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HM Government EU leaflet

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Has anyone else read this propaganda?

The most common/repeated word in the leaflet is "would". It is full of what "would" happen if we exit. Yet in the same leaflet it says we do not know what exit would look like. More contradiction.

Why can't they use the word "guess" instead...or even better "we want you to think".

Osbourne has just now come out to say that due to decrease in GDP households would be £4300 (in total) worse off by 2030 if we exit. That is in 14 years time.

Two points.

Firstly. That is £307 per household each year. Far less than the NETT contribution we make to the EU so even in the extremely unlikely case that he is correct we would be better off financially.

Second. Something like 9 out of 10 of his "predictions" for growth etc in the las 5/6 years have been out by a significant amount.

Gorgeous Gideon is also stating this loss per household to be a "fact". There are no such things as future facts...they are predictions/speculations/guesses or lies. My experience of our chancellor tells me which of those I think this is!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Everyone must send their leaflet back to Westminster, okay it may cost you a stamp but it will cause severe havoc in their mailing office

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

Cameron keeps banging on about British values but he trampled all over the key British value of a sense of fair play by sending those one sided Propaganda leaflets. Next time he talks about British values I hope people remember that, in this referendum he is not entering into a sense of fair play and he is not giving a level playing field by sending those leaflets.

A petition against those leaflets got over 200,000 signatures, so now as a result of that petition parliament will debate the sending of those leaflets on May 9th.

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By *adyboy-DaddyCouple
over a year ago

Andover

Massive flaw in that argument.

Net, we pay in about £6bn a year.

That's £210 per household.

£210 is less than £307.

(Shh, don't tell anyone we pay in £6m net not £18m, at least, not if you want then to stay mis-informed)

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By *anejohnkent6263Couple
over a year ago

canterbury

send it to 10 downing st London ....the eaton ..tory stuck up own arse,,,posh boy who is so out of touch....ps I was a tory supporter up until Cameron and george

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By *adyboy-DaddyCouple
over a year ago

Andover

So you all post your leaflets back which causes cost, confusion and delays in a post room somewhere.

And this upsets DC how exactly? FFS!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Euro is a load of shit. Companies can get better deals out of it as brussels won't be needing their cut of what's sold. Also the main one of paying eu in excess of 30million a day just to be told how we can spend our own money. Charity to other countries can be stopped and put into nhs get that back on its feet. Cameron only want in as it lines his pocket more. Out for me if you hadn't already guessed haha

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"So you all post your leaflets back which causes cost, confusion and delays in a post room somewhere.

And this upsets DC how exactly? FFS!

"

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"Euro is a load of shit. Companies can get better deals out of it as brussels won't be needing their cut of what's sold. Also the main one of paying eu in excess of 30million a day just to be told how we can spend our own money. Charity to other countries can be stopped and put into nhs get that back on its feet. Cameron only want in as it lines his pocket more. Out for me if you hadn't already guessed haha"

Is this a sneak peak of the official Leave campaign leaflet?

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By *otblondewife hornyMrCouple
over a year ago

Cambuslang

The propaganda will only get worse in the Scottish referendum is anything to go by.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Euro is a load of shit. Companies can get better deals out of it as brussels won't be needing their cut of what's sold. Also the main one of paying eu in excess of 30million a day just to be told how we can spend our own money. Charity to other countries can be stopped and put into nhs get that back on its feet. Cameron only want in as it lines his pocket more. Out for me if you hadn't already guessed haha

Is this a sneak peak of the official Leave campaign leaflet? "

If it is it will be called the common sense leaflet.

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"Euro is a load of shit. Companies can get better deals out of it as brussels won't be needing their cut of what's sold. Also the main one of paying eu in excess of 30million a day just to be told how we can spend our own money. Charity to other countries can be stopped and put into nhs get that back on its feet. Cameron only want in as it lines his pocket more. Out for me if you hadn't already guessed haha

Is this a sneak peak of the official Leave campaign leaflet?

If it is it will be called the common sense leaflet."

Why is it that people who espouse 'common sense' never seem to want to think very hard about things? It can't just be coincidence?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Euro is a load of shit. Companies can get better deals out of it as brussels won't be needing their cut of what's sold. Also the main one of paying eu in excess of 30million a day just to be told how we can spend our own money. Charity to other countries can be stopped and put into nhs get that back on its feet. Cameron only want in as it lines his pocket more. Out for me if you hadn't already guessed haha

Is this a sneak peak of the official Leave campaign leaflet?

If it is it will be called the common sense leaflet.

Why is it that people who espouse 'common sense' never seem to want to think very hard about things? It can't just be coincidence?"

It's one of those what does the eu actually bring to the table other than a bank account we need to fund and stupid laws that we need to follow. Country's that fucked at minute we house migrants but leave our own on the streets. We allow free medical care for any fucker who wants it yet we have to pay? The list goes on, we've a strong currency that other country's can trust be stupid to stay in the eu

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Unfortunately because the booklet is gloss it can't be used for what it should be!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Gets log burner going quite well

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"Euro is a load of shit. Companies can get better deals out of it as brussels won't be needing their cut of what's sold. Also the main one of paying eu in excess of 30million a day just to be told how we can spend our own money. Charity to other countries can be stopped and put into nhs get that back on its feet. Cameron only want in as it lines his pocket more. Out for me if you hadn't already guessed haha

Is this a sneak peak of the official Leave campaign leaflet?

If it is it will be called the common sense leaflet.

Why is it that people who espouse 'common sense' never seem to want to think very hard about things? It can't just be coincidence?

It's one of those what does the eu actually bring to the table other than a bank account we need to fund and stupid laws that we need to follow. Country's that fucked at minute we house migrants but leave our own on the streets. We allow free medical care for any fucker who wants it yet we have to pay? The list goes on, we've a strong currency that other country's can trust be stupid to stay in the eu"

When you say 'the list goes on', do you mean 'the list of things that aren't true' goes on?

Because none of what you've written there is true.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's simple the ones who want to stay in believe what government tells them and are too afraid to experience change. Cameron has realised he's fucked up this time due to the extra 9 million he gave his campaign in order to try salvage a little of what he's lost. Out campaign don't need to send leaflets as the majority of us can see what better our selves

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By *he Queen of TartsWoman
Forum Mod
over a year ago

My Own Little World


"Everyone must send their leaflet back to Westminster, okay it may cost you a stamp but it will cause severe havoc in their mailing office "

Did you know that there is a Freepost address for the conservative party. Won't even cost you the price of a stamp

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By *adyboy-DaddyCouple
over a year ago

Andover


"

Did you know that there is a Freepost address for the conservative party. Won't even cost you the price of a stamp "

That's right. It will just cost the Conservative party. in fact, it will cost them a huge chunk of their admin budget.

Hang on a minute, who funds for the govt and opposition admin budget Oh yeah, the taxpayer.

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By *adyboy-DaddyCouple
over a year ago

Andover

Personally I am desperately trying to convince myself to vote out but am having a really hard time justifying it to myself as the vast majority of info from the out campaign just seems like bullshit.

And the people I am trying to align my ideas with keep saying things like "yeah, that's EUrope stuffs a load of shit, innit. Coming over here taking our jobs, blah, blah, blah"

Somone throw me a lifeline and help me understand, with facts, why I should vote leave.

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied

And the out campaigners' say what!!!!!!!.. Nothing that has any truth whatsoever.. Just scaremongering . A campaign based on mistruths and total lies ..to fool voters into believing the state of utopia will be formed if we leave ...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I find that all people seam to do is contradict each other all the time, one said white the other said black and it is hard to find the true picture but I think you have to go with your gut on this, for me it's out.

Immigration is only a very small part of it for me, it's the control that the EU seams to want over this country that I don't like.

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"I find that all people seam to do is contradict each other all the time, one said white the other said black and it is hard to find the true picture but I think you have to go with your gut on this, for me it's out.

Immigration is only a very small part of it for me, it's the control that the EU seams to want over this country that I don't like."
norway's not in but because the wish to trade with look at what they pay in and also they adopt many eu directives ..dont vote out until you know the alternative..

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"I find that all people seam to do is contradict each other all the time, one said white the other said black and it is hard to find the true picture but I think you have to go with your gut on this, for me it's out.

Immigration is only a very small part of it for me, it's the control that the EU seams to want over this country that I don't like."
norway's not in but because the wish to trade with the eu look at what they pay in and also they adopt many eu directives ..dont vote out until you know the alternative..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All trade will still be there regardless of in or out.do you really think the likes of vw and BMW are going to stop trading with us because brussels says so? Out give us better border control. Control of our own waters money to get a navy back. We was once a country that ruled most land and now we are bring ruled. It worked when Ireland wanted out of. So why won't it work for us?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I find that all people seam to do is contradict each other all the time, one said white the other said black and it is hard to find the true picture but I think you have to go with your gut on this, for me it's out.

Immigration is only a very small part of it for me, it's the control that the EU seams to want over this country that I don't like.norway's not in but because the wish to trade with look at what they pay in and also they adopt many eu directives ..dont vote out until you know the alternative.."

