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English Votes ?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Should issues that are devolved in Scotland or Wales or Northern Ireland only be voted on in Parliment by the MPs from the Country it affects ?

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By *eMontresMan
over a year ago

Halesowen

erm - yes, by definition. If those powers are devolved to the respective countries, they are only debated in the respective national assemblies for those countries, which English MPs cannot attend.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Labour won't like it

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By *anchestercubMan
over a year ago

manchester & NI

[Removed by poster at 27/11/14 19:12:48]

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By *anchestercubMan
over a year ago

manchester & NI

In principle yes.

But I can't think of an example where legislation that harms England has passed because of non-England MPs. So I don't understand the pressing need when we're told that it's the wrong time for House of Lords reform.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

iv give careing now

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

Yes, and now we need English votes for English laws, if its good enough for Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, it has to happen in England aswel.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Of course we English should have just our MPs voting on matters that only affect us. Like everything the chattering classes muddy the waters and try and confuse the issues. And for Labour to say "we don't want second class MPs" is a right laugh. English MPs have been second class to Scottish MPs since Devolution.

Its really simple:

For example Scottish Education is devolved to Scotland and MSPs vote on it and English MPs don't. By definition English Education is devolved to England. And yet Scottish MPs can vote and block what English MPs want. So just stop Scottish or Welsh or Northern Irish MPs voting in devolved matters. Simples!

Labour opened Pandora's Box when they created the Scottish Parliament because all it did was feed the Scottish the belief they didn't need us and we nearly had a broken Union last September. Chickens / Roost anyone?

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"Of course we English should have just our MPs voting on matters that only affect us. Like everything the chattering classes muddy the waters and try and confuse the issues. And for Labour to say "we don't want second class MPs" is a right laugh. English MPs have been second class to Scottish MPs since Devolution.

Its really simple:

For example Scottish Education is devolved to Scotland and MSPs vote on it and English MPs don't. By definition English Education is devolved to England. And yet Scottish MPs can vote and block what English MPs want. So just stop Scottish or Welsh or Northern Irish MPs voting in devolved matters. Simples!

Labour opened Pandora's Box when they created the Scottish Parliament because all it did was feed the Scottish the belief they didn't need us and we nearly had a broken Union last September. Chickens / Roost anyone?"

Labour have contributed to their own downfall, i think the SNP will wipe them out in Scotland at the general election.

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By *anchestercubMan
over a year ago

manchester & NI

Lets hope so.

It'd be interesting to have them as potential coalition partners.

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow


".....

Its really simple:

For example Scottish Education is devolved to Scotland and MSPs vote on it and English MPs don't. By definition English Education is devolved to England. And yet Scottish MPs can vote and block what English MPs want. So just stop Scottish or Welsh or Northern Irish MPs voting in devolved matters. Simples!

....."

Far from simples. There are far more English MPs than Scottish MPs so, if they wished and could agree, English MPs could stop Scottish MPs 'blocking' anything.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Labour won't like it "

Even more reason to say Yes!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Far from simples. There are far more English MPs than Scottish MPs so, if they wished and could agree, English MPs could stop Scottish MPs 'blocking' anything."

Forgetting of course the Labour MPs in England and of course, in matters like Education, Wales.

My point was that Labour can utilise 'non English' votes to thwart the will of English MPs on devolved English or English / Welsh matters. and it really is simple. If you devolve a power (lets say Education) to Scotland you by definition devolve English education and Welsh Education (Ulster will always be a special case) and therefore MUST exclude Scottish MPs from having ANY say in English education.

I guess its just I don't get the Socialist view that the Scots are a special breed of people and deserve twice the democracy us rubbish English do.

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

NO!

This is just a ploy on behalf of the Tories in order to keep control of Parliament. Note that there has not been any suggestion that England should have its own assembly with the same devolved powers as have been given to Scotland, Wales and N. Ireland.

Fact is Parliament is sovereign and can vary the powers of or suspend any regional assembly at any time. Therefore all MPs must have full voting powers on all issues being considered by Parliament.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"NO!

This is just a ploy on behalf of the Tories in order to keep control of Parliament. Note that there has not been any suggestion that England should have its own assembly with the same devolved powers as have been given to Scotland, Wales and N. Ireland.

Fact is Parliament is sovereign and can vary the powers of or suspend any regional assembly at any time. Therefore all MPs must have full voting powers on all issues being considered by Parliament."

England already has its own Parliament. Its called Westminster. And it pre-existed the Act of Union. So your point is?

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"NO!

This is just a ploy on behalf of the Tories in order to keep control of Parliament. Note that there has not been any suggestion that England should have its own assembly with the same devolved powers as have been given to Scotland, Wales and N. Ireland.

Fact is Parliament is sovereign and can vary the powers of or suspend any regional assembly at any time. Therefore all MPs must have full voting powers on all issues being considered by Parliament.

England already has its own Parliament. Its called Westminster. And it pre-existed the Act of Union. So your point is?"

England does not have its own Parliament, if it did there would be no Welsh, N. Irish, or Scots sitting in Westminster. Is that simple enough for you?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"England does not have its own Parliament, if it did there would be no Welsh, N. Irish, or Scots sitting in Westminster. Is that simple enough for you?"

Oh dear. Let me try one more time:

The Palace of Westminster was originally an English Parliament and while no specific date for when it started is found it is about 1230 soon after Magna Carta sometimes called 'The Parliament of Simon de Montfort'. Of course Ireland was already part of 'England' from the 1100s. Wales joined (or was forced to) in 1282 and the first 'Act of Union' in 1536 created a unified Wales. The Act of Union with Scotland in 1707 created 'Great Britain'.

So my friend There has always been an 'English Parliament'. Its just we added others as we conquered them. Very rude of us but there we are. So it follows if Scotland, Wales and what is left of Ireland now have their own Parliaments or Assemblies then the laws that are devolved are taken FROM Westminster. Therefore I submit the involvement of those countries' MPs is also taken FROM Westminster. We English just stay as we always have been.

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock


"NO!

This is just a ploy on behalf of the Tories in order to keep control of Parliament. Note that there has not been any suggestion that England should have its own assembly with the same devolved powers as have been given to Scotland, Wales and N. Ireland.

Fact is Parliament is sovereign and can vary the powers of or suspend any regional assembly at any time. Therefore all MPs must have full voting powers on all issues being considered by Parliament.

England already has its own Parliament. Its called Westminster. And it pre-existed the Act of Union. So your point is?

England does not have its own Parliament, if it did there would be no Welsh, N. Irish, or Scots sitting in Westminster. Is that simple enough for you?"

It would be easy to ask the Scots, Welsh and Northern Ireland MPs to leave the house of commons chamber in Westminster so its just the English MP's left to vote on english only matters. This is what is being suggested by the tories so we do have an english parliament. Would be a much fairer system and would even up the balance over the whole of the UK.

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By *luezuluMan
over a year ago

Suffolk

Absolutely YES

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

In the interests of fairness and democracy it has to be a yes

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

Nicola Sturgeon has said SNP members at Westminster WILL vote on English only legislation when they choose.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Not really bothered, there voting won't change anything anyhow!.

Nobody is ever in parliament for the little acts that nibble away at everything anyhow, that's how they always get them though.

They just turn up for the big media covered ones to look the good politician.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The SNP actually get right on my bloody nerves - I wish Scotland had voted for independence personally and let them get on with it. The whole debate left a bad taste in my mouth. Funny isn't it how the Scottish people generally slag off the English (particularly on the sporting front) and yet we support the likes of Murray etc - no more in my book - treat as you get treated - I will never visit Scotland again and I know a lot feel the same.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Why not take it one step further, should there be only English people voting on English issues? Like mini referenda like what the Swiss occasionally have.

If i was merely resident in any of the many countries of the world, how many of those would give me the vote? Not many i expect.

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