FabSwingers.com forum: Breaking Into Britain: The Lorry Jumpers

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I like these updates you give on top picks. I'll watch this tomorrow.

You sad about Tila leaving?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I like these updates you give on top picks. I'll watch this tomorrow.

You sad about Tila leaving?"
Thanks and I like to update you all on good programs, yes Tila left, shame aint it? I liked her, did you?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I like these updates you give on top picks. I'll watch this tomorrow.

You sad about Tila leaving?Thanks and I like to update you all on good programs, yes Tila left, shame aint it? I liked her, did you?"

I sort of liked her, but only to watch. Don't think I could bear being in the same room, she's crazy.

I didn't answer your top question. France should do more, however it's not really a priority to prevent migrants leaving so I can see why they don't.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again."

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

It was all put in perspective for me when the 76 year old Austrian lady who was once a refugee and had been taking food to the migrants said "I feel really sorry, you don't forget"

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I like these updates you give on top picks. I'll watch this tomorrow.

You sad about Tila leaving?Thanks and I like to update you all on good programs, yes Tila left, shame aint it? I liked her, did you?

I sort of liked her, but only to watch. Don't think I could bear being in the same room, she's crazy.

I didn't answer your top question. France should do more, however it's not really a priority to prevent migrants leaving so I can see why they don't."
Yeah I liked her but as you say she was abit crazy there and very sexual, but fun, shame she got send home so ealie tho, would been great tv with her in there too x.

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By *r and mrs sanddancerCouple
over a year ago

BOLDON COLLIERY

a refugee is supposed to to register in the first safe country they reach.

NOT in the one who gives the best benefits, some have traveled through 4 safe countries before getting to the channel.

but we are seen as a soft touch

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don't see why Britain should have to pay for a fence in France. Also that's why the french put songat there in the first place no were near the point of entry

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"a refugee is supposed to to register in the first safe country they reach.

NOT in the one who gives the best benefits, some have traveled through 4 safe countries before getting to the channel.

but we are seen as a soft touch "

Italy and Germany take far more migrants than the UK.

It's not like no other countries are taking migrants in.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away."

Don't you think if it's safety they want they would stay in France or wherever they first entered Europe ?

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By *arry247Couple
over a year ago

Wakefield

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away."

It is nothing, repeat nothing to do with safety.

The laws on asylum seekers are very clear they are supposed to claim aslylum at the first safe country they arrive in.

Those people trying to bypass the immigration procedures are illegal immigrants and do not deserve sympathy.

The French police have a duty to clamp down on those criminals and France should be paying the UK lorry drivers compensation.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Also I think we as a country should take the Australian approach no one gets in

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"a refugee is supposed to to register in the first safe country they reach.

NOT in the one who gives the best benefits, some have traveled through 4 safe countries before getting to the channel.

but we are seen as a soft touch "

so going by these rules. no one should ever reach England? is that fair? that we take none!

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away."

Well I can, and would, and apologise to no-one.

While I have some sympathy for the Syrians going into Greece I do not have one jot of it for the "Lorry Jumpers" in France. They are ALL economic migrants, they may have been fleeing persecution once but they are now in a safe country so they can only want to get to Britain for economic reasons. Genuine asylum seekers would be more than happy to stay in France.

So build the fences HIGH. Increase the guards and send anyone caught back to France. No excuses and no exceptions.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away.

It is nothing, repeat nothing to do with safety.

The laws on asylum seekers are very clear they are supposed to claim aslylum at the first safe country they arrive in.

Those people trying to bypass the immigration procedures are illegal immigrants and do not deserve sympathy.

The French police have a duty to clamp down on those criminals and France should be paying the UK lorry drivers compensation."

IMO Europe should be treated as a whole. We should standardise how we treat migrants, and then migrants who have been rubber-stamped should be able to move as freely as a European citizen.

And don't say it's not about safety. For most displaced peoples it's entirely about safety. These are people who are looking for a safe place to live. .They want to make new lives.

Why do *some* migrants prefer to come to the UK? Because as a legacy of our occupation of their countries we instigated programmes of English language tuition. Many of these people speak English. So they are looking for somewhere to live that speaks English in order that they can start to work quicker and earn a living - if you have to delay working by a year so that you can learn German, Italian, Norwegian, etc, then that's a year more you're claiming benefits and not providing for yourself. Most of these people don't want that. If you go to other countries like Italy or Germany you find that they are often taking in people who speak their language as a second language - and they are often from former colonies too.

Our colonial legacy is this. We treated them like shit and now they're looking to us for help. We have to help.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Do you not think that we've taken more than most countries in the past from the 50s right through. I live in Middlesbrough and if you walk in certain parts of the town centre you'd be hard pushed to hear a teesside accent (not a bad thing some might say) but as Middlesbrough has the highest population of so called refugees in the country fact I think it's time other countries stepped up

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Genuine asylum seekers would be more than happy to stay in France.

So it takes a migrant about 18 months to get into the benefits system in France. And then they get about £30 a week to live on, which has to pay for every single thing they need.

Would you be 'more than happy' to live on £30 a week? Honestly?

And how would you pay for French lessons with £30 a week? And why does it make sense to pay for French lessons out of your £30 a week when you could come to England and find a job much quicker because you already speak English? Because these people don't want to rely on benefits. They want to work. And France makes it hard for them to do that.

I don't think people understand how bad is it for these people. It's as if 500 people didn't drown on a boat. 80 people weren't suffocated in the back of a lorry and two children nearly died of starvation. Honestly. These people aren't looking for an easy life. They're risking their lives in order to try and have a life.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Do you not think that we've taken more than most countries in the past from the 50s right through. I live in Middlesbrough and if you walk in certain parts of the town centre you'd be hard pushed to hear a teesside accent (not a bad thing some might say) but as Middlesbrough has the highest population of so called refugees in the country fact I think it's time other countries stepped up "

Other countries take more than us per capita. This debate is happening everywhere. We're not as special as you think.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We can't accept more cos you can't hear a Teesside accent? That's a ridiculous reason.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Genuine asylum seekers would be more than happy to stay in France.

So it takes a migrant about 18 months to get into the benefits system in France. And then they get about £30 a week to live on, which has to pay for every single thing they need.

Would you be 'more than happy' to live on £30 a week? Honestly?

So they are coming to Britain for the benefits then. By any measure that is economic migration. Nothing to do with safety. They are safe in France.

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By *verysmileMan
over a year ago

Canterbury

I wonder what people would be saying if it was our authorities tasked with stopping Syrians and North Africans trying to get to France. Would we be actively stopping these peope going or turning a blind eye while they approached vehicles?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Other countries take more than us per capita. This debate is happening everywhere. We're not as special as you think."

In fact, these countries have more refuges per head than the UK:

Malaysia

France

Zambia

Ethiopia

Central African Republic

Uganda

Burundi

Cyprus

Costa Rica

Sudan

Netherlands

Guinea-Bissau

Canada

Panama

Cameroon

Rwanda

Israel

Gambia

Austria

Luxembourg

Switzerland

Germany

Venezuela

Serbia

Mauritania

Norway

Ecuador

Yemen

Sweden

South Sudan

Iran

Pakistan

Kenya

Liberia

Montenegro

Turkey

Djibouti

Chad

Republic of the Congo

Syria

Lebanon

Jordan

So in fact, perhaps we should be stepping up. France, Netherlands, Austria, Luxembourg, Sweden, Switzerland, Netherlands, and Germany - they all have more refugees per native person than the UK.