I know we will have to follow EU rules same as you do with every other country outside the EU you wish to work with, but they don't play with our laws.

As for Norway well they paid 447 million euro last year to work with the EU, we paid £12.9 billion.

I'll let you work out which is the better pay scale

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"Control of our own waters money to get a navy back. We was once a country that ruled most land and now we are bring ruled. "

Rule Britannia!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I haven't gotten my leaflet.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I haven't gotten my leaflet. "

You can have mine

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By *tillup4funMan
over a year ago

Wakefield


"I find that all people seam to do is contradict each other all the time, one said white the other said black and it is hard to find the true picture but I think you have to go with your gut on this, for me it's out.

Immigration is only a very small part of it for me, it's the control that the EU seams to want over this country that I don't like.norway's not in but because the wish to trade with the eu look at what they pay in and also they adopt many eu directives ..dont vote out until you know the alternative.."

We cant know the alternative until we leave, why should countries we trade with now stop trading with us just because we leave the EU they will still want and need our goods and products.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I find that all people seam to do is contradict each other all the time, one said white the other said black and it is hard to find the true picture but I think you have to go with your gut on this, for me it's out.

Immigration is only a very small part of it for me, it's the control that the EU seams to want over this country that I don't like.norway's not in but because the wish to trade with the eu look at what they pay in and also they adopt many eu directives ..dont vote out until you know the alternative..

We cant know the alternative until we leave, why should countries we trade with now stop trading with us just because we leave the EU they will still want and need our goods and products. "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Straight from door mat to recycle bin.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I haven't gotten my leaflet.

You can have mine "

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By *adyboy-DaddyCouple
over a year ago

Andover


"

As for Norway well they paid 447 million euro last year to work with the EU, we paid £12.9 billion.

I'll let you work out which is the better pay scale "

This absolutely perfectly sums up the problem.

You have simply not thought about it.

Of £12.9 billion we get a around £6b back.

And £.9b is foreign aid we have agreed to pry regardless of EU membership so we actually pay £6b

Norway pays £447 million, a thirteenth of what we do.

Norways population is 5 million.

Which, surprise surprise, is a thirteenth of the U.K. Population!

Per head, they pay the same to the EU that we do and are not even members.

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By *adyboy-DaddyCouple
over a year ago

Andover


"

Per head, they pay the same to the EU that we do and are not even members.

"

And Noway has full control of its own borders.

And an immigrant population of %13.8.

The U.K. Immigrant population is 11.3.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Why are people reluctant to read the pamphlet and possibly learn? They're like the kids at school who insist it's uncool to succeed.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

As for Norway well they paid 447 million euro last year to work with the EU, we paid £12.9 billion.

I'll let you work out which is the better pay scale

This absolutely perfectly sums up the problem.

You have simply not thought about it.

Of £12.9 billion we get a around £6b back.

And £.9b is foreign aid we have agreed to pry regardless of EU membership so we actually pay £6b

Norway pays £447 million, a thirteenth of what we do.

Norways population is 5 million.

Which, surprise surprise, is a thirteenth of the U.K. Population!

Per head, they pay the same to the EU that we do and are not even members.

"

No not right, see this is what I said about going around and around everyone has there own facts but who's is right???

Anyway my fact say the 12.9 billion is the figure after the £6b rebate is removed.

Not sure what the population of Norway has to do with it as I am sure there payment is not worked out per head

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon

I put it down to read but then accidently picked it up and put it in the recycle bin which was emptied today...Did I miss much?

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By *rightonsteveMan
over a year ago

Brighton - even Hove!


"So you all post your leaflets back which causes cost, confusion and delays in a post room somewhere.

And this upsets DC how exactly? FFS!

"

Could someone explain how sending things through the post causes 'cost, confusion and delays'? The Post Office will make a profit on the the deal through sale of stamps and it's their job to sort and deliver post. It's what they do!!!

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon

I just want an unbiased arguement for each side, I can't find one so I'm even more confused...I have a meet on Friday with a really intelligent guy so I'll ask him

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"So you all post your leaflets back which causes cost, confusion and delays in a post room somewhere.

And this upsets DC how exactly? FFS!

Could someone explain how sending things through the post causes 'cost, confusion and delays'? The Post Office will make a profit on the the deal through sale of stamps and it's their job to sort and deliver post. It's what they do!!! "

Cos they're all dribblers in the sorting room.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I just want an unbiased arguement for each side, I can't find one so I'm even more confused...I have a meet on Friday with a really intelligent guy so I'll ask him "

You won't really find one. Just read as many articles as you can until something hits home and sways you either way.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If these threads are anything to go by. The fabswigers forum should be running the country, everyone seems to be an economical expert

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By *errygTV/TS
over a year ago

denton

people voted them in by their choice, now they are telling us to vote to stay in, so the leaflet has convinced me to vote out of eu.it has had opposite effect

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If these threads are anything to go by. The fabswigers forum should be running the country, everyone seems to be an economical expert "

It's not THAT hard to follow if you're interested.

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By *van ArdenMan
over a year ago

Coleford, Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire.

My family and I have absolutely no intention of reading this scaremongering drivel. It is an outrage against fair play.

After all it is all conjecture without any substance.

Bin it I would suggest.

We won't be a safe and prosperous Great Britain until we leave this unelected group of bureaucrats.

Brexit - bring it on I say.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"My family and I have absolutely no intention of reading this scaremongering drivel. It is an outrage against fair play.

After all it is all conjecture without any substance.

Bin it I would suggest.

We won't be a safe and prosperous Great Britain until we leave this unelected group of bureaucrats.

Brexit - bring it on I say."

How come you don't think the possible changes upon exiting the EU are conjecture too?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If these threads are anything to go by. The fabswigers forum should be running the country, everyone seems to be an economical expert

It's not THAT hard to follow if you're interested. "

I do follow it and my opinion on it is set. but the same people saying the same things over and over gets rather tedious.

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By *tillup4funMan
over a year ago

Wakefield

Does anyone really think they are going to tell us the truth about any thing? We are in the dark about most things until there is a leak and the shit hits the fan.

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By *adyboy-DaddyCouple
over a year ago

Andover


"

No not right, see this is what I said about going around and around everyone has there own facts but who's is right???

Anyway my fact say the 12.9 billion is the figure after the £6b rebate is removed.

Not sure what the population of Norway has to do with it as I am sure there payment is not worked out per head "

Sorry, your still incorrect. Yes the 12.9 is after the rebate, but I'm not talking about rebate.

We then get £6bn back in subsidies.

Then remove foreign aid we have committed to anyway and the net cost is £6bn.

That's a simple fact.

And how can the size of a country not have a bearing on how much it pays????

You can't compare what a country one thirteenth the size of the U.K. pays unless you work it out per head.

You must know that.

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By *tillup4funMan
over a year ago

Wakefield


"My family and I have absolutely no intention of reading this scaremongering drivel. It is an outrage against fair play.

After all it is all conjecture without any substance.

Bin it I would suggest.

We won't be a safe and prosperous Great Britain until we leave this unelected group of bureaucrats.

Brexit - bring it on I say."

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon

Can't I just close my eyes on the voting slip and pick one?

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"

As for Norway well they paid 447 million euro last year to work with the EU, we paid £12.9 billion.

I'll let you work out which is the better pay scale

This absolutely perfectly sums up the problem.

You have simply not thought about it.

Of £12.9 billion we get a around £6b back.

And £.9b is foreign aid we have agreed to pry regardless of EU membership so we actually pay £6b

Norway pays £447 million, a thirteenth of what we do.

Norways population is 5 million.

Which, surprise surprise, is a thirteenth of the U.K. Population!

Per head, they pay the same to the EU that we do and are not even members.

No not right, see this is what I said about going around and around everyone has there own facts but who's is right???

Anyway my fact say the 12.9 billion is the figure after the £6b rebate is removed.

Not sure what the population of Norway has to do with it as I am sure there payment is not worked out per head "
look into norways position more closely..the figure you state is not the total figure they pay its way more than that and way more confusing working it out... they pay for many different part of the EU budget they also have no say in the European Parliament...my point was it wont be the free ride in the EU as the brexit campaigners would have you believe nor will it be as simple as were out .there will be many years if negotiations after we leave ...

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"I find that all people seam to do is contradict each other all the time, one said white the other said black and it is hard to find the true picture but I think you have to go with your gut on this, for me it's out.

Immigration is only a very small part of it for me, it's the control that the EU seams to want over this country that I don't like.norway's not in but because the wish to trade with look at what they pay in and also they adopt many eu directives ..dont vote out until you know the alternative.."

Norway is not the alternative though, we won't be adopting a Norway model if we leave, it won't be a Swiss model either, we will have our own unique British deal.

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By *tillup4funMan
over a year ago

Wakefield


"Can't I just close my eyes on the voting slip and pick one? "

No

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By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

The one thing many people don't seem to be talking about is, what sort of effect would a "Stay" vote have?

I believe it would be a green light to the EU to plough ahead with more political, financial and beauracratic integration, which would mean less say for us in everything. I'm out.

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon


"Can't I just close my eyes on the voting slip and pick one?

