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"Fake?... Seriously? Regardless of their origins or where the conspiracy theorists think their funding comes from ISIS are a real threat. They don't fear us because our ROE's are too civilised which puts us at a distinct disadvantage." who are they really a threat to though? and why have they only just conveniently appeared on the radar and what of al qaeda? are they no longer a threat? isn't smoking,drinking,taking drugs and eating junk food and other related bad lifestyle choices actually more of a threat to the people of the western world than these new and imaginative alleged western funded terrorist groups that keep popping up conveniently around the time everyone get's bored of hearing about it's predecessor?  | |||
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"Fake?... Seriously? Regardless of their origins or where the conspiracy theorists think their funding comes from ISIS are a real threat. They don't fear us because our ROE's are too civilised which puts us at a distinct disadvantage." Would you ask a boxer to fight an opponent with both hands tied behind his back ? That's us !!! Human rights only apply when both sides don't cross them ? They already have ? As for any British !!! Who fight should be shot as traitors and any family sent to the country where they were fighting ! | |||
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" As for any British !!! Who fight should be shot as traitors and any family sent to the country where they were fighting !" Ah, punishing the family for one bad apple. The was tried in Nazi Germany and they called it 'Sippenhaft'. It's also popular in North Korea. I'm not totally sure it will make Britain a brighter place. | |||
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"Fake?... Seriously? Regardless of their origins or where the conspiracy theorists think their funding comes from ISIS are a real threat. They don't fear us because our ROE's are too civilised which puts us at a distinct disadvantage." agree on the whole but would say that the way we deal with them is what separates us from them, they want us to go to their level.. | |||
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" As for any British !!! Who fight should be shot as traitors and any family sent to the country where they were fighting ! Ah, punishing the family for one bad apple. The was tried in Nazi Germany and they called it 'Sippenhaft'. It's also popular in North Korea. I'm not totally sure it will make Britain a brighter place. " This | |||
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"Fake?... Seriously? Regardless of their origins or where the conspiracy theorists think their funding comes from ISIS are a real threat. They don't fear us because our ROE's are too civilised which puts us at a distinct disadvantage. Would you ask a boxer to fight an opponent with both hands tied behind his back ? That's us !!! Human rights only apply when both sides don't cross them ? They already have ? As for any British !!! Who fight should be shot as traitors and any family sent to the country where they were fighting !" does your means of justice apply to the politicians and bankers that are selling us out whilst fattening their pockets? coz lets face the fact's whilst we're caught up in the media circus sorrounding these speculative groups what's really happening on our home ground in terms of our right's and hard earned cash being fleeced from us and that's more relevant to the majority of us than any potential foreign terrorist attacks | |||
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"I would think the poor families of the captives and those already executed, will tell you it's very real. " do you know the poor family of those already executed? as id very much like for them to tell me that it's real as i've come to the conclusion otherwise  | |||
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" As for any British !!! Who fight should be shot as traitors and any family sent to the country where they were fighting ! Ah, punishing the family for one bad apple. The was tried in Nazi Germany and they called it 'Sippenhaft'. It's also popular in North Korea. I'm not totally sure it will make Britain a brighter place. " you are very wise...i salute you people are often to quick to jump the gun and are inclined to be lead by the media rather than having a mind of their own to question the reality that is spoonfed to them which unfortunately isn't always in our best interest otherwise i guess i wouldn't have an issue with it | |||
