FabSwingers.com forum: ***BREXIT/EURO THREADS***

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

Hi, thanks for stopping by

There's much talk of the EU referendum atm and lots of strong opinions in both directions...

But I'm curious...

Has anyone changed their mind as a consequence of the debate on Brexit?

Are any waverers who have read something here and have thought, hmmm, I'm gonna vote one way, or the other or has it confirmed what you already know?

Genuinely interested.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Not one bit, mind was well made up and not seen anything to change that one bit.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I was/am firmly in the open mind set and would see what the debates said. So far all I've seen are bitching, lies, name calling and a distinct lack of facts from both sides. So I guess I'm still waiting for someone to put up a convincing argument to sway me but can't see that coming from anyone.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *eliz NelsonMan
over a year ago

The Tantric Tea Shop

I was a 'reluctant yes' for a long time, now I am really unsure

Its a lot different from the original Common Market

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The more I research the more I'm sure that we should stay in the EU. I've not seen anything yet that would make me change my mind.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

Sorry, am in purdah now so not allowed to discuss it

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The more I research the more I'm sure that we should stay in the EU. I've not seen anything yet that would make me change my mind."

I'm of this thinking as well.

I'm wary of the alternative.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm still undecided....

The only thing I'm certain of, is no-one can say with certainty which option is best......

What suits one person may not suit another,,,

I just hope whichever side wins it does so with such a resounding victory of sufficient support so the debate ends there,,,

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The more I research the more I'm sure that we should stay in the EU. I've not seen anything yet that would make me change my mind.

I'm of this thinking as well.

I'm wary of the alternative."

The BBC has a good EU referendum guide on it's website, it's a good starting point.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *radleyandRavenCouple
over a year ago

Herts

To me, alot of the arguments for staying in the EU almost equates to staying in an abusive relationship because you're scared to be alone...

I've seen fantastic arguments on both sides but there isn't enough to persuade me to stay.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sorry, am in purdah now so not allowed to discuss it

Isn't it purdah from tomorrow (27th)?

To answer the question though, if anything it's solidified my original opinion on the matter.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *rightonsteveMan
over a year ago

Brighton - even Hove!

I always was an undecided and I'm even more undecided now than I was.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *illbillMan
over a year ago

dublin

Imagine a small island nation looking to go it alone without foreign interference and despite the wish of the people they where forced to stay what would u do

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My mind has not changed one bit from the official rhetoric that is being spouted by both sides.

As I see it little difference either way in the next few years, but the changes will matter in 20+ years, neither side is offering any info. that far ahead. so it's best guess for the next genration.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The more I research the more I'm sure that we should stay in the EU. I've not seen anything yet that would make me change my mind."

If the people of ANY European country elect a right-wing populist government then that country face sanctions. The commission awarded itself the power to do that, they are already attacking Poland for democratically electing their government which the commission doesnt like how did you miss that in your research or is democracy not an issue

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm more interested in Euro 2016 and the Olympics .......

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm with #voteleave all the way!!! Increase in net migration, now standing at it's highest level. £18.3bn sent to Brussels in 2015 alone = £350m per week. Spend the money on our NHS and supporting our own, before sending it across Europe. We have people who have fought for this country, who are now homeless, it's wrong.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've just got bored.

The remain campaign has been a lesson in how not to speak to people, and the leave campaign is joyously dumbed down bravado for the politically illiterate. I'm shocked at how far things have sunk.

I suppose we get what we deserve.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm looking at it like a failing relationship, we are miserable and struggling in it, so we may as well be miserable and struggling out of it and then at least we are in a position to find our own way and make new friends

Mrs x

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"Sorry, am in purdah now so not allowed to discuss it

Isn't it purdah from tomorrow (27th)?

To answer the question though, if anything it's solidified my original opinion on the matter."

My last day at work for a while was today

Off to Italy where I wont have to listen to any pro or anti EU rhetoric (at least not that I can understand). Bliss!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm for out..haven't heard a convincing argument to stay. In fact the staying in camp were saying that if we leave, house prices might go down and interest rates will go up. That more or less swung my decision.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sorry, am in purdah now so not allowed to discuss it

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Im an outie!! Time to get our country back, David Cameron started the leave campaign before he had a pay off! The man has no balls

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *radleyandRavenCouple
over a year ago

Herts

"I'm looking at it like a failing relationship, we are miserable and struggling in it, so we may as well be miserable and struggling out of it and then at least we are in a position to find our own way and make new friends

Mrs x "

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"The more I research the more I'm sure that we should stay in the EU. I've not seen anything yet that would make me change my mind.

The EU also crushed a democratically elected government in Greece only that was an extreme left anti austerity party which the EU commission didn't like. Real democracy seems like a completely alien concept to the EU commission, they don't know the meaning of the word democracy. The EU is fundamentally undemocratic. It's one of the main reasons I made my mind up years ago why I wanted out. The economic arguments on both sides are neither here nor there, it's the restoration of our sovereignty, democracy and independence that I want (the ability to make our own laws, control our own borders, control our own money and govern ourselves without any interference from the EU).

#voteleavetakecontrol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *an_WoodMan
over a year ago

Stafford

"Sorry, am in purdah now so not allowed to discuss it

The ultimate swinger taboo

Hot for women in purdah !

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think I know which way I'll vote but I've been watching more on it recently in case anything sways me the other way. I think it'll be an interesting night when the results are coming in.

Sarah

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *an_WoodMan
over a year ago

Stafford

"The more I research the more I'm sure that we should stay in the EU. I've not seen anything yet that would make me change my mind.

#voteleavetakecontrol "

All governments that default on international debt lose control of financial policy and it's a long list of defaulting states. As ever UKIP twist reality for cheap political shots.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm with #voteleave all the way!!! Increase in net migration, now standing at it's highest level. £18.3bn sent to Brussels in 2015 alone = £350m per week. Spend the money on our NHS and supporting our own, before sending it across Europe. We have people who have fought for this country, who are now homeless, it's wrong."

Wasn't it £162 million net that we send over what we receive.

I heard a good debate on the radio today saying that lots of other European countries feel like us regarding being in the EU. I think we forget that sometimes.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

In short: no.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

Just keep hectoring each other from your silos.

As you were.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I was all for staying in but after listening to lots of tv debates I'm more on the fence and even more confused about it all

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *its_n_piecesCouple
over a year ago

Off to Italy where I wont have to listen to any pro or anti EU rhetoric (at least not that I can understand). Bliss!"

well jel ..... have a nice time

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *arry247Couple
over a year ago

Wakefield

The sooner we leave the EU the better.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It was never even up for debate with me. I have known from the outset which box will be ticked on the day

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have about as much interest in anyone else's opinion on this subject as they have in mine......zilch

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm out. I was, am and will be. Game over...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I like these threads, they make my block list longer. :D

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

"I have about as much interest in anyone else's opinion on this subject as they have in mine......zilch

This.

