FabSwingers.com forum: Does charity start at home?

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Im not going to pretend to know statistics on how much cash the government give to other charities and countries, but is it selfish of me to think that if we stop it and sort out our own countries finances that we would be better off??

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

we can't imagine poverty...... not real poverty.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We have a duty as human beings to help others less fortunate, but that should be in conjunction with helping our own needy, not at their expense.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I did some back packing in my youth in India and we have it good. Should we have lower taxes to buy that 50in plasma or stop a child from starving to death? There is no debate on this for me.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

"I did some back packing in my youth in India and we have it good. Should we have lower taxes to buy that 50in plasma or stop a child from starving to death? There is no debate on this for me. "

i totally agree with the sentiment genuine poverty needs all the help it can get , but what were 3rd world nations are often now emerging super econonmies who can (if the will is there) pour more money into solving it themselves instead of spending billions on missiles,navies and nukes.

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By *etillanteWoman
over a year ago

Also leaders of said countries always seem to have so much yet are happy to hold their hands out. For them charity does not begin at home

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A much as I applaud our efforts to help others, I'm also all for sorting ourselves out.

We're pumping millions into foreign countries yet we've got people here who have to choose between money for food or putting the heating on to keep warm in winter.

Not right at all.

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By *opeye-OliveCouple
over a year ago

worcester

Even the poorest in this country are rolling in it compared to those in the third world - We would rather our taxes go to the poor in other countries than to line the pockets of fat Bastard Bankers!!!

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

"but what were 3rd world nations are often now emerging super econonmies who can (if the will is there) pour more money into solving it themselves instead of spending billions on missiles,navies and nukes."

We spend billions on navies, missiles and nukes. Are you suggesting that we're a 3rd world country? Already?

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

Saw on the news the other day a mother had walked for 3 days with sick child on her back for help at the relief hospital.....

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

Maybe we could save everyone a few bob by not deploying those missiles in 3rd world countries?

Just a thought.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"A much as I applaud our efforts to help others, I'm also all for sorting ourselves out.

We're pumping millions into foreign countries yet we've got people here who have to choose between money for food or putting the heating on to keep warm in winter.

Not right at all."

yeah i really agree with you.

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

I was surprised to see and learn of a parliamentary debate a few weeks ago about the statutory figure for aid donations. Some wanted it to be written into law that the country "gives away" 1% ( up from around 0.7% )of our GDP as aid.

It may be worth pointing out that such aid is not actually given as "cash" but in other products and services, including armaments i believe.

I stand to be corrected if anyone knows the facts.

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

"A much as I applaud our efforts to help others, I'm also all for sorting ourselves out.

We're pumping millions into foreign countries yet we've got people here who have to choose between money for food or putting the heating on to keep warm in winter.

Not right at all.

yeah i really agree with you. "

sorry but you are a single mum being supported rightly by the state...

if you were a single mum there whose hubby had died, you and your child would probaly starve to death..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"A much as I applaud our efforts to help others, I'm also all for sorting ourselves out.

We're pumping millions into foreign countries yet we've got people here who have to choose between money for food or putting the heating on to keep warm in winter.

Not right at all."

Its not right but its often a choice between food or fags. There is a state pension for the old and a benefit system for people who aren't working. Some of the poor sods abroad get the choice of grass to ease the hunger pains or starve.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"sorry but you are a single mum being supported rightly by the state...

if you were a single mum there whose hubby had died, you and your child would probaly starve to death.."

im grateful to be living in the Uk

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By *phroditeWoman
over a year ago

(She/ her) in Sensualityland

Am I missing the point or should we not all have a choice what if any charity we support? Some people feel donating to facilitate fresh water supplies in Africa is more value than a local charity... Choices I think...

