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"do they come with a web cam and printer etc ?" If you beg enough, or barter with one of the participating stores who want to offload some old shit they've had lying about for three years... hey, the govt will buy all the old tat we can sell it. | |||
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"familys ............ poor single blokes left out again "well its their own goddam fault for not puting it about a bit more and having 3 kids by 5 fuck buddies innit. | |||
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" Martin Lewis's moneysavingsexpert.com Subscribing to his free weekly e-mail is a good idea too, loads of financial information, links and money saving tips. " yup!! ugg boots for 50 quid, half price ipods and loads of other good information x | |||
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"Many of the laptops are earmarked for children with severe disabilities and special educational needs, I doubt anyone would deny access to laptops for them? "That's simply not true. There are 10,000 laptops left over from the first 'drive' to bring the lowest in our society online, and they are being allocated on a first come first served basis so as you meet the not so stringent criteria, which is: *at least one child between the ages of 7-14 * an income no greater than £16k per household * that you are not online already (although checks are NOT being made to establish this) It's not hard to see how the criminal element of the lowest class are going to spot an absolute kicker in terms of getting a laptop worth £528 for free then go knock it out down the pub for £300 or more. I'd have thought these families on the so called breadline would have needed £500 for much more mundane things - like food & clothing, y'know, the lets keep the family ALIVE sort of mundane crap. | |||
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" Totally agree with you, there was no need for any of the snide and stereotypical comments from 2 of the posters on this thread. " Are we only allowed an opinion if it agrees with yours then? | |||
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" Totally agree with you, there was no need for any of the snide and stereotypical comments from 2 of the posters on this thread. Are we only allowed an opinion if it agrees with yours then?" looks like it | |||
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"Incidentally, the internet access they get free for a year is through the BT educational service they offer to schools. There is also other limited access that includes Tesco's and Asda online grocery shopping and Amazon along with a small list of other sites like Wikipedia Schools. This is one instance where public money is well spent and for the right reasons. " I'll drink to that! Hic, Hic, Hooray regards A.Bastard mpmpmp | |||
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"riiiggghhhhhtt so only the lower classes have a criminal element ooookkkk.... "Yup, have you not heard of the 3 generation families who've never had a job, have zillions of kids and know every benefit scam going. They probably get email alerts about just this sort of govt giveaway and get them via their blackberries. | |||
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"A friend of mine has just got this, she gets a charreg card that she can take to a well known electrical store to purchase a 12 month internet access dongle and a laptop to the value of £520.00. The dongle is being given to her 22 year old daughter for her birthday as they already have internet access, but her daughter doesn't and the laptop being put away for the son for christmas to replace the one he already as. Not being funny but I think it stinks " See, that's what I mean. Scam, scam and more scam. If the govt want to help those really in need then make sure that those are the people they're helping. I kid you not, most of this free stuff is going to go exactly the way the poster above described. To sons and daughters who do not qualify or as Xmas presents, or simply sold off quickly with a chink, chink, thanks Dave. It's a hairbrained scheme that hasn't been thought out or implemented with any real thought or concern for those it's targetted to help. | |||
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" Totally agree with you, there was no need for any of the snide and stereotypical comments from 2 of the posters on this thread. Are we only allowed an opinion if it agrees with yours then?" Nope you can have an opinion if you want to too, it still doesn't mean that I will agree with it and to put people down that you have never met is being stereotypical, but that could just be my OWN opinion!  | |||
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" Totally agree with you, there was no need for any of the snide and stereotypical comments from 2 of the posters on this thread. Are we only allowed an opinion if it agrees with yours then? Nope you can have an opinion if you want to too, it still doesn't mean that I will agree with it and to put people down that you have never met is being stereotypical, but that could just be my OWN opinion! "But at what quantity does stereotyping become validated? | |||
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" Totally agree with you, there was no need for any of the snide and stereotypical comments from 2 of the posters on this thread. Are we only allowed an opinion if it agrees with yours then? Nope you can have an opinion if you want to too, it still doesn't mean that I will agree with it and to put people down that you have never met is being stereotypical, but that could just be my OWN opinion! "You've never met me yet you stereotyped me in your post. Isn't that a paradox? | |||
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"Many of the laptops are earmarked for children with severe disabilities and special educational needs, I doubt anyone would deny access to laptops for them?
That's simply not true. There are 10,000 laptops left over from the first 'drive' to bring the lowest in our society online, and they are being allocated on a first come first served basis so as you meet the not so stringent criteria, which is:
*at least one child between the ages of 7-14
* an income no greater than £16k per household
* that you are not online already (although checks are NOT being made to establish this)
It's not hard to see how the criminal element of the lowest class are going to spot an absolute kicker in terms of getting a laptop worth £528 for free then go knock it out down the pub for £300 or more.
I'd have thought these families on the so called breadline would have needed £500 for much more mundane things - like food & clothing, y'know, the lets keep the family ALIVE sort of mundane crap."You may or may not already know that the "free" boxes given away by Sky can easily be tracked to make sure that they are actually in the property they were supplied to. If you read the terms and conditions that came with your "free" box you will notice that one of the reasons it must be connected to the phone line for at least a year is that Sky do "call-backs" to the boxes and if this "call-back" fails then you will be billed for the full cost of the box! The same may be being applied to the "free laptops" and some of the folk that abuse the system (there will always be people that abuse any idea/promotion, even those with a bit of cash ) could be in for a bill to repay it!
Still unbelievable that some people are just ready to put down any idea to help kids with their education!
As always, just my opinion and everyone is entitled to have their own opinion too!  | |||
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" Totally agree with you, there was no need for any of the snide and stereotypical comments from 2 of the posters on this thread. Are we only allowed an opinion if it agrees with yours then? Nope you can have an opinion if you want to too, it still doesn't mean that I will agree with it and to put people down that you have never met is being stereotypical, but that could just be my OWN opinion!
You've never met me yet you stereotyped me in your post. Isn't that a paradox?"Nah, as I said above, that is my opinion of you based on your earlier posts!
Disclaimer - The above is my OWN opinion and I am sticking to it! | |||
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" Totally agree with you, there was no need for any of the snide and stereotypical comments from 2 of the posters on this thread. Are we only allowed an opinion if it agrees with yours then? Nope you can have an opinion if you want to too, it still doesn't mean that I will agree with it and to put people down that you have never met is being stereotypical, but that could just be my OWN opinion!
