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"In what way do we allow cutting holidays ?" By turning a blind eye to the fact that some families come here solely for that purpose. It may seem like a gross invasion of privacy to insist on examination but if the girl is at risk i believe it's worth it. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done." This subject has already been discussed on the forums | |||
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"FGM is illegal in the UK carrying a sentence of up to 14 years. Sally" And yet it still occurs. The post was highlighting the actions of the French government and suggesting we act in the same way to stamp out this barbaric practice. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums " With all due respect i don't see how that should prevent the subject from being discussed again. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums " . Unlike big cocks and bbw which are just waiting to be discussed for the first time ever..... Kiss snog suicide... The person above  | |||
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"FGM is illegal in the UK carrying a sentence of up to 14 years. Sally" The last time I checked, there has not been one prosecution in this country for FGM but France does prosecute. | |||
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"Some piercers already refuse to do gential piercing regardless of if it's for fashion or fgm. Xxx"  | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so..." Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random." Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? | |||
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"Some piercers already refuse to do gential piercing regardless of if it's for fashion or fgm. Xxx" Never heard of FGM being piercing, i always thought it was cutting bits off (hence the Mutilation bit in 'Female Genital Mutilation') | |||
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"As much as I commend the saving of every single young girl from FGM what are you actually proposing OP? The French seem to have very scant regard for trampling on people's cultural right (see recent hijab/burqua cases), but over here we would be the first to stop everything at the first case of harassment when 'our health professionals want to inspect underage girls' of certain sections of the UK population." Regarding hijab/burqa, French government want to impose women how to dress yet at the same time claiming it is the country of human rights. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? " In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. | |||
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"Some piercers already refuse to do gential piercing regardless of if it's for fashion or fgm. Xxx Never heard of FGM being piercing, i always thought it was cutting bits off (hence the Mutilation bit in 'Female Genital Mutilation')" Some girls are forced to have piercing I do belive. Xxx | |||
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"As much as I commend the saving of every single young girl from FGM what are you actually proposing OP? The French seem to have very scant regard for trampling on people's cultural right (see recent hijab/burqua cases), but over here we would be the first to stop everything at the first case of harassment when 'our health professionals want to inspect underage girls' of certain sections of the UK population. Regarding hijab/burqa, French government want to impose women how to dress yet at the same time claiming it is the country of human rights. " What people choose to wear is hardly the same thing. The human rights of the child must come first. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else." Which religions are you talking about ? | |||
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"As much as I commend the saving of every single young girl from FGM what are you actually proposing OP? The French seem to have very scant regard for trampling on people's cultural right (see recent hijab/burqua cases), but over here we would be the first to stop everything at the first case of harassment when 'our health professionals want to inspect underage girls' of certain sections of the UK population. Regarding hijab/burqa, French government want to impose women how to dress yet at the same time claiming it is the country of human rights. What people choose to wear is hardly the same thing. The human rights of the child must come first." I wasn't doing an analogy to your fgm, just pointing out that the french government's laws are counterproductive. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. Which religions are you talking about ? " I'm not prepared to say here, if you want to know ask google. | |||
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"As much as I commend the saving of every single young girl from FGM what are you actually proposing OP? The French seem to have very scant regard for trampling on people's cultural right (see recent hijab/burqua cases), but over here we would be the first to stop everything at the first case of harassment when 'our health professionals want to inspect underage girls' of certain sections of the UK population. Regarding hijab/burqa, French government want to impose women how to dress yet at the same time claiming it is the country of human rights. What people choose to wear is hardly the same thing. The human rights of the child must come first. I wasn't doing an analogy to your fgm, just pointing out that the french government's laws are counterproductive. " According to reports the actions of the French government have had a dramatic and positive effect regarding fgm. That is specifically what my op was referring to. | |||
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" --*snip*-- Regarding hijab/burqa, French government want to impose women how to dress yet at the same time claiming it is the country of human rights. " that was kinda my point, the French make a big deal riding roughshod over 'cultural diversity' and we do things slightly differently over here. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. Which religions are you talking about ? I'm not prepared to say here, if you want to know ask google." I think the problem doesn't lie in religions per se but more so in how men interpret it. I get your point, a lot of religions seem to be very patriachal, yet when reading their holy books, it isn't the case, Male and Female are equals. Yet most males do not like and recognise it. | |||
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" --*snip*-- Regarding hijab/burqa, French government want to impose women how to dress yet at the same time claiming it is the country of human rights. that was kinda my point, the French make a big deal riding roughshod over 'cultural diversity' and we do things slightly differently over here." I am sort of lost there, are you saying that it is a good thing that the french government do not give a shit or not ? | |||
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"Some piercers already refuse to do gential piercing regardless of if it's for fashion or fgm. Xxx Never heard of FGM being piercing, i always thought it was cutting bits off (hence the Mutilation bit in 'Female Genital Mutilation')" When they new laws against FGM were brought in they were deliberately left quite open to interpretation. In the same way that many consensual BDSM acts *might* be illegal under assault laws, it *could* be that genital piercing is considered illegal under the FGM laws. I think it's good that the laws are very open to interpretation, I'd rather see less genital piercing if it means we can catch more FGM cases. | |||
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"Some piercers already refuse to do gential piercing regardless of if it's for fashion or fgm. Xxx Never heard of FGM being piercing, i always thought it was cutting bits off (hence the Mutilation bit in 'Female Genital Mutilation') Some girls are forced to have piercing I do belive. Xxx" Ok then, and would these piercings be done by people of the same religion/faction as the girl herself, or your local bodypiercing shop in town? I'll give you a clue it won't be a piercing studio which has to adhere to lead to keep its licence,and certainly would TOUCH a fourteen year old child, so your point however well intentioned may be unneeded and possably counterproductive to the argument. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else." If you actually look into FGM and it's history I think you'll find its driven by culture not religion. They can pretend it's religiously motivated but the common denominator is that its simply a long held cultural tradition that overides any and all religious beliefs. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. Which religions are you talking about ? I'm not prepared to say here, if you want to know ask google. I think the problem doesn't lie in religions per se but more so in how men interpret it. I get your point, a lot of religions seem to be very patriachal, yet when reading their holy books, it isn't the case, Male and Female are equals. Yet most males do not like and recognise it. " I don't want to go down the route of crticising specific religions nor do i want this thread to go ofc at a tangent but i would like to point out that this country is Christian and therefore patriarchal and here women are still viewed as an underclass despite what you say regarding equality. | |||
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"Some piercers already refuse to do gential piercing regardless of if it's for fashion or fgm. Xxx Never heard of FGM being piercing, i always thought it was cutting bits off (hence the Mutilation bit in 'Female Genital Mutilation') Some girls are forced to have piercing I do belive. Xxx Ok then, and would these piercings be done by people of the same religion/faction as the girl herself, or your local bodypiercing shop in town? I'll give you a clue it won't be a piercing studio which has to adhere to lead to keep its licence,and certainly would TOUCH a fourteen year old child, so your point however well intentioned may be unneeded and possably counterproductive to the argument." FGM generally does not involve piercing, certainly not that I've ever read about anyway. Piercing is done to enhance pleasure. FGM is done to remove pleasure, to ensure virginity, and to be more 'hygienic' AFAIK. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. Which religions are you talking about ? I'm not prepared to say here, if you want to know ask google. I think the problem doesn't lie in religions per se but more so in how men interpret it. I get your point, a lot of religions seem to be very patriachal, yet when reading their holy books, it isn't the case, Male and Female are equals. Yet most males do not like and recognise it. I don't want to go down the route of crticising specific religions nor do i want this thread to go ofc at a tangent but i would like to point out that this country is Christian and therefore patriarchal and here women are still viewed as an underclass despite what you say regarding equality." Due to interpretation of men, not religion itself. But yes I know what you mean. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. If you actually look into FGM and it's history I think you'll find its driven by culture not religion. They can pretend it's religiously motivated but the common denominator is that its simply a long held cultural tradition that overides any and all religious beliefs. " You're right but i think you'll find that religion has always been the driving force behind culture, i believe the two to be inseparable. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. If you actually look into FGM and it's history I think you'll find its driven by culture not religion. They can pretend it's religiously motivated but the common denominator is that its simply a long held cultural tradition that overides any and all religious beliefs. You're right but i think you'll find that religion has always been the driving force behind culture, i believe the two to be inseparable. " Chinese christian don't share the same culture than swedish one, well I think so | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. If you actually look into FGM and it's history I think you'll find its driven by culture not religion. They can pretend it's religiously motivated but the common denominator is that its simply a long held cultural tradition that overides any and all religious beliefs. You're right but i think you'll find that religion has always been the driving force behind culture, i believe the two to be inseparable. Chinese christian don't share the same culture than swedish one, well I think so " Fair point. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums With all due respect i don't see how that should prevent the subject from being discussed again." And again and again | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums With all due respect i don't see how that should prevent the subject from being discussed again. And again and again " There are always new people joining the forums so it's interesting to revisit subjects. | |||
