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The Universe

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?

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By *ed-monkeyCouple
over a year ago

Hailsham

[Removed by poster at 25/04/19 21:13:41]

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By *ed-monkeyCouple
over a year ago

Hailsham

Ooo deep and existential . .. let me give a deep and considered answer ...

Yes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Mind blown

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The same question can be re-worded many ways. That's philosophy for you.

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By *ed-monkeyCouple
over a year ago

Hailsham

Indeed the cat is dead .... you can hear it thud against the box as you shake it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Indeed the cat is dead .... you can hear it thud against the box as you shake it "

Or trying to scratch it's way out.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"The same question can be re-worded many ways. That's philosophy for you. "

Philosophy is about the nature of reality. How else can you question our reality?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The answer is yes

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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago

upton wirral


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?"
Yes if it wanted to

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?Yes if it wanted to"

Maths please.

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By *ionaScarletTV/TS
over a year ago

Dundee


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?"

There is no spoon...

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?

There is no spoon... "

You intend to eat it?

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By *ionaScarletTV/TS
over a year ago

Dundee


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?Yes if it wanted to"

presuming of course that the universe itself is itself conscious and capable of observing itself...

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By *ionaScarletTV/TS
over a year ago

Dundee


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?

There is no spoon...

You intend to eat it?"

Is it low fat? I'm on a diet

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?"

I used to enjoy this type of thinking when reading about new theories in subatomic particle research etc, now I believe its been misunderstood i.e schrodinger's cat/tree falling in the woods type of thing.

If a tree falls in the woods, a tree falls in the woods and it will make a sound regardless of an observer.

I'd give an example of a planet,lets say mars, we aren't changing the sun's heat on it just because we observed it.

I also think some think this whole observer thing has been blown out of proportion to now make it as if the conscious observer makes the universe therefore leading to some form of creator when if fact there probably has been other observers around the universe before any life in our solar system anyway.

I really don't think the conscious observer theory(or the anthropic principle as its known), holds up when you consider species like plants/animals that have existed for millions/billions of years before our 'kind'.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?

I used to enjoy this type of thinking when reading about new theories in subatomic particle research etc, now I believe its been misunderstood i.e schrodinger's cat/tree falling in the woods type of thing.

If a tree falls in the woods, a tree falls in the woods and it will make a sound regardless of an observer.

I'd give an example of a planet,lets say mars, we aren't changing the sun's heat on it just because we observed it.

I also think some think this whole observer thing has been blown out of proportion to now make it as if the conscious observer makes the universe therefore leading to some form of creator when if fact there probably has been other observers around the universe before any life in our solar system anyway.

I really don't think the conscious observer theory(or the anthropic principle as its known), holds up when you consider species like plants/animals that have existed for millions/billions of years before our 'kind'.

"

But aren't our kind more aware than animals or plants? What plant ever took a carefully constructed photo of a black hole?

Remember, life on other planets hadn't been proven yet

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By *ce WingerMan
over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ

I've actually been to the restaurant at the edge of it

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By *am62Woman
over a year ago

Bristol

Well it's existed 13 billion years lol so I doubt much will change.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I meant to add the subatomic world and the macroscopic world behave quite differently in the physical and mathematical properties they have.

The laws of physics is pretty meaningless when describing such things as what's inside the singularity of a black hole or what's outside our universe.

Star-trek and other such programmes that I love are great for fuelling the imagination of thinkers and scientists, but when you consider the basic premise that trying to travel at the speed of light/or faster-would require more energy than is the universe apparently which isn't possible with the known laws of thermodynamics as well as the problems with relativity.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Well it's existed 13 billion years lol so I doubt much will change. "

How long is 13 billion years (sun years) in subatomic terms? A long time, an instant, like a week in Brexit..?

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By *ce WingerMan
over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ


"Well it's existed 13 billion years lol so I doubt much will change. "

Apart from humankind wiping species off the face of the planet?

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?"

Does the universe exist even when there are conscious observers? Or is it all just in your mind?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?

I used to enjoy this type of thinking when reading about new theories in subatomic particle research etc, now I believe its been misunderstood i.e schrodinger's cat/tree falling in the woods type of thing.

If a tree falls in the woods, a tree falls in the woods and it will make a sound regardless of an observer.

I'd give an example of a planet,lets say mars, we aren't changing the sun's heat on it just because we observed it.

I also think some think this whole observer thing has been blown out of proportion to now make it as if the conscious observer makes the universe therefore leading to some form of creator when if fact there probably has been other observers around the universe before any life in our solar system anyway.

I really don't think the conscious observer theory(or the anthropic principle as its known), holds up when you consider species like plants/animals that have existed for millions/billions of years before our 'kind'.