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

_iew, i was raised to save up for things rather than get myself into debt because i wanted something now..

i cant start to imagine what life is like over in a foreign country or to have to walk for 3 miles or further to get water..

but from all i can see on the news (im no politician or know it all/google statistic finder expert) is how bad our countries financial situation is. Im sure a fair few of us on here have personal debts. If talking on a personal basis would you rather your own money go to clearing your own personal debt or clearing your neighbours?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"sorry but you are a single mum being supported rightly by the state...

if you were a single mum there whose hubby had died, you and your child would probaly starve to death..

im grateful to be living in the Uk"

I think people in western Europe are real lucky all round. Granted there is poverty but everyone looking for work is entitled to benefits and in most cases shelter. The truth is if we DIDN'T give to people abroad there would be many many people who would die. I for one am not comfortable with that.

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

I believe both.. I think we should role model what compassion is to the world.

Absolutely we should look after our old and vulnerable, they deserve that and more...

in those countries family is everything...the young really look after their old.

in this country not as good at that in my opinion.. we treat the old shockingly and that is not all the government faults...... on occasion it is the sons/daughters/nieces/nephews who dont really wanytgran/grandad,old uncle bill/auntie agnes at Xmas because it may interfere with their week in Vilier ski-ing, or a week at Xmas with the olds bids is a fecking pain.....

not all, but not nearly enough looking after people in our own communities....

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By *phroditeWoman
over a year ago

(She/ her) in Sensualityland

"I believe both.. I think we should role model what compassion is to the world.

Absolutely we should look after our old and vulnerable, they deserve that and more...

in those countries family is everything...the young really look after their old.

not all, but not nearly enough looking after people in our own communities...."
agreed... the answer is as always not either or... but AND

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

How many people sit on here all day that could be visiting an elderly person with no one... doing voluntary in an old people home... they would love to see peoples kids... kids bring a smile to an old person....

if people really cared... voluntary visitor programme for the geriatric wards where people have no visitors from one month to the next

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

also for clarification im not on about keeping more money in this country to fund a 50inch tv for 'tax dodgers/government stingers' but just to clear our countries debts and to help those who actually need it, then to once again resume the substantial financial contributions to others in more need

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

Often, the best charitable gift overseas is six months of your time, knowledge and experience. Plus, you will generally have an unbelievably good exeperience.

What's the saying, give a man a few fish and he eats well for dinner, teach him to fish and he eats well all his life?

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By *phroditeWoman
over a year ago

(She/ her) in Sensualityland

Often, the best charitable gift overseas is six months of your time, knowledge and experience. Plus, you will generally have an unbelievably good exeperience.

What's the saying, give a man a few fish and he eats well for dinner, teach him to fish and he eats well all his life?"

and what about the chips?????????

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"How many people sit on here all day that could be visiting an elderly person with no one... doing voluntary in an old people home... they would love to see peoples kids... kids bring a smile to an old person....

if people really cared... voluntary visitor programme for the geriatric wards where people have no visitors from one month to the next"

i am a single parent as you pointed out, and my job before was a community carer so know how lonely the elderly get.. but i also know how cold there homes are and how little money they get. Its a very sorry state..

yes me and the little un do the rounds to spring a bit of cheer upon the ladies and gents that made my job worthwhile xx

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

if people really cared... voluntary visitor programme for the geriatric wards where people have no visitors from one month to the next

yes me and the little un do the rounds to spring a bit of cheer upon the ladies and gents that made my job worthwhile xx"

thats nice to read.. I am sure they appreciate it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"also for clarification im not on about keeping more money in this country to fund a 50inch tv for 'tax dodgers/government stingers' but just to clear our countries debts and to help those who actually need it, then to once again resume the substantial financial contributions to others in more need"

Hey luv i don't mean to be rude but from what i can gather you aint contributing. I pay a fair few bob at the 40% rate and i have a concious. I might speak my mind but i know i am a lucky SOB living in a rich country. So we have to cut some services maybe make some people pay for tv licences, less community projects but that's chicken shit compared to some poor kid starving to death.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

if people really cared... voluntary visitor programme for the geriatric wards where people have no visitors from one month to the next

yes me and the little un do the rounds to spring a bit of cheer upon the ladies and gents that made my job worthwhile xx"

People over 70 get i think £300 heating allowance or there and abouts so no reason to freeze.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

please don't insult me, i have worked since i was 15, paid my taxes up until sept 2010 and i will return to work

i've raised hundreds of pounds for charity in the past..

