FabSwingers.com forum: Clause 17

By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

Mentioned this on another topic but it needs it's own thread.

Mps have voted against clause 17 which is supposed to protect the nhs from foreign control.

When Corbyn warned about this he was absolutely derided with boris declaring with absolute certainty the NHS was safe.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Mentioned this on another topic but it needs it's own thread.

Mps have voted against clause 17 which is supposed to protect the nhs from foreign control.

When Corbyn warned about this he was absolutely derided with boris declaring with absolute certainty the NHS was safe."

It's almost as if you can't trust the blonde buffoon as far as you could throw him...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What is concerning is I just looked and what is thier majority 80? Because 340- 251 has 9 non Tories voting for it if my maths is correct...

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"What is concerning is I just looked and what is thier majority 80? Because 340- 251 has 9 non Tories voting for it if my maths is correct..."

DUP..independents?

Be interesting to see how much air time this gets..I think this is a massive story.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What is concerning is I just looked and what is thier majority 80? Because 340- 251 has 9 non Tories voting for it if my maths is correct...

DUP..independents?

Be interesting to see how much air time this gets..I think this is a massive story."

It is and the only ones wearing "muzzles" is the mainstream media here.

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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago

Grantham

339 Conservatives and 1 Independent voted it down.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"339 Conservatives and 1 Independent voted it down. "

Congrats to the red wall.

You have just sold the NHS down the river.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"339 Conservatives and 1 Independent voted it down. "

After looking deeper your correct. The independent was Julian Lewis...who got booted out for colluding with labour. Once a Tory eh...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"339 Conservatives and 1 Independent voted it down.

Congrats to the red wall.

You have just sold the NHS down the river."

And all then who where out clapping the NHS and voting for Tory...now that is irony.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

Heard people today complaining as nurses,drs and teachers had a pay rise

Is the world full of cunts or is it just in this country?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Heard people today complaining as nurses,drs and teachers had a pay rise

Is the world full of cunts or is it just in this country?"

The same ones who said JC would bankrupt the country and starve the NHS...aye them cunts

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things. "

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up."
YOu have a very vivid coloured imagination based on nothing but your own anti democratic fantases.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up.YOu have a very vivid coloured imagination based on nothing but your own anti democratic fantases."

Anti democratic

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By *V-AliceTV/TS
over a year ago

Ayr

"Mentioned this on another topic but it needs it's own thread.

MPs have voted against Clause 17 which is supposed to protect the NHS from foreign control.

When Corbyn warned about this he was absolutely derided with Boris declaring with absolute certainty the NHS was safe."

So, even though the NHS saved the lying cunt's life, here's what his kind voted down:

(a) to provide a comprehensive publicly funded health service free at the point of delivery,

(b) to protect the employment rights or terms and conditions of employment for public sectoremployees and those working in publicly funded health or care sectors,

(d) to regulate and control the pricing and reimbursement systems for the purchase of medicines or medical devices, or

(e) to regulate and maintain the level of protection afforded in relation to patient data, public health data and publicly provided social care data relating to UK citizens.

(3) The condition in this subsection is that the agreement—

(a) explicitly excludes application of any provision within that agreement to publicly funded health or care services,

(b) explicitly excludes provision for any Investor-State Dispute Settlement (ISDS) clause that provides, or is related to, the delivery of public services, health care, care or public health,

(c) explicitly excludes the use of any negative listing, standstill or ratchet clause that provides, or is related to, the delivery of public services, health care, care or public health,

(d) contains explicit recognition that an appropriate authority (within the meaning of section 4) has the right to enact policies, legislation and regulation which protects and promotes health,

public health, social care and public safety in health or care services, and

(e) prohibits the sale of patient data, public health data and publicly provided social care data.

(4) For the purposes of this section—

“negative listing” means a listing only of exceptions, exclusions or limits to commitments made by parties to the agreement;

“ratchet” in relation to any provision in an agreement means any provision whereby a party, if (after the agreement has been ratified) it has unilaterally removed a barrier in an area where it had made a commitment before the agreement was ratified, may not reintroduce that barrier, and

“standstill” in relation to any provision in an agreement means any provision by which parties list barriers which are in force at the time that they sign the agreement and undertake not to introduce any new barriers.—(Bill Esterson.)

This amendment would aim to protect the NHS and publicly funded health and care services in other parts of the UK from any form of control from outside the UK.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things. "

That is where we are at. We are literally shitting in our hands and rubbing it in our own faces

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Link to it and it appears I was correct with the first figures I posted

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/how-mp-vote-protecting-nhs-22392056

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up."
I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol"

Be careful what you wish for...

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

Be careful what you wish for..."
were is my wish it’s not what I want I just don’t believe it will cost me 30 a check up Do you think it will ?

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol"

I do apologise

It is of course fantastic news anyone can come in and buy a chunk of the NHS and I'm sure it won't affect you whatever...lol.

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol"

When did this charge start for a check up?

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

I do apologise

It is of course fantastic news anyone can come in and buy a chunk of the NHS and I'm sure it won't affect you whatever...lol."
so when are you predicting the nhs been sold off then it’s just I’m waiting for an injection in me back if a check up is going to cost me 30 fuck knows how much an injection will set me back

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

I do apologise

It is of course fantastic news anyone can come in and buy a chunk of the NHS and I'm sure it won't affect you whatever...lol. so when are you predicting the nhs been sold off then it’s just I’m waiting for an injection in me back if a check up is going to cost me 30 fuck knows how much an injection will set me back "

I'm sure you will find out soon enough.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up? "

Probably when we flog off the NHS

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

I do apologise

I'm sure you will find out soon enough."
well you know the price of a check up you say 30 and you know the nhs is about to be sold off I just thought you were the guy in the know our man in the cabinet

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

So would you rather pay £30 quid for a check up that you could get tomorrow with your doctor or have the current situation where you have to wait and unlikely to see your doctor because too many people that have a cold or a scratch or some very minor illness that doesnt need a doctor takes up all your doctors time. It's the same with A & E over run with people that dont need to be there.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

I do apologise

I'm sure you will find out soon enough.well you know the price of a check up you say 30 and you know the nhs is about to be sold off I just thought you were the guy in the know our man in the cabinet "

So you are glad with today's news?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

Be careful what you wish for... were is my wish it’s not what I want I just don’t believe it will cost me 30 a check up Do you think it will ?"

I had a telephone call from nurse following getting my bloods taken...in that call I asked when things will get back to normal, her reply was it will never go back to how it was pre-covid.

So its neigh impossible to see your GP now....I can easily see that 30 quid being on the agenda alright.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"So would you rather pay £30 quid for a check up that you could get tomorrow with your doctor or have the current situation where you have to wait and unlikely to see your doctor because too many people that have a cold or a scratch or some very minor illness that doesnt need a doctor takes up all your doctors time. It's the same with A & E over run with people that dont need to be there."

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

And here we see a perfect example of 'me-ism'. For you, £30 is nothing, and I'm pleased for you. Now, I know this maybe hard to fathom for you, so brace yourself. £30 to some people, is a lot of money, so much so, they may not go to the doctor. Can you understand that??