But aren't our kind more aware than animals or plants? What plant ever took a carefully constructed photo of a black hole?

Remember, life on other planets hadn't been proven yet "

If you really think of it, plants may be more advanced than other types of life. They get their energy from stars(photosynthesis), can mimic smells and looks of insects(and they don't even have eyes).

Whereas we devour and destroy lol-compared to the rest of all species..we are a drip in an ocean. It's a mistake to think we are the most advanced, given our relatively short existence.

*Not knocking us doing amazing achievements

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 25/04/19 22:52:28]

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?

I used to enjoy this type of thinking when reading about new theories in subatomic particle research etc, now I believe its been misunderstood i.e schrodinger's cat/tree falling in the woods type of thing.

If a tree falls in the woods, a tree falls in the woods and it will make a sound regardless of an observer.

I'd give an example of a planet,lets say mars, we aren't changing the sun's heat on it just because we observed it.

I also think some think this whole observer thing has been blown out of proportion to now make it as if the conscious observer makes the universe therefore leading to some form of creator when if fact there probably has been other observers around the universe before any life in our solar system anyway.

I really don't think the conscious observer theory(or the anthropic principle as its known), holds up when you consider species like plants/animals that have existed for millions/billions of years before our 'kind'.

But aren't our kind more aware than animals or plants? What plant ever took a carefully constructed photo of a black hole?

Remember, life on other planets hadn't been proven yet

If you really think of it, plants may be more advanced than other types of life. They get their energy from stars(photosynthesis), can mimic smells and looks of insects(and they don't even have eyes).

Whereas we devour and destroy lol-compared to the rest of all species..we are a drip in an ocean. It's a mistake to think we are the most advanced, given our relatively short existence.

*Not knocking us doing amazing achievements"

Plants don't have universities.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?

I used to enjoy this type of thinking when reading about new theories in subatomic particle research etc, now I believe its been misunderstood i.e schrodinger's cat/tree falling in the woods type of thing.

If a tree falls in the woods, a tree falls in the woods and it will make a sound regardless of an observer.

I'd give an example of a planet,lets say mars, we aren't changing the sun's heat on it just because we observed it.

I also think some think this whole observer thing has been blown out of proportion to now make it as if the conscious observer makes the universe therefore leading to some form of creator when if fact there probably has been other observers around the universe before any life in our solar system anyway.

I really don't think the conscious observer theory(or the anthropic principle as its known), holds up when you consider species like plants/animals that have existed for millions/billions of years before our 'kind'.

But aren't our kind more aware than animals or plants? What plant ever took a carefully constructed photo of a black hole?

Remember, life on other planets hadn't been proven yet

If you really think of it, plants may be more advanced than other types of life. They get their energy from stars(photosynthesis), can mimic smells and looks of insects(and they don't even have eyes).

Whereas we devour and destroy lol-compared to the rest of all species..we are a drip in an ocean. It's a mistake to think we are the most advanced, given our relatively short existence.

*Not knocking us doing amazing achievements

Plants don't have universities."

btw two of the largest(and i think oldest)lifeforms on this planet are a fungus and and a plant(it's counted as one lifeform regardless looking like a collection)-cant remember its name since I watched it last, but probably pretty easy to find. Pretty successful if uneventful lol

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By *ionaScarletTV/TS
over a year ago

Dundee


"Well it's existed 13 billion years lol so I doubt much will change.

Apart from humankind wiping species off the face of the planet? "

That would be the misanthropic principle

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Wouldn't it be easier for us if we were just a simple fungus?

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By *ionaScarletTV/TS
over a year ago

Dundee


"Wouldn't it be easier for us if we were just a simple fungus?"

would there still be chocolate?

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By *ce WingerMan
over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ


"Plants don't have universities."

There have been some cabbages that have been to Eton & Harrow though

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By *uzukiNo1Woman
over a year ago

Rhyl

I think some ppl have been eating fungus

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Wouldn't it be easier for us if we were just a simple fungus?

would there still be chocolate?"

We have more in common with parasites.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Of course, the universe is in an entropic state.

Much like any Fab forum discussion.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I think some ppl have been eating fungus "

possibly it gave rise to higher consciousness in our ancestors by eating fungi-hallucinogens

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By *ionaScarletTV/TS
over a year ago

Dundee


"Of course, the universe is in an entropic state.

Much like any Fab forum discussion."

If I've observed your username correctly though...

Your taste in books is awsome

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By *ionaScarletTV/TS
over a year ago

Dundee


"Wouldn't it be easier for us if we were just a simple fungus?

would there still be chocolate?

We have more in common with parasites."

