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Puberty blockers for trans kids

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By *irthandgirth OP   Man
over a year ago

Camberley occasionally doncaster

I have just been listening to a radio debate on this, and I must say that I think the ethics of this are really shaky.

The basis is that pre-teens who identify as non CIS are given some seriously strong medication which inhibits puberty to make it easier to transition. The long term physical and psychological effects of this are as yet unknown.

During the same debate one statistic that was mooted was that approx 80% of children who identify as non CIS will "grow out" of it (their phrase, not mine) by adulthood.

I am all for people being allowed to transition, I have worked with 3 trans people with no workplace issues - including 1 person who went through full M to F transition while I knew them.

But these were all adult decisions.

Should we allow people to let or encourage their children to transition at such a young age? Is this enabling a whole range of issues further down the line? Should there be a law preventing such early reassignment procedures?

Interested to hear everyone's thoughts (fab community is way more diverse than my real life)

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By *ibblingnewtWoman
over a year ago

by the sea

I think every case should be seen on its merits, if a child has been identifying as one sex for a number of years and has been living as that sex completely then yes it’s a natural progression for them to be given meds to keep the natural body from emerging and the distress they will feel without these drugs would be terrible for them plus the transition will be easier doing it whilst young and it will be near undetectable too, but any doubt then no! Either way life’s just not easy for these kids

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By *ea monkeyMan
over a year ago

Manchester (he/him)

It's a difficult one.

Children are not considered able to make decisions about themselves in anyway unless they're legally emancipated as they're not considered capable in the eyes of the law. Medically then they are also considered not able to make these decisions.

I'm not saying that this is strictly correct as I also believe that a person is the only one really who knows how they feel, so already I'm stuck with it.

I think a long process of examination should be undertaken but at the same point many doctors can and will be biased against it due to the untested nature and the potentially extreme repercussions.

If it were my child and they felt like that then I would fight tooth and nail for them but only after they were certain they knew their own mind and body. A hard ask for a child.

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By *ady LickWoman
over a year ago

Northampton Somewhere

There was a programme on about this recently, interesting to watch. I'm sure they said there were 2500 under 18's who approached their gp about starting these types of drugs. There's a thread somewhere....

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By *elma and ShaggyCouple
over a year ago

Bedworth

When young kids identify as trans and parents seek treatment, that consists of therapy and counselling. For many many years, the child will be seen regularly by psychologists and counsellors. Drugs to delay puberty are a very long way down the process for these kids and the professionals will not recommend it unless they are absolutely certain that the child will not change their mind later

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By *loswingersCouple
over a year ago

Gloucester

It would be interesting to see the long term effects of puberty blocking medication , and the long term effects of hormone medication on the physical body . Obviously neither would be given unless the individual was 100% sure and the psychological effect is a definitive positive , but if the physical body is damaged then this may come into the thought process too .

If 80% ‘ grow out of it ‘ , then it must be so difficult for the powers that be to make the right decision . Once it’s made , either way it’s not like you can turn the clock back is it ?

Because we are now so open and aware , it will be interesting to see how things go over the next few years . If a few kids are out on these blockers and experience side effects or change their mind then no doubt the shit will hit the fan . If kids aren’t given them we will hear cries of how it isn’t fair etc.... so it’s a bit of a no win really .

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By *ibblingnewtWoman
over a year ago

by the sea


"It would be interesting to see the long term effects of puberty blocking medication , and the long term effects of hormone medication on the physical body . Obviously neither would be given unless the individual was 100% sure and the psychological effect is a definitive positive , but if the physical body is damaged then this may come into the thought process too .

If 80% ‘ grow out of it ‘ , then it must be so difficult for the powers that be to make the right decision . Once it’s made , either way it’s not like you can turn the clock back is it ?

Because we are now so open and aware , it will be interesting to see how things go over the next few years . If a few kids are out on these blockers and experience side effects or change their mind then no doubt the shit will hit the fan . If kids aren’t given them we will hear cries of how it isn’t fair etc.... so it’s a bit of a no win really . "

They already give out these meds

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By *loswingersCouple
over a year ago

Gloucester


"It would be interesting to see the long term effects of puberty blocking medication , and the long term effects of hormone medication on the physical body . Obviously neither would be given unless the individual was 100% sure and the psychological effect is a definitive positive , but if the physical body is damaged then this may come into the thought process too .

