FabSwingers.com forum: St. George's Flag: How Are We Conditioned?

By *radleyandRaven OP Couple
over a year ago

Herts

We drove past a pub the other day that had painted the St.George's cross all across the front.

Without thinking, upon mentioning the new paint job, one of our friends in the back seat commented that it looks tacky and it got us talking.

I DO look at St.George's flags sometimes and think this, but why?

Do we associate them with footy fans and a certain group of people who went into over-drive with them when those silly rumours of "foreigners are offended by our flag/football shirts and want them banned", etc started flying around?

As a genuine question, do you find patriotism and flag-donning tacky, and if so, why do you think you feel that way?

And also if so, is it just our flag or all flags?

Be honest.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *alandNitaCouple
over a year ago

Scunthorpe

As a Rugby fan, the Georges cross reinforces my patriotic feelings... I'm proud of my country

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think it looks very nationalistic no matter what flags painted on it.

Scottish

Spanish

German

Italian

Regardless it doesn't look great. Imo.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
Forum Mod
over a year ago

I like to see the flag,I think its nice to be patriotic and not allow other factors detract from what its true meaning is

I wouldn't like to see it painted across the front of a pub thats just tacky regardless of what flag it is

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I see no problem with a national flag looking nationalistic. I like our flags, both of them.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If Pangaea never seperated, there would be no flags.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I am Welsh , and I think its time all English people reclaimed your flag and mot just see it as a symbol of the right wing.

Be proud of your heritage and dont let silly people hijack your national flag

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ust RachelTV/TS
over a year ago

Horsham

I actually associate the St. Georges flag with World superbike racing. They were all over the trackside, normally with some slogan cheering Foggy on.

The ones with football paraphernalia on look extremely tacky.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

I think through Union flag looks patriotic at is more acceptable than before. The St George Cross seems to always be really cheaply produced and agree it does look tacky. I think it has been hijacked by racists and so I don't really like it that much.

I would much rather see the Union flag all across the UK than the St Andrews Cross, the Welsh Dragon etc. Which I think I _iew as exclusionary rather than inclusionary. I think there are more things that bind us together in the UK, than separate us.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's a white rectangle with a couple of white lines, bit boring. Look at Americas fancy schmancy flag with stars and that.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Id have second thoughts about walking into a pub with this painted on the wall. However if it was on a flag pole it wouldn't bother me.

I'm a bit of a snob when it comes to the pubs I frequent.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *omSub_bullcplCouple
over a year ago

Biddeford

I love our flag but I hate the fact it's often sold with "England" printed across the horizontal part of the cross. Like we need to be told what it is!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *eMontresMan
over a year ago

Halesowen

I'm not against the English having a national flag, but I think the George Cross is not the best choice. It originated in the crusades, which was not the west's finest hour. In any event, we adopted it from the French after initially having gone for a white cross, and the French for a red cross, in a Holy (but so unholy) alliance with French forces to invade the middle east.

Whenever I see it, I cringe.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *inaTitzTV/TS
over a year ago

Titz Towers, North Notts

I think it's naff, personally. I don't have to fly a flag to feel British or anything.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

Tacky

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *radleyandRaven OP Couple
over a year ago

Herts

"Tacky

What do you think makes you feel that way about it though?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Perhaps if they were more proudly displayed the St George cross might be more accepting.

Should be law its displayed outside every town hall in the land to begin with. We're just used to see in a window in a pub or hanging from a gutter in some council block.

Go to America and the Stars and Stripes are flying high and proud everywhere.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ere-for-my-convenienceWoman
over a year ago

Tenbury Wells

"I am Welsh , and I think its time all English people reclaimed your flag and mot just see it as a symbol of the right wing.

Be proud of your heritage and dont let silly people hijack your national flag "

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *radleyandRaven OP Couple
over a year ago

Herts

"Perhaps if they were more proudly displayed the St George cross might be more accepting.