But at what quantity does stereotyping become validated?"Never, in my opinion anyway! Just because some folk act like they do it doesn't mean that everyone will. I believe that not all people with a bit of cash in their Bank accounts will put down the more disadvantaged in society, for example!
There are good and bad in all walks of life and if this scheme helps out even a small number of the less privileged kids in the UK then that is money well spent by whatever Government is in power at the time the scheme was thought up or implemented! | |||
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"But we can't afford it. Cutbacks y'know. Half of them will sell the fookin things to buy booze/dope anyway." How come you have time to post on a work day anyway? In between writing leaders for The Daily Mail. | |||
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"Many of the laptops are earmarked for children with severe disabilities and special educational needs, I doubt anyone would deny access to laptops for them?
That's simply not true. There are 10,000 laptops left over from the first 'drive' to bring the lowest in our society online, and they are being allocated on a first come first served basis so as you meet the not so stringent criteria, which is:
*at least one child between the ages of 7-14
* an income no greater than £16k per household
* that you are not online already (although checks are NOT being made to establish this)
It's not hard to see how the criminal element of the lowest class are going to spot an absolute kicker in terms of getting a laptop worth £528 for free then go knock it out down the pub for £300 or more.
I'd have thought these families on the so called breadline would have needed £500 for much more mundane things - like food & clothing, y'know, the lets keep the family ALIVE sort of mundane crap."The following quote was taken from the homeaccess.org.uk website this afternoon. "Due to the success of the programme we are now only inviting applications for computers for children with severe disabilities or Special Educational Needs." | |||
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"But we can't afford it. Cutbacks y'know. Half of them will sell the fookin things to buy booze/dope anyway. How come you have time to post on a work day anyway? In between writing leaders for The Daily Mail. "Because I'm at home on full pay and have been since March. My company don't want me to fuck off and get another job as they'll be left in the shit when my job restarts in January. I am the only engineer in the country who does what I do (there were 4 of us but the other three have moved on, mugs) - so thank you for your concern, I'll be online, every day from now until January apart from access weekends and we're on holiday in the caribbean. Ta. | |||
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"Hmmm.. so much for the poor getting sod all! I could do with a nice shiny new computer and all my internet access paid for (that alone costs us £200 per year) but hey, let's give it all to the fookin lazy eh?" I see the reasoning behind this, the kids can't help what their parents do and may well need that extra help to prevent them turning out the same as their parents. Trouble is, it will probably be the parents that use it more than the kids, I can see a few more profiles appearing on here soon. | |||
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"So if you are the only person in the whole country that can do your job....what happened to the man that trained you?....did he retire, or did he die? And if you were to die tommorrow, who would take over your job? And finally....are you the Prime Minister? "I work for a company who's only customer is Virgin Media. I can't name the company is it would make it too easy to trace my real identity and I'd rather that didn't happen. It's easier to say Virgin Media as it's a name you already know and that pretty much explains that I'm a telecoms engineer without going in to too much detail.. but... As for my job, it is new, cutting edge broadband/television/telephony equipment that we had to learn how to install it as we went along, so nobody trained me per se. It will enable Virgin to pump out TV on demand and will, in all expectations, herald the demise of scheduled broadcasting, you'll pay for what you watch, when you want to watch it. What makes my job unique is that Virgin have existing equipment out there by dozens of different manufacturers (Nokia, Marconi, Eltek to name a few) and each time we cut over to the new equipment it requires a different configuration that pretty much has to be done on the night. I have worked on all of them, from Wales, to London, the South Coast, the North East, North West & Scotland. My boss knows how valuable I am to the company but I'm under no illusions that it can't operate without me, it's just at the moment they are happy to pay me to sit at home and that sits well with me, you wouldn't believe how many tasks Siren has found around the house that needs doing lol. I'm positive that once it's all back up and running they'll want their pound of flesh and that's fine with me, I only work two hours per night when I am working anyway so if they up the amount of installs to cover 6 hours then no problem, I'm being paid for 12 hours regardless. We have a contract with Virgin that excludes any other company from stepping and that contract is more watertight than a duck's arse. It's a great job, for a great company and I have a great boss. I'm one of the rare few who does actually love his job, either when i'm working, or, like now, when i'm being paid to sit at home. ...But then I've spent 25 years learning my skills and that knowledge is worth a lot to me, and to the people who employ me. | |||
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"But we can't afford it. Cutbacks y'know. Half of them will sell the fookin things to buy booze/dope anyway. How come you have time to post on a work day anyway? In between writing leaders for The Daily Mail.
Because I'm at home on full pay and have been since March. My company don't want me to fuck off and get another job as they'll be left in the shit when my job restarts in January. I am the only engineer in the country who does what I do (there were 4 of us but the other three have moved on, mugs) - so thank you for your concern, I'll be online, every day from now until January apart from access weekends and we're on holiday in the caribbean. Ta. "thought it was july you were startin back?? there mps with less holiday entitelment than you!! last person i knew who was off that long with full pay was a policeman who had been very very dodgy!! x | |||
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"But we can't afford it. Cutbacks y'know. Half of them will sell the fookin things to buy booze/dope anyway. How come you have time to post on a work day anyway? In between writing leaders for The Daily Mail.
Because I'm at home on full pay and have been since March. My company don't want me to fuck off and get another job as they'll be left in the shit when my job restarts in January. I am the only engineer in the country who does what I do (there were 4 of us but the other three have moved on, mugs) - so thank you for your concern, I'll be online, every day from now until January apart from access weekends and we're on holiday in the caribbean. Ta.
thought it was july you were startin back?? there mps with less holiday entitelment than you!! last person i knew who was off that long with full pay was a policeman who had been very very dodgy!! x"I've said before, I think he is a politician. | |||
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"But we can't afford it. Cutbacks y'know. Half of them will sell the fookin things to buy booze/dope anyway. How come you have time to post on a work day anyway? In between writing leaders for The Daily Mail.