I propose: let's all stfu until polling day.

It'll save a whole lot of drama, angst and bluster that no-one's really listening to anyway.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

OUT....For a better future for my children.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *uke olovingmanMan
over a year ago

Gravesend

We don't seem to be inundated with Les fabswingers or das fabbensvingerz nicking all our ladies

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

"OUT....For a better future for my children."

"For the children!"

Fab!

I've heard it all now

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"OUT....For a better future for my children.

"For the children!"

Fab!

I've heard it all now

https://m.youtube.com/?#/watch?v=RybNI0KB1bg

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've known all along which way I'm voting

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There are Romanians living in our local park. They have little English and virtually no chance of finding employment. Their main source of income is begging. Many locals complain of an increase in petty crime nothing serious but more a nuisance value. They are here because of the EU. It is not their fault they believed they could find a better life here yet are reduced to living on the streets. They may eventually resort to more serious crime the more desperate they become. The EU has FAILED them and it is has FAILED us.

We have an over crowded country and services that can no longer cope and they are reduced to living on the street and begging.

Rather than opening all borders for free movement of cheap labour so businesses can get richer it should have improved the lives of people in their homelands rather than encouraging mass migration which is destabilising whole countries.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *htcMan
over a year ago

I decided about 8 years ago and mind hasn't changed I'm voting out. And you must be jooking use the BBC guide. They are s biased corp.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *htcMan
over a year ago

"OUT....For a better future for my children."

Exactly

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Not by reading things on here. Thanks for reading

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 26/05/16 19:37:18]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Was always going to vote out even though it could possibly cost me financially. There are more important things at stake, mainly my son's future.

And if I ever had any doubts, the Remainers on this site have helped convince me that I was right all along. Thank you

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"My mind has not changed one bit from the official rhetoric that is being spouted by both sides.

As I see it little difference either way in the next few years, but the changes will matter in 20+ years, neither side is offering any info. that far ahead. so it's best guess for the next genration. "

So few younger people are likely to turn out to vote. I really don't like that this decision is being made by a bunch of people with fixed viewpoints about the past and now and little thought for the future.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

dj, why did you EU do it? Was this the one day when there wasn't a Referendum thread?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"My mind has not changed one bit from the official rhetoric that is being spouted by both sides.

As I see it little difference either way in the next few years, but the changes will matter in 20+ years, neither side is offering any info. that far ahead. so it's best guess for the next genration.

you might find that a lot who want out are thinking of the future. It is more the remainers who aren't and think things will just roll along as they are. They won't

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All I know is that some political parties are staying rather quiet about the subject.

I would of hoped that any political party who was in power on the date of the referendum, would of been make plans for the outcome of any vote.Which ever way it goes.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Never been in any doubt, the only way forward is OUT.

So many facts make the lies that you hear from the 'remain' campaign absolutely laughable if it wasn't such a serious matter. If you were trying to sell products using such lies, it world be against trading standards.

Ask yourself this, if the alternative to leaving the EU would be such a disaster, do you honestly believe you would have been given a referendum in the first place, or that we'd have needed one? Of course not.

Project Fear is in full swing. A project that will not let the truth get in the way of their lies and greed.

Remember, there are two types of people in this world, those who think that politicians have their best interests at heart and those who think.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oachman 9CoolMan
over a year ago

derby

"There are Romanians living in our local park. They have little English and virtually no chance of finding employment. Their main source of income is begging. Many locals complain of an increase in petty crime nothing serious but more a nuisance value. They are here because of the EU. It is not their fault they believed they could find a better life here yet are reduced to living on the streets. They may eventually resort to more serious crime the more desperate they become. The EU has FAILED them and it is has FAILED us.

We have an over crowded country and services that can no longer cope and they are reduced to living on the street and begging.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"My mind has not changed one bit from the official rhetoric that is being spouted by both sides.

As I see it little difference either way in the next few years, but the changes will matter in 20+ years, neither side is offering any info. that far ahead. so it's best guess for the next genration.

you might find that a lot who want out are thinking of the future. It is more the remainers who aren't and think things will just roll along as they are. They won't"
why wont they ??

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

In the last 600 years Europe has been a constant battle field with two of the most destructive conflicts known to human kind being started in its confines.

The treaty of Rome expressly rules out member states taking up arms against on and other. A united Europe will, in my opinion, provide for a safe place to live and stop the rise of jingoistic isolationism that Boris and his type were taught on the sports fields of Eton. His views and those of his supporters emanate from the colonial origins of his beliefs.

You only have to look at Austria and the near election of a white supremacist to feel that things could turn out to be a cluster fuck if we leave Europe.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *piritsonfabCouple
over a year ago

Nottingham

I'm starting to waver towards out but I can assure anyone remotely interested that racism has absolutely no part in my thoughts.

However I don't trust the government much so out is a gamble. We can always rejoin in a few years if we don't like it

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm starting to waver towards out but I can assure anyone remotely interested that racism has absolutely no part in my thoughts.

However I don't trust the government much so out is a gamble. We can always rejoin in a few years if we don't like it

Doesn't work like that I am afraid!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"In the last 600 years Europe has been a constant battle field with two of the most destructive conflicts known to human kind being started in its confines.

You only have to look at Austria and the near election of a white supremacist to feel that things could turn out to be a cluster fuck if we leave Europe.

Do you not realise that the rise of the right all over Europe is down to the EU?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"My mind has not changed one bit from the official rhetoric that is being spouted by both sides.

As I see it little difference either way in the next few years, but the changes will matter in 20+ years, neither side is offering any info. that far ahead. so it's best guess for the next genration.

you might find that a lot who want out are thinking of the future. It is more the remainers who aren't and think things will just roll along as they are. They won'twhy wont they ??"

I aint got time and internet space to answer that one sorry. Just do some research

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

When the EU parliament gives itself powers to over-ride member nations democratic voting process, then it makes me even more determined to spread the word about getting out.

If you have missed it, its in the news today.... if the EU doesn't like the government that a country votes in i.e. if its not in keeping with THEIR political agenda, then they will block, or in other ways penalise, that countries activities within the EU..... how's THAT for democracy?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"In the last 600 years Europe has been a constant battle field with two of the most destructive conflicts known to human kind being started in its confines.

