FabSwingers.com forum: Rochdale Incident

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Is it correct to play the race card in this case ?...should these men be treated as vile criminals who prey on vulverable young women, rather than calling it as an act of sexual abuse against white girls by asian men or pakistani men ?... dont you think playing the racist card by BNP and other members of the community, trivialise such a henious crime ? and why these men are not given capital punishment ?

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By *orth West CoupleCouple
over a year ago

liverpool

"Is it correct to play the race card in this case ?...should these men be treated as vile criminals who prey on vulverable young women, rather than calling it as an act of sexual abuse against white girls by asian men or pakistani men ?... dont you think playing the racist card by BNP and other members of the community, trivialise such a henious crime ? and why these men are not given capital punishment ?"

"rather than calling it as an act of sexual abuse against white girls by asian men or pakistani men ?..." But that's exactly what it was....why sugercoat it because of race...they are scum no matter what race they are

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think the racism thing was kept out of it because it would confuse the issue! These fuckers are vile rapists who deserve to be strung up by the balls until dead!! These are the types of crime that the death penalty should be brought back for!! Crimes against kids, crimes against oaps and murder!!

But, as in this case, only if they found 100% guilty!!

And if they need someone to drop the bastards from the gallows then i'l volunteer!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

They are scum no matter what race they are... their race wouldnt have been mentioned had they been white... so why mention is when they are asian.. or black or any other freaking colour! they do it to make it seem worse but it just takes away from what they did and makes it about them being asian.. i completely agree with the OP race shouldnt be a part of it.. they are scum no matter what!

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By *orth West CoupleCouple
over a year ago

liverpool

"I think the racism thing was kept out of it because it would confuse the issue! These fuckers are vile rapists who deserve to be strung up by the balls until dead!! These are the types of crime that the death penalty should be brought back for!! Crimes against kids, crimes against oaps and murder!!

But, as in this case, only if they found 100% guilty!!

And if they need someone to drop the bastards from the gallows then i'l volunteer!!

"
This is what we need...more impartial jurors

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Didnt they say on the news, that group stuff like this is 90% foreign men but when its just single guys, its mostly white.

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By *araidWoman
over a year ago

the west (ish)

Castrate them all

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By *ovedupstillCouple
over a year ago

mullinwire

"Didnt they say on the news, that group stuff like this is 90% foreign men but when its just single guys, its mostly white."

yes, and studies prove the same.

it was discussed on the radio last night, while i was at work, and even community leaders/speakers were coming out and saying that some in the communities see white women as 'lesser' than asian women. apparently the same can be said within some black communities also.

its the perception of white women being easy i suppose.

and, dont forget, if it were a group of WHITE men that groomed ASIAN or BLACk girls then of course the race card would have been played, so why should it be discarded in this instance?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

but wasnt this actually racially motivated.. ie they picked white girls??

its disgusting whatever the race.. but not sure why it should be ignored when it was part of it.

Cali

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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago

Kidderminster+ surrounding areas.

"Didnt they say on the news, that group stuff like this is 90% foreign men but when its just single guys, its mostly white.

yes, and studies prove the same.

its the perception of white women being easy i suppose.

and, dont forget, if it were a group of WHITE men that groomed ASIAN or BLACk girls then of course the race card would have been played, so why should it be discarded in this instance?"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"but wasnt this actually racially motivated.. ie they picked white girls??

its disgusting whatever the race.. but not sure why it should be ignored when it was part of it.

Cali "

i think it was because the authorities thought the race card would overtake the vileness of the actual crime!

Ye, we all know it was race motivated, but lets not detract that from the fact it was a vile crime and the bastards will get what they deserve when behind bars!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Capital punishment isn't currently an option in this country irregardless of how vile the crime is.

Hence why it is not an option in this case.

Despite the public outrage in this case, they will be given custodial sentences and nothing will change that.

I think the media have jumped on a crime against children and used it to incite further racial hatred as opposed to concentrating on the real issues.

That said, the defendants have also jumped on a racial bandwagon of their own and played the race card to say they will be treated differently.

That has not helped the image of themselves in particular and Muslim males in general in the eyes of the press.

I would hope that anyone with a modicum of intelligence and common sense would realise that this IS NOT a race issue as paedophilia is paedophilia, rape is rape, trafficking is trafficking irregardless of the race of the perpetrators or the victims.

Some will argue that it is a race issues as the Muslim men preyed on white children.

I would say more to the point, they preyed on vulnerable children who by far and large come from white Christian backgrounds as opposed to from more insular and protective Muslim families.

I hope that these men receive the highest sentences they can under English Law, but I also hope that this case is not used as springboard to incite further violence against innocent people from within the Muslim community both in Rochdale and in other areas.

I think the emphasis now should be on providing support to the victims and turning their lives round as opposed to making the perpetrators victims in their own right by making this case a race issue.

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By *uckoldandWifeCouple
over a year ago

Manchester

did they target white girls because of the colour of their skin or because those girls were vulnerable and therefore easier to manipulate, were they easier to ply with alcohol and drugs for whatever reason. Why didn't the police do something about this in 2008 when the first child came forward? Playing the race card in this instance won't affect the sentencing of these criminals, all it does is encourage hatred of communities and people who are as appalled by these crimes as all decent people are.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/05/12 12:43:27]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

These particular people are rapists AND racists in my opinion.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's not to do with race or religion, but I think their culture is important in relation to this particular crime. An unhealthy attitude to sex, caste, cousin marriages, forced marriages, segregation, double life, disempowered women are all factors.

It's no coincidence that these crimes occur amongst working class, northern, pakistani men, as they are most likely to be less integrated with british society and therefore have a cultural identity crisis.

It's important to mention these things because only by getting to the root of the problem can this sickening behaviour be prevented.

On a side note, I have to say what right wing groups have wrong is the belief that they specifically target "white" girls. They target vulnerable teenage girls, often from broken homes, who can be easily manipulated by promises of alcohol and drugs and who are easily impressed by flash cars etc. The majority of girls fitting into this category just happen to be white.

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By *ovedupstillCouple
over a year ago

mullinwire

as with many asian families that i have come int ocontact with, the males of the family get cart blanch to pretty much d what they want, whereas the female of the family get to be taught how to cook, clean and generally be subservient to the males, so to say white girls are easier to ply with whatever is arse. IF they so wished they could have carried out this crime against girls in thier own communities, simply because women are thought less of than boys, end of!

it WAS racially motivated!

it IS a disgustingly henous crime

and for this capital punishment should be reintroduced, because no matter what happens to them inside, it can not replace what has been taken from these poor girls, and thousands like them around the country/world

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By *lirty and dirtyCouple
over a year ago

ashford

It was also on the news earlier that most are men of power. One reads the koran in a mosque and another a school teacher, so we are not talking just guys of the street.These were men who should be trusted!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" to say white girls are easier to ply with whatever is arse. "

That isn't what people are saying. They are saying that girls from broken homes, with no male role models etc. are targeted. It's just that the overwhelming majority of girls fitting the description happen to be white.

