FabSwingers.com forum: Fairy tales

By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

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I'm watching this morning after Keira Knightly said she has banned her child from watching some as they promote unrealistic ideals, giving things up for a man.

For example Ariel gives up her voice.

Cinderella waits for a rich man.

Are they promoting unattainable goals for girls?

Are they sexist?

Do they encourage girls to wait around for a prince?

Thoughts?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes and have I got to remain a frog rivet rivet?

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By *lenderfoxMan
over a year ago

Leeds

They might subconsciously have an influence, along with everything else in society

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm watching this morning after Keira Knightly said she has banned her child from watching some as they promote unrealistic ideals, giving things up for a man.

For example Ariel gives up her voice.

Cinderella waits for a rich man.

Are they promoting unattainable goals for girls?

Are they sexist?

Do they encourage girls to wait around for a prince?

Thoughts?

I'm still waiting for my Prince

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I can appreciate and understand the thought process behind it, but i ask you OP....when you were read or watched fairytale stories as a child, did it make you think that was the way the world worked? That you had to wait for a man to make your life complete and live happily? Or did you know it was just fantasy?

In my experience no young girls grew up thinking that this was the way the real world worked because of fairytales, so i think its an over the top reaction but has prompted discussion which is always welcome.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think she’s spot on.

Sleeping Beauty - get consent before you kiss her, dude!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think it’s an over reaction, kids grow out of these films and know they’re just a fantasy. They bring lots of happiness to little ones, what’s wrong with them thinking for a few years that one day their prince will come x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I can appreciate and understand the thought process behind it, but i ask you OP....when you were read or watched fairytale stories as a child, did it make you think that was the way the world worked? That you had to wait for a man to make your life complete and live happily? Or did you know it was just fantasy?

But I wonder how many of those same girls you know might have the pervasive sense that their roles are lesser than, they should carry the emotional labour, apologise when they don’t fancy someone, to hold power makes them the negative bitch, a sense of inferiority and subordination...the influence can be much more subtle, complex and without conscious awareness. They’ll be plenty of women where the influence hasn’t affected them, of course, but in replacement of other role modelling, encouragement, exposure to trauma and so on, it’s another source of socially accepted evidence of female disempowerment that children are being fed and is a bit shite.

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By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

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No, I didn't think any of those things.

I simply wanted to ask others views on something in the news

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I tried reading a fairy tale to my little boy but every page I turned I was like wtf

It just got more and more horrific and the whole lesson of it was seriously fucked up. Meanwhile my little boy was sat there, taking it all in, eyes widening, fingers clutching firmer at my thumb

Poor little thing

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm watching this morning after Keira Knightly said she has banned her child from watching some as they promote unrealistic ideals, giving things up for a man.

For example Ariel gives up her voice.

Cinderella waits for a rich man.

Yet she's part of the latest offering from Disney. If she felt so strongly about these things surely she should vote with her feet and not work for the company - not like she needs the cash

Are they promoting unattainable goals for girls?

Are they sexist?

Do they encourage girls to wait around for a prince?

Thoughts?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The worst one is the ugly Swan. A little Swan gets born. It's as ugly as fuck. So nobody wants to be it's friend. It grows up to become a beautiful Swan. And then everyone likes it.

That's some fucked up 19th century thinking right there

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By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

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And then on the flipside there is

Beauty and The Beast where a girl falls for someone's personality

Moana, she didnt listen to anyone

Mulan, who had to pretend to me a guy to fight for what she believed in.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm watching this morning after Keira Knightly said she has banned her child from watching some as they promote unrealistic ideals, giving things up for a man.

For example Ariel gives up her voice.

Cinderella waits for a rich man.

Yet she's part of the latest offering from Disney. If she felt so strongly about these things surely she should vote with her feet and not work for the company - not like she needs the cash

It is hypocritical to work for Disney on the one hand and slam stories on the other, but she owns that and hey, who here isn’t a hypocrite? It doesn’t negate her point though.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

TV and movies should be escapism for everybody, kids included. Parents should show and teach their children about the real world.

She sounds like just an other "up their own arse, pseudo-trendy lefty". Wonder what she thinks her kids are going to "learn" about those kids who can't afford to be sent to expensive boarding school, as I bet hers while be!

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By *he Mac LassWoman
over a year ago

Hefty Hideaway

Kids aren’t stupid. Is it any different to telling them to believe in all the other stuff - santa, tooth fairy etc?

