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Austerity - Is it all it's cracked up to be?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have cut back yes and started to save pretty well

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/02/15 16:58:28]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've cut back loads, had to coz my money coming in went down by a third and my money going out went up, by less than a third but i'm pissed off about it.

I'm not struggling because ***edited for the sites sake***, but don't see why i should have to go without.

When the government breaks the rules then it gives me free rein to do so as well. Fuck them and their law.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

"

Cut back a little, i'd say for a short time this is acceptable.

Don't see why anyone should be going without though, and many peoples means are not enough to live off now. Everyone should have their basic needs attended to, and there should be more equilibrium when it comes to luxuries as well.

Won't happen while we continue to allow a bunch of sociopaths run society though.

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By *educedWoman
over a year ago

Birmingham

It's going to get worse for those who are less well off (particularly young people) if the Conservatives get in again as more benefit cuts are planned.

Universal Credit will see the number of people who are homeless increase as they choose to spend Housing Benefit etc on food and heating and then are subsequently evicted.

There will be no front line services to support the vulnerable either (or very few) as they are being decimated by austerity measures or are delivered by third sector organisations who are all scrambling around for the same pots of money.

Don't get me started on the despicable plans Cameron has in store for young people. We are facing a huge crisis as a society.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

"

everyone is experiencing it in one form or another.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've only really noticed it with my public sector clients. They're spending less and inviting more companies than usual to respond to tenders which is making it more difficult to acquire them or retain them. The private clients don't have the same issues.

I'm fortunate in that it hasn't affected me personally.

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By *londeCazWoman
over a year ago

Arse End of the Universe, Cumbria

I've had to cut the Butler's hours and let one of the house slaves go...it's a bugger

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

"

Depends if you are a moaning kind of person or a doing kind of person I reckon.

Some people are just naturally negative and so look for excuses for their own failures. Austerity is a good excuse because it can be blamed on the government.

Funny though, that all through good times and bad times, some people just get on with their lives and adapt their behaviour and lifestyle to the economic conditions that prevail. For them, moaning is pointless as it cant change anything.

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By *lan43sumMan
over a year ago

Leicester

I'd have retired and given my job to someone younger had the bankers not gambled my money away. They so desreved their fees (not)

People living longer, like they say we will, means pensions are lower also.

Austeriy has a big impact on me for sure.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

everyone is experiencing it in one form or another. "

We have been better off since the recession. Our mortgage fell by so much that we were able to save enough to pay it off. As a consequence I am planning on retiring five years earlier.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

Depends if you are a moaning kind of person or a doing kind of person I reckon.

Some people are just naturally negative and so look for excuses for their own failures. Austerity is a good excuse because it can be blamed on the government.

Funny though, that all through good times and bad times, some people just get on with their lives and adapt their behaviour and lifestyle to the economic conditions that prevail. For them, moaning is pointless as it cant change anything."

I'm not moaning about it, just pointing out that everyone is affected. From the local park no longer cutting the grass, to welfare cuts, to historic low interest rates for savers. I agree with you that you just need to adapt and move on, and I suspect most people do.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

everyone is experiencing it in one form or another.

We have been better off since the recession. Our mortgage fell by so much that we were able to save enough to pay it off. As a consequence I am planning on retiring five years earlier. "

it has been a brilliant time to be a borrower, a crap time to be a saver! Enjoy the retirement when it comes

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By *ngel n tedCouple
over a year ago

maidstone

I don't think the tories will be happy till we're back to victorian britain, work houses and street urchins, and the poor being picked off by syphillis and jack the ripper types

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

everyone is experiencing it in one form or another.

We have been better off since the recession. Our mortgage fell by so much that we were able to save enough to pay it off. As a consequence I am planning on retiring five years earlier.

it has been a brilliant time to be a borrower, a crap time to be a saver! Enjoy the retirement when it comes "

This is why we paid the mortgage off as the money was doing fuck all in the bank.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

everyone is experiencing it in one form or another.