To say it was racially motivated is like saying the Catholic priests in Ireland who sexually abused altar boys racially targeted white boys.

No one denies that its a disgusting crime and that punishments for these crimes and other sexual crimes perpetrated against minors are pathetic. But if we are to prevent these crimes we have to see them for what they are and not get things twisted.

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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago

Kidderminster+ surrounding areas.

"These particular people are rapists AND racists in my opinion. "

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By *ovedupstillCouple
over a year ago

mullinwire

" to say white girls are easier to ply with whatever is arse.

To say it was racially motivated is like saying the Catholic priests in Ireland who sexually abused altar boys racially targeted white boys.

your argument doesnt hold water, as there arent many black or asian families that practice catholocism, so the opportunity for the dirty fuggers to prey on these children is slim.

and no, all the girls that were preyed on were not from broken homes, with no mae role models. this is just a conclusion jumped to by yourself, as the identities of all those involved is not known.

ateotd, you ply any girl with drink and drugs and you can pretty much get anything you want from them, no matter what relifion, race or background, these 'men' have specifically targetted young white girls, for whatever reason.

you cannot sit there and tell me they had no coloured of whatever ethnicity) friends that could have been plied???

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The big issue to me is only 9 went to trail where as another 40 plus were involved but the 9 won't give other names. Personally they should get another 10 years for protecting pedos in my book.

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By *oystaMan
over a year ago

Liverpool Tuebrook

Just been to town (Liverpool city centre) huge crowd outside the courts with about 20 police

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If they are of Pakistani origin (as claimed in the BBC news) then extract them from the British communities who's trust they have betrayed and try them in their own country so the Britain doesn't have to foot the bill for their court cases, imprisonment and let's see how their crimes will be punished on their own soil.

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By *histler21Man
over a year ago

Ipswich

"They are scum no matter what race they are... their race wouldnt have been mentioned had they been white... so why mention is when they are asian.. or black or any other freaking colour!

snip

I think if the tables had been turned - there *would* have been a huge vocal outburst about this. And probably more.

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By *ovedupstillCouple
over a year ago

mullinwire

"They are scum no matter what race they are... their race wouldnt have been mentioned had they been white... so why mention is when they are asian.. or black or any other freaking colour!

snip

I think if the tables had been turned - there *would* have been a huge vocal outburst about this. And probably more."

there would have been riots in the streets, mate

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I said they target girls from broken homes, no male role models etc. I didn't say every single girl fitted that description.

You've hit the nail on the head regarding the Catholic priests not having the opportunity to prey on other races. Same applies here. You have to realise that they are extremely unlikely in these northern towns to find young teenage girls from their own community who drink alcohol and/or take drugs and/or are from vulnerable backgrounds (Single parent homes/ in care homes/in foster care/alcoholic parents etc.) On top of that another reason for them not targeting girls within their own communities is that because of the tight knit nature of their communities their crimes would be discovered much easier and they want to save face within their own communities.

Are you saying they actively thought, "lets do this to white girls only" Your telling me if there was a young Asian or Black girl walking down the street alone at night d*unk, they wouldn't have tried to entice her?

Where you say that I don't know that the girls are from the backgrounds I describe, the same applies to your assumption that all the victims are white. The identities of the victims are protected. It also applies to your assumption that they targeted white girls only.

We are both getting our information from the media and they have reported on numerous occasions that the backgrounds of the victims in these grooming cases are those that I described. Also although I am quite middle class and completely disengaged from the British Pakistani community, I am still quite aware of the intricacies of it, which is why I find the idea they actively thought to ONLY target white girls as ridiculous.

If it is treated as a race crime we aren't going to get anywhere when it comes to preventing it. If it's treated for what it is, a crime where the societal situations coupled with the sick predatory minds of the perpetrators is the cause, then the actual root causes can be tackled.

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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago

Kidderminster+ surrounding areas.

"They are scum no matter what race they are... their race wouldnt have been mentioned had they been white... so why mention is when they are asian.. or black or any other freaking colour!

snip

I think if the tables had been turned - there *would* have been a huge vocal outburst about this. And probably more.

there would have been riots in the streets, mate"

my thoughts too!,community leaders first then the mobs!.

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By *ovedupstillCouple
over a year ago

mullinwire

so we actively ignore the racial side of the whole story?

there was a woman on the radio last night that had her daughter groomed in this way by an asian group of men, and they were a stable family.

they got girls to get other girls to come along to be abused, no although that takes a step away from an initial intent of racial abuse, as i stated, said girls MUST have had black and asian friends, from either the perpetraters communities, or from outside, yet actively searched out young WHITE girls.

your mate says to you he wants 2 double date with his g/f and would you meet her friend, would he ask you IFhe knew the friend wasnt your type, or the fact he knew there was a chance you could be attracted to the 3rd person?

same in this instance, the girls were targetted because that is what these men wanted. END OF!

there is no argument that can change my opinion on this. there are black and asian girls in care and so on that, so far, have not been shown to be involved.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This is an odd one.

According to the statistics quoted this morning......... By far the majority of sexual offenders are white.....However, in the particular area of 'gang rape' the majority of crimes are commited by Pakistani men (it is not clear whether that is because they commit a lot of these crimes or that there are a lot of people commiting the crimes).

There is a lot of 'grooming' of white girls going on because there are a lot of white girls on the streets, whereas there are far fewer 'asian' girls (by which I mean muslim, as opposed to sihk, hindu, buddist, or any of the other miriad racial and national groups existing in Asia).

I happened to be in Liverpool city center outside the court where the case is being tried and there was a BNP idiot spouting the usual opportunistic fascist lies about muslim's coming here being given benefits 'hand over fist' and (despite being an English nationalist) I could not help being struck by the irony of the situation............

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

wouldnt catch them doing it to their own

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

But capital punishment would be against there human rights even though what they did carnt be classed as human there animals and should be treated as such

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"wouldnt catch them doing it to their own

Thats like saying there is no black on black crime.. or that bikers stick together... its bullshit.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Didnt they say on the news, that group stuff like this is 90% foreign men but when its just single guys, its mostly white."

Yes they did

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

well duh obviously there will be cases but the majority of these cnuts will target girls outside their communities and race

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"well duh obviously there will be cases but the majority of these cnuts will target girls outside their communities and race"

People will generally target people outside of their direct communities because it affords them the luxury of it taking longer for them to get caught.... and wasn't it just last year that one of the biggest paedophile rings was smashed and yet nothing was mentioned about their race at all

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/8386018/British-police-smash-biggest-ever-paedophile-ring.html oh yes... here it is...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

read harry from mancs post. it about sums it up really

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I said they target girls from broken homes, no male role models etc. I didn't say every single girl fitted that description.

For me, nail on head !

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By *iss_tressWoman
over a year ago

London

What has surprised me is there is still a lot of pussy footying around this: why aren't they called what they are, peodophiles.

It's all well bringing race into it, but let's not forget all races are capable of this and some women too...remember Vanessa George?