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS "

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go"

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

[Removed by poster at 21/07/20 20:00:29]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about yer bud same here I’d rather not aswell I can’t see 30 for an appointment at the doctors comeing anytime soon "

Well, why did they vote against not putting the NHS on the table of any trade deal then??

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

What do you think is likely to happen then?

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?"
no I don’t welcome it but I’m not predicting the nhs been sold of mate I don’t think it will happen

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?"

Did I say either way or even express an opinion on good or bad. I saw a statement and wondered if it was in operation. As I say if it comes in it sounds a bit like going to the dentist where you pay even for check ups or at least I get charged everytime

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?no I don’t welcome it but I’m not predicting the nhs been sold of mate I don’t think it will happen "

Have you seen today's news?

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So what do you think will happen.?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?no I don’t welcome it but I’m not predicting the nhs been sold of mate I don’t think it will happen "

The Irish didn't think there would be border checks...ermmm

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By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?no I don’t welcome it but I’m not predicting the nhs been sold of mate I don’t think it will happen

The Irish didn't think there would be border checks...ermmm"

Fair point, how many lies is too many?

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So what do you think will happen.?"
well I’m not in the cabinet like you so I can’t say for sure but I can’t see paying at point of entry at an nhs hospital because that is political suiside for any party

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So what do you think will happen.? well I’m not in the cabinet like you so I can’t say for sure but I can’t see paying at point of entry at an nhs hospital because that is political suiside for any party "

What about GPs?

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So what do you think will happen.?"

No idea I don't have such information that this is a given or privy to such plans. Hence why I asked. The dentists seem to get away with it and they stick drills in people's mouths

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So you cant even guess what is going happen?

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So what do you think will happen.?

No idea I don't have such information that this is a given or privy to such plans. Hence why I asked. The dentists seem to get away with it and they stick drills in people's mouths"

It's quite surprising that people are so sure I'm so misguided but cannot hazard a guess what will happen themselves.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?no I don’t welcome it but I’m not predicting the nhs been sold of mate I don’t think it will happen

The Irish didn't think there would be border checks...ermmm

Fair point, how many lies is too many?

And we were promised frictionless trade......ermmm

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By *oxychick35Couple
over a year ago

thornaby

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So what do you think will happen.?

No idea I don't have such information that this is a given or privy to such plans. Hence why I asked. The dentists seem to get away with it and they stick drills in people's mouths

It's quite surprising that people are so sure I'm so misguided but cannot hazard a guess what will happen themselves. "
i can guess that paying at point of contact at hospitals won’t happen just can’t see it can you amd if so when ?

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So you cant even guess what is going happen?"

Not sure me guessing would aid anything. If it happens then as said sounds like the dentist to me. I guessed spurs were going to win the premier league, look how accurate I was with that

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By *atEvolutionCouple
over a year ago

atlantisEVOLUTION Swingers Club. Stoke

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up."

]

Costs me £27 for a Dental Check-up already.

Cost me £990.00 for Physio.

Cost my Husband £4500.00 for eye surgery (Done in 4 weeks from booking) He would have waited 2.9 years for the NHS.

Cost a friend £3700.00 for knee Surgery paid through BUPA HealthCare through JCB.

There are already mass swathes of private treatment that insurances and people are paying for already - glad to do so in our case.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So what do you think will happen.?

No idea I don't have such information that this is a given or privy to such plans. Hence why I asked. The dentists seem to get away with it and they stick drills in people's mouths

It's quite surprising that people are so sure I'm so misguided but cannot hazard a guess what will happen themselves. i can guess that paying at point of contact at hospitals won’t happen just can’t see it can you amd if so when ?"

You keep avoiding my question.

What will happen?

The was a dr on the radio a while ago.He predicted in 5 years time we would have a medical system similar to America.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So you cant even guess what is going happen?

Not sure me guessing would aid anything. If it happens then as said sounds like the dentist to me. I guessed spurs were going to win the premier league, look how accurate I was with that"

I hope you didn't put money on that.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up.

]

Costs me £27 for a Dental Check-up already.

Cost me £990.00 for Physio.

Cost my Husband £4500.00 for eye surgery (Done in 4 weeks from booking) He would have waited 2.9 years for the NHS.

Cost a friend £3700.00 for knee Surgery paid through BUPA HealthCare through JCB.

There are already mass swathes of private treatment that insurances and people are paying for already - glad to do so in our case.

At the moment you can jump the Q if you have the money.

In some cases you can be refused treatment for lack of money.

So what's going to happen with even increased private investment?

What's next?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up.

]

Costs me £27 for a Dental Check-up already.

Cost me £990.00 for Physio.

Cost my Husband £4500.00 for eye surgery (Done in 4 weeks from booking) He would have waited 2.9 years for the NHS.

Cost a friend £3700.00 for knee Surgery paid through BUPA HealthCare through JCB.

There are already mass swathes of private treatment that insurances and people are paying for already - glad to do so in our case.

And the people that can't pay? Do we want a system like the US? Ask the yanks......they envy us

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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago

milton keynes

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up. I’m due a check up next week is that what it’s going to cost me omg. or is this just you spouting of again lol

When did this charge start for a check up?

Probably when we flog off the NHS

Oh ok thought the way it was said it was already in place. Wondered why not heard of it before. So sounds like how dentists are where you pay as you go

So I'll ask you aswell..do you

u welcome today's news?

So you cant even guess what is going happen?

Not sure me guessing would aid anything. If it happens then as said sounds like the dentist to me. I guessed spurs were going to win the premier league, look how accurate I was with that

I hope you didn't put money on that."

No I did not as know my guesses rarely come true so prefer to await actual events

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

The fact is that the NHS sees more people every year, A & E numbers go up every year, that simply is unaffordable, people that go to the doctors for no good reason are taking resources from those who do need it.

We need an honest open debate about future health care that removes politics. Do I want to see a usa style service here ? No neither do I want it carrying on as it does, K has worked in it all her working life and its management is a shambles

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

If you are on the bones of your arse I doubt very much if you can afford 90 nicker a month for sky.

People going in for cold etc is probably a tiny minuscule amount.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that.."

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues "

You are a walking cliche

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues "

What dishes?

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

If you are on the bones of your arse I doubt very much if you can afford 90 nicker a month for sky.

People going in for cold etc is probably a tiny minuscule amount."

Yet during the pandemic visits to both have plummeted

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues

You are a walking cliche"

Post some facts that disprove either.

You know those funny little tit bits of truth just the same as the ones you couldnt produce about nhs cuts.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

If you are on the bones of your arse I doubt very much if you can afford 90 nicker a month for sky.

People going in for cold etc is probably a tiny minuscule amount.

Yet during the pandemic visits to both have plummeted "

Prob something to do with the fact that you cant see the dr?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues

You are a walking cliche

Post some facts that disprove either.

You know those funny little tit bits of truth just the same as the ones you couldnt produce about nhs cuts."

The term you can't get your head around is 'real terms'....in real terms the NHS was underfunded. It was not given enough money to cater for its growing needs. Now, I know you will follow the same old shit...'too many foreigners' or some other bollocks. But, in real terms, it has been underfunded.

And to top it off, you probably want a no deal Brexit. Good god, you must hate this country.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Yet during the pandemic visits to both have plummeted

Prob something to do with the fact that you cant see the dr?"

