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"According to the news, the UK is closing in on the Conservatives plans to restrict in work benefits to EU immigrants for first four years of living here. Hoping it will deter some immigrants coming here. I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely. And won't some of the other EU countries want to apply the same rules to our citizens who work in their country? " I worked in Germany and was not allowed to touch their welfare system for 2 years. I lost my job, I moved back to the UK. It seems to work *shrug* | |||
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"According to the news, the UK is closing in on the Conservatives plans to restrict in work benefits to EU immigrants for first four years of living here. Hoping it will deter some immigrants coming here. I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely. And won't some of the other EU countries want to apply the same rules to our citizens who work in their country? " I think it very easy to "get it" The occupations where there are shortages are skilled jobs with higher pay that don't need in work benefits. Importing unskilled workers for lower paid work only forces wages down, especially when subsidised by taxpayers. As for UK citizens working in the EU? It isn't really an issue as very few (if any) other EU country's have a system of in work benefit anything like tax credits. Why do you think Britain is such a draw? | |||
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"It isn't really an issue as very few (if any) other EU country's have a system of in work benefit anything like tax credits. " Because they just don't want it or because they don't have as much need for it? | |||
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"My question would be if they come, have no jobs or benefits how will they live?!! " They'll either turn to crime or they'll leave (most people are hoping it's the latter). | |||
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"So a family comes over to Uk, husband is a qualified gp. But the wife doesn't work, should she be allowed to claim benefits? Or should she be maid to pay some kind of tax in order to be entitled to benefits? " She probably wouldn't be entitled to anything as her husband's earnings would disqualify her. | |||
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"My question would be if they come, have no jobs or benefits how will they live?!! " How did they live in their country? | |||
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"So a family comes over to Uk, husband is a qualified gp. But the wife doesn't work, should she be allowed to claim benefits? Or should she be maid to pay some kind of tax in order to be entitled to benefits? She probably wouldn't be entitled to anything as her husband's earnings would disqualify her. " That would depend on earnings wouldn't it? Even still shouldn't people have to pay into a system before being entitled. If you didn't pay pension you wouldn't just be handed one. | |||
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"According to the news, the UK is closing in on the Conservatives plans to restrict in work benefits to EU immigrants for first four years of living here. Hoping it will deter some immigrants coming here. I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely. And won't some of the other EU countries want to apply the same rules to our citizens who work in their country? I worked in Germany and was not allowed to touch their welfare system for 2 years. I lost my job, I moved back to the UK. It seems to work *shrug*" I think it's a good idea  | |||
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"So a family comes over to Uk, husband is a qualified gp. But the wife doesn't work, should she be allowed to claim benefits? Or should she be maid to pay some kind of tax in order to be entitled to benefits? She probably wouldn't be entitled to anything as her husband's earnings would disqualify her. That would depend on earnings wouldn't it? Even still shouldn't people have to pay into a system before being entitled. If you didn't pay pension you wouldn't just be handed one. " Well a GP makes a salary at least twice the national average so I doubt they'd qualify. In theory you can get a pension without paying in, if you spend what would have been your working life unemployed. If people are having to pay in for an amount of time to qualify for benefits then I hope no school leavers find themselves unemployed, that could really affect their future. | |||
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"According to the news, the UK is closing in on the Conservatives plans to restrict in work benefits to EU immigrants for first four years of living here. Hoping it will deter some immigrants coming here. I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely. And won't some of the other EU countries want to apply the same rules to our citizens who work in their country? " if they are coming here to work then they should not be worried about benefits. | |||
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"It isn't really an issue as very few (if any) other EU country's have a system of in work benefit anything like tax credits. Because they just don't want it or because they don't have as much need for it? " I think that would vary from country to country. But don't think that everyone in Germany for example are all earning megabucks. There are plenty of full time jobs here that pay less that 1000€ (£760) per month. | |||
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"This is gonna end well "I should have thought of a more cheery Friday thread. It just seems to big on the news today and leading up to the referendum in 2017.  | |||
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"So a family comes over to Uk, husband is a qualified gp. But the wife doesn't work, should she be allowed to claim benefits? Or should she be maid to pay some kind of tax in order to be entitled to benefits? As a national if I quit my job I'm not entitled to any jsa as I made myself unemployed. like many able bodied peoplein the uk, why should life be given for free. I agree working families should get help. I agree people who cannot actually work need help. " Your point is one I hear time and time again and agree with. I wouldn't know where to begin claiming benefits. If I lost my job/house tomorrow I wouldn't be entitled to anything, after almost forty years nonstop working. It's irksome to think others with no contribution to the pot can withdraw from it. | |||
