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A question about sexism...

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By *ovepiece OP   Man
over a year ago

Borth

Question is at the end...

So. The last thread 'Are you a feminist' got too big and the ability to respond to comments on the thread, removed.

As the OP of the previous thread, it was interesting to read the variety of responses and viewpoints. One thing that struck me is how different our interpretations of the word 'feminist' are and what it means to each of us. I also noticed how it's so easy to misinterpret meaning in people's comments and how entrenched and defensive some people's positions become.

It's really noticeable when men start looking for examples where women seem to 'have it better' than men, as some kind of counter-argument to the feminist cause. At best I think it misses the point and at worst reveals an ingrained misogyny.

My brand of feminism is to listen to the views of women, to try and understand what it's like to be a woman in this society and to be alert to their perspective. I then carry that knowledge with me in everyday life, challenging sexism and inequality when I witness it. I genuinely believe that in order to smash the patriarchy, men need to get on board as advocates and 'be the change'.

My question is this: What kind of sexism have you personally experienced or witnessed and how did it make you feel?

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

I wouldn't even know where to begin. It started as a young child and has continued till now so around 50 years. It has made me feel every negative emotion you can name.

I could write a 10 thousand word dissertation on my experiences and still run out of space.

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By *Carver-Man
over a year ago

Glasgow


"I wouldn't even know where to begin. It started as a young child and has continued till now so around 50 years. It has made me feel every negative emotion you can name.

I could write a 10 thousand word dissertation on my experiences and still run out of space. "

If you feel up to it, even what you've experienced in the last week would be pretty bloody illustrative, I'm sure.

This is a really good thread idea and I hope dudes will simply take the time to read through the responses and get a sense of how common, constant and inescapable these experiences are - rather than treating it like a debate.

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By *alandNitaCouple
over a year ago

Scunthorpe

Women experience sexism on some level on a regular basis.

Often it's what I consider unintentional sexism, in that it's still a sociatal norm. The expectation that women will want to have children and be the one to stay at home/work part time for example or that if you get married you must want to have children.

I got fed up of people asking when (not if) we were having children when I married Cal

Nita

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By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

I have to fess up and admit that I have never experienced any overt instances of sexism against me. For some reason men don't seem to dare tell me to 'get back to the kitchen', or 'make them a sandwich', at least not more than once. I have worked in the public sector for a long time, which has made a huge effort to normalise wages and ensure opportunities for women to progress.

However there is still the ingrained idea that women who work for equality are making a huge fuss. We have the Women's Network at work, that has events and talks, that all the men in my team bitch about, with remarks about PMT and eating bonbons. They are not excluded from attending themselves, but would rather bitch than go along.

Working with the Armed Forces was completely different. there is still an attitude of 'jobs for the boys' there, even with the increase of women in the Armed Forces. Women really struggle there to get taken seriously, although that's in general. I had no problem. However not everyone is me, and some women did feel harassed and bullied there.

People (and its not just men who think that Feminism is a byword for hairy lesbians shouting slogans) should remember that just because we don't see misogyny and sexism as much as before, doesn't mean its not still there. Any attempt to redress the balance should be applauded, not made fun of. But we still have a long way to go.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

I love the almost daily jokes about being menopausal which have replaced the highly amusing menstrual comments.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

What kind of sexism have you personally experienced or witnessed and how did it make you feel?

When I was about 5 ish. My mum, who was around in those days, gave me dolls. My brother ( spit, spit , spit ) got footballs etc. How did it make me feel ? Didn't give a fuck and played football instead. Much more fun.

When i was about 9 ish. My dad bought me a mini silver cross type twin pram. Then he FOOKING battered me and took it off me. Why ? Cos I was lying people across it and giving them prammies as fast as I could around the square! Poor old beautiful pram. Well he should have just got/made me the 'trolley' I wanted. It's what we called 'go karts' just the bottom of an old pram really.

When I was about sayyyyyy 10 ish. I went to school in my new clothes. So proud. Pants and blue jumper. I felt so good. Teacher said. Don't come dressed in trousers again little girl. You look like you are going to the fair.

Around about the same age the dinner lady collared us all for messing in the hall and asked me 'why I didn't act like a girl.' ....... ( retro me would like to say - So I don't have to end up a fucking dinner lady ) instead I felt quite confused as I wasn't sure how girls acted and I was a girl.

When I was about 11 ish maybe younger, my dad wouldn't let me go window cleaning with him but he let my brother. How did it make me feel ? I was FUCKING outraged. Never got over it.

When I was about the same age up to a teen ....... i'd be at my friends house. She had four sisters and one brother. House was spick and span. All those girls serving and cleaning and mum cooking. Her brother used to sit in the armchair and pass his plates. Woman's work you see.

When I was over the legal drinking age. I stood in a bar with my friend. We stood for ages. People were getting served in front of us. Finally someone told us...... they don't serve women on their own at the bar. You'll have to get a man 'stranger' to go to the bar for you. It was explained to me that women in a bar unescorted were trouble. This was the 70's not the early Victorian period.

Sexism is endemic, ingrained and persistant...... all the little things you 'don't see' form your actions and opinions later in life.

Actually had fight with someone from a roofing company once as I questioned his work and with held money. He kept insisting I bring my husband out. I kept saying ... NO it's MY house and MY money. He was flabbergasted and accused me of sending a woman to the door so he ( a man ) couldn't argue with me. Fucker.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

P.S. It's daily. Several times a day ... a lifetime of this bunk.

Not as bad as it used to be.

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By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

Actually the sexism that is endemic is tied with ageism. Why is an aging woman only taken seriously after she's had enough surgery to qualify her for a Mattel sticker, whereas an aging man is always taken seriously? There are exceptions, yes, but the media does have to change their own attitudes, as it's TV that is the biggest offender.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

Don't start me on ageism.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge


"What kind of sexism have you personally experienced or witnessed and how did it make you feel?

