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"Police officers have a right to protect themselves in my opinion and a tazer is an effective (usually) non-lethal way of doing that. Just because someone has mental health issues it doesn't stop them from causing serious harm to a police officer or innocent people. Race shouldn't be a factor in its use either, a potentially violent criminal comes in all flavours. Issue them to ALL police officers is my opinion." Why not just give 'em all guns? | |||
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"Police officers have a right to protect themselves in my opinion and a tazer is an effective (usually) non-lethal way of doing that. Just because someone has mental health issues it doesn't stop them from causing serious harm to a police officer or innocent people. Race shouldn't be a factor in its use either, a potentially violent criminal comes in all flavours. Issue them to ALL police officers is my opinion. Why not just give 'em all guns?" Because all guns randomly deploy themselves and start killing innocent people because the police are bastards. Or some similar lefty bollocks. I supposed I'm biased, I have family members who are police officers and I've seen the state of them after they've had the shit kicked out of them for trying to stop dickheads smashing car windows or d*unken idiots on a Friday night. | |||
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"Police officers have a right to protect themselves in my opinion and a tazer is an effective (usually) non-lethal way of doing that. Just because someone has mental health issues it doesn't stop them from causing serious harm to a police officer or innocent people. Race shouldn't be a factor in its use either, a potentially violent criminal comes in all flavours. Issue them to ALL police officers is my opinion." Couldn't agree more. The pro's far outweigh the cons.  | |||
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"Try not to do anything that gets you tasered is the correct idea. However the Po Po did Tazer a blind man with a white stick walking back from the pub. So perhaps give them a little bit more training before giving them to every Officer. " Sadly accidents will happen and mistakes will be made but the pro's far outweigh the cons. | |||
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"Why not just give everyone guns, like they do in America? What could possibly go wrong?" Yeah use America as an example, why not use one closer to home like Switzerland where nearly every adult male is required to own one.... | |||
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"Why not just give everyone guns, like they do in America? What could possibly go wrong? Yeah use America as an example, why not use one closer to home like Switzerland where nearly every adult male is required to own one...." Switzerland is a very small, wealthy, parochial country. Give everybody in the UK that kind of living and no-one would need tasers. ? | |||
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"Why not just give everyone guns, like they do in America? What could possibly go wrong? Yeah use America as an example, why not use one closer to home like Switzerland where nearly every adult male is required to own one.... Switzerland is a very small, wealthy, parochial country. Give everybody in the UK that kind of living and no-one would need tasers. ?" It would be a mess. This thread isn't about the average man on the street having a gun or teaser through, it a about police having them and how they're deployed. | |||
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"Why not just give everyone guns, like they do in America? What could possibly go wrong? Yeah use America as an example, why not use one closer to home like Switzerland where nearly every adult male is required to own one.... Switzerland is a very small, wealthy, parochial country. Give everybody in the UK that kind of living and no-one would need tasers. ? It would be a mess. This thread isn't about the average man on the street having a gun or teaser through, it a about police having them and how they're deployed." Yep - see my last post. | |||
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"Have seen recent reports saying that they are used too often, often being used against ethnic minorities disproportionately and those with mental health issues too. There have also been deaths from their use, I believe. What are people's thoughts? Should tasers be scrapped? Or, if they are to be used, in which cases is it appropriate to see them used? Should police officers found to have used them inappropriately face disciplinary action? " Police have every right to protect themselves and these devices are effective and non lethal in threatening close encounters. | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. " You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. | |||
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"I think the fact a Police Officer was shot yesterday indicates a need for Officers to be armed and they need the tools and investment in training to do the job. It's a sad indictment that they can't get away with a whistle and a stick anymore. But there you go. " Again, I have to disagree. 14 officers have died in the line of duty in the last decade. Whereas if you visit killed by police dot net, you'll see a lot more people killed, accidentally most probably, in police custody or collaterally just in the last year... Better training, please. Not more guns. | |||
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"There is a problem with the report. you see just by drawing the taser it's consider a use of force. Now when entering a building to a disturbance they draw taser.(an officer has the right to protect themselves.) Now on the report this is an act of force even though two seconds later the domestic turns out to be the deaf lady watching eastenders too loudly and the weapon is holstered. So the papers once again jump on any story that can make our police look like the FSB in Russia when instead they have been some of the nicest people when I've had stuff stolen, been assaulted or have had need of them. Really we could do alot worse! Just saying! " When I was mooching about in Central and South America I saw some crazy Police practices. Truly grateful for the Police we have | |||
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"Police officers have a right to protect themselves in my opinion and a tazer is an effective (usually) non-lethal way of doing that. Just because someone has mental health issues it doesn't stop them from causing serious harm to a police officer or innocent people. Race shouldn't be a factor in its use either, a potentially violent criminal comes in all flavours. Issue them to ALL police officers is my opinion." This | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. " It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. Have a read of the Independent Police Complaints Commission report on taser use over the last decade... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf See if you think it's necessary | |||
