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NHS - major incident

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

On the news major incidents remain at hospitals across England as staff struggle to cope with the number of patients. Hospitals in Staffordshire, Gloucestershire, Cambridgeshire, London and Surrey are among those affected.

Both my local hospitals have cancelled non emergency surgery for the past 3 days.

One commentator said part of the problem is we are from a - want it now generation, so will not wait for a GP appointment or go to the chemist plus the NHS hotline sends people to hospital too quickly. Maybe it's just normal high, post Christmas, winter demand.

Cheltenham hospital is now closed anyway, for A & E overnight due to economies of scale. Patients have to go to Gloucester. I would happily pay more National Insurance if they pumped it into the NHS.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Remember at the start of the austerity measures, the promise was made that 'front line services would not suffer'?

Well, here we are.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm not sure just pumping money in is the answer. I do agree that people can be very demanding on the NHS for minor things, however I'm lucky in that I've got nurses and doctors in my family so I have people to ask about things. Maybe if I didn't, I'd be at the GP all the time too.

The elephant in the room for me is cuts to social care funding (local authority budgets). There are elderly people who can't be discharged from hospital because their social care is not in place, because councils have had to cut back. While those hospital beds are occupied, other people can't be admitted, hence some of the A&E backlogs.

Protection of NHS budgets is pointless if social care funding is slashed, the two are so closely linked.

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk

If they didn't give themselves 11% pay rises whilst everything else is being cut and let numerous large corporations off paying the tax they owe, you wouldn't have to pay more NI for a decent NHS.

The Tories want the NHS to fail. They are actively trying to kill it so they have an excuse to say it isn't working, we should privatise it.

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By *ucsparkMan
over a year ago

dudley


"Remember at the start of the austerity measures, the promise was made that 'front line services would not suffer'?

Well, here we are.

"

This is very true, have friends who work in A&E and ambulance service and both at breaking point

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk


"I'm not sure just pumping money in is the answer. I do agree that people can be very demanding on the NHS for minor things, however I'm lucky in that I've got nurses and doctors in my family so I have people to ask about things. Maybe if I didn't, I'd be at the GP all the time too.

The elephant in the room for me is cuts to social care funding (local authority budgets). There are elderly people who can't be discharged from hospital because their social care is not in place, because councils have had to cut back. While those hospital beds are occupied, other people can't be admitted, hence some of the A&E backlogs.

Protection of NHS budgets is pointless if social care funding is slashed, the two are so closely linked."

There are other aspects too. The massive cuts to mental health services have massively increased pressure on A&E departments (as well as the police and other emergency services). Norman Lamb commented on it recently.

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By *icefellatwoMan
over a year ago

hastings


"Remember at the start of the austerity measures, the promise was made that 'front line services would not suffer'?

Well, here we are.

"

But that was by a politician so it doesn't count

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm not sure just pumping money in is the answer. I do agree that people can be very demanding on the NHS for minor things, however I'm lucky in that I've got nurses and doctors in my family so I have people to ask about things. Maybe if I didn't, I'd be at the GP all the time too.

The elephant in the room for me is cuts to social care funding (local authority budgets). There are elderly people who can't be discharged from hospital because their social care is not in place, because councils have had to cut back. While those hospital beds are occupied, other people can't be admitted, hence some of the A&E backlogs.

Protection of NHS budgets is pointless if social care funding is slashed, the two are so closely linked.

There are other aspects too. The massive cuts to mental health services have massively increased pressure on A&E departments (as well as the police and other emergency services). Norman Lamb commented on it recently."

Absolutely agree - I think the point is it's naive of people to believe any party's promises to choose some areas of the public services which it's ok to cut while other budgets are protected because none of them operate in isolation. (All of them are at this not just Conservatives. You'll protect NHS funding? If you're slashing everything else you'll increase pressure on it). Schools budgets being protected and increased while council education services budgets are cut is another one. Or pressure on the police is increasing because there aren't local authority teams to deal with things like night time noise and minor antisocial behaviour.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Remember when your GP ran a service, and came to your house when needed and performed proper triage on who went to A&E. Generally it was take this pill and come to the surgery tomorrow, now call 111 for a sore finger and they send you to A&E.