Because I'm at home on full pay and have been since March. My company don't want me to fuck off and get another job as they'll be left in the shit when my job restarts in January. I am the only engineer in the country who does what I do (there were 4 of us but the other three have moved on, mugs) - so thank you for your concern, I'll be online, every day from now until January apart from access weekends and we're on holiday in the caribbean. Ta.
thought it was july you were startin back?? there mps with less holiday entitelment than you!! last person i knew who was off that long with full pay was a policeman who had been very very dodgy!! x"It was supposed to be July but Virgin have opted for a new roll out in January. Virgin shut down for Xmas in early December and it takes 8 weeks to order the equipment. That puts us in end-October by the time the order goes in and it wasn't worth planning cutovers for just a few weeks. It does make planning holidays tricky when I am working but would you believe that I've been told I must take official holiday when I want to go abroad as technically I'm on call lol | |||
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"ahem...wishy...lend us a tenner? "Ask for £20 and i'll go Dutch with you | |||
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"But we can't afford it. Cutbacks y'know. Half of them will sell the fookin things to buy booze/dope anyway. How come you have time to post on a work day anyway? In between writing leaders for The Daily Mail.
Because I'm at home on full pay and have been since March. My company don't want me to fuck off and get another job as they'll be left in the shit when my job restarts in January. I am the only engineer in the country who does what I do (there were 4 of us but the other three have moved on, mugs) - so thank you for your concern, I'll be online, every day from now until January apart from access weekends and we're on holiday in the caribbean. Ta.
thought it was july you were startin back?? there mps with less holiday entitelment than you!! last person i knew who was off that long with full pay was a policeman who had been very very dodgy!! x
It was supposed to be July but Virgin have opted for a new roll out in January. Virgin shut down for Xmas in early December and it takes 8 weeks to order the equipment. That puts us in end-October by the time the order goes in and it wasn't worth planning cutovers for just a few weeks. It does make planning holidays tricky when I am working but would you believe that I've been told I must take official holiday when I want to go abroad as technically I'm on call lol"really for a job u been in 25 years u must have started trainin early and be psychic to know that digital tv was goin to be the future at a time when we only had 3 channels if that! what happens if u sick do u still need to call in?? | |||
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"But we can't afford it. Cutbacks y'know. Half of them will sell the fookin things to buy booze/dope anyway." unlike the government who spend £18k on booze for doing fuck all too eh?! i for one am not going to blame the kids for what the parents do and hope that they do better. my sister is a lone parent on minimum wage so eligible...i hope she does get assistance as her son is at a school where most of the homework they receive requires internet access....again, i wont blame the kids for that | |||
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" really for a job u been in 25 years u must have started trainin early and be psychic to know that digital tv was goin to be the future at a time when we only had 3 channels if that! what happens if u sick do u still need to call in?? " I've been in the telecoms industry for 25 years hon, not for the same company. The old days were a nightmare tbh with single twatsed pair for each house that had to be soldered onto the frame.. yuk.. just the thought of it makes me shudder lol .. and telecoms companies ie BT as they were the only one, only provided telephones. Cable TV didn't enter the market until the late 80s although Sky pretty much cornered that market well before then. It took govt deregulation to allow the hundreds of little TV providers to get established as digging up the road to lay cables was an exclusive BT contract and we had real problems getting them to assist with accurate plans of what was already in the ground etc. NTL began buying up a lot of the smaller players until it left just them and Telewest up until last year when NTL bought Telewest and now they have almost a monopoly on Cable TV in the UK (Kingston Communications in Hull is one independant I can think of off the top of my head but I'm sure there are others scattered around). Virgin competes in three markets: Telephony, Television and Internet. They compete with BT for telephony and broadband and they compete with Sky for television. Virgin are the only company to offer all three services in one package. I'm sure someone will dispute that and all I'll say to that is that anyone providing broadband or telephone services other than Virgin will be selling BT services bundled under their own name. Even Sky offer broadband but you need a BT line to use it. Virgin are leaps ahead of BT AND Sky technologically and they've almost shaken off the old image NTL had of poor customer relations. They were appalling in that respect, I'll admit lol. The Digital Revolution is only just starting in earnest. The future holds so many possiblities with computers that run your household (barcode readers in your kitchen that you'll swipe to re-order any item you need that will then be delivered to your door, or call-in services where you'll telephone your own house, enter a code and your heating will come on/turn off - or you'll set the TV to record something you've only just heard about but you're not at home to activate or watch)... the possibilities are endless and it all begins with the equipment I'm installing now. When it's been fully tested in a live environment, ie a whole town using it, Swansea will be the first, then we're expecting a full roll-out across the UK in multiple towns/cities simultaneously, and that's when I'll be training people to do what I do and working bloody hard 6 days a week. I think I'll enjoy my free time that little bit more now I've put all this into words for once lol ...and to answer your last question: I need to give them three weeks notice if I'm going to be sick. If I don't show up one evening then there's a Virgin Support Tech there and a cable guy we must have also on the night who can't do sod all, the install doesn't go ahead and shit hits the fan. Luckily, it's never happened yet but if my little boy is ill or my daughter has hurt herself of Siren falls down the stairs etc etc etc... I guess the install won't be going ahead that night eh? | |||
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"That's simply not true. There are 10,000 laptops left over from the first 'drive' to bring the lowest in our society online, and they are being allocated on a first come first served basis so as you meet the not so stringent criteria, which is: *at least one child between the ages of 7-14 * an income no greater than £16k per household * that you are not online already (although checks are NOT being made to establish this) It's not hard to see how the criminal element of the lowest class are going to spot an absolute kicker in terms of getting a laptop worth £528 for free then go knock it out down the pub for £300 or more. I'd have thought these families on the so called breadline would have needed £500 for much more mundane things - like food & clothing, y'know, the lets keep the family ALIVE sort of mundane crap. Well as your so on your high horse about this thought i'd have my bit of input. Until last year i was the manager of a childrens nursery due to the ressecion and the fact that people can no longer afford the childcare the nursery was forced to close therefore i lost my job. I do still work and took a job paying far less than my previous one not something i'm happy about but when needs must. I have a son with extra needs and so qualified for this giveaway as you put it and it has helped him no end. My older son also uses it to help with his gcse coursework and hopefully will help him get the grades he wants for uni to become a maths teacher. We didn't qualify for the internet access as we already have it but our computer had broken and due to the cut in my income could not afford to replace it. Does this mean i shouldn't have got the laptop and they should have taken the scheme away from children like mine who really have benefitted from it??????? Oh and by the way no i have never taken drugs. Yes i have the occasional drink but don't we all??????" | |||
