FabSwingers.com forum: HR Advice- offer of employment

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Hi folks. I’ve been offered a job which I’ve accepted. My new employer has sent me a new starter form and a contract. I’ve filled in both and returned. In the offer email they asked for two references. I have supplied them ( but to date they’ve not contacted them). Here is where my issue starts. No where in the employement contract does it state “conditions of offer”. So I have contacted HR asking have I meet all the conditions to move the offer from conditional to unconditional ( i am assuming it’s the references only). I am now really peeved off as im asking this lady direct questions and she’s using phrases such as “ all seems ok” or we “ seem on track”. This employement is due to start on Tuesday 24th July. I’m

Currently I’m working freelance to a company. But I’m

At a lose. I simply cannot understand why she will not state in writing if the conditions are meet.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hi folks. I’ve been offered a job which I’ve accepted. My new employer has sent me a new starter form and a contract. I’ve filled in both and returned. In the offer email they asked for two references. I have supplied them ( but to date they’ve not contacted them). Here is where my issue starts. No where in the employement contract does it state “conditions of offer”. So I have contacted HR asking have I meet all the conditions to move the offer from conditional to unconditional ( i am assuming it’s the references only). I am now really peeved off as im asking this lady direct questions and she’s using phrases such as “ all seems ok” or we “ seem on track”. This employement is due to start on Tuesday 24th July. I’m

Currently I’m working freelance to a company. But I’m

At a lose. I simply cannot understand why she will not state in writing if the conditions are meet. "

Surely they wouldnt offer you employment if the conditions werent met?

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By *an_buryMan
over a year ago

Nottingham

Someone just using standard lingo because they are not switched on enough.

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By *an_buryMan
over a year ago

Nottingham

Have they sent you a letter confirming start date?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Have they sent you a letter confirming start date?"
. No not a letter but the contract of employment states the start date. I’ve signed the contract of employment and returned. I’ve stated in the email I accept the offer. I maybe coming across as a sceptic. But it’s my background I work in construction contracts daily. The simple fact of the matter is this conpmsny asked me directly for references so they quote “could contact directly”. As of today they’ve still not done that. So in my eyes they’ve not closed the circle their end so in turn it’s not closed my end.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Currently I’m working freelance to a company. But I’m

At a lose. I simply cannot understand why she will not state in writing if the conditions are meet.

Surely they wouldnt offer you employment if the conditions werent met?"
From reading up offers are two fold. Conditional and unconditional. Conditional could be pending medical, references etc. Unconditional means jobs yours. In my offer letter no mention of conditions.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

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By *an_buryMan
over a year ago

Nottingham

If it's signed and returned, I'd turn up on Tuesday!

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

"
I ommitted a job from my cv

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv "

Stupid thing to do as it could bite you on the arse at any point.

But that won't vme out in a reference

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv "

Do you have to put every job you have ever done on a CV?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv

Stupid thing to do as it could bite you on the arse at any point.

But that won't vme out in a reference"
I agree totally it was silly. And no it will not come out in references. My issue lies around the fact that HR person in new company is being wafty around the conditions of contract. She’s simply putting fuck all in writing. Which is annoying. Within the contract it does not mention any conditions. Yes I’m being over cautious

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv

Do you have to put every job you have ever done on a CV?

"
legally no

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv

Do you have to put every job you have ever done on a CV?

The opinion is you don't. How will they find out you have not put every job on your CV?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv

Do you have to put every job you have ever done on a CV?

legally no "

I've just read a few pieces of advice and they all say you don't have to and some employers only want the most recent or most relevant. Do companies have time and resources to research if prospective employees have had more jobs than they have included?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv

Do you have to put every job you have ever done on a CV?

legally no

"
probably not. My issue is not around that now. The issue is this lady is not answering direct questions around what the conditions of contact are.

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By *irginieWoman
over a year ago

Near Marlborough

So I start a new job on Monday.

Like you I signed and returned the contract but my employment is conditional on DBS and some other checks. I know the DBS is done cos I had the cert in the post.

I have had nothing to say all is good for Monday.

Once contracts are signed they’d need to withdraw the job offer in writing. So

I’d say turn up for work next week.

And no. Missing out a job is fine as long as you haven’t manufactured something else to cover it.

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By *orkie321bWoman
over a year ago

Nottingham

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv

Stupid thing to do as it could bite you on the arse at any point.

