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"Still early days, hopefully it will take shape " He seems intent on breaking fully with the past. | |||
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"What is the past,that is mixed up in many ways" The recent past | |||
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"If I was Sir Keir I'd have a damn good row with Momentum, kick them out of the party and tell them to get lost and form their own one and call it ermmmmm....... How about the momentum party ? Let's face it that's what they really need to do if they dare. Can't see it happening though, much too good an idea to do that." To split the party in 2? | |||
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"He’s a slick Tory lite. That’s never going to go well in some circles. Switching to his vision of Labour is never going to happen overnight especially with where they were under Corbyn. " But all his talk was of conciliation. If he drives out the left..where does that leave labour?like you say Tory lite | |||
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"He’s a slick Tory lite. That’s never going to go well in some circles. Switching to his vision of Labour is never going to happen overnight especially with where they were under Corbyn. But all his talk was of conciliation. If he drives out the left..where does that leave labour?like you say Tory lite " Another party perhaps | |||
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"He’s a slick Tory lite. That’s never going to go well in some circles. Switching to his vision of Labour is never going to happen overnight especially with where they were under Corbyn. But all his talk was of conciliation. If he drives out the left..where does that leave labour?like you say Tory lite Another party perhaps " Labour and (to a lesser degree) the Tories are both forced to stay as two large parties, due to our FPTP voting system. Splintering into smaller parties would make sense from every perspective, except for the fact they would never govern again. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. " If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. " When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is." Don't you think he was? I'd say defo centre right | |||
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They laughed
Story party make britain great
free 80% of wages.
They laughed even harder
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. Don't you think he was? I'd say defo centre right " Yep. Slightly to the left of Cameron. | |||
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"If I was Sir Keir I'd have a damn good row with Momentum, kick them out of the party and tell them to get lost and form their own one and call it ermmmmm....... How about the momentum party ? Let's face it that's what they really need to do if they dare. Can't see it happening though, much too good an idea to do that." Agree with this | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is." You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. " How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist." Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW " Blm is a protest movement not a political party The labour manifesto last year was no where remotely near Marxist. The current gmnt is probably the most right wing one we have had in the last 30 years. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW " Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Blm is a protest movement not a political party The labour manifesto last year was no where remotely near Marxist. The current gmnt is probably the most right wing one we have had in the last 30 years." I didn't claim it was a political party, merely that it is part of political discourse. More right wing by what measure? | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge?" Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Blm is a protest movement not a political party The labour manifesto last year was no where remotely near Marxist. The current gmnt is probably the most right wing one we have had in the last 30 years. I didn't claim it was a political party, merely that it is part of political discourse. More right wing by what measure? " Policy? Any political party that contains the likes of Johnson,reece mogg,ids,ester mcvey.that Francois gobshite..can hardly claim to be even centre right. You said we have moved to the left.In political terms corbyn moved labour away from the Blair/brown/Miliband era,but in terms of policy,I'd say they were centre left. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. " How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. " Good luck with that my friend | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Blm is a protest movement not a political party The labour manifesto last year was no where remotely near Marxist. The current gmnt is probably the most right wing one we have had in the last 30 years. I didn't claim it was a political party, merely that it is part of political discourse. More right wing by what measure? Policy? Any political party that contains the likes of Johnson,reece mogg,ids,ester mcvey.that Francois gobshite..can hardly claim to be even centre right. You said we have moved to the left.In political terms corbyn moved labour away from the Blair/brown/Miliband era,but in terms of policy,I'd say they were centre left." Which policies specifically? Your just naming people you disagree with politically, that doesn't really make our government more right wing than any other time over the last 30 years. Our country has never been so left wing.Look at our police force, look at political correctness. Corbyn is radical. Prior to the covid crises, the trans politics high very high priority(this has changed due to covid admittedly) Now the vast majority of people are happy for trans people to be whoever they want to be and love however they want, I think it's desirable for people to be what they want in life. However, trying to convince people there are no biological differences between men an women, is very radical. It is not a centre belief at all, and alot of trans people themselves feel the ARE differences, hence their transition. The fact being asked to define "woman" gives and left wing politician the choice of upsetting either the trans lobbyists Or the Rad fems/terfs etc People on the same side cannot agree This should tell you something. We don't need to force ideologys on people in order for them to be accepting, quite the opposite imo. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe." Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Blm is a protest movement not a political party The labour manifesto last year was no where remotely near Marxist. The current gmnt is probably the most right wing one we have had in the last 30 years. I didn't claim it was a political party, merely that it is part of political discourse. More right wing by what measure? Policy? Any political party that contains the likes of Johnson,reece mogg,ids,ester mcvey.that Francois gobshite..can hardly claim to be even centre right. You said we have moved to the left.In political terms corbyn moved labour away from the Blair/brown/Miliband era,but in terms of policy,I'd say they were centre left. Which policies specifically? Your just naming people you disagree with politically, that doesn't really make our government more right wing than any other time over the last 30 years. Our country has never been so left wing.Look at our police force, look at political correctness. Corbyn is radical. Prior to the covid crises, the trans politics high very high priority(this has changed due to covid admittedly) Now the vast majority of people are happy for trans people to be whoever they want to be and love however they want, I think it's desirable for people to be what they want in life. However, trying to convince people there are no biological differences between men an women, is very radical. It is not a centre belief at all, and alot of trans people themselves feel the ARE differences, hence their transition. The fact being asked to define "woman" gives and left wing politician the choice of upsetting either the trans lobbyists Or the Rad fems/terfs etc People on the same side cannot agree This should tell you something. We don't need to force ideologys on people in order for them to be accepting, quite the opposite imo. " Ok there is a lot there. Ok let's see..well in terms of Brexit the Tories focused a lot on immigration.They are going to make it harder for immigrants to work in this country..I'd say that was a right wing policy. They have also clamped down on so called 'scroungers'to the extent that if you are on the sick you are being demonized.There are countless examples of people being told they were fit to work when they were clearly not.There was a story locally who was so emancipated he looked like he had just got out of Auschwitz. He was told he was fit to work and a few months later he was dead. The recent vote about the nhs was another move to the right and it looks like we are going to move closer to america. Every one of these policies is a lurch to the right. So I'd ask you a question.. where would you place the current gmnt..centre?centre right? Can you provide some examples of Corbyns radicalism please? | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Blm is a protest movement not a political party The labour manifesto last year was no where remotely near Marxist. The current gmnt is probably the most right wing one we have had in the last 30 years. I didn't claim it was a political party, merely that it is part of political discourse. More right wing by what measure? Policy? Any political party that contains the likes of Johnson,reece mogg,ids,ester mcvey.that Francois gobshite..can hardly claim to be even centre right. You said we have moved to the left.In political terms corbyn moved labour away from the Blair/brown/Miliband era,but in terms of policy,I'd say they were centre left. Which policies specifically? Your just naming people you disagree with politically, that doesn't really make our government more right wing than any other time over the last 30 years. Our country has never been so left wing.Look at our police force, look at political correctness. Corbyn is radical. Prior to the covid crises, the trans politics high very high priority(this has changed due to covid admittedly) Now the vast majority of people are happy for trans people to be whoever they want to be and love however they want, I think it's desirable for people to be what they want in life. However, trying to convince people there are no biological differences between men an women, is very radical. It is not a centre belief at all, and alot of trans people themselves feel the ARE differences, hence their transition. The fact being asked to define "woman" gives and left wing politician the choice of upsetting either the trans lobbyists Or the Rad fems/terfs etc People on the same side cannot agree This should tell you something. We don't need to force ideologys on people in order for them to be accepting, quite the opposite imo. " I'd say the stuff about trans people is more about being more tolerant as a society I can remember a time when "coming out'was rare. That's nothing to do with politics. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light " When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Blm is a protest movement not a political party The labour manifesto last year was no where remotely near Marxist. The current gmnt is probably the most right wing one we have had in the last 30 years. I didn't claim it was a political party, merely that it is part of political discourse. More right wing by what measure? Policy? Any political party that contains the likes of Johnson,reece mogg,ids,ester mcvey.that Francois gobshite..can hardly claim to be even centre right. You said we have moved to the left.In political terms corbyn moved labour away from the Blair/brown/Miliband era,but in terms of policy,I'd say they were centre left. Which policies specifically? Your just naming people you disagree with politically, that doesn't really make our government more right wing than any other time over the last 30 years. Our country has never been so left wing.Look at our police force, look at political correctness. Corbyn is radical. Prior to the covid crises, the trans politics high very high priority(this has changed due to covid admittedly) Now the vast majority of people are happy for trans people to be whoever they want to be and love however they want, I think it's desirable for people to be what they want in life. However, trying to convince people there are no biological differences between men an women, is very radical. It is not a centre belief at all, and alot of trans people themselves feel the ARE differences, hence their transition. The fact being asked to define "woman" gives and left wing politician the choice of upsetting either the trans lobbyists Or the Rad fems/terfs etc People on the same side cannot agree This should tell you something. We don't need to force ideologys on people in order for them to be accepting, quite the opposite imo. I'd say the stuff about trans people is more about being more tolerant as a society I can remember a time when "coming out'was rare. That's nothing to do with politics. " Its very political. Its the same in the US with the Democrats atm. Trying to make people believe there are no biological differences between men and women ISNT about being tolerant, thats pushing an ideology. Tolerance is not the same thing at all. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. " When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. " You are avoiding my question 
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi"Read again I've answered both of those questions already Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing. Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case. This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs. I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them. It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