If 80% ‘ grow out of it ‘ , then it must be so difficult for the powers that be to make the right decision . Once it’s made , either way it’s not like you can turn the clock back is it ?

Because we are now so open and aware , it will be interesting to see how things go over the next few years . If a few kids are out on these blockers and experience side effects or change their mind then no doubt the shit will hit the fan . If kids aren’t given them we will hear cries of how it isn’t fair etc.... so it’s a bit of a no win really .

They already give out these meds "

Yes they do , and there are side effects already being found . I just wonder how many more will rear their heads over the long term .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think they should be supported in other ways but not by medical means until they are at least 18. Giving them meds may mask any changes in feelings. They may realise it was a phase, or hormones playing havoc with their emotions. And in reality they don't have gender issues after all. Perhaps it was sexuality and not gender.

I think it's easy for older (over 21) trans people to say they 'always knew'- as in they've lived through it and they are sure. There will be other people who felt trans when younger but later realised they're not. It's much harder, if not impossible, to turn back the clock than go forward.

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By *loswingersCouple
over a year ago

Gloucester


"I think they should be supported in other ways but not by medical means until they are at least 18. Giving them meds may mask any changes in feelings. They may realise it was a phase, or hormones playing havoc with their emotions. And in reality they don't have gender issues after all. Perhaps it was sexuality and not gender.

I think it's easy for older (over 21) trans people to say they 'always knew'- as in they've lived through it and they are sure. There will be other people who felt trans when younger but later realised they're not. It's much harder, if not impossible, to turn back the clock than go forward. "

100% agree with this .

Most , if not all kids go through phases . Even I remember wearing my Mums clothes a few times when I was primary school , and I’m glad I wasn’t given the option to be put on puberty blockers !

Some reports suggest the 80% of kids changing their mind may be on the low side . It could be as high as 90% and these odds make it impossible to start giving these treatments with a clear conscience .

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By *ea monkeyMan
over a year ago

Manchester (he/him)


"I think they should be supported in other ways but not by medical means until they are at least 18. Giving them meds may mask any changes in feelings. They may realise it was a phase, or hormones playing havoc with their emotions. And in reality they don't have gender issues after all. Perhaps it was sexuality and not gender.

I think it's easy for older (over 21) trans people to say they 'always knew'- as in they've lived through it and they are sure. There will be other people who felt trans when younger but later realised they're not. It's much harder, if not impossible, to turn back the clock than go forward.

100% agree with this .

Most , if not all kids go through phases . Even I remember wearing my Mums clothes a few times when I was primary school , and I’m glad I wasn’t given the option to be put on puberty blockers !

Some reports suggest the 80% of kids changing their mind may be on the low side . It could be as high as 90% and these odds make it impossible to start giving these treatments with a clear conscience ."

The issue as well is that its a very new situation and medical dedication. Using statistics may mask the issue, it may be less than 80%.

I'm very pro choice and I believe in the experience of the individual but at what age can and do medical practitioners recognise the 'sense of self'. To me I feel very wary of it, it seems a little like offering hysterectomy's to girl who say at 12 that they don't want children ever. (obviously I'm protracting the envelope there).

I think that it leaves me very mixed as to an answer and there certainly can't be a 'cover all' response to this, which is certainly what medical practitioners will look for, as will this thread!

The likelihood that children will be caught on either side of the resulting line taken is an awful thought to consider.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think it's only fair to offer them to straight pensioners too....

.....are there any actual doctors on fab?

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By *ngelina4uWoman
over a year ago

Camberley/Middleton

I would go pro choice but then do people really know the implications of choice? Should parents choose should the child the reality is every case is an individual one and should be assessed on the individual merits of the case. Age how mature the child is and a whole heap ofd other factors should come into it. But you can't blanket say on this matter it should be on a individual person basis.

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By *ea monkeyMan
over a year ago

Manchester (he/him)


"I would go pro choice but then do people really know the implications of choice? Should parents choose should the child the reality is every case is an individual one and should be assessed on the individual merits of the case. Age how mature the child is and a whole heap ofd other factors should come into it. But you can't blanket say on this matter it should be on a individual person basis. "

I agree with you, but will medical practise allow for such flexibility?