One could easily argue that we are not doing enough.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Genuine asylum seekers would be more than happy to stay in France.

So it takes a migrant about 18 months to get into the benefits system in France. And then they get about £30 a week to live on, which has to pay for every single thing they need.

Would you be 'more than happy' to live on £30 a week? Honestly?

So they are coming to Britain for the benefits then. By any measure that is economic migration. Nothing to do with safety. They are safe in France."

Good on ignoring my entire point about the fact that many, many of these migrants speak good English and are therefore looking for somewhere that they can get off benefits sooner rather than later.

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By *iamondsmiles.Woman
over a year ago

little house on the praire

I used to sympathise, I've lost all sympathy and if there lives are so bad at home ( I'm not doubting they are) then they should go to the first safe country

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real

human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away."

Fully in agreement bring back a little humanity for these poor souls.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Genuine asylum seekers would be more than happy to stay in France.

So it takes a migrant about 18 months to get into the benefits system in France. And then they get about £30 a week to live on, which has to pay for every single thing they need.

Would you be 'more than happy' to live on £30 a week? Honestly?

So they are coming to Britain for the benefits then. By any measure that is economic migration. Nothing to do with safety. They are safe in France.

Good on ignoring my entire point about the fact that many, many of these migrants speak good English and are therefore looking for somewhere that they can get off benefits sooner rather than later."

So they are looking for work = economic migration. Nothing to do with safety.

Asylum seekers are asylum seekers. Economic migrants are economic migrants.

You can muddy the water as much as you like but I'll say it again. They are safe in France.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I feel lucky to have been born in the UK. Some people aren't so lucky. I can't blame people for wanting what is best for their family. To keep them safe and to give them the best opportunities.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"a refugee is supposed to to register in the first safe country they reach.

NOT in the one who gives the best benefits, some have traveled through 4 safe countries before getting to the channel.

but we are seen as a soft touch

Italy and Germany take far more migrants than the UK.

It's not like no other countries are taking migrants in."

(m) answering this 1. As I have relatives in Germany, Switzerland, France and Italy and speak fluently all languages in these countries I see it from a different point of _iew from the liberal press.

Switzerland has per month 3'000 young Eritrean males crossing their borders from Italy illegal-no families no kids... Asked by the police why they come the excuse is that they don't want to serve in the Army and how they got to Italy by paying on average $9'000 to smugglers - bear in mind that average earning are per year $2'000.

In Italy goto Milano station there are thousands hanging around stealing, robbing and begging...Most residents will not go near the station after dark as too scared (By the way same as in Malmo where police will enter certain areas only in groups of 10).

Why of all are the mass of these refugees coming from countries like Vietnam, Eritrea and Nigeria ? There are no wars in these countries...

My father fought for freedom of opinion and believes, my Swiss grandfather stood 3 years at the boarders in the Jura defending the Swiss neutral system and to protect refugees and I have in my time as Swiss Army officer looked after refugees from Bosnia - These were real refugees - Scared and living in fear. When their children saw uniforms they cried and screamed only after days of helping did they understand we were "Menschen".

But 80% of these so-called refugees are not refugees but are seeking the "easy" life in Britain; as it is told all over Europe how easy it is to gain benefits in Britain (In Germany a refugee receives Euro 10 per day max and live in dedeciated shelters speak ex. shopping Malls like B&Q).

I will defend a real refugee and would do all for such but as said 80% coming to Europe are not refugees at all as our liberal press like us to believe.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away.

It is nothing, repeat nothing to do with safety.

The laws on asylum seekers are very clear they are supposed to claim aslylum at the first safe country they arrive in.

Those people trying to bypass the immigration procedures are illegal immigrants and do not deserve sympathy.

The French police have a duty to clamp down on those criminals and France should be paying the UK lorry drivers compensation.

IMO Europe should be treated as a whole. We should standardise how we treat migrants, and then migrants who have been rubber-stamped should be able to move as freely as a European citizen.

And don't say it's not about safety. For most displaced peoples it's entirely about safety. These are people who are looking for a safe place to live. .They want to make new lives.

Our colonial legacy is this. We treated them like shit and now they're looking to us for help. We have to help."

I think your post highlights why Britain needs to get out of the EU, and that we should never allow our country to be drawn into a united states of Europe. Free movement of people is a crack pot idea and to apply that same principle to migrants would be madness. Genuine asylum seekers my arse they are economic migrants wanting to come here for benefits. Genuine asylum seekers would claim asylum in first safe country they found themselves in.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away.

It is nothing, repeat nothing to do with safety.

The laws on asylum seekers are very clear they are supposed to claim aslylum at the first safe country they arrive in.

Those people trying to bypass the immigration procedures are illegal immigrants and do not deserve sympathy.

The French police have a duty to clamp down on those criminals and France should be paying the UK lorry drivers compensation.

IMO Europe should be treated as a whole. We should standardise how we treat migrants, and then migrants who have been rubber-stamped should be able to move as freely as a European citizen.

And don't say it's not about safety. For most displaced peoples it's entirely about safety. These are people who are looking for a safe place to live. .They want to make new lives.

Our colonial legacy is this. We treated them like shit and now they're looking to us for help. We have to help.

Pretty much what I've been saying.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

Not watching as I'm out of the country and just feel this sort of 'entertainment' just stirs up unrest and hatred of others.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As a trucker who gets fined personally £2000 per illegal that slips through, (not that they have yet touch wood) i'll not be watching as it would make me cross

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By *r and mrs sanddancerCouple
over a year ago

BOLDON COLLIERY

"Genuine asylum seekers would be more than happy to stay in France.

So it takes a migrant about 18 months to get into the benefits system in France. And then they get about £30 a week to live on, which has to pay for every single thing they need.

Would you be 'more than happy' to live on £30 a week? Honestly?

So they are coming to Britain for the benefits then. By any measure that is economic migration. Nothing to do with safety. They are safe in France.

Good on ignoring my entire point about the fact that many, many of these migrants speak good English and are therefore looking for somewhere that they can get off benefits sooner rather than later."

as your so in favour of these migrants I assume you will have quite a few boarding free in your house

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

not something I would watch.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Every area they go to that area goes down and crime goes up.

Make all the excuses you want it's the truth.

Time to shut up shop. WE ARE FULL

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I used to sympathise, I've lost all sympathy and if there lives are so bad at home ( I'm not doubting they are) then they should go to the first safe country"

The United Nations Charter on Asylum States categorically that Asylum should be sought in "the first safe country that is reached. Anyone who does NOT register for and seek asylum in that first country is defining themselves as NOT being an asylum seeker. That is the United Nations definition.

So whilst I personally think we should do more for those genuinely fleeing persecution I can see the point that many here are making. And to be fair many of the "lorry jumpers" in Calais are economic migrants....wether they seek benefits or jobs isn't relevent.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away."

You just saved me some typing.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Not watching as I'm out of the country and just feel this sort of 'entertainment' just stirs up unrest and hatred of others.

Spot on.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Its about to start

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Not watching as I'm out of the country and just feel this sort of 'entertainment' just stirs up unrest and hatred of others.

Not about hatred. No one in their right mind blames these people coming here for a better life.

This is about the size of our country and what we can afford.

Unfortunately we can't substain an influx like this.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Every area they go to that area goes down and crime goes up.

Make all the excuses you want it's the truth.