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"Some piercers already refuse to do gential piercing regardless of if it's for fashion or fgm. Xxx Never heard of FGM being piercing, i always thought it was cutting bits off (hence the Mutilation bit in 'Female Genital Mutilation')" Wikipedia definition of FGM https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation I am pierced wasn't aware that this is mutilation? Mrs | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums With all due respect i don't see how that should prevent the subject from being discussed again. And again and again There are always new people joining the forums so it's interesting to revisit subjects." The original question was regarding the success of the French government and whether we should adopt the same strategy here. | |||
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"Some piercers already refuse to do gential piercing regardless of if it's for fashion or fgm. Xxx Never heard of FGM being piercing, i always thought it was cutting bits off (hence the Mutilation bit in 'Female Genital Mutilation') Wikipedia definition of FGM https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation I am pierced wasn't aware that this is mutilation? Mrs" Piercing and fgm are completely different. One is concensual and enhancing, the other is most certainly not. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums With all due respect i don't see how that should prevent the subject from being discussed again. And again and again There are always new people joining the forums so it's interesting to revisit subjects." Hardly! I'm seeing the same old people starting new threads | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums With all due respect i don't see how that should prevent the subject from being discussed again. And again and again There are always new people joining the forums so it's interesting to revisit subjects. Hardly! I'm seeing the same old people starting new threads " Well i find it interesting 
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. Which religions are you talking about ? I'm not prepared to say here, if you want to know ask google." FGM is not required by any religion. It is more of a cultural thing and occurs in many countries. Please find below an education pack that Amnesty International uses in schools. http://orchidproject.org/category/about-fgc/why-fgc-happens/ | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. If you actually look into FGM and it's history I think you'll find its driven by culture not religion. They can pretend it's religiously motivated but the common denominator is that its simply a long held cultural tradition that overides any and all religious beliefs. " | |||
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" FGM is not required by any religion. It is more of a cultural thing and occurs in many countries. Please find below an education pack that Amnesty International uses in schools. http://orchidproject.org/category/about-fgc/why-fgc-happens/" Good resource | |||
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"Intimate examinations are carried out routinely in a Doctor's surgery - what is the problem here? Examination has to be better than mutilation and the loss of an enjoyable sex life for life! " Consent would be the issue if a required examination was imposed. Hence different to a GP exam that you consent to going to. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. If you actually look into FGM and it's history I think you'll find its driven by culture not religion. They can pretend it's religiously motivated but the common denominator is that its simply a long held cultural tradition that overides any and all religious beliefs. "It's true that fgm predates modern religions, however, the fact that some adherents believe it is a religious requirement contributes to the continuation of the practice. | |||
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"FGM isn't a religious requirement, it is purely cultural. It isn't generally performed here in the UK, families take their children overseas to have it done. Usually to the town/village of their ancestors. It is illegal here and there has been cases reported in the media although a successful prosecution hasn't happened yet. Protection orders are sometimes put in place to prevent young girls being taken overseas for fgm. In my opinion circumsizing male children is just as bad. This is done routinely in many cultures and religions for no good reason. It should only ever be done for medical reasons but for some reason it is accepted practice " | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? " Ok I will go and press the Empower button. That will stop it all. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? Ok I will go and press the Empower button. That will stop it all." Thank you so much | |||
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"Please find below an education pack that Amnesty International uses in schools. http://orchidproject.org/category/about-fgc/why-fgc-happens/" Thank you. Very informative. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? Ok I will go and press the Empower button. That will stop it all. Thank you so much "If only it was that simple. Unfortunately practices such as fgm are most common where there is already a deep rooted oppression of women. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. If you actually look into FGM and it's history I think you'll find its driven by culture not religion. They can pretend it's religiously motivated but the common denominator is that its simply a long held cultural tradition that overides any and all religious beliefs.
It's true that fgm predates modern religions, however, the fact that some adherents believe it is a religious requirement contributes to the continuation of the practice."There are religious leaders who do frown upon the practice and encourage their community to desist from these practices. For instance in Burkino Faso,where Amnesty worked with local communities and charities, the issue of child marriage was deceased with the help of elders, religious leaders,education in schools for both boys and girls. This in turn affected the number of FGM being carried out. Yes, it is true that women can be much maligned and trodden upon, but don't think that all men think it is right. This includes religious leaders. They live in the twenty first century too. | |||
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"Girls are routinely examined??? Wtf That's abuse in itself. It's illegal in this country but the problem is that the people that partake in it are absolutely nothing wrong with it" I've read up on the topic quite a lot! The material I read was primarily about girls sent to African countries for fgm - the various degrees of fgm (from simple removal of the clitoris to 'sawing away' at all female sexual parts!) and the high mortality rates involved (in some areas with low hygiene there's a 10% mortality) The reasons cited by the practitioners for doing it are open to debate! In some areas it's still almost impossible for a girl to find a husband if she hasn't had fgm - as he'll worry that she may be promiscuous when he's away etc! Taking the pleasure away from sex makes it less likely she'll be unfaithful! Barbaric but a salient point nonetheless! In all honesty - as a young girl I'd much prefer to be examined periodically than be mutilated without my consent! | |||
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" Due to interpretation of men, not religion itself. But yes I know what you mean. " . Religion IS an interpretation by man, it always was and still is... Just like Wednesdays are an interpretation of midweek. You can tell there interpretations by men because all of them subjecate women, Jesus is a man, Mohammed is a man, God is a man, the disciples are all men, Moses is a man, God created man..... Women only show up for virgin births or the pleasure of men?. . Women don't get 72 virgins when they get to Mecca. . Saying it's not religion perse, it's people that are to blame is the most stupid statement you could make..... Religion and man are one and the same | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done." If we don't discuss it here? On fab?! Oh do behave!  | |||
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"Notice how there's no religions or cultural practises that demand that men chop there balls off.... Funny that" Plenty that demand circumcision though. | |||
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" Women only show up for virgin births or the pleasure of men?. . Women don't get 72 virgins when they get to Mecca. . " Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. Please find where in the Quran where what you just stated is written ?? | |||
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" Women only show up for virgin births or the pleasure of men?. . Women don't get 72 virgins when they get to Mecca. . Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. Please find where in the Quran where what you just stated is written ??" . In Islam, the concept of 72 virgins (houri) refers to an aspect of Jannah (Paradise). This concept is grounded in Qur'anic text which describe a sensual Paradise where believing men are rewarded by being wed[1] to virgins with "full grown", "swelling" or "pears-shaped" breasts.[2][3] Conversly, women will be provided with only one man, and they "will be satisfied with him".[4]. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done." It's a criminal offence here | |||
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" Women only show up for virgin births or the pleasure of men?. . Women don't get 72 virgins when they get to Mecca. . Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. Please find where in the Quran where what you just stated is written ??. In Islam, the concept of 72 virgins (houri) refers to an aspect of Jannah (Paradise). This concept is grounded in Qur'anic text which describe a sensual Paradise where believing men are rewarded by being wed[1] to virgins with "full grown", "swelling" or "pears-shaped" breasts.[2][3] Conversly, women will be provided with only one man, and they "will be satisfied with him".[4]." Which Quran have you read though ? Because it is the same I have. https://youtu.be/3Y2Or0LlO6g Watch this TED talk if you get time  | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. If we don't discuss it here? On fab?! Oh do behave! "Why not on fab. Talking about boobs and willies is fun but that doesn't mean we can't have a serious discussion once in a while. We're all adults and raising people's awareness is the best way to make change happen. | |||
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"FGM isn't a religious requirement, it is purely cultural. It isn't generally performed here in the UK, families take their children overseas to have it done. Usually to the town/village of their ancestors. It is illegal here and there has been cases reported in the media although a successful prosecution hasn't happened yet. Protection orders are sometimes put in place to prevent young girls being taken overseas for fgm. In my opinion circumsizing male children is just as bad. This is done routinely in many cultures and religions for no good reason. It should only ever be done for medical reasons but for some reason it is accepted practice "99.9 Americans are circumcised and all muslim males have to be circumcised | |||
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"Notice how there's no religions or cultural practises that demand that men chop there balls off.... Funny that Plenty that demand circumcision though. " | |||
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" Why should we force our western ideals on these barely educated, freeloading, hate fuelled, brain washed, sociopaths? It's not for us to dictate what they should and shouldn't believe in, the ignorant pricks. Who says we're in the right? Are we so arrogant that we think we can poke our noses into the businesses of these malignant animals and tell them that its "ok" to read more than one book, or actually if you use soap you can eat with both hands, or no, you don't HAVE to make an animal suffer a terrible death just so you can eat it! Let alone anyone trying to inform these wretched wastes of skin that no, there really is no need to put your daughters life at risk by fucking up her genetalia with a big knife. Who says we're right?!" Da fuck !  | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums " I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. | |||
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" Why should we force our western ideals on these barely educated, freeloading, hate fuelled, brain washed, sociopaths? It's not for us to dictate what they should and shouldn't believe in, the ignorant pricks. Who says we're in the right? Are we so arrogant that we think we can poke our noses into the businesses of these malignant animals and tell them that its "ok" to read more than one book, or actually if you use soap you can eat with both hands, or no, you don't HAVE to make an animal suffer a terrible death just so you can eat it! Let alone anyone trying to inform these wretched wastes of skin that no, there really is no need to put your daughters life at risk by fucking up her genetalia with a big knife. Who says we're right?!" I do, and the vast majority. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. If we don't discuss it here? On fab?! Oh do behave!
