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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. " Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? " Race and income are not comparable A private landlord should have the right to rent their property to whomever they do or do not want. The issue we have is the lack of affordable housing in general. | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? " Why would race come into it? That’s a whole different subject! Race wouldn’t have even crossed my mind. Credit status, income and affordability did though. | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? Race and income are not comparable A private landlord should have the right to rent their property to whomever they do or do not want. The issue we have is the lack of affordable housing in general. " Private landlords can't rent their property to whoever they want. They can't refuse to rent to people on the basis of race, sex, sexuality, disability etc. The argument is whether they should be similarly not allowed to refuse to rent to people on the basis of their benefit status | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? Race and income are not comparable A private landlord should have the right to rent their property to whomever they do or do not want. The issue we have is the lack of affordable housing in general. Private landlords can't rent their property to whoever they want. They can't refuse to rent to people on the basis of race, sex, sexuality, disability etc. The argument is whether they should be similarly not allowed to refuse to rent to people on the basis of their benefit status " Fair enough, I should have stipulated they are rightly restricted by the equalities act. I personally dont think benefit status/income level should also be included on the list though | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? Why would race come into it? That’s a whole different subject! Race wouldn’t have even crossed my mind. Credit status, income and affordability did though. " Because you said people should be able to choose who lives in a house they own. I'm pointing out that landlords don't in fact have that right. A white landlord can't choose not to have black tenants. It's a discussion about discrimination. There are a number of groups landlords can't discriminate against, the argument is whether that should be extended to people on benefits. | |||
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"Lenders on BTL mortgages can stipulate no DSS tenants or letting to family members etc. If tenants are working but getting top ups tax/universal credit, then getting a guarantor will help. " That was discussed yesterday on the R 4 show I listened to and apparently very few lenders stipulate that nowadays. The landlords came out with some pretty weak excuses as to why they barred DSS I thought. | |||
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"Lenders on BTL mortgages can stipulate no DSS tenants or letting to family members etc. If tenants are working but getting top ups tax/universal credit, then getting a guarantor will help. That was discussed yesterday on the R 4 show I listened to and apparently very few lenders stipulate that nowadays. The landlords came out with some pretty weak excuses as to why they barred DSS I thought. " As I understand it, in the old days the local authority would pay housing benefit direct to landlords so in many ways people in receipt of HB were good bets for landlords as they were guaranteed an income stream. I believe the Cameron government changed the law to pay HB direct to tenants in order to "teach them responsibility", not surprisingly some tenants were not responsible thus making the income stream for landlords more uncertain. | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? Why would race come into it? That’s a whole different subject! Race wouldn’t have even crossed my mind. Credit status, income and affordability did though. Because you said people should be able to choose who lives in a house they own. I'm pointing out that landlords don't in fact have that right. A white landlord can't choose not to have black tenants. It's a discussion about discrimination. There are a number of groups landlords can't discriminate against, the argument is whether that should be extended to people on benefits. " It’s a discussion about whether people should be able to choose to rent to DSS or not. Wtf has race got to do with it! | |||
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"Lenders on BTL mortgages can stipulate no DSS tenants or letting to family members etc. If tenants are working but getting top ups tax/universal credit, then getting a guarantor will help. That was discussed yesterday on the R 4 show I listened to and apparently very few lenders stipulate that nowadays. The landlords came out with some pretty weak excuses as to why they barred DSS I thought. As I understand it, in the old days the local authority would pay housing benefit direct to landlords so in many ways people in receipt of HB were good bets for landlords as they were guaranteed an income stream. I believe the Cameron government changed the law to pay HB direct to tenants in order to "teach them responsibility", not surprisingly some tenants were not responsible thus making the income stream for landlords more uncertain. You are correct I have had dss tenant in the past and it was a safe bet but not now " | |||