It was one of the first "economies" Cameron made to stop "overpaid" gp's forcing his government to give them a pay rise.

Tinkering with the edges of any system is generally a bad idea, especially if the reason is simply political.

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By *icefellatwoMan
over a year ago

hastings

Thats another reason to cut immigration our infrastructure is under so much pressure as it is without more and more people coming in

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Remember when your GP ran a service, and came to your house when needed and performed proper triage on who went to A&E. Generally it was take this pill and come to the surgery tomorrow, now call 111 for a sore finger and they send you to A&E.

It was one of the first "economies" Cameron made to stop "overpaid" gp's forcing his government to give them a pay rise.

Tinkering with the edges of any system is generally a bad idea, especially if the reason is simply political. "

Yes and I think due to the larger number of patients per GP, some of the human element has been lost. I couldn't get past reception to get a GP out to my grandmother last year before she went into a home. My sis and I both struggled to get an 86 year old in a wheelchair down there. When her GP saw her, he made sure it was noted that in the future she should have home visits ! Its a numbers game really , there is just no spare capacity , it's all been stripped to the bone!

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By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire

It's always hard to get to the truth about any story about the NHS, without the usual spin from the political parties and the unions.

Does seem more about misuse by people with a few sniffles, plus Councils and families abrogating their responsibilities, rather than a lack of money.

Interesting juxtaposition on the radio news, in Xmas week Sainsburys served 26million people, yet no 'crisis' was ever declared. So is it not simply lack of planning, poor management, and a refusal to send non AnE cases away with a flee in their ear?

Mr ddc

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By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire


"Thats another reason to cut immigration our infrastructure is under so much pressure as it is without more and more people coming in "

To be fair, I think it's the 'immigrants' who are holding the system together!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Thats another reason to cut immigration our infrastructure is under so much pressure as it is without more and more people coming in "

You do realise that without foreign doctors and nurses working in the NHS there wouldn't be enough staff to actually run the front-line medical services, right?

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk


"I'm not sure just pumping money in is the answer. I do agree that people can be very demanding on the NHS for minor things, however I'm lucky in that I've got nurses and doctors in my family so I have people to ask about things. Maybe if I didn't, I'd be at the GP all the time too.

The elephant in the room for me is cuts to social care funding (local authority budgets). There are elderly people who can't be discharged from hospital because their social care is not in place, because councils have had to cut back. While those hospital beds are occupied, other people can't be admitted, hence some of the A&E backlogs.

Protection of NHS budgets is pointless if social care funding is slashed, the two are so closely linked.

There are other aspects too. The massive cuts to mental health services have massively increased pressure on A&E departments (as well as the police and other emergency services). Norman Lamb commented on it recently.

Absolutely agree - I think the point is it's naive of people to believe any party's promises to choose some areas of the public services which it's ok to cut while other budgets are protected because none of them operate in isolation. (All of them are at this not just Conservatives. You'll protect NHS funding? If you're slashing everything else you'll increase pressure on it). Schools budgets being protected and increased while council education services budgets are cut is another one. Or pressure on the police is increasing because there aren't local authority teams to deal with things like night time noise and minor antisocial behaviour."

Yes, absolutely.

Austerity isn't working. So many cuts so far and yet borrowing has increased massively.

Everything needs investment, not cuts. For a while at least, politicians and big business need to stop bleeding the system. It's nearly dry.

The economy is never going to recover when the majority have less and less all the time, and the fortunate few take more and more (which they invest rather than spend).

Squeezing a few million from the people who can least afford it isn't enough to solve the debt problem and they don't realise that that few million is lost elsewhere, (emergency services, the judicial system as crime increases etc).

And whilst we allow politicians to charge us £39 for one breakfast, to bill us for their underpants, to expect us to pay for their meals and booze, even though they earn way in excess of what most people make, and the rest, things will continue to go downhill.

I want to hear a party commit to collecting the hundreds of millions owed in tax by big business. The debts that HMRC seems happy to write off. Then I want them to actually do it.

I want to see tougher limits on expenses. Realistic, fair allowances on what can be spent on, say, breakfast. An end to subsidised bars and restaurants in the Houses. MPs paying for their own travel to and from work and for their own meals at work, like most people have to.