"Agree it's often shades of grey I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing. Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right. You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical? | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
"
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo. "When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means. Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative) I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself) You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country. Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics. Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism. If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading. Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy. He supported the IRA Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo.
When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc
He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means.
Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative)
I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself)
You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country.
Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics.
Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism.
If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading.
Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy.
He supported the IRA
Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical.
"Him and his crackpot cohorts were too right wing for the tory policy.1 of his policies were for asylum seekers to be denied benefits for 5 years.Im not sure how much more right wing you can get to be honest. Whilst I agree immigration should be monitored we are hardly getting swamped. The tories and their mates in the media have weaponized immigration so much so that people voted for brexit to stop the flood of immigration. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo.
When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc
He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means.
Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative)
I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself)
You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country.
Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics.
Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism.
If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading.
Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy.
He supported the IRA
Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical.
"As for Corbyn tbh I don't see socialist as a negative term,rather the opposite. 1984 was about communist Russia and totalitarianism wasnt it? As for terrorism you trwsly shouldn't believe everything you read in the papers https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-corbyn-on-northern-ireland | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo.
When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc
He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means.
Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative)
I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself)
You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country.
Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics.
Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism.
If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading.
Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy.
He supported the IRA
Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical.
Him and his crackpot cohorts were too right wing for the tory policy.1 of his policies were for asylum seekers to be denied benefits for 5 years.Im not sure how much more right wing you can get to be honest.
Whilst I agree immigration should be monitored we are hardly getting swamped.
The tories and their mates in the media have weaponized immigration so much so that people voted for brexit to stop the flood of immigration."Lol Another person who believes people voted for brexit because they are racist Radical thinking. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo.
When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc
He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means.
Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative)
I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself)
You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country.
Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics.
Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism.
If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading.
Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy.
He supported the IRA
Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical.
As for Corbyn tbh I DONT SEE SOCIALIST AS A NEGATIVE term,rather the opposite.
1984 was about communist Russia and totalitarianism wasnt it?
As for terrorism you trwsly shouldn't believe everything you read in the papers
https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-corbyn-on-northern-ireland"That is where our viewpoints are different I view Socialism as very negative. 1984 was not about communist Russia lol Pro Corbyn From Channel 4 hahaha haha (I'll check it out) I have 23 news subscriptions, from left, right and (claimed) Centre media sources I check most days. There are several other large media orgs I also check and read but don't subscribe to, as there is no need to subscribe. Once I read a story, where ever possible I go to the source and fact check. ALL of the media lie and put spins on things. Again once you start fact checking, the left wing media tend to do it more, but possibly because the majority of msm is left wing, hence its prevalence. They all lie, so the only real way to find out is to check them all | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo.
When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc
He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means.
Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative)
I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself)
You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country.
Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics.
Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism.
If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading.
Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy.
He supported the IRA
Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical.
Him and his crackpot cohorts were too right wing for the tory policy.1 of his policies were for asylum seekers to be denied benefits for 5 years.Im not sure how much more right wing you can get to be honest.
Whilst I agree immigration should be monitored we are hardly getting swamped.
The tories and their mates in the media have weaponized immigration so much so that people voted for brexit to stop the flood of immigration.