But that won't vme out in a reference I agree totally it was silly. And no it will not come out in references. My issue lies around the fact that HR person in new company is being wafty around the conditions of contract. She’s simply putting fuck all in writing. Which is annoying. Within the contract it does not mention any conditions. Yes I’m being over cautious "

OP perhaps you could look at the responses you are getting from the HR lady in another way.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"So I start a new job on Monday.

Like you I signed and returned the contract but my employment is conditional on DBS and some other checks. I know the DBS is done cos I had the cert in the post.

I have had nothing to say all is good for Monday.

Once contracts are signed they’d need to withdraw the job offer in writing. So

I’d say turn up for work next week.

And no. Missing out a job is fine as long as you haven’t manufactured something else to cover it.

"
It does not state anywhere my employement is subject to any conditions. I cannot locate that anywhere. So I asked the HR department of my new employer was my employement subject to any conditions. The reply I got was laughable and did not address the issue. I went one step futher and asked direct “ have I meet the conditions of contract ( if there is any) and can you confirm if my employement is now unconditional. I stated within my email I wanted to ensure all was in order before submitting my resignation in

Current post. The reply again did nor answer my direct questions. I don’t want to assume the conditions are only references. I want them to confirm what the conditions are ( if there is any). I’m simply aggrieved as she’s not answering my questions direct.

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By *W ChapMan
over a year ago

Swindon

Few points....are you sure your CoE / Offer letter doesn't mention subject to Satisfactory references, normally in the offer letter. This letter and CoE form you legal contract.

I would forget the vague questions about have I filled the criteria and just ask whether my start date of xx is ok and confirm where should I report to.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv

Stupid thing to do as it could bite you on the arse at any point.

OP perhaps you could look at the responses you are getting from the HR lady in another way.

I used to work in recruitment for a large company. Our department was split into 2 section, one half responsible for advertising and shortlisting candidates, the other for chasing up references once an offer was made etc. Anyone who phoned up would simply be speaking to someone in the call centre who most likely would have no idea whether the job offer was conditional and they simply cannot answer your questions satisfactorily."
Hi thanks for your reply. I’m dealing directly with the HR representative who formed part of the 3 person interview panel. The same person phoned to offer me the job. And the same person emailed me my contract of employment etc. This same lady asked me in writing for two references to contact “directly”. I’ve supllied those references. She’s to date not contacted them. So I emailed and asked what the conditions of employment were. She never answered direct. I followed this up with a phone call and stated I was only asking the question as I wanted to be sure that all was ok for my start date and I did not want to

Submit my notice until i was sure of that. That was Monday. Today I emailed asking direct was my conditions of contract meet and was all in place for 24th July. Again I got a wafty reply

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don’t think some places do proper checks at all or follow the rules and procedures,I know a few people who have got into big named companies with criminal records fake references or references from a worker in that company,points on driving licences where it clearly stated needs a clean record so all depends really.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Few points....are you sure your CoE / Offer letter doesn't mention subject to Satisfactory references, normally in the offer letter. This letter and CoE form you legal contract.

I would forget the vague questions about have I filled the criteria and just ask whether my start date of xx is ok and confirm where should I report to.

Ref missing a job off, it could be construed as misleading and if I as your employer found out I would want to know why you failed to mention it (ie continuity of employment etc) If you're on linked in make sure this matches what your cv says...I assume it does because many employers will double check. Hope this makes sense and all goes well. "
Hi there was no letter. It was via email. The email contained a contract which I’ve signed an returned. The email asked for two references which I supplied. That was on 6th July. Start date of job is 24th July. As of today 18th she’s not contacted the references. Thus my question to

Her. Is the references a condition of offer. LinkedIn does not show omitted job lol

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By *W ChapMan
over a year ago

Swindon

" Hi there was no letter. It was via email. The email contained a contract which I’ve signed an returned. The email asked for two references which I supplied. That was on 6th July. Start date of job is 24th July. As of today 18th she’s not contacted the references. Thus my question to

Her. Is the references a condition of offer. LinkedIn does not show omitted job lol

"
Email is pretty much the same as letter.......and they wanted you to sign the attachment or a signed paper copy. From what you're saying it's a person's inefficiency or lack of knowledge you're dealing with rather than anything untoward. I am surprised that the offer isn't subject to references though.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Her. Is the references a condition of offer. LinkedIn does not show omitted job lol

Email is pretty much the same as letter.......and they wanted you to sign the attachment or a signed paper copy. From what you're saying it's a person's inefficiency or lack of knowledge you're dealing with rather than anything untoward. I am surprised that the offer isn't subject to references though. "
I’m surprised myself. But it does not state anywhere “ conditions”. I work in construction contracts so I’m ok we these things. My issue is I know she’s not contacted my references. I’d rather she did

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv

Do you have to put every job you have ever done on a CV?

legally no

A lot would depend on how the job has been concealed. Many employers want to know why there has been a gap in employment. So if the OP has lied by extending a position he has misled them. Which is fine. People lie on CVs all the time. But people never omit roles for a good reason so in 6 months time when it turns out the former employer us a client and the op is asked to worun for them, what do you say or do?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Given your previous posts just what is it you are worried your new employer will find out about?