These acts are henious - I'm in no way shape or form excusing these men for what they've done, but I have to ask - where on earth were the parents/guardians?!!

These children weren't dragged off the street and assaulted once, but it was a continued and sustained attack with this group of peodphiles. How can you not know where a 13 year old is?!!

I really feel for these children, betrayed by those that were supposed to look out for them, the police and these awful men who they mistakenly thought were their friends.

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

The racial lines in the postings have been pretty much as I would expect them to be from previous discussions on the forum. The only redeeming feature is the outrage at the sheer volume and vileness of this case.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

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By *umourCouple
over a year ago

Rushden

So if a Catholic priest molests a young boy, should we, for the sake of Furc and Manc Harry just say a "priest"! Should we tar all priests with that brush? No! And neither should we tar people in Rochdale because of a few PC people!

If this is a group of Pakistani men, abusing young girls of ANY ethinic background, why can't we say they are Pakistani? That is what they are! The crime is still just as bad, it doesn't detract from that. It does however add to the background to the story.

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By *waymanMan
over a year ago

newcastle

"but wasnt this actually racially motivated.. ie they picked white girls??

its disgusting whatever the race.. but not sure why it should be ignored when it was part of it.

Cali "
What if it's just the case that they picked white girls because they were available, and they calculated there was less risk?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So if a Catholic priest molests a young boy, should we, for the sake of Furc and Manc Harry just say a "priest"! Should we tar all priests with that brush? No! And neither should we tar people in Rochdale because of a few PC people!

I'm a Roman Catholic (and have been since before I was born.....) and am very annoyed that people seem to forget that before the scandal of paedophile priests was raised, the big scandal was the abuse of children in secular institutions.

People all over the country were abused in children's homes all over this country were abused in secular organisations and their suffering seems to be ignored because of a (seeming) vendetta against an organisation.

The point is that abuse of children seems to be widespread across creed, colour and gender (I remember that Rose West was as implicated in criminality as Fred West) and blaming one group of people at the absence of placing blame on others is absurd......

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Capital punishment isn't currently an option in this country irregardless of how vile the crime is.

Hence why it is not an option in this case.

Despite the public outrage in this case, they will be given custodial sentences and nothing will change that.

I think the media have jumped on a crime against children and used it to incite further racial hatred as opposed to concentrating on the real issues.

That said, the defendants have also jumped on a racial bandwagon of their own and played the race card to say they will be treated differently.

That has not helped the image of themselves in particular and Muslim males in general in the eyes of the press.

Some will argue that it is a race issues as the Muslim men preyed on white children.

I would say more to the point, they preyed on vulnerable children who by far and large come from white Christian backgrounds as opposed to from more insular and protective Muslim families.

I think the emphasis now should be on providing support to the victims and turning their lives round as opposed to making the perpetrators victims in their own right by making this case a race issue."

one thing they certain cannot claim is being Muslim. This kind of activity is impossible for a muslim. Muslim is not a race, it is a choice of a way of life. Nor is it a synomym of Arabic, Eastern or Asian.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm a Roman Catholic (and have been since before I was born.....) "

LOL i always love it when people on here say they are religious!!

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By *_and_MCouple
over a year ago

kings lynn

"I said they target girls from broken homes, no male role models etc. I didn't say every single girl fitted that description.

eloguently put Harry

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By *etillanteWoman
over a year ago

But also one of the men cannot be named as he is requesting political asylum. To me his crime should make his claim void and he should be deported

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"but wasnt this actually racially motivated.. ie they picked white girls??

its disgusting whatever the race.. but not sure why it should be ignored when it was part of it.

Cali What if it's just the case that they picked white girls because they were available, and they calculated there was less risk?"

Exactly...the question society needs to ask is why these girls were vulnerable...one said she got bought a kebab so she knew he liked her!

Paucity of opportunity, lack of self esteem and family backgrounds that meant they were wandering the strest late at night...this is what the men were looking for, children they could exploit. Colour was irrelevent.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It was also on the news earlier that most are men of power. One reads the koran in a mosque and another a school teacher, so we are not talking just guys of the street.These were men who should be trusted!!!

yep just like those priests. religion a dark cloak to cover their evil.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm a Roman Catholic (and have been since before I was born.....)

LOL i always love it when people on here say they are religious!! "

Hehe

I am Catholic, I can do whatever I like so long as I feel guilty afterwards

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"one thing they certain cannot claim is being Muslim. This kind of activity is impossible for a muslim. Muslim is not a race, it is a choice of a way of life. Nor is it a synomym of Arabic, Eastern or Asian."

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By *iss_tressWoman
over a year ago

London

"But also one of the men cannot be named as he is requesting political asylum. To me his crime should make his claim void and he should be deported"

Agree with you there.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" to say white girls are easier to ply with whatever is arse.

To say it was racially motivated is like saying the Catholic priests in Ireland who sexually abused altar boys racially targeted white boys.

your argument doesnt hold water, as there arent many black or asian families that practice catholocism, so the opportunity for the dirty fuggers to prey on these children is slim.

and no, all the girls that were preyed on were not from broken homes, with no mae role models. this is just a conclusion jumped to by yourself, as the identities of all those involved is not known.

you cannot sit there and tell me they had no coloured of whatever ethnicity) friends that could have been plied???"

so did they ply Polish, French, Lithuanian, Welsh, Scottish, English? There is more than one kind of white.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"But also one of the men cannot be named as he is requesting political asylum. To me his crime should make his claim void and he should be deported"

ABSOLUTELY AGREE commit crime within out country and you should then NOT be entitled to any protection and be deported.....SIMPLES

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"What has surprised me is there is still a lot of pussy footying around this: why aren't they called what they are, peodophiles.

It's all well bringing race into it, but let's not forget all races are capable of this and some women too...remember Vanessa George?

These acts are henious - I'm in no way shape or form excusing these men for what they've done, but I have to ask - where on earth were the parents/guardians?!!

These children weren't dragged off the street and assaulted once, but it was a continued and sustained attack with this group of peodphiles. How can you not know where a 13 year old is?!!

I really feel for these children, betrayed by those that were supposed to look out for them, the police and these awful men who they mistakenly thought were their friends."

It is a very interesting point...if you look on the press reporting of certain crimes then the background of the victims affects the reporting of the case. If they are black or white working class and under 16 the word pedophile is rarely used.

There was an infamous article in th Daily Fail where two 12 yr black girls gang raped in a park were described as "lolitas"

Why this should be, i couldnt say

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" to say white girls are easier to ply with whatever is arse.