Lol
Another person who believes people voted for brexit because they are racist
Radical thinking.
"Some people voted for Brexit because of immigration. That's a fact I'm afraid. | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo.
When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc
He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means.
Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative)
I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself)
You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country.
Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics.
Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism.
If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading.
Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy.
He supported the IRA
Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical.
As for Corbyn tbh I DONT SEE SOCIALIST AS A NEGATIVE term,rather the opposite.
1984 was about communist Russia and totalitarianism wasnt it?
As for terrorism you trwsly shouldn't believe everything you read in the papers
https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-corbyn-on-northern-ireland
That is where our viewpoints are different
I view Socialism as very negative.
1984 was not about communist Russia lol
Pro Corbyn From Channel 4 hahaha haha (I'll check it out)
I have 23 news subscriptions, from left, right and (claimed) Centre media sources I check most days.
There are several other large media orgs I also check and read but don't subscribe to, as there is no need to subscribe.
Once I read a story, where ever possible I go to the source and fact check.
ALL of the media lie and put spins on things.
Again once you start fact checking, the left wing media tend to do it more, but possibly because the majority of msm is left wing, hence its prevalence.
They all lie, so the only real way to find out is to check them all
"I got mixed up with aniomsl farm 1984 was about totalitarianism It's an independent fact checking resource. The line about corbyn supporting terrorism Is total bullocks What left wing media is this? The majority of msn is left wing? The mail,the Express,.the sun,the observer,the times,sky? Left wing? Seriously? | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo.
When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc
He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means.
Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative)
I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself)
You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country.
Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics.
Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism.
If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading.
Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy.
He supported the IRA
Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical.
As for Corbyn tbh I DONT SEE SOCIALIST AS A NEGATIVE term,rather the opposite.
1984 was about communist Russia and totalitarianism wasnt it?
As for terrorism you trwsly shouldn't believe everything you read in the papers
https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-corbyn-on-northern-ireland
That is where our viewpoints are different
I view Socialism as very negative.
1984 was not about communist Russia lol
Pro Corbyn From Channel 4 hahaha haha (I'll check it out)
I have 23 news subscriptions, from left, right and (claimed) Centre media sources I check most days.
There are several other large media orgs I also check and read but don't subscribe to, as there is no need to subscribe.
Once I read a story, where ever possible I go to the source and fact check.
ALL of the media lie and put spins on things.
Again once you start fact checking, the left wing media tend to do it more, but possibly because the majority of msm is left wing, hence its prevalence.
They all lie, so the only real way to find out is to check them all
"When people say majority of MSM is left wing, I have to laugh....that well known left winger.....Rupert Murdoch | |||
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"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo.
When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc
He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means.
Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative)
I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself)
You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country.
Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics.
Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism.
If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading.
Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy.
He supported the IRA
Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical.
As for Corbyn tbh I DONT SEE SOCIALIST AS A NEGATIVE term,rather the opposite.
1984 was about communist Russia and totalitarianism wasnt it?
As for terrorism you trwsly shouldn't believe everything you read in the papers
https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-corbyn-on-northern-ireland
That is where our viewpoints are different
I view Socialism as very negative.
1984 was not about communist Russia lol
Pro Corbyn From Channel 4 hahaha haha (I'll check it out)
I have 23 news subscriptions, from left, right and (claimed) Centre media sources I check most days.
There are several other large media orgs I also check and read but don't subscribe to, as there is no need to subscribe.
Once I read a story, where ever possible I go to the source and fact check.
ALL of the media lie and put spins on things.
Again once you start fact checking, the left wing media tend to do it more, but possibly because the majority of msm is left wing, hence its prevalence.
