FabSwingers.com forum: Renewable energy policy

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Once again, what the government say and what they do are two different things!

This one in particular seems hell bent on wrecking any hopes for carbon cuts!

It's hardly surprising

They say we'll sort out housing.. Were at the lowest home ownership in thirty five years!

Sort out immigration... Goes through the roof

Jobs... Lowest labour participation in a generation

Debt.. Higher than ever

Trade deficit.. Higher than ever

Uni fees trebled

Yes everything's great really don't look at the small print, just keep drinking your beer and watching celebritys dance... Trust us we'll sort it!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It is standard policy now.

If it doesn't make an instant profit for big business,then it has to cut to the bone.

Over 4 years to go and only the tip of the iceberg has been revealed.

Lots and lots of Chinese investment,over the next couple of years,as they bring in even more foreign investment and let us slide into more dependency on those countries that want to earn big profits from our low wage culture.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Tell a lie often enough and it becomes the truth.

Everything's fucked up. Has been for a long time if we're honest.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"It is standard policy now.

If it doesn't make an instant profit for big business,then it has to cut to the bone.

Over 4 years to go and only the tip of the iceberg has been revealed.

"
.

Hit the nail on the head there!

The trouble with short sided profit driven policies is... They have a habit of coming back to bite you on the arse (banking).

Business's with its monetary influence has way to much say in politics and the first step to make things improve is disconnecting business and politics and then getting sensible long term plans for infrastructure!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Separating business and politics,is just a fantasy.

To many MPs see the job as a part time job,that is a stepping stone into high paying consultancy and directorships.

Super low tax, super low wage costs, and huge incentives on offer.

Is it any wonder all our big companies are foreign owned.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Separating business and politics,is just a fantasy.

To many MPs see the job as a part time job,that is a stepping stone into high paying consultancy and directorships.

Super low tax, super low wage costs, and huge incentives on offer.

Is it any wonder all our big companies are foreign owned.

"
.

The US is having this same debate, well they are if you listen to the sensible politicans!.

The trouble with listening business influencing politics is what's best for businesses is not necessarily best for a country, people or the earth

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

New Nuclear power stations being built,while we still have to decide how to deal with waste from the ones that already exist.

Clean energy they claim,well maybe we should simply store the waste in the gardens of those that vote for it.

The cost of decommissioning the existing ones, is more than we are actually in debt.

Still there are huge profits to be made by Chinese consortiums, so it must be good for the country and the planet

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Exactly the subsidy being given to the Chinese for hinkley is bigger than the subsidies we were giving renewables!

Plus the carbon output of building the damn thing is worth 12 years of running a gas powered one let alone renewables

Just as the rest of the world is getting geared for renewables the uk is regressing

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The person with the biggest bank account,will always win, in a capitalist

run country.

While the rest of worlds countries clean up their own back yard, UK plc. welcome them all to dump their crap in ours.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Before considering a renewable energy policy that might best suit our nations present and future needs I think it's worth a quick Google of "Saul Griffiths Climate Change Recalculated the terawatt world"

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I work in the reviewable energy sector. And know first had it is possible to generate power without waste while also making a very good profit... If the government focused their efforts in the right direction everyone can Benefit

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

While the rest of the world burns coal to make electricity, the UK burns bridges that can never be fully rebuilt.

Headlines that state,we can just about keep the lights on.

Another bunch of lunatics is planning to build a railway that needs even more electricity

I think I must be the only person that reads all this and thinks its part of a new script for "Blackadder"

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Before considering a renewable energy policy that might best suit our nations present and future needs I think it's worth a quick Google of "Saul Griffiths Climate Change Recalculated the terawatt world"

"
.

I've read alot of sauls stuff, brilliantly clever bloke in lots of ways! Of course he fully realises we can't even think about using all the fossil fuels if we want to stave off the worse off climate change!

In fact I think he calculated it to using a maximum of 30% of the known reserves of oil and 65% of gas...

Now factor in the fact of how much fossil fuel you'll use just changing the system...

And guess what, your at his maximum fossil fuel usage

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *arry247Couple
over a year ago

Wakefield

"Exactly the subsidy being given to the Chinese for hinkley is bigger than the subsidies we were giving renewables!

