FabSwingers.com forum: Good news for teachers 2

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Yer six weeks HOLIDAYS start tomorrow, if they haven't already done so.

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By *anejohnkent6263Couple
over a year ago

canterbury

more holidays more bakers days ,more teacher training days less hours,good wages, paid sick days ,and a pension for doing diddle squat get in the real world u teachers and if u dont like your working conditions get some gonads and get another job that makes u happy.oh no u aint got the balls to come to real world ....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"more holidays more bakers days ,more teacher training days less hours,good wages, paid sick days ,and a pension for doing diddle squat get in the real world u teachers and if u dont like your working conditions get some gonads and get another job that makes u happy.oh no u aint got the balls to come to real world ...."

This is the reason we need good teachers.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

This is the reason we need good teachers."

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By *bony in IvoryCouple
over a year ago

Black&White Utopia

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By *bony in IvoryCouple
over a year ago

Black&White Utopia

This is the reason we need good teachers."

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By *xxwiganMan
over a year ago

LEIGH

Someone did not like school, let it go.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

WTF does that mean - 'live in the real world'. Where the fuck else do teachers live? They deal with real people, with real problems, etc. Also, many teachers have had jobs in OTHER sectors prior to teaching - so which 'real world' is this - some fairy land which people like to throw into an argument as some kind of spurious evidence that teachers are out-of-touch? A specious means to trying to win an argument with nothing else than a soundbite?

Get real.

I certainly am.

All those who say - don't like it leave teaching and get a 'proper job' - I say to you. If it is so easy - YOU DO IT!

I'd say two weeks before you realised you couldn't hack it.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

Yer six weeks HOLIDAYS start tomorrow, if they haven't already done so. "

Some schools don't break up until next week. And they are unpaid holidays. As has been stated, and proven, time and again on these threads - ad nauseum.

Pick another argument - that one is more than a little frayed at the edges.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"WTF does that mean - 'live in the real world'. Where the fuck else do teachers live? They deal with real people, with real problems, etc. Also, many teachers have had jobs in OTHER sectors prior to teaching - so which 'real world' is this - some fairy land which people like to throw into an argument as some kind of spurious evidence that teachers are out-of-touch? A specious means to trying to win an argument with nothing else than a soundbite?

Get real.

I certainly am.

All those who say - don't like it leave teaching and get a 'proper job' - I say to you. If it is so easy - YOU DO IT!

I'd say two weeks before you realised you couldn't hack it."

Its not that hard really if you are organised and can control the kids I think you will find a lot do hack it. I did leave it after 10 years and took a different path but people hacking it? Really I think not its not as hard as many other careers.

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Baker Days, that takes me back.

The secondary academy I know well starts at 8.15am and finishes at 3pm. Then the after school clubs start for a couple of hours, running alongside detentions. If there are serious detentions they happen on a Saturday. Parents evenings go on for three or four days in a row. At this time of year they have also had to get familiar with the new intake ready for September, keep up with all the end of year plays, concerts, art showings etc. and handle sports days.

The teachers are required to be available online until 9pm to receive homework queries, even on a Friday. Every day they have to record the performance of every pupil they have taught that day so that other teachers, the pupil and parents can go on line and see how that child has been at school that day. That's a regular 13 hour day 5 days a week.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Baker Days, that takes me back.

The teachers are required to be available online until 9pm to receive homework queries, even on a Friday.

Really? so is that one 25% 50% or all schools as it's definitely not the case with my ex colleges.

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By *Kgirl80Woman
over a year ago

South Coast

I think the point being made, isn't necessarily that's it's a harder job than others... More that it's a vocation, and unless you truly love it, it's not a sustainable career choice.

The statistics for NQTs leaving the profession within a few years are shocking, especially when training is so expensive.

The long, unpaid holidays are undeniably well timed, however often serve only to counterbalance the 39 weeks a year where 60+ hours are worked.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

I think the main point being made is that the leave teachers have is bitterly resented by many people.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Unfortunately most of these threads are created by Trolls.