We are, after all, apparently, all in it together. Cuts are needed and tough choices must be made...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm not sure just pumping money in is the answer. I do agree that people can be very demanding on the NHS for minor things, however I'm lucky in that I've got nurses and doctors in my family so I have people to ask about things. Maybe if I didn't, I'd be at the GP all the time too.

The elephant in the room for me is cuts to social care funding (local authority budgets). There are elderly people who can't be discharged from hospital because their social care is not in place, because councils have had to cut back. While those hospital beds are occupied, other people can't be admitted, hence some of the A&E backlogs.

Protection of NHS budgets is pointless if social care funding is slashed, the two are so closely linked.

There are other aspects too. The massive cuts to mental health services have massively increased pressure on A&E departments (as well as the police and other emergency services). Norman Lamb commented on it recently.

Absolutely agree - I think the point is it's naive of people to believe any party's promises to choose some areas of the public services which it's ok to cut while other budgets are protected because none of them operate in isolation. (All of them are at this not just Conservatives. You'll protect NHS funding? If you're slashing everything else you'll increase pressure on it). Schools budgets being protected and increased while council education services budgets are cut is another one. Or pressure on the police is increasing because there aren't local authority teams to deal with things like night time noise and minor antisocial behaviour.

Yes, absolutely.

Austerity isn't working. So many cuts so far and yet borrowing has increased massively.

Everything needs investment, not cuts. For a while at least, politicians and big business need to stop bleeding the system. It's nearly dry.

The economy is never going to recover when the majority have less and less all the time, and the fortunate few take more and more (which they invest rather than spend).

Squeezing a few million from the people who can least afford it isn't enough to solve the debt problem and they don't realise that that few million is lost elsewhere, (emergency services, the judicial system as crime increases etc).

And whilst we allow politicians to charge us £39 for one breakfast, to bill us for their underpants, to expect us to pay for their meals and booze, even though they earn way in excess of what most people make, and the rest, things will continue to go downhill.

I want to hear a party commit to collecting the hundreds of millions owed in tax by big business. The debts that HMRC seems happy to write off. Then I want them to actually do it.

I want to see tougher limits on expenses. Realistic, fair allowances on what can be spent on, say, breakfast. An end to subsidised bars and restaurants in the Houses. MPs paying for their own travel to and from work and for their own meals at work, like most people have to.

We are, after all, apparently, all in it together. Cuts are needed and tough choices must be made..."

As good as this sounds, I fear it'll never come to pass. Why would the government fuck themselves as well as the fucking the people over.

We're all in it together though of course

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk


"I'm not sure just pumping money in is the answer. I do agree that people can be very demanding on the NHS for minor things, however I'm lucky in that I've got nurses and doctors in my family so I have people to ask about things. Maybe if I didn't, I'd be at the GP all the time too.

The elephant in the room for me is cuts to social care funding (local authority budgets). There are elderly people who can't be discharged from hospital because their social care is not in place, because councils have had to cut back. While those hospital beds are occupied, other people can't be admitted, hence some of the A&E backlogs.

Protection of NHS budgets is pointless if social care funding is slashed, the two are so closely linked.

There are other aspects too. The massive cuts to mental health services have massively increased pressure on A&E departments (as well as the police and other emergency services). Norman Lamb commented on it recently.

Absolutely agree - I think the point is it's naive of people to believe any party's promises to choose some areas of the public services which it's ok to cut while other budgets are protected because none of them operate in isolation. (All of them are at this not just Conservatives. You'll protect NHS funding? If you're slashing everything else you'll increase pressure on it). Schools budgets being protected and increased while council education services budgets are cut is another one. Or pressure on the police is increasing because there aren't local authority teams to deal with things like night time noise and minor antisocial behaviour.

Yes, absolutely.

Austerity isn't working. So many cuts so far and yet borrowing has increased massively.

Everything needs investment, not cuts. For a while at least, politicians and big business need to stop bleeding the system. It's nearly dry.

The economy is never going to recover when the majority have less and less all the time, and the fortunate few take more and more (which they invest rather than spend).

Squeezing a few million from the people who can least afford it isn't enough to solve the debt problem and they don't realise that that few million is lost elsewhere, (emergency services, the judicial system as crime increases etc).