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"I think the fact a Police Officer was shot yesterday indicates a need for Officers to be armed and they need the tools and investment in training to do the job. It's a sad indictment that they can't get away with a whistle and a stick anymore. But there you go. Again, I have to disagree. 14 officers have died in the line of duty in the last decade. Whereas if you visit killed by police dot net, you'll see a lot more people killed, accidentally most probably, in police custody or collaterally just in the last year... Better training, please. Not more guns." Sorry my comment was not clearer I meant Armed Police as they currently are not for everyone to be armed. Just more investment and tools for the current ones. | |||
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"I think the fact a Police Officer was shot yesterday indicates a need for Officers to be armed and they need the tools and investment in training to do the job. It's a sad indictment that they can't get away with a whistle and a stick anymore. But there you go. Again, I have to disagree. 14 officers have died in the line of duty in the last decade. Whereas if you visit killed by police dot net, you'll see a lot more people killed, accidentally most probably, in police custody or collaterally just in the last year... Better training, please. Not more guns. Sorry my comment was not clearer I meant Armed Police as they currently are not for everyone to be armed. Just more investment and tools for the current ones. " Fair enough | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. Have a read of the Independent Police Complaints Commission report on taser use over the last decade... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf See if you think it's necessary " I have no issue with the police using their powers and tools to defend themselves or others from acts of violence. Criminals will always complain that they've been treated too roughly because it's an easy way to get compensation and making crime pay. | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. Have a read of the Independent Police Complaints Commission report on taser use over the last decade... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf See if you think it's necessary I have no issue with the police using their powers and tools to defend themselves or others from acts of violence. Criminals will always complain that they've been treated too roughly because it's an easy way to get compensation and making crime pay." Possibly. But the simple fact of the matter remains that you're more likely to die at the hands of the police - most probably accidentally - that from violent crime. | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. Have a read of the Independent Police Complaints Commission report on taser use over the last decade... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf See if you think it's necessary I have no issue with the police using their powers and tools to defend themselves or others from acts of violence. Criminals will always complain that they've been treated too roughly because it's an easy way to get compensation and making crime pay. Possibly. But the simple fact of the matter remains that you're more likely to die at the hands of the police - most probably accidentally - that from violent crime. " Don't be a criminal then but if by chance you are, don't resist arrest when you're caught... 
Simple really. | |||
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"I think the fact a Police Officer was shot yesterday indicates a need for Officers to be armed and they need the tools and investment in training to do the job. It's a sad indictment that they can't get away with a whistle and a stick anymore. But there you go. Again, I have to disagree. 14 officers have died in the line of duty in the last decade. Whereas if you visit killed by police dot net, you'll see a lot more people killed, accidentally most probably, in police custody or collaterally just in the last year... Better training, please. Not more guns." couldn't quite read the entire thread as some of it its so far to the left its off my screen..... having worked with hardened crims and being exposed to all those crimes and guns in the past I am sure you will acknowledge that when everyone else is running away from the guy suffering with mental health issues who has the machete , its the police who run towards him... my brother and his partner are police officers in the Newcastle area, I say let them all have the tools they need to do their job... I work in engineering and fortunately aren't exposed to the dangers of people on mind bending drugs and armed with machine guns going to rob banks, but I suppose with the right communication skills and understanding all these misunderstood deprived armed gangs would lay down their weapons and hug one another. fact is there are dangerous people out there and we all need people who are prepared to confront them and deal with them to prevent them from causing harm to innocent people. my view is if rival gangs want to cut each other up , then crack on and all the best, but when it affects the lives of me and my kids, I am right behind the cop with the tazer or even gun who does what is required. | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. " Not as many as criminals. The difference is criminals don't have rules and guidelines. | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. Have a read of the Independent Police Complaints Commission report on taser use over the last decade... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf See if you think it's necessary I have no issue with the police using their powers and tools to defend themselves or others from acts of violence. Criminals will always complain that they've been treated too roughly because it's an easy way to get compensation and making crime pay. Possibly. But the simple fact of the matter remains that you're more likely to die at the hands of the police - most probably accidentally - that from violent crime. " Are you saying the murder/manslaughter rate in this country is lower than Deaths by the Police accidentally or otherwise? | |||
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"Don't be a criminal then but if by chance you are, don't resist arrest when you're caught...
Simple really."Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment? ? | |||
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"Don't be a criminal then but if by chance you are, don't resist arrest when you're caught...
Simple really.
Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment?
?"Petty thieves that steal trinkets from shops to possibly sell and provide for themselves/family members (I know, what a romantic notion) are possibly a product of necessity. Hardened career criminals? To me it's a life choice. Most of us know right from wrong from a very early age and there's no real excuse for it. | |||
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"Don't be a criminal then but if by chance you are, don't resist arrest when you're caught...
Simple really.
Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment?