You only have to look at Austria and the near election of a white supremacist to feel that things could turn out to be a cluster fuck if we leave Europe.

Do you not realise that the rise of the right all over Europe is down to the EU?"
I didn't know that. Can you expand on your hypothesis?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The spin machine is working well.

This matter is so convoluted, and I'm no clearer by the mainstream media.

Wouldn't leaving EU lead to even closer ties with the US? Their foreign policies makes my arse twitch..

Cue Primus - too many puppies

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ady LickWoman
over a year ago

Northampton Somewhere

I have no idea which way I'm voting yet. I've heard some good arguments for and against. I need to research the things that will sway me Immigration, Security and the Economy. But not tonight, that sounds so boring!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"When the EU parliament gives itself powers to over-ride member nations democratic voting process, then it makes me even more determined to spread the word about getting out.

"
Again explain that little gem?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"I'm starting to waver towards out but I can assure anyone remotely interested that racism has absolutely no part in my thoughts.

However I don't trust the government much so out is a gamble. We can always rejoin in a few years if we don't like it

Yes we can but with absolutely NONE of the privileges we currently enjoy. We would HAVE to take on the Euro, for instance, if we re-join. We would lose the rebate and the list goes on.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I wasn't really bothered at the beginning. I'm not really bothered now.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *illbillMan
over a year ago

dublin

I hear all this talk about lack of democracy yet Britain has only to date ever voted on one eu treaty while other eu states vote on every treaty . No treaty can be ratified in rep of Ireland unless the people vote it in that's down to the nature of constitution why doesn't Britain have same type of constitution also people feel I represented in the eu could this because they vote in Euro sceptics who abstain from votes

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm starting to waver towards out but I can assure anyone remotely interested that racism has absolutely no part in my thoughts.

However I don't trust the government much so out is a gamble. We can always rejoin in a few years if we don't like it

Yes we can but with absolutely NONE of the privileges we currently enjoy. We would HAVE to take on the Euro, for instance, if we re-join. We would lose the rebate and the list goes on.

"
We are European and we live in a free Europe where you can change things through democratic debate and ultimately the ballot box. I would be interested to know the figures of how many leavers voted in the last European Parliament elections? Only 35% of the UK could be arsed.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"I hear all this talk about lack of democracy yet Britain has only to date ever voted on one eu treaty while other eu states vote on every treaty . No treaty can be ratified in rep of Ireland unless the people vote it in that's down to the nature of constitution why doesn't Britain have same type of constitution also people feel I represented in the eu could this because they vote in Euro sceptics who abstain from votes"

And make it their manifesto to be paid by the EU to not vote!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

One of the sides shows in this EU debate is the attempt by Boris to try and become leader of the Tories. If we vote to stay he appeases all the suits in the 1922 committee but if we vote to stay he has done no harm to BoJo because he followed his conscience so to speak.

If he was to wrench the job from fellow Etonian and Bullingdon Club member Dave and the septics voted Don Trump into the white house do you think that a Chinese plan to clone the head honchos in the the UK and US had succeeded? They look remarkably similar and talk bollocks in equal measure?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"One of the sides shows in this EU debate is the attempt by Boris to try and become leader of the Tories. If we vote to stay he appeases all the suits in the 1922 committee but if we vote to stay he has done no harm to BoJo because he followed his conscience so to speak.

Trump and Johnson - slang words for what they are?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Trump and Johnson - slang words for what they are?"
Dangerous narcissists that have not got a clue about reality?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Trump and Johnson - slang words for what they are?Dangerous narcissists that have not got a clue about reality?"

Fart and Penis.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

But going back to the debate if:

Boris Johnson

Donald Trump

Nigel Farrage

Michael Gove

Michael Howard

Liam Fox

Douglas Carswell

All of whom, in my opinion and to quote a famous politician have something of the night about them, are for leaving then on the principals of common decency I am a remainer!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Trump and Johnson - slang words for what they are?Dangerous narcissists that have not got a clue about reality?

Fart and Penis.

"
Ms Splits .........how true a expulsion of wind and a prick!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

"dj, why did you EU do it? Was this the one day when there wasn't a Referendum thread? "

Because I wanted to make a point about how pointless this is.

Everyone's made up their minds and all we do is shout at one another.

It's futile.

*surveys thread and rests case*

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"dj, why did you EU do it? Was this the one day when there wasn't a Referendum thread?

Because I wanted to make a point about how pointless this is.

Everyone's made up their minds and all we do is shout at one another.

It's futile.

*surveys thread and rests case*

I know. I wouldn't have opened this one but for the name of the OP.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

*doffs bowler*

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"In the last 600 years Europe has been a constant battle field with two of the most destructive conflicts known to human kind being started in its confines.

You only have to look at Austria and the near election of a white supremacist to feel that things could turn out to be a cluster fuck if we leave Europe.

The EU is a cluster fuck now. Wake up, the far right is on the rise all over Europe as a direct result of the EU's failings.

The Euro = EU failure

The migration crisis = EU failure

Border free Schengen = EU failure

The EU project = failure

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"dj, why did you EU do it? Was this the one day when there wasn't a Referendum thread?

Because I wanted to make a point about how pointless this is.

Everyone's made up their minds and all we do is shout at one another.

It's futile.

*surveys thread and rests case*

Some people do post now and again to say they are still undecided.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

"When the EU parliament gives itself powers to over-ride member nations democratic voting process, then it makes me even more determined to spread the word about getting out.

Again explain that little gem?"

If Austria, or any other EU country, votes in a right-of-centre political party to govt, the EU will restrict that countrys voting rights etc in the EU.

This is a SELF GENERATED power that the EU has GIVEN ITSELF....... last time I looked, the EU was supposed to be a democracy... nothing democratic about telling other countries who they can elect?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

Kind of -

Ideologically, I'm opposed to the EU - I'm with Benn and Galloway on that one.

I will probbaly vote remain though because if we leave, the thought that we will soley be in the hands of Cameron et al. terrifies me, frankly. Also, I am a producer of lamb, and European trade is incredibly important in my sector.

(There is a small helping of "Farrage is a swivel-eyed loon and I can't side with him", too)

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"But going back to the debate if:

Boris Johnson

Donald Trump

Nigel Farrage

Michael Gove

Michael Howard

Liam Fox

Douglas Carswell

All of whom, in my opinion and to quote a famous politician have something of the night about them, are for leaving then on the principals of common decency I am a remainer!"

Something of the night about them? Lol, what about odious key remain figures like...