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By *ngelina4uWoman
over a year ago

Camberley/Middleton


"I would go pro choice but then do people really know the implications of choice? Should parents choose should the child the reality is every case is an individual one and should be assessed on the individual merits of the case. Age how mature the child is and a whole heap ofd other factors should come into it. But you can't blanket say on this matter it should be on a individual person basis.

I agree with you, but will medical practise allow for such flexibility? "

Probably not on a cost basis but morally they should and it could be cheaper long term if it reduces depression and mental illness.

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By *hoenixAdAstraWoman
over a year ago

Hiding in the shadows

[Removed by poster at 15/03/19 18:05:02]

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By *ea monkeyMan
over a year ago

Manchester (he/him)


"I would go pro choice but then do people really know the implications of choice? Should parents choose should the child the reality is every case is an individual one and should be assessed on the individual merits of the case. Age how mature the child is and a whole heap ofd other factors should come into it. But you can't blanket say on this matter it should be on a individual person basis.

I agree with you, but will medical practise allow for such flexibility?

Probably not on a cost basis but morally they should and it could be cheaper long term if it reduces depression and mental illness. "

Unfortunately medicine does come down to a numbers game and effectively a line of best fit. As I said before though; the thought of children getting caught either side of that line is awful.

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By *hoenixAdAstraWoman
over a year ago

Hiding in the shadows

Aaargh bloody silly typo...

A topic, I've been dealing with for over 2 decades.

My goddaughter is 22 this year.

My goddaughter was not born female.

Her mum, already a mother of 2 boys, gave birth to the prettiest baby I have ever seen.

From day one people were surprised when she said "it's a boy"

It was very obvious from a very early age, this child was feminine, dainty in comparison to her chunky brothers, there were no girls toys or clothes in the house, at toddler group would make a bee line for the dolly's & prams, ignore the stereotypical boys toys.

Out shopping, pointing to dresses & pretty things.

My friend did everything to raise another boy, by 7 it was impossible, after the child tried to remove it's own penis with scissors, luckily caught before any serious damage done.

My friend got medical advice. Tests carried out.

My goddaughter was allowed to start dressing in neutral girls clothes.

For the first time, she could be who she wanted to be.

She's undergone years of counselling, support, and finally started taking medication in her early teens.

Her mum only learnt to drive a couple of years ago & had 2 other younger children to look after, so I attended counselling sessions with my goddaughter, took her to special days out with friends from these he out.

I do not know of 1 person from that group that hasn't got a horror story to tell, in one way or another, and not 1 has regretted standing up for their rights to be who they were born to be.

Many have waited til old enough to leave home, many have been ostracised by family & friends for their choices.

I don't believe anyone goes through the things I've seen or heard about without being 100% certain it is what they have to do

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There are a lot of questions I'd need answers to, to be able to say yes comfortably. What are the side effects of the drug? What are the side effects of delaying puberty? Is fertility compromised? Is it 100% reversible?

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

The brain is not fully developed until the end of adolescence, so to offer any treatment pre that is amoral as far as I'm concerned.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I wish I'd come out before puberty and could have gone on blockers but I was so scared of how society treats trans people that I hid it until I was in position to be able to stand on my own if my family abandoned me. I knew I wasn't a boy at 6 and knew I was actually a girl by 11/12 ish, for what it's worth. People who says kids can't know are just plain wrong.

Trans kids who go on blockers and then transition have a significantly easier time "passing" than this of us who didn't.

As far as I'm concerned blockers are not a bad thing, no they aren't perfect but what medical treatments are? There are potential (rare) side effects but 99.9% of the time if someone decided not to transition the effects would be completely reversed by coming off them for couple of months.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I wish I'd come out before puberty and could have gone on blockers but I was so scared of how society treats trans people that I hid it until I was in position to be able to stand on my own if my family abandoned me. I knew I wasn't a boy at 6 and knew I was actually a girl by 11/12 ish, for what it's worth. People who says kids can't know are just plain wrong.

Trans kids who go on blockers and then transition have a significantly easier time "passing" than this of us who didn't.

As far as I'm concerned blockers are not a bad thing, no they aren't perfect but what medical treatments are? There are potential (rare) side effects but 99.9% of the time if someone decided not to transition the effects would be completely reversed by coming off them for couple of months."