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

Often, the best charitable gift overseas is six months of your time, knowledge and experience. Plus, you will generally have an unbelievably good exeperience.

What's the saying, give a man a few fish and he eats well for dinner, teach him to fish and he eats well all his life?

and what about the chips?????????"

Good point. I guess he's had 'em.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

please don't insult me, i have worked since i was 15, paid my taxes up until sept 2010 and i will return to work

i've raised hundreds of pounds for charity in the past.. "

You asked the question, you get an answer and hundreds of pounds isn't exactly a lot but granted its something. I just find it insulting to some extent you have a well fed child that is warm and comfortable yet you would rather my taxes go towards reducing our national debt rather then feed starving children.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"You asked the question, you get an answer and hundreds of pounds isn't exactly a lot but granted its something. I just find it insulting to some extent you have a well fed child that is warm and comfortable yet you would rather my taxes go towards reducing our national debt rather then feed starving children.

guess that's the joys of debate and difference of opinion, we clearly have conflicting interests.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

guess that's the joys of debate and difference of opinion, we clearly have conflicting interests."

Its pretty obvious raising a contentious issue your desire was for a reaction. Far enough we have conflicting _iews. I care about people who are on the starvation line, i just find it very very hard when others don't share my _iews on this.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"guess that's the joys of debate and difference of opinion, we clearly have conflicting interests.

isnt every thread started to get some kind of response and reaction? Its good to have passion for something :D

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

Just my opinion, and out of interest, but does "sorting out the countries finances" include the rather necessary step of making feckless parents become entirely responsible for their own offspring?

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By *phroditeWoman
over a year ago

(She/ her) in Sensualityland

Just my opinion, and out of interest, but does "sorting out the countries finances" include the rather necessary step of making feckless parents become entirely responsible for their own offspring?"

I feel that EVERYBODY is accountable and should contribute in some form to sorting out the deficits... whether it is in the UK or elsewhere. Making parents accountable for the raising, financially, emotionally, culturally etc of their offspring is part of that in my _iew

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

Recent posts have raised a number of men, myself included , who are working very hard to support own own kids, and occasionally other children of other women, both financially, emotionally and developmentally, there's only so much we can do. So satisfying though.

Still find time for external charitable acts though. It's in my nature.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

In 2005/6 I decided to put my money where my mouth was, i sold all of my assets and went to Africa and employed 2000 subsitance farmers for 2 years trying to get them a renewable business model with organic status, every 6 months they got to vote where the money went from the crops sold, after the first meeting and big vote, was it a doctor visiting to innoculate kids and help with pregnant mothers, an improvement to irrigation systems to improve the yeild of their crop or even a new generator for the villages so they were not using moringa oil for lighting ,,,,,,,no they voted for satelite television !! go figure

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Also leaders of said countries always seem to have so much yet are happy to hold their hands out. For them charity does not begin at home"

not a reason to let the little ones suffer tho, is it?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"In 2005/6 I decided to put my money where my mouth was, i sold all of my assets and went to Africa and employed 2000 subsitance farmers for 2 years trying to get them a renewable business model with organic status, every 6 months they got to vote where the money went from the crops sold, after the first meeting and big vote, was it a doctor visiting to innoculate kids and help with pregnant mothers, an improvement to irrigation systems to improve the yeild of their crop or even a new generator for the villages so they were not using moringa oil for lighting ,,,,,,,no they voted for satelite television !! go figure

So you actually went to Africa?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Often, the best charitable gift overseas is six months of your time, knowledge and experience. Plus, you will generally have an unbelievably good exeperience.

What's the saying, give a man a few fish and he eats well for dinner, teach him to fish and he eats well all his life?

and what about the chips?????????"

or sit in a boat and drink beer all day?

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

One could say, if one was being somewhat controversial, that the "West" was very charitable towards Rawanda ( 90's) and Zimbabwe. Never once did we donate "military assitance" to the poor, needy and desperate.

By way of removing thier despot leaders of course.