Plus the carbon output of building the damn thing is worth 12 years of running a gas powered one let alone renewables

Just as the rest of the world is getting geared for renewables the uk is regressing

Yes but unlike renewables it will be able to supply a decent amount of electricity. Renewables are ok for topping up but cannot meet the needs of a nation.

As for cutting carbon why waste money trying, it does not make any difference to climate change, water vapour has more effect.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Exactly the subsidy being given to the Chinese for hinkley is bigger than the subsidies we were giving renewables!

Plus the carbon output of building the damn thing is worth 12 years of running a gas powered one let alone renewables

Just as the rest of the world is getting geared for renewables the uk is regressing

Yes but unlike renewables it will be able to supply a decent amount of electricity. Renewables are ok for topping up but cannot meet the needs of a nation.

As for cutting carbon why waste money trying, it does not make any difference to climate change, water vapour has more effect."
.

What you mean renewables like the dam used by Holland to produce a continuous supply of electricity or the hoover dam or the Aswan dam or do you mean the continuous supply of electric generated by geothermal in Iceland and other countries, or there's renewables from solar, that don't require sunshine or if you really want to go down the road of nuclear energy, you could use a completely different type of rector like thorium, which is inherently safer and could help with the supply of rare earths....

As for carbon not effecting climate... Well, I'm afraid your science is very poor, it's been proven for about errr 130 years!

Water vapour is the biggest forcer of course and that is the reason you need to worry about warming the planet through carbon output.. As a warmer planet has more water vapour, it's a knock on effect of the effect of carbon... Like methane locked in frozen tundra and sea beds, once you warm it enough to unlock that then you release loads of methane which is as bad as water vapour, or you warm it enough to melt ice caps and they stop reflecting sunlight, so more warming again, that's why they call it runaway climate change,its like an avalanche you push a tiny little bit of snow down the hill and the rest is done for you!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hello SexyBum,

keep repeating something doesn't make it true. It is not any more than a hypothesis and ignores so many other factors that cannot be quantified in their 'models' See if you can Google Patrick Moore's recent speech?

The effort put into renewables is largely wasted in the U.K. as they are simply ineffective and save little carbon in practice. Hydro is very good given suitable geographic characteristics but U.K. is not that well endowed. An interesting web site is gridwatch which shows current power generation in the U.K. by type. Just Google it.

Alec

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My renewable energy policy is thus:

I drink lots of beer

I eat lots of curry

I fart a lot

If I were to capture the farts I could use them to power a CHP unit (combined heat and power)

At the current time I'm not capturing my farts, thus the policy is flawed

But at least I'm doing something

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

The art/science of propaganda has flourished since the Nazis were around.

The solar industry is struggling atm, with companies going out of business, due to changes in the Conservative's policies towards feed-in tariffs. Solar installations will diminish now, when we were becoming a good example to other nations.

Cameron is a spin doctor, a former PR worker/wanker. They had the spin of the greenest government ever - complete bollocks. It's hit and run politics, where they'll do what the paymasters want and not care about the long term damage.

We're in a make or break position with our climate. What we do now will have massive impact upon future global warming levels - whether we increase the warming levels more, or make it happen earlier and for longer and just how catastrophic it will be.

Any intelligent person would assume that if the world is about to near self-destruct civilisation as we know it, due to how we're treating the world, that this would be the biggest priority for world leaders. And that it would get most of their attention. The actual experience seems to be the opposite. So we should judge these people by what they do, not the toxic shite that they pump out of their mouths.

They don't care what really happens to the world in the future, and especially not to the everyday person in the streets in future. Just as they lied before the election about not changing tax credits to make working families worse off, they don't give a damn! These politicians are cushioned from the real world that we live in and have safety nets that we could only dream of.

Look quickly for renewable deals, as the window of opportunity is closing.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Hello SexyBum,

Alec"
.

Hello again Alec

You know hydro and the UK not being suitable ... Well We're an island, there's like sea everywhere

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *itzWoman
over a year ago

south wales

[Removed by poster at 19/10/15 18:45:34]

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *itzWoman
over a year ago

south wales

"Hello SexyBum,

Alec.

Hello again Alec

You know hydro and the UK not being suitable ... Well We're an island, there's like sea everywhere

dont forget all the rivers

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Nuclear is not and never will be SAFE.

We have no idea what to do with the waste other than bury it in someone else's back yard.