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"So a family comes over to Uk, husband is a qualified gp. But the wife doesn't work, should she be allowed to claim benefits? Or should she be maid to pay some kind of tax in order to be entitled to benefits? She probably wouldn't be entitled to anything as her husband's earnings would disqualify her. That would depend on earnings wouldn't it? Even still shouldn't people have to pay into a system before being entitled. If you didn't pay pension you wouldn't just be handed one. " I will now be entitled to a German pension (not for a few years yet though) although I had to be in the system for five years before there was any entitlement. To me that is fair. | |||
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"According to the news, the UK is closing in on the Conservatives plans to restrict in work benefits to EU immigrants for first four years of living here. Hoping it will deter some immigrants coming here. I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely. And won't some of the other EU countries want to apply the same rules to our citizens who work in their country? " Off the top of my head the only type of person that would consider leaving the UK to go to Europe to claim benefits would most likely be an MEP. When will we stop questioning the people that are on benefits and start asking about the people who claim expenses? This is a headline in the Daily Telegraph 16 Jan :- "New boss of MPs' expenses watchdog to be paid over £70,000 a year for two days a week", MEPs are given a €304 a day "subsistence" allowance for when they're on official business. Those at the "top" are good at making us feel that those at the "bottom" are the cause of our issues. | |||
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"It isn't really an issue as very few (if any) other EU country's have a system of in work benefit anything like tax credits. Because they just don't want it or because they don't have as much need for it? I think that would vary from country to country. But don't think that everyone in Germany for example are all earning megabucks. There are plenty of full time jobs here that pay less that 1000€ (£760) per month. " Forgot to add. That is gross. | |||
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"We have got ourselves into an awful pickle over this. The basic benefits system was designed as a safety net for people who through no fault of their own have fallen in to hard times and very laudable it is to have such a system. The system progressed and as a thing to be fulfilled on the wish list of things which at the time we thought the country could afford the in works benefit system became established. The trouble is like all these things we all start to think they are an entitlement and lord help us if we all don't get our entitlement. It was designed during a time when mass migration was not such a problem. No one could have imagined that whole countries could empty as a result of the actions of extremist thugs. So I put it that in work benefits should be a discretionary payment. We can't afford the taxes needed to subsidise every person that wants to come here. There's no way we can so I think it's right to put some new rules in place. Sorry if that's harsh but there's just not enough money to go round. " Well said | |||
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"It isn't really an issue as very few (if any) other EU country's have a system of in work benefit anything like tax credits. Because they just don't want it or because they don't have as much need for it? I think that would vary from country to country. But don't think that everyone in Germany for example are all earning megabucks. There are plenty of full time jobs here that pay less that 1000€ (£760) per month. " A lot of full time employees must be working for less than the minimum wage then. | |||
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"We have got ourselves into an awful pickle over this. The basic benefits system was designed as a safety net for people who through no fault of their own have fallen in to hard times and very laudable it is to have such a system. The system progressed and as a thing to be fulfilled on the wish list of things which at the time we thought the country could afford the in works benefit system became established. The trouble is like all these things we all start to think they are an entitlement and lord help us if we all don't get our entitlement. It was designed during a time when mass migration was not such a problem. No one could have imagined that whole countries could empty as a result of the actions of extremist thugs. So I put it that in work benefits should be a discretionary payment. We can't afford the taxes needed to subsidise every person that wants to come here. There's no way we can so I think it's right to put some new rules in place. Sorry if that's harsh but there's just not enough money to go round. " | |||
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"So a family comes over to Uk, husband is a qualified gp. But the wife doesn't work, should she be allowed to claim benefits? Or should she be maid to pay some kind of tax in order to be entitled to benefits? She probably wouldn't be entitled to anything as her husband's earnings would disqualify her. That would depend on earnings wouldn't it? Even still shouldn't people have to pay into a system before being entitled. If you didn't pay pension you wouldn't just be handed one. " | |||
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"This is gonna end well "Of course it will. I will wait for post No 174 then lob in the last word.  | |||
