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"Unions had, and continue to have, a very important role in protecting 'worker' rights. However these days it seems they are only interested in protecting their members to the detriment of everyone else. Look at BA.They seem intent on ensuring their members continue to get twice the going rate even if it means the company goes bust and all the other employees loose their jobs. Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? I cannot think of any other organisation or person who is legally allowed to bully as they do." wouldn't want too much power, but why should they look after employees that are not members and not paying union dues? | |||
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" Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? " No..if you want union protection, join | |||
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" Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? No..if you want union protection, join"  | |||
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" Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? No..if you want union protection, join" Think the OP was alluding to their other members, working for other airlines for lower rates/working practices. | |||
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"Unions had, and continue to have, a very important role in protecting 'worker' rights. However these days it seems they are only interested in protecting their members to the detriment of everyone else. Look at BA.They seem intent on ensuring their members continue to get twice the going rate even if it means the company goes bust and all the other employees loose their jobs. Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? I cannot think of any other organisation or person who is legally allowed to bully as they do." Without unions the employers would have to much power, the unions are there to protect their members, | |||
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"I don't think unions bully. I think that is a fundamental misunderstanding of what a union is. They represent. " So the union won't attend any meetings until BA retract the section 188 notice but if the section 188 has not been issued 100% correctly they sue??? | |||
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"I don't think unions bully. I think that is a fundamental misunderstanding of what a union is. They represent. So the union won't attend any meetings until BA retract the section 188 notice but if the section 188 has not been issued 100% correctly they sue???" I'm sorry, but I don't see how that's a reply to what I said. | |||
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"I don't think unions bully. I think that is a fundamental misunderstanding of what a union is. They represent. So the union won't attend any meetings until BA retract the section 188 notice but if the section 188 has not been issued 100% correctly they sue??? I'm sorry, but I don't see how that's a reply to what I said." So the union is invited to talks to represent their members but refuse to turn up. 250 meetings to date. How is that representing the members? And at the same time they are trying to block BAs parent company from buying another business preventing future security for the business. | |||
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"So the union is invited to talks to represent their members but refuse to turn up. 250 meetings to date. How is that representing the members? And at the same time they are trying to block BAs parent company from buying another business preventing future security for the business." The union *is* the members. | |||
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"Unions had, and continue to have, a very important role in protecting 'worker' rights. However these days it seems they are only interested in protecting their members to the detriment of everyone else. Look at BA.They seem intent on ensuring their members continue to get twice the going rate even if it means the company goes bust and all the other employees loose their jobs. Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? I cannot think of any other organisation or person who is legally allowed to bully as they do." Hi, So BA have said accept a huge pay cut or we sack you all. BA arrange lots of meetings with the union knowing that the union won’t discuss terms until BA withdraw the sacking threats. Do they do this to make themselves seem like they are willing to discuss the situation perhaps they are looking to keep pressure on the union, scare the workforce and manipulate public opinion. The threat that if they don’t take a huge non negotiable pay cut or the company goes bust is I think not true. The company will have funds set aside for future plans and rainy day money, obviously this is a very rainy day. The government has said loudly and clearly that loans are available at very favourable rates 1% if you factor in inflation then some of the loan is free. Do you think that BA’s shareholders are saying that they should consider the company going bust, would you be happy to see your shares become worthless? Do you think that somebody out there would like to pick up that business with their reputation? I see it as taking advantage of the situation and using it to get an advantage also apparently they are looking to buy other businesses. Will we see the likes of Richard Branson et.al putting their hands in vast pockets to help bailout companies when they can use government money, I don’t know. But it’s the people with mortgages and car payments who have to cough up. That’s why’s there’s Unions. What do you think? | |||
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"I don't think unions bully. I think that is a fundamental misunderstanding of what a union is. They represent. So the union won't attend any meetings until BA retract the section 188 notice but if the section 188 has not been issued 100% correctly they sue??? I'm sorry, but I don't see how that's a reply to what I said. So the union is invited to talks to represent their members but refuse to turn up. 250 meetings to date. How is that representing the members? And at the same time they are trying to block BAs parent company from buying another business preventing future security for the business." Source? | |||
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"Unions had, and continue to have, a very important role in protecting 'worker' rights. However these days it seems they are only interested in protecting their members to the detriment of everyone else. Look at BA.They seem intent on ensuring their members continue to get twice the going rate even if it means the company goes bust and all the other employees loose their jobs. Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? I cannot think of any other organisation or person who is legally allowed to bully as they do." Unions are there to protect its new members. We also have some of the most anti union legislation in europe | |||