They all lie, so the only real way to find out is to check them all
When people say majority of MSM is left wing, I have to laugh....that well known left winger.....Rupert Murdoch "And that well known bolshevik rag the mail | |||
| Reply privately | Reply in forum | Reply +quote |
"Anything is possible considering. But KS needs a firm hand to spank the bottoms of those who would damage the chances of Labour winning ever. If KS turns out to ne another Tory Blair then thats a lurch to the right and not all msy follow. When people think Blair was to the right it makes you wonder where their starting place is. You are completely correct It seems to me left has moved further and further left over the past 10 years so far left and even left leaning liberals are considered right wing. How so? Personally I'd say the opposite is true.We have lurched that far to the right that someone who calls for a living wage is branded a Marxist. Alot of the left identify as Marxists,this is in the mainstream political discourse - look at blm Fringe right wingers exist but they aren't in mainstream political discourse pushing agendas I'm a Libertarian BTW Re fringe wing wingers.. like farardge? Has Farage ever claimed to be a Nazi? (himself, not called by others) I think if he were to do so, people would be upset, rightly so However many openly admit to being Marxists I'm genuinely having a discussion here, but your replies seem to just be defending your chosen ideology rather than actually engaging in useful dialogue, I hope I'm wrong of course. How would you define Farage then.. or nuttall?In political terms. Not at all..like I said originally I'd just disagree with your statement about the left. If you are correct that would reflect in labour policy. There may be a few left wing radicals out there,but they are very much on the fringe. Farage? He's definitely right wing, but he's not a Nazi lol (to be clear Farage isn't my guy or anything,I don't care about hin tbh) Anyone claiming he is doesnt know what a Nazi is. I can't stand Blair, but I don't label him a radical in the same way as Corbyn. My disagreement with his outlook doesn't change the facts of his actual position/viewpoint etc So I don't just ascribe negative sounding names to him that arent true, just to paint him in a bad light When did I say Farage was a nazi?.but I'll ask the same question again Where would you place Farage on political scale? Clearly blair wasnt a radical.He was a centrist. When you asked "where you you place Farage" I thought you meant if not placing him as a Nazi. So I've possibly misinterpreted it. I'm glad you understand the distinction though. Blair wasn't a radical, but definitely not a centrist. You are avoiding my question
Where would you place the gmnt?
Where would you place Farage?
Blair wasn't remotely left wing..he got into bed with Murdoch,got rid of clause 4,left the banks unregulated,started pfi
Read again I've answered both of those questions already
Farage - right wing, not particularly extreme(not sure why Mr Farage is so important here but I'm happy to provide my answer
UK gov - mixed bag, slightly left. Police, Political correctness etc
For a country that has a conservative government, its surprisingly left wing.
Please remember I'm a Libertarian, you seem to be replying as if you feel my stance is to try to defend the right wing. That is not the case.
This is why some staunch leftists think everyone else is a right wing extremist, because they don't see that they are just very Far left, and anyone less left wing seems right wing,regardless of their actual beliefs.
I disagree with conversatives too, but they don't ever ascribe beliefs and names to me for my difference of view. Its never happened, they just refer to me as a centrist or Liberal generally Yet I can't say the same about leftists, they always assume anyone they disagree with MUST be a polar opposite to them.
It's just seeing the world in a binary and thing aren't always black and white.
Agree it's often shades of grey
I think farage was brought up because we were talking about extremes.To me Farage is not a million miles away from far right.Behind that bulshit 'just a normal guy having a pint 'persona he isnt a million miles away from the likes of The edl
I'd say without a shadow of a doubt the current gmnt are very,very wing
I respect your opinion but I'm truly baffled how you can see them as remotely left wing.
Everything they do..immigration.. allusiiins to ww2 spirit.. attitude to trade unions.. attitude to those unable to work..imho as a country we have lurched to the right.
You didnt say why you thought corbyn was a radical?
Even if you didcount what Lionel said here, Trump referring to bojo as "Britain Trump" says it all. This government isn't centre right, it's far right imo.
When I think of far right, I think of racial supremacists etc, combat 18 etc
He's not close at all,he doesn't espouse the same sort of narrative by any means.
Look at the massive levels of immigration, that is NOT a typically Conservative rate at all, and Tony Blair really kick started it(not a conservative)
I believe we should have stricter rules for immigration, this is not a hateful or bad thing. (I wasnt born in the UK myself)
You must have noticed people that come here, travel through many countries to get here, we aren't first stop, but we are first choice. The country has alot to offer or people wouldn't come here in droves. Only a tiny percentage of those coming here are refugees from war torn countries, the majority come for a better life with more opportunities than were available in their home country.
Corbyn, he's a socialist for a start and all he does is play identity politics.
Orwell is one of the most famous socialists there is, he definitely understood the dangers of Socialism.