No "

But I'm not listening to some of you lot as it seems all so biased...I'm going to do my own reading and decide from there. I've never been interested in politics I guess I have lived in my own bubble for the past 36 years

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"Why are people reluctant to read the pamphlet and possibly learn? They're like the kids at school who insist it's uncool to succeed."

I did read it, it was not full of facts as Cameron claimed, just a load of unconvincing opinion, predictions and supposition. Also a lot of photographs of random stuff, did the government really just use £9 million of taxpayers money to send us photographs? Lol.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

No not right, see this is what I said about going around and around everyone has there own facts but who's is right???

Anyway my fact say the 12.9 billion is the figure after the £6b rebate is removed.

Not sure what the population of Norway has to do with it as I am sure there payment is not worked out per head

Sorry, your still incorrect. Yes the 12.9 is after the rebate, but I'm not talking about rebate.

We then get £6bn back in subsidies.

Then remove foreign aid we have committed to anyway and the net cost is £6bn.

That's a simple fact.

And how can the size of a country not have a bearing on how much it pays????

You can't compare what a country one thirteenth the size of the U.K. pays unless you work it out per head.

You must know that. "

Well to be honest I don't, having looked at the Norway deal I can't see anywhere it said this figure was arrived at by population of the country and that is the one big problem we will have is working out new trade deals with the EU but I feel that it wont be costing us anywhere close to £6b and that's going on your figure of £6b.

It's a gamble maybe but one I think we have to take.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Can't I just close my eyes on the voting slip and pick one? "

You can as long as you've registered to vote!

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon


"Can't I just close my eyes on the voting slip and pick one?

You can as long as you've registered to vote!

"

I am, I have got that far with life

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"

No not right, see this is what I said about going around and around everyone has there own facts but who's is right???

Anyway my fact say the 12.9 billion is the figure after the £6b rebate is removed.

Not sure what the population of Norway has to do with it as I am sure there payment is not worked out per head

Sorry, your still incorrect. Yes the 12.9 is after the rebate, but I'm not talking about rebate.

We then get £6bn back in subsidies.

Then remove foreign aid we have committed to anyway and the net cost is £6bn.

That's a simple fact.

And how can the size of a country not have a bearing on how much it pays????

You can't compare what a country one thirteenth the size of the U.K. pays unless you work it out per head.

You must know that.

Well to be honest I don't, having looked at the Norway deal I can't see anywhere it said this figure was arrived at by population of the country and that is the one big problem we will have is working out new trade deals with the EU but I feel that it wont be costing us anywhere close to £6b and that's going on your figure of £6b.

It's a gamble maybe but one I think we have to take. "
the problem is neither side will say what route the UK should pursue take if we leave ..what stance will be taken on immigration or emigration....and would you trust the UK government enough to get a good deal for us if we leave ? With so many unanswered questions how can people vote to leave

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By *tillup4funMan
over a year ago

Wakefield


"Can't I just close my eyes on the voting slip and pick one?

No

But I'm not listening to some of you lot as it seems all so biased...I'm going to do my own reading and decide from there. I've never been interested in politics I guess I have lived in my own bubble for the past 36 years "

Nothing wrong with bubbles until they burst

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

No not right, see this is what I said about going around and around everyone has there own facts but who's is right???

Anyway my fact say the 12.9 billion is the figure after the £6b rebate is removed.

Not sure what the population of Norway has to do with it as I am sure there payment is not worked out per head

Sorry, your still incorrect. Yes the 12.9 is after the rebate, but I'm not talking about rebate.

We then get £6bn back in subsidies.

Then remove foreign aid we have committed to anyway and the net cost is £6bn.

That's a simple fact.

And how can the size of a country not have a bearing on how much it pays????

You can't compare what a country one thirteenth the size of the U.K. pays unless you work it out per head.

You must know that.

Well to be honest I don't, having looked at the Norway deal I can't see anywhere it said this figure was arrived at by population of the country and that is the one big problem we will have is working out new trade deals with the EU but I feel that it wont be costing us anywhere close to £6b and that's going on your figure of £6b.

It's a gamble maybe but one I think we have to take. the problem is neither side will say what route the UK should pursue take if we leave ..what stance will be taken on immigration or emigration....and would you trust the UK government enough to get a good deal for us if we leave ? With so many unanswered questions how can people vote to leave "

I do agree with you no that, no one know because I don't remember anyone leaving before but do you stay with something I don't agree with just to be on the safe side.

I think we have to take that chance

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"The one thing many people don't seem to be talking about is, what sort of effect would a "Stay" vote have?

I believe it would be a green light to the EU to plough ahead with more political, financial and beauracratic integration, which would mean less say for us in everything. I'm out."

A vote to remain is not a vote to keep the status quo, the EU is constantly changing and not always for the better. The euro zone is stagnating if it goes into another recession increased numbers of EU migrants will come here looking for jobs which will put our public services under an even greater strain than they already are now. If Turkey, Bosnia and other countries who are currently applying for EU membership are allowed in that means tens of millions more people will get EU passports and will have the right to come here under the EU free movement of people rule. For the eurozone to work it will need greater integration going forward, as the euro countries integrate more and we keep the pound sterling we will be left out on the fringes with no influence in what they do yet they will still have a say in how we are governed, better to leave and take back 100% control of our own affairs and let the eurozone get on with it. Not only closer monetary union the EU wants ever closer political union, this will lead to a united states of Europe in the future with an EU army and an EU foreign policy, something I would rather not be a part of thanks.

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By *adyboy-DaddyCouple
over a year ago

Andover


"

and that's going on your figure of £6b.

It's a gamble maybe but one I think we have to take. "

But it's not my figure of £6bn.

That's just an absolute and indisputable fact.

And that's where my dilemma comes from.

My heart wants to vote out but my head says that when the Brexit campaign has, at its core, such a glaring piece of misinformation that I just can't trust anything the campaign says.

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"The one thing many people don't seem to be talking about is, what sort of effect would a "Stay" vote have?

I believe it would be a green light to the EU to plough ahead with more political, financial and beauracratic integration, which would mean less say for us in everything. I'm out.

A vote to remain is not a vote to keep the status quo, the EU is constantly changing and not always for the better. The euro zone is stagnating if it goes into another recession increased numbers of EU migrants will come here looking for jobs which will put our public services under an even greater strain than they already are now. If Turkey, Bosnia and other countries who are currently applying for EU membership are allowed in that means tens of millions more people will get EU passports and will have the right to come here under the EU free movement of people rule. For the eurozone to work it will need greater integration going forward, as the euro countries integrate more and we keep the pound sterling we will be left out on the fringes with no influence in what they do yet they will still have a say in how we are governed, better to leave and take back 100% control of our own affairs and let the eurozone get on with it. Not only closer monetary union the EU wants ever closer political union, this will lead to a united states of Europe in the future with an EU army and an EU foreign policy, something I would rather not be a part of thanks. "
you are being misled if you think by leaving we will have 100% control of the UK ..anyway its the government who will have control and has there been any government you have fully trusted in the last 30yrs ..

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By *arry247Couple
over a year ago

Wakefield

What should be remembered by both sides is strong economic growth in many developing economies outside the EU has resulted in non-EU economies growing in importance to UK trade, with the proportion accounted for by the EU falling consistently since 1999, despite the value of EU trade increasing.

In simple terms the EU is getting less and less important to the UK in terms of trade as compared to the rest of the world

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"The one thing many people don't seem to be talking about is, what sort of effect would a "Stay" vote have?

I believe it would be a green light to the EU to plough ahead with more political, financial and beauracratic integration, which would mean less say for us in everything. I'm out.

A vote to remain is not a vote to keep the status quo, the EU is constantly changing and not always for the better. The euro zone is stagnating if it goes into another recession increased numbers of EU migrants will come here looking for jobs which will put our public services under an even greater strain than they already are now. If Turkey, Bosnia and other countries who are currently applying for EU membership are allowed in that means tens of millions more people will get EU passports and will have the right to come here under the EU free movement of people rule. For the eurozone to work it will need greater integration going forward, as the euro countries integrate more and we keep the pound sterling we will be left out on the fringes with no influence in what they do yet they will still have a say in how we are governed, better to leave and take back 100% control of our own affairs and let the eurozone get on with it. Not only closer monetary union the EU wants ever closer political union, this will lead to a united states of Europe in the future with an EU army and an EU foreign policy, something I would rather not be a part of thanks. you are being misled if you think by leaving we will have 100% control of the UK ..anyway its the government who will have control and has there been any government you have fully trusted in the last 30yrs .. "

That is the whole point in living under a democracy though isn't it, if you don't like the government you can get rid of them by voting for someone else at the next election. We can't get rid of the EU commission, they are unelected and unaccountable. Tony Benn summed it up very well when he said "if you can't get rid of the people that govern you then you are not living in a real democracy".

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ours is going back to Cameron.

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"The one thing many people don't seem to be talking about is, what sort of effect would a "Stay" vote have?

I believe it would be a green light to the EU to plough ahead with more political, financial and beauracratic integration, which would mean less say for us in everything. I'm out.

