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TED - Ideas worth shredding

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

I could never put my finger on why I hated TED talks and the neatly packaged delivery of "knowledge" via an overenthusiastic, nasally transformational secret magic of of _____ story until I found Benjamin Bratton. I'm quoting the tail end of his talk.

Do you like or loate them and why?

***********

One TED speaker said recently about his work, “Now that this boundary is removed, the only boundary left is our imagination.” Wrong.

If we really want transformation, we have to slog through the hard stuff — the history, economics, philosophy, art, the ambiguities, and contradictions. Because focusing just on technology, or just on innovation, actually prevents transformation. We need to raise the level of general understanding to the level of complexity of the systems in which we are embedded and which are embedded in us. And this is not about “personal stories of inspiration”. It’s about the hard difficult work of demystification and reconceptualization. More Copernicus, less Tony Robbins.

At a societal level, the bottom line is that if we invest in things that make us feel good but which don’t work, and don’t invest in things which don’t make us feel good, but which may solve problems, then our fate is that in the long run it will just get harder and harder to feel good about not solving problems.

And in this case, the placebo is not just ineffective — it’s harmful. Because it takes your interest, and energy and outrage, and diverts into this black hole of affectation. “Keep calm and carry on innovating” — is that the real message of TED? To me it’s not inspirational, it’s cynical.

In the US, the rightwing has certain media channels that allow it to bracket reality. Other constituencies have TED.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

TED who?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

It's a movie about a bear who comes to life.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 21/07/18 19:39:49]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

SUPER TED

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think you might have to explain what a TED talk is before someone that thinks they are the greatest living comedian tries to make a joke about a bear.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I tried to read this. Zoned out about halfway through the first paragraph as I've no idea what the entire thread is about, sorry

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By *etLikeMan
over a year ago

most fundamental aspects

TED talks have their good and bad. It’s like any TV documentary or book. Some styles I like, others you might like.

Definitely worth checking them out via YouTube if you like to learn new ideas about things

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I think you might have to explain what a TED talk is before someone that thinks they are the greatest living comedian tries to make a joke about a bear.

"

Surely you realise how pointless that would be

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I quite like a ted talk as a different angle to the usual academic conferences I go to, however this particularly resonates with me as essentially I would call this a wicked problem, we can’t do anything transformational through innovation until we understand the problem, I wish our government would look back and work out where they went wrong to put things right, would save me a job !!

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Another choice quotes

***************

I mean, think about it: a scientist who creates real knowledge should be more like a journalist who recycles fake insights. This is not popularization. This is taking something with substance and value and coring it out so that it can be swallowed without chewing. This is not how we’ll confront our most frightening problems, this is one of our most frightening problems.

And so what is TED? TED is perhaps a proposition, one that says if we talk about world-changing ideas enough, then the world will change. Well, this is not true either. And that’s the second problem. TED of course stands for Technology, Entertainment, Design. To me, TED stands for: middlebrow megachurch infotainment

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By *etLikeMan
over a year ago

most fundamental aspects


"I quite like a ted talk as a different angle to the usual academic conferences I go to, however this particularly resonates with me as essentially I would call this a wicked problem, we can’t do anything transformational through innovation until we understand the problem, I wish our government would look back and work out where they went wrong to put things right, would save me a job !! "

This for me too

A good (and there are some bad ones) TED talk, can often summarise neatly what ten keynote conference speeches can.

I would also happily be out of my job if things had been properly (and fairly) implemented in the first place

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"

I would also happily be out of my job if things had been properly (and fairly) implemented in the first place "

And rightfully so.

You'll get what I mean, if you check out the full talk.

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By *etLikeMan
over a year ago

most fundamental aspects

There’s one by the highly successful Shonda Rhymes. In it she talks about saying YES to things.

I appreciate OP that you might think it’s all a bit pretentious. I agree that some see it as infotainment too.

What I take issue with, is the assertion that positive thoughts have little value. People do things because they believe they can.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"There’s one by the highly successful Shonda Rhymes. In it she talks about saying YES to things.

I appreciate OP that you might think it’s all a bit pretentious. I agree that some see it as infotainment too.

What I take issue with, is the assertion that positive thoughts have little value. People do things because they believe they can. "

I like that one too and Hans Rosling was off the charts excellent. I'm of course generalising and it's more of a protest about where we learn from nowadays and how we are being dumbed down by oversimplification prettily packaged.

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By *etLikeMan
over a year ago

most fundamental aspects

I accept that. It’s an indictment of the short attention spans bred into some, and forced into others by osmosis.

Tl;Dr attitudes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Zzzzzz zzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz wake me up at 174

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By *etLikeMan
over a year ago

most fundamental aspects


"Zzzzzz zzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz wake me up at 174"

I see what you did there

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Wtf

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have seen many that I enjoyed and many that I learned from. I think it's a decent format, and speaking for myself, as someone with a terrible attention span, a good talker on TED will keep me engrossed.

My personal favourite was the one done by Jojo Mayer on rythm, communication and technology.