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"It isn't really an issue as very few (if any) other EU country's have a system of in work benefit anything like tax credits. Because they just don't want it or because they don't have as much need for it? I think that would vary from country to country. But don't think that everyone in Germany for example are all earning megabucks. There are plenty of full time jobs here that pay less that 1000€ (£760) per month. " . Germany has had plenty of regulations over the years that suppress living costs... Keeping them down, keeps wages down!. That's why I say George Osborne doesn't have a fucking clue what he's doing.... Rising costs, whatever they are, always transfer through in the end. If you earnt 30k here I doubt your standard of living would be much different that the German earning 15k | |||
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"It isn't really an issue as very few (if any) other EU country's have a system of in work benefit anything like tax credits. Because they just don't want it or because they don't have as much need for it? I think that would vary from country to country. But don't think that everyone in Germany for example are all earning megabucks. There are plenty of full time jobs here that pay less that 1000€ (£760) per month. A lot of full time employees must be working for less than the minimum wage then. " It's very easy to read the headline rate (8.50€ per hour) and work that out. Read a bit deeper and you will find the exclusions, and there are lots. BTW. The minimum wage in Germany is only just one year old. | |||
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"It isn't really an issue as very few (if any) other EU country's have a system of in work benefit anything like tax credits. Because they just don't want it or because they don't have as much need for it? I think that would vary from country to country. But don't think that everyone in Germany for example are all earning megabucks. There are plenty of full time jobs here that pay less that 1000€ (£760) per month. . Germany has had plenty of regulations over the years that suppress living costs... Keeping them down, keeps wages down!. That's why I say George Osborne doesn't have a fucking clue what he's doing.... Rising costs, whatever they are, always transfer through in the end. If you earnt 30k here I doubt your standard of living would be much different that the German earning 15k" I wouldn't say the gap is that wide but I get where you are coming from. The biggest difference is the cost of housing. Generally Germans pay nothing like UK prices for rents or house/flat purchase, especially when compared to the south east UK. | |||
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" It's very easy to read the headline rate (8.50€ per hour) and work that out. Read a bit deeper and you will find the exclusions, and there are lots. " I've just read them and there aren't "lots" from what I've read. The main exceptions seem to be certain apprentices or interns and those in their first 6 months of employment after being considered long term unemployed. Certain industries who have previously had lower minimum wages (hairdressing etc) will have until 2017 to `transition into the new minimum rate. But those industries would have been on more than €1000 gross. | |||
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" It's very easy to read the headline rate (8.50€ per hour) and work that out. Read a bit deeper and you will find the exclusions, and there are lots. I've just read them and there aren't "lots" from what I've read. The main exceptions seem to be certain apprentices or interns and those in their first 6 months of employment after being considered long term unemployed. Certain industries who have previously had lower minimum wages (hairdressing etc) will have until 2017 to `transition into the new minimum rate. But those industries would have been on more than €1000 gross. " Meanwhile in the real world outside Wiki........ | |||
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" It's very easy to read the headline rate (8.50€ per hour) and work that out. Read a bit deeper and you will find the exclusions, and there are lots. I've just read them and there aren't "lots" from what I've read. The main exceptions seem to be certain apprentices or interns and those in their first 6 months of employment after being considered long term unemployed. Certain industries who have previously had lower minimum wages (hairdressing etc) will have until 2017 to `transition into the new minimum rate. But those industries would have been on more than €1000 gross. Meanwhile in the real world outside Wiki........" Not from Wiki, but you keep peddling those untruths. | |||
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"It isn't really an issue as very few (if any) other EU country's have a system of in work benefit anything like tax credits. Because they just don't want it or because they don't have as much need for it? I think that would vary from country to country. But don't think that everyone in Germany for example are all earning megabucks. There are plenty of full time jobs here that pay less that 1000€ (£760) per month. . Germany has had plenty of regulations over the years that suppress living costs... Keeping them down, keeps wages down!. That's why I say George Osborne doesn't have a fucking clue what he's doing.... Rising costs, whatever they are, always transfer through in the end. If you earnt 30k here I doubt your standard of living would be much different that the German earning 15k I wouldn't say the gap is that wide but I get where you are coming from. The biggest difference is the cost of housing. Generally Germans pay nothing like UK prices for rents or house/flat purchase, especially when compared to the south east UK." . Biggest expenditure a worker has, followed by a car! Now let's look at what's happened in the uk for the last 40 years!! Houses up, rent up, petrol up, insurance up, vat up.... Guess where wages are going?. It's OK they have a master plan to crush our currency value to bring back competitiveness...  | |||
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" It's very easy to read the headline rate (8.50€ per hour) and work that out. Read a bit deeper and you will find the exclusions, and there are lots. I've just read them and there aren't "lots" from what I've read. The main exceptions seem to be certain apprentices or interns and those in their first 6 months of employment after being considered long term unemployed. Certain industries who have previously had lower minimum wages (hairdressing etc) will have until 2017 to `transition into the new minimum rate. But those industries would have been on more than €1000 gross. Meanwhile in the real world outside Wiki........ Not from Wiki, but you keep peddling those untruths. " Simple really. I'm actually at the sharp end in Germany not nearly 1000 miles away reading Utopian rules from the internet. | |||
