FabSwingers.com forum: What makes an act of terrorism?

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I've not heard the latest on today's events because I'd rather wait until the actual truth is reported than hours and hours of speculation and invasive pictures of a crime scene so I'll wait a bit longer but I've been wondering what actually makes an act of terror?

A guy mounted the pavement and mowed down several pedestrians...are the people of london more terrified of an extremist mowing them down than a d*unk or drugged driver doing the same? Are the police more terrified of being stabbed by an extremist than being stabbed by a gang member or even a football hooligan? Are we more terrified of a plane being brought down by an extremist than by a mechanical fault or an "act of god"?

All these things have the same outcome for the poor victims and their families but the media just love whipping us into a hysterical frenzy over something we as the public cannot possibly prevent.

Would the extremists lose some of their "power" if we refused to call them terrorists and just referred to them as deluded dickheads?

Or are we right to be terrified of the "enemy hiding in plain sight"?

Personally I'm no more terrified of them as I am of anything else that could kill me. If I end up dead I'm certain I will not be interested in the motives of the thing that killed me.

I'm not trying to belittle today's or previous events in any way it just winds me up how the media seem to treat us as puppets "be offended here, be terrified there, be angry at the world's injustice but only when we tell you to be"

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

O.P.

Common sense and level headedness.

Welcomed x

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Excellent post

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I always, maybe wrongly, assumed that it the intent to cause terror rather than actually causing it.

That said, I like your perspective.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *unandbuckCouple
over a year ago

Sheffield

I'm not terrified of them, and don't modify my behaviour because of them.

The huge difference in them and an accident, is the deliberate nature of killing of innocent people.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ystical_InkedBBWWoman
over a year ago

somewhere in the Shire of Derby

Extremists feed on other people's fear, that's how they gain strength and the media is their biggest weapon.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My Ex Girlfriend is going to see Craig David at the O2 this weekend and she's scared stiff because of what's happened today.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *opsy RogersWoman
over a year ago

London

"My Ex Girlfriend is going to see Craig David at the O2 this weekend and she's scared stiff because of what's happened today.

There was a woman here years ago that wouldn't let her children go into her local town because she was convinced they would become victims of an attack.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"My Ex Girlfriend is going to see Craig David at the O2 this weekend and she's scared stiff because of what's happened today.

There was a woman here years ago that wouldn't let her children go into her local town because she was convinced they would become victims of an attack."

I used to be like this myself when I was younger...until I was nearly killed by a sausage roll... kind of makes you realise you're not safe anywhere lol

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *unandbuckCouple
over a year ago

Sheffield

"My Ex Girlfriend is going to see Craig David at the O2 this weekend and she's scared stiff because of what's happened today.

There was a woman here years ago that wouldn't let her children go into her local town because she was convinced they would become victims of an attack.

I used to be like this myself when I was younger...until I was nearly killed by a sausage roll... kind of makes you realise you're not safe anywhere lol"

Hmmm a home grown pastry incident, had it converted to a halal sausage roll?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"My Ex Girlfriend is going to see Craig David at the O2 this weekend and she's scared stiff because of what's happened today.

There was a woman here years ago that wouldn't let her children go into her local town because she was convinced they would become victims of an attack.

I used to be like this myself when I was younger...until I was nearly killed by a sausage roll... kind of makes you realise you're not safe anywhere lol

Hmmm a home grown pastry incident, had it converted to a halal sausage roll?"

Shit I never thought of that!

Oh the terror

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Depends what media outlets you use.

The definition also doesn't mention that anyone has to be scared.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not terrified of them, and don't modify my behaviour because of them.

The huge difference in them and an accident, is the deliberate nature of killing of innocent people."

This, it's a legal definition to show the intent..

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ubSirVient-DefinitionCouple
over a year ago

dukinfield

"My Ex Girlfriend is going to see Craig David at the O2 this weekend and she's scared stiff because of what's happened today.

There was a woman here years ago that wouldn't let her children go into her local town because she was convinced they would become victims of an attack."

Having been through one bomb experience already in Warrington for years it bothered me and adjusted my behaviour as in being nervous around crowds and in town centres then I realised that it's what they wanted. There's nothing scarier than fear it's self. I refused to be a victim any longer. If we change our lives and stop doing what we want through fear of what could happen then they've won already..

That said going to see Craig David would scare me more than anything!!!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Extremists feed on other people's fear, that's how they gain strength and the media is their biggest weapon."