Time to shut up shop. WE ARE FULL"

What about crimes rises in areas where there are no immigrants, who do you blame for that?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Every area they go to that area goes down and crime goes up.

Make all the excuses you want it's the truth.

Time to shut up shop. WE ARE FULL

What about crimes rises in areas where there are no immigrants, who do you blame for that?"

Our prisons are full. Criminals are getting away with stuff because there is no where to put them.

Cut immigration cut crime and free up prisons for our own scum

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What about crimes rises in areas where there are no immigrants, who do you blame for that?"

Probably people on benefits. Or Muslims.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again."
I'm quite enjoying it I may use it as a budget way of travelling to France will save me renewing my passport to

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

It was a good program. The reporter followed them on the lorries and he was surprised by the brutality by the french police and got hit and camera smashed. Few got over and got asylum in glasgow and a flat.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Surely they are already free from the tyranny of their homelands whilst in France ?

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By *urewaterMan
over a year ago

Sex Lab

[Removed by poster at 01/09/15 10:49:53]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There are 10,000 empty homes in my home county alone. Britain isn't 'full' and migrants invariably bring in more money than they cost. People who say otherwise aren't looking at the facts, simple as that.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What about crimes rises in areas where there are no immigrants, who do you blame for that?

Probably people on benefits. Or Muslims.

That answer sums up the problem, I doubt you have ever been in a prison. I have a few times to work and they are full of people from abroad (not born here).

The thing is we are not allowed to talk about it because people shout racism.

Its a real problem it cant be brushed under the capret because it upsets the left wingers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again."
I say open our borders fullstop the country isn't ours anymore if it ever was humans should be able to travel anywhere they want and live where they want, I can't get a job now as it is so why worry about another couple of million people flooding our borders using our services education health benefit what difference does it actually make that someone created all of these things for the good of its own nationals ,Britain shares let them all have a piece share and share alike

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

People get confuse illegal immigrants with the 1000's that are allowed to come to Britain the countries already in the EU and able to claim mainstream benefits as soon as they get here. When British people see all these extra people coming to live here and see the strain that it puts on us they have no time or patience then for the asylum seekers that really need to come here for safety reasons. I think more should be done to stop all the people ckmmng here from EU countries cos they aren't in trouble where they live, they want to come here for the better paid jobs or the benefits but they could just stay where they live then we would be a big more tolerant of the people seeking asylum here. The UK is full and people are pissed off but we're getting angry at the wrong people, we could and we should take more asylum seekers but there's no room for them cos of all the millions that come here from EU countries and I know some Brits move to Spain or Cyprus and things to retire or whatever but the amount of Brits out vs EU citizens in is not equal and besides the Brits that go to another country to live out their retirement will usually have all their own money and savings and shit.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are 10,000 empty homes in my home county alone. Britain isn't 'full' and migrants invariably bring in more money than they cost. People who say otherwise aren't looking at the facts, simple as that."

What facts have you read that they bring in more money then take out.

Every job someone from abroad takes it another local out of work who are now on benifits.

Ive had builders in my house for the last 4 weeks, all foreign, all `tradesmen` all earning less then whatI was payed 20 years ago on the building sites.

In London my kids have been told to move out and buy a place if they want to live on their own or with their other halfs.

Kids go out of the boroughs to schools.

you wait hours in A and E because you cant get Doctors appoitments.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What about crimes rises in areas where there are no immigrants, who do you blame for that?

Probably people on benefits. Or Muslims.

That answer sums up the problem, I doubt you have ever been in a prison. I have a few times to work and they are full of people from abroad (not born here).

The thing is we are not allowed to talk about it because people shout racism.

Its a real problem it cant be brushed under the capret because it upsets the left wingers."

Actually I do volunteer work in a couple of prisons where the populace was largely white men - should we stop white men from coming to this country? Should we kick some white men out of the country in case they cause crime? Of course not, because people should be treated as individuals, not as 'herds'.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What about crimes rises in areas where there are no immigrants, who do you blame for that?

Probably people on benefits. Or Muslims.

That answer sums up the problem, I doubt you have ever been in a prison. I have a few times to work and they are full of people from abroad (not born here).

The thing is we are not allowed to talk about it because people shout racism.

Its a real problem it cant be brushed under the capret because it upsets the left wingers.

But they are coming in as `herds` not in dribs and drabs.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"People get confuse illegal immigrants with the 1000's that are allowed to come to Britain the countries already in the EU and able to claim mainstream benefits as soon as they get here. When British people see all these extra people coming to live here and see the strain that it puts on us they have no time or patience then for the asylum seekers that really need to come here for safety reasons. I think more should be done to stop all the people ckmmng here from EU countries cos they aren't in trouble where they live, they want to come here for the better paid jobs or the benefits but they could just stay where they live then we would be a big more tolerant of the people seeking asylum here. The UK is full and people are pissed off but we're getting angry at the wrong people, we could and we should take more asylum seekers but there's no room for them cos of all the millions that come here from EU countries and I know some Brits move to Spain or Cyprus and things to retire or whatever but the amount of Brits out vs EU citizens in is not equal and besides the Brits that go to another country to live out their retirement will usually have all their own money and savings and shit. "

Spot on

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Let's kick all the right wing bigots out of the UK, and make some room for decent people who want to live here with their families.

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By *vsnikkiTV/TS
over a year ago

Limavady

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away."

I thoroughly agree. We all know that the UK can't afford to fund those that are economic migrants. I think it's very generous of you to offer to do so.

Genuine refugees are a different issue as they will all return to their place of birth when the cause of their status is over. I think that a pan European approach is necessary. I can't see why a "refugee" from Namibia or Mozambique travels thousands of miles to Europe.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What about crimes rises in areas where there are no immigrants, who do you blame for that?

Probably people on benefits. Or Muslims.

That answer sums up the problem, I doubt you have ever been in a prison. I have a few times to work and they are full of people from abroad (not born here).

The thing is we are not allowed to talk about it because people shout racism.

Its a real problem it cant be brushed under the capret because it upsets the left wingers.

People like you give me hope to carry on.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My question is for how long can we keep taking in thousands more people. We have natural population increase with births against deaths ratio. When will we become so populated that we can't sustain the population. Will the problems in other countries sort themselves out before we can't sustain our system,would it take 100s of years to plateau. Will people start leaving the UK if things become better back home? The government is already discouraging some people to have more than 2 children. We won't be around in 100 years to see the effects of population increase,our descendants will.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Let's kick all the right wing bigots out of the UK, and make some room for decent people who want to live here with their families.

who is a right wing bigot

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Let's kick all the right wing bigots out of the UK, and make some room for decent people who want to live here with their families.

who is a right wing bigot"

You tell me.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Ive had builders in my house for the last 4 weeks, all foreign, all `tradesmen` all earning less then whatI was payed 20 years ago on the building site"

So desperate people are being exploited by British employers, is what you're saying. Why don't you pay more for a team of British guys?

And UCL did an in-depth study into this last year that concluded migrants contribute more to the economy than they take out.

The other things you mentioned:

Kids can't afford to live in London? Then they don't get to live in London. Live somewhere cheaper. *shrug*

Waiting times at A+E? Underfunding and poor management.

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By *adysilkCouple
over a year ago

birmingham

we should be like australia and look after our own people who need more money for our hospitals and if you had the immigrants living by you it would change your mind about them ,I say let them live in the posh areas

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"a refugee is supposed to to register in the first safe country they reach.