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"According to the news, the UK is closing in on the Conservatives plans to restrict in work benefits to EU immigrants for first four years of living here. Hoping it will deter some immigrants coming here. I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely. And won't some of the other EU countries want to apply the same rules to our citizens who work in their country? " Well, if we have a shortage they will have a job so they dont need benefits...if the job is so low paid they need in work benefits the pay will havevto rise. But benefits are not the major issue. The main issues are round lack of democracy and repatriation of powers. | |||
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"My question would be if they come, have no jobs or benefits how will they live?!! " They aren't supposed to come with no job or money to see them over until they get a job. They can't live on the street and they aren't eligible for benefits. What some do is bring some money and live with family and friends until they get settled. | |||
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"Does any one know were all the money comes from to pay these benefits. Will tell you were a lot comes from these poor ladies that got a letter 4 year,s ago when they were 58 out the blue telling them they have no state pension till they are 66 most had worked 40 years plus. They had planed there retirement some are lucky had private pensions to start at 60. Alot of these poor ladies wont see 66 what a result the fucking government has got" Good! It was time for the special privilege to stop. A lot of pensioners are having their benefits paid for by people working today above what they paid in, many of them immigrants, I hope they're grateful. | |||
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"My question would be if they come, have no jobs or benefits how will they live?!! They aren't supposed to come with no job or money to see them over until they get a job. They can't live on the street and they aren't eligible for benefits. What some do is bring some money and live with family and friends until they get settled. " Thats right. Its the height of arrogance to land on someones doorstep and say "feed me" | |||
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"Does any one know were all the money comes from to pay these benefits. Will tell you were a lot comes from these poor ladies that got a letter 4 year,s ago when they were 58 out the blue telling them they have no state pension till they are 66 most had worked 40 years plus. They had planed there retirement some are lucky had private pensions to start at 60. Alot of these poor ladies wont see 66 what a result the fucking government has got Good! It was time for the special privilege to stop. A lot of pensioners are having their benefits paid for by people working today above what they paid in, many of them immigrants, I hope they're grateful. " what privilege do pensioners get please tell me very interested | |||
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"Does any one know were all the money comes from to pay these benefits. Will tell you were a lot comes from these poor ladies that got a letter 4 year,s ago when they were 58 out the blue telling them they have no state pension till they are 66 most had worked 40 years plus. They had planed there retirement some are lucky had private pensions to start at 60. Alot of these poor ladies wont see 66 what a result the fucking government has got Good! It was time for the special privilege to stop. A lot of pensioners are having their benefits paid for by people working today above what they paid in, many of them immigrants, I hope they're grateful. what privilege do pensioners get please tell me very interested " The privilege of women retiring earlier than men. | |||
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"According to the news, the UK is closing in on the Conservatives plans to restrict in work benefits to EU immigrants for first four years of living here. Hoping it will deter some immigrants coming here. I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely. And won't some of the other EU countries want to apply the same rules to our citizens who work in their country? " Actually. I dont get it. A couple posting (actually one half) and speaking for him/herself without identifying themself and expressing a view with 'I'. Are you of one opinion or are you assuming the other half agrees. If so say we. If not. Say "john here" or "jill here". | |||
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"have worked in Germany and france.....you cant claim their dole/bennies ....but you can in our soft country......" How strange then that stats came out last year showing 6000+ Brits claiming benefits in Germany and 3000+ claiming in France. | |||
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"yes but check out the period to get these and how long you can claim for....in france only 2 years...." You just said in your previous post that Brits can't claim in France at all... now you're saying they can for 2 years. Someone's pants must be up in flames! | |||
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"have worked in Germany and france.....you cant claim their dole/bennies ....but you can in our soft country...... How strange then that stats came out last year showing 6000+ Brits claiming benefits in Germany and 3000+ claiming in France. " So that's 9,000 from a combined population of around 150 million. Hardly shocking stuff. Also they will be Brits that have lived and worked here for some considerable time. You cannot just turn up here and jump straight onto benefits. | |||