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"The Digital Revolution is only just starting in earnest. The future holds so many possiblities with computers that run your household (barcode readers in your kitchen that you'll swipe to re-order any item you need that will then be delivered to your door, or call-in services where you'll telephone your own house, enter a code and your heating will come on/turn off - or you'll set the TV to record something you've only just heard about but you're not at home to activate or watch)... the possibilities are endless" Seeing as it will be the kids of today that will be using all this "computer technology" I do believe it would be a good idea if they got used to using computers now! And Hey-Presto - We are back to the OP and it being a good idea if as many kids as possible can have access to a "free laptop" so they are not left behind in "The Digital Revolution"
If only all the threads on here were as easy as this one to solve! | |||
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" really for a job u been in 25 years u must have started trainin early and be psychic to know that digital tv was goin to be the future at a time when we only had 3 channels if that! what happens if u sick do u still need to call in?? I've been in the telecoms industry for 25 years hon, not for the same company. The old days were a nightmare tbh with single twatsed pair for each house that had to be soldered onto the frame.. yuk.. just the thought of it makes me shudder lol .. and telecoms companies ie BT as they were the only one, only provided telephones. Cable TV didn't enter the market until the late 80s although Sky pretty much cornered that market well before then. It took govt deregulation to allow the hundreds of little TV providers to get established as digging up the road to lay cables was an exclusive BT contract and we had real problems getting them to assist with accurate plans of what was already in the ground etc. NTL began buying up a lot of the smaller players until it left just them and Telewest up until last year when NTL bought Telewest and now they have almost a monopoly on Cable TV in the UK (Kingston Communications in Hull is one independant I can think of off the top of my head but I'm sure there are others scattered around). Virgin competes in three markets: Telephony, Television and Internet. They compete with BT for telephony and broadband and they compete with Sky for television. Virgin are the only company to offer all three services in one package. I'm sure someone will dispute that and all I'll say to that is that anyone providing broadband or telephone services other than Virgin will be selling BT services bundled under their own name. Even Sky offer broadband but you need a BT line to use it. Virgin are leaps ahead of BT AND Sky technologically and they've almost shaken off the old image NTL had of poor customer relations. They were appalling in that respect, I'll admit lol. The Digital Revolution is only just starting in earnest. The future holds so many possiblities with computers that run your household (barcode readers in your kitchen that you'll swipe to re-order any item you need that will then be delivered to your door, or call-in services where you'll telephone your own house, enter a code and your heating will come on/turn off - or you'll set the TV to record something you've only just heard about but you're not at home to activate or watch)... the possibilities are endless and it all begins with the equipment I'm installing now. When it's been fully tested in a live environment, ie a whole town using it, Swansea will be the first, then we're expecting a full roll-out across the UK in multiple towns/cities simultaneously, and that's when I'll be training people to do what I do and working bloody hard 6 days a week. I think I'll enjoy my free time that little bit more now I've put all this into words for once lol ...and to answer your last question: I need to give them three weeks notice if I'm going to be sick. If I don't show up one evening then there's a Virgin Support Tech there and a cable guy we must have also on the night who can't do sod all, the install doesn't go ahead and shit hits the fan. Luckily, it's never happened yet but if my little boy is ill or my daughter has hurt herself of Siren falls down the stairs etc etc etc... I guess the install won't be going ahead that night eh? "well, with any luck we can get our kids on line, get them the education they need and you wont be in a minority in your job any more eh?! | |||
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"sorry for not reading back through the whole thread again ,...but someone mentioned if the £500 could be better spent on feeding families etc i think this could be seen more as an investment in the child's learning , rather than a one off. Of course there will be people who abuse any system, but my bet is that this will be in the vast minority and an awful lot of people will use this in the spirit in which it is intended. " My brother works in the construction industry and computers and a total enigma to him. So he's never bought one. Consequently, his children had never had access to one at home yet because he earns more than £16k they can't have one at home under this scheme. My question is this: How are children in homes where the parent has no interest in computers going to benefit under this scheme? Bear in mind that the adult will have to set up the machine and ensure the child is supervised whilst online, and my brother wouldn't know a net nanny from a real one tbh. | |||
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" well, with any luck we can get our kids on line, get them the education they need and you wont be in a minority in your job any more eh?! " Ah, sarcasm, you're on the wrong thread. Hon.  | |||
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"sorry for not reading back through the whole thread again ,...but someone mentioned if the £500 could be better spent on feeding families etc i think this could be seen more as an investment in the child's learning , rather than a one off. Of course there will be people who abuse any system, but my bet is that this will be in the vast minority and an awful lot of people will use this in the spirit in which it is intended. My brother works in the construction industry and computers and a total enigma to him. So he's never bought one. Consequently, his children had never had access to one at home yet because he earns more than £16k they can't have one at home under this scheme. My question is this: How are children in homes where the parent has no interest in computers going to benefit under this scheme? Bear in mind that the adult will have to set up the machine and ensure the child is supervised whilst online, and my brother wouldn't know a net nanny from a real one tbh." as I said " an awful lot of people " ... I didnt say everyone as of course there will be people who are unable or unwilling to participate for all sorts of reasons . | |||
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" well, with any luck we can get our kids on line, get them the education they need and you wont be in a minority in your job any more eh?! Ah, sarcasm, you're on the wrong thread. Hon. "ring ring ring ring..."hello?" "hello, is that kettle?"...... "sure is pal, who's this?"...."ah, hello kettle, this is pot, just wanted to call and let you know you're black" | |||
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"And apple need yo seriously sort out the ipad keyboard, apologies for the muiltiude of grammatical and spelling mistakes" iv got kiddo an ipad for christmas are they any good?? | |||
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"I remember when i was a wean i used a pencil and a jotter for my homework. Oh i used my fingers and my head for my maths. Free laptop.......the money can be better spent elsewhere. " yeah and look where it got you..... | |||
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"sorry for not reading back through the whole thread again ,...but someone mentioned if the £500 could be better spent on feeding families etc i think this could be seen more as an investment in the child's learning , rather than a one off. Of course there will be people who abuse any system, but my bet is that this will be in the vast minority and an awful lot of people will use this in the spirit in which it is intended. My brother works in the construction industry and computers and a total enigma to him. So he's never bought one. Consequently, his children had never had access to one at home yet because he earns more than £16k they can't have one at home under this scheme. My question is this: How are children in homes where the parent has no interest in computers going to benefit under this scheme? Bear in mind that the adult will have to set up the machine and ensure the child is supervised whilst online, and my brother wouldn't know a net nanny from a real one tbh." My brother was exactly the same i.e. he had no computer or computer experience and had no interest in learning it either. That is until I gave him one of my old laptops and showed him the basics - can't you do the same and show your brother? My brother now spends hours online and my 2 nephews (6 & 8) get to go online too and do what kids do online; safely too!