Check it out

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Are we talking about the pot smoking talking teddy bear?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Zzzzzz zzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz wake me up at 174

I see what you did there "

I did nothing i said wake me at 174 not the next bloody post ffs

Zzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Well inovation for the sake of inovation is asanine however we're nowhere near there yet in certain fields. TED talks have their positives and negatives as any other medium of communication does. How many people want to read, or ever understand a scientific paper?? TED talks do make them more accessible. However, some of the fringe TED stuff isn't, and shouldn't, be put on the same pedastal as the main TED stuff.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Thanks for switching me on to this talk. Yeah. Very much on my wavelength. There is much to be concerned about in this whole sphere.

The truism that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing has never been truer. The Internet is thriving with masses of people with a little knowledge all agreeing with each other and, through that, gaining the kind of certainty that comes through consensus which was only previously found in the hardest science.

The mass of people misunderstand science, none worse so than those who profess to understand it, and it's this that's leading science to the precipice of uselessness and failure, not religion or superstition.

And as for complex political activism and thought? That's now been siphoned off into utterly useless online petitions and like buttons. Even the vehicles of people's online expression are almost certainly, if not run by intelligence agencies, then used by them.

We are sleep walking towards the fall of civilisation imo. Like with Rome the rot is starting from the inside and the barbarians are knocking on the gates. It's starting from the fact that whilst there's never been more people exposed to as much knowledge, the quality of that knowledge is steeply declining. Trump is only the external manifestation of that

Stephen Hawking was laid to rest next to Newton. That's just nonsense. The guy wrote a popular book. The key theory he gained notoriety for was later falsified by himself. None of his work had any basis in reality. Yet we bury him next to Newton Richard Dawkins, forget any of his other crazy ramblings, gained scientific credibility for claiming genes were selfish. That claim doesn't even hold up as a metaphor. This is who civilisations laud as great thinkers when they've totally lost any sense of what great thought is. We're so fucked and bite sized inspirational "aren't we all getting cleverer" intellectual video pep talks aren't part of the solution... they're part of the problem

Haha rant over

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By *eneRoissyMan
over a year ago

Nailsworth

TLDR

Ironic really when the discussion was about encapsulating complex subjects in bitesized infotainment videos

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The irony is strong in this thread.

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By *eneRoissyMan
over a year ago

Nailsworth

Morality, ethics... What would Jesus do?

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By *eneRoissyMan
over a year ago

Nailsworth

[Removed by poster at 21/07/18 23:01:50]

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By *eneRoissyMan
over a year ago

Nailsworth


"

We are sleep walking towards the fall of civilisation imo. Like with Rome the rot is starting from the inside and the barbarians are knocking on the gates.

"

Shame the forum doesn't have a like button. A voting system would be good too

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By *etLikeMan
over a year ago

most fundamental aspects

I was not referring to the concept of TED talks when I mentioned Tl;Dr. It was a reply to the post above.

Therefore it’s all gone a little paradoxically ironic

...Sometimes those who do read, do not read fully

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"What I take issue with, is the assertion that positive thoughts have little value. People do things because they believe they can. "

Positive thinking is only positive when it's not delusional in a detrimental sense. Take brexit...

"Hey man don't worry that we're totally tearing up the rule book about how our country and its borders work in direct contradiction to absolutely all the expert advice and data about what's in our best interest. Stop being so negative. Just think positively and it'll all work out... you'll see"

Brexit is a kamikaze of positive delusional thinking

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Some people have too much time on their hands!!!

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

What's tldr?

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By *iamondCougarWoman
over a year ago

Norfuck! / Lincolnshire

Crikey - a proper grown up thread

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By *y Favorite PornstarCouple
over a year ago

Basingstoke

TED talks rapidly went down hill a few years ago, I haven't fully understood why.

They started out scientific with experts speaking and perhaps they ran out of genuine experts... most talks now are full on opinion pieces with the TED branding making them sound authorative. There's a massive left wing bias and some absolute crap that gets published. I also read how some 'contraversial' talks were never shown on TEDs channel. Of course contraversial translates to 'conservative'.

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By *y Favorite PornstarCouple
over a year ago

Basingstoke


"Thanks for switching me on to this talk. Yeah. Very much on my wavelength. There is much to be concerned about in this whole sphere.

The truism that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing has never been truer. The Internet is thriving with masses of people with a little knowledge all agreeing with each other and, through that, gaining the kind of certainty that comes through consensus which was only previously found in the hardest science.

The mass of people misunderstand science, none worse so than those who profess to understand it, and it's this that's leading science to the precipice of uselessness and failure, not religion or superstition.

And as for complex political activism and thought? That's now been siphoned off into utterly useless online petitions and like buttons. Even the vehicles of people's online expression are almost certainly, if not run by intelligence agencies, then used by them.