NOT in the one who gives the best benefits, some have traveled through 4 safe countries before getting to the channel.

but we are seen as a soft touch "

An alternative _iew could be that as the UK and the USA armed the rebels to destabilise Libya and create ISIS to make refugees from Syria and Iraq homeless it should fall to us to resolve the problem.

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By *urewaterMan
over a year ago

Sex Lab

"My question is for how long can we keep taking in thousands more people. We have natural population increase with births against deaths ratio. When will we become so populated that we can't sustain the population. Will the problems in other countries sort themselves out before we can't sustain our system,would it take 100s of years to plateau. Will people start leaving the UK if things become better back home? The government is already discouraging some people to have more than 2 children. We won't be around in 100 years to see the effects of population increase,our descendants will. "

Simples. .. you keep sponsoring terrorism and bombing another country .. they keep coming.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Ive had builders in my house for the last 4 weeks, all foreign, all `tradesmen` all earning less then whatI was payed 20 years ago on the building site

So desperate people are being exploited by British employers, is what you're saying. Why don't you pay more for a team of British guys?

And UCL did an in-depth study into this last year that concluded migrants contribute more to the economy than they take out.

The other things you mentioned:

Kids can't afford to live in London? Then they don't get to live in London. Live somewhere cheaper. *shrug*

Waiting times at A+E? Underfunding and poor management."

ha ha ha brilliant replies.

my kids cant get a counciul house in London, why should they move away because immigrants are getting all the houses in our borough.

My house is being repaired by the council.

Why is social services being underfunded. Maybe the population is rising to fast and we cant substain it.

do you have a link to this `IN-DEPTH` study

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"a refugee is supposed to to register in the first safe country they reach.

NOT in the one who gives the best benefits, some have traveled through 4 safe countries before getting to the channel.

but we are seen as a soft touch

Italy and Germany take far more migrants than the UK.

It's not like no other countries are taking migrants in."

*Italy and Germany are bigger countries, we're an island.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Look to the government and the rich and powerful who support and manipulate them, they have manipulated you to look in the direction of Immigrants, Muslims and the vulnerable, so your attention is diverted away from what they are doing. But a lot of people can't see this and believe what they are told to believe.

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By *rivate auditionsMan
over a year ago

West Midlands

"a refugee is supposed to to register in the first safe country they reach.

NOT in the one who gives the best benefits, some have traveled through 4 safe countries before getting to the channel.

but we are seen as a soft touch

so going by these rules. no one should ever reach England? is that fair? that we take none!"

Do you really think we have not taken in any refugees?,we are not as big a country in size as France & Germany as you surely have noticed?,yet we still seem to have a lot of refugees in our towns & cities if you would care to travel about the country a bit and look.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

ha ha ha brilliant replies.

my kids cant get a counciul house in London, why should they move away because immigrants are getting all the houses in our borough.

My house is being repaired by the council.

Why is social services being underfunded. Maybe the population is rising to fast and we cant substain it.

do you have a link to this `IN-DEPTH` study"

I told you the source of the study. Google it.

Why don't you demand the council pay their workers more? Why can't your kids stay with you? Why do you have such a ridiculous sense of entitlement?

And underfunding of services is happening because of the rich (invariably white) men who wrecked the economy, not some poor migrants. Time to face up to the real enemy.

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By *rivate auditionsMan
over a year ago

West Midlands

"Let's kick all the right wing bigots out of the UK, and make some room for decent people who want to live here with their families.

Who is left wing & who is right wing by your definition?,and what do you call decent families?,ones that want to kill others by beheading them for being a different religion?.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Other countries take more than us per capita. This debate is happening everywhere. We're not as special as you think.

In fact, these countries have more refuges per head than the UK:

Malaysia

France

Zambia

Ethiopia

Central African Republic

Uganda

Burundi

Cyprus

Costa Rica

Sudan

Netherlands

Guinea-Bissau

Canada

Panama

Cameroon

Rwanda

Israel

Gambia

Austria

Luxembourg

Switzerland

Germany

Venezuela

Serbia

Mauritania

Norway

Ecuador

Yemen

Sweden

South Sudan

Iran

Pakistan

Kenya

Liberia

Montenegro

Turkey

Djibouti

Chad

Republic of the Congo

Syria

Lebanon

Jordan

So in fact, perhaps we should be stepping up. France, Netherlands, Austria, Luxembourg, Sweden, Switzerland, Netherlands, and Germany - they all have more refugees per native person than the UK.

One could easily argue that we are not doing enough."

There are many more countries closer to where the refugees live which aleady use their language and customes and is close to their own climate why on earth would they want to settle in cold wet miserable britain if it wasnt for the benefits?

And are we really expected to accept all these people because we once colonised their countries? I dont think so we gave them back their countries to rule themselves if they decide to shoot the shit out of one another thats their problem, its years since they were part of the UK. And to be honest if and when they get here many hate us anyway because of our past history and terrorise from within, not only would i not allow any more in id be strengthening our borders with the military using whatever is required to ensure they do not cross our borders

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" Why is social services being underfunded. Maybe the population is rising to fast and we cant substain it.

do you have a link to this `IN-DEPTH` study"

My partner's a social worker working for an agency because he gets paid MORE than double working for an Agency than he does working for the NHS.

....and guess what? The NHS employ him n a temporary contract through the agency.

Go figure!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"People like you give me hope to carry on.

Thanks, but we all do what we can. Except the people who don't do anything and then whine about it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

ha ha ha brilliant replies.

my kids cant get a counciul house in London, why should they move away because immigrants are getting all the houses in our borough.

My house is being repaired by the council.

Why is social services being underfunded. Maybe the population is rising to fast and we cant substain it.

do you have a link to this `IN-DEPTH` study

I told you the source of the study. Google it.

Why don't you demand the council pay their workers more? Why can't your kids stay with you? Why do you have such a ridiculous sense of entitlement?

And underfunding of services is happening because of the rich (invariably white) men who wrecked the economy, not some poor migrants. Time to face up to the real enemy."

People are not encouraged to see reality, they are in a vile little world of their own, for of hatred, anger and with no compassion.

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By *urewaterMan
over a year ago

Sex Lab

Seriously, I dont know why people are ranting about the amout of refugees or illlegal immigrants you taking in... YOUR country was and still is Instrumental in destroying these countries, bomb them to stoneage, sponsor terrorism in their countries yet you ranting about them coming here to better their lives... and not claim your ao called benefits. GET REAL!!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" Why is social services being underfunded. Maybe the population is rising to fast and we cant substain it.

do you have a link to this `IN-DEPTH` study

My partner's a social worker working for an agency because he gets paid MORE than double working for an Agency than he does working for the NHS.

....and guess what? The NHS employ him n a temporary contract through the agency.

Go figure!!!

Exactly. There is sooo much waste in the NHS - we have more than enough funding if the thing was run properly.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

And in my Borough they have built 1000s of new homes,some for people in council housing which has freed up older council properties. The waiting list is not getting any shorter. Britain isn't full but some areas are bursting at the seams. When you pack lots of people in together you get more friction and more trouble.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" Why is social services being underfunded. Maybe the population is rising to fast and we cant substain it.

do you have a link to this `IN-DEPTH` study

My partner's a social worker working for an agency because he gets paid MORE than double working for an Agency than he does working for the NHS.

....and guess what? The NHS employ him n a temporary contract through the agency.

