FabSwingers.com mobile

Join us FREE, we're FREE to use

Web's largest swingers site since 2006.

Already registered?
Login here

Back to forum list
Back to The Lounge

Burka Ban....Good or bad ??

Jump to newest
 

By *xstephbxx OP   Couple
over a year ago

hyde

Have just been watching Sky News and France has announced a ban on Full Face Burka wearing.

I personally think in this day and age it does make sense. If i choose to wear a balaclava, all dressed in black whilst walking round tesco's i would probably be asked to leave within a few minutes.

Security wise it must be a nightmare for the police to cope with

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Good ... it`s not actually required under islam

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *eakcoupleCouple
over a year ago

peak district

did you know women can take driving tests in them? hows that for putting religious mania ahead of public safety?

ban them. if people really want to wear them, they can emigrate to iran!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Same here I am completely opposed to the things for various reasons. They have no place in modern society in the western world. As others have said, you cannot even wear a hooded top in a shop these days without getting in the shit so why should this lot be treated any differently. They are more than welcome to live in an islamic country if they so wish. Fuck i will stop now otherwise it will turn nto a rant and some muppet will accuse me of being a racist

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"did you know women can take driving tests in them? hows that for putting religious mania ahead of public safety?

ban them. if people really want to wear them, they can emigrate to iran!"

I think they can also have passport pics taken with most of the face covered.

Each to their own where the burka is concerned not really bothered either way, but where we are asked to remove helmets and hats etc, so should they.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I reckon only the ugly ones should wear them

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay

The Belgians tried to ban the Burkha last year....the European Court of Human Rights overturned the ban.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *eppersCouple
over a year ago

telford

we should ban them too, if they want to abide by there deep religuose beliefs then go to an islamic country and do it, we didn't ask you come here you came by choice so when in rome etc.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I reckon only the ugly ones should wear them "

How can you tell which ones are which though?????

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *eppersCouple
over a year ago

telford

thats the arguement of the british intellegence services how can you tell if its not a terrorist dressed up in them, its like muslims and the turban and our motorcycle law,

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *northernsoulMan
over a year ago

Manchester

If people want to wear burqas day to day for religious reasons, fair enough, but for driving cars and passing through security measures, they should be removed. As for passports, the same principle applies to wearing sunglasses, baseball caps, hoods, comedy moustaches, or any other distractions, burqas shouldn't be any different.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Full ban - no, not unless your going to ban all other forms of full face attire like helmets and balaclava's

Security ban in certain sensative areas fully acceptable as is the wearing of helmets and balaclava's in such places as banks.

The right of security personnel to request the removal any form of full cover face attire for security purposes. The right of the wearer to request this be done in a private cubicle/office.

That should satisfy any reasonable person.

It should also be noted that the Bhurka is an optional clothing choice for many muslems but not a requirement, some religions do have compulsory clothing requlations like the removal of shoes in some temples, the wearing of Turbans by Sikhs at some events, the wearing of a (forgotton the correct name) cap in Synagogues etc.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Don`t know, but we`ve seen a few folk on here where they should have been compulsary attire.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *eppersCouple
over a year ago

telford

but what happens when we visit there countries we have to abide the rules of the land, so how come they don't when they come over here, we brits are too dam soft in this country its about time we stood up and be counted, soon there will be no christainity in this country we all be muslims or is that we are heading for .

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"but what happens when we visit there countries we have to abide the rules of the land, so how come they don't when they come over here, we brits are too dam soft in this country its about time we stood up and be counted, soon there will be no christainity in this country we all be muslims or is that we are heading for ."

Totally agree with you

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

quite a few peeps have said I've got the perfect face for radio.

When I was a kid, mom tied a pork chop round my neck so as the dog would play with me

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"They" ARE abiding by the rules of this country too aren't they????

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"but what happens when we visit there countries we have to abide the rules of the land, so how come they don't when they come over here, we brits are too dam soft in this country its about time we stood up and be counted, soon there will be no christainity in this country we all be muslims or is that we are heading for ."

But that can't necessarily be blamed on the muslims. Possibly a change in societys values,you look back even 15 years ago church was part of a Sunday, churches were full, now people are more concerned of going shopping and a church is there for weddings and funerals only. Possibly a generation thing that christianity is slowing down.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he BananamanMan
over a year ago

WORCESTERSHIRE

didn't an escaped bomber escape to somalia wearing a burka to go through customs at heathrow airport?,the way the world and indeed this country are regarding terrorism everyone should be obliged by law to show faces!.

any woman that wants to wear a burka can go and walk about freely in this garb in iraq or iran!,and upon leaving take your kids with you!.

as has been said before on this forum it is not a requirement of the religion,more an act of defiance to wear the burka!.

remember the woman who worked at heathrow airport and was ordered to remove her crufifix as it might offend non-christians?,if they are offended by a crucifix they are in in the wrong country!,they do not want to integrate in this country whatsoever.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yeah----I think they look like some kind of ninja warrior!! haaaaaaaaaaa saaaaaaa! lol

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's not an act of "defiance" wearing it...some Muslim women wish to wear it as a reflection of their religious and personal beliefs...

That's their choice so surely choice for anyone is a good thing.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's not an act of "defiance" wearing it...some Muslim women wish to wear it as a reflection of their religious and personal beliefs...

That's their choice so surely choice for anyone is a good thing."

Yeah here here!! its like us drinking beer/wine/spirits on a saturday nite we believe in gettin pissed up! n thats wot they believe in bein similar to a ninja ,,

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"didn't an escaped bomber escape to somalia wearing a burka to go through customs at heathrow airport?,the way the world and indeed this country are regarding terrorism everyone should be obliged by law to show faces!.

any woman that wants to wear a burka can go and walk about freely in this garb in iraq or iran!,and upon leaving take your kids with you!.

as has been said before on this forum it is not a requirement of the religion,more an act of defiance to wear the burka!.

remember the woman who worked at heathrow airport and was ordered to remove her crufifix as it might offend non-christians?,if they are offended by a crucifix they are in in the wrong country!,they do not want to integrate in this country whatsoever. "

The guys that blew up the underground trains and buses on 7/7 were wearing Nike sweatshirts and rucksacks.....I don't agree that there is any connection to the burkha and terrorism.

Make them drop the veil when entering banks, they are already required to do so in most government buildings and when going through security checks like airport passport control.

They are also banned in police stations, courts, and many other places.

All that needs sorting out is banning them from banks, building societies and petrol station counters....anywhere where security is an issue.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Sorry 'Notts' if there was a point in there it escaped me

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"didn't an escaped bomber escape to somalia wearing a burka to go through customs at heathrow airport?,the way the world and indeed this country are regarding terrorism everyone should be obliged by law to show faces!.

any woman that wants to wear a burka can go and walk about freely in this garb in iraq or iran!,and upon leaving take your kids with you!.

as has been said before on this forum it is not a requirement of the religion,more an act of defiance to wear the burka!.

remember the woman who worked at heathrow airport and was ordered to remove her crufifix as it might offend non-christians?,if they are offended by a crucifix they are in in the wrong country!,they do not want to integrate in this country whatsoever.

The guys that blew up the underground trains and buses on 7/7 were wearing Nike sweatshirts and rucksacks.....I don't agree that there is any connection to the burkha and terrorism.

Make them drop the veil when entering banks, they are already required to do so in most government buildings and when going through security checks like airport passport control.

They are also banned in police stations, courts, and many other places.

All that needs sorting out is banning them from banks, building societies and petrol station counters....anywhere where security is an issue.

"

That about sums it up right.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's not an act of "defiance" wearing it...some Muslim women wish to wear it as a reflection of their religious and personal beliefs...

That's their choice so surely choice for anyone is a good thing.

Yeah here here!! its like us drinking beer/wine/spirits on a saturday nite we believe in gettin pissed up! n thats wot they believe in bein similar to a ninja ,, "

Fuck for the first time ever I almost laughed at one of Notts posts

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

ah fook i just come on here thinking it was a ban on that sex thing where everyone cums on ya

thought k nell i aint even done it yet and they are banning it

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Still lost on ME

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's not an act of "defiance" wearing it...some Muslim women wish to wear it as a reflection of their religious and personal beliefs...

That's their choice so surely choice for anyone is a good thing.

Yeah here here!! its like us drinking beer/wine/spirits on a saturday nite we believe in gettin pissed up! n thats wot they believe in bein similar to a ninja ,,

Fuck for the first time ever I almost laughed at one of Notts posts "

U still got time! lol

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The problem is how can we know which women wear them through choice and which ones wear them through force? At least by banning them in public you would save the majority of burkha wearers who wear them by force rather than choice, then again,they probably would not be allowed out in public at all if they were uncovered, so maybe it would lead to even further opression?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The problem is how can we know which women wear them through choice and which ones wear them through force? At least by banning them in public you would save the majority of burkha wearers who wear them by force rather than choice, then again,they probably would not be allowed out in public at all if they were uncovered, so maybe it would lead to even further opression?"

I mean they look like a evil ninja keep expecting um to unleash a massive curved sword!! haaaaaaaaaa saaaaa! lol

but wot i say now is this i totally ignore um its the modern world 4 everyone like it or not but they r here to stay,,Rant over!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It seems a bit rough to me to blame an entire religion on the behaviour of a few fanatics...Christianity has hardly had a blameless past!.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It seems a bit rough to me to blame an entire religion on the behaviour of a few fanatics...Christianity has hardly had a blameless past!."

arrrr yes 2rite!! u a good point maker u r.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton

i dont think it is a good idea to ban anything a muslim wants to do

they can get a bit upset

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6cLa4xoRo8&feature=related

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Here we go...It's all going racist again that's me out

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

so yeah be careful,,u never know they mite nice people..

id take um out 4 the day show um a thing or two! lol

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he BananamanMan
over a year ago

WORCESTERSHIRE


"didn't an escaped bomber escape to somalia wearing a burka to go through customs at heathrow airport?,the way the world and indeed this country are regarding terrorism everyone should be obliged by law to show faces!.

any woman that wants to wear a burka can go and walk about freely in this garb in iraq or iran!,and upon leaving take your kids with you!.

as has been said before on this forum it is not a requirement of the religion,more an act of defiance to wear the burka!.

remember the woman who worked at heathrow airport and was ordered to remove her crufifix as it might offend non-christians?,if they are offended by a crucifix they are in in the wrong country!,they do not want to integrate in this country whatsoever.

The guys that blew up the underground trains and buses on 7/7 were wearing Nike sweatshirts and rucksacks.....I don't agree that there is any connection to the burkha and terrorism.

Make them drop the veil when entering banks, they are already required to do so in most government buildings and when going through security checks like airport passport control.

They are also banned in police stations, courts, and many other places.

All that needs sorting out is banning them from banks, building societies and petrol station counters....anywhere where security is an issue.

"

you might not think there is any links between the burka and terrorism but the bomber still got through heathrow passport control check wearing the burka,and i was present on the apron at T5 when the first realisation of the mixing chemicals with the babies water bottles on an american airlines flight was discovered,the yanks checked the passenger list and found some unsavoury characters were on board so refused the jet and it was turned round in mid flight and returned back to heathrow T5,when the sercurity went on the plane they ejected 3 males and then went back on board for 5 females wearing burkas!.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"ah fook i just come on here thinking it was a ban on that sex thing where everyone cums on ya

thought k nell i aint even done it yet and they are banning it "

i think u confused burka with bukkake, lol.

you cant get more different even if they do sound similar!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *eppersCouple
over a year ago

telford

that link says it all and there in this country what was that copper doing nowt !!!!! now if it was the other way round we all be arrested and charged with inciteing racial hatred how many of those demonstrators were arrested let me think............... er non

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Talking about breaking rules which ones are they breaking? None.

I always felt one of the strengths of this country was in respecting people's differences and allowing them freedoms.

It's disappointing and surprising to find people who for the majority of the nation are leading a fairly alternative lifestyle in swinging be so close-minded and Daily Mail over this.

Demonising people because of their religion will only lead to more trouble ultimately.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I quite fancy one for when I'm having a bad hair day.

And that is meant tongue in cheek...my friend is married to a muslim and she laughed when I said the same to her.

She's promised me one for getting changed under at the beach.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

But didn't you just agree with him too Notts?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *xstephbxx OP   Couple
over a year ago

hyde


"Talking about breaking rules which ones are they breaking? None.

I always felt one of the strengths of this country was in respecting people's differences and allowing them freedoms.

It's disappointing and surprising to find people who for the majority of the nation are leading a fairly alternative lifestyle in swinging be so close-minded and Daily Mail over this.

Demonising people because of their religion will only lead to more trouble ultimately."

Not saying demonise them, but as a security issue it does need to be resolved.

Can we not supply see through ones ??..

In fact, im pretty sure there is an opeing of a fetish market here !!!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"But didn't you just agree with him too Notts?"

No i agree with all good comments!! honest.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"Talking about breaking rules which ones are they breaking? None.

I always felt one of the strengths of this country was in respecting people's differences and allowing them freedoms.

It's disappointing and surprising to find people who for the majority of the nation are leading a fairly alternative lifestyle in swinging be so close-minded and Daily Mail over this.

Demonising people because of their religion will only lead to more trouble ultimately.

Not saying demonise them, but as a security issue it does need to be resolved.

Can we not supply see through ones ??..

In fact, im pretty sure there is an opeing of a fetish market here !!! "

You will find that there are already rules in place regarding the wearing of a burkha in areas of high security.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"But didn't you just agree with him too Notts?

No i agree with all good comments!! honest. "

It wasn't a good comment that's why it's been removed.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"But didn't you just agree with him too Notts?

No i agree with all good comments!! honest.

It wasn't a good comment that's why it's been removed. "

Oh alrite then dont loose ya burka! lol

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

You are trying my patience too now Notts, and I have a lot of patience.

Why not stick to the threads that you know about, it will be more fun for you.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"But didn't you just agree with him too Notts?

No i agree with all good comments!! honest.

It wasn't a good comment that's why it's been removed.

Oh alrite then dont loose ya burka! lol "

means-----keep ya hair on!

ok i follow ure words.lol

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You are trying my patience too now Notts, and I have a lot of patience.

Why not stick to the threads that you know about, it will be more fun for you."

alrite mrs mfm.x

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *U1966Man
over a year ago

Devon

Ban them in this country and all across the eu if that upsets people then they can choose to live somewhere they will be welcome to wear it

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Talking about breaking rules which ones are they breaking? None.

I always felt one of the strengths of this country was in respecting people's differences and allowing them freedoms.

It's disappointing and surprising to find people who for the majority of the nation are leading a fairly alternative lifestyle in swinging be so close-minded and Daily Mail over this.

Demonising people because of their religion will only lead to more trouble ultimately.

Not saying demonise them, but as a security issue it does need to be resolved.

Can we not supply see through ones ??..

In fact, im pretty sure there is an opeing of a fetish market here !!!

You will find that there are already rules in place regarding the wearing of a burkha in areas of high security."

And in those sensitive areas I would imagine burka wearers comply with the requests made of them.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Ban them in this country and all across the eu if that upsets people then they can choose to live somewhere they will be welcome to wear it"

Innit just!! agreed.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"Ban them in this country and all across the eu if that upsets people then they can choose to live somewhere they will be welcome to wear it"

Ban them on what grounds?

Religion?

Security?

Distaste?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Well said that man! ^^^^

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *U1966Man
over a year ago

Devon

No place in our society and a security issue not required to be a practising muslim or citizen of this country

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"No place in our society and a security issue not required to be a practising muslim or citizen of this country"

HERE HERE!!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"No place in our society and a security issue not required to be a practising muslim or citizen of this country"

So are you saying the the United Kingdom has an 'official' religion?

Because it is in the main Christian....doesn't make it a Christian country.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 13/07/10 19:03:45]

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *U1966Man
over a year ago

Devon

Who mentioned religion society is about a lot more that what name they give the person they pray to

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay

So under what premis would you ban the burkha on?, an afront to public decency?, offensive to Christians?, Bad Fashion sense?.....It's a big can of worms to ope, what's next....the closing down of mosques?

Stalin tried that 75 years ago, now the Russians are feeling the backlash from it all this time on.....

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"No place in our society and a security issue not required to be a practising muslim or citizen of this country

So are you saying the the United Kingdom has an 'official' religion?

Because it is in the main Christian....doesn't make it a Christian country."

The UK does have an official religion, it is the Church of England.

The monarch is the head of our official religion and the cross that represents that religion is on the to of the crown that surmounts the royal coat of arms.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

Yeah great, ban them outright ..............

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.... and let's all go down the path of removing freedom of choice over what we wear.

Then a few other folk can come up with what clothing they would like to ban. It might start with hoodies and baseball caps.... and end somewhere like 6 inch heels, pvc, skirts with hems too high... just because it's not what THEY want people to wear.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The only time women wearing burkas should remove them is to momentarily affirm their identity. ie. Passport Control, Schools, government offices, banks. If the wearer is in a public-facing job then the burka should be removed.

I'm sure Allah will understand.

Face-to-face teachers who wear them cannot communicate with their pupils as effective as those that don't wear them as intonation is often not enough to get one's message across. We need to study facial expression in order to understand what some people are trying to say.

The difference between east and west cultures is that in the Middle East the burka has been worn for so long that it is an everyday norm to interact with people who wear them. In the West, we simply do not have a culture where one's face is required to be covered at all times. It is alien to us and in many ways the burka introduces a sense of mistrust in the person wearing it as our association with highwaymen, robbers, burglars etc who wore face masks to detract value from us is reaffirmed on a subconscious level when confronted with someone wearing a burka.

If they want to wear them in muslim schools and muslim places of worship then that's up to them. I don't support a blanket ban on them but I do support a ban in the aforementioned areas.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

Here is the speech of Geert Wilders, Chairman, Party for Freedom, the Netherlands , at the Four Seasons, New York , introducing an Alliance of Patriots and announcing the Facing Jihad Conference in Jerusalem .

There is much in it that is disturbing, mainly because it describes what is happening in our country. The growth of the wearing of the Burka is just one symptom of the underlying truths in the statements made in it.