As for other parents doing this for their own kids, it might surprise you that to "set-up" a new laptop is surprisingly easy seeing as the makers make it that way to get as many people as they can to buy one and most are set up with easy to use parental settings! | |||
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"I remember when i was a wean i used a pencil and a jotter for my homework. Oh i used my fingers and my head for my maths. Free laptop.......the money can be better spent elsewhere. " I agree. I take it you can count to 11 then? | |||
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"And apple need yo seriously sort out the ipad keyboard, apologies for the muiltiude of grammatical and spelling mistakes iv got kiddo an ipad for christmas are they any good?? " Canna access the chatroom with them as apple won't let you near adobe flash, but! I've jailbroken it so may be able to download a form of flash which will allow me to access chat
Only thing is my kid won't let me near it just now. xxx  | |||
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"the majority of children have IT teaching at nursery school i know mine did! and its not the hardest of things to set up really! remember tv plus on video recorders how many people had to get children to set that up! from what i read the internet access will be restricted anyway and i think there may be some software included in the package which will stop access to naughty stuff! as for monitorin msn or that im not sure i know i monitor mines access on it and bebo etc and our laptops were bought x" i have one in nursery...knows how to use a mouse, knows about downloading...can use th keyboard. i'm suprised at some of the negative comments on here tbh, perhaps it's just a mis-education as to what the government is trying to achieve. africa had the "laptop for $1 thing going on and I'm sure other countries are following with other similar schemes. the future is technology and whilst books are worthy (I have a nursery case full of them), we cant ignore that kids DO need them for their education and if we are trying to educate kids this way, we need to be responsible for providing them. My nephews homework was to name all of shakespeares comedies and tragedies. he had to do that for the next day. after his extra curric the libraries would have been closed and i'm not sure, without the internet, where he would have got it. when i was at achool we woulda have had a week to do that. thanks mznwty for bringing this to folks attention...i'm sure it was meant as a gesture of goodwill | |||
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"And apple need yo seriously sort out the ipad keyboard, apologies for the muiltiude of grammatical and spelling mistakes iv got kiddo an ipad for christmas are they any good?? Canna access the chatroom with them as apple won't let you near adobe flash, but! I've jailbroken it so may be able to download a form of flash which will allow me to access chat
Only thing is my kid won't let me near it just now. xxx "its ok im stickin with my old laptop , the ipad hers!! iv no even looked at it it took me long enough to learn how to use iphone!! x | |||
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"I agree. I take it you can count to 11 then?" I can count to potato. | |||
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"Hmmm.. so much for the poor getting sod all! I could do with a nice shiny new computer and all my internet access paid for (that alone costs us £200 per year) but hey, let's give it all to the fookin lazy eh? Not all of us with very little are lazy. I work a 50 hour week for less than minimum wage looking after other peoples kids so that i can be home for my own am studying at college and a single mum. I'd love a new laptop as the one I have is about 6 years old and I struggle to get it working alot of the time. I need one for my work and for college. Take your generalisations and well i am too polite to tell you where to put them" *round of applause* | |||
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"Unfortunately in the long term this will be end of cable tv, etc.. The money was never in the technology the money is in the content and intellectual property.." Which kind of backs up what I'm saying about Virgin and what they're doing with multi-service access nodes (MSAN). They know scheduled broadcasting is going to cease at some point in the not too distant future but people will still want to watch a box in the corner of the living room that they can share with the family. A personal computer by it's definition is a solitary device for use by one person at a time. How entertainment and/or content is delivered is the key, where it is delivered to is second to that. Cable TV companies will continue to exist but as in all things, they will adapt, as Virgin are doing now. BT will adapt also, but I can't see how Sky can survive against a TV company (Virgin) delivering quality programming when it is wanted and a telephone company (Virgin & BT) providing hard wired very high speed internet access. Sky's days as a broadcaster are numbered - their future lies in providing content (news, edu docs etc etc) | |||
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" well, with any luck we can get our kids on line, get them the education they need and you wont be in a minority in your job any more eh?! Ah, sarcasm, you're on the wrong thread. Hon.
ring ring ring ring..."hello?" "hello, is that kettle?"...... "sure is pal, who's this?"...."ah, hello kettle, this is pot, just wanted to call and let you know you're black""Yup, ya def on the wrong thread. | |||
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"Unfortunately in the long term this will be end of cable tv, etc.. The money was never in the technology the money is in the content and intellectual property.. Which kind of backs up what I'm saying about Virgin and what they're doing with multi-service access nodes (MSAN). They know scheduled broadcasting is going to cease at some point in the not too distant future but people will still want to watch a box in the corner of the living room that they can share with the family. A personal computer by it's definition is a solitary device for use by one person at a time. How entertainment and/or content is delivered is the key, where it is delivered to is second to that. Cable TV companies will continue to exist but as in all things, they will adapt, as Virgin are doing now. BT will adapt also, but I can't see how Sky can survive against a TV company (Virgin) delivering quality programming when it is wanted and a telephone company (Virgin & BT) providing hard wired very high speed internet access. Sky's days as a broadcaster are numbered - their future lies in providing content (news, edu docs etc etc)" You keep bigging up Virgin Media and yourself for that matter (but you are entitled to think you are "The One & Only" not putting you down for that) but the Town I live in has no Cable TV whatsoever and Virgin have no intention of ever installing it! So my question is what makes you so sure that the likes of Sky wont survive?? Oh and another wee question - have you never heard of TVs that have a PC input? I can connect both my laptop and tower PC to my 42inch LCD TV and they are then no longer "solitary devices". | |||
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"Hmmm.. so much for the poor getting sod all! I could do with a nice shiny new computer and all my internet access paid for (that alone costs us £200 per year) but hey, let's give it all to the fookin lazy eh?" *WARNING WARNING THE SARCASM ALERT HAS BEEN TRIGGERED* ...and fuck me, if it wasnt the very first post on the thread...not even a warm up to it either.... | |||
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"Bb not leaping to wishes defence here.. But to be quite honest the intelligent pc maybe has a limited life span The tv itself connected to the internet with a wireless keyboard and mouse is probably the direction technology is going The cloud server offerings will not only host your files eg bt vault or emcs backup service, therefore no need for a hard drive, and also the iTunes cloud offering which is being worked on (ie apple like google offer s cloud based offering rather than store locally) Then all we are left with is applications, these can easily be rented from cloud service offering, eg google apps or ms exchange on the cloud for emails, So what does this mean for me.. Well you may have a laptop but it purely bye a presentation device to your local hub.. That hub will provide storage and applications via a rental basis.. Ie why pay hundreds of pounds for excel and you only use it once in a blue moon, why not pay on a a on demand basis As i mentioned before the world is changing, it can go one of many differing ways,,, it is interesting times for some of us,," Agreed, technology changes all the time but I still won't be able to get this wonderfull Virgin Media where I stay as they have no intention of ever installing it here (and where I work I know this for a fact!)