A vote to remain is not a vote to keep the status quo, the EU is constantly changing and not always for the better. The euro zone is stagnating if it goes into another recession increased numbers of EU migrants will come here looking for jobs which will put our public services under an even greater strain than they already are now. If Turkey, Bosnia and other countries who are currently applying for EU membership are allowed in that means tens of millions more people will get EU passports and will have the right to come here under the EU free movement of people rule. For the eurozone to work it will need greater integration going forward, as the euro countries integrate more and we keep the pound sterling we will be left out on the fringes with no influence in what they do yet they will still have a say in how we are governed, better to leave and take back 100% control of our own affairs and let the eurozone get on with it. Not only closer monetary union the EU wants ever closer political union, this will lead to a united states of Europe in the future with an EU army and an EU foreign policy, something I would rather not be a part of thanks. you are being misled if you think by leaving we will have 100% control of the UK ..anyway its the government who will have control and has there been any government you have fully trusted in the last 30yrs ..

That is the whole point in living under a democracy though isn't it, if you don't like the government you can get rid of them by voting for someone else at the next election. We can't get rid of the EU commission, they are unelected and unaccountable. Tony Benn summed it up very well when he said "if you can't get rid of the people that govern you then you are not living in a real democracy". "
mm the house of lords who help govern the UK blows your argument right out of the water ..the European commission consisting of 1 person for every member state changes every 5 yrs .and the European parliament votes for the president ..so is democratic

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon


"Can't I just close my eyes on the voting slip and pick one?

No

But I'm not listening to some of you lot as it seems all so biased...I'm going to do my own reading and decide from there. I've never been interested in politics I guess I have lived in my own bubble for the past 36 years

Nothing wrong with bubbles until they burst "

Well I will make that choice and not listen to what is posted on here

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By *adyboy-DaddyCouple
over a year ago

Andover


"Ours is going back to Cameron."

And you'll paying for it to do so.

I'll bet he'll be well annoyed opening all that mail over his cornflakes. Not.

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By *ex4unowCouple
over a year ago

near you

Was told recently more intergration is coming including welfare and pensions .

Does that mean we can retire at an earlier age as europe does?

Will threre be a eaqual share of pension fund?

If we stay we will pay more but if we leave we will pay more

50 50 odds

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Can't I just close my eyes on the voting slip and pick one?

No

But I'm not listening to some of you lot as it seems all so biased...I'm going to do my own reading and decide from there. I've never been interested in politics I guess I have lived in my own bubble for the past 36 years

Nothing wrong with bubbles until they burst

Well I will make that choice and not listen to what is posted on here "

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"The one thing many people don't seem to be talking about is, what sort of effect would a "Stay" vote have?

I believe it would be a green light to the EU to plough ahead with more political, financial and beauracratic integration, which would mean less say for us in everything. I'm out.

A vote to remain is not a vote to keep the status quo, the EU is constantly changing and not always for the better. The euro zone is stagnating if it goes into another recession increased numbers of EU migrants will come here looking for jobs which will put our public services under an even greater strain than they already are now. If Turkey, Bosnia and other countries who are currently applying for EU membership are allowed in that means tens of millions more people will get EU passports and will have the right to come here under the EU free movement of people rule. For the eurozone to work it will need greater integration going forward, as the euro countries integrate more and we keep the pound sterling we will be left out on the fringes with no influence in what they do yet they will still have a say in how we are governed, better to leave and take back 100% control of our own affairs and let the eurozone get on with it. Not only closer monetary union the EU wants ever closer political union, this will lead to a united states of Europe in the future with an EU army and an EU foreign policy, something I would rather not be a part of thanks. you are being misled if you think by leaving we will have 100% control of the UK ..anyway its the government who will have control and has there been any government you have fully trusted in the last 30yrs ..

That is the whole point in living under a democracy though isn't it, if you don't like the government you can get rid of them by voting for someone else at the next election. We can't get rid of the EU commission, they are unelected and unaccountable. Tony Benn summed it up very well when he said "if you can't get rid of the people that govern you then you are not living in a real democracy". mm the house of lords who help govern the UK blows your argument right out of the water ..the European commission consisting of 1 person for every member state changes every 5 yrs .and the European parliament votes for the president ..so is democratic "

Tell us all how many times has the house of Lords overruled the House of Commons then?

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"The one thing many people don't seem to be talking about is, what sort of effect would a "Stay" vote have?

I believe it would be a green light to the EU to plough ahead with more political, financial and beauracratic integration, which would mean less say for us in everything. I'm out.

A vote to remain is not a vote to keep the status quo, the EU is constantly changing and not always for the better. The euro zone is stagnating if it goes into another recession increased numbers of EU migrants will come here looking for jobs which will put our public services under an even greater strain than they already are now. If Turkey, Bosnia and other countries who are currently applying for EU membership are allowed in that means tens of millions more people will get EU passports and will have the right to come here under the EU free movement of people rule. For the eurozone to work it will need greater integration going forward, as the euro countries integrate more and we keep the pound sterling we will be left out on the fringes with no influence in what they do yet they will still have a say in how we are governed, better to leave and take back 100% control of our own affairs and let the eurozone get on with it. Not only closer monetary union the EU wants ever closer political union, this will lead to a united states of Europe in the future with an EU army and an EU foreign policy, something I would rather not be a part of thanks. you are being misled if you think by leaving we will have 100% control of the UK ..anyway its the government who will have control and has there been any government you have fully trusted in the last 30yrs ..

That is the whole point in living under a democracy though isn't it, if you don't like the government you can get rid of them by voting for someone else at the next election. We can't get rid of the EU commission, they are unelected and unaccountable. Tony Benn summed it up very well when he said "if you can't get rid of the people that govern you then you are not living in a real democracy". mm the house of lords who help govern the UK blows your argument right out of the water ..the European commission consisting of 1 person for every member state changes every 5 yrs .and the European parliament votes for the president ..so is democratic

Tell us all how many times has the house of Lords overruled the House of Commons then? "
at least 4 times during the last parliament bills were sent back to the house of commons for amendments ..also bills are amended before going to the house of lords .because negotiations have taken place between the two houses ..so house of lords undemocratic ..

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By *anejohnkent6263Couple
over a year ago

canterbury

the problem for the eu is this ...if the uk go.....so will others and eu no more....heaven.....lets stand alone and make our own rules ,let the right people come here and look after our own...ie our kids our oaps our health service.....plus give -uck all abroad...make Britain great again ....plus when we vote out ...slimeball posh boy Cameron and George p45 time

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By *van ArdenMan
over a year ago

Coleford, Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire.

Couldn't agree more with the previous sexy twosome :o)

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon


"the problem for the eu is this ...if the uk go.....so will others and eu no more....heaven.....lets stand alone and make our own rules ,let the right people come here and look after our own...ie our kids our oaps our health service.....plus give -uck all abroad...make Britain great again ....plus when we vote out ...slimeball posh boy Cameron and George p45 time"

What do you mean "our" own I don't get that saying at all? Do you mean those with British passports?

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By *i1971Man
over a year ago

Cornwall


"The one thing many people don't seem to be talking about is, what sort of effect would a "Stay" vote have?

I believe it would be a green light to the EU to plough ahead with more political, financial and beauracratic integration, which would mean less say for us in everything. I'm out.

A vote to remain is not a vote to keep the status quo, the EU is constantly changing and not always for the better. The euro zone is stagnating if it goes into another recession increased numbers of EU migrants will come here looking for jobs which will put our public services under an even greater strain than they already are now. If Turkey, Bosnia and other countries who are currently applying for EU membership are allowed in that means tens of millions more people will get EU passports and will have the right to come here under the EU free movement of people rule. For the eurozone to work it will need greater integration going forward, as the euro countries integrate more and we keep the pound sterling we will be left out on the fringes with no influence in what they do yet they will still have a say in how we are governed, better to leave and take back 100% control of our own affairs and let the eurozone get on with it. Not only closer monetary union the EU wants ever closer political union, this will lead to a united states of Europe in the future with an EU army and an EU foreign policy, something I would rather not be a part of thanks. you are being misled if you think by leaving we will have 100% control of the UK ..anyway its the government who will have control and has there been any government you have fully trusted in the last 30yrs ..

That is the whole point in living under a democracy though isn't it, if you don't like the government you can get rid of them by voting for someone else at the next election. We can't get rid of the EU commission, they are unelected and unaccountable. Tony Benn summed it up very well when he said "if you can't get rid of the people that govern you then you are not living in a real democracy". mm the house of lords who help govern the UK blows your argument right out of the water ..the European commission consisting of 1 person for every member state changes every 5 yrs .and the European parliament votes for the president ..so is democratic

Tell us all how many times has the house of Lords overruled the House of Commons then? at least 4 times during the last parliament bills were sent back to the house of commons for amendments ..also bills are amended before going to the house of lords .because negotiations have taken place between the two houses ..so house of lords undemocratic .. "

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By *lactontogMan
over a year ago

Clacton on Sea

We had a leaflet in Tendering telling people how better off they would be out of the EU but strangely nothing was mentioned about its costs in the media.

We then get one urging us to stay again more money wasted on propaganda, who out of the two are right and why should we fork out the costs out of tax payers money.