?"its a life cycle, we now have 3rd generation families that don't even want to work as the benefit system is there to support them, society has a moral obligation to assist and provide for those in poor circumstances and difficulties, however people who chose to commit crime do exactly that.... choose to, be it a thief who steals or a rapist, crimes are crimes and mostly done through choice, all be it poor choices. I entirely get the fact that foreigners in deprived countries steal to live and generally accept that some people commit crime to survive in this country, but I don't accept that drug dealers and armed robbers who drive the range rovers and jeeps and have more disposable income than the vast majority of the country are forced to choose that life... back to the tazer argument | |||
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" Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment? ?" Fuck yeah they had a choice. Christ I've been all over the world and the one thing I'm certain is is we all have a choice. Greed coupled with laziness breeds criminality. Were you a social worker by any chance? | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. Have a read of the Independent Police Complaints Commission report on taser use over the last decade... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf See if you think it's necessary I have no issue with the police using their powers and tools to defend themselves or others from acts of violence. Criminals will always complain that they've been treated too roughly because it's an easy way to get compensation and making crime pay. Possibly. But the simple fact of the matter remains that you're more likely to die at the hands of the police - most probably accidentally - that from violent crime. Are you saying the murder/manslaughter rate in this country is lower than Deaths by the Police accidentally or otherwise? " According to the ONS there were 537 murders in 2013/14, of which 44 were gun related. In the same period 130 people died as a result of or during police contact https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/research_stats/Deaths_Report_1314.pdf So, ok, wrong by a factor of 1 to 4, ish. As Teresa May said: “All too often vulnerable people, often those with mental health problems, are taken because there is no other place to go.” | |||
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" Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment? ? Fuck yeah they had a choice. Christ I've been all over the world and the one thing I'm certain is is we all have a choice. Greed coupled with laziness breeds criminality. Were you a social worker by any chance? " Again, the simple fact of the matter remains that if you give people opportunities and money they are far less likely to turn in to criminals. | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. Have a read of the Independent Police Complaints Commission report on taser use over the last decade... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf See if you think it's necessary I have no issue with the police using their powers and tools to defend themselves or others from acts of violence. Criminals will always complain that they've been treated too roughly because it's an easy way to get compensation and making crime pay. Possibly. But the simple fact of the matter remains that you're more likely to die at the hands of the police - most probably accidentally - that from violent crime. Are you saying the murder/manslaughter rate in this country is lower than Deaths by the Police accidentally or otherwise? According to the ONS there were 537 murders in 2013/14, of which 44 were gun related. In the same period 130 people died as a result of or during police contact https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/research_stats/Deaths_Report_1314.pdf So, ok, wrong by a factor of 1 to 4, ish. As Teresa May said: “All too often vulnerable people, often those with mental health problems, are taken because there is no other place to go.”" I actually agree with part of your statement here. The way the social care system is currently being absolutely mauled by funding cuts I fear the figure may actually increase. I also still can't blame the police though, they're simultaneously defending themselves and don't have the time to carry out a fully mental capacity assessment on someone before drawing their taser.  | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. Have a read of the Independent Police Complaints Commission report on taser use over the last decade... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf See if you think it's necessary I have no issue with the police using their powers and tools to defend themselves or others from acts of violence. Criminals will always complain that they've been treated too roughly because it's an easy way to get compensation and making crime pay. Possibly. But the simple fact of the matter remains that you're more likely to die at the hands of the police - most probably accidentally - that from violent crime. Are you saying the murder/manslaughter rate in this country is lower than Deaths by the Police accidentally or otherwise? According to the ONS there were 537 murders in 2013/14, of which 44 were gun related. In the same period 130 people died as a result of or during police contact https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/research_stats/Deaths_Report_1314.pdf So, ok, wrong by a factor of 1 to 4, ish. As Teresa May said: “All too often vulnerable people, often those with mental health problems, are taken because there is no other place to go.” I actually agree with part of your statement here. The way the social care system is currently being absolutely mauled by funding cuts I fear the figure may actually increase. I also still can't blame the police though, they're simultaneously defending themselves and don't have the time to carry out a fully mental capacity assessment on someone before drawing their taser. "*simply* not simultaneously. | |||
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"I don't disagree. There are billions of poor people with little or no opportunity that don't turn to criminality to get what they need though. Being a criminal is an individuals choice. Especially in this country. No opportunities in this country??. Don't make me laugh. "Hahahahahahaha!!! | |||