Remaining on the news agenda is the biggest act of terror they inflict on us all.

OP, we naturally ascribe different emotions to the method of someone's death but, you are correct, the outcome is the same.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Let them do it. I dont watch the news and i wont Watch it either or read papers. Just get on with our lives let them waste their time on stupid things by killing ppl

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think the main difference is the ability for it to grow and spread.

Yes your just as likely to be run over but then its not as likely that the car will then run into a nuclear power station with a bomb or drop 50 tonnes of aluminium phosphate into your local reservoir.

Yes the actual crime is small proportionally? but it has the ability to become very larger from just one or two committed people

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's the intent behind the act that makes it an act of terror.

Our desire for instant news means we're drip fed information, often incorrect & speculative. One area where quality over quantity should be applied.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I've not heard the latest on today's events because I'd rather wait until the actual truth is reported than hours and hours of speculation and invasive pictures of a crime scene so I'll wait a bit longer but I've been wondering what actually makes an act of terror?

All these things have the same outcome for the poor victims and their families but the media just love whipping us into a hysterical frenzy over something we as the public cannot possibly prevent.

Would the extremists lose some of their "power" if we refused to call them terrorists and just referred to them as deluded dickheads?

Or are we right to be terrified of the "enemy hiding in plain sight"?

Personally I'm no more terrified of them as I am of anything else that could kill me. If I end up dead I'm certain I will not be interested in the motives of the thing that killed me.

Totally agree.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's the intent behind the act that makes it an act of terror.

Our desire for instant news means we're drip fed information, often incorrect & speculative. One area where quality over quantity should be applied."

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We have the ira bastard's here in Northern Ireland you kinda get used to hearing about some poor police officer and others getting killed and hurt.

It's ashame that anyone would kill and am really upset about the people left behind.

When my uncle was killed by the bastard's many years ago.

All he was doing was his job.

It took weeks for him to die. It tore apart the family.And we still hurting. And i never will forget the bastard.

And hearing about one of the bastard's being dead me me really happy.

So my thoughts go out to their families.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We have the ira bastard's here in Northern Ireland you kinda get used to hearing about some poor police officer and others getting killed and hurt.

It's ashame that anyone would kill and am really upset about the people left behind.

When my uncle was killed by the bastard's many years ago.

All he was doing was his job.

It took weeks for him to die. It tore apart the family.And we still hurting. And i never will forget the bastard.

And hearing about one of the bastard's being dead me me really happy.

So my thoughts go out to their families.

"
.

Wasnt there a bomb up there today trying to kill police officers, thought i heard it on the radio?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We have the ira bastard's here in Northern Ireland you kinda get used to hearing about some poor police officer and others getting killed and hurt.

It's ashame that anyone would kill and am really upset about the people left behind.

When my uncle was killed by the bastard's many years ago.

All he was doing was his job.

It took weeks for him to die. It tore apart the family.And we still hurting. And i never will forget the bastard.

And hearing about one of the bastard's being dead me me really happy.

So my thoughts go out to their families.

Wasnt there a bomb up there today trying to kill police officers, thought i heard it on the radio?"

yes last night around 8.30 in Strabane. Lucky no one killed. But only made news for 5 mins. Oh i forgot we at peace with the ira bastard's.

Don't want to upset anyone about a murderer dieing on Tues .

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There is (and has never been) a single definition of 'terrorism' in use worldwide.

The latest UK definition, from The Terrorism Act (2000), is readily available online and has been criticised for its ambiguity.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is (and has never been) a single definition of 'terrorism' in use worldwide.

The latest UK definition, from The Terrorism Act (2000), is readily available online and has been criticised for its ambiguity.

Is not, even!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Agree with op completely!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As a Londoner, this kind of thing doesn't make me the least bit worried. Terrorism is actually such a tiny, tiny fraction of a threat that I don't think we should let it influence our decision making one bit.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Stay strong x

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is (and has never been) a single definition of 'terrorism' in use worldwide.

The latest UK definition, from The Terrorism Act (2000), is readily available online and has been criticised for its ambiguity.

Maybe it's better for it not to be defined as the Terrorists have something to be defined by then. Somehow they'd get a kick out of meeting the definition.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

It only serves to achieve its aim if your sadly unfortunate to be caught up in it or you choose to let it change how you live..

and that is what they want so apart from being vigilant which we have needed to be for several decades with one group or another, fuck em..