What are the rare side effects, and how rare are they?

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford


"I wish I'd come out before puberty and could have gone on blockers but I was so scared of how society treats trans people that I hid it until I was in position to be able to stand on my own if my family abandoned me. I knew I wasn't a boy at 6 and knew I was actually a girl by 11/12 ish, for what it's worth. People who says kids can't know are just plain wrong.

Trans kids who go on blockers and then transition have a significantly easier time "passing" than this of us who didn't.

As far as I'm concerned blockers are not a bad thing, no they aren't perfect but what medical treatments are? There are potential (rare) side effects but 99.9% of the time if someone decided not to transition the effects would be completely reversed by coming off them for couple of months."

They aren't wrong - maybe your stance didn't change, but it's widely understood that the part of the brain responsible for emotional development is the last to develop. This is why adolescents are classed as vulnerable.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I can't remember the specific rates but one of the main ones is to do with bone mineralization, but it's what would be considered a very rare side effect by average medications standards. There have been cases of the reproductive system not restarting after coming off blockers but again it's very rare.

All that said I still would have accepted those risks when I was younger if it meant I hadn't had to go through male puberty (which sent me into a depression which almost ended me), and I came out of puberty relatively lucky, I didn't masculize as much as I could have done bit it still I've had to do a lot of work on my voice to make it passable and am going through hours of laser and electrolysis to get rid of facial hair, things I would have been spared had I come out and gone on blockers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The brain is not fully developed until the end of adolescence, so to offer any treatment pre that is amoral as far as I'm concerned."

This would be my concern. Do the drugs interfere with the bodies growth or brain functions.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I wish I'd come out before puberty and could have gone on blockers but I was so scared of how society treats trans people that I hid it until I was in position to be able to stand on my own if my family abandoned me. I knew I wasn't a boy at 6 and knew I was actually a girl by 11/12 ish, for what it's worth. People who says kids can't know are just plain wrong.

Trans kids who go on blockers and then transition have a significantly easier time "passing" than this of us who didn't.

As far as I'm concerned blockers are not a bad thing, no they aren't perfect but what medical treatments are? There are potential (rare) side effects but 99.9% of the time if someone decided not to transition the effects would be completely reversed by coming off them for couple of months.

They aren't wrong - maybe your stance didn't change, but it's widely understood that the part of the brain responsible for emotional development is the last to develop. This is why adolescents are classed as vulnerable. "

I don't mean this in a confrontational way but yeah, they are wrong. It's people who have no understanding of a trans persons lived experience commenting as if they have authority. Of all the trans people I know I'd say about 80% say they knew before puberty and they all went on to transition.

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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford


"I wish I'd come out before puberty and could have gone on blockers but I was so scared of how society treats trans people that I hid it until I was in position to be able to stand on my own if my family abandoned me. I knew I wasn't a boy at 6 and knew I was actually a girl by 11/12 ish, for what it's worth. People who says kids can't know are just plain wrong.

Trans kids who go on blockers and then transition have a significantly easier time "passing" than this of us who didn't.

As far as I'm concerned blockers are not a bad thing, no they aren't perfect but what medical treatments are? There are potential (rare) side effects but 99.9% of the time if someone decided not to transition the effects would be completely reversed by coming off them for couple of months.

They aren't wrong - maybe your stance didn't change, but it's widely understood that the part of the brain responsible for emotional development is the last to develop. This is why adolescents are classed as vulnerable.

I don't mean this in a confrontational way but yeah, they are wrong. It's people who have no understanding of a trans persons lived experience commenting as if they have authority. Of all the trans people I know I'd say about 80% say they knew before puberty and they all went on to transition."

So 20% didn't. And they aren't wrong, you can map the development of the brain. It hurts nobody to wait until they are fully grown.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There are many issues surrounding this, a major one being the right to have your own children which wouldn't happen if a child was given drugs to block puberty. I do believe taking sperm and egg samples for freezing is an option but a child would have to begin puberty to be able to produce those samples for this to happen.

The human body is a complex organ especially one still developing and growing and I feel its a high risk to give that child hormone drugs which interferes with this.

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By *ibblingnewtWoman
over a year ago

by the sea


"Aaargh bloody silly typo...