If all you can do is fire abuse and vitriolic comments, claiming others have it so easy and that they should stop moaning when in fact that's exactly what you're doing, then why not commit yourself to such an easy job ? We all make choices. If you find you have no choices then education will provide you with some....in all aspects of life.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think the main point being made is that the leave teachers have is bitterly resented by many people."

Why?

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Baker Days, that takes me back.

The teachers are required to be available online until 9pm to receive homework queries, even on a Friday.

Really? so is that one 25% 50% or all schools as it's definitely not the case with my ex colleges."

I know more about one secondary school much more than others. That is why I have made the statement about that school.

The academies in the boroughs around me have taken similar lines on managing the workload and using ICT to provide performance information. It's been a while since I have been a governor but I am still involved with schools in other ways.

The primary schools I know often have teachers working beyond 7pm.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" Unfortunately most of these threads are created by Trolls.

Because if they could, they would.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

"I think the main point being made is that the leave teachers have is bitterly resented by many people.

Why?"

Why do I think it?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Less hours than who? As I have said (many times now) during this thread I work 7.30am - 6.30pm most days. Sometimes I get to leave at 5.30pm, sometimes I'm there till the caretaker kicks us out at 7pm. Most of my friends are teachers and work the same hours, the few friends I have in other jobs all work less hours than I do.

I usually go into school the last week of the holidays to set up the classroom, and also go in sometimes at half terms.

I also take work home for the weekend.

If you think those hours and the workload I have counts as me doing "diddle squat" - its diddly, btw - then perhaps it is you who needs to get into the real world.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think the main point being made is that the leave teachers have is bitterly resented by many people.

Why?

Why do I think it?"

Why do people bitterly resent it?

I have met a great deal of people this week _xpressing the opposite sentiment.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yer six weeks HOLIDAYS start tomorrow, if they haven't already done so. "

And no, actually, my school doesn't break up until next Wednesday.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Baker Days, that takes me back.

The teachers are required to be available online until 9pm to receive homework queries, even on a Friday.

Really? so is that one 25% 50% or all schools as it's definitely not the case with my ex colleges.

I know more about one secondary school much more than others. That is why I have made the statement about that school.

The primary schools I know often have teachers working beyond 7pm.

Its that you implied that teachers all worked "13 hour day 5 days" and worked till 9pm I have just phoned an ex college over another matter and he words not mine were "which silly sod told you that we would all walk out". Now I support teachers as some are good but many not and went into it as they got a poor degree and did a conversion to then teach. I can appreciate you backing teachers but I think you stretched it a little there.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

"I think the main point being made is that the leave teachers have is bitterly resented by many people.

Why?

Why do I think it?

Why do people bitterly resent it?

I have met a great deal of people this week _xpressing the opposite sentiment."

I see, I have no idea why unless it's envy. I've met people who have both attitudes but resentful people outweigh the others.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its that you implied that teachers all worked "13 hour day 5 days" and worked till 9pm I have just phoned an ex college over another matter and he words not mine were "which silly sod told you that we would all walk out". Now I support teachers as some are good but many not and went into it as they got a poor degree and did a conversion to then teach. I can appreciate you backing teachers but I think you stretched it a little there. "

I'm interested to know what you taught and how long ago?

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Baker Days, that takes me back.

The teachers are required to be available online until 9pm to receive homework queries, even on a Friday.

Really? so is that one 25% 50% or all schools as it's definitely not the case with my ex colleges.

I know more about one secondary school much more than others. That is why I have made the statement about that school.

The primary schools I know often have teachers working beyond 7pm.

I speak from my experience, just as you do from yours. Finding a typical school now is quite difficult with the mix of academies and free schools able to do pretty much as they please. When you are in an area that has embraced almost wholesale the academy status and used that to set their own rules these sorts of hours happen.

Their argument and justification is that is has yielded the improvements in results that London is enjoying. Sir Michael is the leader on whom they have modelled themselves.

You see it as me stretching it and I am just saying what I know of the teachers and schools I know about.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My academy finished yesterday, for their hard earned break. I am contracted to work all year round so had a peaceful day today. Me and the handful of others that turned in.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Get real.