These twee fairy tales are just that. A bit of escapism. Real life will beat any unrealistic ideals out of them - if not they can princess all over Instagram with the others.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Fairy tales are there to entertain and in doing so promote literacy skills amongst the young. This cannot be seen as a bad thing.

However, this is secondary to their purpose which is to provide a strong moral backbone. To teach the young the difference between right and wrong, the fight between good and evil, to introduce them to love and loss. In this fairy tales have been a mainstay in the education and development of our children for centuries. Long may they continue.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Kids aren’t stupid. Is it any different to telling them to believe in all the other stuff - santa, tooth fairy etc?

These twee fairy tales are just that. A bit of escapism. Real life will beat any unrealistic ideals out of them - if not they can princess all over Instagram with the others. "

The difference is that santa and the tooth fairy actually exist

...and I'm sticking to that story

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I grew up with fairy tales and I am still an empowered woman.

It is the parents job to teach a child empowerment, and fairy tales can teach the struggles that women have faced in being suppressed.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Fairy tales are there to entertain and in doing so promote literacy skills amongst the young. This cannot be seen as a bad thing.

I agree entirely, but that’s not the point under discussion. Not all fairy tales are being dissed.

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By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

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Basically she is banning her child from watching movies, Disney in particular, which show the woman as weak..that is the impression I get

Then another actress has said about how Snow white was essentially violated because a guy kissed her when she didnt have a choice.

It seems quite ridiculous doesn't it?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Basically she is banning her child from watching movies, Disney in particular, which show the woman as weak..that is the impression I get

Then another actress has said about how Snow white was essentially violated because a guy kissed her when she didnt have a choice.

It seems quite ridiculous doesn't it? "

It does, the current spate of social experiments some people insist on inflicting on the young are causing me some concern.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Basically she is banning her child from watching movies, Disney in particular, which show the woman as weak..that is the impression I get

Then another actress has said about how Snow white was essentially violated because a guy kissed her when she didnt have a choice.

It seems quite ridiculous doesn't it? "

Personally, I think it’s about having the discussion about the issues portrayed in the books/tales or films that is important. There’s a myriad of films and literature, all with positive and negative messages in, just frame the conversation and reading/watching is a key educating tool.

It’s the lack of challenge and inhaling all presented media as truth that concerns me.

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By *educedWoman
over a year ago

Birmingham

I think it's important to remember that Disney isn't the authority on fairy tales.

The Little Mermaid isn't about the fishy woman giving something up for a man or how to marry a Prince, it's about consequences.

Some of my fondest memories of my childhood are of the tales and books that I read. Without fairy tales I probably wouldn't have read C. S. Lewis or Tolkien and I certainly wouldn't be the woman I am today sat in my tower, knitting my hair on the only loom left in all the world waiting for a man to whisk me away on his talking horse...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think they were playing to most little girls dreams. Now, some little girls dream of different things and they have had to change.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Oh some of them are very sexist. I don't have the more classic Disney films in my DVD collection. They are a bit outdated in my opinion. My toddler's favourite film at the moment is Moana. Which I think is a beautiful story

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By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

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If it wasn't for Disney no step mother would know how to be wicked.

My favourite is Lady and The Tramp. I like hounds

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By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

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"Oh some of them are very sexist. I don't have the more classic Disney films in my DVD collection. They are a bit outdated in my opinion. My toddler's favourite film at the moment is Moana. Which I think is a beautiful story

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By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

...

"Basically she is banning her child from watching movies, Disney in particular, which show the woman as weak..that is the impression I get

Then another actress has said about how Snow white was essentially violated because a guy kissed her when she didnt have a choice.

It seems quite ridiculous doesn't it?

It’s the lack of challenge and inhaling all presented media as truth that concerns me. "

What are your concerns?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Basically she is banning her child from watching movies, Disney in particular, which show the woman as weak..that is the impression I get

Then another actress has said about how Snow white was essentially violated because a guy kissed her when she didnt have a choice.

It seems quite ridiculous doesn't it?

It’s the lack of challenge and inhaling all presented media as truth that concerns me.

What are your concerns?"

Those touched on in my second post.

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By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

...

"Basically she is banning her child from watching movies, Disney in particular, which show the woman as weak..that is the impression I get

Then another actress has said about how Snow white was essentially violated because a guy kissed her when she didnt have a choice.

It seems quite ridiculous doesn't it?