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" Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment? ? Fuck yeah they had a choice. Christ I've been all over the world and the one thing I'm certain is is we all have a choice. Greed coupled with laziness breeds criminality. Were you a social worker by any chance? Again, the simple fact of the matter remains that if you give people opportunities and money they are far less likely to turn in to criminals. " fuck yeah man.... give me money and I wont go to work, simple choice, but if you give me 50 grand a year, next year I might want 60 so might have to commit crime to get it as the bloke up the road has a bigger house than me and a better audi or bmw and I want one so as his is bigger and more expensive I am deprived... simple fact is..... give 2 families 50 quid each, next week one will have spent it and the other lot will have invested it and made 75 quid and next week will have 100 quid while the other fuckers spend their 50 quid and want another one every week and will then see the other lot with more so will steal from them as they want the same without the pain of working for it. I will happily help anyone who is on hard times. the entire redcar steel works will close putting hundreds out of work, people who I worked with in the past will be out of work and go looking for work..... so tell me what opportunities are there? the opportunity is I left school and worked hard... like my matey here all over the world, and yes I was blessed with opportunities and consider myself fortunate.... but by shite when the work isn't local I go looking for it.... eastern Europeans are here with degrees in medicine and are happy to work in the fields picking vegetables and doing all the shit jobs that lazy fuckers who wont get out of bed aren't prepared to do. if people don't want to work, that's their choice, and we as society pay taxes to support them, but if they then decide to poison my neighbourhood with armed gangs trying to sell drugs to my kids, then let that cop with the tazer or gun sort the fuckers out | |||
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"I think, on balance, that it's a good thing we don;t have a weapons culture, per se in the UK. I say this as someone who has had a gun waved in his face, has had knives pulled on him, who has worked with gangs and hardened crims. And whatever the problem the police may face, I don't think *more* weapons is the answer. You already have the wrong mind set. You're viewing a teaser as a weapon which it isn't in the case of lawful use, it's merely a tool, much like a knife isn't a weapon until it's used as one. It's another weapon in the police arsenal, of which they have many. Have a read of the Independent Police Complaints Commission report on taser use over the last decade... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf See if you think it's necessary I have no issue with the police using their powers and tools to defend themselves or others from acts of violence. Criminals will always complain that they've been treated too roughly because it's an easy way to get compensation and making crime pay. Possibly. But the simple fact of the matter remains that you're more likely to die at the hands of the police - most probably accidentally - that from violent crime. Are you saying the murder/manslaughter rate in this country is lower than Deaths by the Police accidentally or otherwise? According to the ONS there were 537 murders in 2013/14, of which 44 were gun related. In the same period 130 people died as a result of or during police contact https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/research_stats/Deaths_Report_1314.pdf So, ok, wrong by a factor of 1 to 4, ish. As Teresa May said: “All too often vulnerable people, often those with mental health problems, are taken because there is no other place to go.”" Think I will take my chances with the Police then especially if tha Manslaughter rate is factored in. Teresa May is spot on the Mental Health services provision is shocking. | |||
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" Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment? ? Fuck yeah they had a choice. Christ I've been all over the world and the one thing I'm certain is is we all have a choice. Greed coupled with laziness breeds criminality. Were you a social worker by any chance? " | |||
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" Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment? ? Fuck yeah they had a choice. Christ I've been all over the world and the one thing I'm certain is is we all have a choice. Greed coupled with laziness breeds criminality. Were you a social worker by any chance? Again, the simple fact of the matter remains that if you give people opportunities and money they are far less likely to turn in to criminals. fuck yeah man.... give me money and I wont go to work, simple choice, but if you give me 50 grand a year, next year I might want 60 so might have to commit crime to get it as the bloke up the road has a bigger house than me and a better audi or bmw and I want one so as his is bigger and more expensive I am deprived... simple fact is..... give 2 families 50 quid each, next week one will have spent it and the other lot will have invested it and made 75 quid and next week will have 100 quid while the other fuckers spend their 50 quid and want another one every week and will then see the other lot with more so will steal from them as they want the same without the pain of working for it. I will happily help anyone who is on hard times. the entire redcar steel works will close putting hundreds out of work, people who I worked with in the past will be out of work and go looking for work..... so tell me what opportunities are there? the opportunity is I left school and worked hard... like my matey here all over the world, and yes I was blessed with opportunities and consider myself fortunate.... but by shite when the work isn't local I go looking for it.... eastern Europeans are here with degrees in medicine and are happy to work in the fields picking vegetables and doing all the shit jobs that lazy fuckers who wont get out of bed aren't prepared to do. if people don't want to work, that's their choice, and we as society pay taxes to support them, but if they then decide to poison my neighbourhood with armed gangs trying to sell drugs to my kids, then let that cop with the tazer or gun sort the fuckers out "*coLOOOOOOOOOLffs* | |||