Why not on fab. Talking about boobs and willies is fun but that doesn't mean we can't have a serious discussion once in a while. We're all adults and raising people's awareness is the best way to make change happen."No point telling us mate. Get yourself to Africa etc. We already know it's bad. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post." If you stop pissing everywhere then you might find it | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post." Forum search fgm = lots. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. If we don't discuss it here? On fab?! Oh do behave!
Why not on fab. Talking about boobs and willies is fun but that doesn't mean we can't have a serious discussion once in a while. We're all adults and raising people's awareness is the best way to make change happen.
No point telling us mate. Get yourself to Africa etc. We already know it's bad. "What is wrong with you ?! | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots." | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. If we don't discuss it here? On fab?! Oh do behave!
Why not on fab. Talking about boobs and willies is fun but that doesn't mean we can't have a serious discussion once in a while. We're all adults and raising people's awareness is the best way to make change happen.
No point telling us mate. Get yourself to Africa etc. We already know it's bad.
What is wrong with you ?!"Pointless thread. You might as well tell people who live in Manchester not to support Liverpool. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots. "Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago. Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread. Yeah, you can't fucking move for them. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. If you stop pissing everywhere then you might find it " At least I don't call it squirting. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. If we don't discuss it here? On fab?! Oh do behave!
Why not on fab. Talking about boobs and willies is fun but that doesn't mean we can't have a serious discussion once in a while. We're all adults and raising people's awareness is the best way to make change happen.
No point telling us mate. Get yourself to Africa etc. We already know it's bad.
What is wrong with you ?!
Pointless thread. You might as well tell people who live in Manchester not to support Liverpool. "I meant with your earlier language ? Was it really necessary ? | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them. "There was one only few weeks ago They probably hiding in between the "fuck, kill,shag my aunts dog" threads | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them. "Ah, i see. So unless you personally remember a subject being discussed then it hasn't happened? | |||
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"I fear this is going off topic somewhat, we know what fgm is and that it's bad. The original question was should we adopt France's approach to stamping it out here?" Definitely not | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. " I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them.
Ah, i see. So unless you personally remember a subject being discussed then it hasn't happened?"Nope. But I can't personally remember it, AND I did a forum search. It's not like we've been so inundated it's not worth posting. For all the thread topics that get posted, this seemed an odd one to go "oh god guys this has been done to DEATH" about | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! " Da fuck
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"I fear this is going off topic somewhat, we know what fgm is and that it's bad. The original question was should we adopt France's approach to stamping it out here? Definitely not" Why not? | |||
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" Women only show up for virgin births or the pleasure of men?. . Women don't get 72 virgins when they get to Mecca. . Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. Please find where in the Quran where what you just stated is written ??. In Islam, the concept of 72 virgins (houri) refers to an aspect of Jannah (Paradise). This concept is grounded in Qur'anic text which describe a sensual Paradise where believing men are rewarded by being wed[1] to virgins with "full grown", "swelling" or "pears-shaped" breasts.[2][3] Conversly, women will be provided with only one man, and they "will be satisfied with him".[4]. Which Quran have you read though ? Because it is the same I have. https://youtu.be/3Y2Or0LlO6g Watch this TED talk if you get time ". It's simple. you either belive that a divine all knowing all seeing all powerful deity passed on his absolutes on how every human should live to an illiterate warlord, child marrying, murderer... Or he didn't. In which case Islam like every other religion before it or after it is a completely made up story by men, and we know it's men because women always get a shit deal out of them!.... Now I can't tell you for definite that the divine one didn't choose Mohammed but what I can tell you is the divine one is definitely a sexist twat from what Mohammed wrote (this I will except is no different than Christianity and what's wrote in the Bible). God has a habit of smiting entire city's of "sinners". . So even if it is all true, you could not hold true believers responsible as there just following Gods written testimony!. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them.
Ah, i see. So unless you personally remember a subject being discussed then it hasn't happened?
Nope. But I can't personally remember it, AND I did a forum search. It's not like we've been so inundated it's not worth posting. For all the thread topics that get posted, this seemed an odd one to go "oh god guys this has been done to DEATH" about "All she said was "This subject has already been discussed on the forums". A statement that is entirely true, whether you remember or not. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them.
Ah, i see. So unless you personally remember a subject being discussed then it hasn't happened?
Nope. But I can't personally remember it, AND I did a forum search. It's not like we've been so inundated it's not worth posting. For all the thread topics that get posted, this seemed an odd one to go "oh god guys this has been done to DEATH" about
All she said was "This subject has already been discussed on the forums". A statement that is entirely true, whether you remember or not. "Entirely true and equally entirely pointless then. Because the same could be said of virtually every thread currently running in the Lounge. So unless that point is going to be posted on every single one, why this choose this one to make that observation? 7 threads over the forum lifetime doesn't equate to "lots" in my book. | |||
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" Women only show up for virgin births or the pleasure of men?. . Women don't get 72 virgins when they get to Mecca. . Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. Please find where in the Quran where what you just stated is written ??. In Islam, the concept of 72 virgins (houri) refers to an aspect of Jannah (Paradise). This concept is grounded in Qur'anic text which describe a sensual Paradise where believing men are rewarded by being wed[1] to virgins with "full grown", "swelling" or "pears-shaped" breasts.[2][3] Conversly, women will be provided with only one man, and they "will be satisfied with him".[4]. Which Quran have you read though ? Because it is the same I have. https://youtu.be/3Y2Or0LlO6g Watch this TED talk if you get time .
It's simple.
you either belive that a divine all knowing all seeing all powerful deity passed on his absolutes on how every human should live to an illiterate warlord, child marrying, murderer... Or he didn't.
In which case Islam like every other religion before it or after it is a completely made up story by men, and we know it's men because women always get a shit deal out of them!.... Now I can't tell you for definite that the divine one didn't choose Mohammed but what I can tell you is the divine one is definitely a sexist twat from what Mohammed wrote (this I will except is no different than Christianity and what's wrote in the Bible).
God has a habit of smiting entire city's of "sinners".
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So even if it is all true, you could not hold true believers responsible as there just following Gods written testimony!."See your language ? It shows how respect you have for religions. You are in crusade against them. Your religiously defend your ideas, which according to you are the best, but don't tolerate other's ideas. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them.
Ah, i see. So unless you personally remember a subject being discussed then it hasn't happened?
Nope. But I can't personally remember it, AND I did a forum search. It's not like we've been so inundated it's not worth posting. For all the thread topics that get posted, this seemed an odd one to go "oh god guys this has been done to DEATH" about
All she said was "This subject has already been discussed on the forums". A statement that is entirely true, whether you remember or not.
Entirely true and equally entirely pointless then. Because the same could be said of virtually every thread currently running in the Lounge. So unless that point is going to be posted on every single one, why this choose this one to make that observation? 7 threads over the forum lifetime doesn't equate to "lots" in my book. "I don't remember reading your book. | |||
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"I fear this is going off topic somewhat, we know what fgm is and that it's bad. The original question was should we adopt France's approach to stamping it out here? Definitely not Why not?" Because it is counterproductive to say that you are fighting for human rights then imposing onto others your ideas. This is what France does. | |||
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It's not the newspapers fault for writing shit.... It's people who misinterpret there message.
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Just to make it clear, I'm not against deists.... People who want to belive in a higher power I have no problem with.... It's the people that are in communication with the higher power I worry about | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them.
Ah, i see. So unless you personally remember a subject being discussed then it hasn't happened?
Nope. But I can't personally remember it, AND I did a forum search. It's not like we've been so inundated it's not worth posting. For all the thread topics that get posted, this seemed an odd one to go "oh god guys this has been done to DEATH" about
All she said was "This subject has already been discussed on the forums". A statement that is entirely true, whether you remember or not.
Entirely true and equally entirely pointless then. Because the same could be said of virtually every thread currently running in the Lounge. So unless that point is going to be posted on every single one, why this choose this one to make that observation? 7 threads over the forum lifetime doesn't equate to "lots" in my book.
I don't remember reading your book."You wouldn't like it. | |||
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"Some piercers already refuse to do gential piercing regardless of if it's for fashion or fgm. Xxx Never heard of FGM being piercing, i always thought it was cutting bits off (hence the Mutilation bit in 'Female Genital Mutilation') Wikipedia definition of FGM https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation I am pierced wasn't aware that this is mutilation? Mrs" I don't know tbh I just remember when I spoke on here last year about getting married VCH done I was told that some tattoo parlors refuse to do it because of new laws to do with FGM. Xxx | |||
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"It's like saying it's not trump's fault that some crazy people act out crazy shit from what he says..... No they've misinterpreted what trump said, it's not trump, it's crazy people .