Dear friends,

Thank you very much for inviting me.

I come to America with a mission. All is not well in the old world. There is a tremendous danger looming, and it is very difficult to be optimistic. We might be in the final stages of the Islamization of Europe. This not only is a clear and present danger to the future of Europe itself, it is a threat to America and the sheer survival of the West. The United States as the last bastion of Western civilization, facing an Islamic Europe.

First I will describe the situation on the ground in Europe . Then, I will say a few things about Islam. To close I will tell you about a meeting in Jerusalem .

The Europe you know is changing.

You have probably seen the landmarks. But in all of these cities, sometimes a few blocks away from your tourist destination, there is another world. It is the world of the parallel society created by Muslim mass-migration.

All throughout Europe a new reality is rising: entire Muslim neighborhoods where very few indigenous people reside or are even seen. And if they are, they might regret it. This goes for the police as well. It's the world of head scarves, where women walk around in figure-less tents, with baby strollers and a group of children. Their husbands, or slaveholders if you prefer, walk three steps ahead. With mosques on many street corners. The shops have signs you and I cannot read. You will be hard-pressed to find any economic activity.. These are Muslim ghettos controlled by religious fanatics. These are Muslim neighborhoods, and they are mushrooming in every city across Europe . These are the building-blocks for territorial control of increasingly larger portions of Europe , street by street, neighborhood by neighborhood, city by city.

There are now thousands of mosques throughout Europe . With larger congregations than there are in churches. And in every European city there are plans to build super-mosques that will dwarf every church in the region. Clearly, the signal is: we rule.

Many European cities are already one-quarter Muslim: just take Amsterdam , Marseilles and Mal-mo in Sweden . In many cities the majority of the under-18 population is Muslim. Paris is now surrounded by a ring of Muslim neighborhoods. Mohamed is the most popular name among boys in many cities.

In some elementary schools in Amsterdam the farm can no longer be mentioned, because that would also mean mentioning the pig, and that would be an insult to Muslims.

Many state schools in Belgium and Denmark only serve halal food to all pupils. In once-tolerant Amsterdam gays are beaten up almost exclusively by Muslims. Non-Muslim women routinely hear 'whore, whore'. Satellite dishes are not pointed to local TV stations, but to stations in the country of origin.

In France school teachers are advised to avoid authors deemed offensive to Muslims, including Voltaire and Diderot; the same is increasingly true of Darwin . The history of the Holocaust can no longer be taught because of Muslim sensitivity.

In England sharia courts are now officially part of the British legal system. Many neighborhoods in France are no-go areas for women without head scarves. Last week a man almost died after being beaten up by Muslims in Brussels , because he was drinking during the Ramadan.

Jews are fleeing France in record numbers, on the run for the worst wave of anti-Antisemitism since World War II. French is now commonly spoken on the streets of Tel Aviv and Netanya, Israel. I could go on forever with stories like this. Stories about Islamization.

A total of fifty-four million Muslims now live in Europe . San Diego University recently calculated that a staggering 25 percent of the population in Europe will be Muslim just 12 years from now. Bernhard Lewis has predicted a Muslim majority by the end of this century.

Now these are just numbers. And the numbers would not be threatening if the Muslim-immigrants had a strong desire to assimilate. But there are few signs of that. The Pew Research Center reported that half of French Muslims see their loyalty to Islam as greater than their loyalty to France . One-third of French Muslims do not object to suicide attacks. The British Centre for Social Cohesion reported that one-third of British Muslim students are in favor of a worldwide caliphate. Muslims demand what they call 'respect'. And this is how we give them respect. We have Muslim official state holidays.

The Christian-Democratic attorney general is willing to accept sharia in the Netherlands if there is a Muslim majority. We have cabinet members with passports from Morocco and Turkey .

Muslim demands are supported by unlawful behavior, ranging from petty crimes and random violence, for example against ambulance workers and bus drivers, to small-scale riots. Paris has seen its uprising in the low-income suburbs, the banlieus. I call the perpetrators 'settlers'. Because that is what they are. They do not come to integrate into our societies; they come to integrate our society into their Dar-al-Islam. Therefore, they are settlers.

Much of this street violence I mentioned is directed exclusively against non-Muslims, forcing many native people to leave their neighborhoods, their cities, their countries. Moreover, Muslims are now a swing vote not to be ignored.

The second thing you need to know is the importance of Mohamed the prophet. His behavior is an example to all Muslims and cannot be criticized. Now, if Mohamed had been a man of peace, let us say like Gandhi and Mother Theresa wrapped in one, there would be no problem. But Mohamed was a warlord, a mass murderer, a pedophile, and had several marriages - at the same time. Islamic tradition tells us how he fought in battles, how he had his enemies murdered and even had prisoners of war executed. Mohamed himself slaughtered the Jewish tribe of Banu Qurayza. If it is good for Islam, it is good. If it is bad for Islam, it is bad.

Let no one fool you about Islam being a religion. Sure, it has a god, and a here-after, and 72 virgins. But in its essence Islam is a political ideology. It is a system that lays down detailed rules for society and the life of every person. Islam wants to dictate every aspect of life. Islam means 'submission'. Islam is not compatible with freedom and democracy, because what it strives for is sharia. If you want to compare Islam to anything, compare it to communism or national-socialism, these are all totalitarian ideologies.

Now you know why Winston Churchill called Islam 'the most retrograde force in the world', and why he compared Mein Kampf to the Quran. The public has wholeheartedly accepted the Palestinian narrative, and sees Israel as the aggressor. I have lived in this country and visited it dozens of times. I support Israel . First, because it is the Jewish homeland after two thousand years of exile up to and including Auschwitz, second because it is a democracy, and third because Israel is our first line of defense.

This tiny country is situated on the fault line of jihad, frustrating Islam's territorial advance. Israel is facing the front lines of jihad, like Kashmir, Kosovo, the Philippines , Southern Thailand, Dar-fur in Sudan , Lebanon , and Ac-eh in Indonesia . Israel is simply in the way. The same way West-Berlin was during the Cold War.

The war against Israel is not a war against Israel . It is a war against the West. It is jihad. Israel is simply receiving the blows that are meant for all of us. If there would have been no Israel , Islamic imperialism would have found other venues to release its energy and its desire for conquest. Thanks to Israeli parents who send their children to the army and lay awake at night, parents in Europe and America can sleep well and dream, unaware of the dangers looming.

Many in Europe argue in favor of abandoning Israel in order to address the grievances of our Muslim minorities. But if Israel were, God forbid, to go down, it would not bring any solace to the West It would not mean our Muslim minorities would all of a sudden change their behavior, and accept our values. On the contrary, the end of Israel would give enormous encouragement to the forces of Islam. They would, and rightly so, see the demise of Israel as proof that the West is weak, and doomed. The end of Israel would not mean the end of our problems with Islam, but only the beginning. It would mean the start of the final battle for world domination. If they can get Israel , they can get everything. So-called journalists volunteer to label any and all critics of Islamization as a 'right-wing extremists' or 'racists'. In my country, the Netherlands , 60 percent of the population now sees the mass immigration of Muslims as the number one policy mistake since World War II. And another 60 percent sees Islam as the biggest threat. Yet there is a danger greater danger than terrorist attacks, the scenario of America as the last man standing. The lights may go out in Europe faster than you can imagine. An Islamic Europe means a Europe without freedom and democracy, an economic wasteland, an intellectual nightmare, and a loss of military might for America - as its allies will turn into enemies, enemies with atomic bombs. With an Islamic Europe, it would be up to America alone to preserve the heritage of Rome , Athens and Jerusalem .

Dear friends, liberty is the most precious of gifts. My generation never had to fight for this freedom, it was offered to us on a silver platter, by people who fought for it with their lives. All throughout Europe , American cemeteries remind us of the young boys who never made it home, and whose memory we cherish. My generation does not own this freedom; we are merely its custodians. We can only hand over this hard won liberty to Europe's children in the same state in which it was offered to us. We cannot strike a deal with mullahs and imams. Future generations would never forgive us. We cannot squander our liberties. We simply do not have the right to do so.

We have to take the necessary action now to stop this Islamic stupidity from destroying the free world that we know.

End of speach.

There is much in this speech that I do not like, because it has the style and smell of religious bigotry. However I cant deny the basic message nor the fact that we need to stop the spread of Islamic fundamentalism and banning the Burk seems a good place to start. Unless we are happy living in an Islamic society.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Personally I find them intimidating

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton


"Here is the speech of Geert Wilders, Chairman, Party for Freedom, the Netherlands , at the Four Seasons, New York , introducing an Alliance of Patriots and announcing the Facing Jihad Conference in Jerusalem .

There is much in it that is disturbing, mainly because it describes what is happening in our country. The growth of the wearing of the Burka is just one symptom of the underlying truths in the statements made in it.

Dear friends,

Thank you very much for inviting me.

I come to America with a mission. All is not well in the old world. There is a tremendous danger looming, and it is very difficult to be optimistic. We might be in the final stages of the Islamization of Europe. This not only is a clear and present danger to the future of Europe itself, it is a threat to America and the sheer survival of the West. The United States as the last bastion of Western civilization, facing an Islamic Europe.

First I will describe the situation on the ground in Europe . Then, I will say a few things about Islam. To close I will tell you about a meeting in Jerusalem .

The Europe you know is changing.

You have probably seen the landmarks. But in all of these cities, sometimes a few blocks away from your tourist destination, there is another world. It is the world of the parallel society created by Muslim mass-migration.

All throughout Europe a new reality is rising: entire Muslim neighborhoods where very few indigenous people reside or are even seen. And if they are, they might regret it. This goes for the police as well. It's the world of head scarves, where women walk around in figure-less tents, with baby strollers and a group of children. Their husbands, or slaveholders if you prefer, walk three steps ahead. With mosques on many street corners. The shops have signs you and I cannot read. You will be hard-pressed to find any economic activity.. These are Muslim ghettos controlled by religious fanatics. These are Muslim neighborhoods, and they are mushrooming in every city across Europe . These are the building-blocks for territorial control of increasingly larger portions of Europe , street by street, neighborhood by neighborhood, city by city.

There are now thousands of mosques throughout Europe . With larger congregations than there are in churches. And in every European city there are plans to build super-mosques that will dwarf every church in the region. Clearly, the signal is: we rule.

Many European cities are already one-quarter Muslim: just take Amsterdam , Marseilles and Mal-mo in Sweden . In many cities the majority of the under-18 population is Muslim. Paris is now surrounded by a ring of Muslim neighborhoods. Mohamed is the most popular name among boys in many cities.

In some elementary schools in Amsterdam the farm can no longer be mentioned, because that would also mean mentioning the pig, and that would be an insult to Muslims.

Many state schools in Belgium and Denmark only serve halal food to all pupils. In once-tolerant Amsterdam gays are beaten up almost exclusively by Muslims. Non-Muslim women routinely hear 'whore, whore'. Satellite dishes are not pointed to local TV stations, but to stations in the country of origin.

In France school teachers are advised to avoid authors deemed offensive to Muslims, including Voltaire and Diderot; the same is increasingly true of Darwin . The history of the Holocaust can no longer be taught because of Muslim sensitivity.

In England sharia courts are now officially part of the British legal system. Many neighborhoods in France are no-go areas for women without head scarves. Last week a man almost died after being beaten up by Muslims in Brussels , because he was drinking during the Ramadan.

Jews are fleeing France in record numbers, on the run for the worst wave of anti-Antisemitism since World War II. French is now commonly spoken on the streets of Tel Aviv and Netanya, Israel. I could go on forever with stories like this. Stories about Islamization.

A total of fifty-four million Muslims now live in Europe . San Diego University recently calculated that a staggering 25 percent of the population in Europe will be Muslim just 12 years from now. Bernhard Lewis has predicted a Muslim majority by the end of this century.

Now these are just numbers. And the numbers would not be threatening if the Muslim-immigrants had a strong desire to assimilate. But there are few signs of that. The Pew Research Center reported that half of French Muslims see their loyalty to Islam as greater than their loyalty to France . One-third of French Muslims do not object to suicide attacks. The British Centre for Social Cohesion reported that one-third of British Muslim students are in favor of a worldwide caliphate. Muslims demand what they call 'respect'. And this is how we give them respect. We have Muslim official state holidays.

The Christian-Democratic attorney general is willing to accept sharia in the Netherlands if there is a Muslim majority. We have cabinet members with passports from Morocco and Turkey .

Muslim demands are supported by unlawful behavior, ranging from petty crimes and random violence, for example against ambulance workers and bus drivers, to small-scale riots. Paris has seen its uprising in the low-income suburbs, the banlieus. I call the perpetrators 'settlers'. Because that is what they are. They do not come to integrate into our societies; they come to integrate our society into their Dar-al-Islam. Therefore, they are settlers.

Much of this street violence I mentioned is directed exclusively against non-Muslims, forcing many native people to leave their neighborhoods, their cities, their countries. Moreover, Muslims are now a swing vote not to be ignored.

The second thing you need to know is the importance of Mohamed the prophet. His behavior is an example to all Muslims and cannot be criticized. Now, if Mohamed had been a man of peace, let us say like Gandhi and Mother Theresa wrapped in one, there would be no problem. But Mohamed was a warlord, a mass murderer, a pedophile, and had several marriages - at the same time. Islamic tradition tells us how he fought in battles, how he had his enemies murdered and even had prisoners of war executed. Mohamed himself slaughtered the Jewish tribe of Banu Qurayza. If it is good for Islam, it is good. If it is bad for Islam, it is bad.

Let no one fool you about Islam being a religion. Sure, it has a god, and a here-after, and 72 virgins. But in its essence Islam is a political ideology. It is a system that lays down detailed rules for society and the life of every person. Islam wants to dictate every aspect of life. Islam means 'submission'. Islam is not compatible with freedom and democracy, because what it strives for is sharia. If you want to compare Islam to anything, compare it to communism or national-socialism, these are all totalitarian ideologies.

Now you know why Winston Churchill called Islam 'the most retrograde force in the world', and why he compared Mein Kampf to the Quran. The public has wholeheartedly accepted the Palestinian narrative, and sees Israel as the aggressor. I have lived in this country and visited it dozens of times. I support Israel . First, because it is the Jewish homeland after two thousand years of exile up to and including Auschwitz, second because it is a democracy, and third because Israel is our first line of defense.

This tiny country is situated on the fault line of jihad, frustrating Islam's territorial advance. Israel is facing the front lines of jihad, like Kashmir, Kosovo, the Philippines , Southern Thailand, Dar-fur in Sudan , Lebanon , and Ac-eh in Indonesia . Israel is simply in the way. The same way West-Berlin was during the Cold War.

The war against Israel is not a war against Israel . It is a war against the West. It is jihad. Israel is simply receiving the blows that are meant for all of us. If there would have been no Israel , Islamic imperialism would have found other venues to release its energy and its desire for conquest. Thanks to Israeli parents who send their children to the army and lay awake at night, parents in Europe and America can sleep well and dream, unaware of the dangers looming.

Many in Europe argue in favor of abandoning Israel in order to address the grievances of our Muslim minorities. But if Israel were, God forbid, to go down, it would not bring any solace to the West It would not mean our Muslim minorities would all of a sudden change their behavior, and accept our values. On the contrary, the end of Israel would give enormous encouragement to the forces of Islam. They would, and rightly so, see the demise of Israel as proof that the West is weak, and doomed. The end of Israel would not mean the end of our problems with Islam, but only the beginning. It would mean the start of the final battle for world domination. If they can get Israel , they can get everything. So-called journalists volunteer to label any and all critics of Islamization as a 'right-wing extremists' or 'racists'. In my country, the Netherlands , 60 percent of the population now sees the mass immigration of Muslims as the number one policy mistake since World War II. And another 60 percent sees Islam as the biggest threat. Yet there is a danger greater danger than terrorist attacks, the scenario of America as the last man standing. The lights may go out in Europe faster than you can imagine. An Islamic Europe means a Europe without freedom and democracy, an economic wasteland, an intellectual nightmare, and a loss of military might for America - as its allies will turn into enemies, enemies with atomic bombs. With an Islamic Europe, it would be up to America alone to preserve the heritage of Rome , Athens and Jerusalem .

Dear friends, liberty is the most precious of gifts. My generation never had to fight for this freedom, it was offered to us on a silver platter, by people who fought for it with their lives. All throughout Europe , American cemeteries remind us of the young boys who never made it home, and whose memory we cherish. My generation does not own this freedom; we are merely its custodians. We can only hand over this hard won liberty to Europe's children in the same state in which it was offered to us. We cannot strike a deal with mullahs and imams. Future generations would never forgive us. We cannot squander our liberties. We simply do not have the right to do so.

We have to take the necessary action now to stop this Islamic stupidity from destroying the free world that we know.

End of speach.

There is much in this speech that I do not like, because it has the style and smell of religious bigotry. However I cant deny the basic message nor the fact that we need to stop the spread of Islamic fundamentalism and banning the Burk seems a good place to start. Unless we are happy living in an Islamic society.

"

my god that sounds very like the rivers of blood speech

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

common sense to ban them with what is going on around the world they make a lot of people uneasy and the ladys do have achoice of going somewhere where they are ok

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"common sense to ban them with what is going on around the world they make a lot of people uneasy and the ladys do have achoice of going somewhere where they are ok"

If that is common sense then we may as well give up now.... we are fucked!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Fucked and not in a good way

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"common sense to ban them with what is going on around the world they make a lot of people uneasy and the ladys do have achoice of going somewhere where they are ok"

So what about the Britsh born muslim women.....do they have the choice to go somewhere else and wear them?

There is a very common misconception that it is only immigrants that choose to wear the burkha, remember we have had a muslim popualtion that has been growing since the 60's when the original immigrants came over from Pakistan, India and Yemen.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"The only time women wearing burkas should remove them is to momentarily affirm their identity. ie. Passport Control, Schools, government offices, banks. If the wearer is in a public-facing job then the burka should be removed.

I'm sure Allah will understand.