To say it was racially motivated is like saying the Catholic priests in Ireland who sexually abused altar boys racially targeted white boys.

your argument doesnt hold water, as there arent many black or asian families that practice catholocism, so the opportunity for the dirty fuggers to prey on these children is slim.

and no, all the girls that were preyed on were not from broken homes, with no mae role models. this is just a conclusion jumped to by yourself, as the identities of all those involved is not known.

you cannot sit there and tell me they had no coloured of whatever ethnicity) friends that could have been plied???

so did they ply Polish, French, Lithuanian, Welsh, Scottish, English? There is more than one kind of white."

were getting away from the simple fact these UNDERAGE girls were raped and abused....nationality is secondary as is religeon....THEY and thier needs should come FIRST

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I said they target girls from broken homes, no male role models etc. I didn't say every single girl fitted that description.

i know plenty of asian girls that drink and smoke but at home there respectable muslim girls and im from a northern town so race was definatly a motive.

im also mixed race from a single parent family how in any way does this make me vulnerable.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is an odd one.

According .........There is a lot of 'grooming' of white girls going on because there are a lot of white girls on the streets, whereas there are far fewer 'asian' girls (by which I mean muslim, as opposed to sihk, hindu, buddist, or any of the other miriad racial and national groups existing in Asia).

.........situation............"

And these stats can be sourced where?

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"I said they target girls from broken homes, no male role models etc. I didn't say every single girl fitted that description.

i know plenty of asian girls that drink and smoke but at home there respectable muslim girls and im from a northern town so race was definatly a motive.

im also mixed race from a single parent family how in any way does this make me vulnerable.

no because you are not in the age group the men preyed on...

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By *waymanMan
over a year ago

newcastle

"It's not to do with race or religion, but I think their culture is important in relation to this particular crime. An unhealthy attitude to sex, caste, cousin marriages, forced marriages, segregation, double life, disempowered women are all factors.

It's important to mention these things because only by getting to the root of the problem can this sickening behaviour be prevented.

How do you explain the Cornwall case from 2010 then, when a group of men committed almost identical crimes.

White men. So if it's about religion, or the north, or any of those factors, how do you explain the Cornwall case?

It's not about skin colour.

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"But also one of the men cannot be named as he is requesting political asylum. To me his crime should make his claim void and he should be deported"

Not true, which bnp website did u read that on?

One of the men cannot be named for legal reason.. speculating but that is often the case when pedophiles own children need to have their identities protected...

Only one of the men was not British...he will be deported back to Afghanistan when he has served his sentence.

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"What has surprised me is there is still a lot of pussy footying around this: why aren't they called what they are, peodophiles.

It's all well bringing race into it, but let's not forget all races are capable of this and some women too...remember Vanessa George?

These acts are henious - I'm in no way shape or form excusing these men for what they've done, but I have to ask - where on earth were the parents/guardians?!!

These children weren't dragged off the street and assaulted once, but it was a continued and sustained attack with this group of peodphiles. How can you not know where a 13 year old is?!!

I really feel for these children, betrayed by those that were supposed to look out for them, the police and these awful men who they mistakenly thought were their friends.

There was an infamous article in th Daily Fail where two 12 yr black girls gang raped in a park were described as "lolitas"

Why this should be, i couldnt say

The press narrative of this story is shaping the debate on this case.

I met with a very interesting young woman a couple of months ago. She and her friends had been groomed, repeatedly used as sexual currency, gang raped and when the man she thought loved her asked her to look after his gun (used in a crime) she was the one imprisoned. She us black and so were the gang she was used by. Her vulnerability was known but she didn't the support and help she needed until she left prison. She is a very powerful role model to other young black women now on how to get self respect and say no to these men.

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"What has surprised me is there is still a lot of pussy footying around this: why aren't they called what they are, peodophiles.

It's all well bringing race into it, but let's not forget all races are capable of this and some women too...remember Vanessa George?

These acts are henious - I'm in no way shape or form excusing these men for what they've done, but I have to ask - where on earth were the parents/guardians?!!

These children weren't dragged off the street and assaulted once, but it was a continued and sustained attack with this group of peodphiles. How can you not know where a 13 year old is?!!

I really feel for these children, betrayed by those that were supposed to look out for them, the police and these awful men who they mistakenly thought were their friends.

There was an infamous article in th Daily Fail where two 12 yr black girls gang raped in a park were described as "lolitas"

Why this should be, i couldnt say

The press narrative of this story is shaping the debate on this case.

The narrative of what a surviour of abuse should act like, and look like is still a very powerful one.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm sure many people will draw parallels between the race of the perpetrators and the race of the victims but I'd bet a months wages that these men would be as equally vicious to women of their own culture and race. Picking white girls who were so far removed from their own sphere of society simply made it easier for them to operate. It wasn't because the girls were white. Nor because the perps were Asian.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's important to mention these things because only by getting to the root of the problem can this sickening behaviour be prevented.

How do you explain the Cornwall case from 2010 then, when a group of men committed almost identical crimes.

White men. So if it's about religion, or the north, or any of those factors, how do you explain the Cornwall case?

It's not about skin colour."

No but a large prcentage of this sort of crime is commited by muslim males which number less than 9% of the UK popultion.It may not be race motivated but it seems to be less frowned upon by certain sectors of the population.

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By *waymanMan
over a year ago

newcastle

"I'm sure many people will draw parallels between the race of the perpetrators and the race of the victims but I'd bet a months wages that these men would be as equally vicious to women of their own culture and race. Picking white girls who were so far removed from their own sphere of society simply made it easier for them to operate. It wasn't because the girls were white. Nor because the perps were Asian."

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

succinctly put.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's important to mention these things because only by getting to the root of the problem can this sickening behaviour be prevented.

How do you explain the Cornwall case from 2010 then, when a group of men committed almost identical crimes.

White men. So if it's about religion, or the north, or any of those factors, how do you explain the Cornwall case?

It's not about skin colour.

one thing they certainly cannot claim is being Muslim. This kind of activity is impossible for a muslim. Muslim is not a race, it is a choice of a way of life. Nor is it a synomym of Arabic, Eastern or Asian.

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By *am sampsonMan
over a year ago

cwmbran

It's not about skin colour.

It's actually more like 2%

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By *waymanMan
over a year ago

newcastle

It's important to mention these things because only by getting to the root of the problem can this sickening behaviour be prevented.

How do you explain the Cornwall case from 2010 then, when a group of men committed almost identical crimes.

White men. So if it's about religion, or the north, or any of those factors, how do you explain the Cornwall case?

It's not about skin colour.

Here's what the researchers most people seem to be quoting had to say about this;

"There have been so few investigations of large offending groups that a few cases involving big non-Asian groups could easily shift these offender profiles in a whole new direction. Whether this happens or not remains to be seen, but entrenched stereotypes have a nasty habit of persisting, even when the evidence moves on."

In other words, if the police start catching white guys, (and there may be reasons why the police catch more Asian than white guys that have nothing to do with the incidence of offending) then the patchy, unreliable, badly put together stats may change dramatically.

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By *ixson-BallsMan
over a year ago

Blackpool

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been paedophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

i agree entirely with this statement

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Here's what the researchers most people seem to be quoting had to say about this;

Thank you! I was just looking it up to post. And for the Cornwall case reminder.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been paedophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

i agree entirely with this statement "

Hold on, you agree that this is a gender issue rather than a race issue..........

are you saying that it is somehow more acceptable for boys to be raped than for girls?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Castrate them all"

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been paedophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

i agree entirely with this statement

Hold on, you agree that this is a gender issue rather than a race issue..........

are you saying that it is somehow more acceptable for boys to be raped than for girls?"