Should be law its displayed outside every town hall in the land to begin with. We're just used to see in a window in a pub or hanging from a gutter in some council block.

Go to America and the Stars and Stripes are flying high and proud everywhere. "

Very true.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I ubfortunately now _iew it with a negative association due to watching marches by the EDL And Britain first with the flag hoisted in the air. It is a shame but for me, I dont have a good association with the flag. I know I should not base my _iews on the flag because of a small group of people but its just my mindset now.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Being born n bred English but my blood being English and Irish my adopted family Scottish and Welsh n English and now living in Wales i feel I'm the perfect representative of the UK

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *taffs_hotwifeCouple
over a year ago

Wolverhampton

"Perhaps if they were more proudly displayed the St George cross might be more accepting.

Should be law its displayed outside every town hall in the land to begin with. We're just used to see in a window in a pub or hanging from a gutter in some council block.

Go to America and the Stars and Stripes are flying high and proud everywhere. "

This!

Fine anyone who defaces the flag with tacky slogans, pictures and 'ENG-ER-LAND' written on it too!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

I like to see the St Georges flag out and about, nothing wrong with being patriotic. I'm a big football fan so put mine on show when England play in the World cup or the euros.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

"Tacky

What do you think makes you feel that way about it though?"

One flag on a pole that is kept maintained, fine.

If hanging out the windows ... No

any that goes for any flags, not just the one you mentioned

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My flag has six bars across it - all in lovely pretty rainbow colours.....!

I often fly it with Pride....

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *radleyandRaven OP Couple
over a year ago

Herts

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian. "

So you would naturally associate it with racists?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It's a white rectangle with a couple of white lines, bit boring. Look at Americas fancy schmancy flag with stars and that."

Isnt a white flag with white stripes a French wartime flag?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *taffs_hotwifeCouple
over a year ago

Wolverhampton

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian. "

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian. "

I find when i walk into a pub people look up or stare, and i'm white. If you have been in a pub for a while and someone new walks in don't you look or stare to see who it is? Is'nt it a natural thing to look when someone walks into a pub? Think maybe you are being paranoid?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *allipygousMan
over a year ago

Leicester

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian. "

And as a counterpoint, when there is some world sporting event going on I wish the racists would take a wonder around Leicester and see the cross of St. George displayed in various areas dominated by Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs, by Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian.

Try it in deepest darkest Wales as you open the door everyone's speaking English as you walk in everyone switches to welsh lol

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Meh I think your probably right in what your thinking.

America can fly it's flag and it's patriotic but the George's cross being flown defiantly carries undertones of rasicm

Don't get me wrong

You don't get any more Celt blood than mine. But we were first sold out by the ruling classes back when there was 11 kings of England

It's just a war banner now. I don't know what or who I'd be show honour to.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Those ashamed of their flag are as much a problem as those who abuse it. No English sportsman would be ashamed of the English flag.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Perhaps if they were more proudly displayed the St George cross might be more accepting.

Should be law its displayed outside every town hall in the land to begin with. We're just used to see in a window in a pub or hanging from a gutter in some council block.

Go to America and the Stars and Stripes are flying high and proud everywhere. "

I think we Brits are measured in our display of national pride. Particularly the English, of which I am one.

I don't believe patriotism should be taught in the classroom as it is in the U.S.A. That's edging towards brainwashing. I happened to be in Lithuania on their independence day, when it's law to display the national flag at every household. That's dictatorial.

My pride in my country is strong. Nobody taught it to me or inflicted it upon me. It runs through my veins.

I've only ever displayed the flag on one occasion. When I draped the Union Jack across my Fathers coffin to accompany him to his grave. He survived the siege of Tobruk,Auschwitz and The Death March for King and Country. And for me.

Enough said.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian.