Face-to-face teachers who wear them cannot communicate with their pupils as effective as those that don't wear them as intonation is often not enough to get one's message across. We need to study facial expression in order to understand what some people are trying to say.

The difference between east and west cultures is that in the Middle East the burka has been worn for so long that it is an everyday norm to interact with people who wear them. In the West, we simply do not have a culture where one's face is required to be covered at all times. It is alien to us and in many ways the burka introduces a sense of mistrust in the person wearing it as our association with highwaymen, robbers, burglars etc who wore face masks to detract value from us is reaffirmed on a subconscious level when confronted with someone wearing a burka.

If they want to wear them in muslim schools and muslim places of worship then that's up to them. I don't support a blanket ban on them but I do support a ban in the aforementioned areas."

I totally agree, women teachers should not be allowed to wear burkhas outside of single faith muslim schools.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

actually... something you might want to know about that lovely french bill....

technically because france is "secular" the actual bill covers all religious stuff to wear...

so if they wanted to act this out,there is talk of muslim people going after jewish stars of david and skull caps or for example catholic crosses and rosery beads under the same law.....

they may pass this.... but it may well be unenforceable...

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *oe_Steve_NWestCouple
over a year ago

Bolton

Having lived more than a few years in the Middle East and i can say without a doubt you do as they do or you will land quite rightly in my eyes in very deep trouble.

However i dont feel we can ban the wearing of the burka just cos we dont like the look of it, however i would agree that anyone in a position to request its removal such as police ect should be free to do so.

Thin end of the wedge once we ban things just cos we dont like the look of it.

Steve

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think western politicians need to consult with Muslim counterparts with a view to Western civilians being protected from laws that we consider arcane. I'd be all in favour of the 'when in Rome' approach so long as they live by that same token when visiting our countries. But they don't, do they? They want it both ways: Muslim Law adhered to and enforced for everybody wherever a Muslim is present.

The speech posted above does have a lot of truths in it but that kind of speech can never be delivered without running the risk of being labelled a racist, and that will continue to happen until such time that the threat becomes a very real one.

I've long held the belief that this planet will endure another World War, but that it will be far more ferocious than the previous two because what will be at stake is our very right to live. Muslim fundamentalism supports the deaths of non-Muslims as a way of cleansing the populace and removing the threat of anyone with anti-Muslim views. The Third World War will be between Islam and everybody else. And I hope I am long gone when it happens, unfortunately, I think my children will see it, and their children will fight it.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"No place in our society and a security issue not required to be a practising muslim or citizen of this country

So are you saying the the United Kingdom has an 'official' religion?

Because it is in the main Christian....doesn't make it a Christian country.

The UK does have an official religion, it is the Church of England.

The monarch is the head of our official religion and the cross that represents that religion is on the to of the crown that surmounts the royal coat of arms."

Sorry but again you are wrong, Christianity is the established religion of the United Kingdom, represented in the main by the Church of England (Anglican) and the Church of Scotland (Presbyterian)....this does not make it the 'official' religion of the United Kingdom.

There is no 'official' religion within these isles and there never has been since Henry V.

The Queen is simply the Supreme Governor of the established church in England, the 'Act of Settlement' of 1701 decreed that the Monarch of the United KIngdom shall always join in communion with the Church of England.

So Christianity and to be precise, the Church of England is the official religion of the Monarchy of the UNited KIngdom....but not the subjects of the Monarchy, world of difference in law here.

In law there is a 'Freedom of Religion' on these isles, and there has been for centuries.

This law protects the population of these isles to join religions of their choosing, to establish their own religions, or to abstain from religion.

Easy to mix up tradition with law, but the two do not overlap.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Having lived more than a few years in the Middle East and i can say without a doubt you do as they do or you will land quite rightly in my eyes in very deep trouble.

However i dont feel we can ban the wearing of the burka just cos we dont like the look of it, however i would agree that anyone in a position to request its removal such as police ect should be free to do so.

Thin end of the wedge once we ban things just cos we dont like the look of it.

Steve "

That sums up my feelings on it, remove them for banks etc otherwise not bothered.

I'm not over keen on them, but they probably feel the same way about my jeans.

I seem to have in my mind that I am sure I read or saw that the burka was made because of the heat or something like that, did I dream that????

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

GRRRRRR the Queen is German...SEND HER BACK!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton


"GRRRRRR the Queen is German...SEND HER BACK! "

the royal family already had contingency plans to go back to germany if england had started to fall in the second world war

so no need to send them anywhere , they have themselves well and truly covered

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This post has gone mad I tells ya...mad

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville

whats wrong with the burka??!!!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ig badMan
over a year ago

Up North :-)


"whats wrong with the burka??!!! "

There's no hole for a cock to co through thats whats wrong with them!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman
over a year ago

evesham


"GRRRRRR the Queen is German...SEND HER BACK! "

uh oh!! we had a thread on here that went of thread when someone said that last time

i personally am not against people wearing burkka's if it is in response to their beliefs, whether or not islam says they should wear it or not is another issue.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton


"GRRRRRR the Queen is German...SEND HER BACK!

uh oh!! we had a thread on here that went of thread when someone said that last time

i personally am not against people wearing burkka's if it is in response to their beliefs, whether or not islam says they should wear it or not is another issue."

whats that got to do with the queen ?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman
over a year ago

evesham


"GRRRRRR the Queen is German...SEND HER BACK!

uh oh!! we had a thread on here that went of thread when someone said that last time

i personally am not against people wearing burkka's if it is in response to their beliefs, whether or not islam says they should wear it or not is another issue.

whats that got to do with the queen ?"

whats what got to do with the Queen??

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton


"GRRRRRR the Queen is German...SEND HER BACK!

uh oh!! we had a thread on here that went of thread when someone said that last time

i personally am not against people wearing burkka's if it is in response to their beliefs, whether or not islam says they should wear it or not is another issue.

whats that got to do with the queen ?

whats what got to do with the Queen??"

sorry i thought we were going off thread

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"GRRRRRR the Queen is German...SEND HER BACK!

the royal family already had contingency plans to go back to germany if england had started to fall in the second world war

so no need to send them anywhere , they have themselves well and truly covered"

Er... if Hitler had won WW2 do you seriously think he'd have left the Royal Family in situ in London? He'd have shifted them back to Germany as hostages on the first day of victory. These sorts of high-powered families/individuals HAVE to make contingency plans for every possible scenario they may find themselves in that ordinary people like us simply don't know the intricacies of.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

Throwing links half way down a post that isn't explained looks like there is a hidden agenda, and a sinister one at that...so I have removed it.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The Belgians tried to ban the Burkha last year....the European Court of Human Rights overturned the ban."

We should ban them . if the EU tries to get shirty we should leave the EU. We get nothing from them with us being one of the european super powers. All the EU is to britain is a burden. nothing more nothing less.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

What if they say on banning that we have to ban sexy shoes too?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Having lived more than a few years in the Middle East and i can say without a doubt you do as they do or you will land quite rightly in my eyes in very deep trouble.

However i dont feel we can ban the wearing of the burka just cos we dont like the look of it, however i would agree that anyone in a position to request its removal such as police ect should be free to do so.

Thin end of the wedge once we ban things just cos we dont like the look of it.

Steve

That sums up my feelings on it, remove them for banks etc otherwise not bothered.

I'm not over keen on them, but they probably feel the same way about my jeans.

I seem to have in my mind that I am sure I read or saw that the burka was made because of the heat or something like that, did I dream that????"

So its not ok to have your face covered in a bank for security rreasons. yet little mrs smith who runs the ice cream parlour can have someone enter her shop not knowing what or who they are???

If there not allowed in banks. Shopping centres or any other place they shouldnt be allowed in any. you cant twist the rules to try and stand on the side of political correctness.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"What if they say on banning that we have to ban sexy shoes too? "

Do sexy shoes hide your asppearence?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"What if they say on banning that we have to ban sexy shoes too?

Do sexy shoes hide your asppearence?"

No, but it is something someone likes to wear. What if these women want to wear the it?

I think there should be the same rules as shops etc have with hats and hoodies , but to ban people from wearing it when walking the streets is the same as banning people for wearing any clothes.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm assuming the people who see "terrorist" each time they see a woman in a burka also expect to see a thief in a stripey black and white shirt carrying a bag with "swag" written on it!!

Oh if only life were so simple.

Personally I don't like the burka, there are a lot of things I don't like, it doesn't mean they should be banned.

I wouldn't want to be treated by a doctor wearing one, or have my children taught by someone wearing one, and if it's a rule you can't have your face covered entering a bank etc then it should be applicable to all.

As Jane said the 7/7 bombers wore western clothes, one was West Indian and all were men - not a burka in sight.

The person you should worry about you'll never see coming...and it wont be because they're hidden beneath a burka!!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"What if they say on banning that we have to ban sexy shoes too?

Do sexy shoes hide your asppearence?"

Long floppy hair does... so does...

a hat and scarf in winter... goth make-up... oowww how about big sunglasses.

Ban floppy hair!

Ban hats and scarfs!

Ban goth make-up!

Ban big sunglasses!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ban England knickers so we can see polos ass xx

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"Ban England knickers so we can see polos ass xx "

Bubbles! Ban bubble bath!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *andcCouple
over a year ago

London and Cheshire


"thats the arguement of the british intellegence services how can you tell if its not a terrorist dressed up in them, its like muslims and the turban and our motorcycle law, "

They are not muslims they are Sikhs and as a biker I have yet to see a turban wearing biker! But given the choice of turban or helmet I'll take the helmet thanks!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"What if they say on banning that we have to ban sexy shoes too?

Do sexy shoes hide your asppearence?

Long floppy hair does... so does...

a hat and scarf in winter... goth make-up... oowww how about big sunglasses.

Ban floppy hair!

Ban hats and scarfs!

Ban goth make-up!

Ban big sunglasses! "

Surely any make up can hide peoples appearances.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Ban England knickers so we can see polos ass xx

Bubbles! Ban bubble bath! "

Christ ya really wanna see me naked??

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If people want to wear burqas day to day for religious reasons, fair enough, but for driving cars and passing through security measures, they should be removed. As for passports, the same principle applies to wearing sunglasses, baseball caps, hoods, comedy moustaches, or any other distractions, burqas shouldn't be any different."

burkas are not allowed to be worn on pass port or driving licence photos, tho they are allowed to be worn while driving or passing thro customs, but any woman who goes thro customs wearing a burka are taken into a private room and checked against their photo, i also agree that they have no place in modern society but for different reasons to many on here, i personally think they are just holding muslin women back and keeping them in the dark ages, there is nothing in the muslin religion that states they have to be worn only that womens heads are covered, full burkas are worn on the request of their husband, which is why you dont see young, un married muslims wearing them, which to me shows they are not wanted by muslim women or they would wear them by choice, but wearing a full face burka does not give women the rights to skip between counties unnoticed like a lot of people seem to think it does, i know we like in a shit country but with so many terroists about even our countries not that daft they going to let people thro wearing burkas un checked

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Ban England knickers so we can see polos ass xx

Bubbles! Ban bubble bath!

Christ ya really wanna see me naked?? "

Good point.

Don't ban bubble bath.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"What if they say on banning that we have to ban sexy shoes too?

Do sexy shoes hide your asppearence?

Long floppy hair does... so does...

a hat and scarf in winter... goth make-up... oowww how about big sunglasses.

Ban floppy hair!

Ban hats and scarfs!

Ban goth make-up!

Ban big sunglasses!

Surely any make up can hide peoples appearances."

Good point!

Ban ALL make-up!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

the french have got some balls. I can't see them letter europe telling them what to do. Remember the south pacific nuclear tests and rainbow warrior. There is an advantage to being arrogant, the french symbol isn't a cock for nothing.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The Belgians tried to ban the Burkha last year....the European Court of Human Rights overturned the ban."

Hi all

H. asked me to give an answer to this OP, as I watch German and French news due to my business and see that is going on in various European countries.

The European Court can make judgements, but in the end effect it is the country's own decision to act on these judgements. For example the European Court ruled that the ban on Minarets in Switzerland was illegal; however the Swiss government pointed out that they had not banned Mosques nor banned Islam, but just the building of towers (Minarets).

Is it not the decision of each government to do, what the majority of the inhabitants want ? In case of France and Belgium the majority feel insecure with Burkhas been worn in trains, trams, buses and public places; this does not mean they are all going on an anti Islamic rant, but just want to feel safe and know who is standing next to them in a bus. D.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Ban England knickers so we can see polos ass xx

Bubbles! Ban bubble bath!

Christ ya really wanna see me naked??

Good point.

Don't ban bubble bath. "

Oi lol xx

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

when these people come to a foreign country they should take our ways and if that involves showing your face so be it,they can not be very good for driving in etc,as they must impare some vision.what have they got to hide anyway.only there religion says they must wear it.good on france for standing up to them,i personally hope britain follow suit asap.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"when these people come to a foreign country they should take our ways and if that involves showing your face so be it,they can not be very good for driving in etc,as they must impare some vision.what have they got to hide anyway.only there religion says they must wear it.good on france for standing up to them,i personally hope britain follow suit asap."

there religion doesnt state they have to wear it.

There is nothing write in islamic scriptures stating this to be the case.

If you went to live in some islamic country you have to adapt and accept there way of life. Is it to much for us to accept the same.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"when these people come to a foreign country they should take our ways and if that involves showing your face so be it,they can not be very good for driving in etc,as they must impare some vision.what have they got to hide anyway.only there religion says they must wear it.good on france for standing up to them,i personally hope britain follow suit asap.

there religion doesnt state they have to wear it.

There is nothing write in islamic scriptures stating this to be the case.

If you went to live in some islamic country you have to adapt and accept there way of life. Is it to much for us to accept the same."

You are right... we should stand up and be exemplars for the religious values of the country we live in....

Of course that puts and end to swinging doesn't it!

Sex outside of wedlock..... oh no no no no!

And as for those promiscuous clothes… they can go straight in the dustbin!

Be careful what you wish for.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"when these people come to a foreign country they should take our ways and if that involves showing your face so be it,they can not be very good for driving in etc,as they must impare some vision.what have they got to hide anyway.only there religion says they must wear it.good on france for standing up to them,i personally hope britain follow suit asap.

there religion doesnt state they have to wear it.

There is nothing write in islamic scriptures stating this to be the case.

If you went to live in some islamic country you have to adapt and accept there way of life. Is it to much for us to accept the same.

You are right... we should stand up and be exemplars for the religious values of the country we live in....

Of course that puts and end to swinging doesn't it!

Sex outside of wedlock..... oh no no no no!

And as for those promiscuous clothes… they can go straight in the dustbin!

Be careful what you wish for."

Which religion would that be??? Catholic christian atheist?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"when these people come to a foreign country they should take our ways and if that involves showing your face so be it,they can not be very good for driving in etc,as they must impare some vision.what have they got to hide anyway.only there religion says they must wear it.good on france for standing up to them,i personally hope britain follow suit asap.

there religion doesnt state they have to wear it.

There is nothing write in islamic scriptures stating this to be the case.

If you went to live in some islamic country you have to adapt and accept there way of life. Is it to much for us to accept the same.

You are right... we should stand up and be exemplars for the religious values of the country we live in....

Of course that puts and end to swinging doesn't it!

Sex outside of wedlock..... oh no no no no!

And as for those promiscuous clothes… they can go straight in the dustbin!

Be careful what you wish for.

Which religion would that be??? Catholic christian atheist?

"

Surely you know what religion the country you live in is.... if you don't how the hell do you expect Johnny Foreigner to know and abide by the rules of it.

btw.... the UK Census shows 72% identify as Christians

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"when these people come to a foreign country they should take our ways and if that involves showing your face so be it,they can not be very good for driving in etc,as they must impare some vision.what have they got to hide anyway.only there religion says they must wear it.good on france for standing up to them,i personally hope britain follow suit asap.

there religion doesnt state they have to wear it.

There is nothing write in islamic scriptures stating this to be the case.

If you went to live in some islamic country you have to adapt and accept there way of life. Is it to much for us to accept the same.

You are right... we should stand up and be exemplars for the religious values of the country we live in....

Of course that puts and end to swinging doesn't it!

Sex outside of wedlock..... oh no no no no!

And as for those promiscuous clothes… they can go straight in the dustbin!

Be careful what you wish for."

Oh Polo!!!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Full ban - no, not unless your going to ban all other forms of full face attire like helmets and balaclava's.

thats no the same..helmets and balaclava's

can be took off..yea i think they should

be banned if they want 2 live in our

country then live like us simple xx

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *anndelCouple
over a year ago

farnborough hants

When in Rome and all that. Shops state no hoodies or helmets to be worn so the same should apply.

From a security angle if nothing else they should be banned, what people wear in their own homes is up to them but in public its a different matter.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"Full ban - no, not unless your going to ban all other forms of full face attire like helmets and balaclava's.

thats no the same..helmets and balaclava's

can be took off..yea i think they should

be banned if they want 2 live in our

country then live like us simple xx "

Live like us... does that mean get pissed, have teenagers up the duff before they leave school and go on the Jermey Kyle show when the benefits won't cover a the next holiday funds.

Who exactly is 'us'..... because there are an awful lot of 'us' types out there who wouldn't accociate you or I with living to their moral code.

Yeah it's ok to say 'stop them doing that I don't like it'...... just wait until it's something you choose to do or wear and someone other bunch of 'us' starts wanting to change the law to ban you from choosing.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The problem of living in a free society is that sometimes people do things you dont like.

The more things that are banned the less freedom for the rest of us, its a slippery slope and imho we are half way down the slide already

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don't see how wanting to preserve one's way of life is racist. Why should the way I am comfortable living, ie. in a Western democratic society, be superceded by another type of culture just because someone else wishes it so. Would I be wrong to force those cultures different from my own to accede to my way of living? I'm sure plenty would argue that I would be, so how am I wrong for wanting my own culture protected from those that come here to alter it by stealth, hidden agendas and a slow gradual infiltration process.