"tell me, Mr corrupt Politician, what is it that attracted you to the billionaire leader of an oil rich North African state?"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

One thing that bugs me is some people use the "charity begins at home" bit as and excuse not to give at all. Most of us spend beyond our means and could give more than we are.

But it's not just the money. We're a wealthy country. There are so many ways we can help by lending a hand. sacrificing a couple of days a week/fortnight/month.

If people thought beyond money. The UK would be amazing.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Just my opinion, and out of interest, but does "sorting out the countries finances" include the rather necessary step of making feckless parents become entirely responsible for their own offspring?

Works for me!

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?"

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

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By *ezebelWoman
over a year ago

North of The Wall - youll need your vest

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid."

There are lots of successful support programmes targeting womens groups and many agencies are now focusing their resources on them specifically for that reason.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid."

part of the problem is that the various NGO's have gone in trying to take western values in there and the tribal leaders get very pissed off with cultural dilution ,women are not allowed a say or to work independently

A friend started a bead company in secret to help them earn a bit of money and they had to keep it totally secret,but eventually it got sprung and they didnt turn up. pulled out in 08 due the the inter tribal wars over the christmas killing the confidence in orders.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I can not ever imagine having a life that some people have in other countries...

Without much thought, we wake in the morning after sleeping in a warm soft bed, go to the bathroom which is inside a nice warm house, fill the kettle up from running water and have a coffee normaly followed by brekkie...look in the cupboard or fridge and there it is...waiting....

And so the day progresses...everything to hand or attainable .

Such a difference to having no water unless you walk miles to get it and even then its not clean...no sanitation to speak of and not a lot in the way of furnishings in the hovel you luckily find yourself in...

No food so you have to sit and listen to the cries of your kids as they are so hungry their stomachs blow up ..and they are covered in flies and sores . No doctor for a hundred miles or so and no rain to drench the parched land ....

We are rich , well fed and should do what little we can in order that poverty is totally wiped out.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

unfortunately much of the debate does center on money...I dont give to charity, I know I could...I often question where my money would be going directly. but lets not confuse giving money with having compassion even if u dont or cant contribute.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"unfortunately much of the debate does center on money...I dont give to charity, I know I could...I often question where my money would be going directly. but lets not confuse giving money with having compassion even if u dont or cant contribute."

the money I give goes to help by "adopted" son go to school and a little of it helps his family.

How do I know? I get letters and drawing from him regularly.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I would urge anyone to consider

"There but for the grace of God go I". Think about your own children, nephews, neices etc. By fate they were born lucky but what if it were them?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There's a lot of small organisation you can give to if you're worried about transparency but most charites are audited heavily to stop money being wasted.

But you're right. It's not just money, it's also time.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There's a lot of small organisation you can give to if you're worried about transparency but most charites are audited heavily to stop money being wasted.

But you're right. It's not just money, it's also time.

indeed, it is every act of kindness and care we sincerely we offer to a fellow human.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

the money I give goes to help by "adopted" son go to school and a little of it helps his family.

How do I know? I get letters and drawing from him regularly."

Good on you for the commitment as its a long term thing. It doesn't take a lot to make a vast difference to someone's life.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There's a lot of small organisation you can give to if you're worried about transparency but most charites are audited heavily to stop money being wasted.

But you're right. It's not just money, it's also time.

You are spot on. I find the scaremongering by some is so negative. Some of the smaller charities do a fantastic job.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

the money I give goes to help by "adopted" son go to school and a little of it helps his family.

How do I know? I get letters and drawing from him regularly.

Good on you for the commitment as its a long term thing. It doesn't take a lot to make a vast difference to someone's life.

yes and hence to your own. it is so nice to hear of his hope and dreams. He is hoping to become a doctor one day.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

There are lots of successful support programmes targeting womens groups and many agencies are now focusing their resources on them specifically for that reason."

i can only tell you what i found and only in africa and only up until i think i was last in Nairobi in 09 and there is a tribal backlash against organisations "trying to say live like us" and diluting the culture,they have it rough in some ways but in other ways they have great hereditory knowledge on how to survive in hostile ennvironments,have very little western disease cancer and heart etc and have there own cultures and want to maintain them and who can blame them . The subjugation of women is a pisser tho,but they do look after them even into old age ,no old peoples homes to ship granny and grandad off to over there .