I ommitted a job from my cv

Do you have to put every job you have ever done on a CV?

legally no

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By *W ChapMan
over a year ago

Swindon

" My issue is I know she’s not contacted my references. I’d rather she did "

Yep understand.....may just be a workload thing, taking references is a pain in the ass.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

HR is a fun place.

Firstly... They can ask for references but never actually check them... Depends largely on the role and risk you are exposed to.

Secondly... They can sack you within 2 years without reason and without risk of tribunal anyway so i wouldnt panic too much.

Are you references likely to let you down if they do get them,?

If not then... Enjoy your new job

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

" My issue is I know she’s not contacted my references. I’d rather she did

Yep understand.....may just be a workload thing, taking references is a pain in the ass. "
I know I’m acting OTT. But I simply cannot understand why she would ask for references and not contact them. The sceptic in me whilst her responsibility sees this as a possible stumbling block for me.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"HR is a fun place.

Firstly... They can ask for references but never actually check them... Depends largely on the role and risk you are exposed to.

Secondly... They can sack you within 2 years without reason and without risk of tribunal anyway so i wouldnt panic too much.

Are you references likely to let you down if they do get them,?

If not then... Enjoy your new job"
The references will be very positive

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"HR is a fun place.

Firstly... They can ask for references but never actually check them... Depends largely on the role and risk you are exposed to.

Secondly... They can sack you within 2 years without reason and without risk of tribunal anyway so i wouldnt panic too much.

Are you references likely to let you down if they do get them,?

If not then... Enjoy your new job The references will be very positive "

Dont panic then. They cant actually give you a bad reference anyway... Only refuse to give one at all.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"HR is a fun place.

Firstly... They can ask for references but never actually check them... Depends largely on the role and risk you are exposed to.

Secondly... They can sack you within 2 years without reason and without risk of tribunal anyway so i wouldnt panic too much.

Are you references likely to let you down if they do get them,?

If not then... Enjoy your new job"
Do you work in HR

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Turn up. It’s just admin, they may not even take up the references.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Turn up. It’s just admin, they may not even take up the references. "
Thank

You! I’m sorry to be such a sceptic but I have to protect myself

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By *sylockeWoman
over a year ago

East Anglia

You can always call ACAS and get some legal advice on this. Are you worried your references will not support your appointment?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I used to own a large high at opticians with 40 staff.

As retail director its a large part of the job.

I dont do that now but my facts are accurate as of 2017... And nothing has changed.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"You can always call ACAS and get some legal advice on this. Are you worried your references will not support your appointment?

"
They will

Support it. My issue is I’m unaware of any conditions of contract. And when I ask the question verbally and in writing I get no answer.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I used to own a large high at opticians with 40 staff.

As retail director its a large part of the job.

I dont do that now but my facts are accurate as of 2017... And nothing has changed. "
lovely! I can see how would you know this area! ( you like that)

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By *W ChapMan
over a year ago

Swindon

I dont do that now but my facts are accurate as of 2017... And nothing has changed. "

I sort of do and ^^^^^ is correct albeit the normal risk of Age/Sex/Race etc discrimination.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I dont do that now but my facts are accurate as of 2017... And nothing has changed.

I sort of do and ^^^^^ is correct albeit the normal risk of Age/Sex/Race etc discrimination. "
that’s why I fill in each form I’m a bi sexual Irish traveller it would scare any HR staff

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By *layfulfoxMan
over a year ago

nowhere

As far as I'm aware references are provided if needed, contacting them is optional and not a requirement.

In an ideal world everyone would be reference checked and for vital roles or large companies they may be but it's not essential.

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By *eedsandyMan
over a year ago

Leeds

Currently I’m working freelance to a company. But I’m

At a lose. I simply cannot understand why she will not state in writing if the conditions are meet. "

You have an unconditional contract in this matter.

You don't say that the offer was conditional upon receipt of satisfactory references, but even if it was, then as they have failed to contact the referees, clearly it can not longer be conditional on the references.

You have signed the contract, so you know the terms of your employment and you should report for work next Tuesday.

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