A topic, I've been dealing with for over 2 decades.

My goddaughter is 22 this year.

My goddaughter was not born female.

Her mum, already a mother of 2 boys, gave birth to the prettiest baby I have ever seen.

From day one people were surprised when she said "it's a boy"

It was very obvious from a very early age, this child was feminine, dainty in comparison to her chunky brothers, there were no girls toys or clothes in the house, at toddler group would make a bee line for the dolly's & prams, ignore the stereotypical boys toys.

Out shopping, pointing to dresses & pretty things.

My friend did everything to raise another boy, by 7 it was impossible, after the child tried to remove it's own penis with scissors, luckily caught before any serious damage done.

My friend got medical advice. Tests carried out.

My goddaughter was allowed to start dressing in neutral girls clothes.

For the first time, she could be who she wanted to be.

She's undergone years of counselling, support, and finally started taking medication in her early teens.

Her mum only learnt to drive a couple of years ago & had 2 other younger children to look after, so I attended counselling sessions with my goddaughter, took her to special days out with friends from these he out.

I do not know of 1 person from that group that hasn't got a horror story to tell, in one way or another, and not 1 has regretted standing up for their rights to be who they were born to be.

Many have waited til old enough to leave home, many have been ostracised by family & friends for their choices.

I don't believe anyone goes through the things I've seen or heard about without being 100% certain it is what they have to do"

Sounds like quite a journey, hope things fair well for her transition

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I wish I'd come out before puberty and could have gone on blockers but I was so scared of how society treats trans people that I hid it until I was in position to be able to stand on my own if my family abandoned me. I knew I wasn't a boy at 6 and knew I was actually a girl by 11/12 ish, for what it's worth. People who says kids can't know are just plain wrong.

Trans kids who go on blockers and then transition have a significantly easier time "passing" than this of us who didn't.

As far as I'm concerned blockers are not a bad thing, no they aren't perfect but what medical treatments are? There are potential (rare) side effects but 99.9% of the time if someone decided not to transition the effects would be completely reversed by coming off them for couple of months.

They aren't wrong - maybe your stance didn't change, but it's widely understood that the part of the brain responsible for emotional development is the last to develop. This is why adolescents are classed as vulnerable.

I don't mean this in a confrontational way but yeah, they are wrong. It's people who have no understanding of a trans persons lived experience commenting as if they have authority. Of all the trans people I know I'd say about 80% say they knew before puberty and they all went on to transition.

So 20% didn't. And they aren't wrong, you can map the development of the brain. It hurts nobody to wait until they are fully grown. "

That's where your wrong. Having to go through the wrong puberty has a massive negative effect on trans people's mental health and makes transitioning later that much harder. Trans girls will never have wider hips, will on average be taller than most girls, will have deeper voices that takes a lot of vocal coaching to be able to overcome, will have to go through hours of laser and electrolysis to remove facial and body hair. Trans guys will have to go through a double mastectomy, will be consistently shorter than your average guy and will always have slightly wider hips and narrower shoulders. Saying it does hurt trans kids to make them go through puberty shows you are wrong.

And the other 20%realised they were trans after puberty but still wish they had realised sooner and not had to then live with a body they hated before anything could be done.

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By *.gerri.xTV/TS
over a year ago

North west


"

Many have waited til old enough to leave home, many have been ostracised by family & friends for their choices.

I don't believe anyone goes through the things I've seen or heard about without being 100% certain it is what they have to do"

Pretty well hits the nail on the head that

The kids who are going on puberty blockers through our health service have had to pass many checks to get to the puberty blocker stage. As Phoenix said her god daughter was physically trying to harm herself at 7 in an effort to realise the body her mind thinks she should have.

At least with puberty blockers the physical changes that are brought by puberty can be paused for awhile , things like bone fusing around the hips/pelvic region or breast growth .

This weighed up against the fact that puberty blockers prescribed early an followed by hormone therapy can result in m2f having trouble getting vaginoplasty due to the penis being to small for vaginoplasty or kids who started out on the route of f2m becomig infertile . Never mind bone thinning evidence

From what i have read most of the info giving the idea its reversible has only come from studies of girls with precocious puberty who around 12 where then taken of the GnRH analogs ( puberty blockers ) and puberty naturally occured a year later. Not that much long term history from boys yet .