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" Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment? ? Fuck yeah they had a choice. Christ I've been all over the world and the one thing I'm certain is is we all have a choice. Greed coupled with laziness breeds criminality. Were you a social worker by any chance? Again, the simple fact of the matter remains that if you give people opportunities and money they are far less likely to turn in to criminals. fuck yeah man.... give me money and I wont go to work, simple choice, but if you give me 50 grand a year, next year I might want 60 so might have to commit crime to get it as the bloke up the road has a bigger house than me and a better audi or bmw and I want one so as his is bigger and more expensive I am deprived... simple fact is..... give 2 families 50 quid each, next week one will have spent it and the other lot will have invested it and made 75 quid and next week will have 100 quid while the other fuckers spend their 50 quid and want another one every week and will then see the other lot with more so will steal from them as they want the same without the pain of working for it. I will happily help anyone who is on hard times. the entire redcar steel works will close putting hundreds out of work, people who I worked with in the past will be out of work and go looking for work..... so tell me what opportunities are there? the opportunity is I left school and worked hard... like my matey here all over the world, and yes I was blessed with opportunities and consider myself fortunate.... but by shite when the work isn't local I go looking for it.... eastern Europeans are here with degrees in medicine and are happy to work in the fields picking vegetables and doing all the shit jobs that lazy fuckers who wont get out of bed aren't prepared to do. if people don't want to work, that's their choice, and we as society pay taxes to support them, but if they then decide to poison my neighbourhood with armed gangs trying to sell drugs to my kids, then let that cop with the tazer or gun sort the fuckers out
*coLOOOOOOOOOLffs*"great aint it rrroooofllltpposyrngyygfnfj ntha | |||
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" Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment? ? Fuck yeah they had a choice. Christ I've been all over the world and the one thing I'm certain is is we all have a choice. Greed coupled with laziness breeds criminality. Were you a social worker by any chance? Again, the simple fact of the matter remains that if you give people opportunities and money they are far less likely to turn in to criminals. fuck yeah man.... give me money and I wont go to work, simple choice, but if you give me 50 grand a year, next year I might want 60 so might have to commit crime to get it as the bloke up the road has a bigger house than me and a better audi or bmw and I want one so as his is bigger and more expensive I am deprived... simple fact is..... give 2 families 50 quid each, next week one will have spent it and the other lot will have invested it and made 75 quid and next week will have 100 quid while the other fuckers spend their 50 quid and want another one every week and will then see the other lot with more so will steal from them as they want the same without the pain of working for it. I will happily help anyone who is on hard times. the entire redcar steel works will close putting hundreds out of work, people who I worked with in the past will be out of work and go looking for work..... so tell me what opportunities are there? the opportunity is I left school and worked hard... like my matey here all over the world, and yes I was blessed with opportunities and consider myself fortunate.... but by shite when the work isn't local I go looking for it.... eastern Europeans are here with degrees in medicine and are happy to work in the fields picking vegetables and doing all the shit jobs that lazy fuckers who wont get out of bed aren't prepared to do. if people don't want to work, that's their choice, and we as society pay taxes to support them, but if they then decide to poison my neighbourhood with armed gangs trying to sell drugs to my kids, then let that cop with the tazer or gun sort the fuckers out
*coLOOOOOOOOOLffs*
great aint it rrroooofllltpposyrngyygfnfj ntha"Have a gold star, run along and rejoin the class. | |||
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"Does anyone have any info as to how many (if any) have died from being tasered? " All I can find recently in the UK is one death in 2014 of a burglar in Newcastle. I only did a quick cursory search though. | |||
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" Do you think the majority of criminals 'choose' to be criminals or do you think it might have something to do with opportunity and environment? ? Fuck yeah they had a choice. Christ I've been all over the world and the one thing I'm certain is is we all have a choice. Greed coupled with laziness breeds criminality. Were you a social worker by any chance? Again, the simple fact of the matter remains that if you give people opportunities and money they are far less likely to turn in to criminals. fuck yeah man.... give me money and I wont go to work, simple choice, but if you give me 50 grand a year, next year I might want 60 so might have to commit crime to get it as the bloke up the road has a bigger house than me and a better audi or bmw and I want one so as his is bigger and more expensive I am deprived... simple fact is..... give 2 families 50 quid each, next week one will have spent it and the other lot will have invested it and made 75 quid and next week will have 100 quid while the other fuckers spend their 50 quid and want another one every week and will then see the other lot with more so will steal from them as they want the same without the pain of working for it. I will happily help anyone who is on hard times. the entire redcar steel works will close putting hundreds out of work, people who I worked with in the past will be out of work and go looking for work..... so tell me what opportunities are there? the opportunity is I left school and worked hard... like my matey here all over the world, and yes I was blessed with opportunities and consider myself fortunate.... but by shite when the work isn't local I go looking for it.... eastern Europeans are here with degrees in medicine and are happy to work in the fields picking vegetables and doing all the shit jobs that lazy fuckers who wont get out of bed aren't prepared to do. if people don't want to work, that's their choice, and we as society pay taxes to support them, but if they then decide to poison my neighbourhood with armed gangs trying to sell drugs to my kids, then let that cop with the tazer or gun sort the fuckers out
*coLOOOOOOOOOLffs*
great aint it rrroooofllltpposyrngyygfnfj ntha
Have a gold star, run along and rejoin the class.