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

if its going to happen it will happen..

I was working in Manchester when the IRA bomb went off so I know the level of fear and panic an act of terrorism can cause..

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is (and has never been) a single definition of 'terrorism' in use worldwide.

The latest UK definition, from The Terrorism Act (2000), is readily available online and has been criticised for its ambiguity.

Maybe it's better for it not to be defined as the Terrorists have something to be defined by then. Somehow they'd get a kick out of meeting the definition. "

To be honest, they'd be lucky if they could work out whether they were or not. Plus, you need a definition so that crimes that definitely aren't terrorism don't get prosecuted as such.

Definitions are there for protection from the state, not to facilitate it. Hence they'll do anything to avoid a detailed definition of state crime.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Of one thing I am convinced. There should be a law to bring in a "news blackout" for the first couple of hours at least after such a terror attack. That way, the emergency services can get on with their important jobs - and we may get some proper FACTS released appropriately at the right time. Many journalists are egotistical maniacs who sensationalise at every opportunity unfortunately. I'd rather have a senior police officer co-ordinating the investigation than pampering to journalist vermin by having to provide updates from the off (and I know you can't tar them all with the same brush).

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *orwegian BlueMan
over a year ago

Iceland, but Aldi is closer..

Having spent my entire working career having to deal with terrorism, whether disarming explosive devices during my time in the forces and more recently training others in disposal and dems, I learnt at an early age what terrorism meant..

It meant fear.. The ability to affect others way of life.

It only takes one actual event to spawn the fear that another attack could happen and play upon that fear with hoaxes and disinformation..

We stand united and say "we won't let it affect us" but in truth it does and already has..

Britain has the most cctv in the world thanks to the threat from the IRA..

We can no longer take liquids on planes thanks to an Al Quaida plot..

In a few days, electronic devices larger than a phone will be excluded from cabin baggage.. Just imagine the fun that'll cause, I've seen people moaning when they have to dispose of nail clippers at airport security, what they gonna be like when asked to drop an ipad in the plastic contraband receptacles!!

Our civil liberties are slowly being eroded because of lawless acts of terror by others that do not agree with our freedom and way of life.

So terrorism doesn't mean anything about the human loss, as you say Op, it could have been a d*unk driver running people over; those are just the tragic but consequential losses in the act of terrorism... Terrorism is a wider loss of our way of life.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Of one thing I am convinced. There should be a law to bring in a "news blackout" for the first couple of hours at least after such a terror attack. That way, the emergency services can get on with their important jobs - and we may get some proper FACTS released appropriately at the right time. Many journalists are egotistical maniacs who sensationalise at every opportunity unfortunately. I'd rather have a senior police officer co-ordinating the investigation than pampering to journalist vermin by having to provide updates from the off (and I know you can't tar them all with the same brush)."

But then you'd get social media going mental and the police having a bigger job trying to keep a lid on that and dealing with the probable aftermath of a ton of hate crime being committed. Better you try and coordinate it through traditional press streams and how that some form of ethical code is still in partial place (wishful thinking with the majority of press outlets these days)

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

thing is with modern media and nigh on everyone having the means to put stuff online there is no way a media outlet will sit back and not 'be there'..

its what they do and would be out of business pretty soon if they took that route..

i don't agree that they hinder any incident by reporting it and can in some cases put out appeals etc which has helped..

private citizens being 'ghouls' and pushing phones and camera's in the way is more of my own experience from some incidents..

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *elvet RopeMan
over a year ago

by the big field

My frineds cousin was killed at Omagh

Another friend lost his father in the Birmingham pub bombings

Twice a year i have to complete terrorism awareness training following the Bataclan attack

Despite all that, I still consider those inside the gates of Westminster to be a bigger threat to me than some random crazy with a vague cause

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Having spent my entire working career having to deal with terrorism, whether disarming explosive devices during my time in the forces and more recently training others in disposal and dems, I learnt at an early age what terrorism meant..

It meant fear.. The ability to affect others way of life.

It only takes one actual event to spawn the fear that another attack could happen and play upon that fear with hoaxes and disinformation..

We stand united and say "we won't let it affect us" but in truth it does and already has..

Britain has the most cctv in the world thanks to the threat from the IRA..

We can no longer take liquids on planes thanks to an Al Quaida plot..