Try it in deepest darkest Wales as you open the door everyone's speaking English as you walk in everyone switches to welsh lol"

I worked as a bank carer in a nursing home like that up the other side of denbigh

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ok too many to reply back individually in this thread, to my intial post but I'll try and sum it all up

The stares were agrressive, and to define 'aggressive stares' they were squinting snarling stares not your normal 'oh he's new in this pub' type of stare.

Yes I do associate the St Georges cross with racists.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ath_Neil_bifunCouple
over a year ago

near cardiff

I'm patriotic to a point..when I'm watching wales play but that's about it.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *ath_Neil_bifunCouple
over a year ago

near cardiff

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian.

Try it in deepest darkest Wales as you open the door everyone's speaking English as you walk in everyone switches to welsh lol"

I'm welsh,I'm a welsh speaker I can assure that does not happen in south wales cause there are no welsh speaking communities here!,and only 20% of wales can speak welsh,and only a few thousand speak it as a part of their daily lives outside the classroom

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian. "

Have you ever been threatened in an establishment that hasn't displayed the flag? I'm guessing you have as I certainly have so I'm not sure what you're getting at?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *umpkinMan
over a year ago

near the sounds of the wimborne quarter jack!

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian. "

The same thing would happen if you walked into certain pubs in Portsmouth of Plymouth if you were dressed in an RAF uniform!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian.

Have you ever been threatened in an establishment that hasn't displayed the flag? I'm

guessing you have as I certainly have so I'm not sure what you're getting at?

Ok, I elaborate - I walked and within a minute I had somebody in face saying "nobody's ordered a taxi, so fuck off"

Yes people have threatened me before in pubs before, after a disagreement over something, but not after the first minute of walking into a pub, and the reason being simply the colour of my skin

You get what im getting at now ?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've always considered myself English but never felt the need to display it!

I'm very proud to be a Mancunian but I don't feel the need to put that on a flag pole either

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Does anybody else NOT associate themselves with being english? I know if someone asks me my nationality that's what i am, but i feel the word doesn't mean anything else. Like i'm just a person and some words used to describe me don't mean anything to me.

I don't follow sports or anything so that probably doesn't help.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Does anybody else NOT associate themselves with being english? I know if someone asks me my nationality that's what i am, but i feel the word doesn't mean anything else. Like i'm just a person and some words used to describe me don't mean anything to me.

I don't follow sports or anything so that probably doesn't help."

You didn't feel proud during the Olympic ceremony? You don't feel a pride at being from the same country as Dickens, Newton, Darwin, The Beatles? The island that stood against the Nazi's?

We were discussing something similar earlier - about how do people gain national pride if they don't care about sports/royalty etc. It should be easy given our history but it's a sad state of our education (or general ignorance) that so many aren't aware of it.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *radleyandRaven OP Couple
over a year ago

Herts

I don't follow sports or anything so that probably doesn't help.

You didn't feel proud during the Olympic ceremony? You don't feel a pride at being from the same country as Dickens, Newton, Darwin, The Beatles? The island that stood against the Nazi's?

I enjoy learning about our history, but have to admit, I couldn't care less about sports or the Royal family...

They just aren't something I can dwell up a natural interest in.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A lot of people can't buy they seem to be our main focus of national pride - which is a bit shit.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I am Welsh , and I think its time all English people reclaimed your flag and mot just see it as a symbol of the right wing.

Be proud of your heritage and dont let silly people hijack your national flag "

i agree! Im proud of my St Andrews cross!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *radleyandRaven OP Couple
over a year ago

Herts

"A lot of people can't buy they seem to be our main focus of national pride - which is a bit shit."

Hmm, true.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I LOVE the George cross but tbh I love the Union Jack more that's what makes me proud.

Plus it helps that it transpires well into fashion ect.

We have a Flag that's even cooler then the US so lets celebrate that.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The Union Jack does look cooler - unless you're Welsh

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As all peoples experiences above show, it all depends on the context of the flags' use.