If you haven't read 1984,animal farm, and road to Wigan pier, I'd highly recommend them as essential reading.
Corbyn supports pretty much every terror organisation that declares the UK its enemy.
He supported the IRA
Now whether you agree with those causes or not - supporting the actual terrorist organisations that carry out horrific acts of violence is completely dispicable, and definitely radical.
As for Corbyn tbh I DONT SEE SOCIALIST AS A NEGATIVE term,rather the opposite.
1984 was about communist Russia and totalitarianism wasnt it?
As for terrorism you trwsly shouldn't believe everything you read in the papers
https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-corbyn-on-northern-ireland
That is where our viewpoints are different
I view Socialism as very negative.
1984 was not about communist Russia lol
Pro Corbyn From Channel 4 hahaha haha (I'll check it out)
I have 23 news subscriptions, from left, right and (claimed) Centre media sources I check most days.
There are several other large media orgs I also check and read but don't subscribe to, as there is no need to subscribe.
Once I read a story, where ever possible I go to the source and fact check.
ALL of the media lie and put spins on things.
Again once you start fact checking, the left wing media tend to do it more, but possibly because the majority of msm is left wing, hence its prevalence.
They all lie, so the only real way to find out is to check them all
When people say majority of MSM is left wing, I have to laugh....that well known left winger.....Rupert Murdoch "  comrade murdoch! | |||
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"Labour mp Barry Sheerman posted an anti semitic tweet but deleted it. Presumably he will be out Tue door like rlb?" From the little I seen he deleted it and then tweeted an apology so maybe that's the end of it. With what's happened lately with RLB I thought they would all be but more careful with such quotes | |||
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"Labour mp Barry Sheerman posted an anti semitic tweet but deleted it. Presumably he will be out Tue door like rlb? From the little I seen he deleted it and then tweeted an apology so maybe that's the end of it. With what's happened lately with RLB I thought they would all be but more careful with such quotes" Seems a bit of double standards. Hasn't even been rebuked and much worse than the rlb tweet. | |||
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"Labour mp Barry Sheerman posted an anti semitic tweet but deleted it. Presumably he will be out Tue door like rlb? From the little I seen he deleted it and then tweeted an apology so maybe that's the end of it. With what's happened lately with RLB I thought they would all be but more careful with such quotes Seems a bit of double standards. Hasn't even been rebuked and much worse than the rlb tweet." I'm assuming its because he apologised publicly quickly but that's just an assumption. Why they do this when they must know it will be reported is a bit surprising | |||
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"Labour mp Barry Sheerman posted an anti semitic tweet but deleted it. Presumably he will be out Tue door like rlb? From the little I seen he deleted it and then tweeted an apology so maybe that's the end of it. With what's happened lately with RLB I thought they would all be but more careful with such quotes Seems a bit of double standards. Hasn't even been rebuked and much worse than the rlb tweet. I'm assuming its because he apologised publicly quickly but that's just an assumption. Why they do this when they must know it will be reported is a bit surprising" Its incredibly stupid. Still think it's a case of double standards though. | |||
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"To me labour need the people who were in the party years ago, that used to stand up to the government instead of doing very little. Why can't we have politicians like the rate cappers, who stood up to Thatcher and said no we won't raise the taxes in our area. There doesn't seem to be a strong leader, or a leader that the party gets behind. Corbyn shot himself in the foot, over sitting on the fence over brexit. The unions aren't helping matters either." He was going to lose either way over Brexit | |||
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"To me labour need the people who were in the party years ago, that used to stand up to the government instead of doing very little. Why can't we have politicians like the rate cappers, who stood up to Thatcher and said no we won't raise the taxes in our area. There doesn't seem to be a strong leader, or a leader that the party gets behind. Corbyn shot himself in the foot, over sitting on the fence over brexit. The unions aren't helping matters either. He was going to lose either way over Brexit " Politics in the UK at the moment is worryingly vapid. Her majesty's opposition seem invisible but I'm hopeful it's simply that KS is playing the long game and giving Boris enough rope to do his job for him. But it's embarrassing that the strongest opposition is coming from sturgeons snp, a party with 50 seats only. We need proper quality political debate, like in the thatcher era with heavyweight politicians from all sides. Rather than these lightweight media lovies who have next to know beliefs that can't be changed by the latest twitter post. | |||
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