Our civil liberties are slowly being eroded because of lawless acts of terror by others that do not agree with our freedom and way of life.

Our civil liberties get eroded because society let's government have carte blanche to erode them whilst barely raising a whimper. The justification being that 'I don't do anything wrong so it doesn't affect me'; until you wake up one morning and the line has moved so far across that it DOES affect you.

You'd think that people living this lifestyle would understand the consequences of that, but it all too often appears not.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

That guy is /was the worst terrorist in Islamic history

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"That guy is /was the worst terrorist in Islamic history

Eh?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *orwegian BlueMan
over a year ago

Iceland, but Aldi is closer..

thing is with modern media and nigh on everyone having the means to put stuff online there is no way a media outlet will sit back and not 'be there'..

its what they do and would be out of business pretty soon if they took that route..

i don't agree that they hinder any incident by reporting it and can in some cases put out appeals etc which has helped..

private citizens being 'ghouls' and pushing phones and camera's in the way is more of my own experience from some incidents.."

The security services rely on information and their best source of information is us,the public..

If there is a media blackout then the public will be unaware and vital information that someone may have but not realised at the time will not be forthcoming..

Yes, I agree, images of injured and dead people are harrowing, but it is a small price to pay for the potential information feedback that could help prevent further events..

If todays attack had been a coordinated attack instead of a lone person, as soon as the news is reported, the public become more vigilant, more aware of what's going on around them. Should a subsequent attack be about to take place there may be a greater chance of its prevention.

We should embrace the fact that we are allowed this freedom of reporting as those that attack us would love to control that and remove that freedom from us.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Thank you OP. xx

Some good stories coming out of people rushing to help. Seems to be a 'you won't scare us' vibe going on after all such incidents. Hope...

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

thing is with modern media and nigh on everyone having the means to put stuff online there is no way a media outlet will sit back and not 'be there'..

its what they do and would be out of business pretty soon if they took that route..

i don't agree that they hinder any incident by reporting it and can in some cases put out appeals etc which has helped..

private citizens being 'ghouls' and pushing phones and camera's in the way is more of my own experience from some incidents..

The security services rely on information and their best source of information is us,the public..

If there is a media blackout then the public will be unaware and vital information that someone may have but not realised at the time will not be forthcoming..

Yes, I agree, images of injured and dead people are harrowing, but it is a small price to pay for the potential information feedback that could help prevent further events..

We should embrace the fact that we are allowed this freedom of reporting as those that attack us would love to control that and remove that freedom from us."

agreed..

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *orwegian BlueMan
over a year ago

Iceland, but Aldi is closer..

It meant fear.. The ability to affect others way of life.

It only takes one actual event to spawn the fear that another attack could happen and play upon that fear with hoaxes and disinformation..

We stand united and say "we won't let it affect us" but in truth it does and already has..

Britain has the most cctv in the world thanks to the threat from the IRA..

We can no longer take liquids on planes thanks to an Al Quaida plot..

Our civil liberties are slowly being eroded because of lawless acts of terror by others that do not agree with our freedom and way of life.

You'd think that people living this lifestyle would understand the consequences of that, but it all too often appears not."

It's nothing to do with carte blanche acts by governments.. You make it sound almost conspiracy theorist!!

Governments and security services do what they can to prevent harm to their citizens as they have a duty of care and it is cheaper to prevent then to deal with an aftermath..

Unfortunately, to prevent an unknown and hidden terror, everyone has to be treated as a potential terrorist until it is proven they are not.

Improved identification, scanning of bags in public buildings, monitoring of voice and data for certain strings of words..

These things are all done to protect us but ultimately delay us and inconvenience us in our busy lives..

When the number of potential attacks on the UK mainland that were prevented last year finally gets published, which should be some time soon, perhaps people really will sit up and take notice and accept that our government and security services are actually acting in our best intrests.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"That guy is /was the worst terrorist in Islamic history

Eh?"

He didn't do a very good job did he?

That's why he's a shit terrorist

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 23/03/17 00:10:55]

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"That guy is /was the worst terrorist in Islamic history

Eh?

He didn't do a very good job did he?

That's why he's a shit terrorist "

So killing 4 innocent people going about their daily business isnt doing a good job then?.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

I've been around nombs and not too bothered. But today's did seem a lot of bother, for not that much that happened compared to so many other atrocities. But I've been out all day and not fully aware of all the info.