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"Does anyone have any info as to how many (if any) have died from being tasered? " Aqui... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf | |||
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"Does anyone have any info as to how many (if any) have died from being tasered? All I can find recently in the UK is one death in 2014 of a burglar in Newcastle. I only did a quick cursory search though." Thanks How do we feel about that? Fair enough, he was breaking the law? Or very bad news, someone ought not to die for a relatively minor crime? | |||
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"Does anyone have any info as to how many (if any) have died from being tasered? Aqui... https://www.ipcc.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Documents/guidelines_reports/Taser_report_final_2014.pdf" Can't access (on my phone). Is there a figure given? | |||
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"That didn't come out right... So in 2013 (the last year of available figures) Tasers were used in 10,380 incidents UK-wide.In total the IPCC received 190 referrals where no complaint had been made. Eleven of these referrals involved someone having died." Eleven? Wow. That's a lot. Surely one is too many? Didn't Blunkett a while back recommend they stopped being used? I'm only going from memory so forgive me if I'm wrong | |||
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"I think what needs to be taken into account is underlying conditions such as excited delirium etc. The only other traditional manner in which restraint of these individuals would be successfully achieved would be weight of numbers which then leads to greater risk of Positional asphyxia and the body count would probably be more. Nobody will ever have the correct technique or equipment to confront these situations. So a blanket ban on something that potentially saves someone's life with very little after effect (been Tazered) would be counter productive. Trick is not to get yourself in the situation where you get Tazered. Although easier said then done when you have a mental health episode. " I guess what I'm saying is your dammed if you do and dammed if you don't. | |||
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"I think what needs to be taken into account is underlying conditions such as excited delirium etc. The only other traditional manner in which restraint of these individuals would be successfully achieved would be weight of numbers which then leads to greater risk of Positional asphyxia and the body count would probably be more. Nobody will ever have the correct technique or equipment to confront these situations. So a blanket ban on something that potentially saves someone's life with very little after effect (been Tazered) would be counter productive. Trick is not to get yourself in the situation where you get Tazered. Although easier said then done when you have a mental health episode. " I remember reading of a case where a pensioner in his 60s was tasered over a parking violation | |||
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"I think what needs to be taken into account is underlying conditions such as excited delirium etc. The only other traditional manner in which restraint of these individuals would be successfully achieved would be weight of numbers which then leads to greater risk of Positional asphyxia and the body count would probably be more. Nobody will ever have the correct technique or equipment to confront these situations. So a blanket ban on something that potentially saves someone's life with very little after effect (been Tazered) would be counter productive. Trick is not to get yourself in the situation where you get Tazered. Although easier said then done when you have a mental health episode. I remember reading of a case where a pensioner in his 60s was tasered over a parking violation" Now was it because of his reaction to the aforementioned parking violation or his violently resisting arrest after jumping on several parked cars and needing to be locked up for criminal damage? | |||
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"I think what needs to be taken into account is underlying conditions such as excited delirium etc. The only other traditional manner in which restraint of these individuals would be successfully achieved would be weight of numbers which then leads to greater risk of Positional asphyxia and the body count would probably be more. Nobody will ever have the correct technique or equipment to confront these situations. So a blanket ban on something that potentially saves someone's life with very little after effect (been Tazered) would be counter productive. Trick is not to get yourself in the situation where you get Tazered. Although easier said then done when you have a mental health episode. I remember reading of a case where a pensioner in his 60s was tasered over a parking violation Now was it because of his reaction to the aforementioned parking violation or his violently resisting arrest after jumping on several parked cars and needing to be locked up for criminal damage? " None of these, as I remember. Just an ordinary traffic violation and overly zealous policeman | |||
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"I think what needs to be taken into account is underlying conditions such as excited delirium etc. The only other traditional manner in which restraint of these individuals would be successfully achieved would be weight of numbers which then leads to greater risk of Positional asphyxia and the body count would probably be more. Nobody will ever have the correct technique or equipment to confront these situations. So a blanket ban on something that potentially saves someone's life with very little after effect (been Tazered) would be counter productive. Trick is not to get yourself in the situation where you get Tazered. Although easier said then done when you have a mental health episode. I remember reading of a case where a pensioner in his 60s was tasered over a parking violation Now was it because of his reaction to the aforementioned parking violation or his violently resisting arrest after jumping on several parked cars and needing to be locked up for criminal damage? None of these, as I remember. Just an ordinary traffic violation and overly zealous policeman " Link please | |||
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"That didn't come out right... So in 2013 (the last year of available figures) Tasers were used in 10,380 incidents UK-wide.In total the IPCC received 190 referrals where no complaint had been made. Eleven of these referrals involved someone having died. Eleven? Wow. That's a lot. Surely one is too many? Didn't Blunkett a while back recommend they stopped being used? I'm only going from memory so forgive me if I'm wrong" 11 deaths from 10,380 deployments, is a little over 1% so the chances of being killed by taser is quite low. I'd much rather be tasered than have several burly coppers jump on me. | |||