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"Unions had, and continue to have, a very important role in protecting 'worker' rights. However these days it seems they are only interested in protecting their members to the detriment of everyone else. Look at BA.They seem intent on ensuring their members continue to get twice the going rate even if it means the company goes bust and all the other employees loose their jobs. Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? I cannot think of any other organisation or person who is legally allowed to bully as they do." Yes but you cannot force them | |||
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"Unions had, and continue to have, a very important role in protecting 'worker' rights. However these days it seems they are only interested in protecting their members to the detriment of everyone else. Look at BA.They seem intent on ensuring their members continue to get twice the going rate even if it means the company goes bust and all the other employees loose their jobs. Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? I cannot think of any other organisation or person who is legally allowed to bully as they do." If you pay insurance for your car say, would you be happy to pay insurance for other motorists? Of course not! Trade unions are paid organisations, paid by subscriptions of their members. Trade unions usually do not represent people who join because they have a problem. Do you think you could insure your house AFTER it burnt to the ground? The irony is, whatever benefits trade unions gain in the workplace it does apply to all staff any way not just paid up union members. | |||
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" Should unions be forced by law to look after all employees. Not just their own members? No..if you want union protection, join" | |||
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"Mind you, one very good example of unions existing to allow the continuing abuse of power are the various police unions in the U.S.A." I think the US Police unions are very unique and very corrupt. Pretty much just an extension of the Police. | |||
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"I’ve just found this thread. It’s incredible how endoctrinated and thatcherised people have become in this country. We probably have the weakest inions in the whole of Europe but this gvt is great at putting the blame on them for everything and the sheep take it on face value." | |||
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"I’ve just found this thread. It’s incredible how endoctrinated and thatcherised people have become in this country. We probably have the weakest inions in the whole of Europe but this gvt is great at putting the blame on them for everything and the sheep take it on face value." 100% | |||
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"I’ve just found this thread. It’s incredible how indoctrinated and Thatcherised people have become in this country. We probably have the weakest unions in the whole of Europe but this Gvt is great at putting the blame on them for everything and the sheep take it on face value." Exactly. Unions Baaaaaad. The Tory party would be utterly fucked without the unions. They'd be forced to take responsibility for all their fuck-ups. Although, they will blame almost anyone, other than themselves, under any circumstances. | |||
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"Always thought unions were run by the members, for the members, but not anymore. We both used to be union members - until we saw them hiring coaches to transport people to political rallies/demos. We'll never join another union while they are spending membership fees on supporting undemocratic demos and events - regardless of whether we agree with the cause or not. " They never have been in the 70,s you had no choice if you worked in a closed shop you had to join the union and a % of your union fees went to the labour party and there was nothing you could do about it.  | |||
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"Always thought unions were run by the members, for the members, but not anymore. We both used to be union members - until we saw them hiring coaches to transport people to political rallies/demos. We'll never join another union while they are spending membership fees on supporting undemocratic demos and events - regardless of whether we agree with the cause or not. They never have been in the 70,s you had no choice if you worked in a closed shop you had to join the union and a % of your union fees went to the labour party and there was nothing you could do about it. "That was 40 years ago. How are the Tories funded? | |||
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"Always thought unions were run by the members, for the members, but not anymore. We both used to be union members - until we saw them hiring coaches to transport people to political rallies/demos. We'll never join another union while they are spending membership fees on supporting undemocratic demos and events - regardless of whether we agree with the cause or not. They never have been in the 70,s you had no choice if you worked in a closed shop you had to join the union and a % of your union fees went to the labour party and there was nothing you could do about it.
That was 40 years ago.
How are the Tories funded?"yeah it was mate and can still remember being told i cant work unless i join the union,bit like the old protection rackets.  | |||
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"What demos and rallies? Secondary picketing is illegal" We've seen unions involved in counter protests at edl rallies and promoting themselves at pride marches we've attended. | |||
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"What demos and rallies? Secondary picketing is illegal We've seen unions involved in counter protests at edl rallies and promoting themselves at pride marches we've attended." Thats what unions do? | |||
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"Always thought unions were run by the members, for the members, but not anymore. We both used to be union members - until we saw them hiring coaches to transport people to political rallies/demos. We'll never join another union while they are spending membership fees on supporting undemocratic demos and events - regardless of whether we agree with the cause or not. They never have been in the 70,s you had no choice if you worked in a closed shop you had to join the union and a % of your union fees went to the labour party and there was nothing you could do about it.