If a PM allows new reactors to be built. They and their families should be held responsible for any and all clean up costs.

If this was made law,Britain would never have another nuclear reactor, even if offered free of charge.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm dying to get out of the renewables field..

however, I think the government is actually cheating on their funding...now lots of social housing is getting upgraded energy efficient renewables(air source heat pumps)...so the feed in tariff now goes to....

They've made a mockery out of the renewable market, I'd say mainly just because they really dont want people off the grid, and there was no real actual long term plan to hit any of the carbon reduction targets.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm dying to get out of the renewables field..

*solar feed in tariff goes down 80% in jan..

I think the people missing out are homeowners and those in rural areas.The government has not done enough to highlight or make much of the info easy and accessable.

One of the reasons for the poor solar intake is cheap inefficient chinese panels that have been lying around in warehouses for years..

and the research into solar battery storage has really only recently come to fruitiion, which WILL make solar a much more viable and efficient system!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Tell a lie often enough and it becomes the truth.

Everything's fucked up. Has been for a long time if we're honest."

My cock is 10inches

My cock is 10inches...

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Tell a lie often enough and it becomes the truth.

Everything's fucked up. Has been for a long time if we're honest.

My cock is 10inches

My cock is 10inches..."

They meant "tall tales" not bloody fairy tales.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Once again, what the government say and what they do are two different things!

This one in particular seems hell bent on wrecking any hopes for carbon cuts!

It's hardly surprising

They say we'll sort out housing.. Were at the lowest home ownership in thirty five years!

Sort out immigration... Goes through the roof

Jobs... Lowest labour participation in a generation

Debt.. Higher than ever

Trade deficit.. Higher than ever

Uni fees trebled

Yes everything's great really don't look at the small print, just keep drinking your beer and watching celebritys dance... Trust us we'll sort it!

Sorry. I may be missing the point of the post. What is renewable energy?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Once again, what the government say and what they do are two different things!

This one in particular seems hell bent on wrecking any hopes for carbon cuts!

It's hardly surprising

They say we'll sort out housing.. Were at the lowest home ownership in thirty five years!

Sort out immigration... Goes through the roof

Jobs... Lowest labour participation in a generation

Debt.. Higher than ever

Trade deficit.. Higher than ever

Uni fees trebled

Yes everything's great really don't look at the small print, just keep drinking your beer and watching celebritys dance... Trust us we'll sort it!

This one in particular has only been in the job for a few weeks.

How long do you think it takes to sort out shit like this?

Jeeeeez.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

One of the crazy things are the feed in tarrifs. If you create electricity from wind or tidal in the north of Scotland or anywhere remote area in the UK you are penalised for being away from the centres of population. No matter how green the energy is the companies have to pay to down load the electricity onto the national grid. If you have a manky coal fired power station polluting like fuck near a centre of population then the generating company gets paid for providing the grid with power. That loads the dice against clean green energy , which then requires a subsidy. This is not a sensible energy policy !!!!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Tell a lie often enough and it becomes the truth.

Everything's fucked up. Has been for a long time if we're honest.

My cock is 10inches

My cock is 10inches..."

Not repeated enough yet.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Once again, what the government say and what they do are two different things!

This one in particular seems hell bent on wrecking any hopes for carbon cuts!

It's hardly surprising

They say we'll sort out housing.. Were at the lowest home ownership in thirty five years!

Sort out immigration... Goes through the roof

Jobs... Lowest labour participation in a generation

Debt.. Higher than ever

Trade deficit.. Higher than ever

Uni fees trebled

Yes everything's great really don't look at the small print, just keep drinking your beer and watching celebritys dance... Trust us we'll sort it!

This one in particular has only been in the job for a few weeks.

How long do you think it takes to sort out shit like this?

Jeeeeez."

Think you will find "Dishonest Dave" has been at the helm almost 5 1/2 years. Still yet to decide on a direction though.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Once again, what the government say and what they do are two different things!

This one in particular seems hell bent on wrecking any hopes for carbon cuts!

It's hardly surprising

They say we'll sort out housing.. Were at the lowest home ownership in thirty five years!

Sort out immigration... Goes through the roof

Jobs... Lowest labour participation in a generation

Debt.. Higher than ever

Trade deficit.. Higher than ever

Uni fees trebled

Yes everything's great really don't look at the small print, just keep drinking your beer and watching celebritys dance... Trust us we'll sort it!