It is never acceptable for any gender to be raped but in this case I believe gender is the major factor. The incidence of male violence towards others (sexual and otherwise) is greater than that of female violence. Although it has been interesting to see the shifting patterns in recent years and the realisation that it is acceptable for men to talk about their abuse experiences there still remains a power dynamic which is gender biased to men.

The citing of secular and religious abuse of young people again speaks of a power dynamic, where the child (boys or girls) is denied a voice, because the power sits with a (mainly) male 'leader'.

Before I get shot down on this, I do not dismiss the complicit role that some women play in this. The turning a blind eye, refusing to believe the reported abuse and the 'seeing but not knowing' is just as bad as those women who take a more active and participative approach.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

People like these fear retribution for commiting the same crimes within their own community. Simple as. They would get chopped up, infront of the families who they have done this too.

I don't advocate this type of vigliantism or violence but let them hand them to BNP EDL or whoever, let them sort these people out.

I'm disgusted with this kind of shit surfacing, ruining and tarring the real asians who have worked hard to gain a standing in this country.

Is it targeted racism, in my opinion it is. Yes I'm Indian and I'm disgusted and embarrassed. I feel for the families of these poor girls. These girls WERE targeted for being white. Somebody needs to stand up and say it exactly how it is, not shy away.

Scum like these need to be made an example of, but having read of how the 'prison inmate' law exists, their time will come.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"People like these fear retribution for commiting the same crimes within their own community. Simple as. They would get chopped up, infront of the families who they have done this too.

I don't advocate this type of vigliantism or violence but let them hand them to BNP EDL or whoever, let them sort these people out.

I'm disgusted with this kind of shit surfacing, ruining and tarring the real asians who have worked hard to gain a standing in this country.

Scum like these need to be made an example of, but having read of how the 'prison inmate' law exists, their time will come.

If it transpired that these guys belonged to some ultra-hardline Muslim extremist group who had been told to go out and target young white girls then yes, it would racist.

This group of men targetted white girls simply because they could carry on with their lives within the Asian community to which they belonged believing that their crimes would never reach their families, friends and religious leaders.

They knew full well that if they'd targetted girls from their own community the risk of discovery was far greater, and the risk of retribution at the hands of their own community even greater.

The girls weren't targetted BECAUSE they were white, but being white made it far easier for them to go about their perverted business.

As for handing them over the the EDL/BNP etc.. as far as I'm aware, those groups do not mete out British justice, our courts do that, and that's exactly what these men have got.

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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago

Kidderminster+ surrounding areas.

how would the sharia law (which most muslim activists seem to demand in this country)treat to sentence these paedophile perverts?.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"how would the sharia law (which most muslim activists seem to demand in this country)treat to sentence these paedophile perverts?."

Irrelevant. They are subject to British Law and that's how it should stay.

All this talk of EDL dealing with, or Sharia law dealing with places it firmly back as a race issue. It isn't, please don't make it appear so as I'm satisfied that both the Asian community in Britain and the British people believe these paedophiles were tried and convicted for exactly what they were - perverts.

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"how would the sharia law (which most muslim activists seem to demand in this country)treat to sentence these paedophile perverts?."

Most muslim activists demand sharia...any proof of that?

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"how would the sharia law (which most muslim activists seem to demand in this country)treat to sentence these paedophile perverts?.

Irrelevant. They are subject to British Law and that's how it should stay.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

race did come into it tho, the police knew for years what was happening but in the interest in good racial relations in the area they let it carry on, had they been white guys the cops would have closed in on them years ago

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

The judge said there were very definatly racial elements to the case and that is good enough for me... There are some parts of the case that questions need to be answered...

Why did greater Manchester police believe there was not case to answer after getting the complaint from victim no.1! Irony being it was the elements of the CRE that managed to get the police to finally reopen the case

Also how did nick Griffen managed to tweet the verdict of the trial exactly how it panned out before it was announced.. It is a question the judge also wanted to know

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/05/12 17:40:44]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Who really gives a toss about anything Griffin says. One of the 9 men convicted fathered a child by one of his 13y/o victims. How much more proof is needed that these men were, at the very least, having sex with underage girls, but it has now been proven that they WERE targetting young girls for sexploitation and trafficking.

I'm glad the Judge in this case has repeatedly ignored all the references to the men's race and stuck to his guns and sentenced them as hard as the law allowed him to. He even praised the jury for the painstaking and fair manner they had conducted themselves.

That's good enough for me and now the prison population have 9 new shower bitches to play with. If they last that long.

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By *acreadCouple
over a year ago

central scotland

A lawyer for at least one of the men is already playing the race card on a planned appeal, no surprises there then watch how many more appeal on racist grounds as it seems to be the easy way to squirm out of a conviction/punishment

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

Well technically what griffin did was almost cause a mistrial.. Which would have been the ultimate irony, but the suggestion is someone on the jury was in contact with him

The other baffling bit is that greater Manchester police are being allowed to conduct there own Inquiry where it would normally be the ipcc who would do it

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By *acreadCouple
over a year ago

central scotland

Google Kris Donald murder and you will see how police are reluctant to arrest young Asian men for fear of accusations of racism and how the appeasment can lead to real tragedy.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Once again I find myself asking the same question. . . . . .

Where were the parents when this was going on?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"One of the 9 men convicted fathered a child by one of his 13y/o victims. How much more proof is needed that these men were, at the very least, having sex with underage girls"

the worrying thing about that is, if hes got her pregnant they are not using protection, as you would expect them not to in cases like this, getting a 13 year old girl pregnant is bad enough but think what else they could have been spreading round those children

it is abuse in the worse possible way

targeting childen in care, young girls from broken homes, children who are probably looking for someone to love them, you can imagine them being nice to the girls, buying them gifts and earning their trust only to pull it all away from them when their real reasons for befriending them came out

it really makes your heart sink to know that humanily at its lowest still exists, and thats what they are humans at their lowest

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

You are better looking at why the police routinely dismiss the word of girls and women from all ethnic groups if they do not fit into a nice easy group...drink, take drugs, work on the street and you have no chance of getting a rape complaint taken seriously.

The police didnt ignore this case because of the background of the abusers, but because of the backgrounds of the victims.

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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago

Kidderminster+ surrounding areas.

wasn't the same thing happening in leicester??.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"race did come into it tho, the police knew for years what was happening but in the interest in good racial relations in the area they let it carry on, had they been white guys the cops would have closed in on them years ago"

I find it very difficult to believe that Greater Manchester Police would have turned a blind eye to the systematic abuse of young girls because it was an Asian gang committing the abuse. I'd like to evidence of this claim.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A very similar case was in Shropshire too - same thing very young white girls targetted by a gang of non white men

There was a mis-trial so waiting to come back to court

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By *ezebelWoman
over a year ago

North of The Wall - youll need your vest

The police didnt ignore this case because of the background of the abusers, but because of the backgrounds of the victims."

