one of my friends family or children voted for labour not because of brexit but because they have offered nothing new in yrs.we nearly had are first conservative mp and when we talk nothing as changed even sks does nothing for them I can easily see labour loosing here next may they are not for working class anymore im afraid.
hopefully not going to have people jump on me here cause its just a genuine question.., if not for working class, what do you think they are for now? "I would partly agree. I don't think Starmer would do much for the working class. He would largely be a less overtly nasty version of the Tories. The previous Labour offered change, hence why the press destroyed Corbyn. | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple And you will stay out of power while you keep believing that.
It is fact
Go and do some research on why the red wall voted the way they did.
Brexit
Pure and simple. sorry lionel your wrong im from a old mining village not one of my friends family or children voted for labour not because of brexit but because they have offered nothing new in yrs.we nearly had are first conservative mp and when we talk nothing as changed even sks does nothing for them I can easily see labour loosing here next may they are not for working class anymore im afraid.
hopefully not going to have people jump on me here cause its just a genuine question.., if not for working class, what do you think they are for now?
I would partly agree. I don't think Starmer would do much for the working class. He would largely be a less overtly nasty version of the Tories.
The previous Labour offered change, hence why the press destroyed Corbyn."Oh yeah, obviously the fault of the press. I had a lot of time for Corbyn, particularly that at a late stage in life he actually put himself forward to do a very tough job rather than sit on the sidelines doing protest votes. He then completely sabotaged himself by failing to sort out the very simple issue of anti Semitic members, and not reigning in McDonnell who completely failed to come up with a credible economic plan. | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple And you will stay out of power while you keep believing that.
It is fact
Go and do some research on why the red wall voted the way they did.
Brexit
Pure and simple. sorry lionel your wrong im from a old mining village not one of my friends family or children voted for labour not because of brexit but because they have offered nothing new in yrs.we nearly had are first conservative mp and when we talk nothing as changed even sks does nothing for them I can easily see labour loosing here next may they are not for working class anymore im afraid.
hopefully not going to have people jump on me here cause its just a genuine question.., if not for working class, what do you think they are for now? "Nobody outside of London dinner parties knows | |||
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" Loads of labour voters..vote for brexit it's quite simple. Nope. They voted to keep Corby out. They voted for brexit Simple And you will stay out of power while you keep believing that.
It is fact
Go and do some research on why the red wall voted the way they did.
Brexit
Pure and simple. sorry lionel your wrong im from a old mining village not one of my friends family or children voted for labour not because of brexit but because they have offered nothing new in yrs.we nearly had are first conservative mp and when we talk nothing as changed even sks does nothing for them I can easily see labour loosing here next may they are not for working class anymore im afraid.
hopefully not going to have people jump on me here cause its just a genuine question.., if not for working class, what do you think they are for now?
I would partly agree. I don't think Starmer would do much for the working class. He would largely be a less overtly nasty version of the Tories.
The previous Labour offered change, hence why the press destroyed Corbyn.
Oh yeah, obviously the fault of the press. I had a lot of time for Corbyn, particularly that at a late stage in life he actually put himself forward to do a very tough job rather than sit on the sidelines doing protest votes.
He then completely sabotaged himself by failing to sort out the very simple issue of anti Semitic members, and not reigning in McDonnell who completely failed to come up with a credible economic plan."Those are fair points. Not what the press cared about tough. The smear campaign against him is well documented though. In my opinion, it was simply because he wanted to make meaningful changes to the system. He wasn't perfect, obviously. I'm not a labour supporter, so have no attachment to him, Starmer or their party. So I don't have any interest in defending him. | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Centre Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Out. Standing. That's why they're in government with a large majority ha ha" No. They got a large majority because the FPTP electoral system is fucked. Only 43.6% of voters gave the Tories consent to govern. Plenty of right-wingers, particularly those who are a bit dim, believe that our system is a democracy. It isn't. And, if FPTP isn't as fucked up as I think it is, and it's a good system, despite the fact it is clearly unrepresentative; then surely the SNP's position as the 3rd largest party, in terms of seats in Westminster, is also legitimate? | |||
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"That bit in the middle? It's called social democracy......helping out those who need it so they can help themselves eventually (and thus help others). The extremes are both bad...far right, fuck off if you cant pay might as well die.....far left, fuck off with personal wealth and live to the same standard as everyone else (usually a low standard). At least that's how I see it. Feel free to disagree if you like. We have never had anything approaching far left in the country ever. To be fair, in modern times we have never had anything approaching far right either. Where would you put the current lot on the political scale? Centre Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Out. Standing. That's why they're in government with a large majority ha ha No. They got a large majority because the FPTP electoral system is fucked. Only 43.6% of voters gave the Tories consent to govern. Plenty of right-wingers, particularly those who are a bit dim, believe that our system is a democracy. It isn't. And, if FPTP isn't as fucked up as I think it is, and it's a good system, despite the fact it is clearly unrepresentative; then surely the SNP's position as the 3rd largest party, in terms of seats in Westminster, is also legitimate?" i agree that FPTP had had its day and we need a more modern approach, but to say we don’t live in a democracy is just madness | |||
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