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2 thousand quid for an 8 hour shift

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

I believe as my mate would say.... That's unsustainable

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By *evaquitCouple
over a year ago

Catthorpe

Sounds like a stake out followed by an assassination.

Seriously though, to do what?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I believe as my mate would say.... That's unsustainable "

Depends on the product.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

It's rumoured to be the amount paid to an agency nurse by an NHS trust

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I believe as my mate would say.... That's unsustainable

Depends on the product. "

As per that.

For the NHS, that is ridiculous. In other industries, it certainly wouldn't be.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's rumoured to be the amount paid to an agency nurse by an NHS trust "

Lol if that's the case more ladies and gents would go through the training for £2000 for a shift.

I know a nurse who barely gets that a month doing 12 hour shifts! If she didn't want to help people so much should wouldn't do it.

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By *evaquitCouple
over a year ago

Catthorpe

Not sure of the dizzy heights of qualifications and role responsibilities a 'nurse' can reach these days but it does appear to me to be a very, very high amount to be paying out from a hospitals budget.

Him

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

It's on Jeremy vine at 12.

Agency staff costs

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I believe as my mate would say.... That's unsustainable

Depends on the product.

As per that.

For the NHS, that is ridiculous. In other industries, it certainly wouldn't be. "
.

You say that but really...

Take a look at football?

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By *rank EinsteinMan
over a year ago

Burton upon stather

If wewe're talking about ridiculous wages, footballers, 'nuff said

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

They also paid around 3500 for a Dr... was on news this morning

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The nurse/doctor won't see anywhere near that though.

They will see double of what there tiered rate is potentially.

The rest are the agency costs and profit.

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow


"It's rumoured to be the amount paid to an agency nurse by an NHS trust "

Almost the right words. Wrong order.

Should read 'the amount paid to an nursing agency by an NHS trust'

How much the nurse will see, far less take home is another matter.

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By *iamondjoeMan
over a year ago

Glastonbury

Sounds like the stuff of Daily Fail rants!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The nurse/doctor won't see anywhere near that though.

They will see double of what there tiered rate is potentially.

The rest are the agency costs and profit."

They will receive a sizeable chunk of that possibly 2 3rds depending on their set up i.e registered for VAT

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

This is a total guess but... I reckon if you look at the agencies and trace them back... You'll find some politicians lurking around somewhere!

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By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire


"It's on Jeremy vine at 12.

Agency staff costs"

Yep

Saw it in the papers a while back.

Trouble is, that's the risk you run with a target-based culture, coupled with fines/bonuses for non-compliance and poor management.

If I remember correctly it was around xmas, when managers had authorised too much annual leave, waiting lists were rising, an election was on the way and the opposition had decided to 'weaponise' the NHS.

What we really need is a large increase in nhs training, coupled with minimum term contracts (like the forces use).

Trouble is, with training taking years governments fear the next goverment will reap the credit, so take the easy option of trawling the rest of the world instead.

Mr ddc

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By *est Wales WifeCouple
over a year ago

Near Carmarthen


"It's on Jeremy vine at 12.

"

Must be true then.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

I misheard.... It was £2200 for a 12 hour shift

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

... And then you had the risks (and related costs should something happen) associated with not filling required staff numbers.

£2000 may be the charges needed by the agency for short-notice work.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"It's on Jeremy vine at 12.

Agency staff costs

Yep

Saw it in the papers a while back.

Trouble is, that's the risk you run with a target-based culture, coupled with fines/bonuses for non-compliance and poor management.

If I remember correctly it was around xmas, when managers had authorised too much annual leave, waiting lists were rising, an election was on the way and the opposition had decided to 'weaponise' the NHS.

What we really need is a large increase in nhs training, coupled with minimum term contracts (like the forces use).

Trouble is, with training taking years governments fear the next goverment will reap the credit, so take the easy option of trawling the rest of the world instead.

Mr ddc"
.

I'm shocked Mr d

The torygraph with a sensible answer

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I believe as my mate would say.... That's unsustainable

Depends on the product.