Go figure!!!

Exactly. There is sooo much waste in the NHS - we have more than enough funding if the thing was run properly."

EXACTLY!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The Native Americans keep asking when all the illegal immigrants are going to leave North America, they've been there for hundreds of years now, and made a terrible mess of Turtle Island.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So funny to see people complaining about getting tarred with the racist brush, when they themselves are tarring all migrants with the 'lazy scrounger' brush.

How does that irony taste?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

ha ha ha brilliant replies.

my kids cant get a counciul house in London, why should they move away because immigrants are getting all the houses in our borough.

My house is being repaired by the council.

Why is social services being underfunded. Maybe the population is rising to fast and we cant substain it.

do you have a link to this `IN-DEPTH` study

I told you the source of the study. Google it.

Why don't you demand the council pay their workers more? Why can't your kids stay with you? Why do you have such a ridiculous sense of entitlement?

And underfunding of services is happening because of the rich (invariably white) men who wrecked the economy, not some poor migrants. Time to face up to the real enemy."

I would love to have them for ever but they want their own independents. How rude of you to suggest I have `such a ridiculous sense of entitlement`

I have paid council rent for over 30 years, my kids have all worked since 14 in Saturday jobs and full time since 16, This is their place of birth .

Why should my kids be put back in the queue over people who have just walked in to this country.

You seem to have trouble with white men, why is that.

Our country have been fucked over by dodgey politicians of allsexes and races.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So funny to see people complaining about getting tarred with the racist brush, when they themselves are tarring all migrants with the 'lazy scrounger' brush.

How does that irony taste?"

Rubbish, I work on facts.

no use brushing the immigrant problem under the carpet just in case it offends them

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Oh ok, you work on facts. I've quoted my sources, though I'm sure you didn't actually look at it, so where are yours? Or do you only have anecdotes and entitlement?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"a refugee is supposed to to register in the first safe country they reach.

NOT in the one who gives the best benefits, some have traveled through 4 safe countries before getting to the channel.

but we are seen as a soft touch

so going by these rules. no one should ever reach England? is that fair? that we take none!

no one said we haven't taken any. what annoys me is people complaining about people wanting a better life. if the tables were turned they would want the same. "not in my back yard" is all I hear.

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By *vsnikkiTV/TS
over a year ago

Limavady

And UCL did an in-depth study into this last year that concluded migrants contribute more to the economy than they take out.

I was interested to see this study but couldn't find it.

Did it exclude EU migrants (which are relevant to the general issue but not really to this post)?

In any case, I suspect an immigration policy that allowed needed workers in but excluded all dependants would show an even greater "profit". (I am not advocating a no dependants policy.)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Oh ok, you work on facts. I've quoted my sources, though I'm sure you didn't actually look at it, so where are yours? Or do you only have anecdotes and entitlement?"

I ask people I worked with about rates now, all have gone down to an unabstainable level.

I live across the road from my old primary school, each class has a maximum 3 English born kids in them 1 class have none.

The council have told me their is no where for my kids to go whilst all I see are more `immigrants` taking over places.

This is not a study this is real facts

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By *vsnikkiTV/TS
over a year ago

Limavady

"So funny to see people complaining about getting tarred with the racist brush, when they themselves are tarring all migrants with the 'lazy scrounger' brush.

How does that irony taste?"

The irony is perhaps that only yourself , on this thread, has mentioned lazy scroungers or racists. Are you applying stereotypes?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

And UCL did an in-depth study into this last year that concluded migrants contribute more to the economy than they take out.

I was interested to see this study but couldn't find it.

Did it exclude EU migrants (which are relevant to the general issue but not really to this post)?

In any case, I suspect an immigration policy that allowed needed workers in but excluded all dependants would show an even greater "profit". (I am not advocating a no dependants policy.)"

I just Googled 'UCL immigrant contribution'.

If you still can't find it, it concluded that EU immigrants contributed 34% more in taxes than they took out in benefits from 2000-11. Migrants from outside the EU contributed 2% more. The problem is when we look at the long-term effects, because as people get older they contribute less and cost more, but that's the same for everyone regardless of national origin.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The irony is perhaps that only yourself , on this thread, has mentioned lazy scroungers or racists. Are you applying stereotypes?"

No, I was responding to things people have said. But if that's how you want to play it then whatever.

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By *vsnikkiTV/TS
over a year ago

Limavady

"The irony is perhaps that only yourself , on this thread, has mentioned lazy scroungers or racists. Are you applying stereotypes?

No, I was responding to things people have said. But if that's how you want to play it then whatever."

But they hadn't said them on this thread.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"But they hadn't said them on this thread."

This is the only thread I'm replying to, so...

What, is it easier to try to attack me than the facts? Go ahead.

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By *arry247Couple
over a year ago

Wakefield

And don't say it's not about safety. For most displaced peoples it's entirely about safety. These are people who are looking for a safe place to live. .They want to make new lives."

So you are saying that France is not a safe place to live.

Why not it is not because of the countryside or the animals in France therefore it must be about the people in France.

If that is the case why should we allow the French access to the UK?

However it is interesting that other EU countries such as Germany & France are suggesting that the EU borders should have stronger border controls to stem illegal immigration

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By *vsnikkiTV/TS
over a year ago

Limavady

"But they hadn't said them on this thread.

This is the only thread I'm replying to, so...

What, is it easier to try to attack me than the facts? Go ahead."

I am not attacking anyone and certainly not attacking facts. I was pointing out that you accused people of things they just hadn't said. If you can't see that, dont worry about it; I wold apply to become a political special adivisor though!

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By *vsnikkiTV/TS
over a year ago

Limavady

And don't say it's not about safety. For most displaced peoples it's entirely about safety. These are people who are looking for a safe place to live. .They want to make new lives.

So you are saying that France is not a safe place to live.

Why not it is not because of the countryside or the animals in France therefore it must be about the people in France.

If that is the case why should we allow the French access to the UK?

However it is interesting that other EU countries such as Germany & France are suggesting that the EU borders should have stronger border controls to stem illegal immigration"

If we are going to ban the French, can we please do it ASAP so Ireland don't have to play them in the rugby world cup!

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By *iss_tressWoman
over a year ago

London

"Also I think we as a country should take the Australian approach no one gets in"

I'm sure the aborigines would agree with you.

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By *ngel n tedCouple
over a year ago

maidstone

I just don't understand how someone goes through all that hardship fleeing tyranny and oppression, then when they get here, they go home for a months holiday....does tyranny and oppression take time off as well?

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By *iss_tressWoman
over a year ago

London

Simples. .. you keep sponsoring terrorism and bombing another country .. they keep coming. "

In a nutshell.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I just don't understand how someone goes through all that hardship fleeing tyranny and oppression, then when they get here, they go home for a months holiday....does tyranny and oppression take time off as well?"

Women in my wife's office do that.

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By *razedcatMan
over a year ago

London / Herts

"Also I think we as a country should take the Australian approach no one gets in

I'm sure the aborigines would agree with you."

Burn.

People who advocate the closing or tightening up of borders... Do you not understand that mass migration, indeed integration, is the unstoppable force that our era will one day be remembered for?

Could any of you live in a poverty stricken or war torn country in this day and age, when images of Western wealth and luxury are liberally disseminated via TV, movies and social media? Of course you will be tempted to try and grab a piece of it for yourself, it's human nature.