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"have worked in Germany and france.....you cant claim their dole/bennies ....but you can in our soft country...... How strange then that stats came out last year showing 6000+ Brits claiming benefits in Germany and 3000+ claiming in France. " Oh I forgot. You seem to be good at looking up figures so would you care to look up the number of non British EU citizens who are claiming in the UK. Thought not. | |||
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"have worked in Germany and france.....you cant claim their dole/bennies ....but you can in our soft country...... How strange then that stats came out last year showing 6000+ Brits claiming benefits in Germany and 3000+ claiming in France. Oh I forgot. You seem to be good at looking up figures so would you care to look up the number of non British EU citizens who are claiming in the UK. Thought not." Read it for yourself http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jan/19/-sp-thou_ands-britons-claim-benefits-eu | |||
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"According to the news, the UK is closing in on the Conservatives plans to restrict in work benefits to EU immigrants for first four years of living here. Hoping it will deter some immigrants coming here. I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely. And won't some of the other EU countries want to apply the same rules to our citizens who work in their country? I worked in Germany and was not allowed to touch their welfare system for 2 years. I lost my job, I moved back to the UK. It seems to work *shrug* I think it's a good idea "I do too | |||
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"have worked in Germany and france.....you cant claim their dole/bennies ....but you can in our soft country...... How strange then that stats came out last year showing 6000+ Brits claiming benefits in Germany and 3000+ claiming in France. Oh I forgot. You seem to be good at looking up figures so would you care to look up the number of non British EU citizens who are claiming in the UK. Thought not. Read it for yourself http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jan/19/-sp-thou_ands-britons-claim-benefits-eu" OK I have read that a total of 30,000 Brits are claiming benefits across the EU. With a population of 500 million I would say that is a very tiny drop in the ocean. Funny thing was that the Guardian (don't you just love 'em) had sent out a search party to find the one, yes ONE Brit claiming benefit in Poland LOL. But did you produce the numbers to the question I asked? As I said before. Thought not. | |||
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"I'm going to hold my hand up and say... Benefits were/are to generous!. I work in lots of places where I see the daily slackers, just to be clear these are the people with a slightly bad back, or a slight bit of depression, there not genuinely infirmed unlike alot of people that are. I've worked in flats and houses, where I've known people for years who quite happily will tell you theres no way they could get a job, they would need £300 a week to get what they've got now... I actually point out that, they might get much more 5,10 or 15 years down the line.. The sad thing is, they seem to have quite happily settled for the life they have in their little flat all day, watching shite daytime TV, rarely if ever taking a holiday, don't go to the pictures, drink from cider at home or homebrew and there whiling away there life with this shit... Like that's great!... And we then think, there getting a free life, in a way they are but it isn't a "free" life anyone with an ounce of sense would choose. Somehow, we've got to change people's expectations of what "life" could be like if there'd just get off their arse and try. Frankly no gov has ever managed to motivate that underclass because that task is incredibly difficult and requires wholesale changes.. And voters don't like change! So every year is like groundhog day" What a bloody good post | |||
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"have worked in Germany and france.....you cant claim their dole/bennies ....but you can in our soft country...... How strange then that stats came out last year showing 6000+ Brits claiming benefits in Germany and 3000+ claiming in France. Oh I forgot. You seem to be good at looking up figures so would you care to look up the number of non British EU citizens who are claiming in the UK. Thought not. Read it for yourself http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jan/19/-sp-thou_ands-britons-claim-benefits-eu" As I said thought not, so I have done it for you. While the Guardian (as you would expect) try their best to spin it down the official figure (2013) is between 195,000 and 235,000 out of 525,000. http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/datablog/2015/nov/10/eu-migrants-on-benefits-separating-the-statistics-from-the-spin | |||
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"My question would be if they come, have no jobs or benefits how will they live?!! They'll either turn to crime or they'll leave (most people are hoping it's the latter). " Well said.. | |||
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"I find it very strange that we have to seek the permission of the EU to spend our own money however we see fit. Regardless which side of the fence a person sits." And don't forget we have to pay them for the privilege of asking them as well LoL | |||
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"The reality of in work benefits is tax payers subsidising shareholders by allowing them to pay below living wage wages, They are not unique to the UK, and for some reason are actually popular with politicians. But most countries in the EU have a contributory system. If they re-wrote the rules to make our system a contributory one, then backdated the start of the qualifying period by the same amount the net effect would be exactly what they are asking for, with no need to negotiate with the EU. and minimal effective loss for UK citizens. but of course that wouldn't spin very well or make it look like our PM was fighting for us. plus the newspapers would have to search for something else to write about!" . Yes but that's the whole point of in work benefits, it's a subsidy to businesses!, that's how were making loads of jobs... Jobs that need subsidies!.. Ahh but then you need austerity to pay for the subsidy and we all sing along like before .