We have been better off since the recession. Our mortgage fell by so much that we were able to save enough to pay it off. As a consequence I am planning on retiring five years earlier.

it has been a brilliant time to be a borrower, a crap time to be a saver! Enjoy the retirement when it comes

This is why we paid the mortgage off as the money was doing fuck all in the bank. "

Property continues to perform well as an asset class. One of the few where you can still make a decent return.

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By *oodmessMan
over a year ago

yumsville

I have started to save but I always needed an excuse to. I think austerity is working well personally, but I do think a lot more should be done to help secular groups. And a lot more should be done to equal advantages across a nations wealth.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I've had to cut the Butler's hours and let one of the house slaves go...it's a bugger "

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By *educedWoman
over a year ago

Birmingham

I didn't mean to be so negative but austerity does affect me. I have an increased work load as a direct result.

The number of clients (for example) I am referring to the local Foodbank is increasing from maybe as little as two or three in 2013 to a whopping thirty last week and the vast majority of these people work.

It is not part of my job description to refer people to foodbanks but there are no longer any front line services where I work (one of the top 5% most deprived neighbourhoods) to support our most vulnerable people.

I could go on and on about this subject...above is just a drop in the ocean.

I am glad to hear that there are individuals out there who feel that austerity doesn't affect them personally but it is affecting the society we live in.

Shouldn't we all be concerned about that?

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By *ath_Neil_bifunCouple
over a year ago

near cardiff

I work in central heating spares and we have booked during the recession..do you repair your boiler or replace it?

I've had two pay rises!..

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"I don't think the tories will be happy till we're back to victorian britain, work houses and street urchins, and the poor being picked off by syphillis and jack the ripper types "

Well.... we do need to cull the population a bit and add a bit of quality to the gene pool.... So???////.......

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Pay freeze since 2009. Interviewed for redundancy 3 times. Number of people in my department reduced by 60% without workload decreasing by the same factor.

However a lot of those things are due to the politically motivated uneven distribution of the "cutting back a bit" around the country, and the relative protection of some services over others rather than austerity per se.

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon


"It's going to get worse for those who are less well off (particularly young people) if the Conservatives get in again as more benefit cuts are planned.

Universal Credit will see the number of people who are homeless increase as they choose to spend Housing Benefit etc on food and heating and then are subsequently evicted.

There will be no front line services to support the vulnerable either (or very few) as they are being decimated by austerity measures or are delivered by third sector organisations who are all scrambling around for the same pots of money.

Don't get me started on the despicable plans Cameron has in store for young people. We are facing a huge crisis as a society. "

Couldn't put it better myself we are fucked when it comes to helping the most vulnerable of society

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"I work in central heating spares and we have booked during the recession..do you repair your boiler or replace it?

I've had two pay rises!.."

Good for you.

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By *ukkakewhoreWoman
over a year ago

Dublin

Austerity works for the top 5% on the rich list in every society. 85% of the population get fucked and the bottom 10% get absolutely ass raped!!! Sad times we live in today

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

everyone is experiencing it in one form or another.

We have been better off since the recession. Our mortgage fell by so much that we were able to save enough to pay it off. As a consequence I am planning on retiring five years earlier. "
.

I take it you were one of the very few lucky ones to have a tracker mortgage.

Cost of mortgages hasn't dropped in ten years perse.

In fact in 2005 you could get a 85% std mortgage for around 4%-5% something you'd certainly struggle with now even though back base rate has dropped 4%.

If you happen to be wanting company finance from 200 grand to 10 million it's even worse, where average costs have doubled and that's if you can get the money in the first place!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Austerity works for the top 5% on the rich list in every society. 85% of the population get fucked and the bottom 10% get absolutely ass raped!!! Sad times we live in today"
.

Why do you think they like austerity so much?.