It's not the newspapers fault for writing shit.... It's people who misinterpret there message.
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Just to make it clear, I'm not against deists.... People who want to belive in a higher power I have no problem with.... It's the people that are in communication with the higher power I worry about "Your words 'Mohammed but what I can tell you is the divine one is definitely a sexist twat' Sure you don't have any problems haha | |||
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"I am off " Yes, in this case you are. There is nothing fabulous about allowing people to mutilate the genitals of young girls. | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them.
Ah, i see. So unless you personally remember a subject being discussed then it hasn't happened?
Nope. But I can't personally remember it, AND I did a forum search. It's not like we've been so inundated it's not worth posting. For all the thread topics that get posted, this seemed an odd one to go "oh god guys this has been done to DEATH" about
All she said was "This subject has already been discussed on the forums". A statement that is entirely true, whether you remember or not.
Entirely true and equally entirely pointless then. Because the same could be said of virtually every thread currently running in the Lounge. So unless that point is going to be posted on every single one, why this choose this one to make that observation? 7 threads over the forum lifetime doesn't equate to "lots" in my book.
What book is that then?"Mine. Clue was in "my" book. Do you think 7 threads is a lot to have been posted in the entire time these forums have existed? | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them.
Ah, i see. So unless you personally remember a subject being discussed then it hasn't happened?
Nope. But I can't personally remember it, AND I did a forum search. It's not like we've been so inundated it's not worth posting. For all the thread topics that get posted, this seemed an odd one to go "oh god guys this has been done to DEATH" about
All she said was "This subject has already been discussed on the forums". A statement that is entirely true, whether you remember or not.
Entirely true and equally entirely pointless then. Because the same could be said of virtually every thread currently running in the Lounge. So unless that point is going to be posted on every single one, why this choose this one to make that observation? 7 threads over the forum lifetime doesn't equate to "lots" in my book.
I don't remember reading your book.
You wouldn't like it. "Fifty shades of shit lol | |||
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"I fear this is going off topic somewhat, we know what fgm is and that it's bad. The original question was should we adopt France's approach to stamping it out here? Definitely not Why not? Because it is counterproductive to say that you are fighting for human rights then imposing onto others your ideas. This is what France does. " France imposes its laws in France; not in Africa The UK must impose its' laws in the UK. All laws including those, for instance, which punish burglaries and murder by imprionment; what they do in Africa is their business, not ours | |||
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" I don't remember reading your book." **whispers in your ear** Old age is nothing but a computer with 1000 GB of memory running on a celeron processor... | |||
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"France's tough stance on fgm has seen a dramatic drop in recorded cases. Young girls thought to be at risk are routinely examined and both parents and cutters prosecuted. Isn't it about time we had the same approach here? Even worse is the fact that we allow foreign families to enter this country on a 'cutting holiday' because it's illegal in their own. A difficult subject admittedly but if we don't discuss it nothing will be done. This subject has already been discussed on the forums I've been pissing around these forums for at least 2 years and I can't remember a FGM post. Forum search fgm = lots.
Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago.
Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread.
Yeah, you can't fucking move for them.
Ah, i see. So unless you personally remember a subject being discussed then it hasn't happened?
Nope. But I can't personally remember it, AND I did a forum search. It's not like we've been so inundated it's not worth posting. For all the thread topics that get posted, this seemed an odd one to go "oh god guys this has been done to DEATH" about
All she said was "This subject has already been discussed on the forums". A statement that is entirely true, whether you remember or not.
Entirely true and equally entirely pointless then. Because the same could be said of virtually every thread currently running in the Lounge. So unless that point is going to be posted on every single one, why this choose this one to make that observation? 7 threads over the forum lifetime doesn't equate to "lots" in my book.
I don't remember reading your book.
You wouldn't like it.
Fifty shades of shit lol"LOL | |||
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"I am off Yes, in this case you are. There is nothing fabulous about allowing people to mutilate the genitals of young girls. " when did I say that ?? | |||
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"I am off Yes, in this case you are. There is nothing fabulous about allowing people to mutilate the genitals of young girls. when did I say that ?? " Just here. "The original question was should we adopt France's approach to stamping it out here? Definitely not." | |||
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" Why should we force our western ideals on these barely educated, freeloading, hate fuelled, brain washed, sociopaths? It's not for us to dictate what they should and shouldn't believe in, the ignorant pricks. Who says we're in the right? Are we so arrogant that we think we can poke our noses into the businesses of these malignant animals and tell them that its "ok" to read more than one book, or actually if you use soap you can eat with both hands, or no, you don't HAVE to make an animal suffer a terrible death just so you can eat it! Let alone anyone trying to inform these wretched wastes of skin that no, there really is no need to put your daughters life at risk by fucking up her genetalia with a big knife. Who says we're right?!" There are health issues. Girls forced to have their genitals mutilated with rusty implements. Girls getting HIV from unsanitary implements. Young girls passing blood everytime they urinate and not being able to speak up about the pain and bleeding because they are expected to grin and bear the crude butchery that they have sufferred. I could go on. I haven't even spoke about pregnancy complexities with FGM.I'll just stop at those examples. This is not a right or wrong issue. This is not Western ideals issue.This is a life and death issue for young girls and women. I will say again this is not a religious issue. This is a cultural issue. | |||
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"It's like saying it's not trump's fault that some crazy people act out crazy shit from what he says..... No they've misinterpreted what trump said, it's not trump, it's crazy people .
It's not the newspapers fault for writing shit.... It's people who misinterpret there message.
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Just to make it clear, I'm not against deists.... People who want to belive in a higher power I have no problem with.... It's the people that are in communication with the higher power I worry about
Your words 'Mohammed but what I can tell you is the divine one is definitely a sexist twat'
Sure you don't have any problems haha ". No because there the ones(religions) that always presume to know exactly what the higher power wants of us, they know when he wants us to pray, how many times, when we should work, what work we should do, wether we should divorce, masterbate, eat cows, don't eat cows, how to kill the cow.... They know every tiny little detail of what the supreme leader wants. There the mouthpieces of God, just like Kim Jung il has a mouthpiece to his people | |||
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" Why should we force our western ideals on these barely educated, freeloading, hate fuelled, brain washed, sociopaths? It's not for us to dictate what they should and shouldn't believe in, the ignorant pricks. Who says we're in the right? Are we so arrogant that we think we can poke our noses into the businesses of these malignant animals and tell them that its "ok" to read more than one book, or actually if you use soap you can eat with both hands, or no, you don't HAVE to make an animal suffer a terrible death just so you can eat it! Let alone anyone trying to inform these wretched wastes of skin that no, there really is no need to put your daughters life at risk by fucking up her genetalia with a big knife. Who says we're right?! There are health issues. Girls forced to have their genitals mutilated with rusty implements. Girls getting HIV from unsanitary implements. Young girls passing blood everytime they urinate and not being able to speak up about the pain and bleeding because they are expected to grin and bear the crude butchery that they have sufferred. I could go on. I haven't even spoke about pregnancy complexities with FGM.I'll just stop at those examples. This is not a right or wrong issue. This is not Western ideals issue.This is a life and death issue for young girls and women. I will say again this is not a religious issue. This is a cultural issue." ....i know. | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort..." Which men? From which country? | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country? "Every country that practice Islam | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. If you actually look into FGM and it's history I think you'll find its driven by culture not religion. They can pretend it's religiously motivated but the common denominator is that its simply a long held cultural tradition that overides any and all religious beliefs.
It's true that fgm predates modern religions, however, the fact that some adherents believe it is a religious requirement contributes to the continuation of the practice."And this is where education and awareness comes in! | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country? ". Here there and everywhere!. Perhaps you missed the case of the British woman who divorced her husband and was thinking of remarrying but while visiting in Pakistan her dad and her ex husband were so enraged by this idea they decided to rape and murder her. Theres a lesson for any other woman contemplating divorce and future happiness... Weigh it up before deciding | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country?
Every country that practice Islam "There are many countries that practice Islam and do not practice FGM. Nor chuck acid in people's faces, nor have their females go out with a male escort. As I said FGM is not a requirement of a religion. This is cultural.It is not particularly attached to a particular religion. | |||
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"Traumatic for a young girl to be routinely examined. The lesser of two evils, but even so... Yes of course but i think you'll agree that the trauma of examination is nothing compared to that of mutilation. Routine examination should only be carried out at the discretion of the customs officers and only when potential risk to the girl has been properly assessed. I'm not suggesting doing it at random. Why not simply empower the girl to come forward ? In an ideal world. In religions where this is common practice women have no rights and certainly no power. It's often the case where mothers support having this done to their daughter simply because they can't do anything else. If you actually look into FGM and it's history I think you'll find its driven by culture not religion. They can pretend it's religiously motivated but the common denominator is that its simply a long held cultural tradition that overides any and all religious beliefs.