And whilst we allow politicians to charge us £39 for one breakfast, to bill us for their underpants, to expect us to pay for their meals and booze, even though they earn way in excess of what most people make, and the rest, things will continue to go downhill.

I want to hear a party commit to collecting the hundreds of millions owed in tax by big business. The debts that HMRC seems happy to write off. Then I want them to actually do it.

I want to see tougher limits on expenses. Realistic, fair allowances on what can be spent on, say, breakfast. An end to subsidised bars and restaurants in the Houses. MPs paying for their own travel to and from work and for their own meals at work, like most people have to.

We are, after all, apparently, all in it together. Cuts are needed and tough choices must be made...

As good as this sounds, I fear it'll never come to pass. Why would the government fuck themselves as well as the fucking the people over.

We're all in it together though of course "

Of course they won't do it. They're doing very nicely, thanks very much. There's no reason for them to change a thing. And it's not like we have a decent option to vote for. They're all the same with different coloured rosettes.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The problem is people have to wait so long for doctors appointments these days. I will always try to use walk in centres, minor injuries units and out of hours gp if I can't get a normal gp appointment.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Thats another reason to cut immigration our infrastructure is under so much pressure as it is without more and more people coming in

You do realise that without foreign doctors and nurses working in the NHS there wouldn't be enough staff to actually run the front-line medical services, right?"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 07/01/15 09:14:07]

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By *oodvibrations68Couple
over a year ago

Lake Constance


"I'm not sure just pumping money in is the answer. I do agree that people can be very demanding on the NHS for minor things, however I'm lucky in that I've got nurses and doctors in my family so I have people to ask about things. Maybe if I didn't, I'd be at the GP all the time too.

The elephant in the room for me is cuts to social care funding (local authority budgets). There are elderly people who can't be discharged from hospital because their social care is not in place, because councils have had to cut back. While those hospital beds are occupied, other people can't be admitted, hence some of the A&E backlogs.

Protection of NHS budgets is pointless if social care funding is slashed, the two are so closely linked."

...considered a career change?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Give it a few years and we'll have a privatised system that nobody can afford to use and we'll have health insurance companies fleecing us out of more of our meagre earnings.

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By *reelove1969Couple
over a year ago

bristol

the nhs being a free service is fundamentally the problem ...if there was a token fee for attending 'accident and emergency' we could probably empty the waiting rooms over night ...not because people would go untreated with injuries due to lack of funds but due to the fact that they are trivial matters that do not warrant an a & e department in the first place

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By *icefellatwoMan
over a year ago

hastings


"Thats another reason to cut immigration our infrastructure is under so much pressure as it is without more and more people coming in

You do realise that without foreign doctors and nurses working in the NHS there wouldn't be enough staff to actually run the front-line medical services, right?"

I realise that we do have lots of foreign doctors and nurses working in our NHS we always have done.

But how many of them are eastern European .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm not sure just pumping money in is the answer. I do agree that people can be very demanding on the NHS for minor things, however I'm lucky in that I've got nurses and doctors in my family so I have people to ask about things. Maybe if I didn't, I'd be at the GP all the time too.

The elephant in the room for me is cuts to social care funding (local authority budgets). There are elderly people who can't be discharged from hospital because their social care is not in place, because councils have had to cut back. While those hospital beds are occupied, other people can't be admitted, hence some of the A&E backlogs.

Protection of NHS budgets is pointless if social care funding is slashed, the two are so closely linked.

There are other aspects too. The massive cuts to mental health services have massively increased pressure on A&E departments (as well as the police and other emergency services). Norman Lamb commented on it recently.

Absolutely agree - I think the point is it's naive of people to believe any party's promises to choose some areas of the public services which it's ok to cut while other budgets are protected because none of them operate in isolation. (All of them are at this not just Conservatives. You'll protect NHS funding? If you're slashing everything else you'll increase pressure on it). Schools budgets being protected and increased while council education services budgets are cut is another one. Or pressure on the police is increasing because there aren't local authority teams to deal with things like night time noise and minor antisocial behaviour.

Yes, absolutely.

Austerity isn't working. So many cuts so far and yet borrowing has increased massively.

Everything needs investment, not cuts. For a while at least, politicians and big business need to stop bleeding the system. It's nearly dry.