You can see the doctor or go to a&e if you need to, some may be too scared to of course but if they really needed care they could have.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues

You are a walking cliche

Post some facts that disprove either.

You know those funny little tit bits of truth just the same as the ones you couldnt produce about nhs cuts.

And to top it off, you probably want a no deal Brexit. Good god, you must hate this country."

So you cant provide facts just like last time, so resort to the good old insults,

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues

You are a walking cliche

Post some facts that disprove either.

You know those funny little tit bits of truth just the same as the ones you couldnt produce about nhs cuts.

And to top it off, you probably want a no deal Brexit. Good god, you must hate this country.

So you cant provide facts just like last time, so resort to the good old insults, "

https://nhsfunding.info/symptoms/10-effects-of-underfunding/cuts-to-frontline-services/

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues

You are a walking cliche

Post some facts that disprove either.

You know those funny little tit bits of truth just the same as the ones you couldnt produce about nhs cuts.

And to top it off, you probably want a no deal Brexit. Good god, you must hate this country.

So you cant provide facts just like last time, so resort to the good old insults,

https://nhsfunding.info/symptoms/10-effects-of-underfunding/cuts-to-frontline-services/"

I'm sorry, but all I see in people that hold your beliefs are...

A willingness for British people to lose their jobs....Brexit

You have already said that poor people basically are not poor....that's your fellow Brits..

Happily let our economy take a huge hit....Brexit

Seemingly happy to see the people have to pay to see a doctor...getting rid of free health care...pretty much advocating a two tier health service

These are all things determental to our society.....all from your own mouth. I can only conclude, you don't like this country and a lot of the people in it.

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By *ust RachelTV/TS
over a year ago

Horsham

This is what I found from a quick google, I went for the US as Trump has already shown an interest in the NHS.

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"Blinded brexshiters will say this is great news. That they knew about it, they voted for it and other stupid things.

Let's see if they say it's good news when it costs them £30 to go for a check up.YOu have a very vivid coloured imagination based on nothing but your own anti democratic fantases.

Anti democratic

"
Yes

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral

"This is what I found from a quick google, I went for the US as Trump has already shown an interest in the NHS.

Americans pay almost four times as much for pharmaceutical drugs as citizens of other developed countries. Hospitals, doctors, and nurses all charge more in the U.S. than in other countries, with hospital costs increasing much faster than professional salaries."
This is not relevent,I far as I am aware all this selling out to the US is fake news ,so get real your worries are 100%nonesense,yes I am sure,very very sure

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By *exy7Man
over a year ago

Bristol

"This is what I found from a quick google, I went for the US as Trump has already shown an interest in the NHS.

Americans pay almost four times as much for pharmaceutical drugs as citizens of other developed countries. Hospitals, doctors, and nurses all charge more in the U.S. than in other countries, with hospital costs increasing much faster than professional salaries.This is not relevent,I far as I am aware all this selling out to the US is fake news ,so get real your worries are 100%nonesense,yes I am sure,very very sure"

Ah yes, fake news. Reminds me of somebody. I don’t agree with this, so it’s fake news. Pathetic.

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By *igsteve43Man
over a year ago

derby

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about "

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

But you do not directly pay the full cost of your own personal treatment. All earners pay an amount of National Insurance dependent on how much they earn. To a degree, the more you earn, the more you can afford to pay, so the more you put in. You can argue about exactly how fair the system of different contribution levels is. But, the important thing is that if you are then unlucky enough to get a major illness, or have a bad accident, you will get the required treatment without suddenly receiving a bill for half a million pounds - as can happen in the USA. In many cases in america, anyone who is not a millionaire, even those who are moderately well off and certainly those who are working class, have a very stark choice if they are seriously ill - pay up or die. It is common for people to have to spend their entire life savings, sell their house. Even if they have health insurance (incredibly expensive compared with say Bupa), which always has limits on the amount of pay out, and generally has co-payments required - when you make a claim, you still have to pay part of the medical fees, reaching into thousands for serious conditions. And you know how for many people the

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport

£9.15 charge for a prescription is quite a lot, particularly if on long term medication? In the USA a doctor's prescription (which you pay for) does not cover the cost of the medicine, all it does is give you permission to buy the medication for the full pharmaceutical price - which can again be thousands of pounds for something like cancer treatment.

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport

Of course under the NHS, if you are lucky enough to never have an accident, never get ill - well it might feel unfair that you've paid part of your NI anyway for that health service you never needed. Or you could think of it that it was always an affordable amount, and you have won the health lottery - you never got sick! And if you do get sick tomorrow, you break a leg, or worse - at least you won't have to make the choice between hospital or bankruptcy.

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By *L RogueMan
over a year ago

London

"This is what I found from a quick google, I went for the US as Trump has already shown an interest in the NHS.

Americans pay almost four times as much for pharmaceutical drugs as citizens of other developed countries. Hospitals, doctors, and nurses all charge more in the U.S. than in other countries, with hospital costs increasing much faster than professional salaries.This is not relevent,I far as I am aware all this selling out to the US is fake news ,so get real your worries are 100%nonesense,yes I am sure,very very sure

Ah yes, fake news. Reminds me of somebody. I don’t agree with this, so it’s fake news. Pathetic. "

What I find funny is using the same argument of someone they detest.

You couldn't write it!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We have gone through all this shit, in the past few years, to rid ourselves of alleged EU meddling and telling us what to do only for those same people that voted to leave to just turn a blind eye to Russia doing exactly what they accused the EU of doing.

Brexiteers, are now, just making themselves look so utterly ridiculous.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"This is what I found from a quick google, I went for the US as Trump has already shown an interest in the NHS.

Americans pay almost four times as much for pharmaceutical drugs as citizens of other developed countries. Hospitals, doctors, and nurses all charge more in the U.S. than in other countries, with hospital costs increasing much faster than professional salaries.This is not relevent,I far as I am aware all this selling out to the US is fake news ,so get real your worries are 100%nonesense,yes I am sure,very very sure"

When you say fake news you mean some thing you don't agree with?

Liz truss has met with us pharna companies on several occasions.

That's a fact.

We have just allowed foreign companies to buy into the nhs.

Also a fact.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues

You are a walking cliche

Post some facts that disprove either.

You know those funny little tit bits of truth just the same as the ones you couldnt produce about nhs cuts.

And to top it off, you probably want a no deal Brexit. Good god, you must hate this country.

So you cant provide facts just like last time, so resort to the good old insults,

https://nhsfunding.info/symptoms/10-effects-of-underfunding/cuts-to-frontline-services/

I'm sorry, but all I see in people that hold your beliefs are...

A willingness for British people to lose their jobs....Brexit

You have already said that poor people basically are not poor....that's your fellow Brits..

Happily let our economy take a huge hit....Brexit

Seemingly happy to see the people have to pay to see a doctor...getting rid of free health care...pretty much advocating a two tier health service

These are all things determental to our society.....all from your own mouth. I can only conclude, you don't like this country and a lot of the people in it."

If you can afford ten quid for a pack of fags you are not poor.