Terrible decisions to make for the parents of a child or a doctor. If i refuse them now and i am wrong will he have to have a double masectomy in the future or will my child start going the DIY route and ordering online his or herself. Many times i have seen on various posts kids of 14 discussing what dosages or how to order so parents don't know.

At least with medical support and counselling you'd as a parent only be trying to do your best for your kid rather than in the not so distant decades and the kid/parents wouldn't have even realised that being trans existed .

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By *ade and VanessaCouple
over a year ago

Central Scotland

I'm so torn on this. With enough phychological assessment, I'm in favour of the blockers but so wary because we don't know long term effects yet. I couldn't agree with surgeries at a young age but the suicide rate within the trans community is also a terrifying figure. There's far more to that though but anything that could help, to me, is a good thing. For someone who got her first period at barely 11, it's how young these things would need to start to be effective and how long they would need to be taken before that person is old enough to decide on more permanent procedures is a worry.

V x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Many have waited til old enough to leave home, many have been ostracised by family & friends for their choices.

I don't believe anyone goes through the things I've seen or heard about without being 100% certain it is what they have to do

Pretty well hits the nail on the head that

The kids who are going on puberty blockers through our health service have had to pass many checks to get to the puberty blocker stage. As Phoenix said her god daughter was physically trying to harm herself at 7 in an effort to realise the body her mind thinks she should have.

At least with puberty blockers the physical changes that are brought by puberty can be paused for awhile , things like bone fusing around the hips/pelvic region or breast growth .

This weighed up against the fact that puberty blockers prescribed early an followed by hormone therapy can result in m2f having trouble getting vaginoplasty due to the penis being to small for vaginoplasty or kids who started out on the route of f2m becomig infertile . Never mind bone thinning evidence

From what i have read most of the info giving the idea its reversible has only come from studies of girls with precocious puberty who around 12 where then taken of the GnRH analogs ( puberty blockers ) and puberty naturally occured a year later. Not that much long term history from boys yet .

Terrible decisions to make for the parents of a child or a doctor. If i refuse them now and i am wrong will he have to have a double masectomy in the future or will my child start going the DIY route and ordering online his or herself. Many times i have seen on various posts kids of 14 discussing what dosages or how to order so parents don't know.

At least with medical support and counselling you'd as a parent only be trying to do your best for your kid rather than in the not so distant decades and the kid/parents wouldn't have even realised that being trans existed .

"

Not to mention getting them into the GIC youth clinics should keep them off the diy route since they would already have met the standards for therapy by the time they hit 18. I'll be honest I diy'd at the start of my transition because even after being referred to the GIC by my GP it took 2 years between my referral and my first appointment then a further two years between my first appointment and going to see an endocrinologist for a hormone prescription. The GIC's are so burdened at the moment that it's compounding the issues for trans people.

Then all the media furore over our very existence is just the cherry on the cake.

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By *.gerri.xTV/TS
over a year ago

North west

I myself am transitioning in to me though as i willl still keep my penis as i like the way it comes and have no dysphoria as such over it - its what is there an it works and for that reason i shall purely be transistionin g surgically boob job , facial surgery an lipo body contouring an that hopefully starts this year sometime. Privately so no NHS woes.

I looked at DIY and mones etc over many many years of hiding from the truth and as you say you know from a young age that you aren't built right but i sure learnt fast that you keep this hiddden.

At least now there is options and even places like forums on here where it is a matter of discussion nevermind if everyone agrees with it .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I can't remember the specific rates but one of the main ones is to do with bone mineralization, but it's what would be considered a very rare side effect by average medications standards. There have been cases of the reproductive system not restarting after coming off blockers but again it's very rare.

All that said I still would have accepted those risks when I was younger if it meant I hadn't had to go through male puberty (which sent me into a depression which almost ended me), and I came out of puberty relatively lucky, I didn't masculize as much as I could have done bit it still I've had to do a lot of work on my voice to make it passable and am going through hours of laser and electrolysis to get rid of facial hair, things I would have been spared had I come out and gone on blockers."

I'd also be concerned that they're being prescribed off-label.