The economy is never going to recover when the majority have less and less all the time, and the fortunate few take more and more (which they invest rather than spend).

Squeezing a few million from the people who can least afford it isn't enough to solve the debt problem and they don't realise that that few million is lost elsewhere, (emergency services, the judicial system as crime increases etc).

And whilst we allow politicians to charge us £39 for one breakfast, to bill us for their underpants, to expect us to pay for their meals and booze, even though they earn way in excess of what most people make, and the rest, things will continue to go downhill.

I want to hear a party commit to collecting the hundreds of millions owed in tax by big business. The debts that HMRC seems happy to write off. Then I want them to actually do it.

I want to see tougher limits on expenses. Realistic, fair allowances on what can be spent on, say, breakfast. An end to subsidised bars and restaurants in the Houses. MPs paying for their own travel to and from work and for their own meals at work, like most people have to.

We are, after all, apparently, all in it together. Cuts are needed and tough choices must be made...

As good as this sounds, I fear it'll never come to pass. Why would the government fuck themselves as well as the fucking the people over.

We're all in it together though of course

Of course they won't do it. They're doing very nicely, thanks very much. There's no reason for them to change a thing. And it's not like we have a decent option to vote for. They're all the same with different coloured rosettes."

Vote green. You would be surprised at their honesty.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West

[Removed by poster at 07/01/15 09:21:28]

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk


" The NHS has to change and despite your well meant and absolutely correct condemnation of HMRC failings to close the tax gap. The two issues are not connected."

Including currently legal tax avoidance, the tax gap is what? 30 billion or so?

Having an extra £30 billion in tax revenue wouldn't mean fewer cuts need to be made and more could be invested in essential services?

Oooookay.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


"I'm not sure just pumping money in is the answer. I do agree that people can be very demanding on the NHS for minor things, however I'm lucky in that I've got nurses and doctors in my family so I have people to ask about things. Maybe if I didn't, I'd be at the GP all the time too.

The elephant in the room for me is cuts to social care funding (local authority budgets). There are elderly people who can't be discharged from hospital because their social care is not in place, because councils have had to cut back. While those hospital beds are occupied, other people can't be admitted, hence some of the A&E backlogs.

Protection of NHS budgets is pointless if social care funding is slashed, the two are so closely linked.

There are other aspects too. The massive cuts to mental health services have massively increased pressure on A&E departments (as well as the police and other emergency services). Norman Lamb commented on it recently.

Absolutely agree - I think the point is it's naive of people to believe any party's promises to choose some areas of the public services which it's ok to cut while other budgets are protected because none of them operate in isolation. (All of them are at this not just Conservatives. You'll protect NHS funding? If you're slashing everything else you'll increase pressure on it). Schools budgets being protected and increased while council education services budgets are cut is another one. Or pressure on the police is increasing because there aren't local authority teams to deal with things like night time noise and minor antisocial behaviour.

Yes, absolutely.

Austerity isn't working. So many cuts so far and yet borrowing has increased massively.

Everything needs investment, not cuts. For a while at least, politicians and big business need to stop bleeding the system. It's nearly dry.

The economy is never going to recover when the majority have less and less all the time, and the fortunate few take more and more (which they invest rather than spend).

Squeezing a few million from the people who can least afford it isn't enough to solve the debt problem and they don't realise that that few million is lost elsewhere, (emergency services, the judicial system as crime increases etc).

And whilst we allow politicians to charge us £39 for one breakfast, to bill us for their underpants, to expect us to pay for their meals and booze, even though they earn way in excess of what most people make, and the rest, things will continue to go downhill.

I want to hear a party commit to collecting the hundreds of millions owed in tax by big business. The debts that HMRC seems happy to write off. Then I want them to actually do it.

I want to see tougher limits on expenses. Realistic, fair allowances on what can be spent on, say, breakfast. An end to subsidised bars and restaurants in the Houses. MPs paying for their own travel to and from work and for their own meals at work, like most people have to.

We are, after all, apparently, all in it together. Cuts are needed and tough choices must be made..."

The NHS has to change and despite your well meant and absolutely correct condemnation of HMRC failings to close the tax gap. The two issues are not connected.