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"That didn't come out right... So in 2013 (the last year of available figures) Tasers were used in 10,380 incidents UK-wide.In total the IPCC received 190 referrals where no complaint had been made. Eleven of these referrals involved someone having died. Eleven? Wow. That's a lot. Surely one is too many? Didn't Blunkett a while back recommend they stopped being used? I'm only going from memory so forgive me if I'm wrong 11 deaths from 10,380 deployments, is a little over 1% so the chances of being killed by taser is quite low. I'd much rather be tasered than have several burly coppers jump on me." All about perspective. | |||
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"That didn't come out right... So in 2013 (the last year of available figures) Tasers were used in 10,380 incidents UK-wide.In total the IPCC received 190 referrals where no complaint had been made. Eleven of these referrals involved someone having died. Eleven? Wow. That's a lot. Surely one is too many? Didn't Blunkett a while back recommend they stopped being used? I'm only going from memory so forgive me if I'm wrong 11 deaths from 10,380 deployments, is a little over 1% so the chances of being killed by taser is quite low. I'd much rather be tasered than have several burly coppers jump on me. All about perspective. "My brother is a copper and full time fat bastard. I'd rather be tasered than have him sit on my knee!... | |||
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"That didn't come out right... So in 2013 (the last year of available figures) Tasers were used in 10,380 incidents UK-wide.In total the IPCC received 190 referrals where no complaint had been made. Eleven of these referrals involved someone having died. Eleven? Wow. That's a lot. Surely one is too many? Didn't Blunkett a while back recommend they stopped being used? I'm only going from memory so forgive me if I'm wrong 11 deaths from 10,380 deployments, is a little over 1% so the chances of being killed by taser is quite low. I'd much rather be tasered than have several burly coppers jump on me." 1% chance of dying? Way too high. We don't allow people to be executed even when we know for certain someone is guilty of the most horrific murders!! I'm stunned so many are so lacksadaisacal about this. Obviously you all have greater faith in the police than I do.... | |||
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"That didn't come out right... So in 2013 (the last year of available figures) Tasers were used in 10,380 incidents UK-wide.In total the IPCC received 190 referrals where no complaint had been made. Eleven of these referrals involved someone having died. Eleven? Wow. That's a lot. Surely one is too many? Didn't Blunkett a while back recommend they stopped being used? I'm only going from memory so forgive me if I'm wrong 11 deaths from 10,380 deployments, is a little over 1% so the chances of being killed by taser is quite low. I'd much rather be tasered than have several burly coppers jump on me. 1% chance of dying? Way too high. We don't allow people to be executed even when we know for certain someone is guilty of the most horrific murders!! I'm stunned so many are so lacksadaisacal about this. Obviously you all have greater faith in the police than I do...." In another thread you are saying bring back the death penalty? How would you deal with a PCP tweaking samurai sword wielding person safely? | |||
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"Why not just give everyone guns, like they do in America? What could possibly go wrong? Yeah use America as an example, why not use one closer to home like Switzerland where nearly every adult male is required to own one...." And where the requirements are completely different to the U.S. regarding the storing of the weapons, the ammunition & the military training to own & keep a weapon at home. Switzerland is a completely different case to the USA & cannot be compared. | |||
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"Police officers have a right to protect themselves in my opinion and a tazer is an effective (usually) non-lethal way of doing that. Just because someone has mental health issues it doesn't stop them from causing serious harm to a police officer or innocent people. Race shouldn't be a factor in its use either, a potentially violent criminal comes in all flavours. Issue them to ALL police officers is my opinion." We agree that police have the right to protect themselves. Here in the states we have seen Tasers over used for bullshit reasons. Example - someone wouldn't get off there cell phone. While we agree the person should have gotten off the phone. We don't believe it justifies the use of a Taser. ( An ink pen and thumb combo grabbing the earlobe would have been much more appropriate.) | |||
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"Why not just give everyone guns, like they do in America? What could possibly go wrong? Yeah use America as an example, why not use one closer to home like Switzerland where nearly every adult male is required to own one.... And where the requirements are completely different to the U.S. regarding the storing of the weapons, the ammunition & the military training to own & keep a weapon at home. Switzerland is a completely different case to the USA & cannot be compared." I know they can't. That's why the comparison between England and America doesn't work either. Our gun laws would (and in some instances already are) be similar to the Swiss. Whenever these arguments come around people love to use American gun culture as a bad example, mainly because they know absolutely fuck all about it. | |||
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"That didn't come out right... So in 2013 (the last year of available figures) Tasers were used in 10,380 incidents UK-wide.In total the IPCC received 190 referrals where no complaint had been made. Eleven of these referrals involved someone having died. Eleven? Wow. That's a lot. Surely one is too many? Didn't Blunkett a while back recommend they stopped being used? I'm only going from memory so forgive me if I'm wrong 11 deaths from 10,380 deployments, is a little over 1% so the chances of being killed by taser is quite low. I'd much rather be tasered than have several burly coppers jump on me. 1% chance of dying? Way too high. We don't allow people to be executed even when we know for certain someone is guilty of the most horrific murders!! I'm stunned so many are so lacksadaisacal about this. Obviously you all have greater faith in the police than I do...." You have a higher chance of dying while being physically restrained than tazed. Do you think the police should just say "pretty please" and if the criminal doesn't feel like it he can give the copper a good kicking for being so rude? | |||