Perpetuating the belief that we should be doing everything to stop migration, a them vs us mentality, is primitive. We need to spend more time looking at WHY these people are migrating (based on hard statistical evidence, not stereotypes), and improve conditions in their countries of origin so they have less reason to leave in search of a better life.

If you want my opinion, the main reason these countries are so poor and war stricken is because they're constantly being manipulated by predominantly EXTERNAL forces. Syria was a relatively peaceful place before suddenly Assad was a huge problem. Gaddafi was left to rule Libya for 40 years before suddenly he was a terrible dictator that had to be removed. We destabilised these countries. We caused this exodus. And we have to face up to the consequences.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Burn.

People who advocate the closing or tightening up of borders... Do you not understand that mass migration, indeed integration, is the unstoppable force that our era will one day be remembered for?

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Burn.

People who advocate the closing or tightening up of borders... Do you not understand that mass migration, indeed integration, is the unstoppable force that our era will one day be remembered for?

Er Just a minute.

While I would agree that idiot western politicians have had a hand in the disaster that has unfolded in Iraq, Syria, and Libya, that has very little to do with the "Lorry Jumpers". Most are from sub Saharan Africa. Maybe I have missed something but I don't remember Britain bombing Nigeria, Chad, Somalia, Ethiopia Etc. As for the "colonial past" well guess what? Somalia, Ethiopia and what is now Eritrea were Italian colony's and sod all to do with Britain.

So sorry but the "it's all our fault" shit just doesn't wash.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Burn.

People who advocate the closing or tightening up of borders... Do you not understand that mass migration, indeed integration, is the unstoppable force that our era will one day be remembered for?

Er Just a minute.

So sorry but the "it's all our fault" shit just doesn't wash. "

The

African migrants don't get passports here for identification.

They get disabled badges for their 4x4's

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Britain had colonies in Nigeria, Kenya, Sudan, the Cape, Gambia, the former Rhodesia, West Africa, etc. Our involvement and then abandonment of those countries completely destabilised them. The problems those countries face now are largely due to this, to say nothing of British politicians and arms dealers providing dictators and warlords with weapons and money.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Britain had colonies in Nigeria, Kenya, Sudan, the Cape, Gambia, the former Rhodesia, West Africa, etc. Our involvement and then abandonment of those countries completely destabilised them. The problems those countries face now are largely due to this, to say nothing of British politicians and arms dealers providing dictators and warlords with weapons and money."

Nonsense.

Of all the old colonial powers Britain left its colony's in a pretty good state.

For jumping ship and leaving them well and truly in the shit you should be looking at the Italians (Ethiopia Somalia) Portugal (Mozambique Angola) and Belgium (The Congo) before you start pointing fingers at Britain.

BTW The hair shirt is in the post.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

Oh and I forgot the French (Vietnam)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Because 'Nonsense' is such a great argument against historical fact.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Also I had to Google what a hair shirt was. You need some less archaic ways of patronising the people you disagree with.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Because 'Nonsense' is such a great argument against historical fact."

Then you must read a completely different version of history than the one in which I got an A at A level.

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By *vsnikkiTV/TS
over a year ago

Limavady

What about those former colonies that we "abandoned" that dont seem to be a problem eg Canada, Belize,Guyana, Australia, New Zealand, Fiji,Singapore

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

[Removed by poster at 01/09/15 15:44:43]

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By *vsnikkiTV/TS
over a year ago

Limavady

"Because 'Nonsense' is such a great argument against historical fact.

Then you must read a completely different version of history than the one in which I got an A at A level."

I agree your history reading seems to differ from mine as well! (Degree!)

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

What about those former colonies that we "abandoned" that dont seem to be a problem eg Canada, Belize,Guyana, Australia, New Zealand, Fiji,Singapore"

Well said.

Problem is that the revisionists only like to pluck out a few negatives and conveniently forget the positives.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What about those former colonies that we "abandoned" that dont seem to be a problem eg Canada, Belize,Guyana, Australia, New Zealand, Fiji,Singapore"

'Some former colonies are fine' is not a particularly solid argument tbh.

I think I'm done here. Enjoy your debate.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Because 'Nonsense' is such a great argument against historical fact.

Then you must read a completely different version of history than the one in which I got an A at A level.

I agree your history reading seems to differ from mine as well! (Degree!)"

OK I have to admit I didn't do the degree. Too busy making money.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"What about those former colonies that we "abandoned" that dont seem to be a problem eg Canada, Belize,Guyana, Australia, New Zealand, Fiji,Singapore

'Some former colonies are fine' is not a particularly solid argument tbh.

I think I'm done here. Enjoy your debate."

Neither is that some went to shit, but hey ho it's quite normal to pull out of a debate when you know you can't win.

I'm here for the duration.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What about those former colonies that we "abandoned" that dont seem to be a problem eg Canada, Belize,Guyana, Australia, New Zealand, Fiji,Singapore

'Some former colonies are fine' is not a particularly solid argument tbh.

I think I'm done here. Enjoy your debate.

Neither is that some went to shit, but hey ho it's quite normal to pull out of a debate when you know you can't win.

I'm here for the duration."

Maybe some people have lives away from the forum, be fair.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again."
I don't understand how David Cameron doesn't lay on a regular ferry service for them ,I mean surely the environment agency has been onto him about the health and safety issues involved clinging to a moving lorry without your seatbelt on

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"What about those former colonies that we "abandoned" that dont seem to be a problem eg Canada, Belize,Guyana, Australia, New Zealand, Fiji,Singapore

'Some former colonies are fine' is not a particularly solid argument tbh.

I think I'm done here. Enjoy your debate.

Neither is that some went to shit, but hey ho it's quite normal to pull out of a debate when you know you can't win.

I'm here for the duration.

Maybe some people have lives away from the forum, be fair."

11-10

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

oops sorry. That one made it 12-10 I suppose this one makes it 13-10.

Mrs has gone out, I've not got much on tonight so ridiculing left wing revisionist bullshit could be quite fun.

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By *anejohnkent6263Couple
over a year ago

canterbury

so nice to see that 3 of the migrants soon got a nice flat and 35 pound a week for food.lets do more to help our own and not these economic pests....Britain is slowly becoming a dump ground for crap.come to dover and see the areas where they live in groups and don't intergrate at all and make the housing areas gettos.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away."

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"so nice to see that 3 of the migrants soon got a nice flat and 35 pound a week for food.lets do more to help our own and not these economic pests....Britain is slowly becoming a dump ground for crap.come to dover and see the areas where they live in groups and don't intergrate at all and make the housing areas gettos."

Ooh no. The Notting Hill luvies would never do that. They'e socialists don't you know.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away.

I really wish we could have some upside down thumbs on here. That would be worth half a dozen at least.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Some on here and apparently most migrants / refugees seem to forget that IF France or any country in the EU makes them citizens of the EU then they will be able to travel to the UK legally whenever they wish.

I still believe that the UK caused a lot of the problem by supporting ISIS in the beginning so has more of a responsibility than other EU countries that did not arm the rebels, but the reality is they are there, they are dying while traffickers profit from their misery, and all because nobody wants to make a decision that offends the sovereignty of member and non member states. quite simple half a dozen refugee camps where people can be safe, given some dignity, get processed identify skills and languages then give the most appropriate passport, or send them back if they are not genuine.

There are many Syrians that are qualified doctors / nurses etc. and we have a health service that needs trained doctors and nurses.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Let's kick all the right wing bigots out of the UK, and make some room for decent people who want to live here with their families.