The rich have got richer, the middle lot have got a little bit poorer and the bottom lot got.. Well you said it best!

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By *exyLancs2Couple
over a year ago

Manchester

George Soros and the former IMF boss said that the bankers have been gambling in the Casino, buying drinks for the politicians and academics, knowing full well that someone else was going to pick up the tab when it went wrong.

The culture was criminal. Sub prime debt was sold on as AAA rated and the ratings agencies were corrupted too. When they were told the Tsunami was coming all they did was wonder what swimming costume to wear.

Former IMF boss said: "it's always the poor who pay."

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By *ngel n tedCouple
over a year ago

maidstone


"I don't think the tories will be happy till we're back to victorian britain, work houses and street urchins, and the poor being picked off by syphillis and jack the ripper types

Well.... we do need to cull the population a bit and add a bit of quality to the gene pool.... So???////....... "

well i fer one fink we should get our blooming dander up guv, and kick up a right shine

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Depends if you are a moaning kind of person or a doing kind of person I reckon.

Some people are just naturally negative and so look for excuses for their own failures. Austerity is a good excuse because it can be blamed on the government.

Funny though, that all through good times and bad times, some people just get on with their lives and adapt their behaviour and lifestyle to the economic conditions that prevail. For them, moaning is pointless as it cant change anything."

That's the kind of straight-talking, non-PC, factually unfounded discourse the Great British Public can really get behind, if only those children/disabled/elderly/ex citylink drivers/those straight out of local authority care would stop moaning roll their sleeves up and work a bit harder (never hurt me) then there wouldn't be any austerity, you literally could not make this up.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Living in ireland here and we went down this route and the answer is NO its not easy.

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By *exyLancs2Couple
over a year ago

Manchester


"

Depends if you are a moaning kind of person or a doing kind of person I reckon.

Some people are just naturally negative and so look for excuses for their own failures. Austerity is a good excuse because it can be blamed on the government.

Funny though, that all through good times and bad times, some people just get on with their lives and adapt their behaviour and lifestyle to the economic conditions that prevail. For them, moaning is pointless as it cant change anything.

That's the kind of straight-talking, non-PC, factually unfounded discourse the Great British Public can really get behind, if only those children/disabled/elderly/ex citylink drivers/those straight out of local authority care would stop moaning roll their sleeves up and work a bit harder (never hurt me) then there wouldn't be any austerity, you literally could not make this up."

Good reply

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's going to get worse for those who are less well off (particularly young people) if the Conservatives get in again as more benefit cuts are planned.

Universal Credit will see the number of people who are homeless increase as they choose to spend Housing Benefit etc on food and heating and then are subsequently evicted.

There will be no front line services to support the vulnerable either (or very few) as they are being decimated by austerity measures or are delivered by third sector organisations who are all scrambling around for the same pots of money.

Don't get me started on the despicable plans Cameron has in store for young people. We are facing a huge crisis as a society.

Couldn't put it better myself we are fucked when it comes to helping the most vulnerable of society "

totally agree its the worse off who are paying the highest price ,i for one think in the next few yrs there will be mass demonstrations and riots on our streets if we continue the way we are now,i do hope im wrong though

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I've had to cut the Butler's hours and let one of the house slaves go...it's a bugger "
Would That be gordon Jackson in upstairs Downstirs I prefered him in the Professionals myself with brodie and Doyle..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Couple of years ago we used to dine out all the time and lately just not been able to. Although the amount of horse's we own has gone up hmmmmmmmmm..........

FML.

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By *educedWoman
over a year ago

Birmingham


"

Depends if you are a moaning kind of person or a doing kind of person I reckon.

Some people are just naturally negative and so look for excuses for their own failures. Austerity is a good excuse because it can be blamed on the government.

Funny though, that all through good times and bad times, some people just get on with their lives and adapt their behaviour and lifestyle to the economic conditions that prevail. For them, moaning is pointless as it cant change anything.

That's the kind of straight-talking, non-PC, factually unfounded discourse the Great British Public can really get behind, if only those children/disabled/elderly/ex citylink drivers/those straight out of local authority care would stop moaning roll their sleeves up and work a bit harder (never hurt me) then there wouldn't be any austerity, you literally could not make this up.

Good reply"

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

My earnings went down to 25% of what I had been earning. That was difficult. I adapted. As I am self-employed I wasn't entitled to any benefits or help, even though I had been employed for nearly 30 years previously.

I adapted because I am able and I had a cushion from the years when I was earning well and a supportive family who kept feeding me. I have seen people lose everything because what they were earning wasn't enough to build a cushion.

I'm still only earning half of what I used to but as that is a huge jump from the leanest periods I feel flush right now.

Austerity has been kinder to those with mortgages than those with rents.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I come from a very poor background. Things improved over the years. Nowadays I am relatively comfortable and financially secure.

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound


"I come from a very poor background. Things improved over the years. Nowadays I am relatively comfortable and financially secure. "

I come from a very poor background too. I hated being poor again but I had the skills and ability to manage because I'd been there before.

The cases of debt with people from comfortable backgrounds who have experienced deep austerity do seem to hit them harder (psychologically as well as practically) as they had to learn a whole new way of living.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"George Soros and the former IMF boss said that the bankers have been gambling in the Casino, buying drinks for the politicians and academics, knowing full well that someone else was going to pick up the tab when it went wrong.

The culture was criminal. Sub prime debt was sold on as AAA rated and the ratings agencies were corrupted too. When they were told the Tsunami was coming all they did was wonder what swimming costume to wear.

Former IMF boss said: "it's always the poor who pay.""
Well certainly Starting with the bankers and other Idiots that played along with them Justice would carry a heavy penalty lawfully Against those Involved If it Was possible but their positions got them out of it, they can always look Back If anyone asks them like family Or friends what was the biggest one Single thing they did by contributing To this country they,ll know what that Is but it was,nt contributing in any Way or form but takeing away like the Common thief or gangster..Which in my Mind they are and always will be.

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By *cotbbtopMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

Regardless of which party or parties form the next government, austerity hasn't really started yet. We are still living well beyond our means.

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound


"Regardless of which party or parties form the next government, austerity hasn't really started yet. We are still living well beyond our means."

The easy spending cuts have been made so now's the time for the hard ones. If you need the welfare state or your local authority be prepared to mind the huge holes you may fall through.

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By *lan43sumMan
over a year ago

Leicester

Was it 5 years ago when the Big Society was being bulled up? Did it happen? It sure needs to now after hearing some of the stuff in the Bishop of Leicester's study.

Real people with real problems and desperate to sort for themselves. Bring back the industry that used to need all sorts of skills and unskills

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Regardless of which party or parties form the next government, austerity hasn't really started yet. We are still living well beyond our means.

The easy spending cuts have been made so now's the time for the hard ones. If you need the welfare state or your local authority be prepared to mind the huge holes you may fall through. "

There will literally be huge holes...in the roads because some local authorities have already had to cut non essential spending on things like highways maintenance right to the bone.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Funny thing is, LA's don't seem to bother cutting "holiday entitlement" to the bone. A mate of mine at least has the decency to be embarrassed whenever replying to being asked what his annual holiday allowance is = 37 days plus Statutory Days.

Could be some savings to be found in that area methinks.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central


"It's going to get worse for those who are less well off (particularly young people) if the Conservatives get in again as more benefit cuts are planned.

Universal Credit will see the number of people who are homeless increase as they choose to spend Housing Benefit etc on food and heating and then are subsequently evicted.

There will be no front line services to support the vulnerable either (or very few) as they are being decimated by austerity measures or are delivered by third sector organisations who are all scrambling around for the same pots of money.

Don't get me started on the despicable plans Cameron has in store for young people. We are facing a huge crisis as a society. "

It's sickening what has been happening and what is planned.

There are many who are much worse off now via austerity measures. Some have no safety net financially.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Funny thing is, LA's don't seem to bother cutting "holiday entitlement" to the bone. A mate of mine at least has the decency to be embarrassed whenever replying to being asked what his annual holiday allowance is = 37 days plus Statutory Days.

Could be some savings to be found in that area methinks. "

Well I don't know where the fuck he works but I get 23 days plus statutory and that's pretty normal for local government.

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By *lan43sumMan
over a year ago

Leicester


"I didn't mean to be so negative but austerity does affect me. I have an increased work load as a direct result.

The number of clients (for example) I am referring to the local Foodbank is increasing from maybe as little as two or three in 2013 to a whopping thirty last week and the vast majority of these people work.

It is not part of my job description to refer people to foodbanks but there are no longer any front line services where I work (one of the top 5% most deprived neighbourhoods) to support our most vulnerable people.

I could go on and on about this subject...above is just a drop in the ocean.

I am glad to hear that there are individuals out there who feel that austerity doesn't affect them personally but it is affecting the society we live in.

Shouldn't we all be concerned about that?

"

We should be very concerned. Also we should take note of people like the poster, who know from esperience and not just take the headline "scrounger" cases as the norm. It is said that any of us are but a few steps off needing food banks. Are we heading to be like the US?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think large sections of the population both rich and poor were living relatively beyond their means. Though not everyone.

- but from a politically neutral position we either pay now, or pay double later.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Funny thing is, LA's don't seem to bother cutting "holiday entitlement" to the bone. A mate of mine at least has the decency to be embarrassed whenever replying to being asked what his annual holiday allowance is = 37 days plus Statutory Days.

Could be some savings to be found in that area methinks. "

Is that all ? Blimey I'd go bonkers if that's all the holiday I had.

But I don't get paid for my holidays.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've heard those leftie teachers get 84 plus stats a year, now surely there's room to cut there

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Anyone under 30 without a shit hot degree has my sympathy because the tories seem determined to grind them out of existence

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's going to get worse for those who are less well off (particularly young people) if the Conservatives get in again as more benefit cuts are planned.

Universal Credit will see the number of people who are homeless increase as they choose to spend Housing Benefit etc on food and heating and then are subsequently evicted.

There will be no front line services to support the vulnerable either (or very few) as they are being decimated by austerity measures or are delivered by third sector organisations who are all scrambling around for the same pots of money.

Don't get me started on the despicable plans Cameron has in store for young people. We are facing a huge crisis as a society. "

Here here!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Is anyone really experiencing austerity?

Or is there a difference between ceasing to live well, well beyond your means, and cutting back a little?

Depends if you are a moaning kind of person or a doing kind of person I reckon.

Some people are just naturally negative and so look for excuses for their own failures. Austerity is a good excuse because it can be blamed on the government.

Funny though, that all through good times and bad times, some people just get on with their lives and adapt their behaviour and lifestyle to the economic conditions that prevail. For them, moaning is pointless as it cant change anything."

Here here, instead of moaning about my lot, I'm happy to have a roof over my head and a lovely family including grandchildren, my only gripe is the lack of management at my second job, when people leave there is no-one to replace them until way after they have gone and worked 70 hrs for the last 2 weeks covering vacant shifts

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By *cotbbtopMan
over a year ago

Glasgow


"I think large sections of the population both rich and poor were living relatively beyond their means. Though not everyone.

- but from a politically neutral position we either pay now, or pay double later."

Exactly right

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By *ulfilthmentMan
over a year ago

Just around the corner


"Won't happen while we continue to allow a bunch of sociopaths run society though."

For 'sociopaths' read 'politicians' throughout. I don't see any party offering realistic policies to make life better or even just less unfair.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

Perhaps the great visionaries, luminaries and general economic wizz kids that have contributed to this thread can explain where the money is coming from?

If you want to see what happens to a country that lives beyond its means, take a look at Greece. Perhaps that future for Britain is to just keep borrowing money from someone else in order to enable our population to keep living a lifestyle that they are completely undeserving of. Then when the other people ask us for their money back we can just say no, because the terms we previously agreed to were unfair.

Austerity is about living within your means, no more and no less.

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By *layfull pairingCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

If it wernt for 24 hr rolling news channels and doomladen newspapers i doubt most people would even have heard of "austerity"... certainly not my mrs who is single handedly keeping the shoe and handbag industry going...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Perhaps the great visionaries, luminaries and general economic wizz kids that have contributed to this thread can explain where the money is coming from?

If you want to see what happens to a country that lives beyond its means, take a look at Greece. Perhaps that future for Britain is to just keep borrowing money from someone else in order to enable our population to keep living a lifestyle that they are completely undeserving of. Then when the other people ask us for their money back we can just say no, because the terms we previously agreed to were unfair.

Austerity is about living within your means, no more and no less.

"

Well said!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We are expanding and making more jobs .. see its what sort of things your doing as some will always do well . IT still doing well too ...... I have a person into making apps .. works in London in his 20s doing well .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Perhaps the great visionaries, luminaries and general economic wizz kids that have contributed to this thread can explain where the money is coming from?

If you want to see what happens to a country that lives beyond its means, take a look at Greece. Perhaps that future for Britain is to just keep borrowing money from someone else in order to enable our population to keep living a lifestyle that they are completely undeserving of. Then when the other people ask us for their money back we can just say no, because the terms we previously agreed to were unfair.

Austerity is about living within your means, no more and no less.

Well said! "
.

I would take the time to write a long essay about money creation but I think it would be pointless.

To assume one country borrows their money from another person is quite frankly naivety or stupidity.

If you think that over borrowing is something new or only done by one party try looking at our past 300 year history!.

Also don't blame government for over borrowing, private debt outnumbers public sector debt 3to1

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By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...


"Perhaps the great visionaries, luminaries and general economic wizz kids that have contributed to this thread can explain where the money is coming from?

If you want to see what happens to a country that lives beyond its means, take a look at Greece. Perhaps that future for Britain is to just keep borrowing money from someone else in order to enable our population to keep living a lifestyle that they are completely undeserving of. Then when the other people ask us for their money back we can just say no, because the terms we previously agreed to were unfair.

Austerity is about living within your means, no more and no less.

Well said! "

I'll second that.

Also it saves me a lot of typing

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By *andS4funCouple
over a year ago

Lancashire


"It's going to get worse for those who are less well off (particularly young people) if the Conservatives get in again as more benefit cuts are planned.

Universal Credit will see the number of people who are homeless increase as they choose to spend Housing Benefit etc on food and heating and then are subsequently evicted.

There will be no front line services to support the vulnerable either (or very few) as they are being decimated by austerity measures or are delivered by third sector organisations who are all scrambling around for the same pots of money.

Don't get me started on the despicable plans Cameron has in store for young people. We are facing a huge crisis as a society. "

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

Tax avoidance is what's keeping our country in dire straits, less able to invest in infrastructure and create jobs, as well as pay off some of our deficit.

Estimates of tax evasion and avoidance are typically underestimates as many individuals hide their money, avoiding srutiny - the Swiss bank account issues, HSBC etc, show some of this. Corporations who follow hugely complex routes to set up multiple shell companies in various tax havens to also allow them to benefit from the infrastructure that us - the standard UK taxpayers, who do pay our tax - have to pay, allowing them to run businesses at very low cost but at our expense.

The New Statesman in 2011 stated 'Tax avoidance costs UK economy £69.9 billion a year' If that alone was used to pay off some of our deficit then austerity measures would not be needed as ruthlessly targeted at lower income people.

The Inland Revenue declares that avoided tax is as much as the VAT increase we're all paying.

It's the standard person, like most of us on fab, who are paying their fare share of taxes, the very lowest income people paying a much higher rate of tax from it, via income tax, VAT at 20% etc.

I'm unsure who I'm voting for at this point, but I'm sceptical of many party's claims to really be implementing methods to stop tax evasion and avoidance. Avoidance by legal loopholes is generally as wrong as evasion imo, where tax experts from the big accountancy firms draft our rules, then made into law, whilst advising their clients subsequently how to avoid paying the £billions that the UK needs.

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By *andS4funCouple
over a year ago

Lancashire


"Pay freeze since 2009. Interviewed for redundancy 3 times. Number of people in my department reduced by 60% without workload decreasing by the same factor.

However a lot of those things are due to the politically motivated uneven distribution of the "cutting back a bit" around the country, and the relative protection of some services over others rather than austerity per se. "

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By *andS4funCouple
over a year ago

Lancashire


"Tax avoidance is what's keeping our country in dire straits, less able to invest in infrastructure and create jobs, as well as pay off some of our deficit.

Estimates of tax evasion and avoidance are typically underestimates as many individuals hide their money, avoiding srutiny - the Swiss bank account issues, HSBC etc, show some of this. Corporations who follow hugely complex routes to set up multiple shell companies in various tax havens to also allow them to benefit from the infrastructure that us - the standard UK taxpayers, who do pay our tax - have to pay, allowing them to run businesses at very low cost but at our expense.

The New Statesman in 2011 stated 'Tax avoidance costs UK economy £69.9 billion a year' If that alone was used to pay off some of our deficit then austerity measures would not be needed as ruthlessly targeted at lower income people.

The Inland Revenue declares that avoided tax is as much as the VAT increase we're all paying.

It's the standard person, like most of us on fab, who are paying their fare share of taxes, the very lowest income people paying a much higher rate of tax from it, via income tax, VAT at 20% etc.

I'm unsure who I'm voting for at this point, but I'm sceptical of many party's claims to really be implementing methods to stop tax evasion and avoidance. Avoidance by legal loopholes is generally as wrong as evasion imo, where tax experts from the big accountancy firms draft our rules, then made into law, whilst advising their clients subsequently how to avoid paying the £billions that the UK needs. "
Absofookinglutley !

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By *est Wales WifeCouple
over a year ago

Near Carmarthen

Interesting to add that no one has mentioned the rest of the world.

The reason that the 'west' has lived in such affluence for so long is because much of that wealth has been skimmed, scammed and generally misappropriated from other parts of the world. Now that large chunks of that former 'third world' (India, China, South America etc) are saying 'hey we want some of that good life' there is of course going to be less for us in the west.

Over time living standards will continue to decline here because basically there is only a limited size cake and if someone is having more; we will get less. Just watch out for the social unrest that will follow.

Thus endeth my amateur economics lesson.

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By *lan43sumMan
over a year ago

Leicester


"Perhaps the great visionaries, luminaries and general economic wizz kids that have contributed to this thread can explain where the money is coming from?

If you want to see what happens to a country that lives beyond its means, take a look at Greece. Perhaps that future for Britain is to just keep borrowing money from someone else in order to enable our population to keep living a lifestyle that they are completely undeserving of. Then when the other people ask us for their money back we can just say no, because the terms we previously agreed to were unfair.

Austerity is about living within your means, no more and no less.

Well said! "

The banks etc make their living encouraging us to use "funny money". Look how property and rent prices have gone up. Would that have happened if mortgages were much harder to get (over the last 30 years) Is a mortgage living beyond our means? There is no easy answer but I can see how we became the victims of a relatively few very wealthy organisations living beyond their means.

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By *andS4funCouple
over a year ago

Lancashire


"Interesting to add that no one has mentioned the rest of the world.