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By *ezebelWoman
over a year ago

North of The Wall - youll need your vest

the money I give goes to help by "adopted" son go to school and a little of it helps his family.

How do I know? I get letters and drawing from him regularly."

The money from this type of sponsorship usually goes to the community rather than to individual children...but the children benefit directly because of services that the charity support in that community eg schools, health services, water and sanitation etc.

This usually works really well because the charity undertakes a long term commitment (usually 15 years) to help develop the area in a sustainable way.

The charity wont give the money to individual children because that would be very unfair on the child next door that doesnt have a sponsor. Instead they focus on working with the whole community.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

the money I give goes to help by "adopted" son go to school and a little of it helps his family.

How do I know? I get letters and drawing from him regularly.

Good on you for the commitment as its a long term thing. It doesn't take a lot to make a vast difference to someone's life.

yes and hence to your own. it is so nice to hear of his hope and dreams. He is hoping to become a doctor one day.

I hope he makes it. The first boy i sponsored is an engineer now and in his 20's. I sponsor a 12 yr old girl now like you get the letters which is nice and you feel you are doing something even if its not a lot.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S "

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenya

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

the money I give goes to help by "adopted" son go to school and a little of it helps his family.

How do I know? I get letters and drawing from him regularly."

thats wonderful xxx definitely helps when theres a personal aspect to it of course xxx

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By *ezebelWoman
over a year ago

North of The Wall - youll need your vest

The subjugation of women is a pisser tho,but they do look after them even into old age ,no old peoples homes to ship granny and grandad off to over there ."

Yeah but the average life expectancy in these communites aint great...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenya"
So how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

Don't laugh Pleasure Dome but i recently gave a decent wedge to some Nigerian 419'ers

Broke my heart it did, the sad tale they related.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

the money I give goes to help by "adopted" son go to school and a little of it helps his family.

How do I know? I get letters and drawing from him regularly.

Good on you for the commitment as its a long term thing. It doesn't take a lot to make a vast difference to someone's life.

yes and hence to your own. it is so nice to hear of his hope and dreams. He is hoping to become a doctor one day.

you do what you can it can never be too little in that case.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The subjugation of women is a pisser tho,but they do look after them even into old age ,no old peoples homes to ship granny and grandad off to over there .

Yeah but the average life expectancy in these communites aint great..."

good point.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

The subjugation of women is a pisser tho,but they do look after them even into old age ,no old peoples homes to ship granny and grandad off to over there .

Yeah but the average life expectancy in these communites aint great..."

tbh i dont know i was mainly dealing with people of working age who had land and it was quite rare the maasai or other tribes would let you in to there way,although some of the subsistance farming was elderly women alone but rare now i think back on it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

the money I give goes to help by "adopted" son go to school and a little of it helps his family.

How do I know? I get letters and drawing from him regularly.

Good on you for the commitment as its a long term thing. It doesn't take a lot to make a vast difference to someone's life.

yes and hence to your own. it is so nice to hear of his hope and dreams. He is hoping to become a doctor one day.

you do what you can it can never be too little in that case."

I spent some time out there with work and have seen how bad it is. I still feel a bit of guilt because we ate well bet others didn't. If you can do a bit and others do a bit it adds up to a lot.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?"

i never met anyone but the people i dealt with and that was a subsiduary of a plc who provided me with support, tbh its a bit like saying did you meet mrs jones in blackpool i mainly ran everything from the langatta link in nairobi ,,does she work there then ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her. "

yeah but she's only a woman.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her. "

i dont know the point your trying to make but i have no intention of telling you or naming people on a swing site ok ..but there are people on this site who know what happened and what i did ,i am sorry if that upsets you in some way .but ...hey thats life

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

The point is i don't believe your original quote about satellite tv. Now after you saying you don't know Jillian i don't believe the rest.

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

"_iew, i was raised to save up for things rather than get myself into debt because i wanted something now..

i cant start to imagine what life is like over in a foreign country or to have to walk for 3 miles or further to get water..