It's true that fgm predates modern religions, however, the fact that some adherents believe it is a religious requirement contributes to the continuation of the practice.
And this is where education and awareness comes in!"Good luck with that | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country?
Every country that practice Islam
There are many countries that practice Islam and do not practice FGM. Nor chuck acid in people's faces, nor have their females go out with a male escort.
As I said FGM is not a requirement of a religion. This is cultural.It is not particularly attached to a particular religion."Islam don't practice any of those you mentioned? It's mostly African culture who are into Fgm | |||
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"I fear this is going off topic somewhat, we know what fgm is and that it's bad. The original question was should we adopt France's approach to stamping it out here? Definitely not Why not? Because it is counterproductive to say that you are fighting for human rights then imposing onto others your ideas This is what France does. " True say! | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country? .
Here there and everywhere!.
Perhaps you missed the case of the British woman who divorced her husband and was thinking of remarrying but while visiting in Pakistan her dad and her ex husband were so enraged by this idea they decided to rape and murder her.
Theres a lesson for any other woman contemplating divorce and future happiness... Weigh it up before deciding"And any lesson for any girl and woman refusing FGM? Because that is what this thread is about. If you want to rage about something, then fine.Its a free country. I accept that you have your point of view, but at least stay on the topic... | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country?
Every country that practice Islam
There are many countries that practice Islam and do not practice FGM. Nor chuck acid in people's faces, nor have their females go out with a male escort.
As I said FGM is not a requirement of a religion. This is cultural.It is not particularly attached to a particular religion.
Islam don't practice any of those you mentioned?
It's mostly African culture who are into Fgm"No,it can happen in communities that practice other religions too. There are other countries that do practice Islam that don't do it. I didn't mention them. And BTW there are other countries apart from the those in the continent of Africa that do practice FGM. | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country? .
Here there and everywhere!.
Perhaps you missed the case of the British woman who divorced her husband and was thinking of remarrying but while visiting in Pakistan her dad and her ex husband were so enraged by this idea they decided to rape and murder her.
Theres a lesson for any other woman contemplating divorce and future happiness... Weigh it up before deciding
And any lesson for any girl and woman refusing FGM? Because that is what this thread is about.
If you want to rage about something, then fine.Its a free country. I accept that you have your point of view, but at least stay on the topic...
". It's on topic, your just misinterpreting my message!. | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country?
Every country that practice Islam
There are many countries that practice Islam and do not practice FGM. Nor chuck acid in people's faces, nor have their females go out with a male escort.
As I said FGM is not a requirement of a religion. This is cultural.It is not particularly attached to a particular religion.
Islam don't practice any of those you mentioned?
It's mostly African culture who are into Fgm
No,it can happen in communities that practice other religions too.
There are other countries that do practice Islam that don't do it. I didn't mention them.
And BTW there are other countries apart from the those in the continent of Africa that do practice FGM."Anyone can 'practice' FGM. The only requirements are stupidity and barbarism | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country? .
Here there and everywhere!.
Perhaps you missed the case of the British woman who divorced her husband and was thinking of remarrying but while visiting in Pakistan her dad and her ex husband were so enraged by this idea they decided to rape and murder her.
Theres a lesson for any other woman contemplating divorce and future happiness... Weigh it up before deciding
And any lesson for any girl and woman refusing FGM? Because that is what this thread is about.
If you want to rage about something, then fine.Its a free country. I accept that you have your point of view, but at least stay on the topic...
.
It's on topic, your just misinterpreting my message!."I don't think I am...
However, I respect your right of voicing your opinion,and in this case I think we'll have to agree to disagree... | |||
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Nita | |||
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"I do think more needs to be done about FGM. Whether the French model is the way to go I'm not sure. (It was the French way of doing it Fabulous and Bearded disagreed with BTW) Sadly, I can't think of a way to pick it up that won't make those intent on continuing the practice hide even more. FGM parties are becoming increasingly common in our cities. It is easier to get one woman in (yes it's usually a woman who mutilates them), than several girls out
Nita"I think that the UK feels a bit uneasy about doing it the French way. Health professionals now have to go to the police if they suspect FGM. I agree that FGM parties are becoming more common. In that case,why arent there any prosecutions? Are they waiting for a watertight case? The mind boggles... | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country? .
Here there and everywhere!.
Perhaps you missed the case of the British woman who divorced her husband and was thinking of remarrying but while visiting in Pakistan her dad and her ex husband were so enraged by this idea they decided to rape and murder her.
Theres a lesson for any other woman contemplating divorce and future happiness... Weigh it up before deciding"You can't generalise across whole communities based on the wrongful actions of the a few. Those men were driven by their own egos more than anything else and certainly not religion. You get men who will do this to women regardless of their creed or culture. Violence against women is a big problem in this country too... Let's not forget Katie Piper and other less prominent victims! Root problem? Male egos | |||
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"...There are many countries that practice Islam and do not practice FGM. Nor chuck acid in people's faces, nor have their females go out with a male escort. As I said FGM is not a requirement of a religion. This is cultural.It is not particularly attached to a particular religion." I'm not sure if I'm reading some quite astonishing ignorance or depraved political correctness. From Wiki: " In December 1997, the Court of Cassation (Egypt's highest appeals court) upheld a government banning of the practice providing that those who did not comply would be subjected to criminal and administrative punishments. According to a survey in the year 2000, a study found that 97% of the country's population still practiced FGM; a 2005 study found that over 95% of Egyptian women have undergone some form of FGM." And plenty more where that came from... for those who can be bothered. | |||
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"...There are many countries that practice Islam and do not practice FGM. Nor chuck acid in people's faces, nor have their females go out with a male escort. As I said FGM is not a requirement of a religion. This is cultural.It is not particularly attached to a particular religion. I'm not sure if I'm reading some quite astonishing ignorance or depraved political correctness. From Wiki: " In December 1997, the Court of Cassation (Egypt's highest appeals court) upheld a government banning of the practice providing that those who did not comply would be subjected to criminal and administrative punishments. According to a survey in the year 2000, a study found that 97% of the country's population still practiced FGM; a 2005 study found that over 95% of Egyptian women have undergone some form of FGM." And plenty more where that came from... for those who can be bothered." Egypt is not a wholly Muslim country.Christianity is practiced there too. Therefore,according to the stats you gave 97% of the population in 2000 would consist of Muslims and Christians who practice FGM,and 95% of Christian and Muslim women in 2005. It is not a religious issue. It is a cultural one. | |||
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"...There are many countries that practice Islam and do not practice FGM. Nor chuck acid in people's faces, nor have their females go out with a male escort. As I said FGM is not a requirement of a religion. This is cultural.It is not particularly attached to a particular religion. I'm not sure if I'm reading some quite astonishing ignorance or depraved political correctness. From Wiki: " In December 1997, the Court of Cassation (Egypt's highest appeals court) upheld a government banning of the practice providing that those who did not comply would be subjected to criminal and administrative punishments. According to a survey in the year 2000, a study found that 97% of the country's population still practiced FGM; a 2005 study found that over 95% of Egyptian women have undergone some form of FGM." And plenty more where that came from... for those who can be bothered." It is a stupidity issue; the more backward a people, the more likely they are to engage in barbaric rituals as they could not possibly know any better | |||
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"Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago. Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread. Yeah, you can't fucking move for them. " It is hardly going to be widely advertised and put on Google - FFS | |||
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"Intimate examinations are carried out routinely in a Doctor's surgery - what is the problem here? Examination has to be better than mutilation and the loss of an enjoyable sex life for life! Consent would be the issue if a required examination was imposed. Hence different to a GP exam that you consent to going to. " In which case I would say that there is no hope in eradicating this barbaric practice! Radical steps need to be taken. | |||
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"... It is not a religious issue. It is a cultural one." A snapshot from the Midde East Quarterly: "While Western scholars may dismiss the religious roots of the practice, what counts is that many Islamic clerics in northern Iraq advise women to practice FGM. Should a woman consider abandoning the practice, she must be aware that she could appear as disreputable in the public eye." | |||
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".Christianity is practiced there too. Therefore,according to the stats you gave 97% of the population in 2000 would consist of Muslims and Christians who practice FGM,and 95% of Christian and Muslim women in 2005. It is not a religious issue. It is a cultural one." . If that's the case where's the atheist FGM practised? | |||
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"Forum search FGM = 5, 4 of those over a year ago. Forum search female genital mutilation = 2, 1 of which is over a year ago and the other is this thread. Yeah, you can't fucking move for them. It is hardly going to be widely advertised and put on Google - FFS" WTF are you talking about? I was responding to comments about the number of threads on this site on the topic. | |||
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"Was told by my tattooist that also does piercing that intimate piercing on women is also no longer allowed as classes as FGM ... She said she had the police in to inform her ... " Thank you! Xxx | |||
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".Christianity is practiced there too. Therefore,according to the stats you gave 97% of the population in 2000 would consist of Muslims and Christians who practice FGM,and 95% of Christian and Muslim women in 2005. It is not a religious issue. It is a cultural one.. If that's the case where's the atheist FGM practised?" I daresay that there are atheists there. If there are,then it would decease the number of Muslims even further, and prove the point even more that it is a cultural and not a religious issue. | |||
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"... It is not a religious issue. It is a cultural one. A snapshot from the Midde East Quarterly: "While Western scholars may dismiss the religious roots of the practice, what counts is that many Islamic clerics in northern Iraq advise women to practice FGM. Should a woman consider abandoning the practice, she must be aware that she could appear as disreputable in the public eye."" Iraq is just one Muslim country. A swallow does not make a summer. | |||
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".Christianity is practiced there too. Therefore,according to the stats you gave 97% of the population in 2000 would consist of Muslims and Christians who practice FGM,and 95% of Christian and Muslim women in 2005. It is not a religious issue. It is a cultural one.. If that's the case where's the atheist FGM practised? I daresay that there are atheists there. If there are,then it would decease the number of Muslims even further, and prove the point even more that it is a cultural and not a religious issue." Ah yes, the Egyptian Atheist Society. One member...stoned to death last week. | |||
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".Christianity is practiced there too. Therefore,according to the stats you gave 97% of the population in 2000 would consist of Muslims and Christians who practice FGM,and 95% of Christian and Muslim women in 2005. It is not a religious issue. It is a cultural one.. If that's the case where's the atheist FGM practised? I daresay that there are atheists there. If there are,then it would decease the number of Muslims even further, and prove the point even more that it is a cultural and not a religious issue. Ah yes, the Egyptian Atheist Society. One member...stoned to death last week." Hmmm...yes, I suppose you're right. One atheist swallow doesn't make a summer... | |||
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"It's like saying it's not trump's fault that some crazy people act out crazy shit from what he says..... No they've misinterpreted what trump said, it's not trump, it's crazy people .