If it is used on a march by the EDL it doesn't make the average English person proud, but the flag used in conjunction with patriotism at a rugby or football match, it is being used to support the team and show unity between the fans.

It can be a fine line.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The Union Jack does look cooler - unless you're Welsh

Yeah never thought about that before but why the hell its not in there.

But the Union Jack is the coolest flag ever in the world and the rest know it.

We win. xx

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The Union Jack does look cooler - unless you're Welsh

Yeah never thought about that before but why the hell its not in there.

But the Union Jack is the coolest flag ever in the world and the rest know it.

We win. xx"

It's not on it because Wales was considered to be part of England at the time of the union (best keep that quiet).. but the Welsh have a dragon on their flag and that's cool enough

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The Union Jack does look cooler - unless you're Welsh

Yeah never thought about that before but why the hell its not in there.

But the Union Jack is the coolest flag ever in the world and the rest know it.

We win. xx

It's not on it because Wales was considered to be part of England at the time of the union (best keep that quiet).. but the Welsh have a dragon on their flag and that's cool enough

"
Very Harry Potter.

How many countries can claim that

See the UK is super cool.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don't follow sports or anything so that probably doesn't help.

You didn't feel proud during the Olympic ceremony? You don't feel a pride at being from the same country as Dickens, Newton, Darwin, The Beatles? The island that stood against the Nazi's?

I did like the music at the opening ceremony, but the rest of the sport stuff i didn't watch or care for. Didn't care if someone i don't know won a bit of metal on a string either. The games are just pointless to me, same for supporting teams or supporting famous people, they're nobody i know and unimportant to my life, as are their achievements.

I just don't care if anyone competes and they are no-one i know, obviously i root for relatives and mates and their kids when they achieve something i feel proud, but anyone else i don't care and don't feel like they matter just because they were born here like i was.

I know loads about social history, farming history, and things like that and find that interesting. Newton got some theories disproved by a french woman and that never got given to us in my education. Darwin comes off a bit racist if i'm honest, but as a fan of eugenics i appreciate all he figured out in his time. I don't feel like i have a link with these people either, just because i was born in the same country. I don't even know these people and never spoke to them, they just exist(ed) and aren't anything to do with me.

Just the way i feel about it. And yeah i get most people aren't like that, was hoping to find people who are like me.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Every nation should have the same flag, we're all from the same place. Every flag should have a vaj on it.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Picking holes in a scientists theories after a few centuries of studies based on their initial work pretty much misses the point.

I understand people not caring about sport. I can't really understand not feeling some pride at where you live and where you're from. Were it not for our history it could be us living terrible lives. Remembering all those that sacrificed their lives in so many ways towards this seems important to me.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Picking holes in a scientists theories after a few centuries of studies based on their initial work pretty much misses the point.

I'm not picking at theories, just saying how i feel about them and trying to explain myself because i totally get that people aren't like me usually. I spent some time googling last night why people like sport coz i wanted to understand that.

I don't feel a national pride. I just don't believe that one person in your country achieving something means i was a part of that achievement, in the same way that you wouldn't class yourself as a serial prostitute murderer just because Peter Sutcliffe is english. I just feel nothing for places, some places i enjoy going to and would love to live there but that's it for me.

My country means nothing to me as a feeling, sorry i can't help how my brain works.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'd be worried too if I couldn't help how my brain worked

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I LOVE the George cross but tbh I love the Union Jack more that's what makes me proud.

Plus it helps that it transpires well into fashion ect.

We have a Flag that's even cooler then the US so lets celebrate that.

I feel more about the Union Jack flying than the English flag but I don't really think of myself as 'English'. Another reason I was glad the Scots voted no to independence, the options being proposed for if we had to take the St Andrew's Cross out of it all looked shite.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'd be worried too if I couldn't help how my brain worked

I don't want to change it and i can still function so i'm not worried. I don't see the point in being proud of something that i did nothing to help them achieve and the person who achieved it means nothing to me.