How bad our countries financial situation is? Do we have clean water,free health care, free education,?

Don't believe the hype being sold to push through ideological cuts.

And i promised i would stay away from political threads...but one question...if the economy was growing at the rate of Germany we would have the increased taxes needed to fund many of the cuts we are currently facing.

Ask why we are cutting services,and whether the deficit can be tackled other ways?

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

yeah but she's only a woman."

"Only one woman" - the Marbles, late 60's

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

The point is i don't believe your original quote about satellite tv. Now after you saying you don't know Jillian i don't believe the rest."

i dont feel the need to convince you

either, especially on an open swing site i am sure she is going to appreciate being named on here ,any other indiscretions ?

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By *emima_puddlefuckCouple
over a year ago

hexham

Seriously...you thought the big white paternalistic model would sort their problems out!

Sorry but i hope you realise the number of reasons why the project was doomed from the start. look at micro credit in bangladesh if you want to see how real change can be achieved.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

The point is i don't believe your original quote about satellite tv. Now after you saying you don't know Jillian i don't believe the rest.

i dont feel the need to convince you

either, especially on an open swing site i am sure she is going to appreciate being named on here ,any other indiscretions ?

Hang on a min you have named politicians and other people.Jillian isn't a swinger just ran the project and has always courted as much publicity as she can for her cause. You might feel miffed for being caught out but charity work struggles to find funding as it is without people dissuading people from giving!

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

Seriously...you thought the big white paternalistic model would sort their problems out!

Sorry but i hope you realise the number of reasons why the project was doomed from the start. look at micro credit in bangladesh if you want to see how real change can be achieved."

no it failed because of the intertribal war the supplies didnt believe we could deliver and we couldnt as no one wanted to leave there homes evenwhen we offered transport ,but for 2 years it ran and ran well,we told them the funds were not for that sort of thing and they ended up with a training project still going today

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

Don't believe the hype being sold to push through ideological cuts.

Ask why we are cutting services,and whether the deficit can be tackled other ways?"

No doubt you are aware that Germany's monthly trade surplus is positive and in the billions, ie profitable.

I'm seriously interested in what other ways Britain can pull this round, either financially or morally or what?

There seems to be a significant silence from the left as to what there proposals are?

Hopefully, you won't say increased borrowings, on top of the £750bn and rising at £100bn per year debt?

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

The point is i don't believe your original quote about satellite tv. Now after you saying you don't know Jillian i don't believe the rest.

i dont feel the need to convince you

either, especially on an open swing site i am sure she is going to appreciate being named on here ,any other indiscretions ?

what ever makes you think i am dissuading people from giving ,go re read my opening post ??

its up to you who you name mate its between you and the site

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

The point is i don't believe your original quote about satellite tv. Now after you saying you don't know Jillian i don't believe the rest.

i dont feel the need to convince you

either, especially on an open swing site i am sure she is going to appreciate being named on here ,any other indiscretions ?

what ever makes you think i am dissuading people from giving ,go re read my opening post ??

its up to you who you name mate its between you and the site "

There have been more names on here than toes at a gang bang. From Vince Cable to Maggie Thatcher and so many sports people so its not against the rules. So fess up it was a tall story and i will laugh with you, no point carrying on when the game is up.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

The point is i don't believe your original quote about satellite tv. Now after you saying you don't know Jillian i don't believe the rest.

i dont feel the need to convince you

either, especially on an open swing site i am sure she is going to appreciate being named on here ,any other indiscretions ?

what ever makes you think i am dissuading people from giving ,go re read my opening post ??

its up to you who you name mate its between you and the site

look you think its a lie ,you think you know me ,you think you have the facts ,you have nothing but a name of a woman ,,,i am happy ,,if your happy ...off you go .