We got the bit about staying and what a wonderful country it will be so its only fair we hear the other side.

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By *lactontogMan
over a year ago

Clacton on Sea


"Was told recently more intergration is coming including welfare and pensions .

Does that mean we can retire at an earlier age as europe does?

Will threre be a eaqual share of pension fund?

If we stay we will pay more but if we leave we will pay more

50 50 odds "

We thought the same because at present Britain as the oldest pensionable age whereas most in Europe retire at 60, do we opt for a country who don't give a shit about its elderly or stick or stay in the EU who can still fight for our rights...no brainer really.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Whether to leave or remain in the EU is as much about how you feel in your heart as in your head. It seems to me that the EU is benignly incompetent and is far more about securing the global aspirations of mega corporations as all of the rules and regs are heavily skewed in favour of big business and away from the 'small' business person. I certainly do not recognise the EU as an organisation designed to favour or protect the 'small' person such as pensioners or people needing to heavily rely upon the NHS, if it did have those goals in mind it quite simply would not be tolerating mass immigration which is placing intolerable strain on social benefits such as healthcare, pensions and education. All that unfettered immigration creates is a limited economic growth bubble but sacrifices western culture and values along the way. The paradox in the remain argument which hides behind social welfare as the reason to stay is that the whole reason underpinning the EU is one of creating and furthering globalisation, homogenising everyone into a brand dependent populace without choice or democratic input. I am left with only one logical course of action and that is to vote leave for a safer more secure and ultimately more democratic future.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Whether to leave or remain in the EU is as much about how you feel in your heart as in your head. It seems to me that the EU is benignly incompetent and is far more about securing the global aspirations of mega corporations as all of the rules and regs are heavily skewed in favour of big business and away from the 'small' business person. I certainly do not recognise the EU as an organisation designed to favour or protect the 'small' person such as pensioners or people needing to heavily rely upon the NHS, if it did have those goals in mind it quite simply would not be tolerating mass immigration which is placing intolerable strain on social benefits such as healthcare, pensions and education. All that unfettered immigration creates is a limited economic growth bubble but sacrifices western culture and values along the way. The paradox in the remain argument which hides behind social welfare as the reason to stay is that the whole reason underpinning the EU is one of creating and furthering globalisation, homogenising everyone into a brand dependent populace without choice or democratic input. I am left with only one logical course of action and that is to vote leave for a safer more secure and ultimately more democratic future."

Well said

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"Whether to leave or remain in the EU is as much about how you feel in your heart as in your head. It seems to me that the EU is benignly incompetent and is far more about securing the global aspirations of mega corporations as all of the rules and regs are heavily skewed in favour of big business and away from the 'small' business person. I certainly do not recognise the EU as an organisation designed to favour or protect the 'small' person such as pensioners or people needing to heavily rely upon the NHS, if it did have those goals in mind it quite simply would not be tolerating mass immigration which is placing intolerable strain on social benefits such as healthcare, pensions and education. All that unfettered immigration creates is a limited economic growth bubble but sacrifices western culture and values along the way. The paradox in the remain argument which hides behind social welfare as the reason to stay is that the whole reason underpinning the EU is one of creating and furthering globalisation, homogenising everyone into a brand dependent populace without choice or democratic input. I am left with only one logical course of action and that is to vote leave for a safer more secure and ultimately more democratic future.

Well said "
mass immigration!!!! You do realise there are over 2 million uk citizens who have moved to Europe ....the utopia of an immigrant free uk when we leave the EU is simply not going to happen..its about time the brexit campaigners came clean and started portraying the truth ...

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By *rightonsteveMan
over a year ago

Brighton - even Hove!


"Whether to leave or remain in the EU is as much about how you feel in your heart as in your head. It seems to me that the EU is benignly incompetent and is far more about securing the global aspirations of mega corporations as all of the rules and regs are heavily skewed in favour of big business and away from the 'small' business person. I certainly do not recognise the EU as an organisation designed to favour or protect the 'small' person such as pensioners or people needing to heavily rely upon the NHS, if it did have those goals in mind it quite simply would not be tolerating mass immigration which is placing intolerable strain on social benefits such as healthcare, pensions and education. All that unfettered immigration creates is a limited economic growth bubble but sacrifices western culture and values along the way. The paradox in the remain argument which hides behind social welfare as the reason to stay is that the whole reason underpinning the EU is one of creating and furthering globalisation, homogenising everyone into a brand dependent populace without choice or democratic input. I am left with only one logical course of action and that is to vote leave for a safer more secure and ultimately more democratic future.

Well said mass immigration!!!! You do realise there are over 2 million uk citizens who have moved to Europe ....the utopia of an immigrant free uk when we leave the EU is simply not going to happen..its about time the brexit campaigners came clean and started portraying the truth ..."

The latest net migration statistics show that in the year ending September 2015, net migration to the UK was 323,000.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I am in favour of Brexit but have never thought, nor have I ever heard anyone proposing Brexit suggest that the UK would be immigrant free post Brexit. Quite the reverse in fact, immigration into the UK is desirable if it is controlled and designed to bring to the UK people with the skills that we need to help the country prosper. Current unfettered immigration does not achieve this goal. As for UK citizens living abroad, I suggest they pose a very different proposition to the host countries of Spain, Portugal, Cyprus, Malta (and many others) where they work or retire to, than the thousands of young North African men (predominantly) who are arriving in Europe at the moment? Unless you are suggesting otherwise?

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"I am in favour of Brexit but have never thought, nor have I ever heard anyone proposing Brexit suggest that the UK would be immigrant free post Brexit. Quite the reverse in fact, immigration into the UK is desirable if it is controlled and designed to bring to the UK people with the skills that we need to help the country prosper. Current unfettered immigration does not achieve this goal. As for UK citizens living abroad, I suggest they pose a very different proposition to the host countries of Spain, Portugal, Cyprus, Malta (and many others) where they work or retire to, than the thousands of young North African men (predominantly) who are arriving in Europe at the moment? Unless you are suggesting otherwise?"
you clearly haven't been keeping up with the many posts on social networking sites zero immigration is the way many see brexit should achieve ..the question of what to do with those from Europe who have already arrived in the UK or those who have left is a question that seems to remain unanswered

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"Has anyone else read this propaganda?

The most common/repeated word in the leaflet is "would". It is full of what "would" happen if we exit. Yet in the same leaflet it says we do not know what exit would look like. More contradiction.

Why can't they use the word "guess" instead...or even better "we want you to think".

Osbourne has just now come out to say that due to decrease in GDP households would be £4300 (in total) worse off by 2030 if we exit. That is in 14 years time.

Two points.

Firstly. That is £307 per household each year. Far less than the NETT contribution we make to the EU so even in the extremely unlikely case that he is correct we would be better off financially.

Second. Something like 9 out of 10 of his "predictions" for growth etc in the las 5/6 years have been out by a significant amount.

Gorgeous Gideon is also stating this loss per household to be a "fact". There are no such things as future facts...they are predictions/speculations/guesses or lies. My experience of our chancellor tells me which of those I think this is!"

is this the new brexiter's strategy....rubbish any report that comes out...

The problem is this

Not so easy to rubbish it when the last 6 major organisation to do reports on it all say the same thing

so...lets have a look at them...

Two of the six reports say leaving the EU could have a positive impact on GDP, but even those two reports suggest a negative impact would be more likely.

Centre for Economic Policy Research (2013)... they are well known for being impartial

GDP impact: From -1.24% to -1.77%

Institute of Economic Affairs (2014) they are know for being actually fairly eurosceptic...

GDP impact: From +1.1% to -2.6%

Open Europe (2015).... this one has been the brexiters "poll of choice today... but even they say that a negative outcome is more likely than a positive one...

GDP impact: From +1.55% to -2.2%

Centre for Economic Performance, LSE (2016)...c'mon its the london school of economics... they have to be impartial

GDP impact: From -1.3% to -2.6%

PwC (2016) Price Waterhouse Cooper.... if they aren't impatial, then who is!!!!

GDP impact: From -3% to -5.5% (in 2020)

Oxford Economics..... its Oxford University for god sake!!! how much more impartial would you like!!!!

GDP impact: -0.1% to -3.9%

and thats without even the treasury's calculations..... and the IMF's calculations..... and the institute of fiscal studies (the IFS) who everyone concedes on all sides are about as impartial as they get (even UKIP got the IFS to costplan their entire 2015 general election manifesto to say it was cost neutral) ... so said the treasury's figures are "plausable"

how many more reports do we rubbish.....

so maybe the question that should be asked now (and i say vote leave started interestingly taking this position this afternoon)

if you know its going to cost your pocket £4300 per household per year...... would you still leave????

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

People from EU zone countries already living here would be able to stay and apply for UK citizenship if they wished or go and work somewhere else within the EU. The problem is hardly insurmountable!

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By *riskynriskyCouple
over a year ago

Essex.

It should be easy. If you are here and have a job, you stay.

If you are here and living on the streets as many do in London, you go home.

The same for Brits abroad, if you work or have a pension you stay where you are.