Absolutely.

Although my understanding is that it was the Crown Prosecution Service that declined to take further action, rather than the Police?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

haha well im sorry but im just a nobody on a sex site so i dont have any evidance of a anything

I just remember something about it being on the news about a year or so ago where a 'spokes man' said they had been reluctant till now to close in on the claims in fear of starting a race war in the comunity, but there had been several allegations made over the past couple of years that had not been acted on

Maybe i was dreaming who knows lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

they didnt know about the systematic abuse that was going on!!!

They knew about one 13yr old girl in 2008 but droppf the case because she wouldn't have made a good witness! (being fed dope and vodka by the gang)! The police have since apologised to her and investigating why it was dropped!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"A very similar case was in Shropshire too - same thing very young white girls targetted by a gang of non white men

There was a mis-trial so waiting to come back to court "

They were also Pakistani.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have no idea what the Rochdale incident is beyond what I can glean from what is written here, but I would bet that the complete ignorance that most English people have of cultures other than their own has played a part in it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I have no idea what the Rochdale incident is beyond what I can glean from what is written here, but I would bet that the complete ignorance that most English people have of cultures other than their own has played a part in it."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

so tell me in what culture is it ok to drug and rape kids?

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

Sometimes it is better to keep your mouth shut than open it and prove you are a fool.

What culture thinks it is ok to gang rape a 13 and get her pregnant

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

unbelievable!!!! Have you trif reading the above posts??

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What culture thinks it is ok to gang rape a 13 and get her pregnant

if there is one im glad im ignorant of it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/05/12 18:33:06]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi."

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi."

her names Phoolan Devi and i fail to see what shes got to do with this case??

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"What culture thinks it is ok to gang rape a 13 and get her pregnant

if there is one im glad im ignorant of it

im just amazed someone can read no newspapers, not listen to the radio, not watch tv news, yet feel able to blame the victims of these horrific crimes...truly astounded.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!"

aww you beat me lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls"

You completely miss my point.

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By *iss_tressWoman
over a year ago

London

The police didnt ignore this case because of the background of the abusers, but because of the backgrounds of the victims."

That's what's so, so sad.

These children let down and abused.by all just because.they came from troubled backgrounds.

I doubt it will change anytime soon.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"These particular people are rapists AND racists in my opinion. "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"but wasnt this actually racially motivated.. ie they picked white girls??

its disgusting whatever the race.. but not sure why it should be ignored when it was part of it.

Cali "

Al lot of it is due to the fact that inlike young lady's of there own race corcasion lady's dress differently and are more self aware

My own personal view is whatever race or creed these type of twisted people are it costs an average of £2000 per week to keep them in prison with there TVs and everything else but I have an idea a 7.6 mm copper jacket bullet costs just £4.50 and I won't even charge a fee for my travel or use of rifle to do what I enjoy dispatching vermin !!

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi.

her names Phoolan Devi and i fail to see what shes got to do with this case??"

i am very confused too, unless they mean to take a class based analysis of the cases, which i think there is some kind of validity for doing...comparing her position as a dacoit with the perceived underclass the girls were put in...and their exploitation by people of higher socio economic standing.

Marxist analysis on fab well i never

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi.

her names Phoolan Devi and i fail to see what shes got to do with this case??"

Of course you do!

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point. "

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

aww you beat me lol"

I'm making no point other than the fact that the English are so ignorant of other cultures. Mind you, I am a racist in the true sense of the word in that after having travelled in India twenty times, on each occasion for at least three months, I have come to the conclusion that Indians are innately more intelligent than the poor old English, most of whom have difficulty correctly spelling simple words in their own language despite having gone to school for at least eleven years.

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

The police didnt ignore this case because of the background of the abusers, but because of the backgrounds of the victims.

That's what's so, so sad.

These children let down and abused.by all just because.they came from troubled backgrounds.

I doubt it will change anytime soon."

sadly i agree, we still live in a world where one third of the population believe how a woman dresses means she should take the blame for being attacked

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8515592.stm

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi.

her names Phoolan Devi and i fail to see what shes got to do with this case??

Of course you do!

no i really dont

Phoolan Devi was a woman who was gang raped who fought out to get her rapists and to help other victims of rape, so how is your post saying its because we dont understand the culture of these guys that makes us not understand the crime understandable when a woman from the same culture of these men fought against this sort of crime too, i just dont see using her is a good example to argue your case

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?"

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

aww you beat me lol

What knowledge or understanding of other cultures is needed to know raping children is wrong...you still haven't answered the question.

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!"

because you cannot defend your comment?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi.

her names Phoolan Devi and i fail to see what shes got to do with this case??

Of course you do!

no i really dont

A typing error. It should have read 'of course you don't" and indeed I was clearly right.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

aww you beat me lol"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!

because you cannot defend your comment?"

Ha ha, if that's what you would like to think. By the way, I shall be in India over the winter, where I look forward to having more intelligent conversations with rickshaw drivers in Calcutta than I can here. Perhaps you'd like to join me?

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi.

her names Phoolan Devi and i fail to see what shes got to do with this case??

Of course you do!

no i really dont

She isn't from the same cultural background. She is an untouchable from India. Strange the poster was has a bee in their bonnet about cultural understanding yet doesn't seem to know the difference between Hindu and Muslim, India and Pakistan.

Btw NN what exactly is her case as I am extremely confused by her derail?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

aww you beat me lol

Or mis spelling the name of a person say??

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

aww you beat me lol

What knowledge or understanding of other cultures is needed to know raping children is wrong...you still haven't answered the question.

Well you'd have to have travelled extensively to understand.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/05/12 18:50:12]

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!

because you cannot defend your comment?

Will you please explain why the failure of the girls to have your deep understanding of other cultures led to their abuse. Its a simple question.

i dont use rickshaws, they are responsible for terrible deformities and injuries, and prefer Dehli to Calcutta.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/05/12 18:51:18]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

aww you beat me lol

Or mis spelling the name of a person say??"

Yes, yes, I can't really be bothered to go into explanations involving the differences between Hindi, Bihari, Bengali etc.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A typing error. It should have read 'of course you don't" and indeed I was clearly right."

so explain it then, if a indian woman does not understand her own culture and has to take matters into her own hands to fight against sex crime why should i understand that its ok?

I dont need to understand cultures of other people i need to understand laws of my own country, and no matter whats ok anywhere else sex with 13 year old girls and rape is not legal in this country and thats all that matter

you follow the laws of the country you live in

3rd time lucky with the typos lol

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

aww you beat me lol

What knowledge or understanding of other cultures is needed to know raping children is wrong...you still haven't answered the question.

Well you'd have to have travelled extensively to understand."

Good, 10 years living in Taiwan, not visiting, living, learning the language, the only white face in a city of 1 million...vacations taken over a variety of countries and frequent visits to India where our best friends live...

Try to enlighten me...