Granted... but what about the chocolate?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I think some ppl have been eating fungus "

in fact, this is probably what 'jesus' did, laced bread or wine with LSD/cannibis, fed it to a few folk then proclaimed he was god.

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By *nderIwonder.Man
over a year ago

2nd City

I'm sure A.I will be asking the same question. like bladerunner

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Of course, the universe is in an entropic state.

Much like any Fab forum discussion.

If I've observed your username correctly though...

Your taste in books is awsome "

It is. Thanks

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

I'm thinking yes, though not thinking much.

Ref plants - we still have much to learn about them. We don't know all of their hormones, for example. They appear able to communicate with each other and the good news is that they may help us to save other species and ourselves from global warming catastrophe.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Define conscious observer, that may be a step towards your answer

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Define conscious observer, that may be a step towards your answer "

I'd say a conscious, and I have to add, intelligent observer, is one who is aware of the environment around them including regions of space, not just a creature that is only aware of it's own immediate surrounds.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Define conscious observer, that may be a step towards your answer

I'd say a conscious, and I have to add, intelligent observer, is one who is aware of the environment around them including regions of space, not just a creature that is only aware of it's own immediate surrounds.

"

Normally an observer would also need to sit outside what is being observed, after all if you can't observe from multiple perspectives you can't really observe at all

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?

There is no spoon...

You intend to eat it?"

Well the theory of a donut shaped Universe was put forward by Homer and Stephen Hawking so it’s may be possible to eat it

LJ

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?"

Of course, we are here a mere blink of the eye when you consider the universe

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By *uke olovingmanMan
over a year ago

Gravesend

Yes .. atoms were atoms before anyone thought of them ...and photons...and all the other fundamental constituents of nature

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By *hornleeMan
over a year ago

Stockton on Tees

42

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By *enry1011Man
over a year ago

Leeds

Quantum physics shows us the observer/consciousness is in a symbiotic relationship with the universe; one depends on the other. So no.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Who knows

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There is no way to disprove that I exist within a very elaboate simulation and for all I know, I could be coded and everything around me is to see how AI develops.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"There is no way to disprove that I exist within a very elaboate simulation and for all I know, I could be coded and everything around me is to see how AI develops. "

Had any meets?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There is no way to disprove that I exist within a very elaboate simulation and for all I know, I could be coded and everything around me is to see how AI develops.

Had any meets?"

Why?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Im still here even when no one is watching me so I'll guess Yes.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There is no way to disprove that I exist within a very elaboate simulation and for all I know, I could be coded and everything around me is to see how AI develops. "

We could poke you and see if you grunt

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"There is no way to disprove that I exist within a very elaboate simulation and for all I know, I could be coded and everything around me is to see how AI develops.

Had any meets?

Why?"

Might prove your reality?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There is no way to disprove that I exist within a very elaboate simulation and for all I know, I could be coded and everything around me is to see how AI develops.

Had any meets?

Why?

Might prove your reality?"

Are you also trying to lead to a 'simulation' theory?

I wonder what people think really regarding such questions, I'll admit a black hole picture recently shown wont change anyones lives really., however many aspects we take for granted were born from CERN (This mad internet thing), tv's, computers etc etc..all born from physicists. physicists predict mathematical equations then test and verify(most people can do the same with the same knowledge), they are not always correct and scientists still admit when they got/get something wrong, quite the opposite for religion though.

Our reality is our reality, it causes me pain and love, I don't need to have a sky wizard or matrix controller to say what's right and whats wrong.

People should just understand our time is fleeting, make the best of now and ensure the future, nothing else actually matters.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Wouldn't it be easier for us if we were just a simple fungus?"

Some of us are.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Wouldn't it be easier for us if we were just a simple fungus?

Some of us are."

there's no mushroom for sarcasm here thanks.

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By *SAchickWoman
over a year ago

Hillside desolate


"Wouldn't it be easier for us if we were just a simple fungus?

Some of us are.

there's no mushroom for sarcasm here thanks."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Here's a mind blower.... The earth is less than a spec of dust to the universe.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Wouldn't it be easier for us if we were just a simple fungus?

Some of us are.

there's no mushroom for sarcasm here thanks.

"

I even felt the gravitational waves as you laughed xxx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There is no way to disprove that I exist within a very elaboate simulation and for all I know, I could be coded and everything around me is to see how AI develops.

Had any meets?

Why?

Might prove your reality?

Are you also trying to lead to a 'simulation' theory?

I wonder what people think really regarding such questions, I'll admit a black hole picture recently shown wont change anyones lives really., however many aspects we take for granted were born from CERN (This mad internet thing), tv's, computers etc etc..all born from physicists. physicists predict mathematical equations then test and verify(most people can do the same with the same knowledge), they are not always correct and scientists still admit when they got/get something wrong, quite the opposite for religion though.