It's not the newspapers fault for writing shit.... It's people who misinterpret there message.
......................"In exactly the way how the story of Lady Godiva has evolved over the years. That she rode "naked" on a horse was more like she was "naked of all her refineries" like her expensive clothes and was actually her disguised in rough clothes to escape detection! However, the idea of a long blonde haired woman with big tits riding though the streets stark bollock naked sounds much better! | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country?
Every country that practice Islam
There are many countries that practice Islam and do not practice FGM. Nor chuck acid in people's faces, nor have their females go out with a male escort.
As I said FGM is not a requirement of a religion. This is cultural.It is not particularly attached to a particular religion.
Islam don't practice any of those you mentioned?
It's mostly African culture who are into Fgm
No,it can happen in communities that practice other religions too.
There are other countries that do practice Islam that don't do it. I didn't mention them.
And BTW there are other countries apart from the those in the continent of Africa that do practice FGM."Islam don't do FGM Muslim men have circumcisms | |||
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"...last time I looked the men keep chucking acid in their faces, chopping off their tits, sewing up their Fanny's and shooting them in the head for going to school.... You know they might just think twice about rebelling...Lots of girls in this country aren't allowed out of the house without a MALE escort... Which men? From which country?
Every country that practice Islam
There are many countries that practice Islam and do not practice FGM. Nor chuck acid in people's faces, nor have their females go out with a male escort.
As I said FGM is not a requirement of a religion. This is cultural.It is not particularly attached to a particular religion.
Islam don't practice any of those you mentioned?
It's mostly African culture who are into Fgm
No,it can happen in communities that practice other religions too.
There are other countries that do practice Islam that don't do it. I didn't mention them.
And BTW there are other countries apart from the those in the continent of Africa that do practice FGM.
Islam don't do FGM
Muslim men have circumcisms "That is MGM and its' in Bollywood | |||
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".Christianity is practiced there too. Therefore,according to the stats you gave 97% of the population in 2000 would consist of Muslims and Christians who practice FGM,and 95% of Christian and Muslim women in 2005. It is not a religious issue. It is a cultural one.. If that's the case where's the atheist FGM practised? I daresay that there are atheists there. If there are,then it would decease the number of Muslims even further, and prove the point even more that it is a cultural and not a religious issue." . So you can't find an atheist culture that practice FGM but you still insist it's got nothing to do with religion and it's entirely cultural!. | |||
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".Christianity is practiced there too. Therefore,according to the stats you gave 97% of the population in 2000 would consist of Muslims and Christians who practice FGM,and 95% of Christian and Muslim women in 2005. It is not a religious issue. It is a cultural one.. If that's the case where's the atheist FGM practised? I daresay that there are atheists there. If there are,then it would decease the number of Muslims even further, and prove the point even more that it is a cultural and not a religious issue.. So you can't find an atheist culture that practice FGM but you still insist it's got nothing to do with religion and it's entirely cultural!. " Yes, I am. For the very reasons I stated previously. Read back and see. | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! " Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. " The conviction rate so far is France 100+ : England 0. Not a score sheet any of us should be proud of. Constant hand wringing over the rights of ethnic minorities is not going to deal with this. As i stated earlier the rights of young girls has to come first. France's approach to this has clearly had beneficial effects, there are not plenty of cases there as you seem to think. Attention must be focussed on stamping it out here. How else do you propose to do that? | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. The conviction rate so far is France 100+ : England 0. Not a score sheet any of us should be proud of. Constant hand wringing over the rights of ethnic minorities is not going to deal with this. As i stated earlier the rights of young girls has to come first. France's approach to this has clearly had beneficial effects, there are not plenty of cases there as you seem to think. Attention must be focussed on stamping it out here. How else do you propose to do that?" It's not had wringing. That's the problem. We are talking about human's basic rights. The fact that they are an ethnic minority in this country does not mean that their rights are more malleable than the rights of anyone else. Their rights are their rights and if we change their rights we change ours. Arresting people is too late. The victim has still been mutilated. Stopping it is important. If we simply make it too inconvenient in the uk, those who find it a vital part of their culture will do it elsewhere. We won't stop it, we will only polish our own doorstep. If that's what is important, having a clean doorstep whilst girls clitorises are cut off next door then fine. But I would suggest what is more important is stopping it altogether. Banishing the act is one thing but that is simply selfish so we don't need to think about it. If you actually care for the victims then we need to look at ways of prevention. | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. The conviction rate so far is France 100+ : England 0. Not a score sheet any of us should be proud of. Constant hand wringing over the rights of ethnic minorities is not going to deal with this. As i stated earlier the rights of young girls has to come first. France's approach to this has clearly had beneficial effects, there are not plenty of cases there as you seem to think. Attention must be focussed on stamping it out here. How else do you propose to do that? It's not had wringing. That's the problem. We are talking about human's basic rights. The fact that they are an ethnic minority in this country does not mean that their rights are more malleable than the rights of anyone else. Their rights are their rights and if we change their rights we change ours. Arresting people is too late. The victim has still been mutilated. Stopping it is important. If we simply make it too inconvenient in the uk, those who find it a vital part of their culture will do it elsewhere. We won't stop it, we will only polish our own doorstep. If that's what is important, having a clean doorstep whilst girls clitorises are cut off next door then fine. But I would suggest what is more important is stopping it altogether. Banishing the act is one thing but that is simply selfish so we don't need to think about it. If you actually care for the victims then we need to look at ways of prevention. " You haven't answered the question. Making arrests has been proved to stop it, it's never too late. You seem to think that because it happens in other countries we shouldn't try to deal with it here. It's not polishing our own doorstep, these people need to be shown that it is not an acceptable practice and will not be tolerated. If we can stop it happening here it's a start. In France girls thought to be at risk are examined, the parents,and where possible, the cutters prosecuted. As i said - how else do you propose to deal with it. | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. The conviction rate so far is France 100+ : England 0. Not a score sheet any of us should be proud of. Constant hand wringing over the rights of ethnic minorities is not going to deal with this. As i stated earlier the rights of young girls has to come first. France's approach to this has clearly had beneficial effects, there are not plenty of cases there as you seem to think. Attention must be focussed on stamping it out here. How else do you propose to do that? It's not had wringing. That's the problem. We are talking about human's basic rights. The fact that they are an ethnic minority in this country does not mean that their rights are more malleable than the rights of anyone else. Their rights are their rights and if we change their rights we change ours. Arresting people is too late. The victim has still been mutilated. Stopping it is important. If we simply make it too inconvenient in the uk, those who find it a vital part of their culture will do it elsewhere. We won't stop it, we will only polish our own doorstep. If that's what is important, having a clean doorstep whilst girls clitorises are cut off next door then fine. But I would suggest what is more important is stopping it altogether. Banishing the act is one thing but that is simply selfish so we don't need to think about it. If you actually care for the victims then we need to look at ways of prevention. You haven't answered the question. Making arrests has been proved to stop it, it's never too late. You seem to think that because it happens in other countries we shouldn't try to deal with it here. It's not polishing our own doorstep, these people need to be shown that it is not an acceptable practice and will not be tolerated. If we can stop it happening here it's a start. In France girls thought to be at risk are examined, the parents,and where possible, the cutters prosecuted. As i said - how else do you propose to deal with it." I have not answered the question because I, like you, do not have a workable solution to prevent it. How much have the rates of FGM fallen in France? How do we know it works? I don't have any issue with identification and protection of people at risk, but if all we do is arrest people after the fact, we have failed. The solution is a very long term one of changing cultures and people's attitude towards sex. The same goes for male genital mutilation but the difference is that it is far less destructive to the victim. We need to help people realise that the human body is the shape it is for good reason and we would be well advised to leave it be. Furthermore we need to work in cultures who see males or females enjoying sex as a bad thing and show them the benefits of a more open minded and equality based way of life. What we must not do, and this is of vital importance, is we must not push these cultures and practices any more underground. We need to be able to see what is happening, where and why. Otherwise we will lose sight of the issue and never be able to affect change. Look what happened with racism in this country, we banned it, didn't change anyone who was racist, but told them they could not say certain things, and now with the marginally unrelated catalyst of Brexit we have an upsurge in unpleasant wankers who think they can send the foreigners home. We assumed they had all changed their mind because we stopped them from speaking. The same can be said for misogyny, misandry, homosexual discrimination, religious bigotry etc. I dont disagree with the principle you are putting forward but we need to ensure we get it right or we will make it worse and think we have cured it. | |||