Of course there are some poor people but there are many that waste the money they receive, yet there are many who do manage on low incomes,

It's funny how many of the poor voted for brexit, yet you are happy to insult their intelligence and call them racist.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues

You are a walking cliche

Post some facts that disprove either.

You know those funny little tit bits of truth just the same as the ones you couldnt produce about nhs cuts.

And to top it off, you probably want a no deal Brexit. Good god, you must hate this country.

So you cant provide facts just like last time, so resort to the good old insults,

https://nhsfunding.info/symptoms/10-effects-of-underfunding/cuts-to-frontline-services/

I'm sorry, but all I see in people that hold your beliefs are...

A willingness for British people to lose their jobs....Brexit

You have already said that poor people basically are not poor....that's your fellow Brits..

Happily let our economy take a huge hit....Brexit

Seemingly happy to see the people have to pay to see a doctor...getting rid of free health care...pretty much advocating a two tier health service

These are all things determental to our society.....all from your own mouth. I can only conclude, you don't like this country and a lot of the people in it.

If you can afford ten quid for a pack of fags you are not poor.

Of course there are some poor people but there are many that waste the money they receive, yet there are many who do manage on low incomes,

It's funny how many of the poor voted for brexit, yet you are happy to insult their intelligence and call them racist.

Got figures for how many waste money? As you are so worried about the poor maybe you could have a word with your mate Boris about the fact there are more food banks in this country than McDonald's..... austerity, oh I forgot, you think it never happened

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By *exy7Man
over a year ago

Bristol

[Removed by poster at 22/07/20 08:32:41]

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By *exy7Man
over a year ago

Bristol

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues

You are a walking cliche

Post some facts that disprove either.

You know those funny little tit bits of truth just the same as the ones you couldnt produce about nhs cuts.

And to top it off, you probably want a no deal Brexit. Good god, you must hate this country.

So you cant provide facts just like last time, so resort to the good old insults,

https://nhsfunding.info/symptoms/10-effects-of-underfunding/cuts-to-frontline-services/

I'm sorry, but all I see in people that hold your beliefs are...

A willingness for British people to lose their jobs....Brexit

You have already said that poor people basically are not poor....that's your fellow Brits..

Happily let our economy take a huge hit....Brexit

Seemingly happy to see the people have to pay to see a doctor...getting rid of free health care...pretty much advocating a two tier health service

These are all things determental to our society.....all from your own mouth. I can only conclude, you don't like this country and a lot of the people in it.

If you can afford ten quid for a pack of fags you are not poor.

Of course there are some poor people but there are many that waste the money they receive, yet there are many who do manage on low incomes,

It's funny how many of the poor voted for brexit, yet you are happy to insult their intelligence and call them racist.

It’s easier for the poor to vote for Brexit than have a proper revolution in a country that is happy with the status quo. So the system is in changeable and there’s no risk or chance to see any improvement for these people.

The biggest mystery in this country is how the tories manage to convince the working class that they do a good job for them. The Daily Mail and the Sun are the brain washers doing that job. I’m still waiting for the Mail to campaign for the House of Lords to be abolished, for an end to food banks etc... maybe one day, turkeys will stop voting for Christmas.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

When people lose their income and can't afford private healthcare, when they or a loved one develops a serious illness and the cost of the treatment is so prohibitive that their only options are bankruptcy or death, perhaps then the naysayers will reflect on what they have lost.

Those who don't seem to care? More fool you.

The NHS is now doomed, and it's demise is only a matter of time. Those in denial are due a huge shock in the not too distant future.

Voting for cunts has consequences, and those consequences are soon to make all our lives a whole lot worse, for a long time to come.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"When people lose their income and can't afford private healthcare, when they or a loved one develops a serious illness and the cost of the treatment is so prohibitive that their only options are bankruptcy or death, perhaps then the naysayers will reflect on what they have lost.

Those who don't seem to care? More fool you.

The NHS is now doomed, and it's demise is only a matter of time. Those in denial are due a huge shock in the not too distant future.

Voting for cunts has consequences, and those consequences are soon to make all our lives a whole lot worse, for a long time to come.

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By *igsteve43Man
over a year ago

derby

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?"

Read again it said N.I. and to be honest short of raising it to 25% the NHS as it is, is unsustainable. We desperately need new hospitals, moredoctors, more nurses, more gaps, more dentists , more mental health specialists etc etc, all of which cost money that we don't have so how would you pay for it?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have "

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

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By *igsteve43Man
over a year ago

derby

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?"

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it"

How do you propose those on their bones of their arse pay for it?

Those at the top may more on a sliding scale.Thats how a fair society should work.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it"

It won't be a 'National Health Service' anymore, it will be an insurance backed health service and you'll certainly pay more for it, or you won't get treated.

How much more would be acceptable to you? I'm sure we'd all be willing to pay a little more for a better NHS, but that's not what will be on offer. Insurance companies have profits to make and shareholders to satisfy and the premiums will certainly not be cheap.

As it will most likely be American based insurers and pharmaceutical companies that will be the main beneficiaries of all this, then I consider it prudent to look at their healthcare system. It's not a pretty picture.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

It won't be a 'National Health Service' anymore, it will be an insurance backed health service and you'll certainly pay more for it, or you won't get treated.

Spot on.

The apathy around this issue is astounding.I listened to 5 live and radio 4 yesterday and I didn't hear the story once.

What do people seriously think is going to happen once those multi nationals get their grubby little mitts on it.We aren't talking a few pence on your prescription.There are billions to be made here.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

It won't be a 'National Health Service' anymore, it will be an insurance backed health service and you'll certainly pay more for it, or you won't get treated.

Spot on.

The apathy around this issue is astounding.I listened to 5 live and radio 4 yesterday and I didn't hear the story once.

What do people seriously think is going to happen once those multi nationals get their grubby little mitts on it.We aren't talking a few pence on your prescription.There are billions to be made here."

Head in the sand time for a lot of people I think. They naively believe that because the NHS has been around all their lives, it will continue to be there in the future. They are going to be very disappointed I'm afraid.

As for the more selfish individuals with private health insurance, who don't rely on the NHS and don't care about it, well unforseen circumstances are always around, and karma is a bitch.

The Tories didn't want an NHS in the first place, so the majority of them will be only too happy to see it's demise. Not only that, but you can be certain that a good many ministers both past and present, will have their grubby little mitts in the honeypot.

C'est la vie.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yet many that claim they are poor smoke, drink and have sky telly, it's all down to priorities.

Dear lord....you have fallen for The Daily Mail bullshit....I thought you were cleverer than that..

So are numbers visiting doctors and A&E going up or not ?

You accuse me of falling for dm stuff yet you are the one who only a few weeks ago was claiming the nhs had had funding cuts.

Try visiting poor housing estates and see all the dishes,its a fact that poorer people smoke more, just google it.that is highly likely to make them suffer many health issues "

Them satellite dishes that always get spoken about were put up well over 20 years back and most are defunct. But hey let's keep using it to have a pop at someone who lives on a council estate eh

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By *igsteve43Man
over a year ago

derby

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

How do you propose those on their bones of their arse pay for it?

Those at the top may more on a sliding scale.Thats how a fair society should work."

And a fair society rewards hard work and not the won't works

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

How do you propose those on their bones of their arse pay for it?