When I was about 5 ish. My mum, who was around in those days, gave me dolls. My brother ( spit, spit , spit ) got footballs etc. How did it make me feel ? Didn't give a fuck and played football instead. Much more fun.

When i was about 9 ish. My dad bought me a mini silver cross type twin pram. Then he FOOKING battered me and took it off me. Why ? Cos I was lying people across it and giving them prammies as fast as I could around the square! Poor old beautiful pram. Well he should have just got/made me the 'trolley' I wanted. It's what we called 'go karts' just the bottom of an old pram really.

When I was about sayyyyyy 10 ish. I went to school in my new clothes. So proud. Pants and blue jumper. I felt so good. Teacher said. Don't come dressed in trousers again little girl. You look like you are going to the fair.

Around about the same age the dinner lady collared us all for messing in the hall and asked me 'why I didn't act like a girl.' ....... ( retro me would like to say - So I don't have to end up a fucking dinner lady ) instead I felt quite confused as I wasn't sure how girls acted and I was a girl.

When I was about 11 ish maybe younger, my dad wouldn't let me go window cleaning with him but he let my brother. How did it make me feel ? I was FUCKING outraged. Never got over it.

When I was about the same age up to a teen ....... i'd be at my friends house. She had four sisters and one brother. House was spick and span. All those girls serving and cleaning and mum cooking. Her brother used to sit in the armchair and pass his plates. Woman's work you see.

When I was over the legal drinking age. I stood in a bar with my friend. We stood for ages. People were getting served in front of us. Finally someone told us...... they don't serve women on their own at the bar. You'll have to get a man 'stranger' to go to the bar for you. It was explained to me that women in a bar unescorted were trouble. This was the 70's not the early Victorian period.

Sexism is endemic, ingrained and persistant...... all the little things you 'don't see' form your actions and opinions later in life.

Actually had fight with someone from a roofing company once as I questioned his work and with held money. He kept insisting I bring my husband out. I kept saying ... NO it's MY house and MY money. He was flabbergasted and accused me of sending a woman to the door so he ( a man ) couldn't argue with me. Fucker.

"

I have almost identical experiences (and a nice scar on my thumb from using my dolls pram as a go cart).

Sit with your legs together it's more ladylike. Do do this it's not ladylike. Don't do that it's not ladylike.

I fucking hate being referred to as a lady as a consequence since all it means is that your behaviour is being restricted.

I'm not a fucking lady I'm a WOMAN. Go on say it, it's not a dirty word. (The idea that the word lady is more polite than the word woman. Since when is 'woman' a dirty word? Oh yeah, since fucking always.

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By *ecretlyASoftieWoman
over a year ago

Hull but travel regularly

Told off for wearing trousers in the office, women MUST only wear skirts

Asked at an interview what my plans for marriage and children were

Been pad less (successfully challenged at tribunal)

Called patronising names

The list is endless. Am I a 'feminist' or just a woman who wants to be treated with respect and equality?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yep get the patronising names,girl, love etc

When people ask to speak to the boss even though I am the boss

When I am the one asked to make tea for meetings cos I the female

There are lots...but doesn't overly bother me

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I probably have experienced it but it just doesn't register in my list of things to care about. I'd be a (even worse) miserable twat if I let people offend me. So I don't.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

In restaurants they used to put the bill in front of any male I might be with.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge


"In restaurants they used to put the bill in front of any male I might be with. "

Or when buying an electrical item, car, my kitchen. I was with a male friend for all three and was ignored even though my friend said very clearly that he wasn't buying.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I was told to not interview for a job as girls are better suited to another type of job.

I was told I wouldn't be in charge of my accounts as my clients are sexist and require a male lead.

I was asked if my husband could deal with something instead of little old me.

I was asked about my sex life during a work meeting.

I was assaulted sexually, as the man believed women are there for his use.

I wasn't allowed to lift 25kg at an old job as I'm female, and to leave it for the men.

I've more examples.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I am frequently chastened by my own unintentional sexism but I try to learn from it. I value equality but realise my conditioning has left me with unconscious assumptions that mean I feel the pain of hypocrisy too often

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross


"I am frequently chastened by my own unintentional sexism but I try to learn from it. I value equality but realise my conditioning has left me with unconscious assumptions that mean I feel the pain of hypocrisy too often"

Victim !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I am frequently chastened by my own unintentional sexism but I try to learn from it. I value equality but realise my conditioning has left me with unconscious assumptions that mean I feel the pain of hypocrisy too often

Victim ! "

A victim of my conditioning but by God I do my utmost to shake off that conditioning and become more human

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

On T.V. this week the lovely Kelly Malone said .......

Paraphrasing here .....

' I always used to buy all the drinks and I went into the bar and said .... what's everybody having ...

What ? said some footy fan.

I always buy the drinks , said Kelly.

I've never taken a drink from a woman and im not starting now ..... get out with the other women ( not that nasty/sort of just gentlemanly intentions )

She was accepted and happy course I smelled sexism.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

Forgot to mention that she was Frank Maloen the boxing manager.... for those that don't know.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"On T.V. this week the lovely Kelly Malone said .......

Paraphrasing here .....

' I always used to buy all the drinks and I went into the bar and said .... what's everybody having ...

What ? said some footy fan.

I always buy the drinks , said Kelly.

I've never taken a drink from a woman and im not starting now ..... get out with the other women ( not that nasty/sort of just gentlemanly intentions )

She was accepted and happy course I smelled sexism. "

That one really takes some unpicking ... Given who she is

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