Like i said i googled about liking sport because i don't get that (despite how popular it is). I still don't get it, although i now have some ideas about how it works and why people enjoy it and the reasons do make sense, even if i don't agree with them personally.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Haven't read the thread sorry so not swayed by any previous posts.

I think the flag has been taken over by certain racist groups and is now tainted, which is sad. It needs reclaiming.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'd be worried too if I couldn't help how my brain worked

You could Google VE Day and see if that resonates better.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'd be worried too if I couldn't help how my brain worked

You could Google VE Day and see if that resonates better.

I've always been like this, too logical probably. Don't get why gossip happens and people care about others lives so much when they aren't a part of them, same for 'reality' tv, never got into that coz i don't care about the people in them.

I can appreciate things people have done but they don't relate to me in any way in terms of personal pride etc. Not even the war and winning that, although i appreciate my life would be different if we hadn't won.

I'm still trying to figure out sports yet lol, not googling anything else yet.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Sports are a vehicle for national pride, not a cause. People that represent their country (or dream to) will associate their national flag in a certain way - but there are plenty who change their allegiance or have mixed allegiances.

I think a sense of history, culture and heritage are more relevant (good and bad).

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sports are a vehicle for national pride, not a cause. People that represent their country (or dream to) will associate their national flag in a certain way - but there are plenty who change their allegiance or have mixed allegiances.

I think a sense of history, culture and heritage are more relevant (good and bad).

I googled anti-nationalism and got my answer, i am humanitarian so it makes sense not to develop a pride for one particular (or several) subset(s) of people. As for sport, loads of people aren't into it either so it's not as unusual as i thought. It probably is down to the fact that i don't want conflict as well, and even sport is a type of conflict, with 'winners' and 'losers'.

I don't believe the history of a country means anything more than give lessons to be learned from it anyway, although it can also have it's interesting moments as well. As for culture, i don't actually see the uk as having one, apart from consumerism and enslavement of people on a mass scale. I don't have a heritage either, not just because i don't see possessions as important but also because access to many things costs money so i haven't even inherited anything that belongs to the country as someone else forces me to pay for the privilege of the countries possessions use.

Well was interesting looking into stuff anyway. Glad i have free internet access to a lot of information, hope my country doesn't limit education on the internet and the internet overall or else i will start to hate my country.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *icky999Man
over a year ago

warrington

Its not very English flag waving. Only wave the union jack(and it is.geek) to keep the dominions happy and were too polite to say fuck off!

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It just makes me think of Templars.

And isn't it the 'Union Jack' if it's on a boat? Think I remember Stephen Fry saying it on QI.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hite SnakeMan
over a year ago

leeds

"The Union Jack does look cooler - unless you're Welsh

Yeah never thought about that before but why the hell its not in there.

But the Union Jack is the coolest flag ever in the world and the rest know it.

We win. xx

It's not on it because Wales was considered to be part of England at the time of the union (best keep that quiet).. but the Welsh have a dragon on their flag and that's cool enough

Its not on because the union flag is the flag of the united kingdoms Wales being a principality wasn't included.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *hite SnakeMan
over a year ago

leeds

"If Pangaea never seperated, there would be no flags."

Yes there would Europe is mostly one land mass yet each country has its own flag.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian.

Have you ever been threatened in an establishment that hasn't displayed the flag? I'm

guessing you have as I certainly have so I'm not sure what you're getting at?

Ok, I elaborate - I walked and within a minute I had somebody in face saying "nobody's ordered a taxi, so fuck off"

Yes people have threatened me before in pubs before, after a disagreement over something, but not after the first minute of walking into a pub, and the reason being simply the colour of my skin

You get what im getting at now ? "

But you're connecting racist abuse, which is of course inexcusable, with a place that displayed the flag. Racist abuse happens in every town, city, village not just in places that display the St George flag. It was a coincidence in your case.