We have to get the rose tinted view of our treasured NHS out of our heads and adopt more pragmatic attitude. Society should not be paying to treat d*unks on a Saturday night and society should not be paying to treat type 2 diabetics. Prescription fraud needs to be tackled and everyone should pay a flat fee to attend A & E. Notwithstanding this, we need to examine health care services around the world and plan for a better system on the future AND make sure that the money we pay for it is ring fenced for the purpose. The alternative does not have to be an American system there are other alternatives. - even in Europe.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A revisit to the Aims and Purpose of the NHS is required.... somethings should just not be available on the NHS/prescription.

A fixed fee for overnight stays and food.

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By *exyLancs2Couple
over a year ago

Manchester


"Thats another reason to cut immigration our infrastructure is under so much pressure as it is without more and more people coming in

You do realise that without foreign doctors and nurses working in the NHS there wouldn't be enough staff to actually run the front-line medical services, right?

I realise that we do have lots of foreign doctors and nurses working in our NHS we always have done.

But how many of them are eastern European ."

Think the point UKIP make is not cutting immigration completely. Have control of the borders, like Australia, so that people with the required skills can come and work. For example nurses and doctors where there is a skill shortage. That's the right kind of immigration.

However, a virtually open door policy, with no filters of any kind and no control over numbers will put pressure on policing, housing, health care and schools.

We have a National Health Service, not an international health service. Read a stat somewhere that the majority of newly diagnosed HIV cases come from people that have been 'resident' here less than two years.

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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago

North West


" The NHS has to change and despite your well meant and absolutely correct condemnation of HMRC failings to close the tax gap. The two issues are not connected.

Including currently legal tax avoidance, the tax gap is what? 30 billion or so?

Having an extra £30 billion in tax revenue wouldn't mean fewer cuts need to be made and more could be invested in essential services?

Oooookay."

If your engine is leaking oil, you need to fix the engine, not keep putting more oil in.

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk


"A revisit to the Aims and Purpose of the NHS is required.... somethings should just not be available on the NHS/prescription.

A fixed fee for overnight stays and food. "

And some things should be available that currently aren't.

If we're now paying for hospital treatment, do we get to pay less NI?

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By *icefellatwoMan
over a year ago

hastings


"Thats another reason to cut immigration our infrastructure is under so much pressure as it is without more and more people coming in

You do realise that without foreign doctors and nurses working in the NHS there wouldn't be enough staff to actually run the front-line medical services, right?

I realise that we do have lots of foreign doctors and nurses working in our NHS we always have done.

But how many of them are eastern European .

Think the point UKIP make is not cutting immigration completely. Have control of the borders, like Australia, so that people with the required skills can come and work. For example nurses and doctors where there is a skill shortage. That's the right kind of immigration.

However, a virtually open door policy, with no filters of any kind and no control over numbers will put pressure on policing, housing, health care and schools.

We have a National Health Service, not an international health service. Read a stat somewhere that the majority of newly diagnosed HIV cases come from people that have been 'resident' here less than two years."

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By *exyLancs2Couple
over a year ago

Manchester

Too hot makes a great point there. Ambulance shortages at night, at weekends, are due to d*unks and fighting, quite often connected too.

Why not have d*unk tanks? Secure zones with police and on call nurses on overtime. If you're d*unk and can't look after yourself why tie and ambulance or A&E space up? Get thrown in the tank and an £80 fine in the morning to finance it.

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk


" The NHS has to change and despite your well meant and absolutely correct condemnation of HMRC failings to close the tax gap. The two issues are not connected.

Including currently legal tax avoidance, the tax gap is what? 30 billion or so?

Having an extra £30 billion in tax revenue wouldn't mean fewer cuts need to be made and more could be invested in essential services?

Oooookay.

If your engine is leaking oil, you need to fix the engine, not keep putting more oil in."

Yes, the NHS needs some changes. It's incredibly inefficient. BUT it's also chronically under-funded.

It was bad enough before austerity but now it's just ridiculous.

The problem needs tackling from both perspectives. Under-funding absolutely is an issue.

Like I said though, the Tories want the NHS to fail to give them an excuse to sell it to their mates. Lucky for them that the Tories are the ones in the position to grind it into the ground, eh?