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"Lenders on BTL mortgages can stipulate no DSS tenants or letting to family members etc. If tenants are working but getting top ups tax/universal credit, then getting a guarantor will help. That was discussed yesterday on the R 4 show I listened to and apparently very few lenders stipulate that nowadays. The landlords came out with some pretty weak excuses as to why they barred DSS I thought. As I understand it, in the old days the local authority would pay housing benefit direct to landlords so in many ways people in receipt of HB were good bets for landlords as they were guaranteed an income stream. I believe the Cameron government changed the law to pay HB direct to tenants in order to "teach them responsibility", not surprisingly some tenants were not responsible thus making the income stream for landlords more uncertain. " Yes but the argument put forward yesterday was that being a benefit claimant was not an indication of responsibility. People in work were also not paying their rent. | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? Why would race come into it? That’s a whole different subject! Race wouldn’t have even crossed my mind. Credit status, income and affordability did though. Because you said people should be able to choose who lives in a house they own. I'm pointing out that landlords don't in fact have that right. A white landlord can't choose not to have black tenants. It's a discussion about discrimination. There are a number of groups landlords can't discriminate against, the argument is whether that should be extended to people on benefits. It’s a discussion about whether people should be able to choose to rent to DSS or not. Wtf has race got to do with it!" Can you really not get the point? You can take two positions on this. 1. Landlords should have complete freedom to rent to whoever they choose and (for example) if racist landlords don't want to rent to black people that's up to them and no one should interfere with a person's right to do what they want with their property. Or 2. Its wrong for landlords to refuse to rent to whole groups of people based on a particular characteristic (like race) and the law should stop them doing that. If you take position 2(as I think most people do) then there's a discussion to be had as to which characteristics landlords should not be permitted to be prejudiced against. You appear to agree that race is something they should not be permitted to take into account. The argument is that benefit status should be like that. | |||
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"Lenders on BTL mortgages can stipulate no DSS tenants or letting to family members etc. If tenants are working but getting top ups tax/universal credit, then getting a guarantor will help. That was discussed yesterday on the R 4 show I listened to and apparently very few lenders stipulate that nowadays. The landlords came out with some pretty weak excuses as to why they barred DSS I thought. As I understand it, in the old days the local authority would pay housing benefit direct to landlords so in many ways people in receipt of HB were good bets for landlords as they were guaranteed an income stream. I believe the Cameron government changed the law to pay HB direct to tenants in order to "teach them responsibility", not surprisingly some tenants were not responsible thus making the income stream for landlords more uncertain. Yes but the argument put forward yesterday was that being a benefit claimant was not an indication of responsibility. People in work were also not paying their rent. " Lots of people try to not pay their rent I have had a solicitor, prison officer and a social worker try to bump me, I had the social worker arrested and charged with 'gaining a pecuniary advantage using a false instrument' he bounced several cheques on me , I laughed all day long after watching him being put in the back of a police van  | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? Why would race come into it? That’s a whole different subject! Race wouldn’t have even crossed my mind. Credit status, income and affordability did though. Because you said people should be able to choose who lives in a house they own. I'm pointing out that landlords don't in fact have that right. A white landlord can't choose not to have black tenants. It's a discussion about discrimination. There are a number of groups landlords can't discriminate against, the argument is whether that should be extended to people on benefits. It’s a discussion about whether people should be able to choose to rent to DSS or not. Wtf has race got to do with it! Can you really not get the point? You can take two positions on this. 1. Landlords should have complete freedom to rent to whoever they choose and (for example) if racist landlords don't want to rent to black people that's up to them and no one should interfere with a person's right to do what they want with their property. Or 2. Its wrong for landlords to refuse to rent to whole groups of people based on a particular characteristic (like race) and the law should stop them doing that. If you take position 2(as I think most people do) then there's a discussion to be had as to which characteristics landlords should not be permitted to be prejudiced against. You appear to agree that race is something they should not be permitted to take into account. The argument is that benefit status should be like that. " I choose tenants on face value regardless of race however I also refuse tenants regardless of race | |||