Anyway, it makes an even bigger case for getting the kids of today into technology at the earliest stage possible and if giving them a "free laptop" helps those that can't afford one then this scheme is a great idea!
Once again, this takes us back to the OP! | |||
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"You keep bigging up Virgin Media and yourself for that matter (but you are entitled to think you are "The One & Only" not putting you down for that) but the Town I live in has no Cable TV whatsoever and Virgin have no intention of ever installing it! " Virgin work on the following guide: potential take up (a) -v- cost of laying the cabling (b). If (a) doesn't equal or beat the cost of (b), then it doesn't get cabled. ~ and I'm not 'bigging them up' as you say, nor myself either, I've simply answered questions that have been posed and offered my opinion of what's happening in the industry from an insiders point of view. " So my question is what makes you so sure that the likes of Sky wont survive?? " Sky will survive as content providers, which is what they always were. Murdoch needed a method of delivery for his content and created BSkyB to be that vehicle. Once he knows that he cannot compete with Virgin for TV and broadband or BT for telephony he'll switch to delivery content via the internet, to people like yourself, without cable TV and/or reluctant to use BT, and pump it straight to your PC, which changes your box from a PC to a TV and thus requires a licence. " Oh and another wee question - have you never heard of TVs that have a PC input? I can connect both my laptop and tower PC to my 42inch LCD TV and they are then no longer "solitary devices". "Discussions are already underway to put a licence on computers for this very reason. The BBC are keen to see it implemented as people are watching BBC content on iPlayer etc and they want their cut. At the moment the proposals have been rejected but rest assured, either the licence fee will be scrapped altogether or a new one for computers will come into effect. No prizes for guessing which scenario comes to pass. | |||
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"You keep bigging up Virgin Media and yourself for that matter (but you are entitled to think you are "The One & Only" not putting you down for that) but the Town I live in has no Cable TV whatsoever and Virgin have no intention of ever installing it! Virgin work on the following guide: potential take up (a) -v- cost of laying the cabling (b). If (a) doesn't equal or beat the cost of (b), then it doesn't get cabled. ~ and I'm not 'bigging them up' as you say, nor myself either, I've simply answered questions that have been posed and offered my opinion of what's happening in the industry from an insiders point of view." You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
"So my question is what makes you so sure that the likes of Sky wont survive?? Sky will survive as content providers, which is what they always were. Murdoch needed a method of delivery for his content and created BSkyB to be that vehicle. Once he knows that he cannot compete with Virgin for TV and broadband or BT for telephony he'll switch to delivery content via the internet, to people like yourself, without cable TV and/or reluctant to use BT, and pump it straight to your PC, which changes your box from a PC to a TV and thus requires a licence." I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
"Oh and another wee question - have you never heard of TVs that have a PC input? I can connect both my laptop and tower PC to my 42inch LCD TV and they are then no longer "solitary devices".
Discussions are already underway to put a licence on computers for this very reason. The BBC are keen to see it implemented as people are watching BBC content on iPlayer etc and they want their cut. At the moment the proposals have been rejected but rest assured, either the licence fee will be scrapped altogether or a new one for computers will come into effect. No prizes for guessing which scenario comes to pass."See middle answer above! But Thanks again! | |||
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"Bb not leaping to wishes defence here.. But to be quite honest the intelligent pc maybe has a limited life span The tv itself connected to the internet with a wireless keyboard and mouse is probably the direction technology is going The cloud server offerings will not only host your files eg bt vault or emcs backup service, therefore no need for a hard drive, and also the iTunes cloud offering which is being worked on (ie apple like google offer s cloud based offering rather than store locally) Then all we are left with is applications, these can easily be rented from cloud service offering, eg google apps or ms exchange on the cloud for emails, So what does this mean for me.. Well you may have a laptop but it purely bye a presentation device to your local hub.. That hub will provide storage and applications via a rental basis.. Ie why pay hundreds of pounds for excel and you only use it once in a blue moon, why not pay on a a on demand basis As i mentioned before the world is changing, it can go one of many differing ways,,, it is interesting times for some of us,," whats the cloud?? i was in maccie d's the other day and when i put my net on iphone it came up that? im a total technophobe btw, so explain slowly!! x | |||
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"You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
See middle answer above! But Thanks again! "Yawn.
As the saying goes, ya can't educate pork. | |||
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"You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
See middle answer above! But Thanks again!
Yawn.
As the saying goes, ya can't educate pork. "Hey no need to start to get abusive now is there?
Just because I don't agree that what you are saying are the only answers, you resort to name calling!
Oh and by the way I am highly educated or wouldn't be able to do the Job that I do! But thanks again! | |||
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hurry, might be eligible for a notebook with free internet access for a year before the redundancy run out  | |||
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"You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
See middle answer above! But Thanks again!
Yawn.
As the saying goes, ya can't educate pork.
Hey no need to start to get abusive now is there?