As per that.

For the NHS, that is ridiculous. In other industries, it certainly wouldn't be. .

You say that but really...

Take a look at football?"

Sorry, when I say ridiculous, I mean that its ridiculous to pay that to an agency when they are cutting nursing numbers.

In other industries, such fees would be neither ridiculous nor unsustainable. I can see people earn that in a matter of hours and it doesn't 'break' the industry.

As regards footballers, I agree it is ridiculous but is it unsustainable? that's a different debate.

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

Is there any reason why NHS Trusts can't start their own nursing agency?

That way costs could be better controlled and any profits returned to the NHS.

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By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire


"It's on Jeremy vine at 12.

Agency staff costs

Yep

Saw it in the papers a while back.

Trouble is, that's the risk you run with a target-based culture, coupled with fines/bonuses for non-compliance and poor management.

If I remember correctly it was around xmas, when managers had authorised too much annual leave, waiting lists were rising, an election was on the way and the opposition had decided to 'weaponise' the NHS.

What we really need is a large increase in nhs training, coupled with minimum term contracts (like the forces use).

Trouble is, with training taking years governments fear the next goverment will reap the credit, so take the easy option of trawling the rest of the world instead.

Mr ddc.

I'm shocked Mr d

The torygraph with a sensible answer "

More shocking is Hunt's reported proposed cap on agency costs - sounds a bit like limiting the profit private companies can make from the nhs. Now where did I hear that idea...?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The nurse/doctor won't see anywhere near that though.

They will see double of what there tiered rate is potentially.

The rest are the agency costs and profit.

They will receive a sizeable chunk of that possibly 2 3rds depending on their set up i.e registered for VAT"

It's not even close to that.

Several friends are Nurses who do their own, bank and agency work.

Whilst the agency rates are far higher than standard they still run inline with the rates of the tiers that they are qualified to and paid against by the NHS.

£2200 would be a night shift on a sunday over a bank holiday or something similar where the double/triple time plus extras adds up.

Still won't be anywhere near that they receive though.

The biggest issue with this is that the NHS literally can't get enough nurses to work those shifts.

I've seen it first hand where nurses will cherry pick the shifts they want, actually tell their supervisor the shifts they WON'T work (even though there is a contractual road system in place), call in sick if they don't want to work the shift, etc.

So the agencies can charge whatever they want as the wards can't go short of personnel.

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By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire


"Is there any reason why NHS Trusts can't start their own nursing agency?

That way costs could be better controlled and any profits returned to the NHS."

The trouble is, when a newly qualifed nurse is approached by an external agency and offered double his/her salary...

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I believe as my mate would say.... That's unsustainable

Depends on the product.

As per that.

For the NHS, that is ridiculous. In other industries, it certainly wouldn't be. .

You say that but really...

Take a look at football?

Sorry, when I say ridiculous, I mean that its ridiculous to pay that to an agency when they are cutting nursing numbers.

In other industries, such fees would be neither ridiculous nor unsustainable. I can see people earn that in a matter of hours and it doesn't 'break' the industry.

As regards footballers, I agree it is ridiculous but is it unsustainable? that's a different debate."
.

There's only two clubs in the premiership that generates enough income to pay the players wages, surely that's unsustainable or the equivalent to any other propped up industry?.

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By *est Wales WifeCouple
over a year ago

Near Carmarthen

The free market is a good thing when it suits this government, but you can't have nurses and doctors selling their labour for the highest amount, that's just not cricket.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The most I've heard first hand is £1500 for 10 hour locum registrar in A&E. My little brother is currently raking it in by picking up extra A&E shifts during his days off and annual leave, and he's barely qualified.

I was talking to a friend who works in NHS finance last week who'd been asked to cost up new nursing staff for a particular department. The reason given was that the nurses needed someone to help with the paperwork and clerical stuff to free up their time to spend with patients, but that director knew he'd only be allowed to employ new nurses, not clerical staff or healthcare assistants because they don't have the same emotional pull on the heartstrings of the public.