I will not stand for being told 'When in Rome' if I can't say in return 'Ok then, but When in England' and not be called a racist.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Full ban - no, not unless your going to ban all other forms of full face attire like helmets and balaclava's.

thats no the same..helmets and balaclava's

can be took off..yea i think they should

be banned if they want 2 live in our

country then live like us simple xx

Live like us... does that mean get pissed, have teenagers up the duff before they leave school and go on the Jermey Kyle show when the benefits won't cover a the next holiday funds.

Who exactly is 'us'..... because there are an awful lot of 'us' types out there who wouldn't accociate you or I with living to their moral code.

Yeah it's ok to say 'stop them doing that I don't like it'...... just wait until it's something you choose to do or wear and someone other bunch of 'us' starts wanting to change the law to ban you from choosing."

not everyone gets pissed, or has

teenagers up the duff before they leave

school..i just ment in genral im

speaking for myself i dont dink nor

do i walk about with my head or face

coverd..fs when they even go 2 a

swimming pool it has 2 be emptyed of

guys xx

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"..fs when they even go 2 a

swimming pool it has 2 be emptyed of

guys xx"

Do white non-burka wearing women not also go to the pool when it is a women only session?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"..fs when they even go 2 a

swimming pool it has 2 be emptyed of

guys xx

Do white non-burka wearing women not also go to the pool when it is a women only session?"

there was even a pool that had to cover its windows so muslim women walking past didnt get offended, forget where it was but it was in the news recently

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *layfullsamMan
over a year ago

Solihull

I think if they banned burgers it might help with the problem of overweight obese people in this country

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *layfullsamMan
over a year ago

Solihull

oops burkas not burgers

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"oops burkas not burgers "

and burglers arent good either

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"..fs when they even go 2 a

swimming pool it has 2 be emptyed of

guys xx

Do white non-burka wearing women not also go to the pool when it is a women only session?"

It does happen Polo in other situations.....one instance was a mum and toddler group which only allowed Muslim women and children in.....there was another mum and toddler group in the same place on another day that was for everyone, whatever colour...so sometimes it is special treatment.

And before anyone shouts it is the media reporting the wrong facts.....I saw it with my own eyes.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *layfullsamMan
over a year ago

Solihull

or buglers unless you want a early morning get out of bed alarm

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"..fs when they even go 2 a

swimming pool it has 2 be emptyed of

guys xx

Do white non-burka wearing women not also go to the pool when it is a women only session?

It does happen Polo in other situations.....one instance was a mum and toddler group which only allowed Muslim women and children in.....there was another mum and toddler group in the same place on another day that was for everyone, whatever colour...so sometimes it is special treatment.

And before anyone shouts it is the media reporting the wrong facts.....I saw it with my own eyes."

I have no doubt it will happen in a 'few' places to meet the needs of the local community. But no swimming pool is going to do that for just one or two people, if they have enough to make it viable.... well then that's like any business isn't it.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

I am guessing there will have been more than two and people have paid for the time in the pool. I used to go to a session in a pool where they had hired the pool just for the group we were in.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *layfullsamMan
over a year ago

Solihull


"I am guessing there will have been more than two and people have paid for the time in the pool. I used to go to a session in a pool where they had hired the pool just for the group we were in."
they would definately need at least two people as one would have to rescue the other off the bottom of the pool when the burka fills with water and they sink

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"..fs when they even go 2 a

swimming pool it has 2 be emptyed of

guys xx

Do white non-burka wearing women not also go to the pool when it is a women only session?

It does happen Polo in other situations.....one instance was a mum and toddler group which only allowed Muslim women and children in.....there was another mum and toddler group in the same place on another day that was for everyone, whatever colour...so sometimes it is special treatment.

And before anyone shouts it is the media reporting the wrong facts.....I saw it with my own eyes.

I have no doubt it will happen in a 'few' places to meet the needs of the local community. But no swimming pool is going to do that for just one or two people, if they have enough to make it viable.... well then that's like any business isn't it."

no were in my statement did i say they

closed it for 1 or 2 ppl..have a nice

day all xxx

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *o DaddyMan
over a year ago

Worcestershire


"..fs when they even go 2 a

swimming pool it has 2 be emptyed of

guys xx

Do white non-burka wearing women not also go to the pool when it is a women only session?

there was even a pool that had to cover its windows so muslim women walking past didnt get offended, forget where it was but it was in the news recently"

it was in the west midlands,walsall area near wolverhampton.

the covering on the windows now has to remain all the time now and means that the non-muslims who use the swimming pool now have to swim in semi-darkness and miss out on all the natural light!.

talk about being priviliged eh?,one click of a muslim finger and our way of living is changed just to accomadate them and their beliefs.

thoroughly sickening!.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's bad. it is essentially taking away the right of a certain person to dress how they want.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman
over a year ago

evesham

its a tough one cos if the facilities refused to do anything they could force the communities into segregation - building their own facilities used only by muslims etc and then people would be annoyed at that, saying that they dont integrate themselves into the community etc

no simple answer i guess

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's bad. it is essentially taking away the right of a certain person to dress how they want."

Well if you take that viewpoint people should be able to walk around naked where ever they please. There has to be rules for society to exist.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 14/07/10 11:26:24]

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"I am guessing there will have been more than two and people have paid for the time in the pool. I used to go to a session in a pool where they had hired the pool just for the group we were in."

One pool I know of does an over 60's session, whilst most pools near me have adults only, ladies only and mums and toddlers. The only reason the other pool does an over 60's is because there is enough demand for it in the local area to make it viable.

Now, Spence Street pool on the other hand... well it's in the heart of an Asian community. The ratio of Asian to non-Asian who use the pool is about 10-1 (at a guess for when I have been in there)... and they have no special sessions for Muslim women.... which does suprise me.

If people turned up at a pool in their community and got turned away with "sorry you're white you can't come in" ... then I could understand them being miffed. But most of the people who complain about such things didn't want to go to the pool ... it's just something else to complain about.

Actually I should complain that my local pool has a 'women only' session..... 8pm-9pm on a Friday night (ffs).. are they trying to say if you need to go to a women only session you're a munter so won't have anything to do (or screw) on a Friday night!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"its a tough one cos if the facilities refused to do anything they could force the communities into segregation - building their own facilities used only by muslims etc and then people would be annoyed at that, saying that they dont integrate themselves into the community etc

no simple answer i guess"

Correct no simple answer, but I think this is a totally seperate argument to the burka.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"...soon there will be no christainity in this country we all be muslims or is that we are heading for ."

Are you really that surprised? Islam is a religion that actively encourages their followers to expand the territories ruled by Muslims at the expense of territories ruled by non-Muslims, in the aim to enforce Islamic rule. Whilst most Muslims don't take this in a literal sense, there will always be a vast majority, who interpret it in their own way.


"Security ban in certain sensative areas fully acceptable as is the wearing of helmets and balaclava's in such places as banks."

I totally agree! There's certain situations where religion is irrelevant, like when protecting the safety of others, or enforcing the law.

Anyway, if they wish to go outside, covered from head-to-toe in this heat, then fair enough!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *o DaddyMan
over a year ago

Worcestershire


"It's bad. it is essentially taking away the right of a certain person to dress how they want.

Well if you take that viewpoint people should be able to walk around naked where ever they please. There has to be rules for society to exist."

i see every now and then a guy appears on tv who does not want to wear clothes at all,he goes for walks round the country wearing only a rucksack on his back yet keeps getting arrested and locked up for offending public decency or some such silly law!.

whats all that about?,we are all born naked so no surprises in store,his penis is visible but not erect so who is offended?,why is he being denied the freedom of choice of going back to nature and i am wondering about his human rights,have they ever been considered at all?.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

ALL religions actively encourage the expansion of it's religion to other territories!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *layfullsamMan
over a year ago

Solihull

[Removed by poster at 14/07/10 11:57:54]

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

They had a discussion on This Morning today. They had done a survey before the discussion and after.

After the discussion which gave both sides of the argument, the survey ended up higher than before and came in at

89% yes to ban it 11% for no ban.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

To equate nakedness to a burka is little more than Jeremy Kyle level ignorance. Well done.

It is a ban on a headpiece that does, regardless of religious law, have religious significance. The nearest equivalent would be the banning of wearing a crucifix, or a turban, or any other quasi-religious item.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"To equate nakedness to a burka is little more than Jeremy Kyle level ignorance. Well done.

It is a ban on a headpiece that does, regardless of religious law, have religious significance. The nearest equivalent would be the banning of wearing a crucifix, or a turban, or any other quasi-religious item."

That isn't such a convincing argument either. A ban on a burka would be on security grounds - not religious ones. Neither a crucifix, nor a turban, obscures the wearer's face completely.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 14/07/10 12:14:22]

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Its religion that should be banned .. caused more wars and problems then anything else in the history of mankind.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 14/07/10 12:18:43]

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"Now, Spence Street pool on the other hand... well it's in the heart of an Asian community. The ratio of Asian to non-Asian who use the pool is about 10-1 (at a guess for when I have been in there)... and they have no special sessions for Muslim women.... which does surprise me."

Why should that surprise you? and before you answer turn your statement on its head and then ask yourself would you be surprised?

Just to help:

Most swimming pools are in areas where the ratio of WHITE to Asian/non white is about 10 to 1... do I need to continue such a racist statement?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *andcCouple
over a year ago

London and Cheshire

[Removed by poster at 14/07/10 12:23:08]

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *andcCouple
over a year ago

London and Cheshire


"Here is the speech of Geert Wilders, Chairman, Party for Freedom, the Netherlands , at the Four Seasons, New York , introducing an Alliance of Patriots and announcing the Facing Jihad Conference in Jerusalem .

There is much in it that is disturbing, mainly because it describes what is happening in our country. The growth of the wearing of the Burka is just one symptom of the underlying truths in the statements made in it.

Dear friends,

Thank you very much for inviting me.

I come to America with a mission. All is not well in the old world. There is a tremendous danger looming, and it is very difficult to be optimistic. We might be in the final stages of the Islamization of Europe. This not only is a clear and present danger to the future of Europe itself, it is a threat to America and the sheer survival of the West. The United States as the last bastion of Western civilization, facing an Islamic Europe.

First I will describe the situation on the ground in Europe . Then, I will say a few things about Islam. To close I will tell you about a meeting in Jerusalem .

The Europe you know is changing.

You have probably seen the landmarks. But in all of these cities, sometimes a few blocks away from your tourist destination, there is another world. It is the world of the parallel society created by Muslim mass-migration.

All throughout Europe a new reality is rising: entire Muslim neighborhoods where very few indigenous people reside or are even seen. And if they are, they might regret it. This goes for the police as well. It's the world of head scarves, where women walk around in figure-less tents, with baby strollers and a group of children. Their husbands, or slaveholders if you prefer, walk three steps ahead. With mosques on many street corners. The shops have signs you and I cannot read. You will be hard-pressed to find any economic activity.. These are Muslim ghettos controlled by religious fanatics. These are Muslim neighborhoods, and they are mushrooming in every city across Europe . These are the building-blocks for territorial control of increasingly larger portions of Europe , street by street, neighborhood by neighborhood, city by city.

There are now thousands of mosques throughout Europe . With larger congregations than there are in churches. And in every European city there are plans to build super-mosques that will dwarf every church in the region. Clearly, the signal is: we rule.

Many European cities are already one-quarter Muslim: just take Amsterdam , Marseilles and Mal-mo in Sweden . In many cities the majority of the under-18 population is Muslim. Paris is now surrounded by a ring of Muslim neighborhoods. Mohamed is the most popular name among boys in many cities.

In some elementary schools in Amsterdam the farm can no longer be mentioned, because that would also mean mentioning the pig, and that would be an insult to Muslims.

Many state schools in Belgium and Denmark only serve halal food to all pupils. In once-tolerant Amsterdam gays are beaten up almost exclusively by Muslims. Non-Muslim women routinely hear 'whore, whore'. Satellite dishes are not pointed to local TV stations, but to stations in the country of origin.

In France school teachers are advised to avoid authors deemed offensive to Muslims, including Voltaire and Diderot; the same is increasingly true of Darwin . The history of the Holocaust can no longer be taught because of Muslim sensitivity.

In England sharia courts are now officially part of the British legal system. Many neighborhoods in France are no-go areas for women without head scarves. Last week a man almost died after being beaten up by Muslims in Brussels , because he was drinking during the Ramadan.

Jews are fleeing France in record numbers, on the run for the worst wave of anti-Antisemitism since World War II. French is now commonly spoken on the streets of Tel Aviv and Netanya, Israel. I could go on forever with stories like this. Stories about Islamization.

A total of fifty-four million Muslims now live in Europe . San Diego University recently calculated that a staggering 25 percent of the population in Europe will be Muslim just 12 years from now. Bernhard Lewis has predicted a Muslim majority by the end of this century.

Now these are just numbers. And the numbers would not be threatening if the Muslim-immigrants had a strong desire to assimilate. But there are few signs of that. The Pew Research Center reported that half of French Muslims see their loyalty to Islam as greater than their loyalty to France . One-third of French Muslims do not object to suicide attacks. The British Centre for Social Cohesion reported that one-third of British Muslim students are in favor of a worldwide caliphate. Muslims demand what they call 'respect'. And this is how we give them respect. We have Muslim official state holidays.

The Christian-Democratic attorney general is willing to accept sharia in the Netherlands if there is a Muslim majority. We have cabinet members with passports from Morocco and Turkey .

Muslim demands are supported by unlawful behavior, ranging from petty crimes and random violence, for example against ambulance workers and bus drivers, to small-scale riots. Paris has seen its uprising in the low-income suburbs, the banlieus. I call the perpetrators 'settlers'. Because that is what they are. They do not come to integrate into our societies; they come to integrate our society into their Dar-al-Islam. Therefore, they are settlers.

Much of this street violence I mentioned is directed exclusively against non-Muslims, forcing many native people to leave their neighborhoods, their cities, their countries. Moreover, Muslims are now a swing vote not to be ignored.

The second thing you need to know is the importance of Mohamed the prophet. His behavior is an example to all Muslims and cannot be criticized. Now, if Mohamed had been a man of peace, let us say like Gandhi and Mother Theresa wrapped in one, there would be no problem. But Mohamed was a warlord, a mass murderer, a pedophile, and had several marriages - at the same time. Islamic tradition tells us how he fought in battles, how he had his enemies murdered and even had prisoners of war executed. Mohamed himself slaughtered the Jewish tribe of Banu Qurayza. If it is good for Islam, it is good. If it is bad for Islam, it is bad.

Let no one fool you about Islam being a religion. Sure, it has a god, and a here-after, and 72 virgins. But in its essence Islam is a political ideology. It is a system that lays down detailed rules for society and the life of every person. Islam wants to dictate every aspect of life. Islam means 'submission'. Islam is not compatible with freedom and democracy, because what it strives for is sharia. If you want to compare Islam to anything, compare it to communism or national-socialism, these are all totalitarian ideologies.

Now you know why Winston Churchill called Islam 'the most retrograde force in the world', and why he compared Mein Kampf to the Quran. The public has wholeheartedly accepted the Palestinian narrative, and sees Israel as the aggressor. I have lived in this country and visited it dozens of times. I support Israel . First, because it is the Jewish homeland after two thousand years of exile up to and including Auschwitz, second because it is a democracy, and third because Israel is our first line of defense.

This tiny country is situated on the fault line of jihad, frustrating Islam's territorial advance. Israel is facing the front lines of jihad, like Kashmir, Kosovo, the Philippines , Southern Thailand, Dar-fur in Sudan , Lebanon , and Ac-eh in Indonesia . Israel is simply in the way. The same way West-Berlin was during the Cold War.

The war against Israel is not a war against Israel . It is a war against the West. It is jihad. Israel is simply receiving the blows that are meant for all of us. If there would have been no Israel , Islamic imperialism would have found other venues to release its energy and its desire for conquest. Thanks to Israeli parents who send their children to the army and lay awake at night, parents in Europe and America can sleep well and dream, unaware of the dangers looming.

Many in Europe argue in favor of abandoning Israel in order to address the grievances of our Muslim minorities. But if Israel were, God forbid, to go down, it would not bring any solace to the West It would not mean our Muslim minorities would all of a sudden change their behavior, and accept our values. On the contrary, the end of Israel would give enormous encouragement to the forces of Islam. They would, and rightly so, see the demise of Israel as proof that the West is weak, and doomed. The end of Israel would not mean the end of our problems with Islam, but only the beginning. It would mean the start of the final battle for world domination. If they can get Israel , they can get everything. So-called journalists volunteer to label any and all critics of Islamization as a 'right-wing extremists' or 'racists'. In my country, the Netherlands , 60 percent of the population now sees the mass immigration of Muslims as the number one policy mistake since World War II. And another 60 percent sees Islam as the biggest threat. Yet there is a danger greater danger than terrorist attacks, the scenario of America as the last man standing. The lights may go out in Europe faster than you can imagine. An Islamic Europe means a Europe without freedom and democracy, an economic wasteland, an intellectual nightmare, and a loss of military might for America - as its allies will turn into enemies, enemies with atomic bombs. With an Islamic Europe, it would be up to America alone to preserve the heritage of Rome , Athens and Jerusalem .

Dear friends, liberty is the most precious of gifts. My generation never had to fight for this freedom, it was offered to us on a silver platter, by people who fought for it with their lives. All throughout Europe , American cemeteries remind us of the young boys who never made it home, and whose memory we cherish. My generation does not own this freedom; we are merely its custodians. We can only hand over this hard won liberty to Europe's children in the same state in which it was offered to us. We cannot strike a deal with mullahs and imams. Future generations would never forgive us. We cannot squander our liberties. We simply do not have the right to do so.

We have to take the necessary action now to stop this Islamic stupidity from destroying the free world that we know.

End of speach.

There is much in this speech that I do not like, because it has the style and smell of religious bigotry. However I cant deny the basic message nor the fact that we need to stop the spread of Islamic fundamentalism and banning the Burk seems a good place to start. Unless we are happy living in an Islamic society.

"

Usual load of BOLLOX..

NO-ONE in Europe can preach about religion, rights/local laws and wearing different clothes.