My question again...

Girls were drugged, raped, given alcohol, one girl spoke in court of being raped whilst she was vomiting ...

The Muslim community, even some of the mens own families have condemned them, Imams have spoken against the,...

But you say its down to a lack of cultural understanding....

So please enlighten us all.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

aww you beat me lol

Or mis spelling the name of a person say??

Yes, yes, I can't really be bothered to go into explanations involving the differences between Hindi, Bihari, Bengali etc."

must be true what they say eh!

Ignorance must truly be bliss!!

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By *U1966Man
over a year ago

Devon

Racist attack by group of sick bastards who should be strung up they will be asking to serve their sentences in their own countries where the can secure their release for money

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!

because you cannot defend your comment?

A miracle will need to be performed them as they were banned in 2006 when ‘The state's top politician calls it inhumane. Others call it a lingering symbol of colonial oppression. In modern India, advocates of the ban say, no man should have to bear another man practically on his back. After all, the Communists in China eliminated this mode of transport soon after assuming power more than 50 years ago, criticizing it as primitive and demeaning.”

Sounds like a little bit of the Walter Mitty in you to me.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Racist attack by group of sick bastards who should be strung up they will be asking to serve their sentences in their own countries where the can secure their release for money "

I think they are better classed as pedofiles and hope they receive what they all receive inside prison.

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!

because you cannot defend your comment?

Sounds like a little bit of the Walter Mitty in you to me.

i did wonder, but thought it may have been a Dehli state law,and would nevr call another poster a liar

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi.

her names Phoolan Devi and i fail to see what shes got to do with this case??

Of course you do!

no i really dont

Btw NN what exactly is her case as I am extremely confused by her derail?"

I know fully the difference between India and Pakistan having been to the latter country as well as the former.I could also tell you not only the difference between the Sunnis and the Shiites, but about sects such as the Hanafis and the Ismaelis whom you will find living in the Hunza valley which is in Pakistan to the north of Gilgit.

Incidentally, there are a hundred million Moslems in India and the Wahabbi sect to which Osama bin Laden belongs had its beginnings in Hyderabad which is in the southern Indian state of Andhara Pradesh.

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By *ezebelWoman
over a year ago

North of The Wall - youll need your vest

I love a good pissing contest

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!

because you cannot defend your comment?

Sounds like a little bit of the Walter Mitty in you to me.

i did wonder, but thought it may have been a Dehli state law,and would nevr call another poster a liar

There are three types of rickshaw. One is pulled by a man. This is now uncommon in India except in Calcutta and a few other places. One is pulled by a man on a bicycle. This is common everywhere in India. One, called 'auto rickshaws" are similar to what in Thailand they call 'tuk tuks'. The law to which you are referring concerns only the first type of rickshaw.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi.

her names Phoolan Devi and i fail to see what shes got to do with this case??

Of course you do!

no i really dont

Btw NN what exactly is her case as I am extremely confused by her derail?

Not too bad! Only quarter an hour to google all that!! Do you have the new intel core processor perchance?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I love a good pissing contest

Just out of interest, how high can u piss?

(all in the aid of good healthy fun, you understand........)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What I would say is that yes this is a most deplorable sequence of events and I am thankful the people responsible have been delt justice by the legal system but I would also pose the following

As these poor young lady's come from the broken home syndrome would it not be a logical question as to why the parents or responsible and I use the term very loosely adults in charge of there care fail miserably to protect and care for them. I myself have four children now grown and fled the nest all but one and for one my children would never be out at that age unsupervised I know for a certainty if my child were to come into the home in drink disheveled or under the influence of drugs and not in control of there faculties I would notice

Also would this not be accompanied by quietness withdrawn altered personality which should of highlighted a problem to be investigated

If and I'm not sure so will not quote the lady's were under government control ie home or social worker care. Do we not need as a populas urgently need to demand changes to prevent this happening again.

Now for the men in question and I use the term very loosely as they are more like an ameba a parasitic organism that needs to be eradicated yea they have been tried but now this will cost we the British public White black Asian yellow pink green whatever Colot £2000 per

week to keep each one in languished comfort in a sex offenders wing where they will have access to train an corrupt others.

Why not spend £4.50 on a half decent 7.6mm copper jacket bullet to fit my rifle and I shall attends at my own cost and do what I enjoy dispatching vermin

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

i rather thing the point of the thread is being missed, makes no difference where someone comes from or where anyones been, if you live in a country to live by that countries law, what culture or back ground you come from matters not, so if you rape, pinch or kill you do the time same as everyone else

hows that hard to understand?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What I would say is that yes this is a most deplorable sequence of events and I am thankful the people responsible have been delt justice by the legal system but I would also pose the following

Also would this not be accompanied by quietness withdrawn altered personality which should of highlighted a problem to be investigated

week to keep each one in languished comfort in a sex offenders wing where they will have access to train an corrupt others.

Why not spend £4.50 on a half decent 7.6mm copper jacket bullet to fit my rifle and I shall attends at my own cost and do what I enjoy dispatching vermin

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"i rather thing the point of the thread is being missed, makes no difference where someone comes from or where anyones been, if you live in a country to live by that countries law, what culture or back ground you come from matters not, so if you rape, pinch or kill you do the time same as everyone else

hows that hard to understand?"

It isn't. Why did you assume I disagreed with you?

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

hows that hard to understand?

It isn't. Why did you assume I disagreed with you?

your opening post

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!

because you cannot defend your comment?

Sounds like a little bit of the Walter Mitty in you to me.

i did wonder, but thought it may have been a Dehli state law,and would nevr call another poster a liar

You still havnt answered my question?

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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago

Kidderminster+ surrounding areas.

"how would the sharia law (which most muslim activists seem to demand in this country)treat to sentence these paedophile perverts?.

Most muslim activists demand sharia...any proof of that?"

check out

bbc asian news uk

16th jan-2012

the growing use of sharia by uk muslims by divya dilwar

also in london oct 31st 2009 a big rally by muslims called islam 4 uk marching in our capital city of london calling for sharia law.

also traffic stopped by muslim marchers,on oxford street london by muslim males,women & children.

march 25th 2011

news probably never reached your neck of the woods?.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

hows that hard to understand?

It isn't. Why did you assume I disagreed with you?

well to be honest your first post did make you come over as doing so, by saying it was our lack of cultural understanding that played a part in it

i would never dream of using someone culture to excuse or blame anyone for anything, we are all people with thinking brains, we make our choices we live with the consequences

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I love a good pissing contest

Mines bigger than yours

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is a gender issue. Race is a factor in this particular case only because the 'gang' are Asian. There have been peadophile rings of white men. There have been internet rings of all races.

Cases of this happen in the Asian community to their own young women are often not reported. Very often the girl is blamed and sent off to a foreign country to marry a man much older than her.

Work with abused women and children and you will see all races, all classes and all ages affected.

Gender not race is the over-riding factor here.

I suggest that you read something about Phoona Devi.

her names Phoolan Devi and i fail to see what shes got to do with this case??