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"Girls are routinely examined??? Wtf That's abuse in itself. It's illegal in this country but the problem is that the people that partake in it are absolutely nothing wrong with it" Totally agree. There is also the element of racial profiling. I don't know what the solution is but it's defintely not the French way. | |||
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"FGM isn't a religious requirement, it is purely cultural. It isn't generally performed here in the UK, families take their children overseas to have it done. Usually to the town/village of their ancestors. It is illegal here and there has been cases reported in the media although a successful prosecution hasn't happened yet. Protection orders are sometimes put in place to prevent young girls being taken overseas for fgm. In my opinion circumsizing male children is just as bad. This is done routinely in many cultures and religions for no good reason. It should only ever be done for medical reasons but for some reason it is accepted practice
99.9 Americans are circumcised and all muslim males have to be circumcised "I always find it strange when people speak about things or situation they don't experience: male circumcision I'm talking about. I'll also say 90+ African male are circumcised Don't know much about women/girls circumcision so can't speak on that however more need to be learn as to why, by speaking to people with first hand experience and understanding rather than straight forward condemning the act. Does sound pretty brutal. | |||
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"According to doctorprod If we discuss it on here, then something will be done about it "It's about raising public awareness. | |||
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" It's about raising public awareness." The mantra uttered by so many so often about so little. | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. The conviction rate so far is France 100+ : England 0. Not a score sheet any of us should be proud of. Constant hand wringing over the rights of ethnic minorities is not going to deal with this. As i stated earlier the rights of young girls has to come first. France's approach to this has clearly had beneficial effects, there are not plenty of cases there as you seem to think. Attention must be focussed on stamping it out here. How else do you propose to do that? It's not had wringing. That's the problem. We are talking about human's basic rights. The fact that they are an ethnic minority in this country does not mean that their rights are more malleable than the rights of anyone else. Their rights are their rights and if we change their rights we change ours. Arresting people is too late. The victim has still been mutilated. Stopping it is important. If we simply make it too inconvenient in the uk, those who find it a vital part of their culture will do it elsewhere. We won't stop it, we will only polish our own doorstep. If that's what is important, having a clean doorstep whilst girls clitorises are cut off next door then fine. But I would suggest what is more important is stopping it altogether. Banishing the act is one thing but that is simply selfish so we don't need to think about it. If you actually care for the victims then we need to look at ways of prevention. You haven't answered the question. Making arrests has been proved to stop it, it's never too late. You seem to think that because it happens in other countries we shouldn't try to deal with it here. It's not polishing our own doorstep, these people need to be shown that it is not an acceptable practice and will not be tolerated. If we can stop it happening here it's a start. In France girls thought to be at risk are examined, the parents,and where possible, the cutters prosecuted. As i said - how else do you propose to deal with it. I have not answered the question because I, like you, do not have a workable solution to prevent it. How much have the rates of FGM fallen in France? How do we know it works? I don't have any issue with identification and protection of people at risk, but if all we do is arrest people after the fact, we have failed. The solution is a very long term one of changing cultures and people's attitude towards sex. The same goes for male genital mutilation but the difference is that it is far less destructive to the victim. We need to help people realise that the human body is the shape it is for good reason and we would be well advised to leave it be. Furthermore we need to work in cultures who see males or females enjoying sex as a bad thing and show them the benefits of a more open minded and equality based way of life. What we must not do, and this is of vital importance, is we must not push these cultures and practices any more underground. We need to be able to see what is happening, where and why. Otherwise we will lose sight of the issue and never be able to affect change. Look what happened with racism in this country, we banned it, didn't change anyone who was racist, but told them they could not say certain things, and now with the marginally unrelated catalyst of Brexit we have an upsurge in unpleasant wankers who think they can send the foreigners home. We assumed they had all changed their mind because we stopped them from speaking. The same can be said for misogyny, misandry, homosexual discrimination, religious bigotry etc. I dont disagree with the principle you are putting forward but we need to ensure we get it right or we will make it worse and think we have cured it. " Making arrests after the event is not failure, it will prevent it happening again and sends out a strong signal that it will not be tolerated and will make them think twice. Fgm has not been pushed underground in France, it's always been there and research has proved a dramatic reduction in incedents. It's not rocket science. I also think it's a mistake to play the race/religion/culture card, the same rules aply to all By all means try re education, that is the best solution but fighting hundreds of years of tradition will take time. What we need to do is stop it now. | |||
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" It's about raising public awareness. The mantra uttered by so many so often about so little. " And yet it's always the first step on a long journey. | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. The conviction rate so far is France 100+ : England 0. Not a score sheet any of us should be proud of. Constant hand wringing over the rights of ethnic minorities is not going to deal with this. As i stated earlier the rights of young girls has to come first. France's approach to this has clearly had beneficial effects, there are not plenty of cases there as you seem to think. Attention must be focussed on stamping it out here. How else do you propose to do that? It's not had wringing. That's the problem. We are talking about human's basic rights. The fact that they are an ethnic minority in this country does not mean that their rights are more malleable than the rights of anyone else. Their rights are their rights and if we change their rights we change ours. Arresting people is too late. The victim has still been mutilated. Stopping it is important. If we simply make it too inconvenient in the uk, those who find it a vital part of their culture will do it elsewhere. We won't stop it, we will only polish our own doorstep. If that's what is important, having a clean doorstep whilst girls clitorises are cut off next door then fine. But I would suggest what is more important is stopping it altogether. Banishing the act is one thing but that is simply selfish so we don't need to think about it. If you actually care for the victims then we need to look at ways of prevention. You haven't answered the question. Making arrests has been proved to stop it, it's never too late. You seem to think that because it happens in other countries we shouldn't try to deal with it here. It's not polishing our own doorstep, these people need to be shown that it is not an acceptable practice and will not be tolerated. If we can stop it happening here it's a start. In France girls thought to be at risk are examined, the parents,and where possible, the cutters prosecuted. As i said - how else do you propose to deal with it. I have not answered the question because I, like you, do not have a workable solution to prevent it. How much have the rates of FGM fallen in France? How do we know it works? I don't have any issue with identification and protection of people at risk, but if all we do is arrest people after the fact, we have failed. The solution is a very long term one of changing cultures and people's attitude towards sex. The same goes for male genital mutilation but the difference is that it is far less destructive to the victim. We need to help people realise that the human body is the shape it is for good reason and we would be well advised to leave it be. Furthermore we need to work in cultures who see males or females enjoying sex as a bad thing and show them the benefits of a more open minded and equality based way of life. What we must not do, and this is of vital importance, is we must not push these cultures and practices any more underground. We need to be able to see what is happening, where and why. Otherwise we will lose sight of the issue and never be able to affect change. Look what happened with racism in this country, we banned it, didn't change anyone who was racist, but told them they could not say certain things, and now with the marginally unrelated catalyst of Brexit we have an upsurge in unpleasant wankers who think they can send the foreigners home. We assumed they had all changed their mind because we stopped them from speaking. The same can be said for misogyny, misandry, homosexual discrimination, religious bigotry etc. I dont disagree with the principle you are putting forward but we need to ensure we get it right or we will make it worse and think we have cured it. " | |||
(closed, thread got too big) | |||