That was 40 years ago.
How are the Tories funded?"Is it still the case that some union fees go to the Labour party without having a choice or can people opt out of that part | |||
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"Always thought unions were run by the members, for the members, but not anymore. We both used to be union members - until we saw them hiring coaches to transport people to political rallies/demos. We'll never join another union while they are spending membership fees on supporting undemocratic demos and events - regardless of whether we agree with the cause or not. They never have been in the 70,s you had no choice if you worked in a closed shop you had to join the union and a % of your union fees went to the labour party and there was nothing you could do about it.
That was 40 years ago.
How are the Tories funded?
Is it still the case that some union fees go to the Labour party without having a choice or can people opt out of that part"Not all trade unions are affiliated to political parties. My previous union employer was affiliated to the Labour party, my current one isn't. | |||
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"Always thought unions were run by the members, for the members, but not anymore. We both used to be union members - until we saw them hiring coaches to transport people to political rallies/demos. We'll never join another union while they are spending membership fees on supporting undemocratic demos and events - regardless of whether we agree with the cause or not. They never have been in the 70,s you had no choice if you worked in a closed shop you had to join the union and a % of your union fees went to the labour party and there was nothing you could do about it.
That was 40 years ago.
How are the Tories funded?
Is it still the case that some union fees go to the Labour party without having a choice or can people opt out of that part
Not all trade unions are affiliated to political parties. My previous union employer was affiliated to the Labour party, my current one isn't.
"I don't think so.There has been increasing anti union legislation the last x number of years. We have to agree that so much money goes to labour. To go on strike you also need,I think,60%,of the membership to vote. Something that doesnt apply in any form of election. | |||
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"Always thought unions were run by the members, for the members, but not anymore. We both used to be union members - until we saw them hiring coaches to transport people to political rallies/demos. We'll never join another union while they are spending membership fees on supporting undemocratic demos and events - regardless of whether we agree with the cause or not. They never have been in the 70,s you had no choice if you worked in a closed shop you had to join the union and a % of your union fees went to the labour party and there was nothing you could do about it.
That was 40 years ago.
How are the Tories funded?" | |||
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"What demos and rallies? Secondary picketing is illegal" It’s not picketing, it’s attending a demo or rally ... very different from picketing... | |||
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"Always thought unions were run by the members, for the members, but not anymore. We both used to be union members - until we saw them hiring coaches to transport people to political rallies/demos. We'll never join another union while they are spending membership fees on supporting undemocratic demos and events - regardless of whether we agree with the cause or not. They never have been in the 70,s you had no choice if you worked in a closed shop you had to join the union and a % of your union fees went to the labour party and there was nothing you could do about it.
That was 40 years ago.
How are the Tories funded?
Is it still the case that some union fees go to the Labour party without having a choice or can people opt out of that part"U can op out | |||
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"By their very nature Capitalists are international. They will go wherever there is money to be made. unions represent a local workforce even if they are a national union. Why did German manufacturing succeed? Possibly because unions wanted to improve the lot of the worker and not break the system for political ends. The last forty years have shown us that if you try to block the tide of progress the work goes elsewhere. We have been successful in creating a successful economy but only in areas that are non unionised." I'm not sure we have been that successful in creating a healthy economy tbf. You seem to be putting a lot of blame for the issues on the unions.An economy will work better if the gmnt and the unions work together.In this country the Tories have made no secret of wanting to destroy any power the unions have left.Even recently they have been pointing the finger of blame at teaching unions. Non unions workplaces tend to be characterized by low wages and awful working conditions (Amazon being a prime example) | |||
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"When it comes to unions we need to look at they fo it in Germany. Very healthy relationships. Constant dialogues that lead to healthy relationships and very few strikes. And unions in Germany are far more powerful than British unio" Because the unions want to promote wealth for their members and not deny wealth for others? | |||
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"This BA issue makes me chuckle. Years ago BA got rid of all the loaders, tug drivers, ramp agents, etc. as some of them were getting £15 to £20 an hour. I don't remember the unions helping the staff that much back then." Unions only help when thet think they can gain from it and cause polical problems,most of them are two face scum out to make money. | |||
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"When it comes to unions we need to look at they fo it in Germany. Very healthy relationships. Constant dialogues that lead to healthy relationships and very few strikes. And unions in Germany are far more powerful than British unio Because the unions want to promote wealth for their members and not deny wealth for others?" Do you think that British unions are preventing or really want to prevent anyone from being wealthy. From where I stand, I see them defending their members. However the Tory part is going a great job at demonising them. | |||