Tony Blair

Peter Mandelson

David Cameron

George Osborne

Nick Clegg

Gerry Adams

Martin McGuinness

Alex Salmond

Nicola Sturgeon

If they are for remaining then on the principles of common decency I'm for leaving.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *inky-MinxWoman
over a year ago

Grantham

I've been decided all along but I studied the EU as part of a degree and seeing how it is structured and operates makes me know that we need to be out.

No one knows how it will go but as a country we've held our own for centuries and don't need the EU.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

"Some people do post now and again to say they are still undecided. "

So why are people still posting?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France

Voted today ( postal)

I have a real world view; I have lived outside the UK enough to understand the UK's real position in the world;

And know exactly what is a no brainier for the UK....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"Kind of -

Ideologically, I'm opposed to the EU - I'm with Benn and Galloway on that one.

(There is a small helping of "Farrage is a swivel-eyed loon and I can't side with him", too)"

I find it utterly bizarre that people think that if we leave the EU the UK Government will suddenly decide to start legislating to the voters benefit.

Yeah, right. They'll be voting for TTIP and lining their pockets on beanos to China in no time.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"My mind has not changed one bit from the official rhetoric that is being spouted by both sides.

As I see it little difference either way in the next few years, but the changes will matter in 20+ years, neither side is offering any info. that far ahead. so it's best guess for the next genration.

you might find that a lot who want out are thinking of the future. It is more the remainers who aren't and think things will just roll along as they are. They won'twhy wont they ??"

Have a look at the EU five President's report to get an idea of where the EU is heading in the future. Full political union and full monetary union is the ultimate goal for the EU elite, they will keep pushing the agenda until they get what they want which is a European federal superstate (a fully integrated united states of Europe).

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

*sticks fingers in ears*

LA LA LA LA LA - I CAN'T HEAR YOU

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Those that are voting to leave

How do you KNOW that an exit will guarantee a better future ?

How do you KNOW it will stop or stem immigration ?

How do you KNOW the NHS will benefit from it ?

I have a feeling an exit will benefit the few and leave a lot of disillusioned people who were expecting a better life.

That is not me supporting the EU, but rather me being cynical that whether we are in or out, we have a current political establishment that works for our good as opposed to its own.

A revolution in Europe provides an adequate smoke screen to prevent one from happening here.

Or is that just a bit TOO cynical ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Some people do post now and again to say they are still undecided.

So why are people still posting?

To convince them one way or the other.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

"Some people do post now and again to say they are still undecided.

So why are people still posting?

To convince them one way or the other. "

But as has been established (ad nauseam) the vast majority of people have made up their minds.

This is not a debate - I've demonstrated that - it's people hectoring. There is no space for discussion, only a void filled with shouting.

That's all.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"But going back to the debate if:

Boris Johnson

Donald Trump

Nigel Farrage

Michael Gove

Michael Howard

Liam Fox

Douglas Carswell

All of whom, in my opinion and to quote a famous politician have something of the night about them, are for leaving then on the principals of common decency I am a remainer!

Something of the night about them? Lol, what about odious key remain figures like...

Tony Blair

Peter Mandelson

David Cameron

George Osborne

Nick Clegg

Gerry Adams

Martin McGuinness

Alex Salmond

Nicola Sturgeon

If they are for remaining then on the principles of common decency I'm for leaving. "
Do you know I think you have just proved a point!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Some people do post now and again to say they are still undecided.

So why are people still posting?

To convince them one way or the other.

But as has been established (ad nauseam) the vast majority of people have made up their minds.

This is not a debate - I've demonstrated that - it's people hectoring. There is no space for discussion, only a void filled with shouting.

That's all.

You said a majority had made their mind up, not all had made their mind up. There are still some undecided voters who could be persuaded one way or the other.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"But going back to the debate if:

Boris Johnson

Donald Trump

Nigel Farrage

Michael Gove

Michael Howard

Liam Fox

Douglas Carswell

All of whom, in my opinion and to quote a famous politician have something of the night about them, are for leaving then on the principals of common decency I am a remainer!

Something of the night about them? Lol, what about odious key remain figures like...

Tony Blair

Peter Mandelson

David Cameron

George Osborne

Nick Clegg

Gerry Adams

Martin McGuinness

Alex Salmond

Nicola Sturgeon

If they are for remaining then on the principles of common decency I'm for leaving. Do you know I think you have just proved a point!"

But you forgot....

Joan Collins

Sean Connery

Roger Moore

Michael Caine

All have a vote to leave but don't live here!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"But going back to the debate if:

Boris Johnson

Donald Trump

Nigel Farrage

Michael Gove

Michael Howard

Liam Fox

Douglas Carswell

All of whom, in my opinion and to quote a famous politician have something of the night about them, are for leaving then on the principals of common decency I am a remainer!

Something of the night about them? Lol, what about odious key remain figures like...

Tony Blair

Peter Mandelson

David Cameron

George Osborne

Nick Clegg

Gerry Adams

Martin McGuinness

Alex Salmond

Nicola Sturgeon

If they are for remaining then on the principles of common decency I'm for leaving. Do you know I think you have just proved a point!"

Just saw another one on the news, how did I forget to include him, drum roll......

Alastair Campbell

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Politics is almost at its worst with all this - nobody is very convincing of their own facts.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

"Some people do post now and again to say they are still undecided.

So why are people still posting?

To convince them one way or the other.

But as has been established (ad nauseam) the vast majority of people have made up their minds.

This is not a debate - I've demonstrated that - it's people hectoring. There is no space for discussion, only a void filled with shouting.

That's all.

You said a majority had made their mind up, not all had made their mind up. There are still some undecided voters who could be persuaded one way or the other. "

And is this the medium that will persuade people?

Tbh the result is not in question.

I think the referendum a waste of time.

Think of this thread as a metaphor.

Refer-exit, or sommat.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"But going back to the debate if:

Boris Johnson

Donald Trump

Nigel Farrage

Michael Gove

Michael Howard

Liam Fox

Douglas Carswell

All of whom, in my opinion and to quote a famous politician have something of the night about them, are for leaving then on the principals of common decency I am a remainer!

Something of the night about them? Lol, what about odious key remain figures like...

Tony Blair

Peter Mandelson

David Cameron

George Osborne

Nick Clegg

Gerry Adams

Martin McGuinness

Alex Salmond

Nicola Sturgeon

If they are for remaining then on the principles of common decency I'm for leaving. Do you know I think you have just proved a point!

Just saw another one on the news, how did I forget to include him, drum roll......