The staffing of the NHS and public sector in general is used as a political football, with predictable results like these.

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By *oe bloggs69Man
over a year ago

fife

I doubt very much the bank nurses will see 25% of that

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"It's on Jeremy vine at 12.

Agency staff costs

Yep

Saw it in the papers a while back.

Trouble is, that's the risk you run with a target-based culture, coupled with fines/bonuses for non-compliance and poor management.

If I remember correctly it was around xmas, when managers had authorised too much annual leave, waiting lists were rising, an election was on the way and the opposition had decided to 'weaponise' the NHS.

What we really need is a large increase in nhs training, coupled with minimum term contracts (like the forces use).

Trouble is, with training taking years governments fear the next goverment will reap the credit, so take the easy option of trawling the rest of the world instead.

Mr ddc.

I'm shocked Mr d

The torygraph with a sensible answer

More shocking is Hunt's reported proposed cap on agency costs - sounds a bit like limiting the profit private companies can make from the nhs. Now where did I hear that idea...? "
.

The worlds gove topsy turvy Mr d

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I believe as my mate would say.... That's unsustainable

Depends on the product.

As per that.

For the NHS, that is ridiculous. In other industries, it certainly wouldn't be. .

You say that but really...

Take a look at football?

Sorry, when I say ridiculous, I mean that its ridiculous to pay that to an agency when they are cutting nursing numbers.

In other industries, such fees would be neither ridiculous nor unsustainable. I can see people earn that in a matter of hours and it doesn't 'break' the industry.

As regards footballers, I agree it is ridiculous but is it unsustainable? that's a different debate..

There's only two clubs in the premiership that generates enough income to pay the players wages, surely that's unsustainable or the equivalent to any other propped up industry?.

"

You've got to look at assets as well though, solvency is not purely defined by income.

Allegedly some of these players/assets are worth £50 million!

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"The free market is a good thing when it suits this government, but you can't have nurses and doctors selling their labour for the highest amount, that's just not cricket. "
.

It's no more a free market than the premiership.

The government employee the vast majority involved in healthcare.

When you control 85% of anything it's a monopoly and you control it!.

How the fuck you manage to fuck up badly enough to end up paying that amount is just incompetency

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"I believe as my mate would say.... That's unsustainable

Depends on the product.

As per that.

For the NHS, that is ridiculous. In other industries, it certainly wouldn't be. .

You say that but really...

Take a look at football?

Sorry, when I say ridiculous, I mean that its ridiculous to pay that to an agency when they are cutting nursing numbers.

In other industries, such fees would be neither ridiculous nor unsustainable. I can see people earn that in a matter of hours and it doesn't 'break' the industry.

As regards footballers, I agree it is ridiculous but is it unsustainable? that's a different debate..

There's only two clubs in the premiership that generates enough income to pay the players wages, surely that's unsustainable or the equivalent to any other propped up industry?.

You've got to look at assets as well though, solvency is not purely defined by income.

Allegedly some of these players/assets are worth £50 million! "
.

Tesco tried that and look how that ended!

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By *heBirminghamWeekendMan
over a year ago

here

According to the owner of one of the agencies on bbc this morning, a nurse (can't remember the exact grade etc..) is charged at £26.66 per hour and of this it costs them £22.00. (Salary to nurse, ni, paye admin all the usual stuff).

Did point out that this was for standard situation (I.e not last minute.com, speciality theatre nurse etc...)

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By (user no longer on site)
Forum Mod
over a year ago

The NHS should may be look at why their workforce of nurses is leaving in droves and try to rectify that

Then they wouldn't be held to ransom in difficult situations by nursing agencies

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I spoke to a nurse a few days ago who told me she gave up her 23 hour NHS nursing job to go on an agency and was working a 12hour shift on bank hol Monday and getting paid £90 per hour, even after tax she took home £960 for 1 shift, she said she only need to work 1 day poet month at that rate, crazy money

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