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"Lenders on BTL mortgages can stipulate no DSS tenants or letting to family members etc. If tenants are working but getting top ups tax/universal credit, then getting a guarantor will help. That was discussed yesterday on the R 4 show I listened to and apparently very few lenders stipulate that nowadays. The landlords came out with some pretty weak excuses as to why they barred DSS I thought. As I understand it, in the old days the local authority would pay housing benefit direct to landlords so in many ways people in receipt of HB were good bets for landlords as they were guaranteed an income stream. I believe the Cameron government changed the law to pay HB direct to tenants in order to "teach them responsibility", not surprisingly some tenants were not responsible thus making the income stream for landlords more uncertain. Yes but the argument put forward yesterday was that being a benefit claimant was not an indication of responsibility. People in work were also not paying their rent. " Indeed, but by definition people on benefits will generally have less money than people in work hence be more likely to have difficulty paying rent. Hence landlords may well be more wary with them which paying HB direct to them would overcome. I agree it's shitty for people on HB. Way to go to stigmatise them. In my view the government should indeed ban discrimination against people on benefit in letting property and to placate landlords reintroduce direct payment to then. | |||
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"The landlord should have the final decision on who he rents to or not simple as that. No different to who you choose to fuck, if you take away peoples choice then its an oppressive society. " As pointed out above, there are already laws that ensure the landlord does not have unfettered choice on who he rents to. | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? Why would race come into it? That’s a whole different subject! Race wouldn’t have even crossed my mind. Credit status, income and affordability did though. Because you said people should be able to choose who lives in a house they own. I'm pointing out that landlords don't in fact have that right. A white landlord can't choose not to have black tenants. It's a discussion about discrimination. There are a number of groups landlords can't discriminate against, the argument is whether that should be extended to people on benefits. It’s a discussion about whether people should be able to choose to rent to DSS or not. Wtf has race got to do with it! Can you really not get the point? You can take two positions on this. 1. Landlords should have complete freedom to rent to whoever they choose and (for example) if racist landlords don't want to rent to black people that's up to them and no one should interfere with a person's right to do what they want with their property. Or 2. Its wrong for landlords to refuse to rent to whole groups of people based on a particular characteristic (like race) and the law should stop them doing that. If you take position 2(as I think most people do) then there's a discussion to be had as to which characteristics landlords should not be permitted to be prejudiced against. You appear to agree that race is something they should not be permitted to take into account. The argument is that benefit status should be like that. " Yes I do get the point. I’m thinking perhaps you don’t. That wasn’t the question. Perhaps you’d like to read the op again. | |||
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"I'm now curious, if landlords should offer rentals to people on DSS, should banks also offer mortgages to people on DSS? " Different point. Its perfectly fine to refuse to rent to or lend money to people who you rationally believe would not be able to pay the rent /repay the loan. That's not the case with people on HB. The state pays their rent. Of course you might get some people on HB who may indeed blow their benefits and not pay their rent and it would be fine not to rent to people you have reason to believe will behave like that. What people object to is the assumption all people on benefits are like that. | |||
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"I employ a letting agents to take care of this. They filter out DSS applicants if you stipulate it when you employ them. I happily let to two DSS tenants and sadly got burned twice and it cost me a lot of money to fix. Why should I take that risk again? " Exactly. Same here so I won’t. My choice. I also “discriminate” against people who have pets and smoke too. | |||
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"I’m unsure about this to be honest. If it’s your house surely it should be your choice who lives in it. Should you be allowed to refuse to rent to people of a certain race? Why would race come into it? That’s a whole different subject! Race wouldn’t have even crossed my mind. Credit status, income and affordability did though. Because you said people should be able to choose who lives in a house they own. I'm pointing out that landlords don't in fact have that right. A white landlord can't choose not to have black tenants. It's a discussion about discrimination. There are a number of groups landlords can't discriminate against, the argument is whether that should be extended to people on benefits. It’s a discussion about whether people should be able to choose to rent to DSS or not. Wtf has race got to do with it! Can you really not get the point? You can take two positions on this. 1. Landlords should have complete freedom to rent to whoever they choose and (for example) if racist landlords don't want to rent to black people that's up to them and no one should interfere with a person's right to do what they want with their property. Or 2. Its wrong for landlords to refuse to rent to whole groups of people based on a particular characteristic (like race) and the law should stop them doing that. If you take position 2(as I think most people do) then there's a discussion to be had as to which characteristics landlords should not be permitted to be prejudiced against. You appear to agree that race is something they should not be permitted to take into account. The argument is that benefit status should be like that. Yes I do get the point. I’m thinking perhaps you don’t. That wasn’t the question. Perhaps you’d like to read the op again. " That's exactly the point. We're agree that you shouldn't have a blanket ban on renting to people of a certain race and not judge them as individuals . The discussion is whether you be permitted to have a blanket ban on people on benefits and not judge them as individuals. | |||
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"I employ a letting agents to take care of this. They filter out DSS applicants if you stipulate it when you employ them. I happily let to two DSS tenants and sadly got burned twice and it cost me a lot of money to fix. Why should I take that risk again? Exactly. Same here so I won’t. My choice. I also “discriminate” against people who have pets and smoke too. " But my dogs are awesome! | |||
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"The landlord should have the final decision on who he rents to or not simple as that. No different to who you choose to fuck, if you take away peoples choice then its an oppressive society. " .....and I wouldn't rent a property to a few of the people we've fucked from here.  | |||
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"I employ a letting agents to take care of this. They filter out DSS applicants if you stipulate it when you employ them. I happily let to two DSS tenants and sadly got burned twice and it cost me a lot of money to fix. Why should I take that risk again? Exactly. Same here so I won’t. My choice. I also “discriminate” against people who have pets and smoke too. But my dogs are awesome! " . So is mine. He’s allowed in there. | |||
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"I'm now curious, if landlords should offer rentals to people on DSS, should banks also offer mortgages to people on DSS? Different point. Its perfectly fine to refuse to rent to or lend money to people who you rationally believe would not be able to pay the rent /repay the loan. That's not the case with people on HB. The state pays their rent. Of course you might get some people on HB who may indeed blow their benefits and not pay their rent and it would be fine not to rent to people you have reason to believe will behave like that. What people object to is the assumption all people on benefits are like that. " As I understand it, in some cases the state doesnt pay all the rent, they contribute towards it, but there is no way for a tennant to specify this distinction. There is therefore still a risk that the tennant can not/ will not pay the difference and therefore a landlord should be able to say no, it's too risky | |||
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"I'm now curious, if landlords should offer rentals to people on DSS, should banks also offer mortgages to people on DSS? Different point. Its perfectly fine to refuse to rent to or lend money to people who you rationally believe would not be able to pay the rent /repay the loan. That's not the case with people on HB. The state pays their rent. Of course you might get some people on HB who may indeed blow their benefits and not pay their rent and it would be fine not to rent to people you have reason to believe will behave like that. What people object to is the assumption all people on benefits are like that. As I understand it, in some cases the state doesnt pay all the rent, they contribute towards it, but there is no way for a tennant to specify this distinction. There is therefore still a risk that the tennant can not/ will not pay the difference and therefore a landlord should be able to say no, it's too risky " Exactly "some cases". All I'm saying is that the landlord should judge each potential tenant on their merits. Some people in work will be good tenants and some bad. Ditto with people on benefits. I can't imagine what it must feel like to be homeless and on benefits looking for a place to live and coming up continously against "no DSS" | |||
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"I actually think we are in the same place, should a landlord say no just because they are on DSS, no. Should a landlord "have" to accept a tenant they consider risky, also no. " We are indeed agreed
No one is suggesting a landlord has to accept every potential tenant on benefits. Just treat them as individuals and assess them in the same way as other potential tenants. | |||
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"Three ladies have won cases against landlords Agents effectively advertising property to rent but not taking DSS claimants. One even offered 12 month's rent up front. Should this practice be outlawed or allowed ?" Are the three ladies swingers? I need to know this before I can answer the question truthfully | |||