We are sleep walking towards the fall of civilisation imo. Like with Rome the rot is starting from the inside and the barbarians are knocking on the gates. It's starting from the fact that whilst there's never been more people exposed to as much knowledge, the quality of that knowledge is steeply declining. Trump is only the external manifestation of that

Stephen Hawking was laid to rest next to Newton. That's just nonsense. The guy wrote a popular book. The key theory he gained notoriety for was later falsified by himself. None of his work had any basis in reality. Yet we bury him next to Newton Richard Dawkins, forget any of his other crazy ramblings, gained scientific credibility for claiming genes were selfish. That claim doesn't even hold up as a metaphor. This is who civilisations laud as great thinkers when they've totally lost any sense of what great thought is. We're so fucked and bite sized inspirational "aren't we all getting cleverer" intellectual video pep talks aren't part of the solution... they're part of the problem

Haha rant over "

Do you understand science?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"TED talks rapidly went down hill a few years ago, I haven't fully understood why.

They started out scientific with experts speaking and perhaps they ran out of genuine experts... most talks now are full on opinion pieces with the TED branding making them sound authorative. There's a massive left wing bias and some absolute crap that gets published. I also read how some 'contraversial' talks were never shown on TEDs channel. Of course contraversial translates to 'conservative'. "

Did you see Rupert Sheldrakes talk that was banned from TED? There's nothing particularly controversial about it except for the fact that he pulls science's constants into doubt. The TED panel of adjudicators is far from unbiased and contains several card carrying militant atheists with an axe to grind.

Do I understand science? I certainly wouldn't be as precocious as to imagine I understand all its theories and methods. I think the time has passed when anyone but specialists in their field can really claim such understanding... and in some cases even they will admit they're a bit flummoxed by some stuff. But I feel I've got a much better grasp of what science is and how it works than many of my peers. But that's no great achievement. All you've got to do is read up on it from a more critical angle that's all. It's that which most people have got wrong... as well as the theories and methods, which is much more understandable and forgivable

The greater trouble, in the context of this thread, is the growth of science that doesn't understand science. Computers have particularly hastened this evolution, with scientists now more obsessed with procuring vast amounts of data than understanding it. A vast amount of our current science has stepped beyond human capabilities and comes to us through technology. Do gravitational waves exist? Or is there a glitch in the sensors? Who has the intelligence and knowledge to answer such a simple question? Maybe no one. That's the problem right there.

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By *etLikeMan
over a year ago

most fundamental aspects


"TED talks rapidly went down hill a few years ago, I haven't fully understood why.

. "

TEDex and all the other pseudo talks might be one reason.

It’s become more of a mass market than its original niche, hence a lot of the dumbing down, in order to appeal to the lowest common denominator

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By *y Favorite PornstarCouple
over a year ago

Basingstoke


"TED talks rapidly went down hill a few years ago, I haven't fully understood why.

.

TEDex and all the other pseudo talks might be one reason.

It’s become more of a mass market than its original niche, hence a lot of the dumbing down, in order to appeal to the lowest common denominator

"

I rage quit my YouTube subscription after about the 5th talk that didn't reference a single study in support of what they were saying

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By *y Favorite PornstarCouple
over a year ago

Basingstoke


"TED talks rapidly went down hill a few years ago, I haven't fully understood why.

They started out scientific with experts speaking and perhaps they ran out of genuine experts... most talks now are full on opinion pieces with the TED branding making them sound authorative. There's a massive left wing bias and some absolute crap that gets published. I also read how some 'contraversial' talks were never shown on TEDs channel. Of course contraversial translates to 'conservative'.

Did you see Rupert Sheldrakes talk that was banned from TED? There's nothing particularly controversial about it except for the fact that he pulls science's constants into doubt. The TED panel of adjudicators is far from unbiased and contains several card carrying militant atheists with an axe to grind.

Do I understand science? I certainly wouldn't be as precocious as to imagine I understand all its theories and methods. I think the time has passed when anyone but specialists in their field can really claim such understanding... and in some cases even they will admit they're a bit flummoxed by some stuff. But I feel I've got a much better grasp of what science is and how it works than many of my peers. But that's no great achievement. All you've got to do is read up on it from a more critical angle that's all. It's that which most people have got wrong... as well as the theories and methods, which is much more understandable and forgivable

The greater trouble, in the context of this thread, is the growth of science that doesn't understand science. Computers have particularly hastened this evolution, with scientists now more obsessed with procuring vast amounts of data than understanding it. A vast amount of our current science has stepped beyond human capabilities and comes to us through technology. Do gravitational waves exist? Or is there a glitch in the sensors? Who has the intelligence and knowledge to answer such a simple question? Maybe no one. That's the problem right there. "

What you talk about science, you seem to have a boarder (or narrower) term than me, I can't tell. We've got the scientific method which is hypothesis (optional), experiment, results, eat, sleep and repeat. That hasn't changed in quite a while so I think most people get that. Understand results generally requires some statistical knowledge that most people don't have but it can be explained to people that understand the meaning of the word 'average'. Then you've got scientists who come with all the problems on humans. Which part of that do you think is complex?

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