Sorry. I may be missing the point of the post. What is renewable energy?"

energy that can be sustainably sourced, solar.wind,hydro,air,bacteria digestion,ground and of course wood

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Once again, what the government say and what they do are two different things!

This one in particular seems hell bent on wrecking any hopes for carbon cuts!

It's hardly surprising

They say we'll sort out housing.. Were at the lowest home ownership in thirty five years!

Sort out immigration... Goes through the roof

Jobs... Lowest labour participation in a generation

Debt.. Higher than ever

Trade deficit.. Higher than ever

Uni fees trebled

Yes everything's great really don't look at the small print, just keep drinking your beer and watching celebritys dance... Trust us we'll sort it!

This one in particular has only been in the job for a few weeks.

How long do you think it takes to sort out shit like this?

Jeeeeez.

Think you will find "Dishonest Dave" has been at the helm almost 5 1/2 years. Still yet to decide on a direction though.

Unless I've been asleep for 5 1/2 years I think you'll find that he was leader of a coalition government where every man and his dog chipped in with their tuppenceworth and deals had to be done.

He's only been in sole charge for a few weeks, as I said...

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire

"They say we'll sort out housing.. Were at the lowest home ownership in thirty five years!"

Blimey, SB, I never thought I'd see the day when you were harping back to "the good old days of Mrs T."

It just goes to show the Tories get everyone in the end...

Mr ddc

Ps, I thought the Greens were for less home-ownership, that we should all be living in Council Housing?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

There's currently about 5gw of available wind generation in the uk. With another 13gw already granted planning. 18gw's of wind alone. Plus another 2-4gw of localised solar (no one is actually sure of the exact figure even the national grid).

That's 22gw of renewable energy. Built because the government paid a subsidy to those companies so they would build it and they will be paying it for years to come even if those installations are not generating. They have to pay £150 per mw to take a wind farm off the grid and keep paying it while they sit and do fek all. Those companies would not have built anything without that subsidy. Because without it they can't make money, because wind is unpredictable therefore you can't have it when you need it only when it is there. Which means they can only make money when it's windy..... 1.5billion overspend on the subsidy budget btw.

Now... All the major generators are shutting state of the art gas plant down. There's a handful of coal plant left only 2 or 3 of which will be left by 2020. Nearly all if not all of the U.K. Nukes have had their life extended already and can't be extended any more without major investment. With only two new ones being built and even they look uncertain right now and arn't going to be online until 2027 at the earliest.

It's February, it gets dark at 4pm and light at 7.30am, It's not windy, it's 6pm, evening demand peeks at 45+gw.

Where the fek are you getting your power from?

If they keep building wind and solar expect your electricity bills to treble (ask the Germans and Swiss). Not to mention do people actually realise how many wind turbines are needed to replace a 2gw station?...

The government is changing the policy because they have to. We need security of supply and at the rate investment in conventional power is leaving this country we are at risk of losing it already.

Anybody that says hydro or thermal in the Uk.... Well just don't because frankly it's ridiculous.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"One of the crazy things are the feed in tarrifs. If you create electricity from wind or tidal in the north of Scotland or anywhere remote area in the UK you are penalised for being away from the centres of population. No matter how green the energy is the companies have to pay to down load the electricity onto the national grid. If you have a manky coal fired power station polluting like fuck near a centre of population then the generating company gets paid for providing the grid with power. That loads the dice against clean green energy , which then requires a subsidy. This is not a sensible energy policy !!!!"

The feed in tariff is what you are paid if you have renewable energy generation installed for excess energy you don't use that you feed back to grid.

ALL major generators pay a connection charge excluding domestic. If you generate in Scotland and try to supply to England you lose energy as it travels. So that 3mw your windmill produced is next to fek all when it gets hundreds of miles away. That's why the big population centres have big power stations around them.

You can have one 2000mw station or nearly 700 onsure wind turbines, per station you want to replace.

Scotland has something like 3000 planning applications going through for onsure wind.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hello Phoenix couple,

well put.

It's quite timely also the reports of steel company losses. High energy consuming companies are severely hampered by the green energy subsidies that put up their fuel costs. We need these companies but make it harder for them to compete.