Alastair Campbell

Fanfare ............the queen? You would think with her background she would be a remainer?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"But going back to the debate if:

Boris Johnson

Donald Trump

Nigel Farrage

Michael Gove

Michael Howard

Liam Fox

Douglas Carswell

All of whom, in my opinion and to quote a famous politician have something of the night about them, are for leaving then on the principals of common decency I am a remainer!

Something of the night about them? Lol, what about odious key remain figures like...

Tony Blair

Peter Mandelson

David Cameron

George Osborne

Nick Clegg

Gerry Adams

Martin McGuinness

Alex Salmond

Nicola Sturgeon

If they are for remaining then on the principles of common decency I'm for leaving. Do you know I think you have just proved a point!

Just saw another one on the news, how did I forget to include him, drum roll......

Alastair Campbell

Fanfare ............the queen? You would think with her background she would be a remainer?"

You're doing a good job for the Brexiters. Keep it up

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icolerobbieCouple
over a year ago

walsall

I am undecided. There are pros & cons both for and against.

I am not convinced that the money saved will end up in the NHS

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Those that are voting to leave

How do you KNOW that an exit will guarantee a better future ?

How do you KNOW it will stop or stem immigration ?

How do you KNOW the NHS will benefit from it ?

Exit from the EU will mean a better future for Britain because we will restore our sovereignty and our democracy. The political establishment will work better for us because they will be more accountable and they won't be able to blame failings on the EU anymore. The EU has been going backwards for decades now it's share of global trade had been decreasing steadily and is now stagnating. There is ongoing crisis with the Euro, ongoing crisis with the migration situation and I think now the start of a new EU crisis with anti EU parties gaining more and more share of the vote with each passing election all over the EU.

It will stem immigration because we can take back control of our borders when we leave the EU we will no longer be subject to the EU free movement of people rules. We can have our own immigration policy instead of an EU immigration policy. We can treat all immigrants on an equal footing instead of giving unfair advantage to people with an EU passport.

The Nhs will benefit from the injection of cash £ billions savings made from our EU membership fee. Plus less strain will be put on the Nhs, hospitals and GP surgeries when we can control immigration better to reduce the numbers of patients going through the doors.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France

"I am undecided. There are pros & cons both for and against.

I am not convinced that the money saved will end up in the NHS"

Of course it won't ; it will be spunked away

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icolerobbieCouple
over a year ago

walsall

"Those that are voting to leave

How do you KNOW that an exit will guarantee a better future ?

How do you KNOW it will stop or stem immigration ?

How do you KNOW the NHS will benefit from it ?

You are assuming that our own politicians will not f**k us all over like they have been for years and like they did before the EU was ever thought of!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

i have said the same since the beginning...

I would be more inclined to vote leave if they were actually just be realistic....

everything in the leave world is "we will get everything we want out of the negioiations and give up nothing!!!"

thats not realistic.....

all i ever asked to know is "what are you plan b's if you don't get everything you want?" but all the answers are... we will get everything... and they will get nothing, and we will get sweetheart deals and they will like it!!!!

again..... not realistic....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Those that are voting to leave

How do you KNOW that an exit will guarantee a better future ?

How do you KNOW it will stop or stem immigration ?

How do you KNOW the NHS will benefit from it ?

You are assuming that our own politicians will not f**k us all over like they have been for years and like they did before the EU was ever thought of!"

That is kinda my point

Those voting to leave are assuming an idealistic situation post Brexit

I understand a great deal of the argument

I am just unconvinced that our current political establishment will deliver and that, for the majority, shit will still go down EU or no EU

There is a lot of unease and unrest in this country right now, so what better than to shift the focus to those pesky Europeans, let the populace think they are the problem.

Whilst they do, we'll shadow dance and strip the country of some of its greatest industries and institutions - if nothing else, we can blame the Indians or the Chinese once the Brussels lot are out of the picture

But that's an argument for another day. I should go to bed

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

problem is this... its a soundbite!!!! not even the chief nhs execs of the major hospitals believe this

of the top 80 hospital execs not 1 thought they would be better off outside the EU...

Plus you have to remember that about 10-15% of the total nhs staff come from the EU........

that not because of immigration, that because the UK doesn't train enough doctors and nurses and specialist..... and the ones leaving are being poached by other EU countries.... they are being poached by the likes of the US, Canada Australia and New Zealand......

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

Some very long posts in 'ere

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

I'm more likely to vote one way than I was a few weeks ago. But absolutely I'm still open to influence and definitely willing to vote either way. Though I'm guessing I'll become more certain, without a massive swing.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"I'm more likely to vote one way than I was a few weeks ago. But absolutely I'm still open to influence and definitely willing to vote either way. Though I'm guessing I'll become more certain, without a massive swing."

We are the swinger voters.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

We are the swinger voters.

*as gravel-voiced Northern comic*

Ladies n' gents, she's 'ere all week!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

We are the swinger voters.

I noticed that choice of words as I finished it. Swinger voters power

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *illbillMan
over a year ago

dublin

One thing people forget when they talk about a brexit and closing borders is what will happen to the Uks land border with the eu .

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *andemanMan
over a year ago

bedforshire

I am all in faviour of the free movment of sexy Europeans to the UK.

Saves me the bother of having to go to each country independently to find and fuck them.

London the biggest shmorgiousbord of Sexy people from around the world on Earth.

So its IN IN IN for me.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I am all in faviour of the free movment of sexy Europeans to the UK.

Saves me the bother of having to go to each country independently to find and fuck them.

London the biggest shmorgiousbord of Sexy people from around the world on Earth.

So its IN IN IN for me."

A fuck Is different when on holiday, worth the trip I think.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Some people do post now and again to say they are still undecided.

So why are people still posting?

To convince them one way or the other.

But as has been established (ad nauseam) the vast majority of people have made up their minds.

This is not a debate - I've demonstrated that - it's people hectoring. There is no space for discussion, only a void filled with shouting.

That's all.

You said a majority had made their mind up, not all had made their mind up. There are still some undecided voters who could be persuaded one way or the other.

And is this the medium that will persuade people?

Tbh the result is not in question.

I think the referendum a waste of time.

Think of this thread as a metaphor.

Refer-exit, or sommat.

This is just one medium of which there are many Joe.

You may think the referendum is a waste of time, I don't.

I think the result could go either way so it's still all to play for.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think that the available info to make a proper decision is not properly available to the public. I find that each side is throwing out statements that are not properly explained or backed up and its difficult to get t full picture of pros and cons.

I have swayed a bit and changed my mind.

It's a tough one and most of the affects will be in the long term future.

Regardless of what happens who's in for a world wide agreement for the free movement o swingers?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Those that are voting to leave

How do you KNOW that an exit will guarantee a better future ?