Your argument would suggest if I owned a pub and had a St George flag outside, chances are you'd be racially abused?

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I don't believe the history of a country means anything more than give lessons to be learned from it anyway, although it can also have it's interesting moments as well. As for culture, i don't actually see the uk as having one, apart from consumerism and enslavement of people on a mass scale. I don't have a heritage either, not just because i don't see possessions as important but also because access to many things costs money so i haven't even inherited anything that belongs to the country as someone else forces me to pay for the privilege of the countries possessions use.

Your heritage includes your ability to share your thoughts online. Benefits from people like Berners-Lee and Turing whose work you clearly appreciate, albeit dismiss. It includes the freedom to be ignorant and apathetic thanks in part to the people marching through London today.

The house you live in, the streets you walk, the shops you use, the healthcare you benefit from are all part of your heritage.

You're similarly surrounded by culture, albeit apparently oblivious. The language you are using is both heritage and culture.

Our flags represent all of this and more.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian.

Have you ever been threatened in an establishment that hasn't displayed the flag? I'm

guessing you have as I certainly have so I'm not sure what you're getting at?

Ok, I elaborate - I walked and within a minute I had somebody in face saying "nobody's ordered a taxi, so fuck off"

Yes people have threatened me before in pubs before, after a disagreement over something, but not after the first minute of walking into a pub, and the reason being simply the colour of my skin

You get what im getting at now ?

Your argument would suggest if I owned a pub and had a St George flag outside, chances are you'd be racially abused?"

I think what he is saying is that due to past experiences, he has been conditioned to make certain associations... Which is essentially what the OP asked...

Of course, common sense suggests that not all flag wielders are the same, nor are all pubs. A shame he had such experiences...hopefully a few better ones will help erase previous memories and delink the negative associations.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *L RogueMan
over a year ago

London

"Beleive me, if I saw a pub with a big St George's flag hung outside, or as the OP suggests painted across the building i wouldn't set foot anywhere near it.

I walked into 3 pubs (one in South, 2 in the Midlands) and the whole pub stopped and almost burned me to dust with their stares

In one of them, I was threatened before I even got a drink

Why ? All because im indian.

Have you ever been threatened in an establishment that hasn't displayed the flag? I'm

guessing you have as I certainly have so I'm not sure what you're getting at?

Ok, I elaborate - I walked and within a minute I had somebody in face saying "nobody's ordered a taxi, so fuck off"

Yes people have threatened me before in pubs before, after a disagreement over something, but not after the first minute of walking into a pub, and the reason being simply the colour of my skin

You get what im getting at now ?

Your argument would suggest if I owned a pub and had a St George flag outside, chances are you'd be racially abused?

I think what he is saying is that due to past experiences, he has been conditioned to make certain associations... Which is essentially what the OP asked...

I've encountered similar to be honest.

. But I know it's a few mindless idiots! But sadly, the flag has been "hijacked" by extreme _iews. I don't think it's conditioning but the associations from society. For example, I'd be less threatened I saw the union flag. I'd also be more likely to have one myself as I'm proud to be British. Albeit through Caribbean heritage.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

I don't give a shit about flags. It's a piece of cloth and not worth getting worked up about.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

spent about 2 hours yesterday painting union flags and making bunting.. i embrace my nationality and love it when i see others doing the same

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *heOwlMan
over a year ago

Altrincham

Prior to hopping over the pond for 4 years, I was quite proud to fly the Union Jack (we are a union after all). However after experiencing the rediculous perocial nature over there with the stars and stripes so heavily imbeded in it, no I have difficulty with any flag flying - no matter what the flag is.

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I dont care for any flag...but i do have a flag waving outside...FREE FANNY LICKS

some neighbours dfont like it

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

By *radleyandRaven OP Couple
over a year ago

Herts

Some interesting responses so far.

Thank you all. x

Reply privately

Reply in forum

Reply +quote

Post new Message to Thread