Of course you do!

no i really dont

Btw NN what exactly is her case as I am extremely confused by her derail?

Not too bad! Only quarter an hour to google all that!! Do you have the new intel core processor perchance?

I don't even know what that is!!. I have spent much of my life travelling mostly in Asia, but also in South America .India and Nepal I know best, but I travelled in Pakistan in 1989 from Karachi up to the north and over the Khunjerab Pass and into what they used to call Chinese Turkestan.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

hows that hard to understand?

It isn't. Why did you assume I disagreed with you?

well to be honest your first post did make you come over as doing so, by saying it was our lack of cultural understanding that played a part in it

i would never dream of using someone culture to excuse or blame anyone for anything, we are all people with thinking brains, we make our choices we live with the consequences"

Well if a single woman travelled among people who practice Tibetan Buddhism, such as the Tibetans themselves, or the Sherpas, she would find the experience very different to travelling among people who practice Islam such as the Baluchis in southern Pakistan.

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

hows that hard to understand?

It isn't. Why did you assume I disagreed with you?

well to be honest your first post did make you come over as doing so, by saying it was our lack of cultural understanding that played a part in it

i would never dream of using someone culture to excuse or blame anyone for anything, we are all people with thinking brains, we make our choices we live with the consequences"

To say a persons culture plays a part in them committing rape is racist in the extreme.

A man or woman chooses to abuse another, under sharia law, since it has come up, sexual offences against children are considered an offence against god, the highest class of crimes. There is no cultural , racial or religious excuse for their crimes.

Although i have to agree with nice, these men were no more muslims than Nick Griffin is a Christian.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!

because you cannot defend your comment?

Sounds like a little bit of the Walter Mitty in you to me.

i did wonder, but thought it may have been a Dehli state law,and would nevr call another poster a liar

You still havnt answered my question?"

I've forgotten your question and my very English dinner of beef braised in Mackeson is ready .

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

hows that hard to understand?

It isn't. Why did you assume I disagreed with you?

well to be honest your first post did make you come over as doing so, by saying it was our lack of cultural understanding that played a part in it

i would never dream of using someone culture to excuse or blame anyone for anything, we are all people with thinking brains, we make our choices we live with the consequences

Possibly true...tibetan buddhist monks kept asking me for sex

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

if you live in England you live by the laws of England, if its ok to have sex with a 13 year old girl in some counties that does not mean its ok to come here and have sex with 13 year old girls

You completely miss my point.

so what was your point othet than to blame the victims?

What? I can see it's not worth discussing this matter with you!

because you cannot defend your comment?

Sounds like a little bit of the Walter Mitty in you to me.

i did wonder, but thought it may have been a Dehli state law,and would nevr call another poster a liar

You still havnt answered my question?

I've forgotten your question and my very English dinner of beef braised in Mackeson is ready ."

Dont worry the dog whistle in your last post said what i already suspected.

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By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay

Never mind.....the thread will have run it's course soon

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Maybe you should read the news, or at least try and find out what we're talking about before jumping in with such a crass statement.

So, let's apply your logic shall we. The Rochdale incident is an event that took place where 9 asian men targetted and sexually abused dozens of underage white English girls after plying them with drink and drugs because... English people are completely ignorant of other cultures? Doesn't stack up does it.

Try bbc.co.uk/news

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

your point being?? And its PHOOLAN devi!!

aww you beat me lol

What knowledge or understanding of other cultures is needed to know raping children is wrong...you still haven't answered the question.

Well you'd have to have travelled extensively to understand.

Try to enlighten me...

My question again...

Girls were drugged, raped, given alcohol, one girl spoke in court of being raped whilst she was vomiting ...

The Muslim community, even some of the mens own families have condemned them, Imams have spoken against the,...

But you say its down to a lack of cultural understanding....

So please enlighten us all."

Right well think hoicking which the Chinese do even better than the Indians (and that's really saying something) or the concept of 'losing face" and perhaps you might get an inkling of what I am talking about.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

this thing has being going on in this country for years asian men have no respect for white woman and will continue to abuse them

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By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay

"this thing has being going on in this country for years asian men have no respect for white woman and will continue to abuse them"

Is that...

(a) Some asian men or....

(b) All asian men?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Maybe you should read the news, or at least try and find out what we're talking about before jumping in with such a crass statement.

Try bbc.co.uk/news

No I'm not interested in the BBC news. It's as full of propaganda as the Chinese Peoples' Daily. And your post makes it transparently clear that your frame of reference is too limited to understand what I am saying.Perhaps you might like to read what I've said about single women travelling among various Asian peoples.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"this thing has being going on in this country for years asian men have no respect for white woman and will continue to abuse them"

Precisely.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"this thing has being going on in this country for years asian men have no respect for white woman and will continue to abuse them"

Is that a fact Carol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Maybe you should read the news, or at least try and find out what we're talking about before jumping in with such a crass statement.

Try bbc.co.uk/news

What has single women travelling amongstr various asian people got to do with 9 perverts in Rochdale raping dozens of 11-15y/o English girls?

Was it their fault for travelling alone with them?

If you think it's in anyway excusable because 'thats what they do in Nepal' then you have a very loose grip on morality.

No means No, and underage sex is illegal. On top of that, drugging and trafficking ANY woman for sex is also illegal.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"this thing has being going on in this country for years asian men have no respect for white woman and will continue to abuse them

Is that...

(a) Some asian men or....

(b) All asian men?"

Ask any attractive young Western woman who has travelled in India or Pakistan. Then ask any attractive young Western woman who has travelled in Tibet and Nepal.

'Asian". What a stupid term.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"this thing has being going on in this country for years asian men have no respect for white woman and will continue to abuse them

Is that...

(a) Some asian men or....

(b) All asian men?

Ask any attractive young Western woman who has travelled in India or Pakistan. Then ask any attractive young Western woman who has travelled in Tibet and Nepal.

'Asian". What a stupid term.

Um... what continent are India, Pakistan, Tibet and Nepal on?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Maybe you should read the news, or at least try and find out what we're talking about before jumping in with such a crass statement.

Try bbc.co.uk/news

What has single women travelling amongstr various asian people got to do with 9 perverts in Rochdale raping dozens of 11-15y/o English girls?

Was it their fault for travelling alone with them?

If you think it's in anyway excusable because 'thats what they do in Nepal' then you have a very loose grip on morality.

No means No, and underage sex is illegal. On top of that, drugging and trafficking ANY woman for sex is also illegal. "

You are demonstrating your ignorance of several cultures here. Any attractive young Western woman who has travelled in Nepal would tell you that it is a safe country for women.

When you use that stupid term 'Asian" I assume you mean Indians, Pakistanis and Bangladeshis (though not perhaps, Sri Lankese.. Any attractive young Western woman would tell you that India is reasonably safe for women providing they exercise caution and, for example, avoid eye contact with Indian men because this is considered a "come on", but that Pakistan and Bangladesh most certainly aren't.

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By *b430Man
over a year ago

Tayside

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