Cronie capitalism is no better than communism, the net result is that all the wealth ends up in the hands of the few, the only difference being, they hide that fact better | |||
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"We have tier 1 visa friends (highly skilled route) from Russia and India both earning £150K ish and paying £65K a year tax (probably paid in 500k each) and are entitled to Zero benefits if they lost there jobs tomorrow (and will have to pay all NHS costs if required soon also) Not everyone coming to the uk are here for benefits !!!! This thread makes me sad" So this issue does not affect your friends at all? | |||
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"According to the news, the UK is closing in on the Conservatives plans to restrict in work benefits to EU immigrants for first four years of living here. Hoping it will deter some immigrants coming here. I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely. And won't some of the other EU countries want to apply the same rules to our citizens who work in their country? " ......because like Australia we should only be looking for skilled workers that can benefit this country , not encouraging the dregs of society | |||
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"We have tier 1 visa friends (highly skilled route) from Russia and India both earning £150K ish and paying £65K a year tax (probably paid in 500k each) and are entitled to Zero benefits if they lost there jobs tomorrow (and will have to pay all NHS costs if required soon also) Not everyone coming to the uk are here for benefits !!!! This thread makes me sad" This maybe true but these are a minority group, because of their jobs and pay grade they wouldn't need benefits anyway. Also we could have highly skilled workers here but average joes cannot afford the tuition fees anymore (that's another thread for another day) | |||
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"One of the points that was made in the Guardian article quoted above was that the HMRC method of counting migrant families includes families where one partner is a British national and the other a foreign national. The entire family of a UK citizen marrying a foreign national will be counted in the figures for migrant families. Let's say a UK citizen marries a German, and works in Germany (or anywhere else outside the UK) then returns to the UK to live. He and his entire family will be counted in the figures as migrant families. People with marital situations very similar to _otlovefun42 would be counted as economic migrants on returning to the UK and, if falling on hard times, would have restricted benefits along with all other economic migrants. The Guardian was asking if that was really fair on people like _otlovefun42, though what they actually said was "Britons could be caught in policies to restrict tax credits for EU migrants" and didn't mention them in particular." Just seems like the usual muddy the water routine to me. I'm surprised you haven't brought up my little parody from the summer again. After recent events maybe I should re-write it. There are lots of things I could add. | |||
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"One of the points that was made in the Guardian article quoted above was that the HMRC method of counting migrant families includes families where one partner is a British national and the other a foreign national. The entire family of a UK citizen marrying a foreign national will be counted in the figures for migrant families. Let's say a UK citizen marries a German, and works in Germany (or anywhere else outside the UK) then returns to the UK to live. He and his entire family will be counted in the figures as migrant families. People with marital situations very similar to _otlovefun42 would be counted as economic migrants on returning to the UK and, if falling on hard times, would have restricted benefits along with all other economic migrants. The Guardian was asking if that was really fair on people like _otlovefun42, though what they actually said was "Britons could be caught in policies to restrict tax credits for EU migrants" and didn't mention them in particular. Just seems like the usual muddy the water routine to me. I'm surprised you haven't brought up my little parody from the summer again. After recent events maybe I should re-write it. There are lots of things I could add." It seems that you didn't bother to read any more than a headline and you even managed to misinterpret that. You should be encouraged by all to practise your story writing. It shows your true colours and lack of understanding of the term parody. Try to include in it the irony that that if you return to this country it will be as an economic migrant family. | |||
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"One of the points that was made in the Guardian article quoted above was that the HMRC method of counting migrant families includes families where one partner is a British national and the other a foreign national. The entire family of a UK citizen marrying a foreign national will be counted in the figures for migrant families. Let's say a UK citizen marries a German, and works in Germany (or anywhere else outside the UK) then returns to the UK to live. He and his entire family will be counted in the figures as migrant families. People with marital situations very similar to _otlovefun42 would be counted as economic migrants on returning to the UK and, if falling on hard times, would have restricted benefits along with all other economic migrants. The Guardian was asking if that was really fair on people like _otlovefun42, though what they actually said was "Britons could be caught in policies to restrict tax credits for EU migrants" and didn't mention them in particular. Just seems like the usual muddy the water routine to me. I'm surprised you haven't brought up my little parody from the summer again. After recent events maybe I should re-write it. There are lots of things I could add. It seems that you didn't bother to read any more than a headline and you even managed to misinterpret that. You should be encouraged by all to practise your story writing. It shows your true colours and lack of understanding of the term parody. Try to include in it the irony that that if you return to this country it will be as an economic migrant family." I make no secret of my true colours. I am strongly against MASS immigration. I do not see any advantage only a huge heap of disadvantages. I warned in the summer of the folly, no damn right stupidity, of allowing hundreds of thou_ands of young men to rampage, YES RAMPAGE, across Europe. But of course you and others accused me of scaremongering (and worse) Well since then we have had Cologne and dozens of other German cities plunged into fear by these so called Syrian refugees. We've seen a young girl murdered in Sweden by a 15 year old Somalian (if he is 15 I'm 21) Oh