I don't think the side effect as demineralisation can be brushed aside as being a rare side effect, when it hasn't been studied adequately.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 16/03/19 23:27:15]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I can't remember the specific rates but one of the main ones is to do with bone mineralization, but it's what would be considered a very rare side effect by average medications standards. There have been cases of the reproductive system not restarting after coming off blockers but again it's very rare.

All that said I still would have accepted those risks when I was younger if it meant I hadn't had to go through male puberty (which sent me into a depression which almost ended me), and I came out of puberty relatively lucky, I didn't masculize as much as I could have done bit it still I've had to do a lot of work on my voice to make it passable and am going through hours of laser and electrolysis to get rid of facial hair, things I would have been spared had I come out and gone on blockers.

I'd also be concerned that they're being prescribed off-label.

I don't think the side effect as demineralisation can be brushed aside as being a rare side effect, when it hasn't been studied adequately. "

*demineralisation as a side effect.

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport

Puberty blockers should not be confused with the feminisation/masculinisation hormones that are used during transition proper. All that blockers do is put puberty on hold for a while to allow the teenager a breathing space to fully understand their gender identity. If blockers are then halted, puberty just naturally resumes and the body develops as it would have done.

Blockers have been in use for quite a while now, they are not in any sense a new experimental treatment. Yes, as with any type of medication there are risk of side effects, however as I understand it, the risks of blockers are lower than say the risks of the pill or even of paracetamol! Any young person using blockers would be regularly monitored and endocrine levels checked. Conversely there must be many thousands of teenage girls taking the pill with hardly any supervision.

As stated somewhere above, the main disadvantage that blockers can result in are where male-to-female surgery is subsequently performed and the avoidance of male puberty means that there is only a limited amount of penile and scrotal tissue available for reforming into a vagina and clitoral lips. On the other hand the fact that voice has not deepened, adams apple has not grown, face has not hardened or beard started growing, can make male to female transition considerably easier.

The common argument against allowing a young person to use blockers is "how can they know at that age?". And the answer is "precisely, so instead of forcing them to go through an irreversible process that may destroy their future life, this can give them a chance to wait until they can know".

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Puberty blockers should not be confused with the feminisation/masculinisation hormones that are used during transition proper. All that blockers do is put puberty on hold for a while to allow the teenager a breathing space to fully understand their gender identity. If blockers are then halted, puberty just naturally resumes and the body develops as it would have done.

Blockers have been in use for quite a while now, they are not in any sense a new experimental treatment. Yes, as with any type of medication there are risk of side effects, however as I understand it, the risks of blockers are lower than say the risks of the pill or even of paracetamol! Any young person using blockers would be regularly monitored and endocrine levels checked. Conversely there must be many thousands of teenage girls taking the pill with hardly any supervision.

As stated somewhere above, the main disadvantage that blockers can result in are where male-to-female surgery is subsequently performed and the avoidance of male puberty means that there is only a limited amount of penile and scrotal tissue available for reforming into a vagina and clitoral lips. On the other hand the fact that voice has not deepened, adams apple has not grown, face has not hardened or beard started growing, can make male to female transition considerably easier.

The common argument against allowing a young person to use blockers is "how can they know at that age?". And the answer is "precisely, so instead of forcing them to go through an irreversible process that may destroy their future life, this can give them a chance to wait until they can know"."

How long is quite a while?

I've read a bit on puberty blockers and it's hard to get a clear answer on safety.

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport

I really cannot quantify "quite a while". I know that they were in use when i first got involved in trans support, about ten years ago. And they were already well established at that point in their other use to defer puberty for early developers.

As for safety, it's impossible to get a true picture of health benefits vs risk about any medication. If you read the full info sheet about paracetamol you would never take it. If you go for even a minor op in a hospital you have to sign a paper saying you understand the risks include death!

I think that an important thing to understand is that no doctor (in this country at least) will give blockers to any person without them having gone through a lot of counselling, physical and psychological checks, and will be well monitored throughout. It is actually really difficult to get to the point of being seen at a gender identity clinic, and there is in fact only one clinic in the country where under 18's will be seen. A teen cannot get blockers if just casually exploring their gender options; they have to be definite, determined, and consistent over a period of years. Many young people even miss the window of opportunity where blockers could be used, because of the length of the clinic waiting lists.