It’s the lack of challenge and inhaling all presented media as truth that concerns me.

What are your concerns?

Those touched on in my second post. "

Sorry I missed that

Yes, I think those are some valid concerns.

What film would you make?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I personally think it’s adults imposing their ‘grown up’ thoughts onto children. Kids deserve to be kids and enjoy the innocence of childhood. God knows it’s ripped away from them early enough as it is, without inflicting more adult insecurities on them.

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By *radleywigginsMan
over a year ago

northwest

Jesus.. to answer your question search through a dozen or so of the single girls profiles on this, or even more pertinently, a dating site.

You’ll see a shockingly high number still trotting out the tired old ‘someone to treat me like a princess’ or ‘kissed a load of frogs’ cliche.

Surely as a adult women have to realise that we don’t live in an enchanted forest, a haunted castle or fucking Hollywood.

It’s puts unrealistic expectations upon men and presents women as lazy, goldiggers who only can be respected for their looks or that they’ve bagged the prince.

Effort, education and self-respect would be better things to teach young girls than fairytales.

Sadly for most of these little princess-wannabes they’ll never get near a prince, so instead will target the footballer or the drug dealer that they hop will offer them very nearly the same lifestyle.

It’s very rarely a happy fucking ending.

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By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

...

"Jesus.. to answer your question search through a dozen or so of the single girls profiles on this, or even more pertinently, a dating site.

You’ll see a shockingly high number still trotting out the tired old ‘someone to treat me like a princess’ or ‘kissed a load of frogs’ cliche.

Surely as a adult women have to realise that we don’t live in an enchanted forest, a haunted castle or fucking Hollywood.

It’s puts unrealistic expectations upon men and presents women as lazy, goldiggers who only can be respected for their looks or that they’ve bagged the prince.

Effort, education and self-respect would be better things to teach young girls than fairytales.

It’s very rarely a happy fucking ending."

strong views

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By *iss.Honey OP Woman
over a year ago

...

"I personally think it’s adults imposing their ‘grown up’ thoughts onto children. Kids deserve to be kids and enjoy the innocence of childhood. God knows it’s ripped away from them early enough as it is, without inflicting more adult insecurities on them."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Jesus.. to answer your question search through a dozen or so of the single girls profiles on this, or even more pertinently, a dating site.

You’ll see a shockingly high number still trotting out the tired old ‘someone to treat me like a princess’ or ‘kissed a load of frogs’ cliche.

Surely as a adult women have to realise that we don’t live in an enchanted forest, a haunted castle or fucking Hollywood.

It’s puts unrealistic expectations upon men and presents women as lazy, goldiggers who only can be respected for their looks or that they’ve bagged the prince.

Effort, education and self-respect would be better things to teach young girls than fairytales.

It’s very rarely a happy fucking ending.

strong views "

Patriarchy fucks guys and the girls just as much

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's worth noting that many of these tales began with an oral tradition that stretches back millenia and in their original form can be found in multiple cultures throughout history. The term 'fairy tale' was first coined by d'Aulnoy C17th and stuck. Most modern fairy tales are merely an adaptation or variation of these.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Basically she is banning her child from watching movies, Disney in particular, which show the woman as weak..that is the impression I get

Then another actress has said about how Snow white was essentially violated because a guy kissed her when she didnt have a choice.

It seems quite ridiculous doesn't it? "

Not only that but I wonder how many of them would turn down a role so to uphold their principles?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What a utter load of bollox.. The world's gone mad.. They are children for fucks sake let them be innocent!!!! Shouldn't even be a debate

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By *alandNitaCouple
over a year ago

Scunthorpe

This is my take on it too.

I never wanted to be a princess and was a very ungirly girl...my sister is very girly. We both had the same upbringing.

Fairy tales are just a bit of fun.

Nita

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

And then there was the fairy tale about the bad Princess Quilina who talked too much and wouldn't let the good Prince come into her bed at night. Then he smashed down the door, burnt her parents, gagged her, forced her to work as a slave in the kitchen, and made her accept his nightly visits until she bore 100 beautiful babies for him. And this made her turn into a good princess and they all lived happily ever after.

Seriously though. Some of the old fairy tales aren't too dissimilar. They were written by grumpy old 18th-19th century misogynistic men and we've carried them forward because "ahhhh they're cute kiddy stuff"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just give her a copy of the Bloody Chamber when she's older. The girls all get their own back.

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