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". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. The conviction rate so far is France 100+ : England 0. Not a score sheet any of us should be proud of. Constant hand wringing over the rights of ethnic minorities is not going to deal with this. As i stated earlier the rights of young girls has to come first. France's approach to this has clearly had beneficial effects, there are not plenty of cases there as you seem to think. Attention must be focussed on stamping it out here. How else do you propose to do that? It's not had wringing. That's the problem. We are talking about human's basic rights. The fact that they are an ethnic minority in this country does not mean that their rights are more malleable than the rights of anyone else. Their rights are their rights and if we change their rights we change ours. Arresting people is too late. The victim has still been mutilated. Stopping it is important. If we simply make it too inconvenient in the uk, those who find it a vital part of their culture will do it elsewhere. We won't stop it, we will only polish our own doorstep. If that's what is important, having a clean doorstep whilst girls clitorises are cut off next door then fine. But I would suggest what is more important is stopping it altogether. Banishing the act is one thing but that is simply selfish so we don't need to think about it. If you actually care for the victims then we need to look at ways of prevention. You haven't answered the question. Making arrests has been proved to stop it, it's never too late. You seem to think that because it happens in other countries we shouldn't try to deal with it here. It's not polishing our own doorstep, these people need to be shown that it is not an acceptable practice and will not be tolerated. If we can stop it happening here it's a start. In France girls thought to be at risk are examined, the parents,and where possible, the cutters prosecuted. As i said - how else do you propose to deal with it. I have not answered the question because I, like you, do not have a workable solution to prevent it. How much have the rates of FGM fallen in France? How do we know it works? I don't have any issue with identification and protection of people at risk, but if all we do is arrest people after the fact, we have failed. The solution is a very long term one of changing cultures and people's attitude towards sex. The same goes for male genital mutilation but the difference is that it is far less destructive to the victim. We need to help people realise that the human body is the shape it is for good reason and we would be well advised to leave it be. Furthermore we need to work in cultures who see males or females enjoying sex as a bad thing and show them the benefits of a more open minded and equality based way of life. What we must not do, and this is of vital importance, is we must not push these cultures and practices any more underground. We need to be able to see what is happening, where and why. Otherwise we will lose sight of the issue and never be able to affect change. Look what happened with racism in this country, we banned it, didn't change anyone who was racist, but told them they could not say certain things, and now with the marginally unrelated catalyst of Brexit we have an upsurge in unpleasant wankers who think they can send the foreigners home. We assumed they had all changed their mind because we stopped them from speaking. The same can be said for misogyny, misandry, homosexual discrimination, religious bigotry etc. I dont disagree with the principle you are putting forward but we need to ensure we get it right or we will make it worse and think we have cured it. Making arrests after the event is not failure, it will prevent it happening again and sends out a strong signal that it will not be tolerated and will make them think twice. Fgm has not been pushed underground in France, it's always been there and research has proved a dramatic reduction in incedents. It's not rocket science. I also think it's a mistake to play the race/religion/culture card, the same rules aply to all By all means try re education, that is the best solution but fighting hundreds of years of tradition will take time. What we need to do is stop it now." If a mother is arrested after her daughter has her genitals mutilated, who is saved? If we need to wait till people are mutilated before we can take any action then we will end up with no more than a lot of mutilated people with parents in jail. We must stop it before it happens. It's like shooting dead a gunman who has killed already. It is too late and it doesn't seem to stop the initial crime. | |||
(closed, thread got too big) | |||
| Reply privately |
". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. The conviction rate so far is France 100+ : England 0. Not a score sheet any of us should be proud of. Constant hand wringing over the rights of ethnic minorities is not going to deal with this. As i stated earlier the rights of young girls has to come first. France's approach to this has clearly had beneficial effects, there are not plenty of cases there as you seem to think. Attention must be focussed on stamping it out here. How else do you propose to do that? It's not had wringing. That's the problem. We are talking about human's basic rights. The fact that they are an ethnic minority in this country does not mean that their rights are more malleable than the rights of anyone else. Their rights are their rights and if we change their rights we change ours. Arresting people is too late. The victim has still been mutilated. Stopping it is important. If we simply make it too inconvenient in the uk, those who find it a vital part of their culture will do it elsewhere. We won't stop it, we will only polish our own doorstep. If that's what is important, having a clean doorstep whilst girls clitorises are cut off next door then fine. But I would suggest what is more important is stopping it altogether. Banishing the act is one thing but that is simply selfish so we don't need to think about it. If you actually care for the victims then we need to look at ways of prevention. You haven't answered the question. Making arrests has been proved to stop it, it's never too late. You seem to think that because it happens in other countries we shouldn't try to deal with it here. It's not polishing our own doorstep, these people need to be shown that it is not an acceptable practice and will not be tolerated. If we can stop it happening here it's a start. In France girls thought to be at risk are examined, the parents,and where possible, the cutters prosecuted. As i said - how else do you propose to deal with it. I have not answered the question because I, like you, do not have a workable solution to prevent it. How much have the rates of FGM fallen in France? How do we know it works? I don't have any issue with identification and protection of people at risk, but if all we do is arrest people after the fact, we have failed. The solution is a very long term one of changing cultures and people's attitude towards sex. The same goes for male genital mutilation but the difference is that it is far less destructive to the victim. We need to help people realise that the human body is the shape it is for good reason and we would be well advised to leave it be. Furthermore we need to work in cultures who see males or females enjoying sex as a bad thing and show them the benefits of a more open minded and equality based way of life. What we must not do, and this is of vital importance, is we must not push these cultures and practices any more underground. We need to be able to see what is happening, where and why. Otherwise we will lose sight of the issue and never be able to affect change. Look what happened with racism in this country, we banned it, didn't change anyone who was racist, but told them they could not say certain things, and now with the marginally unrelated catalyst of Brexit we have an upsurge in unpleasant wankers who think they can send the foreigners home. We assumed they had all changed their mind because we stopped them from speaking. The same can be said for misogyny, misandry, homosexual discrimination, religious bigotry etc. I dont disagree with the principle you are putting forward but we need to ensure we get it right or we will make it worse and think we have cured it. Making arrests after the event is not failure, it will prevent it happening again and sends out a strong signal that it will not be tolerated and will make them think twice. Fgm has not been pushed underground in France, it's always been there and research has proved a dramatic reduction in incedents. It's not rocket science. I also think it's a mistake to play the race/religion/culture card, the same rules aply to all By all means try re education, that is the best solution but fighting hundreds of years of tradition will take time. What we need to do is stop it now. If a mother is arrested after her daughter has her genitals mutilated, who is saved? If we need to wait till people are mutilated before we can take any action then we will end up with no more than a lot of mutilated people with parents in jail. We must stop it before it happens. It's like shooting dead a gunman who has killed already. It is too late and it doesn't seem to stop the initial crime. " The next girl who is at risk. If we prosecute guilty parents we can prosecute the cutters that carry out this barbarism. A gunman has to kill before he can be arrested, do you consider that a failure in the law. If it stops it happening again then that has to be condidered a success. | |||
(closed, thread got too big) | |||
| Reply privately |
". Ok smart ass. I am fed up with your lack of discernment, and you religiously hate of religions. I'm not, I applaud his attitude. To think there are PC apologists for FGM...and on a sex site!? Sickening. Have you been to any female circumcision 'parties'? Yeah that's the description given by devotees to a ceremony that includes grievous bodily harm and torture. Crimes for which the authorities in this country are too PC scared to prosecute! Not when there is evidence of it having happened. What are the police to do otherwise? Arrest every African looking family who takes their daughter out of school for a few days? Prevent any Africans from going to Africa with any children? Weirdly they don't put a sign above their home saying "FGM happens here". The issue here is not that there is a tacit approval of FGM, the issue is that it is bloody hard to spot and stop. Arrests are too bloody late. The girl has already had her clitoris cut off with a fucking razor. I would defy you to find any ranking police officer or politician who does not find this practice abhorrent, but simply put it is very very difficult to spot before it happens or after. If the victim does not speak up there is virtually no way to detect it until much much later. The only solutions which have been put forward boil down to oppressing the rights of entire groups of people based on their ethnic origin. I fucking hope we don't go down that route again. That is called Apartheid. It is bloody easy to cry on about the political correct conspiracy, a lot harder to suggest any workable solutions. Given that there is plenty FGM in France and little being done to stop it then the original idea is not sufficient. The conviction rate so far is France 100+ : England 0. Not a score sheet any of us should be proud of. Constant hand wringing over the rights of ethnic minorities is not going to deal with this. As i stated earlier the rights of young girls has to come first. France's approach to this has clearly had beneficial effects, there are not plenty of cases there as you seem to think. Attention must be focussed on stamping it out here. How else do you propose to do that? It's not had wringing. That's the problem. We are talking about human's basic rights. The fact that they are an ethnic minority in this country does not mean that their rights are more malleable than the rights of anyone else. Their rights are their rights and if we change their rights we change ours. Arresting people is too late. The victim has still been mutilated. Stopping it is important. If we simply make it too inconvenient in the uk, those who find it a vital part of their culture will do it elsewhere. We won't stop it, we will only polish our own doorstep. If that's what is important, having a clean doorstep whilst girls clitorises are cut off next door then fine. But I would suggest what is more important is stopping it altogether. Banishing the act is one thing but that is simply selfish so we don't need to think about it. If you actually care for the victims then we need to look at ways of prevention. " Arresting people after they have committed murder is also too late. Maybe we should give them a pat over the head and send a message saying don't get caught whilst committing murder. Wait until the job is done, properly | |||
(closed, thread got too big) | |||
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