When the British(also including Dutch/French/Spanish) were in Africa and India/Pakistan we were trying to get them to be Christian, Live by OUR laws and I have NEVER seen a picture of a English man or his wife wearing local clothing in either Africa or India, so why are Muslims different? or perhaps you think your better than them?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton


"They had a discussion on This Morning today. They had done a survey before the discussion and after.

After the discussion which gave both sides of the argument, the survey ended up higher than before and came in at

89% yes to ban it 11% for no ban."

it would be very interesting to have a poll on here by starting a new thread

leaving it open for perhaps 24 hours

as on the tv show just a yes or no vote with no comments

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

and i thought we lived in a free country stupid me

and as for feeling intimitaded by a woman in a veil

REALLY?????

man up

and fully agree with everything polo has said saves my typing lol cheers polo

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

and as for feeling intimitaded by a woman in a veil"

I've been married twice and it's fucking scarey I tell ya!!

p.s. Siren, you know I luvs ya really, sexy gorgeous wife of mine. Thought I'd better add that, just in case like.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Come to think of it... maybe that's why women about to get married wear veils too. I mean, there's a guy standing at the altar shitting himself and the very last thing he needs to see is his soon to be devil-in-law standing alongside his soon to be trouble & strife just as she pulls in for the kill - he'll know EXACTLY what she's gonna look like in 40 years time won't he!!

Hence the veil.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"ALL religions actively encourage the expansion of it's religion to other territories!"

And openly sing about it.... crap tunes though.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"Now, Spence Street pool on the other hand... well it's in the heart of an Asian community. The ratio of Asian to non-Asian who use the pool is about 10-1 (at a guess for when I have been in there)... and they have no special sessions for Muslim women.... which does surprise me.

Why should that surprise you? and before you answer turn your statement on its head and then ask yourself would you be surprised?

Just to help:

Most swimming pools are in areas where the ratio of WHITE to Asian/non white is about 10 to 1... do I need to continue such a racist statement?"

Oh for fanny-aunt's sake don't make stupid comments like that. I didn't put 'white' or even 'WHITE'. How else do I emphasise it is a predominantly Asian patrons who use the pool... and therefore I am surprised there are no sessions specifically to meet the needs of the people who use the fecking pool.

In the words of Jim...... racist statement my arse!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he BananamanMan
over a year ago

WORCESTERSHIRE

someone on here posted a copy of a speech by dutchman geert wilders, perhaps just can in the interest of fair play we can post a copy of one of the speeches by that chap who used to rant and rave outside a north london mosque whilst protected by our police force who of course were there in case anyone should disagree with such a fair & unbiased view of life in the uk.

just a thought.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"and i thought we lived in a free country stupid me

and as for feeling intimitaded by a woman in a veil

REALLY?????

man up

and fully agree with everything polo has said saves my typing lol cheers polo "

I think we should ban fancy dress costumes…. gorilla suits and the like… especially clowns.... yeah clowns with their fake big feet, fuzzy wigs and big red noses… you can’t tell who the fuck is behind all that face paint!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"and i thought we lived in a free country stupid me

and as for feeling intimitaded by a woman in a veil

REALLY?????

man up

and fully agree with everything polo has said saves my typing lol cheers polo

I think we should ban fancy dress costumes…. gorilla suits and the like… especially clowns.... yeah clowns with their fake big feet, fuzzy wigs and big red noses… you can’t tell who the fuck is behind all that face paint!"

I feel a lot more confident when I'm wearing my mask

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"and i thought we lived in a free country stupid me

and as for feeling intimitaded by a woman in a veil

REALLY?????

man up

and fully agree with everything polo has said saves my typing lol cheers polo

I think we should ban fancy dress costumes…. gorilla suits and the like… especially clowns.... yeah clowns with their fake big feet, fuzzy wigs and big red noses… you can’t tell who the fuck is behind all that face paint!

I feel a lot more confident when I'm wearing my mask "

Bollox to that! Clowns should fit in with the rest of us and if they don't like it they can feck off back to where they came from!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"someone on here posted a copy of a speech by dutchman geert wilders, perhaps just can in the interest of fair play we can post a copy of one of the speeches by that chap who used to rant and rave outside a north london mosque whilst protected by our police force who of course were there in case anyone should disagree with such a fair & unbiased view of life in the uk.

just a thought."

I posted the speech because I thought it was relevant and quite moderate in what it said, although there were disturbing undertones to the speech. I do not see how posting one of Abu Hanza's (excuse the spelling if wrong) speeches inciting religious hatred and violence would balance things. Although I can see how it may remind some of our more liberal (on this issue) posters as to exactly what has inspired the wearing of the burka, and what in their rush to be politically correct they are supporting by default.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"ah fook i just come on here thinking it was a ban on that sex thing where everyone cums on ya

thought k nell i aint even done it yet and they are banning it

i think u confused burka with bukkake, lol.

you cant get more different even if they do sound similar!

"

perhaps it means i will get a group of terroists to cum on me

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *andcCouple
over a year ago

London and Cheshire

I love forum threads like this!

All the bigots come out and tell you what they're thinking, so it's easy to ban them from looking at our profile.

Remember there are good people and there are bad people,religion, colour, gender and sexual orientation have nothing to do with it.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I love forum threads like this!

All the bigots come out and tell you what they're thinking, so it's easy to ban them from looking at our profile.

Remember there are good people and there are bad people,religion, colour, gender and sexual orientation have nothing to do with it."

am not a racist i just need a good dictionary

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"someone on here posted a copy of a speech by dutchman geert wilders, perhaps just can in the interest of fair play we can post a copy of one of the speeches by that chap who used to rant and rave outside a north london mosque whilst protected by our police force who of course were there in case anyone should disagree with such a fair & unbiased view of life in the uk.

just a thought.

I posted the speech because I thought it was relevant and quite moderate in what it said, although there were disturbing undertones to the speech. I do not see how posting one of Abu Hanza's (excuse the spelling if wrong) speeches inciting religious hatred and violence would balance things. Although I can see how it may remind some of our more liberal (on this issue) posters as to exactly what has inspired the wearing of the burka, and what in their rush to be politically correct they are supporting by default."

actually funnily enough it has nothing to do with being PC it has everything to do with being free i do not give 2 hoots what anyone thinks of my opinion i am known for being quite forthright in sharing my opnions and some in fact many would argue against my opinions on many things but yet it is my freedom to express it and your freedom do disagree with it that i will gladly defend nay fight for. i believe that we all have the right to say or wear or even just look like whatever we like because we are FREE

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"... I do not see how posting one of Abu Hanza's (excuse the spelling if wrong) speeches inciting religious hatred and violence would balance things. Although I can see how it may remind some of our more liberal (on this issue) posters as to exactly what has inspired the wearing of the burka, and what in their rush to be politically correct they are supporting by default."

Abu Hamza did not inspire the wearing of a burka.... so let's get that straight.

If we follow your logic then let's post something really tasty by an extremist right winger... the BNP or how about a Neo Nazi and suggest their words inspired all the white folk who want to outright ban the burka...... I can't though can I... because it would be bollox, in the same way the underlying message you have written is.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"I love forum threads like this!

All the bigots come out and tell you what they're thinking, so it's easy to ban them from looking at our profile.

Remember there are good people and there are bad people,religion, colour, gender and sexual orientation have nothing to do with it."

I would agree with you in what you say about good and bad in all groups, however there can be no doubt that religious bigotry is inspired by self serving theocrats and unless they are faced down every time they preach whatever brand theological control they subscribe to freedom of worship, thought and speech are soon lost.

Now in relation to this thread there is one particular brand of Islam (it is called Wasabi) that preaches jihad, hate and overthrow of the west. It comes from and is financed by the Saudis'. It also preaches that women are property, first of their fathers, then of their husbands (who is picked for them by their father), and it is from this sect that the burka comes from.

Now personally I find bigotry offensive, but just because someone is a bigot does not mean that they are wrong.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"...

actually funnily enough it has nothing to do with being PC it has everything to do with being free i do not give 2 hoots what anyone thinks of my opinion i am known for being quite forthright in sharing my opnions and some in fact many would argue against my opinions on many things but yet it is my freedom to express it and your freedom do disagree with it that i will gladly defend nay fight for. i believe that we all have the right to say or wear or even just look like whatever we like because we are FREE"

Come come now bouncy... when they suggest an outright ban, they are not suggesting we give up our freedom of choice... just the freedom of choice for people who are different.

Of course there is the question of who decides on who counts as being 'different' and also how long it will be before another group is pointed at for being 'different' and their freedom of choice is revoked. But that is another story and some people just can't see beyond one page of a story... never mind about working out what's coming up in the sequel.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"

... but just because someone is a bigot does not mean that they are wrong. "

No, but it does frequently mean they are an arse.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

Polo I think that if you go and do some research that you will find that Hamza (I take it your spelling is correct) is actually a Wasabi preacher, and that was one of the reasons that we cannot extradite him (he had preached the same hate in Egypt and they want to take his head for the murders he inspired in their country I believe).

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"and i thought we lived in a free country stupid me

and as for feeling intimitaded by a woman in a veil

REALLY?????

man up

and fully agree with everything polo has said saves my typing lol cheers polo "

Would you feel equally safe if you found that rapists were dressing up in those outfits and using them to approach women.

You say you would feel safe walking along a street at night with a woman wearing a full Bhurka and (whatever the rest of the outfit is called) but would you feel safe if a man was following you, now me, if I was a rapist I would use the outfit to put women off thier guard and get close enough to attack them ?

Just a thought, after all I did say I don't support a full ban but there are points for and against any form of full face/body covering clothing.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"Polo I think that if you go and do some research that you will find that Hamza (I take it your spelling is correct) is actually a Wasabi preacher, and that was one of the reasons that we cannot extradite him (he had preached the same hate in Egypt and they want to take his head for the murders he inspired in their country I believe)."

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"but what happens when we visit there countries we have to abide the rules of the land, so how come they don't when they come over here, we brits are too dam soft in this country its about time we stood up and be counted, soon there will be no christainity in this country we all be muslims or is that we are heading for ."

I have been to many countries in the world and have never been made to wear a Sari, a Turban, A Burka, Liederhosen, Kilt, cow thong or any other form of local attire ?

A few people in this thread are talking about "when in Rome" or "when you choose to come to Britain" what about the thousands of 2nd and 3rd generation Muslims who were born in this country ? and where do we send them back to ? where do they come from, oh you mean Bradford, Birmingham, Walsall and all the other towns and Cities in Britain

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's curious to see so many inflexible and intolerant comments considering the nature of this site...I thought the beauty of this site would be a meeting of open minds.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1294630/Shopping-centre-management-install-Asian-stand-toilets-following-cultural-awareness-course.html

.

.

.

check this out

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

See now that is nice.... see how a bit of awareness can help us all have a choice.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka."

I think you need to go and do some reading about the Wasabis', how they operate and their aims and methods. then read up about the Saudi Religious police and then ask yourself if that is what you want for your children or their children. Because that is where we are heading.

If at some point you decide that it is all anti Muslim propaganda with a little effort you can find some of the Arabic sites that give instructions for shaping societies and the use of Arabic/ Islamic dress to prepare them for Islamafication. Its all there if you care to look.

One final point do you think that the majority of the Afghan population and especially the female population want to live under "taliban" (by the way that means student of Islam) control, because they come out of the Saudi/Wasabi backed and paid for madrases (Islamic religious schools). The simple fact is that the Burka is just a visible part of an indoctrination process.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Will all the Cristian fundamentalists on here go to hell for using sex recreationally?...or,dare I say it, using condoms.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"but what happens when we visit there countries we have to abide the rules of the land, so how come they don't when they come over here, we brits are too dam soft in this country its about time we stood up and be counted, soon there will be no christainity in this country we all be muslims or is that we are heading for .

I have been to many countries in the world and have never been made to wear a Sari, a Turban, A Burka, Liederhosen, Kilt, cow thong or any other form of local attire ?

A few people in this thread are talking about "when in Rome" or "when you choose to come to Britain" what about the thousands of 2nd and 3rd generation Muslims who were born in this country ? and where do we send them back to ? where do they come from, oh you mean Bradford, Birmingham, Walsall and all the other towns and Cities in Britain "

I could be wrong but I would have thought the majority of burkha wearers in the uk are not 2nd or 3rd generation muslims. No doubt knowing this site someone will correct me if i am indeed wrong or try and correct me even if i am not

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think you are wrong...they probably wont

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

I think you need to go and do some reading about the Wasabis', how they operate and their aims and methods. then read up about the Saudi Religious police and then ask yourself if that is what you want for your children or their children. Because that is where we are heading.

If at some point you decide that it is all anti Muslim propaganda with a little effort you can find some of the Arabic sites that give instructions for shaping societies and the use of Arabic/ Islamic dress to prepare them for Islamafication. Its all there if you care to look.

One final point do you think that the majority of the Afghan population and especially the female population want to live under "taliban" (by the way that means student of Islam) control, because they come out of the Saudi/Wasabi backed and paid for madrases (Islamic religious schools). The simple fact is that the Burka is just a visible part of an indoctrination process. "

And I think, sorry make that 'know' you need to widen your reading to include a little more balance representative of the typical UK Muslim.

All you seem to do is quote extremists... I can do that... shall I go and google a few white Christian extremists for you… some of them have very clear views about men who such cock and what should be done to them with a length of rope and a burning cross … I could end it with “because that's the way we are heading”. It’s easy to type “because that's the way we are heading” but it doesn’t make it any less bollox.

We are not heading that way because the majority of UK Muslims (Muslims making up approx only 3% of the UK population btw... oowwwww fucking hell we'll be out numbered soon) because the majority of UK Muslims don't want to be associated with the extremists who preach hate. It’s a bit like saying all people who want to ban the burka want to burn Muslim children in their sleep by petrol bombing the houses…. I am sure one or two in the country do want to do that, but NOT ALL of them.

If we do end up heading that way (as you say – in relation to Muslims) I have no doubt whatsoever it will be people like you who force the direction.

The simple fact is many (many being the majority) Muslim women who wear a Burka choose to wear one because of tradition and because it is a normal thing to do for them... not because they want to blow up the chippy.

Btw… have you read the Bible… not one of those fancy fluffy versions printed recently…. but THE Bible , the original version. It is after all the foundation for the religion of this great land… and if you want to read words of hate, words of wrath against those who do not follow the faith, words which put women in their place at the bottom of the pile – their to obey the man and bare children not just for their husbands but for (and by) their fathers also. Where the selling of women is OK and so is marrying your sister…. not forgetting where gay and bi men should be stoned to death. You should have a read, I think it will be right up your street.

The thing is… I can accept this is not the part of Christianity most Christians will follow to the letter and it is only the extremists who even talk about it. You don’t seem to be able to accept the same when it comes to Muslims and the Qur'an.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"They had a discussion on This Morning today. They had done a survey before the discussion and after.

After the discussion which gave both sides of the argument, the survey ended up higher than before and came in at

89% yes to ban it 11% for no ban.

it would be very interesting to have a poll on here by starting a new thread

leaving it open for perhaps 24 hours

as on the tv show just a yes or no vote with no comments "

Good idea.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Polo I think that if you go and do some research that you will find that Hamza (I take it your spelling is correct) is actually a Wasabi preacher, and that was one of the reasons that we cannot extradite him (he had preached the same hate in Egypt and they want to take his head for the murders he inspired in their country I believe).

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka."

There was an interesting programme on TV recently about an English guy who was following the Tropic of Cancer around the globe and tried to enter/visit all the countries it passed through. One of those countries is Saudi Arabia and whilst there he was monitored closely by the govt so that he didn't film in sensitive areas nor project a bad image of the Saudi people. He given a guide to remain with him while he filmed and SHE wore a hijab but also explained that a lot of muslim women CHOOSE to wear the full-face burka and are not forced into it as some western cultures believed. She went on to state that they see it as a way of protecting themselves from unwanted attention from men who are not their husbands and are quite happy to wear them.

We, in the West, have issues with them for security reasons alone. There were pictures in the press recently showing women in full-face burkas learning how to fire rifles and proud of what they were doing and trying to achieve. I cannot say who produced this propoganda, either Western sensationalist journalism or proactive muslim fundamentalists, but the security threat of people wearing full-face coverings is very real and in a country closely allied to the USA, as we are, it is a threat that MUST be taken seriously.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

I think you need to go and do some reading about the Wasabis', how they operate and their aims and methods. then read up about the Saudi Religious police and then ask yourself if that is what you want for your children or their children. Because that is where we are heading.

If at some point you decide that it is all anti Muslim propaganda with a little effort you can find some of the Arabic sites that give instructions for shaping societies and the use of Arabic/ Islamic dress to prepare them for Islamafication. Its all there if you care to look.

One final point do you think that the majority of the Afghan population and especially the female population want to live under "taliban" (by the way that means student of Islam) control, because they come out of the Saudi/Wasabi backed and paid for madrases (Islamic religious schools). The simple fact is that the Burka is just a visible part of an indoctrination process.

And I think, sorry make that 'know' you need to widen your reading to include a little more balance representative of the typical UK Muslim.

All you seem to do is quote extremists... I can do that... shall I go and google a few white Christian extremists for you… some of them have very clear views about men who such cock and what should be done to them with a length of rope and a burning cross … I could end it with “because that's the way we are heading”. It’s easy to type “because that's the way we are heading” but it doesn’t make it any less bollox.

We are not heading that way because the majority of UK Muslims (Muslims making up approx only 3% of the UK population btw... oowwwww fucking hell we'll be out numbered soon) because the majority of UK Muslims don't want to be associated with the extremists who preach hate. It’s a bit like saying all people who want to ban the burka want to burn Muslim children in their sleep by petrol bombing the houses…. I am sure one or two in the country do want to do that, but NOT ALL of them.

If we do end up heading that way (as you say – in relation to Muslims) I have no doubt whatsoever it will be people like you who force the direction.

The simple fact is many (many being the majority) Muslim women who wear a Burka choose to wear one because of tradition and because it is a normal thing to do for them... not because they want to blow up the chippy.

Btw… have you read the Bible… not one of those fancy fluffy versions printed recently…. but THE Bible , the original version. It is after all the foundation for the religion of this great land… and if you want to read words of hate, words of wrath against those who do not follow the faith, words which put women in their place at the bottom of the pile – their to obey the man and bare children not just for their husbands but for (and by) their fathers also. Where the selling of women is OK and so is marrying your sister…. not forgetting where gay and bi men should be stoned to death. You should have a read, I think it will be right up your street.

The thing is… I can accept this is not the part of Christianity most Christians will follow to the letter and it is only the extremists who even talk about it. You don’t seem to be able to accept the same when it comes to Muslims and the Qur'an.

"

Top post Polo. Couldn't have put it better myself. (Where's an 'applaud' icon when you need one huh? Someone's fookin covered it up!)

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"Polo I think that if you go and do some research that you will find that Hamza (I take it your spelling is correct) is actually a Wasabi preacher, and that was one of the reasons that we cannot extradite him (he had preached the same hate in Egypt and they want to take his head for the murders he inspired in their country I believe).

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

There was an interesting programme on TV recently about an English guy who was following the Tropic of Cancer around the globe and tried to enter/visit all the countries it passed through. One of those countries is Saudi Arabia and whilst there he was monitored closely by the govt so that he didn't film in sensitive areas nor project a bad image of the Saudi people. He given a guide to remain with him while he filmed and SHE wore a hijab but also explained that a lot of muslim women CHOOSE to wear the full-face burka and are not forced into it as some western cultures believed. She went on to state that they see it as a way of protecting themselves from unwanted attention from men who are not their husbands and are quite happy to wear them.

We, in the West, have issues with them for security reasons alone. There were pictures in the press recently showing women in full-face burkas learning how to fire rifles and proud of what they were doing and trying to achieve. I cannot say who produced this propoganda, either Western sensationalist journalism or proactive muslim fundamentalists, but the security threat of people wearing full-face coverings is very real and in a country closely allied to the USA, as we are, it is a threat that MUST be taken seriously. "

Where there is a need to ascertain identity... even if that is just to prove you are the eligible owner of a discount bus pass.... I have no problem with anyone being required to remove anything which prevents recognition.

However, I do have a very big problem with the outright banning of a garment of choice. It harms no one for a woman to sit on a park bench wearing a burka and I believe they should have just as much right to wear one as I have to wear a gorilla suit, clown make-up, big sunglasses, a hoody, a scarf, a masquerade ball mask or (at the request of most of my meets) a brown paper bag on my head.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"

There was an interesting programme on TV recently about an English guy who was following the Tropic of Cancer around the globe and tried to enter/visit all the countries it passed through. One of those countries is Saudi Arabia and whilst there he was monitored closely by the govt so that he didn't film in sensitive areas nor project a bad image of the Saudi people. He given a guide to remain with him while he filmed and SHE wore a hijab but also explained that a lot of muslim women CHOOSE to wear the full-face burka and are not forced into it as some western cultures believed. She went on to state that they see it as a way of protecting themselves from unwanted attention from men who are not their husbands and are quite happy to wear them.

"

Yes Wishy we certainly have security issues in the west, and in light of numerous hijackings starting with the 1970 hijackings by the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, through Lockerbie Pan Am 103, then the twin towers to the London Tube attacks with many stops in between we have become the target of every Arab who feels like killing Westerners.

Now as for the program you mention I saw it too, it was very good. However I would suggest that you have supplied the basis for an answer to your point about the hijab and burka in your post.

Firstly the hijab is all that is required for modesty under Islamic law and therefore no Islamic law was broken, however that the Saudi government felt it was necessary to escort and censor what was filmed speaks volumes. As for what they thought may damage their international reputation, maybe it could be the religious police beating anyone out at times of prayer, or maybe the public executions of women for being raped (if a woman is raped unless she can get 4 men to say they witnessed the rape she is an adulteress and is killed) or any of the other numerous outrages committed under the auspices of Islamic law. Or maybe it was to hide their human rights abuses as documented by Amnesty International.

If you wish to read the amnesty report go to:

http://www.amnesty.org/en/appeals-for-action/saudi-arabia-dire-human-rights-record-exacerbated-by-counter-terrorism-measures

or you can read about the religious police:

http://amnesty.name/en/news-and-updates/saudi-arabia-sorcery-death-sentence-upheld-2010-03-18

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton

i have been watching a number of various discussions on the subject sky news , BBC , ITV etc and one thing is very noticable

there is always a woman that is in support of the burqa , in every case they are wearing a head scarfe

i wonder why they dont have a woman wearing a burqa , in support of its wearing

at least the people that support motor bikes have enough pride to go on tv wearing a leather jacket with studs on

but it seems the burka wearers find them too intimidating , antisocial , and seperatist to have there spokesperson wearing one

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 14/07/10 18:52:11]

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"and i thought we lived in a free country stupid me

and as for feeling intimitaded by a woman in a veil

REALLY?????

man up

and fully agree with everything polo has said saves my typing lol cheers polo

Would you feel equally safe if you found that rapists were dressing up in those outfits and using them to approach women.

You say you would feel safe walking along a street at night with a woman wearing a full Bhurka and (whatever the rest of the outfit is called) but would you feel safe if a man was following you, now me, if I was a rapist I would use the outfit to put women off thier guard and get close enough to attack them ?

Just a thought, after all I did say I don't support a full ban but there are points for and against any form of full face/body covering clothing."

seriously???

you expect me to take that seriously???

so if you don't support a full ban how are you gonna be sure that their isn't a rapist under it you contradict your own reasoning there

maybe i'm too trusting but i do not walk down the street thinking that there is a rapist behind me

i'm not naive and i am very aware of dangers and do not put myself in dangerous situations so i'm at all worried about any woman in a burhka being a rapist in disguise

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

I think you need to go and do some reading about the Wasabis', how they operate and their aims and methods. then read up about the Saudi Religious police and then ask yourself if that is what you want for your children or their children. Because that is where we are heading.

If at some point you decide that it is all anti Muslim propaganda with a little effort you can find some of the Arabic sites that give instructions for shaping societies and the use of Arabic/ Islamic dress to prepare them for Islamafication. Its all there if you care to look.

One final point do you think that the majority of the Afghan population and especially the female population want to live under "taliban" (by the way that means student of Islam) control, because they come out of the Saudi/Wasabi backed and paid for madrases (Islamic religious schools). The simple fact is that the Burka is just a visible part of an indoctrination process.

And I think, sorry make that 'know' you need to widen your reading to include a little more balance representative of the typical UK Muslim.

All you seem to do is quote extremists... I can do that... shall I go and google a few white Christian extremists for you… some of them have very clear views about men who such cock and what should be done to them with a length of rope and a burning cross … I could end it with “because that's the way we are heading”. It’s easy to type “because that's the way we are heading” but it doesn’t make it any less bollox.

We are not heading that way because the majority of UK Muslims (Muslims making up approx only 3% of the UK population btw... oowwwww fucking hell we'll be out numbered soon) because the majority of UK Muslims don't want to be associated with the extremists who preach hate. It’s a bit like saying all people who want to ban the burka want to burn Muslim children in their sleep by petrol bombing the houses…. I am sure one or two in the country do want to do that, but NOT ALL of them.

If we do end up heading that way (as you say – in relation to Muslims) I have no doubt whatsoever it will be people like you who force the direction.

The simple fact is many (many being the majority) Muslim women who wear a Burka choose to wear one because of tradition and because it is a normal thing to do for them... not because they want to blow up the chippy.

Btw… have you read the Bible… not one of those fancy fluffy versions printed recently…. but THE Bible , the original version. It is after all the foundation for the religion of this great land… and if you want to read words of hate, words of wrath against those who do not follow the faith, words which put women in their place at the bottom of the pile – their to obey the man and bare children not just for their husbands but for (and by) their fathers also. Where the selling of women is OK and so is marrying your sister…. not forgetting where gay and bi men should be stoned to death. You should have a read, I think it will be right up your street.

The thing is… I can accept this is not the part of Christianity most Christians will follow to the letter and it is only the extremists who even talk about it. You don’t seem to be able to accept the same when it comes to Muslims and the Qur'an.

"

huge thumbs up

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"but what happens when we visit there countries we have to abide the rules of the land, so how come they don't when they come over here, we brits are too dam soft in this country its about time we stood up and be counted, soon there will be no christainity in this country we all be muslims or is that we are heading for .

I have been to many countries in the world and have never been made to wear a Sari, a Turban, A Burka, Liederhosen, Kilt, cow thong or any other form of local attire ?

A few people in this thread are talking about "when in Rome" or "when you choose to come to Britain" what about the thousands of 2nd and 3rd generation Muslims who were born in this country ? and where do we send them back to ? where do they come from, oh you mean Bradford, Birmingham, Walsall and all the other towns and Cities in Britain

I could be wrong but I would have thought the majority of burkha wearers in the uk are not 2nd or 3rd generation muslims. No doubt knowing this site someone will correct me if i am indeed wrong or try and correct me even if i am not "

Have to absolutely disagree with that, the majority of the older generation of muslims who came to this Country to live did not wear the burka, it is many of those that have been born here that do so, if you ever go to Chameleons drive up the Walsall road for about 3 miles, go past the Muslim School on the way to Walsall where you will see literally hundreds of young muslim girls coming in and out of the school dressed in full burka sets, these girls are between 5 and 15, almost all of them born in the UK.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Talking about Chams lol we have actually seen a couple just leaving as we arrived and she was wearing a full burka honestly he too was in full Muslim dress

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"and i thought we lived in a free country stupid me

and as for feeling intimitaded by a woman in a veil

REALLY?????

man up

and fully agree with everything polo has said saves my typing lol cheers polo

Would you feel equally safe if you found that rapists were dressing up in those outfits and using them to approach women.

You say you would feel safe walking along a street at night with a woman wearing a full Bhurka and (whatever the rest of the outfit is called) but would you feel safe if a man was following you, now me, if I was a rapist I would use the outfit to put women off thier guard and get close enough to attack them ?

Just a thought, after all I did say I don't support a full ban but there are points for and against any form of full face/body covering clothing.

seriously???

you expect me to take that seriously???

so if you don't support a full ban how are you gonna be sure that their isn't a rapist under it you contradict your own reasoning there

maybe i'm too trusting but i do not walk down the street thinking that there is a rapist behind me

i'm not naive and i am very aware of dangers and do not put myself in dangerous situations so i'm at all worried about any woman in a burhka being a rapist in disguise "

Of course I expect you to take me seriously, but I don't expect everyone to agree with me, we are all entitled to our opinion. my point (probably not put over very well as I am not very well educated) was that whilst you personally don't find the burka intimidating many do and especially when worn in certain places or scenarios, my example was extreme but to show a point, as discussed, anywhere that security is an issue can be a problem, even in bars and clubs where bar staff can incur legal penalities for serving underage people, how can they tell if someone is underage if they cannot see anything but thier eyes ?

I said I didn't support a full ban but can see how in certain circumstances security staff should be able to ask for the item to be removed in the same way people are asked to remove helmets and balaclavas.

Your point about not being intimidated by them is a valid one because it is your own personal view, but laws are there to protect the majority both in thier safety and in thier mental stability, some people do feel intimidated so the wearing of such clothing should be discussed and dealt with.

MAN UP ? what does that mean ? is it just a flippant insult or was there a point to the comment please ?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Talking about Chams lol we have actually seen a couple just leaving as we arrived and she was wearing a full burka honestly he too was in full Muslim dress"

Naturally. If she was spotted coming out of Chams she'd be stoned to death for adultery the next time she popped down to Allahs-R-Us on a Sunday morning.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Talking about Chams lol we have actually seen a couple just leaving as we arrived and she was wearing a full burka honestly he too was in full Muslim dress"

Your absolutely right there are a number of couples who are members of the club and always arrive dressed in full muslim attire (if thats a correct way of describing it) I have also seen 3 ladies dressed in full muslim attire and burkas shopping in Ann Summers, makes you wonder what each one has on beneath all that black linen (linen hmmmm are they made of cotton or muslin lol)

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

I think you need to go and do some reading about the Wasabis', how they operate and their aims and methods. then read up about the Saudi Religious police and then ask yourself if that is what you want for your children or their children. Because that is where we are heading.

If at some point you decide that it is all anti Muslim propaganda with a little effort you can find some of the Arabic sites that give instructions for shaping societies and the use of Arabic/ Islamic dress to prepare them for Islamafication. Its all there if you care to look.

One final point do you think that the majority of the Afghan population and especially the female population want to live under "taliban" (by the way that means student of Islam) control, because they come out of the Saudi/Wasabi backed and paid for madrases (Islamic religious schools). The simple fact is that the Burka is just a visible part of an indoctrination process.

And I think, sorry make that 'know' you need to widen your reading to include a little more balance representative of the typical UK Muslim.

All you seem to do is quote extremists... I can do that... shall I go and google a few white Christian extremists for you… some of them have very clear views about men who such cock and what should be done to them with a length of rope and a burning cross … I could end it with “because that's the way we are heading”. It’s easy to type “because that's the way we are heading” but it doesn’t make it any less bollox.

We are not heading that way because the majority of UK Muslims (Muslims making up approx only 3% of the UK population btw... oowwwww fucking hell we'll be out numbered soon) because the majority of UK Muslims don't want to be associated with the extremists who preach hate. It’s a bit like saying all people who want to ban the burka want to burn Muslim children in their sleep by petrol bombing the houses…. I am sure one or two in the country do want to do that, but NOT ALL of them.

If we do end up heading that way (as you say – in relation to Muslims) I have no doubt whatsoever it will be people like you who force the direction.

The simple fact is many (many being the majority) Muslim women who wear a Burka choose to wear one because of tradition and because it is a normal thing to do for them... not because they want to blow up the chippy.

Btw… have you read the Bible… not one of those fancy fluffy versions printed recently…. but THE Bible , the original version. It is after all the foundation for the religion of this great land… and if you want to read words of hate, words of wrath against those who do not follow the faith, words which put women in their place at the bottom of the pile – their to obey the man and bare children not just for their husbands but for (and by) their fathers also. Where the selling of women is OK and so is marrying your sister…. not forgetting where gay and bi men should be stoned to death. You should have a read, I think it will be right up your street.

The thing is… I can accept this is not the part of Christianity most Christians will follow to the letter and it is only the extremists who even talk about it. You don’t seem to be able to accept the same when it comes to Muslims and the Qur'an.

"

Absolutely top post Polo....

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay

[Removed by poster at 14/07/10 19:58:52]

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"but what happens when we visit there countries we have to abide the rules of the land, so how come they don't when they come over here, we brits are too dam soft in this country its about time we stood up and be counted, soon there will be no christainity in this country we all be muslims or is that we are heading for .

I have been to many countries in the world and have never been made to wear a Sari, a Turban, A Burka, Liederhosen, Kilt, cow thong or any other form of local attire ?

A few people in this thread are talking about "when in Rome" or "when you choose to come to Britain" what about the thousands of 2nd and 3rd generation Muslims who were born in this country ? and where do we send them back to ? where do they come from, oh you mean Bradford, Birmingham, Walsall and all the other towns and Cities in Britain

I could be wrong but I would have thought the majority of burkha wearers in the uk are not 2nd or 3rd generation muslims. No doubt knowing this site someone will correct me if i am indeed wrong or try and correct me even if i am not

Have to absolutely disagree with that, the majority of the older generation of muslims who came to this Country to live did not wear the burka, it is many of those that have been born here that do so, if you ever go to Chameleons drive up the Walsall road for about 3 miles, go past the Muslim School on the way to Walsall where you will see literally hundreds of young muslim girls coming in and out of the school dressed in full burka sets, these girls are between 5 and 15, almost all of them born in the UK."

It would be interesting to see actual figures rather than just going on our opinions I guess

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"The Belgians tried to ban the Burkha last year....the European Court of Human Rights overturned the ban.

Hi all

H. asked me to give an answer to this OP, as I watch German and French news due to my business and see that is going on in various European countries.

The European Court can make judgements, but in the end effect it is the country's own decision to act on these judgements. For example the European Court ruled that the ban on Minarets in Switzerland was illegal; however the Swiss government pointed out that they had not banned Mosques nor banned Islam, but just the building of towers (Minarets).

Is it not the decision of each government to do, what the majority of the inhabitants want ? In case of France and Belgium the majority feel insecure with Burkhas been worn in trains, trams, buses and public places; this does not mean they are all going on an anti Islamic rant, but just want to feel safe and know who is standing next to them in a bus. D. "

You will have to excuse me for being rude here, but how do you work out that Switzerland had to answer to the EU on human rights issues when Switzerland IS NOT a full member state of the EU?

Switzerland is only an economic partner State of the EU, they signed Two treaties with the EU that covered the following and only the following...

Free movement of people

Air traffic

Road traffic

Agriculture

Technical trade barriers

Public procurement

Science

Security and asylum/Schengen membership

Cooperation in fraud pursuits

Final stipulations in open questions about agriculture, environment, media, education, care of the elderly, statistics and services.

So if Switzerland ARE NOT a full member State EU partner, and haven't signed up to the Human Rights Treaty of 1998....how would they have to answer to the EU on sodding mosques?

Jesus wept!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"i have been watching a number of various discussions on the subject sky news , BBC , ITV etc and one thing is very noticable

there is always a woman that is in support of the burqa , in every case they are wearing a head scarfe

i wonder why they dont have a woman wearing a burqa , in support of its wearing

at least the people that support motor bikes have enough pride to go on tv wearing a leather jacket with studs on

but it seems the burka wearers find them too intimidating , antisocial , and seperatist to have there spokesperson wearing one

"

Oh please... could you make up anything more tosh than that statement.

And if she had been wearing one I bet you'd have said "why was she ashamed to show her face on the telly if she only had it on through personal choice"

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The Belgians tried to ban the Burkha last year....the European Court of Human Rights overturned the ban.

Hi all

H. asked me to give an answer to this OP, as I watch German and French news due to my business and see that is going on in various European countries.

The European Court can make judgements, but in the end effect it is the country's own decision to act on these judgements. For example the European Court ruled that the ban on Minarets in Switzerland was illegal; however the Swiss government pointed out that they had not banned Mosques nor banned Islam, but just the building of towers (Minarets).

Is it not the decision of each government to do, what the majority of the inhabitants want ? In case of France and Belgium the majority feel insecure with Burkhas been worn in trains, trams, buses and public places; this does not mean they are all going on an anti Islamic rant, but just want to feel safe and know who is standing next to them in a bus. D.

You will have to excuse me for being rude here, but how do you work out that Switzerland had to answer to the EU on human rights issues when Switzerland IS NOT a full member state of the EU?

Switzerland is only an economic partner State of the EU, they signed Two treaties with the EU that covered the following and only the following...

Free movement of people

Air traffic

Road traffic

Agriculture

Technical trade barriers

Public procurement

Science

Security and asylum/Schengen membership

Cooperation in fraud pursuits

Final stipulations in open questions about agriculture, environment, media, education, care of the elderly, statistics and services.

So if Switzerland ARE NOT a full member State EU partner, and haven't signed up to the Human Rights Treaty of 1998....how would they have to answer to the EU on sodding mosques?

Jesus wept!"

Which is exactly why the Suisse were ablt to ban minorets, truth is all Countries could probably do that EU or not based on the laws of planning permission and let's face they are a law unto themselves.

I see the point though, parts of Switzerland are ultra modern, parts are traditional and some areas (such as Verbier) have not changed in building design for Centuries and will not allow any change, indeed in one village motor vehicles are totally banned and only sleighs and sledges are permitted. Quite right too.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 14/07/10 20:31:48]

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I was working in Manchester a few weeks ago, by the roadside. Watched a women (i assume a woman, lol) wearing a burkha start to cross the road....

She walked straight in front of a car, the car had to brake heavily and swerve to avoid her.

Wonder if thats cos she couldn't see properly?

TBH, If they want to wear them in the streets etc, then so be it, its them thats isolating themselves from society, doesn't effect me.

I do however think that anyone going through sensitive areas (airports etc) should be made to drop the veil as well as in banks etc where normally a crash helmet or balaclava wouldn't be allowed.

We pander far too much to the beliefs of non christians over their religious beliefs over their choice of dress and religious symbols yet are strict on christians who want to show a cross or other religious mark.

S.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

I think you need to go and do some reading about the Wasabis', how they operate and their aims and methods. then read up about the Saudi Religious police and then ask yourself if that is what you want for your children or their children. Because that is where we are heading.

If at some point you decide that it is all anti Muslim propaganda with a little effort you can find some of the Arabic sites that give instructions for shaping societies and the use of Arabic/ Islamic dress to prepare them for Islamafication. Its all there if you care to look.

One final point do you think that the majority of the Afghan population and especially the female population want to live under "taliban" (by the way that means student of Islam) control, because they come out of the Saudi/Wasabi backed and paid for madrases (Islamic religious schools). The simple fact is that the Burka is just a visible part of an indoctrination process.

And I think, sorry make that 'know' you need to widen your reading to include a little more balance representative of the typical UK Muslim.

All you seem to do is quote extremists... I can do that... shall I go and google a few white Christian extremists for you… some of them have very clear views about men who such cock and what should be done to them with a length of rope and a burning cross … I could end it with “because that's the way we are heading”. It’s easy to type “because that's the way we are heading” but it doesn’t make it any less bollox.

We are not heading that way because the majority of UK Muslims (Muslims making up approx only 3% of the UK population btw... oowwwww fucking hell we'll be out numbered soon) because the majority of UK Muslims don't want to be associated with the extremists who preach hate. It’s a bit like saying all people who want to ban the burka want to burn Muslim children in their sleep by petrol bombing the houses…. I am sure one or two in the country do want to do that, but NOT ALL of them.

If we do end up heading that way (as you say – in relation to Muslims) I have no doubt whatsoever it will be people like you who force the direction.

The simple fact is many (many being the majority) Muslim women who wear a Burka choose to wear one because of tradition and because it is a normal thing to do for them... not because they want to blow up the chippy.

Btw… have you read the Bible… not one of those fancy fluffy versions printed recently…. but THE Bible , the original version. It is after all the foundation for the religion of this great land… and if you want to read words of hate, words of wrath against those who do not follow the faith, words which put women in their place at the bottom of the pile – their to obey the man and bare children not just for their husbands but for (and by) their fathers also. Where the selling of women is OK and so is marrying your sister…. not forgetting where gay and bi men should be stoned to death. You should have a read, I think it will be right up your street.

The thing is… I can accept this is not the part of Christianity most Christians will follow to the letter and it is only the extremists who even talk about it. You don’t seem to be able to accept the same when it comes to Muslims and the Qur'an.

Absolutely top post Polo...."

I must admit I cant be bothered going through what has been said point by point, so quickly firstly look at a world map and plot all the places where muslim fundementalist are murdering ANYONE who refuses to submit to their rule. Then follow this link to the ICM UK muslim poll, and remember these answers were given AFTER 7/7 when you would expect that most muslims would not want to answer in a way that would show them in a bad light, and take a long hard look at the results for Q10! Then tell me how well you know the muslims and how small and unrepresentitive the radical are.

http://www.icmresearch.co.uk/pdfs/2006_february_sunday_telegraph_muslims_poll.pdf

then listen to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maHSOB2RFm4

and then this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lWABGwFJn0

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay

I choose not to live my life in fear of those with different religious beliefs, all fear does is it eats you up.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"MAN UP ? what does that mean ? is it just a flippant insult or was there a point to the comment please ?"

more a flipant comment not an insult it means grow a set take the time to talk to people and you will soon discover there is absolutly nothing to be intimidated by they are all just human beings wether it be a chav in a hoodie or a punk with tattoos and peircings or a muslim woman in a burkha they are all human just look a little different to your prefered look thats all take the time to get to know people then you will see there is nothing to be intimidated about

look people in the eye and smile you'll be amazed at just how many smile back

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"

I must admit I cant be bothered going through what has been said point by point, so quickly firstly look at a world map and plot all the places where muslim fundementalist are murdering ANYONE who refuses to submit to their rule. Then follow this link to the ICM UK muslim poll, and remember these answers were given AFTER 7/7 when you would expect that most muslims would not want to answer in a way that would show them in a bad light, and take a long hard look at the results for Q10! Then tell me how well you know the muslims and how small and unrepresentitive the radical are.

then listen to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maHSOB2RFm4

and then this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lWABGwFJn0"

I'm not sure the point you are trying to make by posting the link to the ICM UK muslim poll... as it states 80% of the Muslims who took part in the survey selected "Western society may not be perfect but Muslims should live within it and not seek to bring it to an end"... which seems like a pretty big majority to me compared to the 7% who want to change it (though violent means if necessary - though there wasn't an option to chnge it through peaceful means).

As for the question “Do you think that relations between Muslims and white, British people are getting better or getting worse?” … who do you think plays a significant part in making relations worse… (in the words of an old comedy sketch) that’s you that is!

I read something somewhere on this site about not blaming the opressed for fighting back against their opressors… which do you think you are where Muslims are concerned? Are you the opressed or the opressor?

I don’t care what happens in other countries… I live here in England and if you had half an argument you’d be able to stick to what actually happens in England…. or do I have to go and find some stuff that the white Christian nutters do in the redneck states of the U.S.A.?

Or shall we talk about Robert Mugabe as Zimbabwe is a Christian nation (approx 70% Christian – less that 1% Muslim) and it’s a crime in that country to be gay or bi-sexual… if you’re lucky you go to prison. Because of what Mugabe has done in Zimbabwe, should we assume all black african christians living in the UK want to commit generside in order to remove white minority rule… should we fuck... and neither should we make the assumptions you keep making about Muslims living in the UK.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

I forgot to add about the Christian countries which still perform forced female circumsision on young teenage girls … that’s also called ‘genital mutilation’.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville

In response to naughtynymphos ( see im being good Rugby) i disagree, not all unmarried muslim women forgoe the Burka, i know lots that do wear it.....lots wear it down to choice, while i dont dispell the fact that some of muslim hubbys are insistent ..lots are not

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In response to naughtynymphos ( see im being good Rugby) i disagree, not all unmarried muslim women forgoe the Burka, i know lots that do wear it.....lots wear it down to choice, while i dont dispell the fact that some of muslim hubbys are insistent ..lots are not "

The thing i would find hard though is how can we know they are not just saying they wear them through choice because that is what they have been forced to say?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville


"In response to naughtynymphos ( see im being good Rugby) i disagree, not all unmarried muslim women forgoe the Burka, i know lots that do wear it.....lots wear it down to choice, while i dont dispell the fact that some of muslim hubbys are insistent ..lots are not

The thing i would find hard though is how can we know they are not just saying they wear them through choice because that is what they have been forced to say? "
well you could ask that of every situation a couple can be in really cant you? how do u know that husband A doesnt make wife A shop at tescos when really she wants to shop at Waitrose, the list is endless, whilst i have said some CHOOSE to wear it i know SOME DO NOT

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In response to naughtynymphos ( see im being good Rugby) i disagree, not all unmarried muslim women forgoe the Burka, i know lots that do wear it.....lots wear it down to choice, while i dont dispell the fact that some of muslim hubbys are insistent ..lots are not

The thing i would find hard though is how can we know they are not just saying they wear them through choice because that is what they have been forced to say? well you could ask that of every situation a couple can be in really cant you? how do u know that husband A doesnt make wife A shop at tescos when really she wants to shop at Waitrose, the list is endless, whilst i have said some CHOOSE to wear it i know SOME DO NOT "

Being made to wear a full veil so that the only thing barely on show is your eyes is slightly different to shopping in tesco instead of waitrose, all i meant really was that there are many out there who say there wear it through choice who unfortunately do not. And for once I actually believe im right.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"

I'm not sure the point you are trying to make by posting the link to the ICM UK muslim poll... as it states 80% of the Muslims who took part in the survey selected "Western society may not be perfect but Muslims should live within it and not seek to bring it to an end"... which seems like a pretty big majority to me compared to the 7% who want to change it (though violent means if necessary - though there wasn't an option to chnge it through peaceful means)."

but only 80% said Western society may not be perfect but Muslims should live within it and not seek to bring it to an end.

That leaves 1 in 5 who are already well on their way into the jihadists arms.

Then there was Q.3 Do you think compared to a year ago, Muslims in this country have become more or less radical in their views

toward British and Western society?46% thought more

Q.6b Still thinking about the publication of the cartoons, were you personally offended by them or not? 85% said yes and 77% said a lot.

However the offensive cartoons were made up by Muslims to show what we (in this case Danes) could do to offend Muslims.

Q.7 Irrespective of whether you think the London bombings were justified or not, do you personally have any sympathy with the feelings and motives

of those who carried out the attacks?20% said yes (the same 20% who would not say they were happy to live in our country as it is I would guess)

Then there is the question I directed you to:

Q.10 Would you support or oppose there being areas of Britain which are pre-dominantly Muslim and in which Sharia law is introduced? 40% said yes and only 41% said no!

How about Q.12 I would now like you to think about the Muslim cleric Abu Hamza, who last week was sentenced for 7 years in prison after being found guilty of

incitement to murder and race hatred. Do you think he received a fair or unfair...? 25% thought that the prosecution unfair, and only 52% thought that was fair, 26% thought his conviction was unfair, and 30% thought his sentence was unfair.

Now while you keep pointing out that as a bi male I am for the chop if the radical Islamists gain power in my lifetime, if I were you I'd remember that you are due to either be burned alive or stoned to death, but then as a female you are less than any male in Islam.

As for your comment about my post about the riots maybe you would like to tell me about the laws that Muslims second class in this country? I think you will find that there are none, in fact it could well be argued that we give them more rights than we allow ourselves. However if you check the Act of Settlement you will find it bans catholics or anyone married to a catholic from accession to the throne. There are other restrictions in law on catholics, there are no such restrictions on any other religion. I hope that you can understand that and see that there is no conflict in my position in both threads.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville


"In response to naughtynymphos ( see im being good Rugby) i disagree, not all unmarried muslim women forgoe the Burka, i know lots that do wear it.....lots wear it down to choice, while i dont dispell the fact that some of muslim hubbys are insistent ..lots are not

The thing i would find hard though is how can we know they are not just saying they wear them through choice because that is what they have been forced to say? well you could ask that of every situation a couple can be in really cant you? how do u know that husband A doesnt make wife A shop at tescos when really she wants to shop at Waitrose, the list is endless, whilst i have said some CHOOSE to wear it i know SOME DO NOT

Being made to wear a full veil so that the only thing barely on show is your eyes is slightly different to shopping in tesco instead of waitrose, all i meant really was that there are many out there who say there wear it through choice who unfortunately do not. And for once I actually believe im right."
Well you would do, all people who are wrong believe they are right you know

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Its bollox they are all wannabe ninjas.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Still the funny thing is...there is no god.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville


"Still the funny thing is...there is no god."
shame on you , say twenty five hail marys n twenty our fathers

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
Forum Mod
over a year ago

There was.....he was posting this morning but got banned

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Still the funny thing is...there is no god.shame on you , say twenty five hail marys n twenty our fathers "

Don't know the words...is it ok if I just hum the tune?.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton


"I choose not to live my life in fear of those with different religious beliefs, all fear does is it eats you up."

i think you will find it depends where you live

this you tube link was filmed about 500 yards from our house last august

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbAdoD9LnQ8&feature=related

we have to live with this kind of thing day in and day out , and although we are not frightened we are very very wary

it is not just the people like myself and my wife that need to be wary it is the polish and the jaimacans that also live in luton that have to be wary as this other you tube link shows

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilKIeag1HUc&feature=related

talk is very cheap , and i know when i have said we have had our window bricked in because it had an england flag in it , im sure a lot of people thought we were either making it up , or like you accused me of making a BNP party political broadcast

if you want to live you life without fear thats your choice

clement attlee lived without fear with his little bit of paper under his pillow

untill germany invaded poland

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville


"Still the funny thing is...there is no god.shame on you , say twenty five hail marys n twenty our fathers

Don't know the words...is it ok if I just hum the tune?. "
ok but do it naked whilst sucking a banana

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"I choose not to live my life in fear of those with different religious beliefs, all fear does is it eats you up.

i think you will find it depends where you live

this you tube link was filmed about 500 yards from our house last august

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbAdoD9LnQ8&feature=related

we have to live with this kind of thing day in and day out , and although we are not frightened we are very very wary

it is not just the people like myself and my wife that need to be wary it is the polish and the jaimacans that also live in luton that have to be wary as this other you tube link shows

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilKIeag1HUc&feature=related

talk is very cheap , and i know when i have said we have had our window bricked in because it had an england flag in it , im sure a lot of people thought we were either making it up , or like you accused me of making a BNP party political broadcast

if you want to live you life without fear thats your choice

clement attlee lived without fear with his little bit of paper under his pillow

untill germany invaded poland "

And what does the burkha have to do with your window having a brick thrown through it?

Unless of course you are claiming the person that vandalised your home was in full muslim dress?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Still the funny thing is...there is no god.shame on you , say twenty five hail marys n twenty our fathers

Don't know the words...is it ok if I just hum the tune?. ok but do it naked whilst sucking a banana "

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville


"Still the funny thing is...there is no god.shame on you , say twenty five hail marys n twenty our fathers

Don't know the words...is it ok if I just hum the tune?. ok but do it naked whilst sucking a banana

"
ok then an orange

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Still the funny thing is...there is no god.shame on you , say twenty five hail marys n twenty our fathers

Don't know the words...is it ok if I just hum the tune?. ok but do it naked whilst sucking a banana

ok then an orange "

Nudity and fruit...sounds a bit scary/asphyxi-wank to me ...

I'll suck my thumb

Think it might be more appropriately childlike...to fit in with some of the comments here

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think they should be banned purely on the grounds of what they represent, which to my mind is extremism.

It is not required by the Koran for women to wear them just insecure husbands and extreme clerics.

If Muslim women want to be integrated into our society they should do things to make themselves more acceptable,wearing a burka isn't one of them.

Besides,if they were banned the sales of Imac and razors would soar,which would be great for the economy! R

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I always thought this form of address was so men would not be tempted by the female form. But had no relious signification at all just a way to keep women undet the control of men and husbands or brothers.

If caught without it in some areas and they feel that the girl or women has tempeted a man she can be punished.

So are we willingly subjecting these females to an unsafe home life for our benifits.

Great care needs to be thought about when putting up this ban, will the women be safe or more in danger

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton


"I choose not to live my life in fear of those with different religious beliefs, all fear does is it eats you up.

i think you will find it depends where you live

this you tube link was filmed about 500 yards from our house last august

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbAdoD9LnQ8&feature=related

we have to live with this kind of thing day in and day out , and although we are not frightened we are very very wary

it is not just the people like myself and my wife that need to be wary it is the polish and the jaimacans that also live in luton that have to be wary as this other you tube link shows

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilKIeag1HUc&feature=related

talk is very cheap , and i know when i have said we have had our window bricked in because it had an england flag in it , im sure a lot of people thought we were either making it up , or like you accused me of making a BNP party political broadcast

if you want to live you life without fear thats your choice

clement attlee lived without fear with his little bit of paper under his pillow

untill germany invaded poland

And what does the burkha have to do with your window having a brick thrown through it?

Unless of course you are claiming the person that vandalised your home was in full muslim dress?

"

there are two connections with my window being bricked in , and the burka

one / is that the police told me there have been a large number of identical attacks and they have allready charged a number of people with these ofences and that they are self confesed muslim extreemists who follow the same modus operandi

two/ i have had follow up hate mail threatening to petrol bomb my house that named the group involved

it is not rocket science to connect hard line exreemist muslims with the wearing of the burka , for example the taliban make women wear it by law

look ........... i know what goes on in luton and thats good enough for me

if you want to have your veiws i respect that and good luck to you

i dont have to justify why i feel the way i do to anyone on here

but at least thanks to you tube i can prove what it is like here in luton

no one need take my word for anything all they need do is clik on the links

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *thwalescplCouple
over a year ago

brecon


"Have just been watching Sky News and France has announced a ban on Full Face Burka wearing.

I personally think in this day and age it does make sense. If i choose to wear a balaclava, all dressed in black whilst walking round tesco's i would probably be asked to leave within a few minutes.

Security wise it must be a nightmare for the police to cope with"

I think you have jumped the gun a bit, according to what I have read, it still has to get past one more layer of their government before it gets ratified.... and this one could throw it out.

On a personal level, I think it should be banned.... you cant walk into a bank with a motorcycle helmet or balaclava on, and two bank robberies have been carried out by men dressed in burkas, who then possibly used the same disguise to leave the country!!!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In response to naughtynymphos ( see im being good Rugby) i disagree, not all unmarried muslim women forgoe the Burka, i know lots that do wear it.....lots wear it down to choice, while i dont dispell the fact that some of muslim hubbys are insistent ..lots are not

The thing i would find hard though is how can we know they are not just saying they wear them through choice because that is what they have been forced to say? well you could ask that of every situation a couple can be in really cant you? how do u know that husband A doesnt make wife A shop at tescos when really she wants to shop at Waitrose, the list is endless, whilst i have said some CHOOSE to wear it i know SOME DO NOT

Being made to wear a full veil so that the only thing barely on show is your eyes is slightly different to shopping in tesco instead of waitrose, all i meant really was that there are many out there who say there wear it through choice who unfortunately do not. And for once I actually believe im right.Well you would do, all people who are wrong believe they are right you know "

Prove me wrong and i will gladly stand corrected. Otherwise, my opinion is just as relevant as yours

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton


"Polo I think that if you go and do some research that you will find that Hamza (I take it your spelling is correct) is actually a Wasabi preacher, and that was one of the reasons that we cannot extradite him (he had preached the same hate in Egypt and they want to take his head for the murders he inspired in their country I believe).

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

There was an interesting programme on TV recently about an English guy who was following the Tropic of Cancer around the globe and tried to enter/visit all the countries it passed through. One of those countries is Saudi Arabia and whilst there he was monitored closely by the govt so that he didn't film in sensitive areas nor project a bad image of the Saudi people. He given a guide to remain with him while he filmed and SHE wore a hijab but also explained that a lot of muslim women CHOOSE to wear the full-face burka and are not forced into it as some western cultures believed. She went on to state that they see it as a way of protecting themselves from unwanted attention from men who are not their husbands and are quite happy to wear them.

We, in the West, have issues with them for security reasons alone. There were pictures in the press recently showing women in full-face burkas learning how to fire rifles and proud of what they were doing and trying to achieve. I cannot say who produced this propoganda, either Western sensationalist journalism or proactive muslim fundamentalists, but the security threat of people wearing full-face coverings is very real and in a country closely allied to the USA, as we are, it is a threat that MUST be taken seriously.

Where there is a need to ascertain identity... even if that is just to prove you are the eligible owner of a discount bus pass.... I have no problem with anyone being required to remove anything which prevents recognition.

However, I do have a very big problem with the outright banning of a garment of choice. It harms no one for a woman to sit on a park bench wearing a burka and I believe they should have just as much right to wear one as I have to wear a gorilla suit, clown make-up, big sunglasses, a hoody, a scarf, a masquerade ball mask or (at the request of most of my meets) a brown paper bag on my head.

"

you think the burka is just an item of clothing like a baseball cap or a pair of sunglasses etc

in fact , and i appologise if i am mistaken but your avatar recently was a burka ( or someones was )

we all know the klu klux klan is a foul and abhorent organisation , and it pains me to mention them while making this point but

i openly ask the moderators of the site to openly comment on wether a person could have an avatar dressed as a kkk

i very very very much doubt it , and thank goodness for that

would they allow an avatar wearing a gorilla mask , probably yes

anyway they wouldnt be able to tell if i had one on or not !

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It seems that Westerners will never truly understand the minds of Arabic muslims (the area of Islam that the Burkah originates from). I have worked with muslims from all areas of Islam and I have asked the question of some wearers - "do you really want to wear a burkah?". The answer is always a variation of "of course I want to wear it, because that is what my father/husband wishes - I will serve my husband/father in this life and the next". Of the slightly less devout muslims that I talk to, the majority do not agree with the wearing of it.

To those that don't wish to ban it - if this statement is true, and it's only being worn because the men demand it, are you still in favour of not banning it?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It seems that Westerners will never truly understand the minds of Arabic muslims (the area of Islam that the Burkah originates from). I have worked with muslims from all areas of Islam and I have asked the question of some wearers - "do you really want to wear a burkah?". The answer is always a variation of "of course I want to wear it, because that is what my father/husband wishes - I will serve my husband/father in this life and the next". Of the slightly less devout muslims that I talk to, the majority do not agree with the wearing of it.

To those that don't wish to ban it - if this statement is true, and it's only being worn because the men demand it, are you still in favour of not banning it?"

But there are some members on here who have asked muslim women themselves and they wear it because they want to, so you can't possibly be right because they are never wrong

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo


"Polo I think that if you go and do some research that you will find that Hamza (I take it your spelling is correct) is actually a Wasabi preacher, and that was one of the reasons that we cannot extradite him (he had preached the same hate in Egypt and they want to take his head for the murders he inspired in their country I believe).

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

There was an interesting programme on TV recently about an English guy who was following the Tropic of Cancer around the globe and tried to enter/visit all the countries it passed through. One of those countries is Saudi Arabia and whilst there he was monitored closely by the govt so that he didn't film in sensitive areas nor project a bad image of the Saudi people. He given a guide to remain with him while he filmed and SHE wore a hijab but also explained that a lot of muslim women CHOOSE to wear the full-face burka and are not forced into it as some western cultures believed. She went on to state that they see it as a way of protecting themselves from unwanted attention from men who are not their husbands and are quite happy to wear them.

We, in the West, have issues with them for security reasons alone. There were pictures in the press recently showing women in full-face burkas learning how to fire rifles and proud of what they were doing and trying to achieve. I cannot say who produced this propoganda, either Western sensationalist journalism or proactive muslim fundamentalists, but the security threat of people wearing full-face coverings is very real and in a country closely allied to the USA, as we are, it is a threat that MUST be taken seriously.

Where there is a need to ascertain identity... even if that is just to prove you are the eligible owner of a discount bus pass.... I have no problem with anyone being required to remove anything which prevents recognition.

However, I do have a very big problem with the outright banning of a garment of choice. It harms no one for a woman to sit on a park bench wearing a burka and I believe they should have just as much right to wear one as I have to wear a gorilla suit, clown make-up, big sunglasses, a hoody, a scarf, a masquerade ball mask or (at the request of most of my meets) a brown paper bag on my head.

you think the burka is just an item of clothing like a baseball cap or a pair of sunglasses etc

in fact , and i appologise if i am mistaken but your avatar recently was a burka ( or someones was )

we all know the klu klux klan is a foul and abhorent organisation , and it pains me to mention them while making this point but

i openly ask the moderators of the site to openly comment on wether a person could have an avatar dressed as a kkk

i very very very much doubt it , and thank goodness for that

would they allow an avatar wearing a gorilla mask , probably yes

anyway they wouldnt be able to tell if i had one on or not !

"

Ok forgive me if I have read this wrong.......are you comparing wearing a Burka to the KKK?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *atisfy janeWoman
over a year ago

Torquay


"It seems that Westerners will never truly understand the minds of Arabic muslims (the area of Islam that the Burkah originates from). I have worked with muslims from all areas of Islam and I have asked the question of some wearers - "do you really want to wear a burkah?". The answer is always a variation of "of course I want to wear it, because that is what my father/husband wishes - I will serve my husband/father in this life and the next". Of the slightly less devout muslims that I talk to, the majority do not agree with the wearing of it.

To those that don't wish to ban it - if this statement is true, and it's only being worn because the men demand it, are you still in favour of not banning it?"

By the same token I worked with many Muslim women when I worked in hospital pharmacies in the past (many Muslim women become pharmacists.

I have completely different experiences than you while working with these women and never got the impression that they were under any form of pressure, I think some of us on here are not giving Muslim women enough credit for their abilities to think for themselves.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Good thing...

Simple as that

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It seems that Westerners will never truly understand the minds of Arabic muslims (the area of Islam that the Burkah originates from). I have worked with muslims from all areas of Islam and I have asked the question of some wearers - "do you really want to wear a burkah?". The answer is always a variation of "of course I want to wear it, because that is what my father/husband wishes - I will serve my husband/father in this life and the next". Of the slightly less devout muslims that I talk to, the majority do not agree with the wearing of it.

To those that don't wish to ban it - if this statement is true, and it's only being worn because the men demand it, are you still in favour of not banning it?

By the same token I worked with many Muslim women when I worked in hospital pharmacies in the past (many Muslim women become pharmacists.

I have completely different experiences than you while working with these women and never got the impression that they were under any form of pressure, I think some of us on here are not giving Muslim women enough credit for their abilities to think for themselves."

I think some people on here are so anti anything thats different, regarding muslims especially.

I am also summising that all the people who are so anti muslim have never been to a muslim owned restaurant, take away, shop etc.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

I am somewhere in the middle.... but I am not one for putting rose coloured glasses on.

Just because there are women that have said they have their own minds and wouldn't be oppressed by any man doesn't mean that there are not a lot of women out there who are oppressed by men, whatever religion.

It just so happens that with different cultures, men are number one and make sure it stays that way...

I also know that some things that happen in this country makes a lot of people say "WTF " me included......but I think there is a difference when some people can't see past what they see is an injustice, so make any other story that goes on an injustice too, just because.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"I think some people on here are so anti anything thats different, regarding muslims especially.

I am also summising that all the people who are so anti muslim have never been to a muslim owned restaurant, take away, shop etc."

Or maybe some of us see a correlation between the growth of fundamentalist Islam, the radicalization of Muslim youth, the increase of the burka, the increase in honer killings of Muslim women and the worldwide explosion in violence against any the fail to submit to the most extreme Arab interpretation of Islam.

One final point to those who refuse to consider that I may be right, if my radical and reactionary view prevails and British Muslims are made to integrate and abide by all our laws regardless of religious teachings and I am wrong in my reading of what is happening, we remove one piece of positive discrimination and in doing so make this country a more equal place for all. If my critics pro Muslim, politically correct, live and let live, liberal views prevail and you are wrong you sentence future generations to the tyranny that is the Saudi state or the Afghan state under the Taliban.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

Just a coupe of points for all of you ladies who are so pro the burka and who know so many Muslim women who tell you they wear the burka willingly.

How many times have you know women who have been beaten up by their men but have denied that they are being abused?

And how many of the women wearing the burka are covering up the bruises of violent husbands?

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *uton_coupleCouple
over a year ago

luton


"Polo I think that if you go and do some research that you will find that Hamza (I take it your spelling is correct) is actually a Wasabi preacher, and that was one of the reasons that we cannot extradite him (he had preached the same hate in Egypt and they want to take his head for the murders he inspired in their country I believe).

I know what he is..... I also know he is not the voice of the majority when it comes to Muslims and certainly not the inspiration for women to choose to wear a burka.

There was an interesting programme on TV recently about an English guy who was following the Tropic of Cancer around the globe and tried to enter/visit all the countries it passed through. One of those countries is Saudi Arabia and whilst there he was monitored closely by the govt so that he didn't film in sensitive areas nor project a bad image of the Saudi people. He given a guide to remain with him while he filmed and SHE wore a hijab but also explained that a lot of muslim women CHOOSE to wear the full-face burka and are not forced into it as some western cultures believed. She went on to state that they see it as a way of protecting themselves from unwanted attention from men who are not their husbands and are quite happy to wear them.

We, in the West, have issues with them for security reasons alone. There were pictures in the press recently showing women in full-face burkas learning how to fire rifles and proud of what they were doing and trying to achieve. I cannot say who produced this propoganda, either Western sensationalist journalism or proactive muslim fundamentalists, but the security threat of people wearing full-face coverings is very real and in a country closely allied to the USA, as we are, it is a threat that MUST be taken seriously.

Where there is a need to ascertain identity... even if that is just to prove you are the eligible owner of a discount bus pass.... I have no problem with anyone being required to remove anything which prevents recognition.

However, I do have a very big problem with the outright banning of a garment of choice. It harms no one for a woman to sit on a park bench wearing a burka and I believe they should have just as much right to wear one as I have to wear a gorilla suit, clown make-up, big sunglasses, a hoody, a scarf, a masquerade ball mask or (at the request of most of my meets) a brown paper bag on my head.

you think the burka is just an item of clothing like a baseball cap or a pair of sunglasses etc

in fact , and i appologise if i am mistaken but your avatar recently was a burka ( or someones was )

we all know the klu klux klan is a foul and abhorent organisation , and it pains me to mention them while making this point but

i openly ask the moderators of the site to openly comment on wether a person could have an avatar dressed as a kkk

i very very very much doubt it , and thank goodness for that

would they allow an avatar wearing a gorilla mask , probably yes

anyway they wouldnt be able to tell if i had one on or not !

Ok forgive me if I have read this wrong.......are you comparing wearing a Burka to the KKK?"

no im am not making that comparison at all

i am pointing out that there is a difference between sunglasses gorilla , masks , and burkas

in some parts of the world it is deeply offensive for a woman to be seen NOT wearing a burka

some people on the threads have said they find the burka offensive or intimidating

i was attempting to dress the comment of

___________________________________

However, I do have a very big problem with the outright banning of a garment of choice. It harms no one for a woman to sit on a park bench wearing a burka

________________________________________

i doubt anyone would say the same about the dreadfull kkk garments

so in my veiw there is a difference between a pair of sunglasses and a burka

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville


"In response to naughtynymphos ( see im being good Rugby) i disagree, not all unmarried muslim women forgoe the Burka, i know lots that do wear it.....lots wear it down to choice, while i dont dispell the fact that some of muslim hubbys are insistent ..lots are not

The thing i would find hard though is how can we know they are not just saying they wear them through choice because that is what they have been forced to say? well you could ask that of every situation a couple can be in really cant you? how do u know that husband A doesnt make wife A shop at tescos when really she wants to shop at Waitrose, the list is endless, whilst i have said some CHOOSE to wear it i know SOME DO NOT

Being made to wear a full veil so that the only thing barely on show is your eyes is slightly different to shopping in tesco instead of waitrose, all i meant really was that there are many out there who say there wear it through choice who unfortunately do not. And for once I actually believe im right.Well you would do, all people who are wrong believe they are right you know

Prove me wrong and i will gladly stand corrected. Otherwise, my opinion is just as relevant as yours "
I agree you are entitled to your opinion

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *arnaclebillMan
over a year ago

Robin Hood County


"Good ... it`s not actually required under islam "

I think they should continue to allow it especially for the ugly ones

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Good ... it`s not actually required under islam

I think they should continue to allow it especially for the ugly ones"

Sorry but had ta smile at that one xx

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Good ... it`s not actually required under islam

I think they should continue to allow it especially for the ugly ones

Sorry but had ta smile at that one xx "

Haven't read all the posts then Soapy...it's been written about 10 times now!!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Good ... it`s not actually required under islam

I think they should continue to allow it especially for the ugly ones

Sorry but had ta smile at that one xx

Haven't read all the posts then Soapy...it's been written about 10 times now!! "

Nope i aint lol xx

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

Ok thanks for your reply Luton, I won't quote the post as it is huge.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Well i feel sorry for the people in shops and banks etc that have to deal with them. It can't be pleasant when you have to deal with someone who at best makes you feel uncomfortable.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It seems that Westerners will never truly understand the minds of Arabic muslims (the area of Islam that the Burkah originates from). I have worked with muslims from all areas of Islam and I have asked the question of some wearers - "do you really want to wear a burkah?". The answer is always a variation of "of course I want to wear it, because that is what my father/husband wishes - I will serve my husband/father in this life and the next"."

I could be wrong but I believe Islam is a religion, not a geographical location.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It seems that Westerners will never truly understand the minds of Arabic muslims (the area of Islam that the Burkah originates from). I have worked with muslims from all areas of Islam and I have asked the question of some wearers - "do you really want to wear a burkah?". The answer is always a variation of "of course I want to wear it, because that is what my father/husband wishes - I will serve my husband/father in this life and the next".

I could be wrong but I believe Islam is a religion, not a geographical location."

You're not! Even children in primary schools know Islam is a religion and not a geographical location!

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It seems that Westerners will never truly understand the minds of Arabic muslims (the area of Islam that the Burkah originates from). I have worked with muslims from all areas of Islam and I have asked the question of some wearers - "do you really want to wear a burkah?". The answer is always a variation of "of course I want to wear it, because that is what my father/husband wishes - I will serve my husband/father in this life and the next".

I could be wrong but I believe Islam is a religion, not a geographical location.

You're not! Even children in primary schools know Islam is a religion and not a geographical location! "

It makes it somewhat difficult to take comments seriously from someone who says that have had close interaction with Muslims yet fails to demonstrate a full understanding of what Islam is.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston


"It seems that Westerners will never truly understand the minds of I have worked with muslims from all areas of Islam and I have asked the question of some wearers - "do you really want to wear a burkah?". The answer is always a variation of "of course I want to wear it, because that is what my father/husband wishes - I will serve my husband/father in this life and the next".

I could be wrong but I believe Islam is a religion, not a geographical location.

You're not! Even children in primary schools know Islam is a religion and not a geographical location!

It makes it somewhat difficult to take comments seriously from someone who says that have had close interaction with Muslims yet fails to demonstrate a full understanding of what Islam is. "

I see you are playing semantic pingpong again Wishy.

What was said was, Arabic muslims [note ARABIC](the area of Islam that the Burkah originates from), a factualy correct statement.

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
 
 

By *ugby 123Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

O o O oo

This is getting way too long sorry.

If someone wants to start Part 2?

Thanks

 (closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately
back to top