You mean those decent illegals in calais or what I would call criminals who break the law night after night by breaking and entering into lorries or the channel tunnel to try and enter our country illegally? It was also revealed on the programme last night they steal cargo from the lorries they break into so add theft to the list of criminal acts they commit.

People born here have a right to live here, all those "economic migrants" in calais don't.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

be so glad when this thread reaches its max. though its given me loads to block..

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

How about housing all the homeless British people who are out sleeping rough on the streets night after night in those empty houses then?

As for migrants bringing in more money than they cost the independent body Migration watch UK would probably disagree with you there.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

we are only a small island and we will soon be over populated if we open our boarders I live in a village and they are taking field after field up to build houses for people the village is now a town and not safe and nice to live in any more if I had the money I would leave this country lol

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By *ngel n tedCouple
over a year ago

maidstone

How about housing all the homeless British people who are out sleeping rough on the streets night after night in those empty houses then?

As for migrants bringing in more money than they cost the independent body Migration watch UK would probably disagree with you there. "

They must bring some money with them, barber shops, chicken shops, pizza shops and taxi's don't buy themselves

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

Simples. .. you keep sponsoring terrorism and bombing another country .. they keep coming. "

Maybe Jeremy Corbyn would like to sponsor terrorism? It now appears he was rather fond of Osama bin Laden.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

How about housing all the homeless British people who are out sleeping rough on the streets night after night in those empty houses then?

As for migrants bringing in more money than they cost the independent body Migration watch UK would probably disagree with you there.

They must bring some money with them, barber shops, chicken shops, pizza shops and taxi's don't buy themselves"

Maybe they spent some of their money on those cans of Fosters they were drinking on the programme last night to get pissed? Unless of course they "fell of the back of a lorry"?

You tell me?

Also thousands of pounds paid to people smugglers to get them over borders illegally? If these people are penniless with nothing to their name just where do they get these thousands of pounds from to begin with?

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By *ngel n tedCouple
over a year ago

maidstone

How about housing all the homeless British people who are out sleeping rough on the streets night after night in those empty houses then?

As for migrants bringing in more money than they cost the independent body Migration watch UK would probably disagree with you there.

They must bring some money with them, barber shops, chicken shops, pizza shops and taxi's don't buy themselves

Maybe they spent some of their money on those cans of Fosters they were drinking on the programme last night to get pissed? Unless of course they "fell of the back of a lorry"?

You tell me?

When they get in a lorry, the cargo then has to be destroyed, as it's deemed contaminated....one can only hope they get into some M&S lorries, minds will only change when they can't get their quail eggs and fois grais

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Neither is that some went to shit, but hey ho it's quite normal to pull out of a debate when you know you can't win.

I'm here for the duration."

That's an immensely childish response. Some of us have lives outside of Fab forums. Some of us remembered that we don't have to bash our heads against the wall in discussions like this.

One final correction, I'm a County Durham miner's daughter socialist. Never been to Notting Hill, nor seen the film.

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

"Neither is that some went to shit, but hey ho it's quite normal to pull out of a debate when you know you can't win.

I'm here for the duration.

That's an immensely childish response. Some of us have lives outside of Fab forums. Some of us remembered that we don't have to bash our heads against the wall in discussions like this.

One final correction, I'm a County Durham miner's daughter socialist. Never been to Notting Hill, nor seen the film."

Oh yes the usual socialist response.

Anybody and everybody who doesn't agree is childish, racist, sexist or some other bloody ist or ish.

Bottom line is the "Lorry Jumpers" are nothing but thugs and criminals egged on and supported by gangsters, Problem is that doesn't quite fit in with the socialist/internationalist _iew of the world. So any way of trying to shout down the dissenters is acceptable. Trotsky would be proud.

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By *aneandpaulCouple
over a year ago

cleveleys

Very TRUE

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've disagreed with other people on this thread and gone on to have perfectly amiable conversations with them privately. I'm not trying to silence debate, quite the contrary. You're the one with the problem right now. Who hurt you?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Couldn't care less which countrys do or don't take these migrants,or rather illegal migrants,about time border controls were re established in Europe,no point spending huge sums on security then letting anyone who decides the want to come,can! All these bleeding hearts so keen on flooding this country,hope you get surrounded by them in neighbouring houses,bet you'l change your outlook,Britain doesn't need or want more immigration.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Neither is that some went to shit, but hey ho it's quite normal to pull out of a debate when you know you can't win.

I'm here for the duration.

That's an immensely childish response. Some of us have lives outside of Fab forums. Some of us remembered that we don't have to bash our heads against the wall in discussions like this.

One final correction, I'm a County Durham miner's daughter socialist. Never been to Notting Hill, nor seen the film."

Hi swanny, can I ask something?

Just from what you're saying about being a socialist.

Isn't that why you're pro-immigration?

Coz you're snocialist and that's all part of the 'internationalism'?

Nothing wrong with believing in the comradeship. I don't myself, but anyway.

So, cutting to the chase.

You think mass immigration is right, as a principle. So no evidence nor arguments will influence that _iew?

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By *aneandpaulCouple
over a year ago

cleveleys

another one that talks the truth let these that try to be so righteous take them into there homes not just white English but others that have come here by the rules and work and pay tax

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By *iver_iew1Couple
over a year ago

gourock

notice they all end up in Glasgow so I will look after them

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So, cutting to the chase.

You think mass immigration is right, as a principle. So no evidence nor arguments will influence that _iew?

My arguments and sources are above in this thread.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

we live in a democracy. majority rule. so the minority can simply fall into line an stop complaining.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away."

Because they have no humanity

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You think mass immigration is right, as a principle

Wait, I didn't say that either! Ok I know people are keen to kick-a-Commie here but at least read the thread!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Couldn't care less which countrys do or don't take these migrants,or rather illegal migrants,about time border controls were re established in Europe,no point spending huge sums on security then letting anyone who decides the want to come,can! All these bleeding hearts so keen on flooding this country,hope you get surrounded by them in neighbouring houses,bet you'l change your outlook,Britain doesn't need or want more immigration."

^^ See. Perfect example right here.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Why is it that people who are caring, compassionate, and actually want to do something to help others and improve the world, are always called " lefties". or " red socialists", by the self centred people who care about nobody.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm actually a Soviet spy. Lock up your sons and daughters!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm actually a Soviet spy. Lock up your sons and daughters!"

Not Onatop?

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By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon

"Would you be 'more than happy' to live on £30 a week? Honestly?"

So, how much did they have/earn per week before?

I'll wager it was a lot less than 30 quid!

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By *orestersCouple
over a year ago

The Forest

"Why is it that people who are caring, compassionate, and actually want to do something to help others and improve the world, are always called " lefties". or " red socialists", by the self centred people who care about nobody."

I'm sure I remember on one thread that you said you have a disabled child? How would you feel if the essential services he/she needs were cut because the money was diverted from them to fund the various "needs" of illegal immigrants? If I've got the wrong person, I apologise, but the theoretical question still stands. The pot is only so deep.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm actually a Soviet spy. Lock up your sons and daughters!

Not Onatop?

Smothering free speech with my ample thighs!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 01/09/15 19:44:09]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm actually a Soviet spy. Lock up your sons and daughters!

Not Onatop?

Smothering free speech with my ample thighs!"