Our reality is our reality, it causes me pain and love, I don't need to have a sky wizard or matrix controller to say what's right and whats wrong.

People should just understand our time is fleeting, make the best of now and ensure the future, nothing else actually matters."

You are quite right.

I opened with the speculation that my reality may be part of a complex simulation because I cannot prove or disprove anything.

"We are all ghosts, piloting meat covered skeletons, made of stardust" is about as abstract a way to describe us. However, my experience in life is basednon whatever is fed to my concious via the five senses.

I don't believe for one second that I'm a disembodied brain, being electronically stimulated to generate a reality which I experience, or that everyone else exists whenever I interact with them. It is just me being abstract.

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By *ark ph0enixWoman
over a year ago

Teesside

The answer is 42

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By *rumpyMcFuckNuggetMan
over a year ago

Den of Iniquity

I look at it like this ..

If you stood on Bondi Beach and picked up one grain of sand , that would amount to our own galaxy in the vastness of the universe . Then split that grain of sand into around 100 Bilion pieces and then picked up one of those pieces , that would get you close to the insignificance that is our Planet

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By *ensualtouch15Man
over a year ago

ashby de la zouch


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?"

Yes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I look at it like this ..

If you stood on Bondi Beach and picked up one grain of sand , that would amount to our own galaxy in the vastness of the universe . Then split that grain of sand into around 100 Bilion pieces and then picked up one of those pieces , that would get you close to the insignificance that is our Planet "

It may be an insignificant little planet but it is big enough for me, imagine you had to commute from that billionth of a grain of sand to Bronty beach each day.

So are we any closer to deciding if there is something observing the universe?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Iiiiiii have the poweeeeeeeeer

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By *andm300Man
over a year ago

guildford

You presuppose that the universe exists as it can be observable. Do the things in your dream exist? Could reality not be as real as we think it is.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Its great question, however if you believe there is an infinite 'you', then any choice you make,means nothing. Dont get me wrong,I can go on a killing spree right now and it matters nothing to the cosmos, I'd rather understand on my scale that I have a role to play, my future generations will probably agree, however the universe will never really care, it might sound sad, but it is more an issue of humanity than anything astrophysical.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If a man walks into a forest where no woman can hear him, is he still wrong?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We appear to be believing everything scientists tell us from an early age...Have we been duped / brainwashed all our lives?

Would they ever admit that they've got it wrong?...Am I alone in thinking that some deep secrets are hidden from us because we're insignificant?

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By *ce WingerMan
over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ


"If a man walks into a forest where no woman can hear him, is he still wrong?"

Only if he emerges without knowing all the lyrics to Gloria Gaynor's Greatest Hits Vols I, II and III

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By *oss and SuzieCouple
over a year ago

Porthmadog

I gather current thinking is that we are part of a multiverse where our observable universe is one of a vast number that spring into existence like bubbles in a froth.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

before women study parallel universes and they need to study parallel parking

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Maybe. But as a society, we’re also starting to believe the bollocks we spout off, which has no factual basis, but makes a great story of them against us?

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By *abs..Woman
over a year ago

..

This makes my head hurt

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

parallel universes could explain ghost sightings.eventually 'our' universe will become nothingness forever.no light /matter /time ..nobody to see it as it doesnt exist so no it wouldnt be there to be seen.

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By *nabelle21Woman
over a year ago

B38


"This makes my head hurt "

I was just thinking the same

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By *abs..Woman
over a year ago

..


"This makes my head hurt

I was just thinking the same "

Shall we have a coffee and look at pretty pictures?

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By *nabelle21Woman
over a year ago

B38


"This makes my head hurt

I was just thinking the same

Shall we have a coffee and look at pretty pictures? "

Now your talking. I can definitely get my head around that

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"This makes my head hurt

I was just thinking the same

Shall we have a coffee and look at pretty pictures?

Now your talking. I can definitely get my head around that "
don't spill your coffee into a black hole

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If a man walks into a forest where no woman can hear him, is he still wrong?

Only if he emerges without knowing all the lyrics to Gloria Gaynor's Greatest Hits Vols I, II and III "

So it is a yes then, he is still wrong

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

thousands of years in the future the only known non universe thing could be the voyager probes.( the Sun will destroy close satellites) Earth gone. Sun gone.Brexit still debated.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If conscious observers were not observing it, would the universe exist?"

Yes, and it's the height of human arrogance to believe otherwise.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

what existed before the universe before time before energy.. ..a something from absolute nothingness..Brian Cox says in a billion times x 8 years will be the state again ..absolute nothingness forever and ever

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