How can anyone with a vested interest in a company or institution failing be trusted to run it?

Oh, and until you can fix the broken engine, adding more oil will keep it running and stop it failing catastrophically.

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk

As mentioned, "health tourism" is a huge problem here and absolutely needs to be stopped.

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By *exyLancs2Couple
over a year ago

Manchester

Have to agree though that MP's implementing the recommendation of their 'independent' pay review body of an 11% pay rise was a public relations disaster. Especially when you consider the pay review body for NHS staff recommended 1% and that was refused.

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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago

Somewhere in North Norfolk


"Have to agree though that MP's implementing the recommendation of their 'independent' pay review body of an 11% pay rise was a public relations disaster. Especially when you consider the pay review body for NHS staff recommended 1% and that was refused. "

Plus the increase in their apparently unlimited expenses. That 11% is only part of the story.

We're all in it together, my arse.

Given that 11% for them equates to much more than 11% of most people's income, I'm still spitting mad. Greedy fuckers.

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By *icefellatwoMan
over a year ago

hastings

The problem with our politicians is they are to busy trying to score points against each other rather than doing whats right for the country

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By *erbyDalesCplCouple
over a year ago

Derbyshire


"The problem with our politicians is they are to busy trying to score points against each other rather than doing whats right for the country "

Ain't that the truth!

Agree though that some system of charging for AnE use, or mid-use, is well overdue.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"A revisit to the Aims and Purpose of the NHS is required.... somethings should just not be available on the NHS/prescription.

A fixed fee for overnight stays and food.

And some things should be available that currently aren't.

If we're now paying for hospital treatment, do we get to pay less NI?"

That is the overall aim, pay less taxes and NI...

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By *uby0000Woman
over a year ago

hertfordshire

ambulance drivers are getting more abuse nowdays hospitals have to see patients for minor things that could be dealt with by a gp

agency nurses instead of nhs nurses cos pay iis crap

we don't appreciate our NHS the nurses do a wonderful job and deserve decent pay

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By *its_n_piecesCouple
over a year ago


"

If your engine is leaking oil, you need to fix the engine, not keep putting more oil in."

true ... but your idea of scrapping the whole car and leasing another one from a shady dealer who has control over who we give a lift to is utter rubbish

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By *reelove1969Couple
over a year ago

bristol

how about we all get an nhs clubcard ....it works likes tescos ....whatever you put in you can get out as and when required ..radical !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Remember at the start of the austerity measures, the promise was made that 'front line services would not suffer'?

Well, here we are.

"

The distinction between 'front line services' and 'back office' is a fallacy anyway. You want to catch more tax dodgers and close loopholes? You need more and better paid tax inspectors. You want doctors and nurses to spend more time with patients? You need good admin and management functions. But these are the roles that are derided as overpaid, bureaucratic and

We can't just keep putting money into the NHS and all the public services for that matter. It's demographic change that's the pressure here. To some extent the NHS is a victim of it's own success - more people are living longer and surviving illnesses that would once have been a death sentence.

You could close every tax loophole going, put all of those billions into the NHS but it would still only be a matter of time before more was needed.

Fundamental change is needed, both in the organisations themselves and in people's expectations about what can and will be provided, what their own responsibilities are, and how much and how we pay. I don't know what the answer is but unfortunately none of the parties will ever face up to this anyway because it's too hard and it's not a vote winner.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"unfortunately none of the parties will ever face up to this because it's too hard and it's not a vote winner."

This.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Would now be OK to point out.... That if you let 5 to 9 million people in while reducing infrastructure spending by 45%, your bound to put your services under pressure sooner or later!.

Next up is schools?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Too hot makes a great point there. Ambulance shortages at night, at weekends, are due to d*unks and fighting, quite often connected too.

Why not have d*unk tanks? Secure zones with police and on call nurses on overtime. If you're d*unk and can't look after yourself why tie and ambulance or A&E space up? Get thrown in the tank and an £80 fine in the morning to finance it."

I get the theory , it's those cases though that go wrong that make me wary. Diabetics can appear d*unk if their sugars are way too low.

I know it would be never happen but charging for missed GP appointments might make people ensure they get to them. My surgery puts up stats of lots of missed appointments every month. Managing those would ease pressure on other services too.

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