Bet you can't break brick walls with your head though.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Tell me if you was in their situation you wouldnt do the same

When you can sit there and say in all honestly that if you was in a war torn country you wouldnt try to get your family to a safer place and risk life and limb for your children then you can sit in judgement of what they are doing

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Don't try cheap manipulation tactics, there's money for both, ask the corporations and politicians about where the money is going, very low of you that one.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As a fully paid up 'bleeding heart guardian reading do-gooder' I demand to be included in that list.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As a fully paid up 'bleeding heart guardian reading do-gooder' I demand to be included in that list."

Sorry I missed you out, welcome.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its on ch4 10pm and its a documentary on how the immigrants get into the uk, it will be a good watch, will you tune in too?

Do you recon france should do more tho as they say "your welcome to try again", as they catch them on the lorries? So they are free to try again.

I probably won't watch, because it's likely to be a cesspit of humanity looking to demonise real human beings for wanting safety.

I still have no idea how anyone with a shred of humanity can turn these people away.

It is nothing, repeat nothing to do with safety.

The laws on asylum seekers are very clear they are supposed to claim aslylum at the first safe country they arrive in.

Those people trying to bypass the immigration procedures are illegal immigrants and do not deserve sympathy.

The French police have a duty to clamp down on those criminals and France should be paying the UK lorry drivers compensation.

IMO Europe should be treated as a whole. We should standardise how we treat migrants, and then migrants who have been rubber-stamped should be able to move as freely as a European citizen.

And don't say it's not about safety. For most displaced peoples it's entirely about safety. These are people who are looking for a safe place to live. .They want to make new lives.

Our colonial legacy is this. We treated them like shit and now they're looking to us for help. We have to help."
.

Then the Italians and the French should take them all

Libya was an Italian colony and so was Eritrea, the uk only got involved in Eritrea when they defeated the Italians in ww2 and even then only for a few years, Syria was ceded from the Ottoman empire in ww1 and im pretty sure it and Lebanon were the French section, we had Palestine and bits of Iraq.

In fact your much more likely to speak French as a Syrian than English, at one time in Libya a large minority of the population was Italian so again second languages would be Italian and if your from central Africa your second language would be French as most of that section was Belgium and French colonies.

We still retain commonwealth links with most of our ex African colonies except Zimbabwe and Gambia?.

Of course if being colonised and fucked over gives you some right to entry.... Then all of Europe is entitled to recompenses from Italy as for the Germans they never really had any colonies or empire except the Prussian and that was almost entirely European!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You think mass immigration is right, as a principle

Wait, I didn't say that either! Ok I know people are keen to kick-a-Commie here but at least read the thread!

No, I know you didn't say that.

That what I was asking. A lot of socialists think MI is a good principle, communists probably- I'm not sure.

the right used to call it freedom of movement.

Libertarians love it as well, in theory anyway.

So really my question is/was - how far do you go with a principle?

In my experience, not many hold out under all circumstances.

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By *orestersCouple
over a year ago

The Forest

Don't try cheap manipulation tactics, there's money for both, ask the corporations and politicians about where the money is going, very low of you that one."

It can, and probably will get to such a personal level. Don't shut the stable door after the horse has bolted.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have no idea how to answer that question, sorry.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It can, and probably will get to such a personal level. Don't shut the stable door after the horse has bolted. "

Have to say I thought it was very low to use someone's disabled children for political pointscoring. There was no need for it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Neither is that some went to shit, but hey ho it's quite normal to pull out of a debate when you know you can't win.

I'm here for the duration.

That's an immensely childish response. Some of us have lives outside of Fab forums. Some of us remembered that we don't have to bash our heads against the wall in discussions like this.

One final correction, I'm a County Durham miner's daughter socialist. Never been to Notting Hill, nor seen the film.

Hi swanny, can I ask something?

Just from what you're saying about being a socialist.

Isn't that why you're pro-immigration?

Coz you're snocialist and that's all part of the 'internationalism'?

Nothing wrong with believing in the comradeship. I don't myself, but anyway.

So, cutting to the chase.

You think mass immigration is right, as a principle. So no evidence nor arguments will influence that _iew?

"
.

I'm a socialist and I don't agree with mass emigration or immigration, I base my socialistic values on a society that gives everyone a helping hand and allows them the best chance to get ahead in life, that is obviously based on a nation state.

If you want to help people start at the source surely, you don't start mopping the floor while the pipes still leaking in my opinion.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

Tell me if you was in their situation you wouldnt do the same

They are already in a safe country though, its called France. They probably travelled through several other safe EU countries in order to get to France such as Hungary, greece, italy, etc. The "but they are trying to reach safety by coming to the uk" argument just does'nt hold any water when they have already travelled through most of europe to get to calais.

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By *vsnikkiTV/TS
over a year ago

Limavady

As a fully paid up 'bleeding heart guardian reading do-gooder' I demand to be included in that list.

Sorry I missed you out, welcome.

I doubt if anyone that knows me would describe me as left wing.

Why is it that the "lefties" and "red socialists" seem to think they have a monopoly on being caring, compassionate or wanting to do something for others and improve the world. Those of us right of centre just differ from those left of centre in the way we think that should happen.

There are self centered people throughout the political spectrum.

Even black shirts like me can read the Guardian!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It can, and probably will get to such a personal level. Don't shut the stable door after the horse has bolted.

Have to say I thought it was very low to use someone's disabled children for political pointscoring. There was no need for it."

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"we live in a democracy. majority rule. so the minority can simply fall into line an stop complaining.

Tell that to the disgruntled Labour, snp, lib dem supporters who organised an anti austerity rally just 2 weeks after losing the general election to the tories.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"we live in a democracy. majority rule. so the minority can simply fall into line an stop complaining.

Tell that to the disgruntled Labour, snp, lib dem supporters who organised an anti austerity rally just 2 weeks after losing the general election to the tories. "

and it changed what?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Don't try cheap manipulation tactics, there's money for both, ask the corporations and politicians about where the money is going, very low of you that one.

It can, and probably will get to such a personal level. Don't shut the stable door after the horse has bolted. "

It's not immigrants that concern me in this country, it's people like you.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

As a fully paid up 'bleeding heart guardian reading do-gooder' I demand to be included in that list.

Sorry I missed you out, welcome.

I doubt if anyone that knows me would describe me as left wing.

There are self centered people throughout the political spectrum.

Even black shirts like me can read the Guardian!"

No idea why they think they have the monopoly on it? Some on this thread seem to want to ignore the british homeless sleeping rough on our streets and give 10,000 empty houses in Durham to the economic migrants in calais.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

not long now. is it 175 that the thread closes?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As a fully paid up 'bleeding heart guardian reading do-gooder' I demand to be included in that list.

Sorry I missed you out, welcome.

I doubt if anyone that knows me would describe me as left wing.

There are self centered people throughout the political spectrum.

Even black shirts like me can read the Guardian!

Ah they must be the bleeding heart somewhat less liberal non-do-gooder daily mail readers. Why do you think that the powers that be haven't already filled these houses with our deserving homeless?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"not long now. is it 175 that the thread closes?

One can only hope so

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Simples. .. you keep sponsoring terrorism and bombing another country .. they keep coming.

Maybe Jeremy Corbyn would like to sponsor terrorism? It now appears he was rather fond of Osama bin Laden. "

AH, let's hope that Nigel Farage's extreme right wing and fascist pals in his European Group can come up with a final solution to Corbyn's evil ways

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