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"This BA issue makes me chuckle. Years ago BA got rid of all the loaders, tug drivers, ramp agents, etc. as some of them were getting £15 to £20 an hour. I don't remember the unions helping the staff that much back then.Unions only help when thet think they can gain from it and cause polical problems,most of them are two face scum out to make money. " Can you develop a bit? | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters." You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters." Do you mean that Starmer didn’t answer the question? Have you noticed that it’s what your rockstar had done for eight months Every time he’s asked a question? Doesn’t seem to bother you much. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. " We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. " I have to say I am a little disappointed in the teaching profession. I an a school governor and at the same time rent a dozen or so flats next to a hospital. The hospital people have been workings their bollocks off in a very risky situation. If you had a safe job in physio that was cancelled you were put on a COVID ward. And they did it. They are on massive overtime and they see it as a once in a lifetime opportunity. I am talking to two of them about buying flats off me. Teachers on the other hand have sat a home moaning about their workload, on full pay. I have a primary age son. I have been doing the home learning. Teachers have been taking the piss. Sorry. But that is my opinion and I do know how many teachers swing. | |||
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"By their very nature Capitalists are international. They will go wherever there is money to be made. unions represent a local workforce even if they are a national union. Why did German manufacturing succeed? Possibly because unions wanted to improve the lot of the worker and not break the system for political ends. The last forty years have shown us that if you try to block the tide of progress the work goes elsewhere. We have been successful in creating a successful economy but only in areas that are non unionised."
You're clearly a scholar of German history
The only way that capital "decides" to work alongside the unions is if it knows organised labour can bring it to it's knees.
Karl Liebknecht and Rosa Luxembourg must be spinning in their graves. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude." I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! " Funny how every other country can do it could it be they think more of the kids than trying to score political points.Nothing has changed with the unions they just have less power these days thank god. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! Funny how every other country can do it could it be they think more of the kids than trying to score political points.Nothing has changed with the unions they just have less power these days thank god." Do you ever read other people's replies because you've already mentioned this and I've already answered it. Here it is again: You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! " Let those trained to manage manage and those who are trained to teach teach. Unions leaders generally have neither skill and only have the wish to use a union as a springboard for their own desire for a political career. | |||
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"Always thought unions were run by the members, for the members, but not anymore. We both used to be union members - until we saw them hiring coaches to transport people to political rallies/demos. We'll never join another union while they are spending membership fees on supporting undemocratic demos and events - regardless of whether we agree with the cause or not. " Best not take a look in the union car park then. I went on strike in a company on Gatwick, the union did absolutely nothing for us. For all the time we went on the picket line, the strike pay was pittance. The union reps I worked with looked after themselves, fucked over everyone else. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! Let those trained to manage manage and those who are trained to teach teach. Unions leaders generally have neither skill and only have the wish to use a union as a springboard for their own desire for a political career." Teaching unions are usually run by ex or current teachers as far as I know. It's just amazing how the word union has become a swear word in this country. I know the tories have been discrediting them for 50 years now but still, it's unbelievable how naïve people are. Unions are probably not perfect but they're certainly not the evil that some people would like you to believe. It's a bit like the EU that is responsible for everything that was wrong in the UK. Talking about letting people do what they're trained to do. You could also refer to David Frost, the bloke who has been appointed or the head of the Civil Service without any experience at all. That's a classic | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! Funny how every other country can do it could it be they think more of the kids than trying to score political points.Nothing has changed with the unions they just have less power these days thank god. Do you ever read other people's replies because you've already mentioned this and I've already answered it. Here it is again: You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail." Do you not read peoples replies? i have already said they have plenty of time to look at what works in other countries and adopt what works.What is so hard to understand about that. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! Funny how every other country can do it could it be they think more of the kids than trying to score political points.Nothing has changed with the unions they just have less power these days thank god. Do you ever read other people's replies because you've already mentioned this and I've already answered it. Here it is again: You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail.Do you not read peoples replies? i have already said they have plenty of time to look at what works in other countries and adopt what works.What is so hard to understand about that." What don't you understand about not being able to teach per tutor group when kids have been in sets for several years? What don't you understand about the reluctance of this gvt to make masks compulsory (nothing to do with unions)? What don't you understand about class sizes in this country being the largest in the whole of Europe which makes things more complicated? Schools are at your disposal. They'd like to take advantage of your expertise. Get in touch with them. Show them how it's done. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! Funny how every other country can do it could it be they think more of the kids than trying to score political points.Nothing has changed with the unions they just have less power these days thank god. Do you ever read other people's replies because you've already mentioned this and I've already answered it. Here it is again: You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail.Do you not read peoples replies? i have already said they have plenty of time to look at what works in other countries and adopt what works.What is so hard to understand about that. What don't you understand about not being able to teach per tutor group when kids have been in sets for several years? What don't you understand about the reluctance of this gvt to make masks compulsory (nothing to do with unions)? What don't you understand about class sizes in this country being the largest in the whole of Europe which makes things more complicated? Schools are at your disposal. They'd like to take advantage of your expertise. Get in touch with them. Show them how it's done. "Well i cant speak for all of europe but in spain face masks are not compulsory for under 10,s or social distancing.Older kids will have to wear them if they cant keep 1.5 mtrs but not at their desks.Try uk gov.com all you need to know on there. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! Funny how every other country can do it could it be they think more of the kids than trying to score political points.Nothing has changed with the unions they just have less power these days thank god. Do you ever read other people's replies because you've already mentioned this and I've already answered it. Here it is again: You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail.Do you not read peoples replies? i have already said they have plenty of time to look at what works in other countries and adopt what works.What is so hard to understand about that. What don't you understand about not being able to teach per tutor group when kids have been in sets for several years? What don't you understand about the reluctance of this gvt to make masks compulsory (nothing to do with unions)? What don't you understand about class sizes in this country being the largest in the whole of Europe which makes things more complicated? Schools are at your disposal. They'd like to take advantage of your expertise. Get in touch with them. Show them how it's done. Well i cant speak for all of europe but in spain face masks are not compulsory for under 10,s or social distancing.Older kids will have to wear them if they cant keep 1.5 mtrs but not at their desks.Try uk gov.com all you need to know on there. "Well, if you don't know about other countries why are you comparing us to them? Telling us that their schools have reopened doesn't tell the whole story. I don't know about the size of Spanish schools but so many secondary schools in this country are massive. It's quite common to have school with 1800 students. Good luck with that. Anyway, everyone want school to reopen. We just need the gvt to give everyone clear instructions. It looks like they have been more thorough this time. We'll see but for god sake, let's stop blaming the unions for everything. | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. We are talking about September, 2 months away im sure they can look at whats working and adopt the measures but no its all negative. If this is the attitude of the teachers as well as their union (which i hope its not) god help the children they will all grow up with a cant do attitude. I’ve read the unions’ answers and they’re not as categorical as you depict them. I don’t know how often you go to a school these days but making sure that pupils from the same year can’t be in contact with a pupil from another year it’s not easy. All this in cramped buildings with behaviour which is obviously not perfect and having to stagger lunch for 5 or 7 different years with a timetable that is already complicated in normal times, good luck! And obviously with far fewer non teaching than it would have been the case 5 of 10 years ago because of all the cuts decided by who you know. Im sure teachers and unions will do their best but when you see that our gvt cant organise a piss-up in a brewery, they make me laugh when they tell teachers that it’s a piss of cake to sort this out. It’s probably about common sense again isn’t it? Like everything else with these clowns... We’re talking about a gvt that promised laptops for vulnerable children four months ago. Today, apparently 30 or 40% of these pupils are equipped. That’s great isn’t it? Schools haven’t asked much, just laptops. How much easier is it to send laptops compared to sort such a conundrum for September? Well, I’d rather trust teachers to sort out schools by September than those incompetent muppets who, apart from blaming everyone but themselves, are blatantly incompetent! Funny how every other country can do it could it be they think more of the kids than trying to score political points.Nothing has changed with the unions they just have less power these days thank god. Do you ever read other people's replies because you've already mentioned this and I've already answered it. Here it is again: You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail.Do you not read peoples replies? i have already said they have plenty of time to look at what works in other countries and adopt what works.What is so hard to understand about that. What don't you understand about not being able to teach per tutor group when kids have been in sets for several years? What don't you understand about the reluctance of this gvt to make masks compulsory (nothing to do with unions)? What don't you understand about class sizes in this country being the largest in the whole of Europe which makes things more complicated? Schools are at your disposal. They'd like to take advantage of your expertise. Get in touch with them. Show them how it's done. Well i cant speak for all of europe but in spain face masks are not compulsory for under 10,s or social distancing.Older kids will have to wear them if they cant keep 1.5 mtrs but not at their desks.Try uk gov.com all you need to know on there.
Well, if you don't know about other countries why are you comparing us to them?