Moving from country to country for work should just be basic visa application.

The EU would probably agree to that as European companies own a lot of utility companies etc in the UK. They would still want to send staff from the parent company to work in the UK...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Firstly Fabio, the alleged fact that it will cost us £4300 is hardly reliable is it? The treasury and Mr Osbourne do not have a good record in predicting the economic picture month to month let alone what it might look like in 14 years. So I think the question is more like do we believe as the 5th biggest economy on the planet and with all of our cultural and political networks established around the globe over hundreds of years of successful trading that we can make a go of it outside of the EU? Remember that 55% of our current trade is conducted with countries outside of the EU.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"I am in favour of Brexit but have never thought, nor have I ever heard anyone proposing Brexit suggest that the UK would be immigrant free post Brexit. Quite the reverse in fact, immigration into the UK is desirable if it is controlled and designed to bring to the UK people with the skills that we need to help the country prosper. Current unfettered immigration does not achieve this goal. As for UK citizens living abroad, I suggest they pose a very different proposition to the host countries of Spain, Portugal, Cyprus, Malta (and many others) where they work or retire to, than the thousands of young North African men (predominantly) who are arriving in Europe at the moment? Unless you are suggesting otherwise?you clearly haven't been keeping up with the many posts on social networking sites zero immigration is the way many see brexit should achieve ..the question of what to do with those from Europe who have already arrived in the UK or those who have left is a question that seems to remain unanswered "

I'm not seeing that being said by everyone on the Brexit side. Everyone accepts we need a certain level of sensible immigration which we have control over.

It's the current lack of control people are opposed to.

Secondly those who have already come here legally from the EU won't be deported or sent back anywhere, for the remain in side to suggest so is just more scaremongering rubbish.

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"People from EU zone countries already living here would be able to stay and apply for UK citizenship if they wished or go and work somewhere else within the EU. The problem is hardly insurmountable!"
you make no mention of the UK citizens living in Europe!!!!!and that position is not one being supported by the in campaigners or Europe where these 2 million UK citizens live to many unknowns for me to vote leave ...

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"Firstly Fabio, the alleged fact that it will cost us £4300 is hardly reliable is it? The treasury and Mr Osbourne do not have a good record in predicting the economic picture month to month let alone what it might look like in 14 years. So I think the question is more like do we believe as the 5th biggest economy on the planet and with all of our cultural and political networks established around the globe over hundreds of years of successful trading that we can make a go of it outside of the EU? Remember that 55% of our current trade is conducted with countries outside of the EU."

so that is how you rubbished the treasurys reports.... how do you then rubbish the other 6 who have said the same thing.... that the likelyhood is the UK would be worst off if brexit....

its like people keep telling you the same thing... to which your answer is "la la la not listening".....

so which report would you like to rubbish next?

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"Firstly Fabio, the alleged fact that it will cost us £4300 is hardly reliable is it? The treasury and Mr Osbourne do not have a good record in predicting the economic picture month to month let alone what it might look like in 14 years. So I think the question is more like do we believe as the 5th biggest economy on the planet and with all of our cultural and political networks established around the globe over hundreds of years of successful trading that we can make a go of it outside of the EU? Remember that 55% of our current trade is conducted with countries outside of the EU."

okay lev.... since you and me both live in newcastle... let me bring you an example close to home....

lets look at nissan in sunderland.... how many thousands work there.... they build cars that are mainly exported to the continent......what would be in it for them to stay?

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"Firstly Fabio, the alleged fact that it will cost us £4300 is hardly reliable is it? The treasury and Mr Osbourne do not have a good record in predicting the economic picture month to month let alone what it might look like in 14 years. So I think the question is more like do we believe as the 5th biggest economy on the planet and with all of our cultural and political networks established around the globe over hundreds of years of successful trading that we can make a go of it outside of the EU? Remember that 55% of our current trade is conducted with countries outside of the EU."

The IMF also have a spectacular record for getting it wrong when making predictions. They failed to predict the global economic crash in 2008, then they rubbished George Osborne's austerity cuts for which they had to later make a humiliating public apology to him and the government and admit they got it wrong. I'm pretty sure the IMF were also one of the bodies who told us to join the euro, and it's clear now they got that one wrong too.

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By *enny PR9TV/TS
over a year ago

Southport

Considering they factored in the nuclear war which takes place in 2024 and the great pandemic which followed, killing over 85% of the worlds population. I think we sound in good shape.

Jenny xxx

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"Firstly Fabio, the alleged fact that it will cost us £4300 is hardly reliable is it? The treasury and Mr Osbourne do not have a good record in predicting the economic picture month to month let alone what it might look like in 14 years. So I think the question is more like do we believe as the 5th biggest economy on the planet and with all of our cultural and political networks established around the globe over hundreds of years of successful trading that we can make a go of it outside of the EU? Remember that 55% of our current trade is conducted with countries outside of the EU.

The IMF also have a spectacular record for getting it wrong when making predictions. They failed to predict the global economic crash in 2008, then they rubbished George Osborne's austerity cuts for which they had to later make a humiliating public apology to him and the government and admit they got it wrong. I'm pretty sure the IMF were also one of the bodies who told us to join the euro, and it's clear now they got that one wrong too. "

so thats the treasury and the imf...... how about rubbishing the 6 others i have mentioned?

you going to distrust the IFS... after all they did your beloved ukips manifesto commitments ......

if ukip had enough confidence in them... then surely you would....

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By *enuinedannyMan
over a year ago

walsall

I dont really care either way but I would rather be a part of a country that worked hard though difficult times and become the truly great place for all that it should be than watch it die in the eu but I wont be voting anyhow

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All of them frankly, as they all represent the self interest of the globalist sand corporatists. What they most certainly do not represent are the best interests of the ordinary working people of this country! Have you ever stopped to think why Cameron and Osborne are so fervently pro EU? There are hardly on the side of the working man are they? It suits the interests of big business who are desperate for the UK to join the Euro and for the EU to become a federal entity. TTIP allows access to the NHS for all of the big US medical insurance companies (amongst many other horrific events) and the TTIP negotiations are being conducted in complete secrecy. Does anyone really believe that these things are being done to benefit us?

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"

Considering they factored in the nuclear war which takes place in 2024 and the great pandemic which followed, killing over 85% of the worlds population. I think we sound in good shape.

Jenny xxx"

Lol, you forgot about skynet taking over the world in 2025, and then the terminators taking control of all the countries. Maybe in the realms of fantasy but no more a fantasy than George Osborne thinking he can predict what the world will look like in 2030.

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"All of them frankly, as they all represent the self interest of the globalist sand corporatists. What they most certainly do not represent are the best interests of the ordinary working people of this country! Have you ever stopped to think why Cameron and Osborne are so fervently pro EU? There are hardly on the side of the working man are they? It suits the interests of big business who are desperate for the UK to join the Euro and for the EU to become a federal entity. TTIP allows access to the NHS for all of the big US medical insurance companies (amongst many other horrific events) and the TTIP negotiations are being conducted in complete secrecy. Does anyone really believe that these things are being done to benefit us?"
do you really believe leaving the EU will benefit the average working person ? ..surely you cannot be that naïve to believe it..

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"All of them frankly, as they all represent the self interest of the globalist sand corporatists. What they most certainly do not represent are the best interests of the ordinary working people of this country! Have you ever stopped to think why Cameron and Osborne are so fervently pro EU? There are hardly on the side of the working man are they? It suits the interests of big business who are desperate for the UK to join the Euro and for the EU to become a federal entity. TTIP allows access to the NHS for all of the big US medical insurance companies (amongst many other horrific events) and the TTIP negotiations are being conducted in complete secrecy. Does anyone really believe that these things are being done to benefit us? do you really believe leaving the EU will benefit the average working person ? ..surely you cannot be that naïve to believe it.."

Stuart Rose, the leader of the Britain stronger in Europe campaign admitted while he was being grilled by the commons select committee that if we leave the EU it's likely British workers wages would go up. That would be a benefit to the average working person.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"All of them frankly, as they all represent the self interest of the globalist sand corporatists. What they most certainly do not represent are the best interests of the ordinary working people of this country! Have you ever stopped to think why Cameron and Osborne are so fervently pro EU? There are hardly on the side of the working man are they? It suits the interests of big business who are desperate for the UK to join the Euro and for the EU to become a federal entity. TTIP allows access to the NHS for all of the big US medical insurance companies (amongst many other horrific events) and the TTIP negotiations are being conducted in complete secrecy. Does anyone really believe that these things are being done to benefit us? do you really believe leaving the EU will benefit the average working person ? ..surely you cannot be that naïve to believe it.."

sad thing is that even though he live here in newcastle... he doesn't realise that north east england is actually a net benefiter of EU money..... and the regeneration of the newcastle/gateshead quayside area is built on the back of EU money....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Mines gone back with the following written on it.