Alec

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *andS66Couple
over a year ago

Derby

Sorry. I may be missing the point of the post. What is renewable energy?

energy that can be sustainably sourced, solar.wind,hydro,air,bacteria digestion,ground and of course wood"

Renewables aren't necessarily good for the environment. There's been numerous studies, including by the IPCC, that prove that wood, although a renewable, actually produces more GHGs than coal. And one of the GHGs wood produces is Nitrogen Dioxide. Burning wood produces 1/5 the amount of Nitrogen Dioxide as it does Carbon Dioxide. However Nitrogen Dioxide is 300 times more damaging to the environment as CO2. It also produces methane (21 times worse than CO2), and Carbon Monoxide.

And it is extremely land intensive- for an average 3 bedroom house, somewhere between 6 and 10 acres of woodland would be needed, depending upon the type of wood used. So, although theoretically sustainable, in practice wood is neither sustainable nor green.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"Hello Phoenix couple,

well put.

Alec

Tata steel. More industry gone, never to return. 1200 job losses and more product we'll now need to import. Feeling it for those people and their families

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

Sorry. I may be missing the point of the post. What is renewable energy?

energy that can be sustainably sourced, solar.wind,hydro,air,bacteria digestion,ground and of course wood

Yep, you've got to grow it, harvest it and transport it. Same with some of the others as well. Bio oil for example.

When all things taken into account it's worse than coal.

We simply must have diversity of supply.

Certainly you will be looking at the lesser of two evils but the world simply isn't all fairies and butterflies. With the amount of energy we use we can't do it reliably and economically with renewables right now.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *arry247Couple
over a year ago

Wakefield

As for carbon not effecting climate... Well, I'm afraid your science is very poor, it's been proven for about errr 130 years!

When we mentioned a nation we specifically meant the UK.

Here we have hydroelectric schemes in place and have had them for 100 years, including dams, river runs schemes and pumped-storage.

They still only amount to around 1.8% of the UK's total generating capacity.

The problem with hydro is the remoteness of suitable locations and the environmental impact such schemes have.

The earth is still coming out of the last ice age and the tiny effect that mankind has on atmospheric carbon is negligible.

Approximately 750 gigatons of carbon is moving through the carbon cycle (the cycle that takes up and releases carbon from vegetation, land and oceans) each year of this 750 gigatons mankind is responsible for about 29 gigatons.

In the Cambrian period the earth had carbon dioxide concentrations of around 7,000ppm as opposed to a maximum of 400ppm today. Concentrations of around 2000 ppm have been common during the life of earth.

Atmospheric carbon is essential for plant growth (i.e. growing food to feed the staving millions), the more there is the better the crops grow.

Yes an exaggeration but only the same as the claim that man is making a difference to the world with the carbon we produce.

As for your comparison with an avalanche if you knew anything about why avalanches occur you would know they do not occur like that, if they did nothing could travel on a mountain without causing avalanches.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

Right now there is .58 of a gw of hydro on the grid generating. There is only 1gw available in this country. We don't have enough suitable environment on the scale needed, in the places where it's needed.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

The feed in tariff is what you are paid if you have renewable energy generation installed for excess energy you don't use that you feed back to grid.

You can have one 2000mw station or nearly 700 onsure wind turbines, per station you want to replace.

Scotland has something like 3000 planning applications going through for onsure wind."
.

Subsidies on renewables!!

Wtf do you think the 100£ per mw were paying for hinkley is.. Charity

Coal is subsidised, oil, gas, nuclear is the biggest subsidy user of all the generators, Christ wait to you have to pay to decommission them, because as you say there nearing there life span try hundreds of billions of pounds!

Hydro power is perfectly doable in this country, we've got massive tidal rivers like the seven, Thames,fourth, Clyde, number, never mind the huge potential places for sea tidal generation!

The grid runs at extremely high voltages to mitigate losses, yes you'll always gets losses but you certainly don't turn 3mw into fuck all, that's why ask the nuclear plants are stuck out on seaside towns in Remote places

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Right now there is .58 of a gw of hydro on the grid generating. There is only 1gw available in this country. We don't have enough suitable environment on the scale needed, in the places where it's needed."
.

You ever wondered why there's little hydro generation!

Policy making

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

As for carbon not effecting climate... Well, I'm afraid your science is very poor, it's been proven for about errr 130 years!