Those at the top may more on a sliding scale.Thats how a fair society should work.

And a fair society rewards hard work and not the won't works"

Ah yeah.

Bankers crash The economy and we blame the poor.

Timeless

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

It won't be a 'National Health Service' anymore, it will be an insurance backed health service and you'll certainly pay more for it, or you won't get treated.

Spot on.

The apathy around this issue is astounding.I listened to 5 live and radio 4 yesterday and I didn't hear the story once.

What do people seriously think is going to happen once those multi nationals get their grubby little mitts on it.We aren't talking a few pence on your prescription.There are billions to be made here.

As for the more selfish individuals with private health insurance, who don't rely on the NHS and don't care about it, well unforseen circumstances are always around, and karma is a bitch.

C'est la vie.

I'm amazed how many times I've read the last few days the NHS needs 'reform'

Classic tale of you don't miss something till it's gone.

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By *igsteve43Man
over a year ago

derby

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

How do you propose those on their bones of their arse pay for it?

Those at the top may more on a sliding scale.Thats how a fair society should work.

And a fair society rewards hard work and not the won't works

Ah yeah.

Bankers crash The economy and we blame the poor.

Timeless"

Where in my last post did I mention the bankers, I was talking about anybody doing a full days work, I just don't think people should be rewarded for spending all day in their local wetherspoons or bookies

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

How do you propose those on their bones of their arse pay for it?

Those at the top may more on a sliding scale.Thats how a fair society should work.

And a fair society rewards hard work and not the won't works

Ah yeah.

Bankers crash The economy and we blame the poor.

Timeless

Do they?

And I fail to see what this had to do with the nhs getting flogged off?

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By *igsteve43Man
over a year ago

derby

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

How do you propose those on their bones of their arse pay for it?

Those at the top may more on a sliding scale.Thats how a fair society should work.

And a fair society rewards hard work and not the won't works

Ah yeah.

Bankers crash The economy and we blame the poor.

Timeless

Do they?

And I fail to see what this had to do with the nhs getting flogged off?"

Yes they do , and it was you who started about a fair society

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

How do you propose those on their bones of their arse pay for it?

Those at the top may more on a sliding scale.Thats how a fair society should work.

And a fair society rewards hard work and not the won't works

Ah yeah.

Bankers crash The economy and we blame the poor.

Timeless

Do they?

And I fail to see what this had to do with the nhs getting flogged off?

Yes they do , and it was you who started about a fair society"

You really shouldn't believe everything you read in the daily mail

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By *igsteve43Man
over a year ago

derby

I'd rather not pay if I'm honest.

I think free healthcare,at point of entry,is one of the few things this country has to be proud about

Sorry to tell you this but you do pay it's called N,i

What's nu?

Also people talk of extortionate pharmacies costs, I go to the usa once or twice a year and my first visit is always to Walgreens as I get stuff 50-70% cheaper than have

Ni pays for all sorts..not just the NHS

We can raise money in terms of increased tax for those at the top,close tax loopholes,nationalisation etc..

What do you suggest?

I don't profess to have the answers but unlike you I do accept that if we want a better NHS then we all must be willing to pay more for it

How do you propose those on their bones of their arse pay for it?

Those at the top may more on a sliding scale.Thats how a fair society should work.

And a fair society rewards hard work and not the won't works

Ah yeah.

Bankers crash The economy and we blame the poor.

Timeless

Do they?

And I fail to see what this had to do with the nhs getting flogged off?

Yes they do , and it was you who started about a fair society

You really shouldn't believe everything you read in the daily mail

Sorry wrong again don't read the mail, and if you don't believe me go to your local spoons for a couple of days and bet you see the same faces

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By *ust RachelTV/TS
over a year ago

Horsham

"£9.15 charge for a prescription is quite a lot, particularly if on long term medication? In the USA a doctor's prescription (which you pay for) does not cover the cost of the medicine, all it does is give you permission to buy the medication for the full pharmaceutical price - which can again be thousands of pounds for something like cancer treatment.

I remember back in the 90's being told, that the anti sickness tablets I took when I had radiotherapy cost about £10 each. I hate to think how much they cost now.

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By *Wman15Man
over a year ago

Altrincham

A lot of inevitable but disappointing political rhetoric on this thread

The UK healthcare sector is already a mix of public and private provision and very often the NHS contracts through private facilities when it doesn't have capacity. For example one of my friends had a knee replacement done at the local private hospital but as an NHS patient. I'm waiting for a cataract operation and have been given a choice of NHS or private hospitals and will choose based on proximity and length of wait

Currently the private sector works well for non urgent elective surgery and the NHS is excellent for emergency care. Again, as a personal example I suffered a retinal detachment in early March - diagnosed on a Sunday at the opticians and operated on at An NHS specialist centre 24 hours later. A delay of 48 hours could've led to a total loss of sight

Of course my initial diagnosis was through my primary care provider - Specsavers. So again a mix of private and NHS involved

However, healthcare is becoming ever more expensive - be it the resources - drugs, people, equipment - or the number of procedures that are now common place

Knee and hip replacements are now run of the mill for example

And as the population ages so healthcare costs inevitably rise on a volume basis let alone the average treatment cost

So, all of this means that we either are more selective about what and who is treated or we have to all pay more, either directly or through our collective taxes

There are no easy answers

But we, as a country, need to debate and consider the options. Much as we do other areas like the state pension

Simply sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to solve the looming issues

A mature debate is needed

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

"A lot of inevitable but disappointing political rhetoric on this thread

Of course my initial diagnosis was through my primary care provider - Specsavers. So again a mix of private and NHS involved

However, healthcare is becoming ever more expensive - be it the resources - drugs, people, equipment - or the number of procedures that are now common place

Knee and hip replacements are now run of the mill for example

And as the population ages so healthcare costs inevitably rise on a volume basis let alone the average treatment cost

So, all of this means that we either are more selective about what and who is treated or we have to all pay more, either directly or through our collective taxes

There are no easy answers

But we, as a country, need to debate and consider the options. Much as we do other areas like the state pension

Simply sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to solve the looming issues

A mature debate is needed"

Completely agree but as soon as its mentioned labour and unions shout hands off the nhs.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"A lot of inevitable but disappointing political rhetoric on this thread

Of course my initial diagnosis was through my primary care provider - Specsavers. So again a mix of private and NHS involved

However, healthcare is becoming ever more expensive - be it the resources - drugs, people, equipment - or the number of procedures that are now common place

Knee and hip replacements are now run of the mill for example

And as the population ages so healthcare costs inevitably rise on a volume basis let alone the average treatment cost

So, all of this means that we either are more selective about what and who is treated or we have to all pay more, either directly or through our collective taxes

There are no easy answers

But we, as a country, need to debate and consider the options. Much as we do other areas like the state pension

Simply sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to solve the looming issues

A mature debate is needed"

Did you think that vote the other day was a positive step?

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Better than shouting hands off the nhs all the time.

Do we all want the best health care we can afford? Yes, is there too much management? Yes according to many who work in it.

Can we find better ways of doing things ? Always a better way.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Better than shouting hands off the nhs all the time.

Do we all want the best health care we can afford? Yes, is there too much management? Yes according to many who work in it.

Can we find better ways of doing things ? Always a better way.