How do you KNOW it will stop or stem immigration ?

How do you KNOW the NHS will benefit from it ?

You are assuming that our own politicians will not f**k us all over like they have been for years and like they did before the EU was ever thought of!"

If we leave the EU and the government fuck everyone over then we can vote them out after 5 years at each general election. It's called democratic accountability. They will have to do a good job if they want to be re-elected. You may say "but we can do that now", only the thing is we are not truly ruled by our government at the moment, we are ruled by Brussels and the EU, it's the EU commission who make the laws and we can't vote them out or get rid of them. The elected MEP's in the EU parliament only vote on making ammendments to the laws passed down by the commission and the EU council. The commission and the council have the authority to overule any ammendments made by the elected MEP's so in effect the EU parliament is a complete waste of time. We may as well live under a dictatorship.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

problem is this... its a soundbite!!!! not even the chief nhs execs of the major hospitals believe this

of the top 80 hospital execs not 1 thought they would be better off outside the EU...

Plus you have to remember that about 10-15% of the total nhs staff come from the EU........

Yet again the remain side try to paint this picture that all immigration will cease to exist if Britain leaves the EU. No one on the leave side has suggested such a thing. We will need to continue having a certain level of immigration, of which we can have control over the numbers and we can prioritise the skills which are most needed, be they doctors, nurses or any trade you can think of. The key thing is taking back control and having the ability to govern ourselves.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *andemanMan
over a year ago

bedforshire

Sexy Europeans free movment YES PLEASE CUM THIS WAY!

on a slightly more serious note.

Boris = OUT

Proff Hawkins = IN

Who would you trust?

The worlds greatist Living physisist Nobel Prize winner.

Or A Mop Top Numpty with ambitions to be Priminister.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sexy Europeans free movment YES PLEASE CUM THIS WAY!

on a slightly more serious note.

Boris = OUT

Proff Hawkins = IN

Who would you trust?

The worlds greatist Living physisist Nobel Prize winner.

Or A Mop Top Numpty with ambitions to be Priminister.

Lord Carey former Arch Bishop of Canterbury = OUT

Tony Blair = IN

who would you trust?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Im an outie!! Time to get our country back, David Cameron started the leave campaign before he had a pay off! The man has no balls "

Nor does his girlfriend Osborne

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *andemanMan
over a year ago

bedforshire

"Sexy Europeans free movment YES PLEASE CUM THIS WAY!

on a slightly more serious note.

Boris = OUT

Proff Hawkins = IN

Who would you trust?

The worlds greatist Living physisist Nobel Prize winner.

Or A Mop Top Numpty with ambitions to be Priminister.

Lord Carey former Arch Bishop of Canterbury = OUT

Tony Blair = IN

who would you trust?"

Neither both a pair of Right Wing Numpties and i Knew Carey.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *unky monkeyMan
over a year ago

in the night garden

I've given this a lot of thought and I think we should leave Europe.

Once we have removed the links to Europe we can float off down to the West Indies and have a nice summer holiday together, then off to Oz for a toasty winter.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"I've given this a lot of thought and I think we should leave Europe.

Once we have removed the links to Europe we can float off down to the West Indies and have a nice summer holiday together, then off to Oz for a toasty winter.

Will the currents take us that way? We could just end up banging the French or Dutch coasts over and over again.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sexy Europeans free movment YES PLEASE CUM THIS WAY!

on a slightly more serious note.

Boris = OUT

Proff Hawkins = IN

Who would you trust?

The worlds greatist Living physisist Nobel Prize winner.

Or A Mop Top Numpty with ambitions to be Priminister.

Lord Carey former Arch Bishop of Canterbury = OUT

Tony Blair = IN

who would you trust?

Neither both a pair of Right Wing Numpties and i Knew Carey."

I bet you know Boris and Hawkins too.

The point is, your point was pointless

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *eliz NelsonMan
over a year ago

The Tantric Tea Shop

The only part I am convinced about, is that if we do leave, it will be like a very, very messy divorce

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *andemanMan
over a year ago

bedforshire

"Sexy Europeans free movment YES PLEASE CUM THIS WAY!

on a slightly more serious note.

Boris = OUT

Proff Hawkins = IN

Who would you trust?

The worlds greatist Living physisist Nobel Prize winner.

Or A Mop Top Numpty with ambitions to be Priminister.

Lord Carey former Arch Bishop of Canterbury = OUT

Tony Blair = IN

who would you trust?

Neither both a pair of Right Wing Numpties and i Knew Carey.

I bet you know Boris and Hawkins too.

The point is, your point was pointless"

You mean I won! Cool i never win anything ware is my prize

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

In still undecided and watching question time last night made me even more undecided

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *xxxMan
over a year ago

Bedford & Chester

"Imagine a small island nation looking to go it alone without foreign interference and despite the wish of the people they where forced to stay what would u do"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icknpussy1000Couple
over a year ago

birmingham

Euro needs the uk if we leave watch this space a few other countries may do the same for me why should germany decide our laws I am a leave

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *unky monkeyMan
over a year ago

in the night garden

"I've given this a lot of thought and I think we should leave Europe.

Once we have removed the links to Europe we can float off down to the West Indies and have a nice summer holiday together, then off to Oz for a toasty winter.

Will the currents take us that way? We could just end up banging the French or Dutch coasts over and over again.

Fit a small outboard motor to Aberdeen and hey presto! Full control!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"In the last 600 years Europe has been a constant battle field with two of the most destructive conflicts known to human kind being started in its confines.

You only have to look at Austria and the near election of a white supremacist to feel that things could turn out to be a cluster fuck if we leave Europe.

...and what happens if by stealth the extreme right takeover the European parliament ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *htcMan
over a year ago

I just got a inn leaflet and it's going back to sender x2 no stamps. The one I also got is a leave leaflet which I will keep handy for people.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *arry247Couple
over a year ago

Wakefield

"Those that are voting to leave

How do you KNOW that an exit will guarantee a better future ?

How do you KNOW it will stop or stem immigration ?

How do you KNOW the NHS will benefit from it ?

I have a feeling an exit will benefit the few and leave a lot of disillusioned people who were expecting a better life.

That is not me supporting the EU, but rather me being cynical that whether we are in or out, we have a current political establishment that works for our good as opposed to its own.

A revolution in Europe provides an adequate smoke screen to prevent one from happening here.

Or is that just a bit TOO cynical ?"

We could turn those questions around and ask

How do you KNOW that staying in will guarantee a better future ?