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"Fake?... Seriously? Regardless of their origins or where the conspiracy theorists think their funding comes from ISIS are a real threat. They don't fear us because our ROE's are too civilised which puts us at a distinct disadvantage. Would you ask a boxer to fight an opponent with both hands tied behind his back ? That's us !!! Human rights only apply when both sides don't cross them ? They already have ? As for any British !!! Who fight should be shot as traitors and any family sent to the country where they were fighting !" you say human rights only apply when both sides dont cross them? well unfortunately they do say that all is fair in love and war and if i remember correctly we started the (illegal) war and i wouldn't exactly say that we have our hands tied behind our backs when we have infinitely superior weaponry and more of it than our opponents and we're using it prolifically to kill hundreds of thousands of those who appose us abroad...many of which are women and children which in my opinion is not exactly much of a fair fight | |||
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"Ask Saul Berenson" let's ask the rothschild family what their stance is on all of this....war = profit for the rich who fund it | |||
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"real or fake? what are your personal views on the subject? ;)" Judging by your profile pic you must work in Parliament!! | |||
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"[Removed by poster at 21/10/14 13:21:57]" tongue got your cat rodney? | |||
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"real or fake? what are your personal views on the subject? ;) Judging by your profile pic you must work in Parliament!! "haha i'll take that as a compliment comrade....unfortunately im not in favour of poltricks or politrickans ...but i've been on the frontline enough to know what most dont want to believe | |||
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"My neighbours pussy got the better of my tongue" meeeeeeeeeeeeow! | |||
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" As for any British !!! Who fight should be shot as traitors and any family sent to the country where they were fighting ! Ah, punishing the family for one bad apple. The was tried in Nazi Germany and they called it 'Sippenhaft'. It's also popular in North Korea. I'm not totally sure it will make Britain a brighter place. " Actually, it has generally been the rule across the world that traitors and the families of traitors forfeit all property to the state and also loose their citizenship and protection in law being given between 3 and 30 days to leave whichever country they were from. In fact the justification for such a harsh law is found in the bible... The sins of the father shall be visited upon the son ye to the 7th generation, and like it or not in general the treason laws worked. So maybe the idea of returning to a law that worked is not that bad an idea (just a thought)... After all would the 7/7 bomber who left a video saying he was happy to kill because his wife would bring his child up to continue the struggle, and would she have been so quick to rush off to Syria to administer 'justice' for ISIS if they both know that their child and extended family would be exiled from Britain or executed if found in the UK as soon as their period of grace was over? I would suggest that many migrant families and communities would be incentified to assimilate and ensure that their young were not 'radicalised', rather than forming what are effectively cultural ghettos that are perfect breeding grounds for disaffection. Again just a thought... | |||
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"I would think the poor families of the captives and those already executed, will tell you it's very real. do you know the poor family of those already executed? as id very much like for them to tell me that it's real as i've come to the conclusion otherwise "That's possibly one of the most disrespectful things I've ever read. It's quite shameful that you'd think that. | |||
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"I would think the poor families of the captives and those already executed, will tell you it's very real. do you know the poor family of those already executed? as id very much like for them to tell me that it's real as i've come to the conclusion otherwise
That's possibly one of the most disrespectful things I've ever read. It's quite shameful that you'd think that."I have to agree and chucking a wink on the end doesn't excuse it. | |||
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"I would think the poor families of the captives and those already executed, will tell you it's very real. do you know the poor family of those already executed? as id very much like for them to tell me that it's real as i've come to the conclusion otherwise
That's possibly one of the most disrespectful things I've ever read. It's quite shameful that you'd think that.
I have to agree and chucking a wink on the end doesn't excuse it."Sums up the mentality of some people... I know I can often be quite caustic but even I wouldn't stoop to something that low. | |||
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"I would think the poor families of the captives and those already executed, will tell you it's very real. do you know the poor family of those already executed? as id very much like for them to tell me that it's real as i've come to the conclusion otherwise "Ask the RAF to drop you off in a parachute somewhere over Northern Iraq and you can really make your mind up and base it on real life experience - as opposed to what you are spoon fed... | |||
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"They are a threat. A very real threat. Though I'm not 100% convinced they are a threat to people living in Britain on a day to day basis. But they are clearly a violent and destabilising force. I do wonder how they have appeared so suddenly and are such a significant force in such a short time. I'd love to know who is bank rolling them, and arming them" They would very much like to be a threat over here. The main reason they currently aren't is partly down to excellent anti-terror policing and good intelligence and the fact their attention currently seems to be building their own state from which to operate. The biggest concern is those who sympathise with them and attempt to radicalise others into carrying out acts of terror in their name (as we've already seen attempts in Australia for instance). As for who's funding them? Well I suppose it depends on which theory you believe the most but there's credibility in several of them. There's been so much instability in that part of the world for so long it would be easy for someone with an agenda to influence something like this and plenty of weapons to go around and plenty more to capture. So it can snowball without the need for outside investment.... | |||
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"They are a threat. A very real threat. Though I'm not 100% convinced they are a threat to people living in Britain on a day to day basis. But they are clearly a violent and destabilising force. I do wonder how they have appeared so suddenly and are such a significant force in such a short time. I'd love to know who is bank rolling them, and arming them" Transparency from our EU counterparts may answer at least a part of this. Paying ransoms I don't understand. | |||
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"I would think the poor families of the captives and those already executed, will tell you it's very real. do you know the poor family of those already executed? as id very much like for them to tell me that it's real as i've come to the conclusion otherwise
That's possibly one of the most disrespectful things I've ever read. It's quite shameful that you'd think that."Have to agree, regardless of what you think, are you actually saying that the shocking videos portrayed around the world are fake? I think not, in which case, let's at least show some respect to families and friends and keep opinions to ourselves on here, this is a swinging site and not a political website for discussion topics | |||
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"I would think the poor families of the captives and those already executed, will tell you it's very real. do you know the poor family of those already executed? as id very much like for them to tell me that it's real as i've come to the conclusion otherwise
That's possibly one of the most disrespectful things I've ever read. It's quite shameful that you'd think that.
Have to agree, regardless of what you think, are you actually saying that the shocking videos portrayed around the world are fake?
I think not, in which case, let's at least show some respect to families and friends and keep opinions to ourselves on here, this is a swinging site and not a political website for discussion topics"like this I was supposed to say!, sorry | |||
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"Fake?... Seriously? Regardless of their origins or where the conspiracy theorists think their funding comes from ISIS are a real threat. They don't fear us because our ROE's are too civilised which puts us at a distinct disadvantage. who are they really a threat to though? and why have they only just conveniently appeared on the radar and what of al qaeda? are they no longer a threat? isn't smoking,drinking,taking drugs and eating junk food and other related bad lifestyle choices actually more of a threat to the people of the western world than these new and imaginative alleged western funded terrorist groups that keep popping up conveniently around the time everyone get's bored of hearing about it's predecessor? "Ronald McDonald doesnt lop the heads off of innocent people who do nothing wrong.  | |||
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" Paying ransoms I don't understand. " That shows a real lack of empathy. I for one fully understand why those who have loved ones taken for ransom or just as hostages will do everything they can to get their loved ones back. And by extension I can also understand why countries (ours included) will enter into negotiations (public or secret) with those who take hostages in an attempt to get their citizens returned unharmed. | |||
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" Paying ransoms I don't understand. That shows a real lack of empathy. I for one fully understand why those who have loved ones taken for ransom or just as hostages will do everything they can to get their loved ones back. And by extension I can also understand why countries (ours included) will enter into negotiations (public or secret) with those who take hostages in an attempt to get their citizens returned unharmed. " Oh I don't say that lightly at all. It's a bloody hard call to make. However if every country paid terrorist groups the massive ransoms they are demanding, those groups would very quickly be a horrific force to reckon with. Flip from the emotional side to the practical side of the argument. How can giving these groups vast sums of money help the countries they reside or the rest of the world. To me it's a no brainier. | |||
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"real or fake? what are your personal views on the subject? ;)"  | |||
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" Paying ransoms I don't understand. That shows a real lack of empathy. I for one fully understand why those who have loved ones taken for ransom or just as hostages will do everything they can to get their loved ones back. And by extension I can also understand why countries (ours included) will enter into negotiations (public or secret) with those who take hostages in an attempt to get their citizens returned unharmed. Oh I don't say that lightly at all. It's a bloody hard call to make. However if every country paid terrorist groups the massive ransoms they are demanding, those groups would very quickly be a horrific force to reckon with. Flip from the emotional side to the practical side of the argument. How can giving these groups vast sums of money help the countries they reside or the rest of the world. To me it's a no brainier. " I am very unemotional about these things. In fact, I would make the cost benefit equation so negative for the hostage takers and their supporting communities that they would stop. However that would mean that we (the western democracies) would have to man up and accept that the only way to discourage our enemies is to use such overwhelming force against those who attack us. That is not going to happen because we now believe that individual criminals have more rights than the rest of society. So what chance is there that we will stand up to criminal countries or pseudo-countries? | |||
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"A lot of you appear to have been sucked in by the sensationalist propaganda our media outlets churn out these days. Take it from someone who has family from that region, we're not being told the whole story. I mean, why isn't it explained HOW isis got its hands on missiles and god knows what other serious military hardware? Because they were given that stuff by Western states. Isis is the name of one group of "rebels" that just a short while ago we were arming and cheering on in the fight against Assad in Syria. Its a mirror image of the situation in 2011 against Gaddafi, who suddenly, after 40 years of rule became some terrible dictator the world had to deal with (side note, what the hell is going on in Libya now anyway? Oh, we're not told? Great). And they make these British citizens martyrs for their cause, in the same way the opposing forces and the countless "enemies" that have gone before did. Seriously, the sooner we all wake up and realise that politicians do nothing but lie when it comes to international relations, the better. I'd prefer if they just told us they want to play global puppetmaster." It's very easy to explain. There were already lots of guns in the region and the more people they killed and took weapons from, the more they got and will continue to get. There may also be foreign benefactors. The area is unstable, lots of factional/tribal rivalries, it doesn't take a lot to kick things off and then it just snowballs from there. Sometimes this shit just happens and that's the only explanation, it doesnt mean that there's a dark western agenda behind it. Regardless of what some conspiracy nuts would like you to think.... | |||
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. Are they so intrenched in the UK thAt they are now infiltrating swinger sites
Back later there's a nut job on the loose. We are off down to the bunker  | |||
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"A lot of you appear to have been sucked in by the sensationalist propaganda our media outlets churn out these days. Take it from someone who has family from that region, we're not being told the whole story. I mean, why isn't it explained HOW isis got its hands on missiles and god knows what other serious military hardware? Because they were given that stuff by Western states. Isis is the name of one group of "rebels" that just a short while ago we were arming and cheering on in the fight against Assad in Syria. Its a mirror image of the situation in 2011 against Gaddafi, who suddenly, after 40 years of rule became some terrible dictator the world had to deal with (side note, what the hell is going on in Libya now anyway? Oh, we're not told? Great). And they make these British citizens martyrs for their cause, in the same way the opposing forces and the countless "enemies" that have gone before did. Seriously, the sooner we all wake up and realise that politicians do nothing but lie when it comes to international relations, the better. I'd prefer if they just told us they want to play global puppetmaster." I for one have no illusions about where ISIS get their weapons from and the roll we (as in the western democracies) have played in arming them. However the idea that our politicians have deliberately armed our enemies because they want to play a global power game is preposterous. In fact what actually happens is the western democracies leaders pander to their constituents wishes for conflict free lives and in doing so allow the growth of extremism which they then hide from their populations in order to retain power. By the time conflagrations are so large they can no longer be hidden they are out of control, by then they require massive force to bring under control. This conflict has had some 70 years to gain strength and will require massive step-change in force to bring it under control. We will not be willing to make that move until the barbarians are banging down our own doors because there are too many that believe that if we leave them alone they will leave us alone. | |||
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"real or fake? what are your personal views on the subject? ;)" Its not exactly fake as they are shooting shit out of people, is it maximum media exposure? Probably but then there is a bigger game a foot anyway. | |||
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" It's very easy to explain. There were already lots of guns in the region and the more people they killed and took weapons from, the more they got and will continue to get. There may also be foreign benefactors. " I disagree. Though a lot of arms were left over in the region from the Saddam era, there is evidence that they have obtained up-to-date weaponry that could not have been simply lying around. It is already evident your "foreign benefactors" include Qatar, Saudi Arabia, and Kuwait (though that never makes the news), and I assert other providers include the United States and prominent EU countries, including the UK. I hardly think that's a preposterous notion considering it's PUBLIC knowledge that western states have supported rebel groups in the region. What's to say Isis is just a rebel group gone rogue? Just like Al-Qaeda, originally created to fight the USSR, and around the same time, the Islamic regime in Iran, set up to ensure the permanent exclusion of the increasingly anti-western Shah. " This conflict has had some 70 years to gain strength and will require massive step-change in force to bring it under control. We will not be willing to make that move until the barbarians are banging down our own doors because there are too many that believe that if we leave them alone they will leave us alone." 70 years...I assume you're referring to the Israel/Palestine conflict? Which was effectively created by Western involvement? And is "barbarians" really the way to talk about your fellow man? Especially when we sit in a state that contributed to the deaths of 150,000 Iraqi civilians during the Second Gulf War, which solved nothing and arguably led to the veritable sh*tstorm that has descended on that region? | |||
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"70 years...I assume you're referring to the Israel/Palestine conflict? Which was effectively created by Western involvement? And is "barbarians" really the way to talk about your fellow man? Especially when we sit in a state that contributed to the deaths of 150,000 Iraqi civilians during the Second Gulf War, which solved nothing and arguably led to the veritable sh*tstorm that has descended on that region?" Yes, the 70 years does refer to the Arab, Israeli conflict. However to say that that conflict is the product of the West is really quite disingenuous. The only fault that can be placed at the West's door is that we abrogated our responsibilities and did not stamp on the Stern Gangs in the late 40's. However as stated before this was not done by design, but by default because nearly everyone wanted peace after WW2 and a collective guilt felt by most for allowing the haulachaust to happen. As for the cause of the second Gulf War, that has to be laid squarely at the feet of Sadam and the general Arab mindset. Firstly there was the 9/11 attack on the USA that led to the Afghan War, then Sadam refused to be totally open and continued to play stupid games that were designed to elicit a reaction because he was a hard man. He gambled with the lives of his people and lost. Don't blame the West for eventually striking those who believe that restraint is a sign of weakness, and don't claim western politicians are playing power games when they reflect the views of the populations they represent and hide the truth from people who don't want to see the nasty underside of life. If you want to blame someone find a mirror and take a long hard look at yourself. Because unless you are one of the very few anti political correctness activists you are partly to blame for the situation we find ourselves in. | |||
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"I do like posts like these makes it nice and easy for 6 to know who to keep an eye on... " Now, now, play nice, you never know who is listening
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"I would think the poor families of the captives and those already executed, will tell you it's very real. do you know the poor family of those already executed? as id very much like for them to tell me that it's real as i've come to the conclusion otherwise "You do have some very strange ideas. Many exhibit a worrying degree of paranoia. As for dismissing the people who have been killed as political lies, it could be the foulest claptrap you've come out with to date on here. Free thinker? No, paranoid conspiracy theorist sums it up much better. I'm saddened to know anyone thinks like you, and that they justify it as "free thinking". | |||
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"real or fake? what are your personal views on the subject? ;)" It's not a crisis here. So does that mean we ignore where it is a crisis? | |||
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" It's very easy to explain. There were already lots of guns in the region and the more people they killed and took weapons from, the more they got and will continue to get. There may also be foreign benefactors. I disagree. Though a lot of arms were left over in the region from the Saddam era, there is evidence that they have obtained up-to-date weaponry that could not have been simply lying around. It is already evident your "foreign benefactors" include Qatar, Saudi Arabia, and Kuwait (though that never makes the news), and I assert other providers include the United States and prominent EU countries, including the UK. I hardly think that's a preposterous notion considering it's PUBLIC knowledge that western states have supported rebel groups in the region. What's to say Isis is just a rebel group gone rogue? Just like Al-Qaeda, originally created to fight the USSR, and around the same time, the Islamic regime in Iran, set up to ensure the permanent exclusion of the increasingly anti-western Shah. This conflict has had some 70 years to gain strength and will require massive step-change in force to bring it under control. We will not be willing to make that move until the barbarians are banging down our own doors because there are too many that believe that if we leave them alone they will leave us alone. 70 years...I assume you're referring to the Israel/Palestine conflict? Which was effectively created by Western involvement? And is "barbarians" really the way to talk about your fellow man? Especially when we sit in a state that contributed to the deaths of 150,000 Iraqi civilians during the Second Gulf War, which solved nothing and arguably led to the veritable sh*tstorm that has descended on that region?" The 'up to date' weapons are mostly captured. | |||
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i"I would think the poor families of the captives and those already executed, will tell you it's very real. do you know the poor family of those already executed? as id very much like for them to tell me that it's real as i've come to the conclusion otherwise
You do have some very strange ideas. Many exhibit a worrying degree of paranoia.
As for dismissing the people who have been killed as political lies, it could be the foulest claptrap you've come out with to date on here.
Free thinker? No, paranoid conspiracy theorist sums it up much better.
I'm saddened to know anyone thinks like you, and that they justify it as "free thinking"." | |||
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"Is this a party political broadcast by ISis . Are they so intrenched in the UK thAt they are now infiltrating swinger sites
Back later there's a nut job on the loose. We are off down to the bunker "why don't you "duck and cover" and hide under a table and bury your head in a sand and im sure it will all go away hehe oi the next round is on you | |||
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"What makes you think that all the people here who think you are quite nutty are basing their opinions on what the media say. It is possible not to automatically believe what is reported and to be a "free thinker" without agreeing with you! This and other previous posts of yours show you to be a paranoid conspiracy theorist. If you were a "free thinker" you'd have the ability to understand that people are able to think for themselves and still reach conclusions that differ from yours."  +1 | |||
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"What makes you think that all the people here who think you are quite nutty are basing their opinions on what the media say. It is possible not to automatically believe what is reported and to be a "free thinker" without agreeing with you! This and other previous posts of yours show you to be a paranoid conspiracy theorist. If you were a "free thinker" you'd have the ability to understand that people are able to think for themselves and still reach conclusions that differ from yours." | |||
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"Watch that Katy Perry video... Black horse Look up the link between that n IsIs" is she a jihadist | |||
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"Watch that Katy Perry video... Black horse Look up the link between that n IsIs is she a jihadist "I always thought there was something dodgy about her. | |||
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"A thread like this is always going to generate strong opinion, right or wrong. There is no easy answer to a number of the points put forward aside from the one that questions the existence of ISIS/IS/ISIL, yes they do exist, and no I'm not taking my knowledge from what you describe as western media propaganda. I do a lot of work in the region amongst others and there are a number of contributing factors, but, 2 stand out significantly and 1 is uncomfortable in that it is a sad reality that the west and its actions have contributed to the rise of such extremist groups. The second main contributing factor is the previous Iraq regime, that of Maliki not Sadaam. Maliki effectively governed on a sectarian basis thus exacerbating discontent that was already rife, firing on his own citizens and thus himself being guilty of war crimes/crimes against humanity. Just as there is not one answer to why they have risen so quickly, there is no one solution but a combination. The issue now is how to stop it, it is perhaps counter productive at this stage to apportion blame, that can come after when accountability is required and impunity addressed. IS is a threat to global stability, but not IS in its form in Iraq/Syria, its IS or those that sympathise in other countries that pose the threat and they cannot be addressed with the military. It is an idealogical issue that must be countered the same way. That is not to say that we shouldn't seek to address the problem in Iraq and Syria as we must (we being all countries), as we cannot sit by and allow massacrers to happen as we did in Bosnia, Rwanda, CAR etc etc. I could go on and on, but i fear i may bore people so ill stop there." My ex-husband is Iraqi and he is currently living back in his home city, Irbil in the Kurdish area (North of Iraq). I spoke to him on the phone a few weeks ago - ISIS are certainly real and his city is 'full of refugees' from places like Mosul, etc. | |||
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"Watch that Katy Perry video... Black horse Look up the link between that n IsIs is she a jihadist
I always thought there was something dodgy about her. "She's waaaaay too sexy to be a jihadist. I think suicide bombings would fall sharply as no amount of virgins would be as good as trying to get in bed with her | |||
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