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"That didn't come out right... So in 2013 (the last year of available figures) Tasers were used in 10,380 incidents UK-wide.In total the IPCC received 190 referrals where no complaint had been made. Eleven of these referrals involved someone having died. Eleven? Wow. That's a lot. Surely one is too many? Didn't Blunkett a while back recommend they stopped being used? I'm only going from memory so forgive me if I'm wrong 11 deaths from 10,380 deployments, is a little over 1% so the chances of being killed by taser is quite low. I'd much rather be tasered than have several burly coppers jump on me. 1% chance of dying? Way too high. We don't allow people to be executed even when we know for certain someone is guilty of the most horrific murders!! I'm stunned so many are so lacksadaisacal about this. Obviously you all have greater faith in the police than I do.... You have a higher chance of dying while being physically restrained than tazed. Do you think the police should just say "pretty please" and if the criminal doesn't feel like it he can give the copper a good kicking for being so rude?" Having had my head kicked in by police in Nottingham I have no faith in them | |||
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"You have a higher chance of dying while being physically restrained than tazed. Do you think the police should just say "pretty please" and if the criminal doesn't feel like it he can give the copper a good kicking for being so rude?" immediately after being tazed a person will be physically restrained .... so that's a completely crap arguement you have there | |||
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"i've actually been in a place in bern, switerland where an open gun battle took place around us ..... they have issues with gun related crime, and it wasn't an isolated incident either. so using switerland as an example of it all being roses is utter tosh. this ridiculous belief by those with a fascination for weapons that "the only thing that stops bad guys with guns is good guys with guns" is ludicrous. and the people who believe it, in my opinion, are morally bankrupt. joe's stance of being against weapons can't be considered as the wrong mind-set.... it is on the contrary an admirable idea and i for one are with him on that 100%" I'm not saying your story is bullshit but Switzerland has virtually no gun crime and some of the lowest overall crime rates in the world. | |||
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"You have a higher chance of dying while being physically restrained than tazed. Do you think the police should just say "pretty please" and if the criminal doesn't feel like it he can give the copper a good kicking for being so rude? immediately after being tazed a person will be physically restrained .... so that's a completely crap arguement you have there" Nah you can gain control of a subject during the tazing as long as you don't touch between the entry barbs. | |||
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"i've actually been in a place in bern, switerland where an open gun battle took place around us ..... they have issues with gun related crime, and it wasn't an isolated incident either. so using switerland as an example of it all being roses is utter tosh. this ridiculous belief by those with a fascination for weapons that "the only thing that stops bad guys with guns is good guys with guns" is ludicrous. and the people who believe it, in my opinion, are morally bankrupt. joe's stance of being against weapons can't be considered as the wrong mind-set.... it is on the contrary an admirable idea and i for one are with him on that 100% I'm not saying your story is bullshit but Switzerland has virtually no gun crime and some of the lowest overall crime rates in the world. " the fact is that they have guns and there IS gun crime. other factors govern the reasons why the overall crime rate is low. | |||
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"I think the fact a Police Officer was shot yesterday indicates a need for Officers to be armed and they need the tools and investment in training to do the job. It's a sad indictment that they can't get away with a whistle and a stick anymore. But there you go. Again, I have to disagree. 14 officers have died in the line of duty in the last decade. Whereas if you visit killed by police dot net, you'll see a lot more people killed, accidentally most probably, in police custody or collaterally just in the last year... Better training, please. Not more guns." Accidentally most probably you say? Do you think that highly trained Police Officers deliberately kill people in their custody? As for the people dying in custody do you think that these fine upstanding members of the law abiding public were denied of their liberty for no reason at all? You are blinkered my friend to one side of this. Tasers are a very necessary tool and just the sight of the Taser is often enough to defuse most situations. | |||
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"i've actually been in a place in bern, switerland where an open gun battle took place around us ..... they have issues with gun related crime, and it wasn't an isolated incident either. so using switerland as an example of it all being roses is utter tosh. this ridiculous belief by those with a fascination for weapons that "the only thing that stops bad guys with guns is good guys with guns" is ludicrous. and the people who believe it, in my opinion, are morally bankrupt. joe's stance of being against weapons can't be considered as the wrong mind-set.... it is on the contrary an admirable idea and i for one are with him on that 100% I'm not saying your story is bullshit but Switzerland has virtually no gun crime and some of the lowest overall crime rates in the world. the fact is that they have guns and there IS gun crime. other factors govern the reasons why the overall crime rate is low." Show me a country where there isn't gun crime... | |||
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"You have a higher chance of dying while being physically restrained than tazed. Do you think the police should just say "pretty please" and if the criminal doesn't feel like it he can give the copper a good kicking for being so rude? immediately after being tazed a person will be physically restrained .... so that's a completely crap arguement you have there" There's a massive difference between cuffing someone who's been incapacitated by taser and restraining someone who's violently resisting. | |||
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"Show me a country where there isn't gun crime..." exactly .... where there are guns there is gun crime | |||
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