and lets not forget the slaughter of 130 innocents in Paris. Finally the dumb fucking idiot politicians have realised that their gross stupidity has bitten them on the arse and now decided to do something. Sweden is sending 80,000 back, Finland 20,000 and only this morning Germany has announced that all from Morocco, Algeria, and Tunisia have to go. I have always said that genuine refugees from Syria have to be helped but anyone using that as an excuse for opening the floodgates to all and sundry should be bloody well ashamed of themselves. Not only for the problems it causes to the native population but also the obvious backlash that would hurt the genuine people seeking safety. Now I will surprise you. I personally have done more for genuine Syrian refugees than you or probably anyone else on this site. We now have two Syrian families in our flats and myself, wife, and stepson have spent most of the last 3 weeks helping them with paperwork, finding furniture, and generally settling in. There is still a bit to do but hey ho we will stick with it. That doesn't mean however that I will ever change my view that mass immigration is wrong. It is and funnily enough even the Syrians agree that there are far too many chancer's and dodge pots (around 60% if the latest German government figures are to be believed ) jumping on the bandwagon of Syria's problem. I am fully aware that your view is to allow anyone to go anywhere I just genuinely hope it doesn't bite you on the arse one day. | |||
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"I make no secret of my true colours. I am strongly against MASS immigration. I do not see any advantage only a huge heap of disadvantages. I warned in the summer of the folly, no damn right stupidity, of allowing hundreds of thou_ands of young men to rampage, YES RAMPAGE, across Europe. But of course you and others accused me of scaremongering (and worse) Well since then we have had Cologne and dozens of other German cities plunged into fear by these so called Syrian refugees. We've seen a young girl murdered in Sweden by a 15 year old Somalian (if he is 15 I'm 21) Oh and lets not forget the slaughter of 130 innocents in Paris. Finally the dumb fucking idiot politicians have realised that their gross stupidity has bitten them on the arse and now decided to do something. Sweden is sending 80,000 back, Finland 20,000 and only this morning Germany has announced that all from Morocco, Algeria, and Tunisia have to go. I have always said that genuine refugees from Syria have to be helped but anyone using that as an excuse for opening the floodgates to all and sundry should be bloody well ashamed of themselves. Not only for the problems it causes to the native population but also the obvious backlash that would hurt the genuine people seeking safety. Now I will surprise you. I personally have done more for genuine Syrian refugees than you or probably anyone else on this site. We now have two Syrian families in our flats and myself, wife, and stepson have spent most of the last 3 weeks helping them with paperwork, finding furniture, and generally settling in. There is still a bit to do but hey ho we will stick with it. That doesn't mean however that I will ever change my view that mass immigration is wrong. It is and funnily enough even the Syrians agree that there are far too many chancer's and dodge pots (around 60% if the latest German government figures are to be believed ) jumping on the bandwagon of Syria's problem. I am fully aware that your view is to allow anyone to go anywhere I just genuinely hope it doesn't bite you on the arse one day."
Well done you two. Totally agree we should do as we are doing and bring the REAL refugees over from the camps in Jordan and Lebanon especially those poor kids. Carry on funding those camps so they are at least dry and get fed (£1.1 Billion and we are the highest EU donor). And more importantly make sure those illegal migrants and criminals in Calais are sent back. Merkel showed how stupid an open door policy was and how right we have been to keep them out. We have an honourable record of caring for those in need. We need apologise to no one regardless of the tripe the Lefties talk. | |||
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"I don't get it. We encourage immigrants for certain occupations as we have a shortage. How can we limit it for some and not others. It's discrimination surely " well we don't actually encourage anyone to come here. Quite the contrary. Its just as far as the EU is concerned we have no choice. So a Romanian family of 6 can come here and we have to house them and pay them £300 a week to live. Just like that. Oh and if a daughter gets up the chuff and has her baby here she can trundle of back to Bucharest and buy a nice flat on the Child benefit we will kindly send to her bank account every week. Bless .... Meanwhile a trained Canadian doctor who wants to come here is banned because we a) have to give priority to a Bulgarian non-English speaking one and b) we have to keep the numbers down as schools, health, housing systems are overloaded. I am no 'kipper' but Farage has hit it dead right. We do NOT stop immigration but we select a) what skills we do need and b) find people on a points based system to fill those needs. And no one else. We do still of course take in GENUINE Asylum Seekers. We really don't need a Romanian child thief pickpocketing in Oxford Street in preference to an Aussie nurse.... | |||
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" We really don't need a Romanian child thief pickpocketing in Oxford Street in preference to an Aussie nurse...." true .... we allready have a an organised gang of 330 pick pockets operating across the whole of the UK .... they're called the government ..... and we already have 500,000 aussies overstaying on visas but nobody notices them.... just saying | |||
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"One of the points that was made in the Guardian article quoted above was that the HMRC method of counting migrant families includes families where one partner is a British national and the other a foreign national. The entire family of a UK citizen marrying a foreign national will be counted in the figures for migrant families. Let's say a UK citizen marries a German, and works in Germany (or anywhere else outside the UK) then returns to the UK to live. He and his entire family will be counted in the figures as migrant families. People with marital situations very similar to _otlovefun42 would be counted as economic migrants on returning to the UK and, if falling on hard times, would have restricted benefits along with all other economic migrants. The Guardian was asking if that was really fair on people like _otlovefun42, though what they actually said was "Britons could be caught in policies to restrict tax credits for EU migrants" and didn't mention them in particular. Just seems like the usual muddy the