Telling us that their schools have reopened doesn't tell the whole story.
I don't know about the size of Spanish schools but so many secondary schools in this country are massive. It's quite common to have school with 1800 students. Good luck with that. Anyway, everyone want school to reopen. We just need the gvt to give everyone clear instructions. It looks like they have been more thorough this time. We'll see but for god sake, let's stop blaming the unions for everything. "Did you look at the uk gov think they are clear enough and updated today. | |||
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"Not going to spend hours to find something on you.gov. If there is anything relevant, just post it here. " Right so you didnt check the gov guidelines before calling them incompetent muppets etc .Love the detail in your posts. how about the other link enjoy that one especially the last couple of paragraphs. | |||
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"Not going to spend hours to find something on you.gov. If there is anything relevant, just post it here. Right so you didnt check the gov guidelines before calling them incompetent muppets etc .Love the detail in your posts. how about the other link enjoy that one especially the last couple of paragraphs."I have listened to Williamson and read quite a lot about the whole thing this afternoon. That's enough. You don't know about European schools and cheese us off with your dim comparisons. Enough for me I'd rather talk to my cats.  | |||
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"Not going to spend hours to find something on you.gov. If there is anything relevant, just post it here. Right so you didnt check the gov guidelines before calling them incompetent muppets etc .Love the detail in your posts. how about the other link enjoy that one especially the last couple of paragraphs.
I have listened to Williamson and read quite a lot about the whole thing this afternoon. That's enough.
You don't know about European schools and cheese us off with your dim comparisons.
Enough for me I'd rather talk to my cats. " | |||
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"This BA issue makes me chuckle. Years ago BA got rid of all the loaders, tug drivers, ramp agents, etc. as some of them were getting £15 to £20 an hour. I don't remember the unions helping the staff that much back then.Unions only help when thet think they can gain from it and cause polical problems,most of them are two face scum out to make money. " Jesus | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters." The same unions who called for 4 meetings with the gmnt and were ignored? | |||
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"Only have to look at the teachers union going against the government still.the whole of European schools are back with no major problems yet our unions are still saying they may not be able to open even in September. Labour were ask in the house the other day why they are not backing the opening of schools its obvious that they dont want to upset their pay masters. You’ve only got to look a bit further than your nose to understand that schools on the continent are run differently that here. Masks are compulsory in most countries, social distancing is only 1m or 1.50 in most other countries, that pupils are not setted but are taught per tutor group which means it’s the teachers changing classroom not the pupils etc.., but obviously to understand this, you’ve got to go beyond your preconceived ideas that teaching unions are scum when we have probably the weakest unions in the whole of Europe. Viva el Daily Mail. I have to say I am a little disappointed in the teaching profession. I an a school governor and at the same time rent a dozen or so flats next to a hospital. The hospital people have been workings their bollocks off in a very risky situation. If you had a safe job in physio that was cancelled you were put on a COVID ward. And they did it. They are on massive overtime and they see it as a once in a lifetime opportunity. I am talking to two of them about buying flats off me. Teachers on the other hand have sat a home moaning about their workload, on full pay. I have a primary age son. I have been doing the home learning. Teachers have been taking the piss. Sorry. But that is my opinion and I do know how many teachers swing. " I don’t think you are fit to be a school governor | |||
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"In terms of taking sides it's a tough one to call. On 1 side you have a gmnt who have systematically cut every service to the bone and imposed pay freezes on the most crucial sectors of our society. On the other a profession who have devoted their lives to teaching our kids and organisations which exist to make sure workers are not treated as cattle. In this thread one of these sides have been labelled as "cunts'and taking the piss." | |||
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"In terms of taking sides it's a tough one to call. On 1 side you have a gmnt who have systematically cut every service to the bone and imposed pay freezes on the most crucial sectors of our society. On the other a profession who have devoted their lives to teaching our kids and organisations which exist to make sure workers are not treated as cattle. In this thread one of these sides have been labelled as "cunts'and taking the piss." Most of these forum posts are crazy anyway | |||
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"In terms of taking sides it's a tough one to call. On 1 side you have a gmnt who have systematically cut every service to the bone and imposed pay freezes on the most crucial sectors of our society. On the other a profession who have devoted their lives to teaching our kids and organisations which exist to make sure workers are not treated as cattle. In this thread one of these sides have been labelled as "cunts'and taking the piss.Most of these forum posts are crazy anyway" Good job you are here to bring a bit of normality, logic and clear arguments. | |||
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