How do you KNOW immigration will stop or stem if we stay in?

How do you KNOW the NHS will benefit by staying in?

But instead we will give you reasoned answers.

If we exit the country will be able to negotiate trade deals with the world, including Europe on our own terms, even the most cautious estimate of the future (put out by the remain side) admit the UK’s economic future will grow if we exit (just not as fast).

The fact that we could complete trade deals with individual countries throughout the world on our own terms far more quickly than the EU completes deals means that over all our trade will increase faster when we exit than if we stay in.

Immigration will not stop if we exit, no one wants it to stop, but we will be able to choose who we want to come in to the country rather than having to accept many unskilled people simply because they have an EU passport.

The immigration levels could be controlled giving time to build the infrastructure to support the influx.

The case for the NHS is rather different, it at present relies on immigrants from around 200 countries of which around 3.6% were nationals of EU countries.

In terms of staffing levels being in or out does not make much difference.

With regards to EU nationals using the NHS, we think there would be little change whether we stayed in or left the EU. The UK currently has reciprocal arrangements with EU countries for treating those needing medical attention, there is no reason why this should change

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I like these threads, they make my block list longer. :D"

The tears that will be shed

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *its_n_piecesCouple
over a year ago

"...and what happens if by stealth the extreme right takeover the European parliament ?"

it would bring them into line with the current uk governments way of thinking

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *andemanMan
over a year ago

bedforshire

"In the last 600 years Europe has been a constant battle field with two of the most destructive conflicts known to human kind being started in its confines.

You only have to look at Austria and the near election of a white supremacist to feel that things could turn out to be a cluster fuck if we leave Europe.

...and what happens if by stealth the extreme right takeover the European parliament ?"

What happens if by Leaving the Extream Right take over Britian?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

I'm quite frankly bored by them. Full of long rambling posts justifying the rationale for staying in /leaving. Repetitive and mind -numbing.

I generally have avoided them.

I don't care about other people's reasons. Only my own. That's what will influence my vote.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"I'm quite frankly bored by them. Full of long rambling posts justifying the rationale for staying in /leaving. Repetitive and mind -numbing.

I generally have avoided them.

I don't care about other people's reasons. Only my own. That's what will influence my vote."

And we've still got 4 weeks to go!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied

How about all the nationalistic people putting there efforts in to buying British made produce by British owned companies in order to make the UK great again ..its only when the attitude of the buying public changes will the UK will succeed!!!!!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oncupiscentTonyMan
over a year ago

Kent

"How about all the nationalistic people putting there efforts in to buying British made produce by British owned companies in order to make the UK great again ..its only when the attitude of the buying public changes will the UK will succeed!!!!!"

eeerm yeah, worked well with British Leyland didn't it

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied

eeerm yeah, worked well with British Leyland didn't it"
well if you wont buy British goods how is the UK ever to succeed ? As a nation of shopkeepers ? ITS ATTITUDE LIKE YOURS THAT HAS DRIVEN THE UK DOWN OVER THE PAST YEARS NOT THE EU .....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I used to be very eurosceptic. I've been totally convinced by the repeated lies from Brexiteers of the madness of following them.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied

"I used to be very eurosceptic. I've been totally convinced by the repeated lies from Brexiteers of the madness of following them. "
I agree and whilst there are many things that require change within the EU .there are also many changes required by the British public in order to make the UK a leading country within the community..they all could start by buying British once again ....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I used to be very eurosceptic. I've been totally convinced by the repeated lies from Brexiteers of the madness of following them. I agree and whilst there are many things that require change within the EU .there are also many changes required by the British public in order to make the UK a leading country within the community..they all could start by buying British once again ...."

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Not one bit, mind was well made up and not seen anything to change that one bit."

Same here actually it's been reinforced by the lies the other side are using....shows they are scared rather than belief in their point.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I used to be very eurosceptic. I've been totally convinced by the repeated lies from Brexiteers of the madness of following them. "

Complete opposite for me...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

eeerm yeah, worked well with British Leyland didn't itwell if you wont buy British goods how is the UK ever to succeed ? As a nation of shopkeepers ? ITS ATTITUDE LIKE YOURS THAT HAS DRIVEN THE UK DOWN OVER THE PAST YEARS NOT THE EU ....."

Are you currently living in Spain?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The misinformation bandied about by both sides is a disgrace.

We get a rebate & subsidies from the EU, so things are not as clear cut as you seem to think.

If anyone actually believes that ANY money saved would go to the NHS they are very naive. The problems faced by the NHS are ideological not monetary, and leaving the EU will not change that.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iamondjoe OP Man
over a year ago

Glastonbury

Some people will do *anything* for attention

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Not one bit, mind was well made up and not seen anything to change that one bit.

Same here actually it's been reinforced by the lies the other side are using....shows they are scared rather than belief in their point."

Even leading figures on the remain side don't believe the bullshit Cameron and Osborne keep coming out with. Nicola Sturgeon said a few days ago that Osborne and Cameron's claims were overblown and not credible. She said Cameron and Osborne were insulting the intelligence of the British public with the wild claims they have been making.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Not one bit, mind was well made up and not seen anything to change that one bit.

Same here actually it's been reinforced by the lies the other side are using....shows they are scared rather than belief in their point.

Have they repainted the brexit battle bus yet since the treasury committee report yesterday totally slammed the £350 million pound/week lie?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Not one bit, mind was well made up and not seen anything to change that one bit.

Same here actually it's been reinforced by the lies the other side are using....shows they are scared rather than belief in their point.

Cameron. ..lying I doubt that ...never ever heard him utter anything with a wiff of a wink and a smile ...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

For every claim one side makes, the other counters with a similar claim on the subject that supports their point of view.

For example, Cameron said British pensioners could be up to £32,000 worse off if we leave, today some "expert" on the leave side say that British pensioners will be worse off if we stay, and they produce evidence to support this.

Who's right?

Honestly, I don't know.

But my point, that I have repeatedly made, is what happens if we vote to stay?

And the answer is, the EU will take it as permission to do whatever they like to push for closer financial, political and social integration.

We will lose more decision making powers to them, about pensions, the armed forces, trade, immigration, agriculture, fisheries, law, finance.... and so on.

The only way to stop us becoming part of the planned European superstate (no secret, the EU is pushing for this) is to vote leave.