water routine to me. I'm surprised you haven't brought up my little parody from the summer again. After recent events maybe I should re-write it. There are lots of things I could add. It seems that you didn't bother to read any more than a headline and you even managed to misinterpret that. You should be encouraged by all to practise your story writing. It shows your true colours and lack of understanding of the term parody. Try to include in it the irony that that if you return to this country it will be as an economic migrant family. I make no secret of my true colours. I am strongly against MASS immigration. I do not see any advantage only a huge heap of disadvantages. I warned in the summer of the folly, no damn right stupidity, of allowing hundreds of thou_ands of young men to rampage, YES RAMPAGE, across Europe. But of course you and others accused me of scaremongering (and worse) Well since then we have had Cologne and dozens of other German cities plunged into fear by these so called Syrian refugees. We've seen a young girl murdered in Sweden by a 15 year old Somalian (if he is 15 I'm 21) Oh and lets not forget the slaughter of 130 innocents in Paris. Finally the dumb fucking idiot politicians have realised that their gross stupidity has bitten them on the arse and now decided to do something. Sweden is sending 80,000 back, Finland 20,000 and only this morning Germany has announced that all from Morocco, Algeria, and Tunisia have to go. I have always said that genuine refugees from Syria have to be helped but anyone using that as an excuse for opening the floodgates to all and sundry should be bloody well ashamed of themselves. Not only for the problems it causes to the native population but also the obvious backlash that would hurt the genuine people seeking safety. Now I will surprise you. I personally have done more for genuine Syrian refugees than you or probably anyone else on this site. We now have two Syrian families in our flats and myself, wife, and stepson have spent most of the last 3 weeks helping them with paperwork, finding furniture, and generally settling in. There is still a bit to do but hey ho we will stick with it. That doesn't mean however that I will ever change my view that mass immigration is wrong. It is and funnily enough even the Syrians agree that there are far too many chancer's and dodge pots (around 60% if the latest German government figures are to be believed ) jumping on the bandwagon of Syria's problem. I am fully aware that your view is to allow anyone to go anywhere I just genuinely hope it doesn't bite you on the arse one day." You're not full aware of my view - you've never actually bothered to listen to it. You've been too busy throwing "loony left red tied Guardian reading sandal wearing" insults at anyone who's challenged your more xenophobic or openly racist posts to actually listen to people who are suggesting following the rule the law - including the way we treat those who have no right to refugee status. Please don't go to any trouble to write a new 'parody' for the rest of us until you've read your previous one to your Syrian tenants. Do though tell us all how they chuckle at your jokes in your previous story about wives and children being "beheaded/crucified/gang raped/chucked off high building" or how after a few weeks on the road their father "turns up in Britain/Germany/Sweden Joins FAB or local equivalent and forgets all about wife and kids" You probably don't see how hard it is to believe someone who comes up with a promise to produce more rubbish like that and then claims to be helping Syrians. Still as I suppose they say "there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who need no repentance" | |||
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"Never met anyone from this country who as gone abroad to clam benefits but will take your word for it " Not quite the same, but a friend of the family kept a registered adress in the UK for all the years they lived in Portugal. They moved out there when they both retired, but kept coming back for medical treatment. On a different note there are quite a few workers in our place have had a child in this country then the mother and baby have gone back home, still claim the child benefits are what ever they are called now. | |||
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" No need to claim benefits if taxpayers fund her salary as his bogus assistant (when he was on his high horse about putting British workers 1st) , did you watch the panorama programme about him ?" Yes I did and it was an excellent piece of biased BBC journalism .. but hey ... Oh right so the man employs his wife but he gets slagged off because she is German? Just now I am sure you were all for allowing everyone in and claiming benefits. Oh and he is paid by European taxpayers not British taxpayers so our contribution to Mrs Farage will be 1/28th of her cost. Now remind us again how many Labour MPs were caught with their hands in the expenses till and how many went to jail? As I said I am no 'kipper' but it makes me smile how few people take him on about his policies on immigration and the EU because he is totally right. So what you Lefties and EU luvvies do is play the person and make personally abusive remarks and find 'stories' about him personally. It doesn't improve your arguments ... | |||
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"My question would be if they come, have no jobs or benefits how will they live?!! " simple answer really we stop being a soft touch,they dont get to come,cant see the problem with looking after our own first | |||
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"So a family comes over to Uk, husband is a qualified gp. But the wife doesn't work, should she be allowed to claim benefits? Or should she be maid to pay some kind of tax in order to be entitled to benefits? She probably wouldn't be entitled to anything as her husband's earnings would disqualify her. That would depend on earnings wouldn't it? Even still shouldn't people have to pay into a system before being entitled. If you didn't pay pension you wouldn't just be handed one. Well a GP makes a salary at least twice the national average so I doubt they'd qualify. In theory you can get a pension without paying in, if you spend what would have been your working life unemployed. If people are having to pay in for an amount of time to qualify for benefits then I hope no school leavers find themselves unemployed, that could really affect their future. " This is the problem. The only way they can get this through the EU laws is if it applies to british people too. | |||
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" As I said I am no 'kipper' " ... but your statistics always smell fishy | |||
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" As I said I am no 'kipper' ... but your statistics always smell fishy " | |||
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