It's a myth there is too management in the nhs.Proportianlly there is more in the private sector.

Let's see if in a better way in 4 years time.I doubt it.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

"Better than shouting hands off the nhs all the time.

Do we all want the best health care we can afford? Yes, is there too much management? Yes according to many who work in it.

Can we find better ways of doing things ? Always a better way.

It's a myth there is too management in the nhs.Proportianlly there is more in the private sector.

Let's see if in a better way in 4 years time.I doubt it."

Do you work in it ?

K does and in the 16 years she has worked in her current job there has been two layers more added(both during labour in power) virgin healthcare have been running the service for three years, they have reduced managers, got rid of expensive offices, given all staff laptops and work phones, instead of FIVE copies of every bit of paper work it now goes into the laptop ONCE .

Lots more could be done in removing more layers of managers but of course they want to keep their jobs so things move slowly.

Of course dinosaurs like you want it all to stay in the 1940's

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"Better than shouting hands off the nhs all the time.

Do we all want the best health care we can afford? Yes, is there too much management? Yes according to many who work in it.

Can we find better ways of doing things ? Always a better way.

It's a myth there is too management in the nhs.Proportianlly there is more in the private sector.

Let's see if in a better way in 4 years time.I doubt it.

Do you work in it ?

Lots more could be done in removing more layers of managers but of course they want to keep their jobs so things move slowly.

Of course dinosaurs like you want it all to stay in the 1940's "

Nope.

Work in the public sector.

There is top heavy management in almost every single job I've worked in.

I'm sure flogging it off to the highest bidder will solve that issue.

You seem to suggesting that the managers themselves are actually adding more burarcactacy so it keeps them in a job.

But like I said I don't work in the nhs so let them sell it off and we will see if you are just as enthusiastic in 4 years time.

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By *Wman15Man
over a year ago

Altrincham

"A lot of inevitable but disappointing political rhetoric on this thread

Of course my initial diagnosis was through my primary care provider - Specsavers. So again a mix of private and NHS involved

However, healthcare is becoming ever more expensive - be it the resources - drugs, people, equipment - or the number of procedures that are now common place

Knee and hip replacements are now run of the mill for example

And as the population ages so healthcare costs inevitably rise on a volume basis let alone the average treatment cost

So, all of this means that we either are more selective about what and who is treated or we have to all pay more, either directly or through our collective taxes

There are no easy answers

But we, as a country, need to debate and consider the options. Much as we do other areas like the state pension

Simply sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to solve the looming issues

A mature debate is needed

Did you think that vote the other day was a positive step?"

I don't think it was either positive or negative because I don't think that we (as a country) can afford to constrict how the NHS in the medium / long term without a proper debate

I'm fed up with political dogma on both sides of the political spectrum at the moment

It is stifling proper debate over too many critical issues and too many people have adopted entrenched positions

I'm a pragmatist - I've worked in business for over 30 years and without this approach some of the businesses that I've worked for would never have been so successful

It amazes and depresses me when I see so much energy being wasted because people are unwilling to see others point of view

I can remember my uncle - years a miner and NUM official in Yorkshire - at the time of the NUM / Thatcher coal dispute saying to me that they were fighting a losing battle because coal had had its day and all they were doing was try to squeeze a few more years out of an industry that would be dead soon regardless. He always felt conflicted because of his politics and the need to represent his members on one hand and his belief that the industry's days were numbered

As I said in my original post - I don't have the answers to our healthcare conundrum but it certainly isn't dogmatic party politics

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"A lot of inevitable but disappointing political rhetoric on this thread

Of course my initial diagnosis was through my primary care provider - Specsavers. So again a mix of private and NHS involved

However, healthcare is becoming ever more expensive - be it the resources - drugs, people, equipment - or the number of procedures that are now common place

Knee and hip replacements are now run of the mill for example

And as the population ages so healthcare costs inevitably rise on a volume basis let alone the average treatment cost

So, all of this means that we either are more selective about what and who is treated or we have to all pay more, either directly or through our collective taxes

There are no easy answers

But we, as a country, need to debate and consider the options. Much as we do other areas like the state pension

Simply sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to solve the looming issues

A mature debate is needed

Did you think that vote the other day was a positive step?

I don't think it was either positive or negative because I don't think that we (as a country) can afford to constrict how the NHS in the medium / long term without a proper debate

I'm fed up with political dogma on both sides of the political spectrum at the moment

It is stifling proper debate over too many critical issues and too many people have adopted entrenched positions

I'm a pragmatist - I've worked in business for over 30 years and without this approach some of the businesses that I've worked for would never have been so successful

It amazes and depresses me when I see so much energy being wasted because people are unwilling to see others point of view

As I said in my original post - I don't have the answers to our healthcare conundrum but it certainly isn't dogmatic party politics"

I cant disagree with that but the nhs isnt a business.

Look what happened when they tried to be privatise the probation service.Its been an absolute shitstorm.

I cant agree with taking the political dogma out of it.Its rather simple.You either have faith in bj and co or you don't.(To be quite honest we haven't got much choice)

I've seen what the tories have done in the past so my mind is made up.

I genuinely think in 5 years time the nhs as we know will be long gone.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

I cant disagree with that but the nhs isnt a business.

Look what happened when they tried to be privatise the probation service.Its been an absolute shitstorm.

I cant agree with taking the political dogma out of it.Its rather simple.You either have faith in bj and co or you don't.(To be quite honest we haven't got much choice)

I've seen what the tories have done in the past so my mind is made up.

I genuinely think in 5 years time the nhs as we know will be long gone.

So you have a closed mind, just what the country needs.

Where in any of my posts have I said we should sell it off. Your closed mind just makes you see what you want.

The nhs needs to modernise not be a dinosaur, remember what happened to them

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I cant disagree with that but the nhs isnt a business.

Look what happened when they tried to be privatise the probation service.Its been an absolute shitstorm.

I cant agree with taking the political dogma out of it.Its rather simple.You either have faith in bj and co or you don't.(To be quite honest we haven't got much choice)

I've seen what the tories have done in the past so my mind is made up.

I genuinely think in 5 years time the nhs as we know will be long gone.

So you have a closed mind, just what the country needs.

Where in any of my posts have I said we should sell it off. Your closed mind just makes you see what you want.

The nhs needs to modernise not be a dinosaur, remember what happened to them"

We have just agreed to let ot be sold off to practically anyone.. what do you think is going to happen?

What do you mean by modernise exactly?

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By *Wman15Man
over a year ago

Altrincham

"A lot of inevitable but disappointing political rhetoric on this thread

Of course my initial diagnosis was through my primary care provider - Specsavers. So again a mix of private and NHS involved

However, healthcare is becoming ever more expensive - be it the resources - drugs, people, equipment - or the number of procedures that are now common place

Knee and hip replacements are now run of the mill for example

And as the population ages so healthcare costs inevitably rise on a volume basis let alone the average treatment cost

So, all of this means that we either are more selective about what and who is treated or we have to all pay more, either directly or through our collective taxes

There are no easy answers

But we, as a country, need to debate and consider the options. Much as we do other areas like the state pension

Simply sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to solve the looming issues

A mature debate is needed

Did you think that vote the other day was a positive step?