When we mentioned a nation we specifically meant the UK.

Here we have hydroelectric schemes in place and have had them for 100 years, including dams, river runs schemes and pumped-storage.

They still only amount to around 1.8% of the UK's total generating capacity.

The problem with hydro is the remoteness of suitable locations and the environmental impact such schemes have.

The earth is still coming out of the last ice age and the tiny effect that mankind has on atmospheric carbon is negligible.

Atmospheric carbon is essential for plant growth (i.e. growing food to feed the staving millions), the more there is the better the crops grow.

Yes an exaggeration but only the same as the claim that man is making a difference to the world with the carbon we produce.

"
.

That's a great story, but there's no evidence to back up one word you've wrote.

Try reading what the 22,000 peer reviewed scientific papers have actually concluded!

The Cambrian period was what 500 million years ago?

There was no land life at all at that time, the sun would have been several percent lower in magnitude by any established nuclear theory, with a sun producing far less energy you can guess what..

Have much more c02 concentrations in the atmosphere... In fact if we hadn't had that much c02 with a much dimer sun, you'd never had got the climate to sustain life on land

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

The feed in tariff is what you are paid if you have renewable energy generation installed for excess energy you don't use that you feed back to grid.

You can have one 2000mw station or nearly 700 onsure wind turbines, per station you want to replace.

Scotland has something like 3000 planning applications going through for onsure wind..

Subsidies on renewables!!

Wtf do you think the 100£ per mw were paying for hinkley is.. Charity

Hydro power is perfectly doable in this country, we've got massive tidal rivers like the seven, Thames,fourth, Clyde, number, never mind the huge potential places for sea tidal generation!

No I think the £96 a megawatt minimum the grid are paying on Hinkley (when they run) is what they had to garauntee the conglomerate so they would build it. That's nothing like paying a wind farm £150 a megawatt when it's off!

By 2027 that will be below what it costs to generate anyway. Last week it hit £150 a megawatt at times.

Carbon tax on coal is currently £40 a tonne. the capacity market means everyone is paid to be contracted to supply. How is coal, oil or gas subsidised?

A 3mw wind turbine is Scotland is hardly comparable to the losses of a nuke. They don't get charged any extra to supply from there as implied by the previous poster. They just can't generate enough to mitigate their losses.

Tidal power is nowhere, it's being researched but it does not have the capacity to generate on the scale needed. Yeah it can all be developed but that all takes a lot of time and money. We don't have either.

You still haven't answered my other question.

It's February, 6pm, it's not windy, it's dark, evening peak at 45gw. Where are you getting your power?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

The feed in tariff is what you are paid if you have renewable energy generation installed for excess energy you don't use that you feed back to grid.

You can have one 2000mw station or nearly 700 onsure wind turbines, per station you want to replace.

Scotland has something like 3000 planning applications going through for onsure wind..

Subsidies on renewables!!

Wtf do you think the 100£ per mw were paying for hinkley is.. Charity

Hydro power is perfectly doable in this country, we've got massive tidal rivers like the seven, Thames,fourth, Clyde, number, never mind the huge potential places for sea tidal generation!

By 2027 that will be below what it costs to generate anyway. Last week it hit £150 a megawatt at times.

Carbon tax on coal is currently £40 a tonne. the capacity market means everyone is paid to be contracted to supply. How is coal, oil or gas subsidised?

You still haven't answered my other question.

It's February, 6pm, it's not windy, it's dark, evening peak at 45gw. Where are you getting your power?"
.

Ahh so your question to me is... We've left it too late to do it!

Firstly the green party have been campaigning to change tact on generation for decades, the government have always ignored us!

Secondly the Germans in a period of what 5 years since Fukushima went tits and there own report found there nuclear plants were liable to the same accident have transformed there generating ability!

Yes it's cost them, it's costs them lots, no argument there.. However there own government sustainability report, reported that over aa 50 year period there'd actually be in the black!

You see you keep saying nuclear and I keep saying... How much will it cost to decommission hinkley or even the ones all approaching there end within 15 years!

The answer to your question is to vary your demand as much as possible through using less, using at different times, using moor efficently... But mostly by having a long term effective energy policy.

One we haven't got now, nor had for 30 years!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Out of curiosity seen as you mentioned losses.