Sending back unread. Why don't you go visit Panama you toffee nosed cunt and do us all a favour a resign

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The Economy

The Exciting New World Outside the European Union

With every new EU regulation and with every extra pound paid into the E U’s coffers, Britain’s EU membership is an increasingly bad deal. I do not know of any cost-benefit study that shows EU membership actually benefits Britain. On the contrary, they vie with each other to show how costly, and increasingly costly, membership is. The country needs a new relationship with the EU

A free trade relationship for Britain and the EU

When we set up Global Vision in 2007, we focused on the economic case for an EFTA/Swiss-style relationship with the EU based on trade and mutually beneficial co-operation. We understand that trade with the EU countries is important to Britain but, under a free trade relationship with the EU, this would continue. There is not a shred of evidence to show that trade would be blocked – just look at Germany’s trade surplus with us

But we do not need the single Market, which is still widely misunderstood in this country as a free trade area. It is not a free trade area. It is a highly regulated market based on the notion of “harmonization”. And the costs of the Single Market’s regulations far outweigh the benefits. We do not need the EU’s Custom’s Union either, an idea as dated as drainpipe trousers and beehive hairstyles. Indeed we would be better off outside the Custom’s Union. We would then be free to choose the countries we wanted to negotiate special trade deals with, rather than rely on Brussels to decide for us.

This negotiating freedom is a huge potential boon for this country. It is too often overlooked. Much is, rightly, made of the savings we would make if we left the EU. But too little is made of the potential prizes if were free to negotiate our own trade deals. Yet these potential prizes are the really exciting aspect of leaving the EU in the rapidly changing 21st-century global economy, where Europe will inevitably shrink in relative importance. They could transform the economic prospects of this country.

Free to trade: the importance of the Commonwealth

The US, which is UK’s largest trading partner by a substantial margin, and the biggest investor in the UK by a mile, would be an obvious candidate. But so would be the Commonwealth nations whose economic potential is quite special, not least of all because of the Indian economy, which is clocking up annual growth rates of 7-8 per cent. The Indian Diaspora, well represented here in the UK, adds to the excitement of the Commonwealth’s economic prospects and its relevance to Britain.

And the Commonwealth is open for trade and economic cooperation. Commonwealth leaders issued the historic ‘Edinburgh Communique’, following a Commonwealth heads of government meeting (CHOGM), in 1997. It was a masterly and inspired document that outlined the objectives of the Commonwealth relating to increased trade and investment opportunities and also, crucially, to development issues.

The individual Commonwealth nations were, of course, left to decide which policies they should implement in order to achieve the Edinburgh objectives. The Commonwealth Business Council, which should be far better known in Britain than it is, was established in 1997 following the meeting.

The contrast between the Edinburgh Communiques flexible, bottom-up approach and the top-down, inflexible and heavily regulated directive-driven processes of the EU, a regional bloc in relative decline, could not be starker

The Commonwealth nations, taken together are an economic colossus comprising some 15 per cent of world GDP, 54 member states and two billion citizens. They will inevitably become more powerful. The Commonwealth spans five continents and contains developed, emerging and developing economies. The Commonwealth in it’s richness and diversity mirrors today’s global economy in a way that the EU simply cannot start to aspire to. It is the future, not a curious relic of empire.

Moreover, other Commonwealth countries see this when we do not, blinded as we are by our masochistic attachment to the EU and its Single Market. The attitude of Canada for example, is altogether more enlightened. “Commonwealth Advantage” is a go-ahead Canadian organisation with the objectives of creating new trade opportunities and strengthening ties with other Commonwealth nations. Commonwealth advantage sees the Commonwealth as a true economic bloc, where the commonalities of language, law, accounting systems and business regulations can present a 15 per cent cost advantage over dealing with countries that are outside the Commonwealth

And Kamal Nath, India’s Road Transport Minister and former Industry Minister, was quoted recently saying: “The Commonwealth is the ideal platform for business and trade… I hope that India’s ties with the Commonwealth will move from strength to strength, and that the new paradigm will only mean greater warmth, greater cooperation.” The “new paradigm are his words, not mine.

The framework for Britain to raise its game in the Commonwealth is already in place. The institutions exist. Our Commonwealth partners are very willing partners. But we must be free of the EU’s restraints, bureaucratic, legalistic and psychological, if we are to make best of the opportunities open to us. Making the best of these opportunities would benefit everyone in the Commonwealth

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Anyone fancy a shag X. Or even a French kiss X

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

No Fabio, you don't understand that the money used to regenerate the Quayside was our money that we paid in taxes to HMRC which was then transferred to the EU and a small proportion of that was given back to us to carry out the work. Wake up and smell the coffee man, we are net contributes to the EU budget, meaning we are out of pocket to the tune of around £8billion Stirling every year.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"All of them frankly, as they all represent the self interest of the globalist sand corporatists. What they most certainly do not represent are the best interests of the ordinary working people of this country! Have you ever stopped to think why Cameron and Osborne are so fervently pro EU? There are hardly on the side of the working man are they? It suits the interests of big business who are desperate for the UK to join the Euro and for the EU to become a federal entity. TTIP allows access to the NHS for all of the big US medical insurance companies (amongst many other horrific events) and the TTIP negotiations are being conducted in complete secrecy. Does anyone really believe that these things are being done to benefit us? do you really believe leaving the EU will benefit the average working person ? ..surely you cannot be that naïve to believe it..

sad thing is that even though he live here in newcastle... he doesn't realise that north east england is actually a net benefiter of EU money..... and the regeneration of the newcastle/gateshead quayside area is built on the back of EU money...."

It's not EU money though it is our own money paid to the EU which they then give back to us. There is no such thing as EU money.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The only other internet forum I use is one for my profession.

In a poll with over 600 respondents that closed today, 68% said they will vote to remain, 19% leave, with 13% undecided. It's not great methodology, of course, as it's focused around a narrow occupational group, but very few of those people are Cameron, or business-centric.

I mention this because this forum, for whatever reason, often appears to show opposite numbers (similarly unrepresentative survey, of course, and based on the posts of those who shout loudest).

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"All of them frankly, as they all represent the self interest of the globalist sand corporatists. What they most certainly do not represent are the best interests of the ordinary working people of this country! Have you ever stopped to think why Cameron and Osborne are so fervently pro EU? There are hardly on the side of the working man are they? It suits the interests of big business who are desperate for the UK to join the Euro and for the EU to become a federal entity. TTIP allows access to the NHS for all of the big US medical insurance companies (amongst many other horrific events) and the TTIP negotiations are being conducted in complete secrecy. Does anyone really believe that these things are being done to benefit us? do you really believe leaving the EU will benefit the average working person ? ..surely you cannot be that naïve to believe it..

sad thing is that even though he live here in newcastle... he doesn't realise that north east england is actually a net benefiter of EU money..... and the regeneration of the newcastle/gateshead quayside area is built on the back of EU money....

It's not EU money though it is our own money paid to the EU which they then give back to us. There is no such thing as EU money. "
the reality is a government based in London will not replace eu money to regenerate the north of England in not a northerner even I realise the north will only get eu funding to regenerate the area ..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The north does not need EU handouts it needs genuine opportunities for trade and growth. The Nissan car plant has recently expanded to start making cars for the US market, it is growth like this that is needed, not charitable donations from Brussels.

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"The north does not need EU handouts it needs genuine opportunities for trade and growth. The Nissan car plant has recently expanded to start making cars for the US market, it is growth like this that is needed, not charitable donations from Brussels."
I know its difficult foe you ro understand but you need to improve an area to entice further large companies in to create real jobs ...ohh and ask all the people being paid with eu money to improve the quayside wether they would like to continue being paid with eu money or have no work ..so yes the north does need the improvements and eu money

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We live in a very sad country if you believe that. The EU does not have any money other than what we give it through our taxes and the fact that we get less back than we give it is hardly a good deal. I agree that we need a government that is prepared to back the north, which 13 years of labour and now six years of the Cameron/Osborne mismanagement have failed to do. But salvation for the north does not lie within the EU.

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"We live in a very sad country if you believe that. The EU does not have any money other than what we give it through our taxes and the fact that we get less back than we give it is hardly a good deal. I agree that we need a government that is prepared to back the north, which 13 years of labour and now six years of the Cameron/Osborne mismanagement have failed to do. But salvation for the north does not lie within the EU."
you forgot to mention the 18 yrs of the thatcher government who decimated the north sorry but in the last 37 yrs of labour and tory governments salvation comes only from the EU..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Only from redistribution of our own taxes I think is what you mean. The EU acts as a middle man and takes a very hefty chunk out of it as its fee. Personally I'd rather take responsibility for that job back from Brussels. Unless you are suggesting that we are incapable of running our own affairs?

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"Only from redistribution of our own taxes I think is what you mean. The EU acts as a middle man and takes a very hefty chunk out of it as its fee. Personally I'd rather take responsibility for that job back from Brussels. Unless you are suggesting that we are incapable of running our own affairs?"
you will never get a fair distribution from Westminster you haven't in the last 37 yrs leaving the EU wont change that

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By *its_n_piecesCouple
over a year ago


" Unless you are suggesting that we are incapable of running our own affairs?"

yup ... that just about puts the UK in a nutshell

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Well I'm an optimist and I'd rather take responsibility as a mature sovereign nation than play the child role to the Democratically absent EU.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


" Unless you are suggesting that we are incapable of running our own affairs?

yup ... that just about puts the UK in a nutshell"

So instead of project fear now it's project pessimism from the Remainians?