I don't think it was either positive or negative because I don't think that we (as a country) can afford to constrict how the NHS in the medium / long term without a proper debate

I'm fed up with political dogma on both sides of the political spectrum at the moment

It is stifling proper debate over too many critical issues and too many people have adopted entrenched positions

I'm a pragmatist - I've worked in business for over 30 years and without this approach some of the businesses that I've worked for would never have been so successful

It amazes and depresses me when I see so much energy being wasted because people are unwilling to see others point of view

As I said in my original post - I don't have the answers to our healthcare conundrum but it certainly isn't dogmatic party politics

I cant disagree with that but the nhs isnt a business.

Look what happened when they tried to be privatise the probation service.Its been an absolute shitstorm.

I cant agree with taking the political dogma out of it.Its rather simple.You either have faith in bj and co or you don't.(To be quite honest we haven't got much choice)

I've seen what the tories have done in the past so my mind is made up.

I genuinely think in 5 years time the nhs as we know will be long gone.

I understand what you are saying

I didn't say that the NHS is a business - I don't think anyone really wants it to be, including the Tories

However, we do need fresh thinking. Someone like a Frank Field would be great for this - principled but willing to listen to opposing points of view and to pick out good policies regardless of their political colour

The NHS is enormously different to the first incarnation back in the late 1940s and it will have to continue adapting as it has done over the years

I firmly believe that it will be largely the same in 5 years - I guess we will both have to return to this thread in 5 year's time

Or I may bump into you on one of my frequent visits to Liverpool lol

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"A lot of inevitable but disappointing political rhetoric on this thread

Of course my initial diagnosis was through my primary care provider - Specsavers. So again a mix of private and NHS involved

However, healthcare is becoming ever more expensive - be it the resources - drugs, people, equipment - or the number of procedures that are now common place

Knee and hip replacements are now run of the mill for example

And as the population ages so healthcare costs inevitably rise on a volume basis let alone the average treatment cost

So, all of this means that we either are more selective about what and who is treated or we have to all pay more, either directly or through our collective taxes

There are no easy answers

But we, as a country, need to debate and consider the options. Much as we do other areas like the state pension

Simply sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to solve the looming issues

A mature debate is needed

Did you think that vote the other day was a positive step?

I don't think it was either positive or negative because I don't think that we (as a country) can afford to constrict how the NHS in the medium / long term without a proper debate

I'm fed up with political dogma on both sides of the political spectrum at the moment

It is stifling proper debate over too many critical issues and too many people have adopted entrenched positions

I'm a pragmatist - I've worked in business for over 30 years and without this approach some of the businesses that I've worked for would never have been so successful

It amazes and depresses me when I see so much energy being wasted because people are unwilling to see others point of view

As I said in my original post - I don't have the answers to our healthcare conundrum but it certainly isn't dogmatic party politics

I cant disagree with that but the nhs isnt a business.

Look what happened when they tried to be privatise the probation service.Its been an absolute shitstorm.

I cant agree with taking the political dogma out of it.Its rather simple.You either have faith in bj and co or you don't.(To be quite honest we haven't got much choice)

I've seen what the tories have done in the past so my mind is made up.

I genuinely think in 5 years time the nhs as we know will be long gone.

I understand what you are saying

I didn't say that the NHS is a business - I don't think anyone really wants it to be, including the Tories

The NHS is enormously different to the first incarnation back in the late 1940s and it will have to continue adapting as it has done over the years

I firmly believe that it will be largely the same in 5 years - I guess we will both have to return to this thread in 5 year's time

Or I may bump into you on one of my frequent visits to Liverpool lol"

I do think it needs looking at I've just got zero faith in this lot of clowns doing it.

I genuinely think if they could get away they would privatise the lot.Looks what happened with the probation service,prisons,schools etc.

There was a dr on the radio a while ago and he said he genuinely believed in a few years time we would have a system like America.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

I cant disagree with that but the nhs isnt a business.

Look what happened when they tried to be privatise the probation service.Its been an absolute shitstorm.

I cant agree with taking the political dogma out of it.Its rather simple.You either have faith in bj and co or you don't.(To be quite honest we haven't got much choice)

I've seen what the tories have done in the past so my mind is made up.

I genuinely think in 5 years time the nhs as we know will be long gone.

So you have a closed mind, just what the country needs.

Where in any of my posts have I said we should sell it off. Your closed mind just makes you see what you want.

The nhs needs to modernise not be a dinosaur, remember what happened to them

We have just agreed to let ot be sold off to practically anyone.. what do you think is going to happen?

What do you mean by modernise exactly?

Allowing a foreign company to provide services is not "selling " it, all nhs contracts are time limited and if they can provide a better service what's the problem ?

Modernise means using modern tech to save time on admin, taking the best of the nhs and adding the best bits of health care systems from around the world, also social care needs serious thought, we are an aging population which is going to cost huge sums, we have a younger generation that are in general unfit, overweight and sedentary they eat processed rubbish and are highly likely to have a lower life expectancy than my generation unless they change.

And there you are with your self confessed closed mind,

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

I cant disagree with that but the nhs isnt a business.

Look what happened when they tried to be privatise the probation service.Its been an absolute shitstorm.

I cant agree with taking the political dogma out of it.Its rather simple.You either have faith in bj and co or you don't.(To be quite honest we haven't got much choice)

I've seen what the tories have done in the past so my mind is made up.

I genuinely think in 5 years time the nhs as we know will be long gone.

So you have a closed mind, just what the country needs.

Where in any of my posts have I said we should sell it off. Your closed mind just makes you see what you want.

The nhs needs to modernise not be a dinosaur, remember what happened to them

We have just agreed to let ot be sold off to practically anyone.. what do you think is going to happen?

What do you mean by modernise exactly?

Allowing a foreign company to provide services is not "selling " it, all nhs contracts are time limited and if they can provide a better service what's the problem ?

And there you are with your self confessed closed mind, "

Maybe I'm going by the roaring success that's been made of the probation service?

You have clearly got more faith in privatisation than I have.

I keep saying it.Lets see where we are in a few years

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

You have plainly forgotten the mess that was public services, even though many still carry the work practices of old they still are far better than before yes of course there are some horror stories but having a dogmatic resistance to moving on as you plainly have will result in less and less money available at the front line.

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By *Wman15Man
over a year ago

Altrincham

"A lot of inevitable but disappointing political rhetoric on this thread

Of course my initial diagnosis was through my primary care provider - Specsavers. So again a mix of private and NHS involved

However, healthcare is becoming ever more expensive - be it the resources - drugs, people, equipment - or the number of procedures that are now common place

Knee and hip replacements are now run of the mill for example

And as the population ages so healthcare costs inevitably rise on a volume basis let alone the average treatment cost

So, all of this means that we either are more selective about what and who is treated or we have to all pay more, either directly or through our collective taxes

There are no easy answers

But we, as a country, need to debate and consider the options. Much as we do other areas like the state pension

Simply sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to solve the looming issues

A mature debate is needed

Did you think that vote the other day was a positive step?