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"I actually think we are in the same place, should a landlord say no just because they are on DSS, no. Should a landlord "have" to accept a tenant they consider risky, also no. " I do agree to a certain extent, but we all tend to go by previous experiences. It’s natural. I’ve had problems on more than one occasion with DSS tenants. I never have with private tenants. | |||
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"I wont have dss in any of my properties and stipulate this in the contract. I used to but had properties wrecked on multiple occasions." Surely anyone has potential to wreck a property not just people claiming housing benefit? I work but as a single parent I get a top up of housing benefit. I’ve been a good tenant for the last 7 years and had much improved the condition of the house I live in. A young couple who work full time and dint claim any benefits could have lots of parties and not pay rent and wreck a property so I don’t think that is a reasonable argument. Landlords can also state as a condition that the housing benefit is paid direct to them. | |||
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"I'm now curious, if landlords should offer rentals to people on DSS, should banks also offer mortgages to people on DSS? " No as housing benefit can not be made for mortgage payments | |||
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"Three ladies have won cases against landlords Agents effectively advertising property to rent but not taking DSS claimants. One even offered 12 month's rent up front. Should this practice be outlawed or allowed ?" I think only claimaints under a Limited capability for work payment (The payment made for people who cant work due to disabilities or major mental health) should be able too rent. I think too many people take the piss on DSS and its hard to tell whos going to respect a property and whos not. Its shitty they clash all DSS claimaints into one boat, but there is so much evidence of arrears accumulating from missed rent payments down to DWP and i guess this is what landlords are trying to avoid. | |||
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"Three ladies have won cases against landlords Agents effectively advertising property to rent but not taking DSS claimants. One even offered 12 month's rent up front. Should this practice be outlawed or allowed ? I think only claimaints under a Limited capability for work payment (The payment made for people who cant work due to disabilities or major mental health) should be able too rent. I think too many people take the piss on DSS and its hard to tell whos going to respect a property and whos not. Its shitty they clash all DSS claimaints into one boat, but there is so much evidence of arrears accumulating from missed rent payments down to DWP and i guess this is what landlords are trying to avoid. " Where will the others live? | |||
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"I wont have dss in any of my properties and stipulate this in the contract. I used to but had properties wrecked on multiple occasions. Surely anyone has potential to wreck a property not just people claiming housing benefit? I work but as a single parent I get a top up of housing benefit. I’ve been a good tenant for the last 7 years and had much improved the condition of the house I live in. A young couple who work full time and dint claim any benefits could have lots of parties and not pay rent and wreck a property so I don’t think that is a reasonable argument. Landlords can also state as a condition that the housing benefit is paid direct to them. " Im not saying all are the same as they arn't but Ive been burnt 7 times and had to say enough is enough with dss. no one is there to foot the bill but myself When its private/professional the deposit is their own money and from experience they lookafter the property as their own they dont want to loose it.  | |||
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"I employ a letting agents to take care of this. They filter out DSS applicants if you stipulate it when you employ them. I happily let to two DSS tenants and sadly got burned twice and it cost me a lot of money to fix. Why should I take that risk again? Exactly. Same here so I won’t. My choice. I also “discriminate” against people who have pets and smoke too. " Pets that smoke. Beagles presumably.. ? | |||
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"I wont have dss in any of my properties and stipulate this in the contract. I used to but had properties wrecked on multiple occasions. Surely anyone has potential to wreck a property not just people claiming housing benefit? I work but as a single parent I get a top up of housing benefit. I’ve been a good tenant for the last 7 years and had much improved the condition of the house I live in. A young couple who work full time and dint claim any benefits could have lots of parties and not pay rent and wreck a property so I don’t think that is a reasonable argument. Landlords can also state as a condition that the housing benefit is paid direct to them. Im not saying all are the same as they arn't but Ive been burnt 7 times and had to say enough is enough with dss. no one is there to foot the bill but myself When its private/professional the deposit is their own money and from experience they lookafter the property as their own they dont want to loose it. "I have found this to be the case too. Sadly the profit margin is quite thin at the moment so why should I have to payout all the time. Luckily I have found some reliable tenants through my strategy. | |||
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