Just because I don't agree that what you are saying are the only answers, you resort to name calling!
Oh and by the way I am highly educated or wouldn't be able to do the Job that I do! But thanks again! "Look up the meaning. | |||
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"You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
See middle answer above! But Thanks again!
Yawn.
As the saying goes, ya can't educate pork.
Hey no need to start to get abusive now is there?
Just because I don't agree that what you are saying are the only answers, you resort to name calling!
Oh and by the way I am highly educated or wouldn't be able to do the Job that I do! But thanks again!
Look up the meaning. "No need to I got what you meant by it! Thanks again though for your concern! | |||
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" whats the cloud?? i was in maccie d's the other day and when i put my net on iphone it came up that? im a total technophobe btw, so explain slowly!! x" Cloud computing is Internet-based computing, whereby shared resources, software, and information are provided to computers and other devices on demand, a bit like the electricity grid that provides the electricity to whatever device you need it for. In a nutshell, it's like having software you need but not having to actually buy it outright for 00's of pounds as it's stored centrally for you to retrieve when you need to use it. | |||
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"You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
See middle answer above! But Thanks again!
Yawn.
As the saying goes, ya can't educate pork.
Hey no need to start to get abusive now is there?
Just because I don't agree that what you are saying are the only answers, you resort to name calling!
Oh and by the way I am highly educated or wouldn't be able to do the Job that I do! But thanks again!
Look up the meaning. "That is genuinely quite insulting and really not called for. Just because someone expresses and opinion that is different to yours doesn't make them wrong. No matter how much you quote and moan about it | |||
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"You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
See middle answer above! But Thanks again!
Yawn.
As the saying goes, ya can't educate pork.
Hey no need to start to get abusive now is there?
Just because I don't agree that what you are saying are the only answers, you resort to name calling!
Oh and by the way I am highly educated or wouldn't be able to do the Job that I do! But thanks again!
Look up the meaning.
That is genuinely quite insulting and really not called for. Just because someone expresses and opinion that is different to yours doesn't make them wrong. No matter how much you quote and moan about it"Sheesh.... ok, just for those who THINK they know what the saying means, here is it's actual interpetation: "You can't educate pork" means "you can't educate something with an inability to comprehend." Now what's so offensive about that? | |||
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" Sheesh.... ok, just for those who THINK they know what the saying means, here is it's actual interpetation: "You can't educate pork" means "you can't educate something with an inability to comprehend." Now what's so offensive about that?" I didn't THINK I knew what it meant as I knew this already. You're saying people can't comprehend simple things. It's simply insulting | |||
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"but why did maccie d's have it? does it mean i could use the net on my phone in there without havin to connect to the net on my phone? i know when i go to connect to it at home it gives me the option of connecting to next doors network? x" It's free WiFi that McD's are pumping out now across all of their 1200 outlets. It's provided by The Cloud, a company specialising in high speed WiFi networks. It's often confused with the technological term of 'cloud computing'. | |||
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"but why did maccie d's have it? does it mean i could use the net on my phone in there without havin to connect to the net on my phone? i know when i go to connect to it at home it gives me the option of connecting to next doors network? x It's free WiFi that McD's are pumping out now across all of their 1200 outlets. It's provided by The Cloud, a company specialising in high speed WiFi networks. It's often confused with the technological term of 'cloud computing'." ah right gotcha! i never used it as kiddo took phone of me to do some important thing! | |||
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""You can't educate pork" means "you can't educate something with an inability to comprehend." Now what's so offensive about that?"
everything
i think the meaning is that the person you are addressing is as incapable of understanding your point as is a piece of pork
meaning, you cant get your point across | |||
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"You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
See middle answer above! But Thanks again!
Yawn.
As the saying goes, ya can't educate pork.
Hey no need to start to get abusive now is there?
Just because I don't agree that what you are saying are the only answers, you resort to name calling!
Oh and by the way I am highly educated or wouldn't be able to do the Job that I do! But thanks again!
Look up the meaning.
That is genuinely quite insulting and really not called for. Just because someone expresses and opinion that is different to yours doesn't make them wrong. No matter how much you quote and moan about it
Sheesh.... ok, just for those who THINK they know what the saying means, here is it's actual interpetation:
"You can't educate pork" means "you can't educate something with an inability to comprehend."
Now what's so offensive about that?"The thing is I do and did comprehend all the way throughout this thread because you never know what folk do as part of their work now do you?!
For you to say that I am "something with an inability to comprehend" i.e. "pork" is actually quite offensive to me, but hey-ho I won't be losing any sleep over it seeing as I will be able to sleep easy knowing I didn't resort to name calling!
Now lets get back to the OP - Did you know that there is a scheme for underprivileged families to get a "free laptop" to help their kids with their education? | |||
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"You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
See middle answer above! But Thanks again!
Yawn.
As the saying goes, ya can't educate pork.
Hey no need to start to get abusive now is there?
Just because I don't agree that what you are saying are the only answers, you resort to name calling!
Oh and by the way I am highly educated or wouldn't be able to do the Job that I do! But thanks again!
Look up the meaning.
That is genuinely quite insulting and really not called for. Just because someone expresses and opinion that is different to yours doesn't make them wrong. No matter how much you quote and moan about it
Sheesh.... ok, just for those who THINK they know what the saying means, here is it's actual interpetation:
"You can't educate pork" means "you can't educate something with an inability to comprehend."
Now what's so offensive about that?
The thing is I do and did comprehend all the way throughout this thread because you never know what folk do as part of their work now do you?!
For you to say that I am "something with an inability to comprehend" i.e. "pork" is actually quite offensive to me, but hey-ho I won't be losing any sleep over it seeing as I will be able to sleep easy knowing I didn't resort to name calling!
Now lets get back to the OP - Did you know that there is a scheme for underprivileged families to get a "free laptop" to help their kids with their education? "yeah but it only applies in england and i think its a great idea as due to cuts we soon have no libraries or that where kids can get the information they need for homework x | |||
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"You shot your own arguments in this thread in the foot there and showed that mine was the accurate one! Thanks
I already have a TV licence that allows me to do this so once again my post is the correct one. Thanks!
See middle answer above! But Thanks again!
Yawn.
As the saying goes, ya can't educate pork.
Hey no need to start to get abusive now is there?