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By *its_n_piecesCouple
over a year ago


" Unless you are suggesting that we are incapable of running our own affairs?

yup ... that just about puts the UK in a nutshell

So instead of project fear now it's project pessimism from the Remainians?"

which project fear do you mean? the leave or be in ruins project fear? or the stay and be in ruins project fear?

as i've clearly stated previously i couldn't give a shit which of you squabbling factions wins this time wasting farce

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Remain = we are incapable of being any better than the current shoddy mess. Wow what a prospect.

Good night children, wherever you are.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" Unless you are suggesting that we are incapable of running our own affairs?

yup ... that just about puts the UK in a nutshell

So instead of project fear now it's project pessimism from the Remainians?"

Don't forget "Project Eat Your First Born" and "Project Kill Fluffy Kittens"

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By * TRUE GENTMan
over a year ago

west bromwich

As any one thought of the life's lost to keep this counrty independent so why do humans make life so hard to live .we only borrow the time we live on the planet and destruction is man made and the real question to ask each other do we trust the human to make anything of the shit we are good at achieving sorry if this sounds a little deep but I find it all a joke that a human can maka prediction on the next 14 years as we can't go from day to day without conflicted

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Why are people reluctant to read the pamphlet and possibly learn? They're like the kids at school who insist it's uncool to succeed."

I have read every word...a few times. Hence my complaint about the use of the word "would" for every speculative guess it contains. Cameron and his cronies are listing things as facts which are at best predictions, generally conjecture, and in many cases lies! You cannot talk about future facts as they haven't happened yet!

Gideon reckons our GDP could fall by 6% by 2030.... Strangely this is exactly the same amount his prediction of 5 years ago was wrong by! And he expects us to believe this as fact? (Apparently he also equates a 6% fall as being £4300 per household....so according to that average income must be £71666...... Really??? And he is chancellor?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Mine went straight in the recycle bin.

Nice to see our goverment wasting taxpayers money on this garbage

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By *lactontogMan
over a year ago

Clacton on Sea


"We live in a very sad country if you believe that. The EU does not have any money other than what we give it through our taxes and the fact that we get less back than we give it is hardly a good deal. I agree that we need a government that is prepared to back the north, which 13 years of labour and now six years of the Cameron/Osborne mismanagement have failed to do. But salvation for the north does not lie within the EU."

Its not a North South thing as we have Jaywick 4 miles down the road the most deprived pace in the country followed by Tower Hamlets slums & some pretty fucked up places in Wales so its the same all over mate.

Wages/Benefits in Essex are no different to those in Yorkshire but prices are twice as much here for food & clothes...we need the government to back the whole country & not just line the pockets of the rich.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Google 'better off out' for a start

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By *arry247Couple
over a year ago

Wakefield


"We had a leaflet in Tendering telling people how better off they would be out of the EU but strangely nothing was mentioned about its costs in the media.

We then get one urging us to stay again more money wasted on propaganda, who out of the two are right and why should we fork out the costs out of tax payers money.

We got the bit about staying and what a wonderful country it will be so its only fair we hear the other side."

That is very simple the out leaflet was paid by the out supportsers the Government in leaflet which is what people are complaining about was paid for by the taxpayers.

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"Google 'better off out' for a start"
easy way to decide in or out .....would u leave your job for one that wont tell you the rate of pay,holiday entitlement.whether you get company car .private health .its simple you wouldn't..so why leave the EU when you don't know the benefits.you wouldn't gamble with your job why gamble with your country.

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By *enuinedannyMan
over a year ago

walsall


"Well I'm an optimist and I'd rather take responsibility as a mature sovereign nation than play the child role to the Democratically absent EU."

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

Have not had one...

Think Ill email callme'Ifuckpigs'dave and complain!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Google 'better off out' for a starteasy way to decide in or out .....would u leave your job for one that wont tell you the rate of pay,holiday entitlement.whether you get company car .private health .its simple you wouldn't..so why leave the EU when you don't know the benefits.you wouldn't gamble with your job why gamble with your country."

Leaving is no gamble it is the better option/'job' for sure. Now having said that, I am not even thinking of my pocket, I am thinking of the future for my 13 year old son and the futures of the kids I know in Spain. The whole union wants tearing down

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"Google 'better off out' for a starteasy way to decide in or out .....would u leave your job for one that wont tell you the rate of pay,holiday entitlement.whether you get company car .private health .its simple you wouldn't..so why leave the EU when you don't know the benefits.you wouldn't gamble with your job why gamble with your country.

Leaving is no gamble it is the better option/'job' for sure. Now having said that, I am not even thinking of my pocket, I am thinking of the future for my 13 year old son and the futures of the kids I know in Spain. The whole union wants tearing down"
that's ridiculous statement of course leaving is a gamble nobody knows what will be put in place after eu membership ..or are you one of the uneducated people that think we can just walk away from the club but still keep all of the benefits of the EU..dint you realise the wont just be given they will have to be negotiated hard for ....

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By *arker66Man
over a year ago

Manchester


"Euro is a load of shit. Companies can get better deals out of it as brussels won't be needing their cut of what's sold. Also the main one of paying eu in excess of 30million a day just to be told how we can spend our own money. Charity to other countries can be stopped and put into nhs get that back on its feet. Cameron only want in as it lines his pocket more. Out for me if you hadn't already guessed haha"

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By *ELLONS AND CREAMWoman
over a year ago

stourbridge area


"I haven't gotten my leaflet.

You can have mine "

Mine too ......

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"Euro is a load of shit. Companies can get better deals out of it as brussels won't be needing their cut of what's sold. Also the main one of paying eu in excess of 30million a day just to be told how we can spend our own money. Charity to other countries can be stopped and put into nhs get that back on its feet. Cameron only want in as it lines his pocket more. Out for me if you hadn't already guessed haha "
ah like china where up to 45% import tax is charged on cars yep great deals to be had outside the EU ..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Google 'better off out' for a starteasy way to decide in or out .....would u leave your job for one that wont tell you the rate of pay,holiday entitlement.whether you get company car .private health .its simple you wouldn't..so why leave the EU when you don't know the benefits.you wouldn't gamble with your job why gamble with your country.

Leaving is no gamble it is the better option/'job' for sure. Now having said that, I am not even thinking of my pocket, I am thinking of the future for my 13 year old son and the futures of the kids I know in Spain. The whole union wants tearing downthat's ridiculous statement of course leaving is a gamble nobody knows what will be put in place after eu membership ..or are you one of the uneducated people that think we can just walk away from the club but still keep all of the benefits of the EU..dint you realise the wont just be given they will have to be negotiated hard for ...."

When will you realise that there are no longer any benefits to being in the EU? Maybe you should put a hat on, too much sun can frazzle the brain

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By *horehouseCouple
over a year ago

dissatisfied


"Google 'better off out' for a starteasy way to decide in or out .....would u leave your job for one that wont tell you the rate of pay,holiday entitlement.whether you get company car .private health .its simple you wouldn't..so why leave the EU when you don't know the benefits.you wouldn't gamble with your job why gamble with your country.

Leaving is no gamble it is the better option/'job' for sure. Now having said that, I am not even thinking of my pocket, I am thinking of the future for my 13 year old son and the futures of the kids I know in Spain. The whole union wants tearing downthat's ridiculous statement of course leaving is a gamble nobody knows what will be put in place after eu membership ..or are you one of the uneducated people that think we can just walk away from the club but still keep all of the benefits of the EU..dint you realise the wont just be given they will have to be negotiated hard for ....

When will you realise that there are no longer any benefits to being in the EU? Maybe you should put a hat on, too much sun can frazzle the brain"
no benefits to being in the EU !!!!!!!!!!

Quick turn the heating up you have brain freeze

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Google 'better off out' for a starteasy way to decide in or out .....would u leave your job for one that wont tell you the rate of pay,holiday entitlement.whether you get company car .private health .its simple you wouldn't..so why leave the EU when you don't know the benefits.you wouldn't gamble with your job why gamble with your country.

Leaving is no gamble it is the better option/'job' for sure. Now having said that, I am not even thinking of my pocket, I am thinking of the future for my 13 year old son and the futures of the kids I know in Spain. The whole union wants tearing downthat's ridiculous statement of course leaving is a gamble nobody knows what will be put in place after eu membership ..or are you one of the uneducated people that think we can just walk away from the club but still keep all of the benefits of the EU..dint you realise the wont just be given they will have to be negotiated hard for ....

When will you realise that there are no longer any benefits to being in the EU? Maybe you should put a hat on, too much sun can frazzle the brainno benefits to being in the EU !!!!!!!!!!

Quick turn the heating up you have brain freeze"

This coming from the man who thinks the pound has never gone below 1.21 euros in the last five years. Ok so you think that any benefits we do have would suddenly be taken away? Who would that suit? There are no future benefits to be had. Tradewise the EU is shrinking year on year on the world stage. Countries will be better off on their own. It is companies and businessmen that do business not governments. The world has shrunk and this is a new age

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