Personally, I don't think the EU is going to last more than one or two more years, so we are better off getting out now, and sorting out our trade deals, before the rest of the EU countries leave the sinking ship and end up competing with us.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've never been able to work out the maths by those who say we get more out of the EU than we put in... where does that extra money come from...Greece, Portugal or maybe Italy... oh maybe it's Germany. Total bollocks. ..the only ones getting more out of it are those who can't put in much. It's the political and administration systems that get more out of it....they can claim against expenses and fiddles. Tell me my maths is wrong?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It is our chance to reclaim again what choices we used to have in making decisions that will benefit us more than cow-tailing to Europe. Why are people scared to do that?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied

"I've never been able to work out the maths by those who say we get more out of the EU than we put in... where does that extra money come from...Greece, Portugal or maybe Italy... oh maybe it's Germany. Total bollocks. ..the only ones getting more out of it are those who can't put in much. It's the political and administration systems that get more out of it....they can claim against expenses and fiddles. Tell me my maths is wrong?"
it hard to believe in this day and age people think getting more has to be seen in cleared cash funds ..in which case the UK get jack shit out of having a royal family ..more UK funds goes into maintaining a royal family than comes out ....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

"Hi, thanks for stopping by

There's much talk of the EU referendum atm and lots of strong opinions in both directions...

But I'm curious...

Has anyone changed their mind as a consequence of the debate on Brexit?

Are any waverers who have read something here and have thought, hmmm, I'm gonna vote one way, or the other or has it confirmed what you already know?

Genuinely interested."

I think the op has been a bit lost! Lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

Buy British what? There's hardly any manufacturing left in this country and what there is, is owned by non British companies.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Started off remain, now exit.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I've never been able to work out the maths by those who say we get more out of the EU than we put in... where does that extra money come from...Greece, Portugal or maybe Italy... oh maybe it's Germany. Total bollocks. ..the only ones getting more out of it are those who can't put in much. It's the political and administration systems that get more out of it....they can claim against expenses and fiddles. Tell me my maths is wrong?it hard to believe in this day and age people think getting more has to be seen in cleared cash funds ..in which case the UK get jack shit out of having a royal family ..more UK funds goes into maintaining a royal family than comes out ...."

It certainly isn't about just monetary terms...its more about decision making and have more control of who we are and what we can or cannot do. We have lost so much and we can now and do need to start taking back control of that. It's not an over night change...nothing ever is... but if we don't Europe will continue to control and tell us how to live. When will the next opportunity arises? What furthet damage and loss will we take in the mean time?

Actually they generate more business that one could imagine.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Buy British what? There's hardly any manufacturing left in this country and what there is, is owned by non British companies."

Funny but sad at the same time as it's true

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Cardiff

"Hi, thanks for stopping by

There's much talk of the EU referendum atm and lots of strong opinions in both directions...

But I'm curious...

Has anyone changed their mind as a consequence of the debate on Brexit?

Are any waverers who have read something here and have thought, hmmm, I'm gonna vote one way, or the other or has it confirmed what you already know?

Genuinely interested."

I started out with the romantic view that voting out would bring out the best in us, but I've just been saddened by the UKIP/Right Wing Tories and Daily Mail pushing the out agenda and totally lying about the £350m a day paid to the EC.

So I have moved to stay, partly as my daughters and most of the younger people I have talked to want a future and see that as being part of Europe. They aren't old colonialists and see the future as being better working with our European partners.

We all have our views, it seems likely that most people who will vote to stay won't get over excited about it and therefore won't comment on these forums. So I am hoping for a big turnout as the silent majority are likely to go for stay.

But as I've said before, the vote will be final and whichever way it goes we all have to get behind it.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

Some figures from the house of commons library quoted by Conservative MP Bill Cash a couple of weeks ago. In relation to Britain's relationship with the other 27 countries in the EU Britain has a trade deficit of £67.8 billion pounds annually. When the same is applied to Germany with the other 27 countries in th EU then Germany has a trade surplus of £81.8 billion pounds annually. So a loss for Britain and a gain for Germany, it's working for them, it's clearly not working for us. In contrast the UK had last year a trade surplus with the rest of the world outside of the EU of £31.1 billion pounds and that figure is growing each year, year after year. More prosperous future for Britain is outside of the EU where we can open ourselves up to global trade in a modern globalised world. The EU is out of date an analogue union in a digital age not fit for purpose in the modern globalised world.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hi, thanks for stopping by

There's much talk of the EU referendum atm and lots of strong opinions in both directions...

But I'm curious...

Has anyone changed their mind as a consequence of the debate on Brexit?

Are any waverers who have read something here and have thought, hmmm, I'm gonna vote one way, or the other or has it confirmed what you already know?

Genuinely interested.

But as I've said before, the vote will be final and whichever way it goes we all have to get behind it.

Not sure how it will be final...It will reappear next election again and dare I say it with disillusioned yes voters...woken up so one reason or another. I'd wager my house on it.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

Plus a Secret government memo that was leaked last week shows EU trade wars are costing the UK billions, and damaging the British economy.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/21/trade-wars-memo-shows-eu-is-costing-uk-billions/

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It occurs to me that we might get £67.8 billion pounds worth of goods for that £67.8 billion. That's what trade is about - you act is if the money disappears without trace, perhaps hidden in a dark corner of the House of Commons library? Are those goods suddenly going to become free if we leave the eu?

So somewhere in the uk there's a demand for £67.8 billion worth of stuff (far more than that because it's just the balance). What are those goods? Where will you get them from? How do you know it'll cost less and not more? While you dither and make up some response related to sovereignty, U.K. Consumers wii be wondering why you can't keep the supermarkets stocked.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *andemanMan
over a year ago

bedforshire

Once the rebate the grants direct from the EU and Subsidies to UK farmers are taken account of the Net figure is £161 mill a week.

The rest of the income is from international trade and tax.

The real scandle is the tax Dodging that would increase income to the Tresury (the public Purse) of £120 Billion a year if it were collected. Making the costs of the EU negligable.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

And so the saga continues.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *oncupiscentTonyMan
over a year ago

Kent

As laudable as these buy British campaigns are they're counter productive to achieving their aims

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"In the last 600 years Europe has been a constant battle field with two of the most destructive conflicts known to human kind being started in its confines.

You only have to look at Austria and the near election of a white supremacist to feel that things could turn out to be a cluster fuck if we leave Europe.

...and what happens if by stealth the extreme right takeover the European parliament ?

What happens if by Leaving the Extream Right take over Britian?"

We'll find out how welcome UK refugees will be in other countries.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire

"But I'm curious...

Has anyone changed their mind as a consequence of the debate on Brexit?"

I seriously like to hope at least one person has read something that has then made them go away, do some research for themselves and think about the issues involved...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire

...otherwise what's the point of filling the forum with them?

Mr ddc

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately