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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." How can you include someone that is hellbent in thinking you are the enemy? | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? | |||
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"You cant. If someone is zealous enough, they will kill. " Exactly, they use religion, they use football clubs, they use skin colour. Take away religion/football and they'll kill in the name of accents or something else. They want to kill. They will always find a way to kill, a reason for a group to be a target Bugs | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. How can you include someone that is hellbent in thinking you are the enemy? " By not thinking of them as a different species and finding a common ground. Education is key. I'm not saying it's going to happen over night, it's likely to take over 6 generations, but it's still possible. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world?" Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. | |||
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"Nuclear bomb" Who do you intend to drop it on?? | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. " Well there's not much kindness there!!! | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. " How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." This has worked at no point in history with no religious zealot. You may possibly want to adopt a real world view. | |||
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"Nuclear bomb"  | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." That is never going to happen! | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment?" I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. | |||
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"After the sad events of what's happened in France. Something really needs to be done, how do you stop people like this that don't care if they die?" It's a hard one. Some people don't want to be included or integrated and thrive on being outside Society. They will find any excuse not to be part of it. And what can you do if someone does not value their lives and the lives of others? So I think that it is hard to stop it. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. This has worked at no point in history with no religious zealot. You may possibly want to adopt a real world view." 
Assimilation has worked in several other cases; especially within Europe. I think you're possibly being flippant. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. " Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." we are to kind we give them freedom stay in the uk we giving them safe homes to live in and money to spend and they wish death on all people who don't like there god or belives . There is a small amount that respect are law and everyone's else belives in | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness.we are to kind we give them freedom stay in the uk we giving them safe homes to live in and money to spend and they wish death on all people who don't like there god or belives . There is a small amount that respect are law and everyone's else belives in " That's not true. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x" I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. | |||
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Extremists no matter what their cause happen, and do actually have a use... They eventually make all the moderates bond better.
It takes time, and will come round again, but the educate and include answer is the best we have, demonising an entire religion based on a few nutters just makes more nutters. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." Weather it would work or not a person can not dispute your empathy towards your fellow man , it's very refreshing . | |||
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"Catch the terrorists and mock them on live TV 24/7 - show them for what they are , and the kids would realise what the extremists are really like . " Maybe dress them in orange jumpsuits and then get a big knife......oh hang on! | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world?" I'd rather live in her marshmallow house than a world full of those who are afraid of what is different. Speaking as someone who has served in the army and seen every side of the terror problem I can assure you that extremists are a minority of any culture / religion that they claim to represent and by standing together we can and will weaken them. | |||
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"After the sad events of what's happened in France. Something really needs to be done, how do you stop people like this that don't care if they die?" you can't, they're willing to die for it and we're not! Real terrorists are ppl like Obama and Cameron anyway. If we stayed out of they're country's they probably wouldn't attack ours | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Weather it would work or not a person can not dispute your empathy towards your fellow man , it's very refreshing . " Right on brother  | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. " My children go to a school where it's 93% Muslim, the School is a Church of England school and the comments I heard from some of the parents are themselves disgusting. I've heard parents say that they will not send there kids to school on Friday mornings because the vicar will attend and says a little speech, on Diwali the Hindu/Sikh children will celebrate away from the other children, on Christmas you can't say happy Christmas but happy Holidays, but there is a Eid party, no wonder there is so much segregation, and I believe this is common practise from other people I have spoke to. My ex partner (who is white) was told to go back to her "own" country by kids, so I think it's something learnt at home/parents/elders. Us/them | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. " I'm sorry but I still don't understand your point about integration. I'm a bit dim so please explain how you would improve it and who is not intergrating at the moment. Thanks again. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. " Oooo you really don't practise the kindness you preach. Trolling my forum posts to bring into this debate is a little cheap. Naughty. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? I'd rather live in her marshmallow house than a world full of those who are afraid of what is different. Speaking as someone who has served in the army and seen every side of the terror problem I can assure you that extremists are a minority of any culture / religion that they claim to represent and by standing together we can and will weaken them. " | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. My children go to a school where it's 93% Muslim, the School is a Church of England school and the comments I heard from some of the parents are themselves disgusting. I've heard parents say that they will not send there kids to school on Friday mornings because the vicar will attend and says a little speech, on Diwali the Hindu/Sikh children will celebrate away from the other children, on Christmas you can't say happy Christmas but happy Holidays, but there is a Eid party, no wonder there is so much segregation, and I believe this is common practise from other people I have spoke to. My ex partner (who is white) was told to go back to her "own" country by kids, so I think it's something learnt at home/parents/elders. Us/them" I think so. I went to Catholic schools and it wasn't an issue having mass every morning. We also learnt about other religions, and others were invited in to talk about their beliefs. I realise this was a luxury, but it really shouldn't be. Yes, schools should be secular, but that's besides the point. Understanding why people have beliefs is so important and should be enforced by the curriculum, just like mathematics and English literature. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. My children go to a school where it's 93% Muslim, the School is a Church of England school and the comments I heard from some of the parents are themselves disgusting. I've heard parents say that they will not send there kids to school on Friday mornings because the vicar will attend and says a little speech, on Diwali the Hindu/Sikh children will celebrate away from the other children, on Christmas you can't say happy Christmas but happy Holidays, but there is a Eid party, no wonder there is so much segregation, and I believe this is common practise from other people I have spoke to. My ex partner (who is white) was told to go back to her "own" country by kids, so I think it's something learnt at home/parents/elders. Us/them I think so. I went to Catholic schools and it wasn't an issue having mass every morning. We also learnt about other religions, and others were invited in to talk about their beliefs. I realise this was a luxury, but it really shouldn't be. Yes, schools should be secular, but that's besides the point. Understanding why people have beliefs is so important and should be enforced by the curriculum, just like mathematics and English literature. " You descibed a typical school in uk. I had that education and my children do. They learn about all faiths. Do you think that's happen in Muslim faith schools? | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? I'd rather live in her marshmallow house than a world full of those who are afraid of what is different. Speaking as someone who has served in the army and seen every side of the terror problem I can assure you that extremists are a minority of any culture / religion that they claim to represent and by standing together we can and will weaken them. " Minority or not they are causing an awful lot of damage and standing together doesnt seem to have weakened them yet does it Gimp  | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. I'm sorry but I still don't understand your point about integration. I'm a bit dim so please explain how you would improve it and who is not intergrating at the moment. Thanks again." I don't know how to explain integration further. 1 in 3 Europeans believe that migrants should drop their religious/ethnic identities if they want to be accepted. This is ridiculous, and a horrible thought. Perhaps you should read about the change in attitudes to Muslims after 9/11 as there's many published papers which identify the poor treatment. I believe if more people were accepting of Islam and understood the religion AND were able to communicate properly (and vice versa), the issue would be less significant. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. Oooo you really don't practise the kindness you preach. Trolling my forum posts to bring into this debate is a little cheap. Naughty." That's not what trolling means - I'm pointing out why you're wrong and why your opinion carries little weight. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. How can you include someone that is hellbent in thinking you are the enemy? " Find out why your the enemy and stop I guess | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. Oooo you really don't practise the kindness you preach. Trolling my forum posts to bring into this debate is a little cheap. Naughty. That's not what trolling means - I'm pointing out why you're wrong and why your opinion carries little weight. " Wow for someone that wants to "Hug a Jihadi" you are quite rude and aggressive. Maybe if I pop my bomb vest on and lop a few heads off you'll show the compassion and kindness that you apparently have for all mankind. Wow!!! That is all. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. Oooo you really don't practise the kindness you preach. Trolling my forum posts to bring into this debate is a little cheap. Naughty. That's not what trolling means - I'm pointing out why you're wrong and why your opinion carries little weight. Wow for someone that wants to "Hug a Jihadi" you are quite rude and aggressive. Maybe if I pop my bomb vest on and lop a few heads off you'll show the compassion and kindness that you apparently have for all mankind. Wow!!! That is all. " It was a neutral comment. I don't think it's funny to take the piss out of acts of terrorism either. Bizarre and disgusting. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. How can you include someone that is hellbent in thinking you are the enemy? " For those ones it may be too late but they can only commit suicide ones. So it's really the next not you have to convince. Take the Northern Ireland as an example. Before internment of IRA suspects was introduced many Catholics didn't feel that strongly against the Union to really give full backing to the IRA. One internment of IRA suspects was introduced it had the effect of hardening the attitude of many Catholics against the Union and in favour of the IRA. We have to make sure we don't make the same mistakes again with Muslims in Britain and the rest of Western Europe and North America. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. Oooo you really don't practise the kindness you preach. Trolling my forum posts to bring into this debate is a little cheap. Naughty. That's not what trolling means - I'm pointing out why you're wrong and why your opinion carries little weight. Wow for someone that wants to "Hug a Jihadi" you are quite rude and aggressive. Maybe if I pop my bomb vest on and lop a few heads off you'll show the compassion and kindness that you apparently have for all mankind. Wow!!! That is all. It was a neutral comment. I don't think it's funny to take the piss out of acts of terrorism either. Bizarre and disgusting. " You told me my opinion counted for nothing! Not particularly "neutral". If my comments don't sit well with you....ignore. I will do same. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. This has worked at no point in history with no religious zealot. You may possibly want to adopt a real world view." But it has worked quite well on the others from the same community. Surely you cannot be saying that we should be educating moderate Muslims to accept that freedom and democracy are the best way forward for all. Am I misunderstanding you? | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. How can you include someone that is hellbent in thinking you are the enemy? For those ones it may be too late but they can only commit suicide ones. So it's really the next not you have to convince. Take the Northern Ireland as an example. Before internment of IRA suspects was introduced many Catholics didn't feel that strongly against the Union to really give full backing to the IRA. One internment of IRA suspects was introduced it had the effect of hardening the attitude of many Catholics against the Union and in favour of the IRA. We have to make sure we don't make the same mistakes again with Muslims in Britain and the rest of Western Europe and North America. " Exactly. There's hardly any evidence to link exclusion of minorities to these events due to the reluctance of bodies willing to monitor it, however there is a correlation between social cohesion and terrorism so it's pretty obvious. | |||
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"As I posted on another thread, this type of thing has happened in the past, is happening now and will continue to happen in the future. Some people hold no value to human life whatsoever and sadly their beliefs will never change "When you say 'Some people' do you mean individual or groups of people? If you mean individuals then, although difficult, people can a do change their beliefs but even if they don't they can only commit suicide once. If you mean groups of people well then of course you can. Just look at how much peoples beliefs have changed in this country over less than a generation. Not so long ago a site like this would have been un thinkable. Homosexuality was illegal and the thought of same sex marriage would have been a joke. If we can change our views and beliefs so much so can any other group given the right incentives and education. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. That is never going to happen!" It will if we make the effert | |||
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"After the sad events of what's happened in France. Something really needs to be done, how do you stop people like this that don't care if they die? It's a hard one. Some people don't want to be included or integrated and thrive on being outside Society. They will find any excuse not to be part of it. And what can you do if someone does not value their lives and the lives of others? So I think that it is hard to stop it." We can't stop it overnight but we can over a long term by education as 26pion has said. | |||
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"Terrorism exists. Media organisations are effective what contributes to what we see as terrorism. Reported terror usually comes with sensationalism. Headlines that grab attention or promote the views of any one popular paradigm or Newspaper group. Terror of the 'unknown' will always gain more press attention than terror that has existed for years but is thwarted. Take Christian extremism in the USA: the number of attempts on life is in the thousands - it vastly outweighs that of any outside terror group, religious splinter cell or lone wolf. Though Media groups, with vested self interest can easily shape they way we and Governments view threats. Combating terrorism has had countless theories thrown at it, whilst it can give understanding, open knowledge bases, dialouge and approaches. The human condition is such that we are wholly autonomous creatures. " Do you believe those traits are innate though? Or taught? Yes I'm aware some people are born evil, but not all. I've always been taught to accept and not be a terrorist, so I do and I'm not. I don't believe it's unfathomable that education can reach and fix this in the generations to come. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. How can you include someone that is hellbent in thinking you are the enemy? Find out why your the enemy and stop I guess " So I'd be the enemy because Im not a Muslim, does that mean I should convert? So I'm no longer the enemy? | |||
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"It is possible but highly unlikely, I recently spoke to a Muslim guy and he said there was no such thing as a moderate Muslim, you either believe or you don't he said you can't mix and match. I know he don't represent Muslims but maybe Tommy Robinson had is right when he said Islam Is incompatible with modern day UK." A lot of Christians would say the same thing to but we know that's not true for Christians and it's not true for Muslims either. If it was they would all believe the same but they don't. Islam, like Christianity, is split in to two groups. The Sunni Muslims, who have similar beliefs about many things as Protestants do and Shia, who have similar beliefs about many things that Catholics do. With in these two groups there are further divisions, just like CofE and Baptists or Roman Catholics and Greek Orthodox. If they don't all believe exactly the same and yet they are all Muslims then it can not be said that all Muslims have to accept every part of one given strand of faith to be Muslims. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x" And I would suggest that you take a look at some the moderate Muslim web sites that espouse nothing about violent Jihad but talk about peace and brotherhood between Abrahamic peoples. | |||
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"As I posted on another thread, this type of thing has happened in the past, is happening now and will continue to happen in the future. Some people hold no value to human life whatsoever and sadly their beliefs will never change
When you say 'Some people' do you mean individual or groups of people?
If you mean individuals then, although difficult, people can a do change their beliefs but even if they don't they can only commit suicide once.
If you mean groups of people well then of course you can. Just look at how much peoples beliefs have changed in this country over less than a generation. Not so long ago a site like this would have been un thinkable. Homosexuality was illegal and the thought of same sex marriage would have been a joke. If we can change our views and beliefs so much so can any other group given the right incentives and education.
"Homosexuality was rife amongst the Greeks, many folks are taught what is acceptable and what is not. Whether that is right or wrong can only be determined by the human conscience and how certain peoples actions will impact on other people's lives  | |||
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"Terrorism exists. Media organisations are effective what contributes to what we see as terrorism. Reported terror usually comes with sensationalism. Headlines that grab attention or promote the views of any one popular paradigm or Newspaper group. Terror of the 'unknown' will always gain more press attention than terror that has existed for years but is thwarted. Take Christian extremism in the USA: the number of attempts on life is in the thousands - it vastly outweighs that of any outside terror group, religious splinter cell or lone wolf. Though Media groups, with vested self interest can easily shape they way we and Governments view threats. Combating terrorism has had countless theories thrown at it, whilst it can give understanding, open knowledge bases, dialouge and approaches. The human condition is such that we are wholly autonomous creatures. Do you believe those traits are innate though? Or taught? Yes I'm aware some people are born evil, but not all. I've always been taught to accept and not be a terrorist, so I do and I'm not. I don't believe it's unfathomable that education can reach and fix this in the generations to come. " I remember a quote from my old psychology teacher she was talking about things she or "we" never thought we'd ever see ourselves doing. Bear with me. She was explaining that she was a middle aged 40+ something year old woman, of a certain social class, with a professional longstanding career, education and such and such. Just so happens she was driving home with her two kids and she was in a car accident. she said "I turned around to look at the kids, they were buckled up and screaming, I knew they were fine though. But I could tell you how I got down the road - but this 40 + something year old woman was racing down the road, gritting her teeth with her fist clenched toward the other driver" She then realised - only being feet from the other car and seeing the womans reaction to her - that she too had been in an accident. She in a fit had snapped. Reacted. Gone from a conservative, reasoned, educated, psychologist. To a maniac at the treat of her children being put in danger. You hear it in reports that - terrorists now come from all walks of life, whether they are law students, lawyers, chemistry teachers. They are no longer the easily lead or susceptible. If News did not highlight everything we see as terrorism. And instead straight out criminalise it - it may not have the heat of flame or potential appeal that it does. There is no answer I dont think. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. That is never going to happen! It will if we make the effert" Will it? Look at the very recent history of Egypt. The Islamists won power through "democracy". Once they were in power they started to slaughter other non-believeing Egyptians. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness.we are to kind we give them freedom stay in the uk we giving them safe homes to live in and money to spend and they wish death on all people who don't like there god or belives . There is a small amount that respect are law and everyone's else belives in " Not so, Islam, like Christianity believes that all power comes from God and all authority on earth can only be exercised by appointment from God. That being the case a Muslim, like a Christian, is duty bound to uphold the law of the state he lives in. | |||
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"It's always been around and always will be , but how do you define it first ?? As Albert Einstine said peace can not be kept by force it may only be achieved by understanding . " | |||
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"Terrorism exists. Media organisations are effective what contributes to what we see as terrorism. Reported terror usually comes with sensationalism. Headlines that grab attention or promote the views of any one popular paradigm or Newspaper group. Terror of the 'unknown' will always gain more press attention than terror that has existed for years but is thwarted. Take Christian extremism in the USA: the number of attempts on life is in the thousands - it vastly outweighs that of any outside terror group, religious splinter cell or lone wolf. Though Media groups, with vested self interest can easily shape they way we and Governments view threats. Combating terrorism has had countless theories thrown at it, whilst it can give understanding, open knowledge bases, dialouge and approaches. The human condition is such that we are wholly autonomous creatures. Do you believe those traits are innate though? Or taught? Yes I'm aware some people are born evil, but not all. I've always been taught to accept and not be a terrorist, so I do and I'm not. I don't believe it's unfathomable that education can reach and fix this in the generations to come. I remember a quote from my old psychology teacher she was talking about things she or "we" never thought we'd ever see ourselves doing. Bear with me. She was explaining that she was a middle aged 40+ something year old woman, of a certain social class, with a professional longstanding career, education and such and such. Just so happens she was driving home with her two kids and she was in a car accident. she said "I turned around to look at the kids, they were buckled up and screaming, I knew they were fine though. But I could tell you how I got down the road - but this 40 + something year old woman was racing down the road, gritting her teeth with her fist clenched toward the other driver" She then realised - only being feet from the other car and seeing the womans reaction to her - that she too had been in an accident. She in a fit had snapped. Reacted. Gone from a conservative, reasoned, educated, psychologist. To a maniac at the treat of her children being put in danger. You hear it in reports that - terrorists now come from all walks of life, whether they are law students, lawyers, chemistry teachers. They are no longer the easily lead or susceptible. If News did not highlight everything we see as terrorism. And instead straight out criminalise it - it may not have the heat of flame or potential appeal that it does. There is no answer I dont think." Surely that's a learned behaviour and a result of frustration with something else. If you're consistently taught that terrorism is wrong and human life is valuable, it's more likely you'll preserve it. I don't think acts of terrorism can be compared to crimes of passion as they are typically planned in advance. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x And I would suggest that you take a look at some the moderate Muslim web sites that espouse nothing about violent Jihad but talk about peace and brotherhood between Abrahamic peoples." That's all well and good but by definition, you only need one terrorist to have terrorism. Shia v Sunni, the base cause, is all you really need to know. | |||
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"Catch the terrorists and mock them on live TV 24/7 - show them for what they are , and the kids would realise what the extremists are really like . " I generally find that mocking your opponents tends to paint you in a worse light than them and is generally counter productive | |||
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"Isis tss got nothing on the IRA now they new how to terrorise, look at me reminiscing on the good old days "I am going to have to hand it to ISIS. beheading women killing children executing their own fleeing fighters absolute gorilla warfare funded to the tune of billions oh and - wanting to kill every fucker, not just the Brits. | |||
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"Catch the terrorists and mock them on live TV 24/7 - show them for what they are , and the kids would realise what the extremists are really like . Maybe dress them in orange jumpsuits and then get a big knife......oh hang on!" West has already tried the orange suits and, whilst not killing them, has tortured them. Not been too successful so far that policy. Has it? | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." Im Ex Forces an have sat an spoke to 'Local Elders' an drank tea an less than an hour later they are shooting at you. Im afraid it is a us v them because their mindset is if you dont conform to their religion (thats what this is all about) then they will kill you! | |||
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"Terrorism exists. Media organisations are effective what contributes to what we see as terrorism. Reported terror usually comes with sensationalism. Headlines that grab attention or promote the views of any one popular paradigm or Newspaper group. Terror of the 'unknown' will always gain more press attention than terror that has existed for years but is thwarted. Take Christian extremism in the USA: the number of attempts on life is in the thousands - it vastly outweighs that of any outside terror group, religious splinter cell or lone wolf. Though Media groups, with vested self interest can easily shape they way we and Governments view threats. Combating terrorism has had countless theories thrown at it, whilst it can give understanding, open knowledge bases, dialouge and approaches. The human condition is such that we are wholly autonomous creatures. Do you believe those traits are innate though? Or taught? Yes I'm aware some people are born evil, but not all. I've always been taught to accept and not be a terrorist, so I do and I'm not. I don't believe it's unfathomable that education can reach and fix this in the generations to come. I remember a quote from my old psychology teacher she was talking about things she or "we" never thought we'd ever see ourselves doing. Bear with me. She was explaining that she was a middle aged 40+ something year old woman, of a certain social class, with a professional longstanding career, education and such and such. Just so happens she was driving home with her two kids and she was in a car accident. she said "I turned around to look at the kids, they were buckled up and screaming, I knew they were fine though. But I could tell you how I got down the road - but this 40 + something year old woman was racing down the road, gritting her teeth with her fist clenched toward the other driver" She then realised - only being feet from the other car and seeing the womans reaction to her - that she too had been in an accident. She in a fit had snapped. Reacted. Gone from a conservative, reasoned, educated, psychologist. To a maniac at the treat of her children being put in danger. You hear it in reports that - terrorists now come from all walks of life, whether they are law students, lawyers, chemistry teachers. They are no longer the easily lead or susceptible. If News did not highlight everything we see as terrorism. And instead straight out criminalise it - it may not have the heat of flame or potential appeal that it does. There is no answer I dont think. Surely that's a learned behaviour and a result of frustration with something else. If you're consistently taught that terrorism is wrong and human life is valuable, it's more likely you'll preserve it. I don't think acts of terrorism can be compared to crimes of passion as they are typically planned in advance. " How is it learned behaviour? Learned behaviour takes years on years on years of repetition? Reports often say that after a few months people upped and left on a jet plane. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Im Ex Forces an have sat an spoke to 'Local Elders' an drank tea an less than an hour later they are shooting at you. Im afraid it is a us v them because their mindset is if you dont conform to their religion (thats what this is all about) then they will kill you! " No apparently mate we have to hug it out with them. Only people like youself who have faced these people know the problem at hand. | |||
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"The words of Martin Niemoller come to mind with this. However, the only way, in my mind, to understand this is to look at the Memetics in play. Ok back to la la land for me. "Mathematics in play? Yeah, i can go with that. | |||
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"Catch the terrorists and mock them on live TV 24/7 - show them for what they are , and the kids would realise what the extremists are really like . I generally find that mocking your opponents tends to paint you in a worse light than them and is generally counter productive" Good point .... maybe let them do it for themselves then . Interview them for long enough to let them dig their own hole ? | |||
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"After the sad events of what's happened in France. Something really needs to be done, how do you stop people like this that don't care if they die? you can't, they're willing to die for it and we're not! Real terrorists are ppl like Obama and Cameron anyway. If we stayed out of they're country's they probably wouldn't attack ours " Are they did. We went into Afghanistan after 9/11, not before. And I thought it was Bush and Blair who went in, not Obama and Cameron. It must be my age confusing me. | |||
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"Terrorism exists. Media organisations are effective what contributes to what we see as terrorism. Reported terror usually comes with sensationalism. Headlines that grab attention or promote the views of any one popular paradigm or Newspaper group. Terror of the 'unknown' will always gain more press attention than terror that has existed for years but is thwarted. Take Christian extremism in the USA: the number of attempts on life is in the thousands - it vastly outweighs that of any outside terror group, religious splinter cell or lone wolf. Though Media groups, with vested self interest can easily shape they way we and Governments view threats. Combating terrorism has had countless theories thrown at it, whilst it can give understanding, open knowledge bases, dialouge and approaches. The human condition is such that we are wholly autonomous creatures. Do you believe those traits are innate though? Or taught? Yes I'm aware some people are born evil, but not all. I've always been taught to accept and not be a terrorist, so I do and I'm not. I don't believe it's unfathomable that education can reach and fix this in the generations to come. I remember a quote from my old psychology teacher she was talking about things she or "we" never thought we'd ever see ourselves doing. Bear with me. She was explaining that she was a middle aged 40+ something year old woman, of a certain social class, with a professional longstanding career, education and such and such. Just so happens she was driving home with her two kids and she was in a car accident. she said "I turned around to look at the kids, they were buckled up and screaming, I knew they were fine though. But I could tell you how I got down the road - but this 40 + something year old woman was racing down the road, gritting her teeth with her fist clenched toward the other driver" She then realised - only being feet from the other car and seeing the womans reaction to her - that she too had been in an accident. She in a fit had snapped. Reacted. Gone from a conservative, reasoned, educated, psychologist. To a maniac at the treat of her children being put in danger. You hear it in reports that - terrorists now come from all walks of life, whether they are law students, lawyers, chemistry teachers. They are no longer the easily lead or susceptible. If News did not highlight everything we see as terrorism. And instead straight out criminalise it - it may not have the heat of flame or potential appeal that it does. There is no answer I dont think. Surely that's a learned behaviour and a result of frustration with something else. If you're consistently taught that terrorism is wrong and human life is valuable, it's more likely you'll preserve it. I don't think acts of terrorism can be compared to crimes of passion as they are typically planned in advance. How is it learned behaviour? Learned behaviour takes years on years on years of repetition? Reports often say that after a few months people upped and left on a jet plane. " Well, there's several ways of dealing with high stress situations. In this case, you could think "they must be having a bad day, and didn't mean to cause this accident. It's just that, an accident." or you could think "that idiot! This is their fault and I'm angry!". Both possibilities are learned behaviours as it's a result of how you assess and perceive situations and how you choose to react. Getting on a plane and committing to a cause in such a way negates the chance of it being a crime of passion, as there was planning and intent. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. My children go to a school where it's 93% Muslim, the School is a Church of England school and the comments I heard from some of the parents are themselves disgusting. I've heard parents say that they will not send there kids to school on Friday mornings because the vicar will attend and says a little speech, on Diwali the Hindu/Sikh children will celebrate away from the other children, on Christmas you can't say happy Christmas but happy Holidays, but there is a Eid party, no wonder there is so much segregation, and I believe this is common practise from other people I have spoke to. My ex partner (who is white) was told to go back to her "own" country by kids, so I think it's something learnt at home/parents/elders. Us/them" Muslims have no problem with Christmas as such. Jesus is the second most important profit in Islam after Mohamed. Some Muslim may have a similar problem with Christmas as some Christians do. That is that they believe that Christmas should not be celebrated as it is based on pagan festivals. That's why Christmas was actually banned in this country by the Christian Puritans back in the day. Many fundamentalist Christians do not celebrate Christmas for the same reason. | |||
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"It is possible but highly unlikely, I recently spoke to a Muslim guy and he said there was no such thing as a moderate Muslim, you either believe or you don't he said you can't mix and match. I know he don't represent Muslims but maybe Tommy Robinson had is right when he said Islam Is incompatible with modern day UK." I may be dim, but I'd have thought that a Muslim police officer rushing to the aid of staff at a satirical magazine who were under attack (and who'd probably offended his beliefs), was pretty much the definition of a moderate Muslim. I think this guy you spoke to is wrong. I used to work alongside Muslims who will be devastated at a terrorist atrocity like this and see it as an insult to their religion. | |||
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"Education, integration and standing together. There are 1.5 billion Muslims on this planet, and making it a them and us situation is likely to have a knock on effect, creating a bigger problem."
I don't know why anyone would desire an us and them situation. If we don't value them, why should they value us? | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Im Ex Forces an have sat an spoke to 'Local Elders' an drank tea an less than an hour later they are shooting at you. Im afraid it is a us v them because their mindset is if you dont conform to their religion (thats what this is all about) then they will kill you! This is part of the problem, people are not being told how dark these people are. Only when you see their hatred for us an our way of life first hand do you realise what we are up against, an its not pretty I can tell you... No apparently mate we have to hug it out with them. Only people like youself who have faced these people know the problem at hand." | |||
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"As a insert religion here you will bomb the shit out of and kill all who do not conform to this and follow insert god character name here" Isn't religion promoting of peace and tranquility in general. These terrorist are just Cunts for the sake of it. The problem is extremeism breeds extremism. One extremist will preach until someone listens, then two extremists preach and so on. Bugs | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. My children go to a school where it's 93% Muslim, the School is a Church of England school and the comments I heard from some of the parents are themselves disgusting. I've heard parents say that they will not send there kids to school on Friday mornings because the vicar will attend and says a little speech, on Diwali the Hindu/Sikh children will celebrate away from the other children, on Christmas you can't say happy Christmas but happy Holidays, but there is a Eid party, no wonder there is so much segregation, and I believe this is common practise from other people I have spoke to. My ex partner (who is white) was told to go back to her "own" country by kids, so I think it's something learnt at home/parents/elders. Us/them I think so. I went to Catholic schools and it wasn't an issue having mass every morning. We also learnt about other religions, and others were invited in to talk about their beliefs. I realise this was a luxury, but it really shouldn't be. Yes, schools should be secular, but that's besides the point. Understanding why people have beliefs is so important and should be enforced by the curriculum, just like mathematics and English literature. You descibed a typical school in uk. I had that education and my children do. They learn about all faiths. Do you think that's happen in Muslim faith schools? " If any school, Muslim or other, is not teaching in accordance with the National Curriculum it can be taken over or closed down. Some Muslims schools have been, most have not. Probably because they were doing it at least as correctly as many other non Muslim schools. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics." C of E is a form of Christianity. Anyway, bombing will just perpetuate the situation and widen the gap as nothing is actually resolved. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? I'd rather live in her marshmallow house than a world full of those who are afraid of what is different. Speaking as someone who has served in the army and seen every side of the terror problem I can assure you that extremists are a minority of any culture / religion that they claim to represent and by standing together we can and will weaken them. Minority or not they are causing an awful lot of damage and standing together doesnt seem to have weakened them yet does it Gimp "Maybe that is because we are not actually standing together with them but trying to blame then for events most have no control over. Be a bit like blaming you for the murder of an abortionist by Christian fundamentalists just because you come from a Christian community. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. Oooo you really don't practise the kindness you preach. Trolling my forum posts to bring into this debate is a little cheap. Naughty. That's not what trolling means - I'm pointing out why you're wrong and why your opinion carries little weight. Wow for someone that wants to "Hug a Jihadi" you are quite rude and aggressive. Maybe if I pop my bomb vest on and lop a few heads off you'll show the compassion and kindness that you apparently have for all mankind. Wow!!! That is all. " And maybe if you made points relevant to the discussion rather than trying to belittle some one for putting forward a perfectly good and sensible point of view you would be taken more seriously. | |||
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"The words of Martin Niemoller come to mind with this. However, the only way, in my mind, to understand this is to look at the Memetics in play. Ok back to la la land for me.
Mathematics in play? Yeah, i can go with that. "Sorry I don't understand, what's mathematic to do with the (genetics) Memetics of human bio-sycho-social behaviour | |||
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"However much you try and appease they will want more. It is the desire for power and control under the guise of religion or another excuse, that feeds it to satisfy their greed and insecurity. That's why they want to keep us all ill educated - so we are more easily persuaded by their arguments. Education is the answer - as long as it is a proper education and not that espoused by the purveyors of religious ideology. " You mean like the religion free education provided in Nazi Germany or The Soviet Union. Religion is not the problem here. Extremism is. Don't try and turn this into the same old atheist vs religion thread. There are already many of those if you want to make that point. | |||
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"As I posted on another thread, this type of thing has happened in the past, is happening now and will continue to happen in the future. Some people hold no value to human life whatsoever and sadly their beliefs will never change
When you say 'Some people' do you mean individual or groups of people?
If you mean individuals then, although difficult, people can a do change their beliefs but even if they don't they can only commit suicide once.
If you mean groups of people well then of course you can. Just look at how much peoples beliefs have changed in this country over less than a generation. Not so long ago a site like this would have been un thinkable. Homosexuality was illegal and the thought of same sex marriage would have been a joke. If we can change our views and beliefs so much so can any other group given the right incentives and education.
Homosexuality was rife amongst the Greeks, many folks are taught what is acceptable and what is not. Whether that is right or wrong can only be determined by the human conscience and how certain peoples actions will impact on other people's lives "Exactly, taught. And we can teach people either of those surly we can teach them that a liberal, tolerant democracy is the best way forward for all. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics."
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse"A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in. How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics. C of E is a form of Christianity. Anyway, bombing will just perpetuate the situation and widen the gap as nothing is actually resolved. " .Yes I know it its that's why I put Christin, Jewish and Islamic! all devout religions churn out extremists, where as wishy washy turn up once a year at Xmas CofE type ones rarely do. You've not got 120 years to solve this you've got way less, let's be realists if the 60s hippy movement had come through back then, then yes we may not be here but it didn't and we are where we are, the fact that I or you may not like right wing solutions doesn't mean there not the best or in this case the only way to solve the current problem!. There's at least a hundred thousand extremists right now planning to kill you and me and my kids, I'll be brutally honest, this shit is real I've warned against it for years and it's like a giant snowball getting bigger and worse every month, they've massacred kids in Pakistan, thousands in Iraq and Syria, Mumbai, London, new York, Madrid, Australia.. FFS how bad do you want it to get before you take it that negotiating, integrating and educating with them ain't going to cut it. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. Oooo you really don't practise the kindness you preach. Trolling my forum posts to bring into this debate is a little cheap. Naughty. That's not what trolling means - I'm pointing out why you're wrong and why your opinion carries little weight. Wow for someone that wants to "Hug a Jihadi" you are quite rude and aggressive. Maybe if I pop my bomb vest on and lop a few heads off you'll show the compassion and kindness that you apparently have for all mankind. Wow!!! That is all. And maybe if you made points relevant to the discussion rather than trying to belittle some one for putting forward a perfectly good and sensible point of view you would be taken more seriously." And you sir are a hero. I'm sure you have scored lot's of brownie points with the lady in question and will soon be reaping your rewards. She does need your backing as her views are woollier than a herd of hairy sheep. | |||
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"Isis tss got nothing on the IRA now they new how to terrorise, look at me reminiscing on the good old days "As Gerry Adams said, "they haven't gone away you know" 10 IRA terrorist incidents in Northern Ireland in the last week. Let's sort out terrorism in the UK first. 46 years and counting. Forgive me for thinking that France may not welcome our help in stopping terrorism! | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x I don't know what your point is. I mean, if you've received such a strong education on the background of Islam, then you'd not make gross comments like how Ched Evans should be sent to a Middle Eastern country "lol". I think you're part of the problem, and you're hindering progression. Oooo you really don't practise the kindness you preach. Trolling my forum posts to bring into this debate is a little cheap. Naughty. That's not what trolling means - I'm pointing out why you're wrong and why your opinion carries little weight. Wow for someone that wants to "Hug a Jihadi" you are quite rude and aggressive. Maybe if I pop my bomb vest on and lop a few heads off you'll show the compassion and kindness that you apparently have for all mankind. Wow!!! That is all. And maybe if you made points relevant to the discussion rather than trying to belittle some one for putting forward a perfectly good and sensible point of view you would be taken more seriously. And you sir are a hero. I'm sure you have scored lot's of brownie points with the lady in question and will soon be reaping your rewards. She does need your backing as her views are woollier than a herd of hairy sheep. "
I gave up! | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics. C of E is a form of Christianity. Anyway, bombing will just perpetuate the situation and widen the gap as nothing is actually resolved. .Yes I know it its that's why I put Christin, Jewish and Islamic! all devout religions churn out extremists, where as wishy washy turn up once a year at Xmas CofE type ones rarely do. You've not got 120 years to solve this you've got way less, let's be realists if the 60s hippy movement had come through back then, then yes we may not be here but it didn't and we are where we are, the fact that I or you may not like right wing solutions doesn't mean there not the best or in this case the only way to solve the current problem!. There's at least a hundred thousand extremists right now planning to kill you and me and my kids, I'll be brutally honest, this shit is real I've warned against it for years and it's like a giant snowball getting bigger and worse every month, they've massacred kids in Pakistan, thousands in Iraq and Syria, Mumbai, London, new York, Madrid, Australia.. FFS how bad do you want it to get before you take it that negotiating, integrating and educating with them ain't going to cut it." By eck, if Nigel Clegg, Deputy PM ( for now) threw a wobbly over Farage then he ain't gonna like, nor admittedly read, this post. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing. "So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so? You surprise me but enjoy your integration. | |||
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"Terrorism exists. Media organisations are effective what contributes to what we see as terrorism. Reported terror usually comes with sensationalism. Headlines that grab attention or promote the views of any one popular paradigm or Newspaper group. Terror of the 'unknown' will always gain more press attention than terror that has existed for years but is thwarted. Take Christian extremism in the USA: the number of attempts on life is in the thousands - it vastly outweighs that of any outside terror group, religious splinter cell or lone wolf. Though Media groups, with vested self interest can easily shape they way we and Governments view threats. Combating terrorism has had countless theories thrown at it, whilst it can give understanding, open knowledge bases, dialouge and approaches. The human condition is such that we are wholly autonomous creatures. " Thank god finally someone with the intellect to think out side the bubble . I agree 100% spot on . | |||
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"Terrorism exists. Media organisations are effective what contributes to what we see as terrorism. Reported terror usually comes with sensationalism. Headlines that grab attention or promote the views of any one popular paradigm or Newspaper group. Terror of the 'unknown' will always gain more press attention than terror that has existed for years but is thwarted. Take Christian extremism in the USA: the number of attempts on life is in the thousands - it vastly outweighs that of any outside terror group, religious splinter cell or lone wolf. Though Media groups, with vested self interest can easily shape they way we and Governments view threats. Combating terrorism has had countless theories thrown at it, whilst it can give understanding, open knowledge bases, dialouge and approaches. The human condition is such that we are wholly autonomous creatures. Do you believe those traits are innate though? Or taught? Yes I'm aware some people are born evil, but not all. I've always been taught to accept and not be a terrorist, so I do and I'm not. I don't believe it's unfathomable that education can reach and fix this in the generations to come. " First we must define terrorist we are the "west " to many we are the "terrorist" they see us as that but we do not see it in our selves ,so the argument could be that like you said not are all born evil so therefore do not see there actions as terror but justified acts . | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. That is never going to happen! It will if we make the effert Will it? Look at the very recent history of Egypt. The Islamists won power through "democracy". Once they were in power they started to slaughter other non-believeing Egyptians. " Well let me show you the true story of Muslims and Christians in Egypt http://www.ucanews.com/news/viral-photo-shows-muslims-defending-catholic-church-in-egypt/69064 And, if you take the time to read it and the comments below it come back and tell me who seems to the ones in this case talking peace and love. The Muslims or the Christians. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration. "Our liberal friends have forgotten about Sharia law. Maybe a couple of weeks in Syria might chnge thier mind. Only this week there was an article about women publicly breastfeeding in a market in an ISIS governed town having thier breasts mutilated for shaming them selves by feeding publicly. | |||
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"Nuclear bomb Who do you intend to drop it on?? " You could always start with the towns and cities where those who preach and fund this hate come from and as it is all done in the name of Islam move on to the centres of Islam much in the way the jihadists are attacking the centres of the non Islamic... | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration. "I think you've misunderstood what integration means. Assimilation does not mean you have to lose your own identity. I never once said "hey everyone, let's all become Muslim", so I don't think your point really makes sense. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x And I would suggest that you take a look at some the moderate Muslim web sites that espouse nothing about violent Jihad but talk about peace and brotherhood between Abrahamic peoples. That's all well and good but by definition, you only need one terrorist to have terrorism. Shia v Sunni, the base cause, is all you really need to know. " I'm not sure what you are saying here. Are you saying that because one Shia or Sunni might be a terrorist we should treat them all as suspects. Please clarify | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
Our liberal friends have forgotten about Sharia law. Maybe a couple of weeks in Syria might chnge thier mind. Only this week there was an article about women publicly breastfeeding in a market in an ISIS governed town having thier breasts mutilated for shaming them selves by feeding publicly."Well, it's started here, wasn't there a woman in a posh hotel in London who was made to wear a large napkin or something over her whilst she breastfed? | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
I think you've misunderstood what integration means. Assimilation does not mean you have to lose your own identity. I never once said "hey everyone, let's all become Muslim", so I don't think your point really makes sense. "Is integration not readily available right now to all who want it? | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
I think you've misunderstood what integration means. Assimilation does not mean you have to lose your own identity. I never once said "hey everyone, let's all become Muslim", so I don't think your point really makes sense. "There's only one person on here not making sense......guess who? Yep you! You started off talking about kindness to others etc.. but as soon as someone has a different opinion to you (most) that kindness is quickly replaced with aggression. Hypocrite | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Im Ex Forces an have sat an spoke to 'Local Elders' an drank tea an less than an hour later they are shooting at you. Im afraid it is a us v them because their mindset is if you dont conform to their religion (thats what this is all about) then they will kill you! No apparently mate we have to hug it out with them. Only people like youself who have faced these people know the problem at hand." I don't think he's the only person who's faced this. Not all conclude the same as him. However I will give him more respect than others saying similar because, at the end of the day, he has had to put his life on the line for my freedom | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
I think you've misunderstood what integration means. Assimilation does not mean you have to lose your own identity. I never once said "hey everyone, let's all become Muslim", so I don't think your point really makes sense.
Is integration not readily available right now to all who want it? "To a degree, but certain misconceptions are limiting it. For example - there's a LOT of Islamophobic people in the UK (think of the EDL marches, for example) and there's a few Islamic groups preaching hatred, all of which spread fear. It's hard to implement it when there's so many who criticise it out of lack of knowledge. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
Our liberal friends have forgotten about Sharia law. Maybe a couple of weeks in Syria might chnge thier mind. Only this week there was an article about women publicly breastfeeding in a market in an ISIS governed town having thier breasts mutilated for shaming them selves by feeding publicly.
Well, it's started here, wasn't there a woman in a posh hotel in London who was made to wear a large napkin or something over her whilst she breastfed?
"Not quite the same as the mother being brutally flogged or had her breast torn up with some medieval torture instrument. | |||
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"The words of Martin Niemoller come to mind with this. However, the only way, in my mind, to understand this is to look at the Memetics in play. Ok back to la la land for me.
Mathematics in play? Yeah, i can go with that. "Please don't bring Dawkins into this as well. Havn't we got enough to content with already.  | |||
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"Catch the terrorists and mock them on live TV 24/7 - show them for what they are , and the kids would realise what the extremists are really like . I generally find that mocking your opponents tends to paint you in a worse light than them and is generally counter productive Good point .... maybe let them do it for themselves then . Interview them for long enough to let them dig their own hole ?" Now that would be a much better way to show them up | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
I think you've misunderstood what integration means. Assimilation does not mean you have to lose your own identity. I never once said "hey everyone, let's all become Muslim", so I don't think your point really makes sense.
There's only one person on here not making sense......guess who? Yep you! You started off talking about kindness to others etc.. but as soon as someone has a different opinion to you (most) that kindness is quickly replaced with aggression.
Hypocrite "Okay - I'm not sure what your problem is, but I preferred it when you said you'll ignore my posts. You're welcome to your opinion and as soon as you stop saying disgusting things I'll start paying attention | |||
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"Or the west could stop financing them, just a thought "You do have a bit of a point there | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." the only way you can be nice to these people is to bow down to them and appease them and turn muslim and have sharia law..etc im ok as I am and don't want to be muslim thank you.sometimes you have to fight fire with fire..its the only way to deal with these terrorists I think..? | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? Nah, I'm just not full of resentment. It's not a bad thing and I'm sorry you're so bitter you need to mock/patronise me. How do we improve integration and who do you feel is not intergrating at the moment? I was referring to the OP, so Islam and the western world. One way would be by improving education within Islamic communities and promoting social integration, as well as highlighting the damaging effects of extremist acts. Also, by educating the West to not be fearful of Muslim communities. A lot of people make disgusting comments about Islam and it doesn't help. Wow you make it sound so simple. Why has no one else thought of this? Hmmmm they have! It doesn't work. Unfortunately Islamic communities are too busy educating thier children the opposite of what you have suggested. Dont believe my children have ever had any anti muslim teachings at school. Take a peek online at some of the Islamic schools in uk. With kindness. x And I would suggest that you take a look at some the moderate Muslim web sites that espouse nothing about violent Jihad but talk about peace and brotherhood between Abrahamic peoples. That's all well and good but by definition, you only need one terrorist to have terrorism. Shia v Sunni, the base cause, is all you really need to know. I'm not sure what you are saying here. Are you saying that because one Shia or Sunni might be a terrorist we should treat them all as suspects. Please clarify" Not at all, many of them are indeed victims. The clue is in the existence of the two sects. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
I think you've misunderstood what integration means. Assimilation does not mean you have to lose your own identity. I never once said "hey everyone, let's all become Muslim", so I don't think your point really makes sense.
There's only one person on here not making sense......guess who? Yep you! You started off talking about kindness to others etc.. but as soon as someone has a different opinion to you (most) that kindness is quickly replaced with aggression.
Hypocrite
Okay - I'm not sure what your problem is, but I preferred it when you said you'll ignore my posts. You're welcome to your opinion and as soon as you stop saying disgusting things I'll start paying attention "Disgusting things??? Enlighten me? | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
Our liberal friends have forgotten about Sharia law. Maybe a couple of weeks in Syria might chnge thier mind. Only this week there was an article about women publicly breastfeeding in a market in an ISIS governed town having thier breasts mutilated for shaming them selves by feeding publicly.
Well, it's started here, wasn't there a woman in a posh hotel in London who was made to wear a large napkin or something over her whilst she breastfed?
Not quite the same as the mother being brutally flogged or had her breast torn up with some medieval torture instrument. "Precisely, that's a point i think many of our apologists miss. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
Our liberal friends have forgotten about Sharia law. Maybe a couple of weeks in Syria might chnge thier mind. Only this week there was an article about women publicly breastfeeding in a market in an ISIS governed town having thier breasts mutilated for shaming them selves by feeding publicly.
Well, it's started here, wasn't there a woman in a posh hotel in London who was made to wear a large napkin or something over her whilst she breastfed?
""Started here"????? Please say that you are joking trying to link that to ISIS. That could have happened here any time in the last 50 years or more. That's traditional English prudishness and has been happening as long as I can remember. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
I think you've misunderstood what integration means. Assimilation does not mean you have to lose your own identity. I never once said "hey everyone, let's all become Muslim", so I don't think your point really makes sense.
Is integration not readily available right now to all who want it? "Absolutely it is. To those who want it and to any who want to make it work. Sadly, the issue is the not so few who don't want it. Or only want their one way street. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
Our liberal friends have forgotten about Sharia law. Maybe a couple of weeks in Syria might chnge thier mind. Only this week there was an article about women publicly breastfeeding in a market in an ISIS governed town having thier breasts mutilated for shaming them selves by feeding publicly.
Well, it's started here, wasn't there a woman in a posh hotel in London who was made to wear a large napkin or something over her whilst she breastfed?
"Started here"????? Please say that you are joking trying to link that to ISIS. That could have happened here any time in the last 50 years or more. That's traditional English prudishness and has been happening as long as I can remember."Do i really have to say that i'm not linking that to ISIS. Really? Do you miss the bigger picture? | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics." Bloody hell. Talk about role reversal. I'm now the left wing liberal and your the right wing authoritarian. What's the world coming to ffs. Have I woken up in some weird parallel universe. | |||
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"It always has been difficult to overcome. For many aspects of terrorism, it has been indocrinated into everyday ways of life for decades, if not centuries, so it is far harder to convince their followers otherwise. True followers of Islam say that what is occurring in the name of their "faith" actually goes against what their faith states. Thus you have an element who feel marginalised and disillusioned, who then become easy targets for the more radical thinkers and members of that faith who then whip up their misguided views etc. It is those disillusioned followers that Governments, Communities and everyone else have to work on to prevent them going out to foreign countries to join their ranks. In short, an "army" has to rely on people joining them. Cut off the supply of followers and it is a start. But that is easy to say and maybe achieve some chance of success especially in the more civilised, major countries, like the UK etc. But to many inhabitants of poorer and impoverished countries in the African and Indian continents plus the Middle East, a wish to achieve a "better life" is what the terrorists play on, in their recruiting drive. It will continue for years and decades to come." This is the most sensible post on this thread I think, drowned out by naively simplistic viewpoints on both sides. That for me is a metaphor for the entire debate...any sensible discussion or debate about a way forward always seems to be lost in reactionary responses from both left/liberal and right wing commentators. E.g. "it's all our fault"/Western apologists up against the "bomb the bastards crowd". | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Weather it would work or not a person can not dispute your empathy towards your fellow man , it's very refreshing . Right on brother "
Education is one answer, combined with integration.
And then you wipe the extremists out, and you keep doing it... after all, with automated production lines its easy to make thousands and thousands of bullets, certainly faster than mummy terrorist can pop out baby-terrorists!
Bottom line... it's unfortunate, but these extremists cannot be reasoned with, they actually believe in what they are doing, you cant educate or integrate those that have been radicalised, so it's better just to erase the problem. | |||
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"The words of Martin Niemoller come to mind with this. However, the only way, in my mind, to understand this is to look at the Memetics in play. Ok back to la la land for me.
Mathematics in play? Yeah, i can go with that.
Sorry I don't understand, what's mathematic to do with the (genetics) Memetics of human bio-sycho-social behaviour "Noooo, please keep Dawkins out of this. It's tough enough already. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics. Bloody hell. Talk about role reversal. I'm now the left wing liberal and your the right wing authoritarian. What's the world coming to ffs. Have I woken up in some weird parallel universe." I strongly suspect you'd like to. | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse
A human is still a human though, right? You don't have less rights depending on what country you're from or what religion you believe in.
How exactly would integration hurt and decrease the chance of harmony? I don't know how it's a negative thing.
So you don't foresee "any" harm in becoming Muslim, replace existing law with Sharia and set back all women's rights that have been hard won, and yet to be won,over the last hundred years or so?
You surprise me but enjoy your integration.
Our liberal friends have forgotten about Sharia law. Maybe a couple of weeks in Syria might chnge thier mind. Only this week there was an article about women publicly breastfeeding in a market in an ISIS governed town having thier breasts mutilated for shaming them selves by feeding publicly.
Well, it's started here, wasn't there a woman in a posh hotel in London who was made to wear a large napkin or something over her whilst she breastfed?
"Started here"????? Please say that you are joking trying to link that to ISIS. That could have happened here any time in the last 50 years or more. That's traditional English prudishness and has been happening as long as I can remember.
Do i really have to say that i'm not linking that to ISIS. Really?
Do you miss the bigger picture?"You don't have to say anything. You wrote it already. Immediately after "women publicly breastfeeding in a market in an ISIS governed town having thier breasts mutilated for shaming them selves by feeding publicly" you wrote "it's started here already" | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world?" i can see what the poster your commenting on is suggesting so instead of responding like a 5 year old perhaps come up with an idea as that was the intent of the op yes..? or would that be against your right to free speech..? | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics.
as for the over used integrating and l was born here comments, a few of them might want to and a few of us might want them to but its only a few on both sides and a cow born in a stable don't make it a horse"Would that be because most British cows are black and white whilst most British houses tend to be brown? Or are you saying that Muslims are a different species to the rest of the British? | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? i can see what the poster your commenting on is suggesting so instead of responding like a 5 year old perhaps come up with an idea as that was the intent of the op yes..? or would that be against your right to free speech..? " | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics. Bloody hell. Talk about role reversal. I'm now the left wing liberal and your the right wing authoritarian. What's the world coming to ffs. Have I woken up in some weird parallel universe." . That my friend is human survival instincts. I just recognise how bad it's going to get very quickly. If there's one thing I've learnt from these forums it's people with deep beliefs don't change them with facts or hugs or niceness, they will act out these deep beliefs in the full and absolute knowledge that there going somewhere better. Now me I don't have those beliefs and I like the life I've got, so it's come down on this issue to self preservation, it's the same reason I joined the green party I genuinely believe(but through scientific facts)if we don't change our way of life were in the mire. You ain't going to debate your way out of trouble with radicalised crazed religious nutjobs, they don't want freedom of speech, they don't want consumerism, or swinging sites or anything except us dead. There well funded, well armed, well trained and scariest of all well devout. And if history tells us anything it won't stop easily or nicely. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness. Awww do you live in a house made from chocolate with a candy cane roof and madshmellow pillows lol. Can I live in your world? i can see what the poster your commenting on is suggesting so instead of responding like a 5 year old perhaps come up with an idea as that was the intent of the op yes..? or would that be against your right to free speech..? " Shhhhhhh!!! (Free speech temporarily banned) | |||
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"So we've got the left wing way(integration and education) and the right wing way (nuclear), personally I think both would work but there's problems with both, the right wing way is not even thinkable and unfortunately the left wing way by one persons own admission is 6 generations.. We ain't got a 120 years to sort this shit out we've got about 20 tops, are biggest advancement is also our worst problem right now, and that is technology, it's evolving way faster than us. In no less than 10 years time all the rogue states will have nuclear capability, most already have biological capabilities, how long before these nutjobs get hold of them?. Now is the time for wishy washy religion, let's face facts wishy washy C of E Religions rarely produce extremists but devout ones nearly always do(Jewish Christian and Islamic), Islam could wishy washy itself down to a CofE type but i doubt they will i think if they did that and we resolved some land issues it might work!!. but now is not the time for wishy washy politics, the left wing (the nice way) don't have the time or the resources, were going to have to bomb our way out of this problem for at least this generation maybe the next one too,i don't say this lightly as I'm by no way right wing, however I am a realist and right now we need right wing actions and right wing politics. C of E is a form of Christianity. Anyway, bombing will just perpetuate the situation and widen the gap as nothing is actually resolved. .Yes I know it its that's why I put Christin, Jewish and Islamic! all devout religions churn out extremists, where as wishy washy turn up once a year at Xmas CofE type ones rarely do. You've not got 120 years to solve this you've got way less, let's be realists if the 60s hippy movement had come through back then, then yes we may not be here but it didn't and we are where we are, the fact that I or you may not like right wing solutions doesn't mean there not the best or in this case the only way to solve the current problem!. There's at least a hundred thousand extremists right now planning to kill you and me and my kids, I'll be brutally honest, this shit is real I've warned against it for years and it's like a giant snowball getting bigger and worse every month, they've massacred kids in Pakistan, thousands in Iraq and Syria, Mumbai, London, new York, Madrid, Australia.. FFS how bad do you want it to get before you take it that negotiating, integrating and educating with them ain't going to cut it." I'll never accept that it won't work because the alternative is something like Nazi Germany and the Jews. And I hate to bring that old Chestnut up but in this case it really is apt. | |||
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"its ok saying lets integrate,you dont see them mixing with people in certain towns in Lancashire and Yorkshire.They live in their little communities and will NOT mix with other faiths.Surely integration works both ways." That is a real problem and it has to be addressed also. We have allowed almost ghettoes to build up in many towns in the name of multiculturalism. That has not worked well. Now we need to teach their children about the benefits of our liberal, free and democratic culture. Unfortunately, just when we need those values most, they seem to be in very short supply. At least on this thread anyway. | |||
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"Oooo you really don't practise the kindness you preach. Trolling my forum posts to bring into this debate is a little cheap. Naughty. That's not what trolling means - I'm pointing out why you're wrong and why your opinion carries little weight. Wow for someone that wants to "Hug a Jihadi" you are quite rude and aggressive. Maybe if I pop my bomb vest on and lop a few heads off you'll show the compassion and kindness that you apparently have for all mankind. Wow!!! That is all. And maybe if you made points relevant to the discussion rather than trying to belittle some one for putting forward a perfectly good and sensible point of view you would be taken more seriously. And you sir are a hero. I'm sure you have scored lot's of brownie points with the lady in question and will soon be reaping your rewards. She does need your backing as her views are woollier than a herd of hairy sheep.
I gave up!"I was surprised it was not said sooner TBH. But I'll leave others to judge whether what I'm saying is just get in some birds knickers or because it's what I believe and whether what he is saying is because he believes it or because he just thinks that throwing insults at people will some how add value to his argument. | |||
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"After the sad events of what's happened in France. Something really needs to be done, how do you stop people like this that don't care if they die?" Stop drawing cartoons of prophets | |||
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Mr ddc
(Sorry, couldn't be bothered with a serious one, 26pions, mr cracken n t'other one pretty much had it covered drom the start )
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"After the sad events of what's happened in France. Something really needs to be done, how do you stop people like this that don't care if they die?" Intern their families until they have served there sentence. That would deter them. | |||
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"its ok saying lets integrate,you dont see them mixing with people in certain towns in Lancashire and Yorkshire.They live in their little communities and will NOT mix with other faiths.Surely integration works both ways. That is a real problem and it has to be addressed also. We have allowed almost ghettoes to build up in many towns in the name of multiculturalism. That has not worked well. Now we need to teach their children about the benefits of our liberal, free and democratic culture. Unfortunately, just when we need those values most, they seem to be in very short supply. At least on this thread anyway." .Your right there's lots of things that need tackling, we've drifted through life being sheltered from really series problems, we got caught up with how peaceful everything was going to be after the cold war, and we got more interested in flash cars, foreign holidays and getting wealthy and we should have been looking after our parents, neighbours and children. Right now we've got big problems, really big problems, we need free speech, we need honest debate, all of us white black brown and yellow, gay and straight, were in real fucking trouble. | |||
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"You don't give them the publicity the news is there biggest advertising campaign so far " This. And change your foreign policy and who you politically get Into bed with to stop pissing people off for greed. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness."
and also open your eyes and see that the whole picture not the manipulated media one. We are all hurting someone, somewhere.. where its resource theft, oil theft, political unstability in the world... if we dont help make it a better place then we are someone elses 'evil doer' | |||
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"After the sad events of what's happened in France. Something really needs to be done, how do you stop people like this that don't care if they die? Intern their families until they have served there sentence. That would deter them." Ah Sippenhaft - that was tried in 1940's Germany, Stalinist Russia and is popular in North Korea. I'm not sure it reflects our values. | |||
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"You integrate and include them. You stop thinking it's "us versus them". Tackle it with kindness." Perfect answer. Alienate and segregate is not the answer. Inclusion, however distasteful has to be the way ahead. If they are included, they only harm the community they are part of. As an aside, terrorists with body armour, a get away car and stop to pick up a shoe are not wanting to die for their cause. They want to live to fight again. | |||
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".. they don't want freedom of speech, they don't want consumerism, or swinging sites or anything except us dead." And you really think you have freedom of speech ... trying saying something really controversial (passing judgement on those who have power over your and make a change to shake up the establishment) and see how far you get. No one really has any freedom, just the illusion of it. | |||
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