Just because I don't agree that what you are saying are the only answers, you resort to name calling!
Oh and by the way I am highly educated or wouldn't be able to do the Job that I do! But thanks again!
Look up the meaning.
That is genuinely quite insulting and really not called for. Just because someone expresses and opinion that is different to yours doesn't make them wrong. No matter how much you quote and moan about it
Sheesh.... ok, just for those who THINK they know what the saying means, here is it's actual interpetation:
"You can't educate pork" means "you can't educate something with an inability to comprehend."
Now what's so offensive about that?
The thing is I do and did comprehend all the way throughout this thread because you never know what folk do as part of their work now do you?!
For you to say that I am "something with an inability to comprehend" i.e. "pork" is actually quite offensive to me, but hey-ho I won't be losing any sleep over it seeing as I will be able to sleep easy knowing I didn't resort to name calling!
Now lets get back to the OP - Did you know that there is a scheme for underprivileged families to get a "free laptop" to help their kids with their education?
yeah but it only applies in england and i think its a great idea as due to cuts we soon have no libraries or that where kids can get the information they need for homework x"Blooming nora if that is the case then I think the sooner these "free laptops" are given out the better! I wouldn't want any kid whose family can't afford one themselves to miss out on a better education, especially when technology is changing all the time too. You never know one day they might get a job that involves supplying all the new digital media to us all when we are sitting at home retired! | |||
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Dont know anything about Pork except it used to be a Pig lol x | |||
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"its looking bad in here have I really got to read all the way through "I did, so just start from here | |||
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"its looking bad in here have I really got to read all the way through "Nah just the last few posts that got it back to the OP
A lot of the rest of it isn't worth losing any sleep over! | |||
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"its looking bad in here have I really got to read all the way through
I did, so just start from here"Ah thanks | |||
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"its looking bad in here have I really got to read all the way through
I did, so just start from here
Ah thanks "Saves ya eyes | |||
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" I've just put my head through my laptop. Do i qualify for a new one under ( induced ) mental stress?" Not unless you're in years 3-9 inclusive, in which case, you're far too young to be on here. | |||
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"The qualifying criteria as stated on homeaccess.org.uk/Are-you-eligible/ states the following: Quick eligibility check Take the quick eligibilty check below. You may be able to qualify for a Home Access package if you answer YES to: • four questions in Section one, and • at least one question in Section two. Section One: Are you a parent or guardian responsible for and living with a child... …who is in school years 3 to 9 inclusive? …who attends a state-maintained school in England full time**? …who has not already had a computer from a Home Access Grant or similar programme, such as Computers for Pupils? ... who has a Statement of Special Educational Needs, or receives a Disability Living Allowance, or whose school/local authority representative can certify they have Assistive Technology needs? Section Two: Do you receive at least one of the following? • Free School Meals for your child*** • Income-based Jobseeker’s Allowance • Income support • Child Tax Credit but not Working Tax Credit and an income of less than £16,190 • Guaranteed Pension Credit (not Savings Credit) • Income-based Employment Support Allowance • Support under Part VI of the Immigration and Asylum Act 199 ~ So, with all this hullabaloo, it turns out it isn't available to anyone under £16k income and with a child between the ages of 7-14. "well as it wasnt relevant to me i was just stating that people could qualify for them and to go and look at the webpage! didnt realise i had to give out all the facts and take them by the hand to it and fill the form out for them too!!
times you think you doin people a good turn and what do you get???
but il say this much, the first few posts that were removed showed the true colours of some people at least i try to help people and not take the mickey out of them unlike some!
sorry folks if i wasnt 100% accurate with the criteria for this x | |||
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" I've just put my head through my laptop. Do i qualify for a new one under ( induced ) mental stress? Not unless you're in years 3-9 inclusive, in which case, you're far too young to be on here. "Could be, i never got further than Upper Sixth. And that was with pen and paper. | |||
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"The qualifying criteria as stated on homeaccess.org.uk/Are-you-eligible/ states the following: Quick eligibility check Take the quick eligibilty check below. You may be able to qualify for a Home Access package if you answer YES to: • four questions in Section one, and • at least one question in Section two. Section One: Are you a parent or guardian responsible for and living with a child... …who is in school years 3 to 9 inclusive? …who attends a state-maintained school in England full time**? …who has not already had a computer from a Home Access Grant or similar programme, such as Computers for Pupils? ... who has a Statement of Special Educational Needs, or receives a Disability Living Allowance, or whose school/local authority representative can certify they have Assistive Technology needs? Section Two: Do you receive at least one of the following? • Free School Meals for your child*** • Income-based Jobseeker’s Allowance • Income support • Child Tax Credit but not Working Tax Credit and an income of less than £16,190 • Guaranteed Pension Credit (not Savings Credit) • Income-based Employment Support Allowance • Support under Part VI of the Immigration and Asylum Act 199 ~ So, with all this hullabaloo, it turns out it isn't available to anyone under £16k income and with a child between the ages of 7-14. "...and as I said previously. "Due to the success of the programme we are now only inviting applications for computers for children with severe disabilities or Special Educational Needs."
same website. | |||
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" but il say this much, the first few posts that were removed showed the true colours of some people at least i try to help people and not take the mickey out of them unlike some! sorry folks if i wasnt 100% accurate with the criteria for this x" Huh? removed posts? when did that happen? it all seems as it was to me, someone musta been on the boil lol. ** I'm not taking the piss, I didn't know there were posts removed, but this thread has moved very fast today. | |||
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" but il say this much, the first few posts that were removed showed the true colours of some people at least i try to help people and not take the mickey out of them unlike some! sorry folks if i wasnt 100% accurate with the criteria for this x Huh? removed posts? when did that happen? it all seems as it was to me, someone musta been on the boil lol. ** I'm not taking the piss, I didn't know there were posts removed, but this thread has moved very fast today." away n dont talk pish it was you and lutons post plus my remarks back to them that were removed! | |||
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" ...and as I said previously. "Due to the success of the programme we are now only inviting applications for computers for children with severe disabilities or Special Educational Needs."
same website."So it was a really popular scheme then? I thought it might be seeing as the majority of jobs these days needs at least a basic knowledge of computers! Hopefully the kids whose family did qualify for one make something out of their lives and get better jobs than they might have otherwise! | |||
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