The reason that the 'west' has lived in such affluence for so long is because much of that wealth has been skimmed, scammed and generally misappropriated from other parts of the world. Now that large chunks of that former 'third world' (India, China, South America etc) are saying 'hey we want some of that good life' there is of course going to be less for us in the west.

Over time living standards will continue to decline here because basically there is only a limited size cake and if someone is having more; we will get less. Just watch out for the social unrest that will follow.

Thus endeth my amateur economics lesson."

Very good point

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By *andS4funCouple
over a year ago

Lancashire


"Perhaps the great visionaries, luminaries and general economic wizz kids that have contributed to this thread can explain where the money is coming from?

If you want to see what happens to a country that lives beyond its means, take a look at Greece. Perhaps that future for Britain is to just keep borrowing money from someone else in order to enable our population to keep living a lifestyle that they are completely undeserving of. Then when the other people ask us for their money back we can just say no, because the terms we previously agreed to were unfair.

Austerity is about living within your means, no more and no less.

Well said!

The banks etc make their living encouraging us to use "funny money". Look how property and rent prices have gone up. Would that have happened if mortgages were much harder to get (over the last 30 years) Is a mortgage living beyond our means? There is no easy answer but I can see how we became the victims of a relatively few very wealthy organisations living beyond their means."

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"Tax avoidance is what's keeping our country in dire straits, less able to invest in infrastructure and create jobs, as well as pay off some of our deficit.....

.....snipped.....

The New Statesman in 2011 stated 'Tax avoidance costs UK economy £69.9 billion a year' ... snipped.....

The Inland Revenue declares that avoided tax is as much as the VAT increase we're all paying.

"

HMRC figures. Tax gap is £34 billion. Around £5 billion of that is tax evasion. This is £5 billion that should be collected but it is not an amount that will significantly change the world that we live in. The NHS as an example costs around £100 billion a year.

To blame the state of the economy on tax evasion is wrong. Tax evasion is wrong but it is small fry in terms of the tax and spend issues that the country faces.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central


"Tax avoidance is what's keeping our country in dire straits, less able to invest in infrastructure and create jobs, as well as pay off some of our deficit.....

.....snipped.....

The New Statesman in 2011 stated 'Tax avoidance costs UK economy £69.9 billion a year' ... snipped.....

The Inland Revenue declares that avoided tax is as much as the VAT increase we're all paying.

HMRC figures. Tax gap is £34 billion. Around £5 billion of that is tax evasion. This is £5 billion that should be collected but it is not an amount that will significantly change the world that we live in. The NHS as an example costs around £100 billion a year.

To blame the state of the economy on tax evasion is wrong. Tax evasion is wrong but it is small fry in terms of the tax and spend issues that the country faces."

Tax evasion is crippling us but is not the reason the economy crashed. Evaded cmtax of £billions would pay off debts - less austerity needed, or build infrastructure that would potentially boost the economy and increase ecomic prosperity, potentially reducing the so called need for austerity.

Good rent control laws would also help millions have greater prosperity, with more spending power and higher VAT income.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"

Tax evasion is crippling us but is not the reason the economy crashed. Evaded cmtax of £billions would pay off debts - less austerity needed, or build infrastructure that would potentially boost the economy and increase ecomic prosperity, potentially reducing the so called need for austerity.

Good rent control laws would also help millions have greater prosperity, with more spending power and higher VAT income. "

Tax evasion is NOT crippling us. It is around £5 billion a year and government spend is £732 billion.

Tax evasion is a problem and it needs tackling but it wont change the world if it stopped altogether.

Another problem is the black economy which also accounts for around £5 billion in lost revenue. Not to mention perfectly legal tax avoidance worth another £5 billion.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I've heard those leftie teachers get 84 plus stats a year, now surely there's room to cut there"

How many do the right wing teachers get ?

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"I've heard those leftie teachers get 84 plus stats a year, now surely there's room to cut there

How many do the right wing teachers get ? "

They pay us for the privilige of teaching our kids

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