I don't think it was either positive or negative because I don't think that we (as a country) can afford to constrict how the NHS in the medium / long term without a proper debate

I'm fed up with political dogma on both sides of the political spectrum at the moment

It is stifling proper debate over too many critical issues and too many people have adopted entrenched positions

I'm a pragmatist - I've worked in business for over 30 years and without this approach some of the businesses that I've worked for would never have been so successful

It amazes and depresses me when I see so much energy being wasted because people are unwilling to see others point of view

As I said in my original post - I don't have the answers to our healthcare conundrum but it certainly isn't dogmatic party politics

I cant disagree with that but the nhs isnt a business.

Look what happened when they tried to be privatise the probation service.Its been an absolute shitstorm.

I cant agree with taking the political dogma out of it.Its rather simple.You either have faith in bj and co or you don't.(To be quite honest we haven't got much choice)

I've seen what the tories have done in the past so my mind is made up.

I genuinely think in 5 years time the nhs as we know will be long gone.

I understand what you are saying

I didn't say that the NHS is a business - I don't think anyone really wants it to be, including the Tories

The NHS is enormously different to the first incarnation back in the late 1940s and it will have to continue adapting as it has done over the years

I firmly believe that it will be largely the same in 5 years - I guess we will both have to return to this thread in 5 year's time

Or I may bump into you on one of my frequent visits to Liverpool lol

I do think it needs looking at I've just got zero faith in this lot of clowns doing it.

I genuinely think if they could get away they would privatise the lot.Looks what happened with the probation service,prisons,schools etc.

There was a dr on the radio a while ago and he said he genuinely believed in a few years time we would have a system like America."

A single doctor? And a single opinion

I could probably find you a doctor who believes in UFOs too

I think our system is much more likely to be the mixed system that currently exists in Germany than what exists in the US currently IF the NHS changes from what it is today

But what most of us are really doing is idle speculation based on our own political beliefs or experiences....none of us - least of all you or me - is in possession of the forecasts (of future demands on the NHS) and potential costs or any other key factors to be able to make fully reasoned judgements

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"You have plainly forgotten the mess that was public services, even though many still carry the work practices of old they still are far better than before yes of course there are some horror stories but having a dogmatic resistance to moving on as you plainly have will result in less and less money available at the front line.

Yes the trains and utilities have been a roaring success haven't they ?

Its not a case of public bad or private good.

Or the other way round.

They both can work well together but the tories put their total faith in the market.They don't want a welfare system.simple.

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

"A lot of inevitable but disappointing political rhetoric on this thread

Of course my initial diagnosis was through my primary care provider - Specsavers. So again a mix of private and NHS involved

However, healthcare is becoming ever more expensive - be it the resources - drugs, people, equipment - or the number of procedures that are now common place

Knee and hip replacements are now run of the mill for example

And as the population ages so healthcare costs inevitably rise on a volume basis let alone the average treatment cost

So, all of this means that we either are more selective about what and who is treated or we have to all pay more, either directly or through our collective taxes

There are no easy answers

But we, as a country, need to debate and consider the options. Much as we do other areas like the state pension

Simply sticking our heads in the sand isn't going to solve the looming issues

A mature debate is needed

Did you think that vote the other day was a positive step?

I don't think it was either positive or negative because I don't think that we (as a country) can afford to constrict how the NHS in the medium / long term without a proper debate

I'm fed up with political dogma on both sides of the political spectrum at the moment

It is stifling proper debate over too many critical issues and too many people have adopted entrenched positions

I'm a pragmatist - I've worked in business for over 30 years and without this approach some of the businesses that I've worked for would never have been so successful

It amazes and depresses me when I see so much energy being wasted because people are unwilling to see others point of view

As I said in my original post - I don't have the answers to our healthcare conundrum but it certainly isn't dogmatic party politics

I cant disagree with that but the nhs isnt a business.

Look what happened when they tried to be privatise the probation service.Its been an absolute shitstorm.

I cant agree with taking the political dogma out of it.Its rather simple.You either have faith in bj and co or you don't.(To be quite honest we haven't got much choice)

I've seen what the tories have done in the past so my mind is made up.

I genuinely think in 5 years time the nhs as we know will be long gone.

I understand what you are saying

I didn't say that the NHS is a business - I don't think anyone really wants it to be, including the Tories

The NHS is enormously different to the first incarnation back in the late 1940s and it will have to continue adapting as it has done over the years

I firmly believe that it will be largely the same in 5 years - I guess we will both have to return to this thread in 5 year's time

Or I may bump into you on one of my frequent visits to Liverpool lol

I do think it needs looking at I've just got zero faith in this lot of clowns doing it.

I genuinely think if they could get away they would privatise the lot.Looks what happened with the probation service,prisons,schools etc.

There was a dr on the radio a while ago and he said he genuinely believed in a few years time we would have a system like America.

A single doctor? And a single opinion

I could probably find you a doctor who believes in UFOs too

I think our system is much more likely to be the mixed system that currently exists in Germany than what exists in the US currently IF the NHS changes from what it is today

Never said it was gospel simply giving his opinion.

You could be right but as we are moving fairly away from Germany and closer to America in terms of trade I fear not.

Trump has already stated he wants his grubby mitts on the NHS and we very rarely stand upto them.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Yes the trains and utilities have been a roaring success haven't they ?

Its not a case of public bad or private good.

Or the other way round.

They both can work well together but the tories put their total faith in the market.They don't want a welfare system.simple."

The biggest problem with the trains is the numbers using them, far far more than pre privatised ones. So they are ten minutes late so what, are you never held up by traffic jams?

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By *ionelhutz OP Man
over a year ago

liverpool

Yes the trains and utilities have been a roaring success haven't they ?

Its not a case of public bad or private good.

Or the other way round.

They both can work well together but the tories put their total faith in the market.They don't want a welfare system.simple.

The biggest problem with the trains is the numbers using them, far far more than pre privatised ones. So they are ten minutes late so what, are you never held up by traffic jams?"

I'm fairly sure the astronomical price rises may also be a cause for concern.

Still once private companies get their teeth into the NHS I cant see being too bothered about their profit margins.

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By *obka3Couple
over a year ago

bournemouth

Yes the trains and utilities have been a roaring success haven't they ?

Its not a case of public bad or private good.

Or the other way round.

They both can work well together but the tories put their total faith in the market.They don't want a welfare system.simple.

The biggest problem with the trains is the numbers using them, far far more than pre privatised ones. So they are ten minutes late so what, are you never held up by traffic jams?

I'm fairly sure the astronomical price rises may also be a cause for concern.

Still once private companies get their teeth into the NHS I cant see being too bothered about their profit margins."

If you actually check the FACTS according to the bbc article on the rise in rail fares season ticket prices had risen by around the rate of inflation at 66%, petrol had increase by 170% in the same time but to be far have not risen since then but rail fares have by inflation.

That closed mind you have has blinded you again I'm afraid

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By *shrop_cpleCouple
over a year ago

Ceredigion

"What is concerning is I just looked and what is thier majority 80? Because 340- 251 has 9 non Tories voting for it if my maths is correct...

DUP..independents?

Be interesting to see how much air time this gets..I think this is a massive story.

It is and the only ones wearing "muzzles" is the mainstream media here."

That is why everyone watches RT, France24, and Al Jazeera now. The BBC is an absolute joke and an affront to the name 'public service broadcaster'.

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