What's the loss on 80 miles of cable at 100,000 volts

What's the loss on 25 miles of cable at 30,000 volts

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Once again, what the government say and what they do are two different things!

This one in particular seems hell bent on wrecking any hopes for carbon cuts!

It's hardly surprising

They say we'll sort out housing.. Were at the lowest home ownership in thirty five years!

Sort out immigration... Goes through the roof

Jobs... Lowest labour participation in a generation

Debt.. Higher than ever

Trade deficit.. Higher than ever

Uni fees trebled

Yes everything's great really don't look at the small print, just keep drinking your beer and watching celebritys dance... Trust us we'll sort it!

Sorry. I may be missing the point of the post. What is renewable energy?

energy that can be sustainably sourced, solar.wind,hydro,air,bacteria digestion,ground and of course wood"

Ah, yes, that myth. And the financial and environmental cost of manufacturing and maintaining the equipment?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

I've not said nuclear. I've said diversity.

I think we need sustainable security of supply that includes options so we are not tied to any one form of generation.

IF all the renewables are built that are in planning that will be roughly 50% of the current demand. Which is only going up.

You can try and spread usage but unfortunately the vast majority of the population can't be arsed with that. They are more interested in the lights being there when they want them at a reasonable price. The peaks are still there they are just at different times now.

On dark, February winters evenings wind and solar don't cut it. Tidal is in its infancy so not viable.

I do agree with your point on policy though. The government have done a lot of damage purely because they can't make their mind up.

They've realised that if they keep pushing renewables their heading for a huge problem, financially and practically. Now they seem to be thinking about doing an about turn. Neither was the right approach. Even the industry have no idea wtf they're going to do next so currently hardly anyone is investing in anything and that is a huge problem.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"Out of curiosity seen as you mentioned losses.

What's the loss on 80 miles of cable at 100,000 volts

What's the loss on 25 miles of cable at 30,000 volts"

The reference used was Scotland. So let's round it up and say 1000 miles.

The unit that matters is watts. The answer is nearly 9% or 8.7% if you want to get picky.

Let's say you have 10gig of generation. That's 871mw lost in transmition.

That's almost half of a conventional power station. You can thicken you cables to reduce losses, which costs a lot more to do and increases build cost massively. Or you can use overground cables to mitigate your losses. You could paint the pylons white to match the beautiful wind turbines you've built all over Scotland.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

People appear to forget,just how big this country actually is.

Its bloody minute in the scale of the planet.

Even if the UK became carbon neutral, it would have so little effect globally, that it wouldn't matter.

We could burn all our coal reserves and produce less emissions than any of the larger countries.

Build coal powered plants and just get on with it.

Our co2 emmissions are less than half (per head of population) than the good old USA.

Anyone see them in a panic,wanting the Chinese to build them some nuclear power stations.

Profit Profit Profit is all that matters to the present and every UK government for generations in the past.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Just in case you didn't know.

All but one of our nuclear power stations will be gone in 15 years maximum!

The government white paper that was wrote by the NDA that's the body responsible fit decommissioning the plants.. They first estimated the cost to be 40 billion pounds.. That got rounded up to 80 billon pounds not long after and was left with a comment that basically said it could be 160 billon because... Nobody's actually decommissioned that many, one leading American expert that was asked by congress a few years back said.... It could take between 25 years and 60 years to decommission ONE plant!

The cost of decommissioning will be met by the tax payer, in fact we had a bit of a row with the French generator edf.. Who were running one of our plants a few years back.. They wanted an extra 250 million for something or other and when the government umed and arred... They basically said pay up or we walk off and lock the gates, if you know anything about nuclear generation, you know can't just walk away from one that quick, or even stop generating.

So for me the nuclear is the last option firstly because it's fucking expensive and secondly because it's fucking dirty!

There's dozens of countries making very successful moves in renewables... China for starters

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

"I've not said nuclear. I've said diversity.

I think we need sustainable security of supply that includes options so we are not tied to any one form of generation.

IF all the renewables are built that are in planning that will be roughly 50% of the current demand. Which is only going up."

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hoenixcouplexxCouple
over a year ago

Leicestershire

Another 8gw that has nothing to replace it. Apart from Hinkley and a proposal that's still looking for backing. And that's after the 18gw of wind that's been granted planning.