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By *reeMan
over a year ago

Paisley


"When young kids identify as trans and parents seek treatment, that consists of therapy and counselling. For many many years, the child will be seen regularly by psychologists and counsellors. Drugs to delay puberty are a very long way down the process for these kids and the professionals will not recommend it unless they are absolutely certain that the child will not change their mind later"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I agree that this is a seriously difficult one to ‘call’.

Speaking only from my own experience, at about seven years old I was so distressed by the mere presence of a penis that I found it very hard to cope.

As I went through puberty I was a complete mess. I hated my fucked up body.

At 18 I was wanting to damage it enough for it to be no option but remove it.

If I had the option to have had puberty blocking medications I would have given anything for them.

However, I completely get that it’s not easy to spot the people who will feel that way for life and those who won’t.

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By *ungBlackTopMan
over a year ago

salford

disgraceful as if kids nowadays aren't messed up enough as it is, then to give them medication which can cause side effects just to appease the minority....disgrace. Where's Piers Morgan when you need him?

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By *loswingersCouple
over a year ago

Gloucester


"disgraceful as if kids nowadays aren't messed up enough as it is, then to give them medication which can cause side effects just to appease the minority....disgrace. Where's Piers Morgan when you need him?"

I saw a you tube video of Piers Morgan’s reaction to a woman who describes her kids as non binary , and it is priceless !

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By *irthandgirth OP   Man
over a year ago

Camberley occasionally doncaster


"Puberty blockers should not be confused with the feminisation/masculinisation hormones that are used during transition proper. All that blockers do is put puberty on hold for a while to allow the teenager a breathing space to fully understand their gender identity. If blockers are then halted, puberty just naturally resumes and the body develops as it would have done.

Blockers have been in use for quite a while now, they are not in any sense a new experimental treatment. Yes, as with any type of medication there are risk of side effects, however as I understand it, the risks of blockers are lower than say the risks of the pill or even of paracetamol! Any young person using blockers would be regularly monitored and endocrine levels checked. Conversely there must be many thousands of teenage girls taking the pill with hardly any supervision.

As stated somewhere above, the main disadvantage that blockers can result in are where male-to-female surgery is subsequently performed and the avoidance of male puberty means that there is only a limited amount of penile and scrotal tissue available for reforming into a vagina and clitoral lips. On the other hand the fact that voice has not deepened, adams apple has not grown, face has not hardened or beard started growing, can make male to female transition considerably easier.

The common argument against allowing a young person to use blockers is "how can they know at that age?". And the answer is "precisely, so instead of forcing them to go through an irreversible process that may destroy their future life, this can give them a chance to wait until they can know".

"

This is a relatively new application of these drugs. They were originally developed for genuine medical conditions where some children start puberty really early (in some cases as young as 4/5)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"disgraceful as if kids nowadays aren't messed up enough as it is, then to give them medication which can cause side effects just to appease the minority....disgrace. Where's Piers Morgan when you need him?

I saw a you tube video of Piers Morgan’s reaction to a woman who describes her kids as non binary , and it is priceless ! "

Piers Morgan is very anti trans.

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport


"disgraceful as if kids nowadays aren't messed up enough as it is, then to give them medication which can cause side effects just to appease the minority....disgrace. Where's Piers Morgan when you need him?

I saw a you tube video of Piers Morgan’s reaction to a woman who describes her kids as non binary , and it is priceless !

Piers Morgan is very anti trans. "

Piers Morgan is a total scumbag

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"disgraceful as if kids nowadays aren't messed up enough as it is, then to give them medication which can cause side effects just to appease the minority....disgrace. Where's Piers Morgan when you need him?

I saw a you tube video of Piers Morgan’s reaction to a woman who describes her kids as non binary , and it is priceless !

Piers Morgan is very anti trans.

Piers Morgan is a total scumbag"

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By *hoenixAdAstraWoman
over a year ago

Hiding in the shadows


"disgraceful as if kids nowadays aren't messed up enough as it is, then to give them medication which can cause side effects just to appease the minority....disgrace. Where's Piers Morgan when you need him?

I saw a you tube video of Piers Morgan’s reaction to a woman who describes her kids as non binary , and it is priceless !

Piers Morgan is very anti trans.

Piers Morgan is a total scumbag

"

A twunting cockwomble of the highest order

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