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

On a lighter note, with the amount of previous comments quoted, thats one less tree in Africa fom now on.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

On a lighter note, with the amount of previous comments quoted, thats one less tree in Africa fom now on. "

lmao your right there good job were not printing

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

The point is i don't believe your original quote about satellite tv. Now after you saying you don't know Jillian i don't believe the rest.

i dont feel the need to convince you

either, especially on an open swing site i am sure she is going to appreciate being named on here ,any other indiscretions ?

what ever makes you think i am dissuading people from giving ,go re read my opening post ??

its up to you who you name mate its between you and the site

look you think its a lie ,you think you know me ,you think you have the facts ,you have nothing but a name of a woman ,,,i am happy ,,if your happy ...off you go ."

Ok i gave you the chance to tell us you were kidding us with a tall story. But humour me and tell me when you were there.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

forgive me if I am impertinent, but were the women and the children consulted?

Unfortunately in Tribal Africa they rank slightly below the cattle so no ,it

is a do it there way or no way mentality.

the group that I support on a regular basis target womens groups and children and have had a lot of success. Don't know if I am allowed to mention but will anyway. Action Aid.

Still waiting! Oi i asked you did you go to Africa! Answer please!!!!!!

No answer and i will presume its pure B/S

yes i went to Africa see other posts i operated out of Nairobi and Athi River

and the moof project up in kenyaSo how long were you out there doing that? Did you meet Jillian Lesslie then?

No she ran the whole project and sorted out who did what. If you were vetted before going over you would have met her.

The point is i don't believe your original quote about satellite tv. Now after you saying you don't know Jillian i don't believe the rest.

i dont feel the need to convince you

either, especially on an open swing site i am sure she is going to appreciate being named on here ,any other indiscretions ?

what ever makes you think i am dissuading people from giving ,go re read my opening post ??

its up to you who you name mate its between you and the site

look you think its a lie ,you think you know me ,you think you have the facts ,you have nothing but a name of a woman ,,,i am happy ,,if your happy ...off you go .

Ok i gave you the chance to tell us you were kidding us with a tall story. But humour me and tell me when you were there.

do you actually read posts i dont feel the need,you know it all,so go and be happy...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ok i gave you the chance to tell us you were kidding us with a tall story. But humour me and tell me when you were there.

do you actually read posts i dont feel the need,you know it all,so go and be happy...

Lol i do read that's why i answer and you have made me laugh but come on admit it, the whole thing is a Tall Story other wise you would have said which months you were there

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

oops, there goes another rubber tree plant

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

Ok i gave you the chance to tell us you were kidding us with a tall story. But humour me and tell me when you were there.

do you actually read posts i dont feel the need,you know it all,so go and be happy...

Lol i do read that's why i answer and you have made me laugh but come on admit it, the whole thing is a Tall Story other wise you would have said which months you were there

but you see i will be totally honest with you here ,no disrespect but i simply do not care what you think,so i just do not feel the need to justify anything to you or get into some pointless dialogue on it ,you have said your piece ,i say ok ,leave it at that rather than trying to goad me into a reaction it simply will not work ..ok

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

oops, there goes another rubber tree plant

i remember that song

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ok i gave you the chance to tell us you were kidding us with a tall story. But humour me and tell me when you were there.

do you actually read posts i dont feel the need,you know it all,so go and be happy...

Lol i do read that's why i answer and you have made me laugh but come on admit it, the whole thing is a Tall Story other wise you would have said which months you were there

Hey i am not goading i am giving you the chance to fess up and say you are winding us up. I love some tall stories but why not admit its a wind up.

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

Ok i gave you the chance to tell us you were kidding us with a tall story. But humour me and tell me when you were there.

do you actually read posts i dont feel the need,you know it all,so go and be happy...

Lol i do read that's why i answer and you have made me laugh but come on admit it, the whole thing is a Tall Story other wise you would have said which months you were there

Hey i am not goading i am giving you the chance to fess up and say you are winding us up. I love some tall stories but why not admit its a wind up.

knock yourself out mate

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

** runs into a brick wall to knock herself out **

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

"** runs into a brick wall to knock herself out **

pmsl your totally mad they were right

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By *ushroom7Man
over a year ago

Bradford

i'm saying nothing about knocking one out

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By *leasureDomeMan
over a year ago

all over the place

i'm saying nothing about knocking one out"

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