I certainly am.

All those who say - don't like it leave teaching and get a 'proper job' - I say to you. If it is so easy - YOU DO IT!

I'd say two weeks before you realised you couldn't hack it.

I think that's also dependent on where you teach. My sister in law and I both taught year 2 for the same year. She had a nice little village primary up north and I was in Tottenham. We both had very different experiences. I'm not saying hers was better. I like working in deprived areas as I get more job satisfaction out of it. However, she had no children with IEPs... I had six. All her kids were native English speaking... 85% of mine were not. We ended up with completely different workloads.

Sometimes it is very hard.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Baker Days, that takes me back.

The teachers are required to be available online until 9pm to receive homework queries, even on a Friday.

Really? so is that one 25% 50% or all schools as it's definitely not the case with my ex colleges.

I know more about one secondary school much more than others. That is why I have made the statement about that school.

The primary schools I know often have teachers working beyond 7pm.

Their argument and justification is that is has yielded the improvements in results that London is enjoying. Sir Michael is the leader on whom they have modelled themselves.

You see it as me stretching it and I am just saying what I know of the teachers and schools I know about.

So 13 hour day 5 days really? Is dishonest a better word?

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Baker Days, that takes me back.

The teachers are required to be available online until 9pm to receive homework queries, even on a Friday.

Really? so is that one 25% 50% or all schools as it's definitely not the case with my ex colleges.

I know more about one secondary school much more than others. That is why I have made the statement about that school.

The primary schools I know often have teachers working beyond 7pm.

Their argument and justification is that is has yielded the improvements in results that London is enjoying. Sir Michael is the leader on whom they have modelled themselves.

You see it as me stretching it and I am just saying what I know of the teachers and schools I know about.

So 13 hour day 5 days really? Is dishonest a better word?"

They are required to be available online to answer pupil queries until 9pm. You interpret that as you please. Just as the pupils are required to submit their online homework by 9pm (so that it is timestamped) to avoid it being in late.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Baker Days, that takes me back.

The teachers are required to be available online until 9pm to receive homework queries, even on a Friday.

Really? so is that one 25% 50% or all schools as it's definitely not the case with my ex colleges.

I know more about one secondary school much more than others. That is why I have made the statement about that school.

The primary schools I know often have teachers working beyond 7pm.

Their argument and justification is that is has yielded the improvements in results that London is enjoying. Sir Michael is the leader on whom they have modelled themselves.

You see it as me stretching it and I am just saying what I know of the teachers and schools I know about.

So 13 hour day 5 days really? Is dishonest a better word?

Actualy thats not true there may be a small percentage in a limited number of schools that do but they do not do it every night so please get your facts right. And to claim teachers work a 13 hr day 5 days a week is dishonest to say the least but that was your aim. In reality there will be the odd head teacher that does and 95% and more really do not picking the odd example to try and say something is decisive at best and far from honest.

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland

" Unfortunately most of these threads are created by Trolls.

just because someone's point of view is not the same as yours that does not necessarily make the opposing argument a Troll...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You have to laugh don't you. Real world. I'm laughing my nads of here. I'll come back with a proper response once my sides stop hurting.

Funniest post I've ever read. Well played

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

My aim was dishonest? Thanks for that information. I can see there is no point trying to explain, again, what I have said. I assume you know the schools I have been referring to better than I do?

I have not claimed it is all schools. I have stated it is the academy schools that have adopted a particular model. However, as you know best I will defer to your frankly insulting comments and beliefs about my intentions and statements.

Enjoy your certainty and chalk up the winning points on getting me worked up.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I can't see it myself. There are a few teachers in the academy from 7:30 and still there at 5-6pm. Most arrive 8-ish and are gone by 4-ish.

My this academy is too easy on them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is the point you are making that teachers don't work long hours? I find that surprising from somebody that claims to have been a teacher.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is the point you are making that teachers don't work long hours? I find that surprising from somebody that claims to have been a teacher."

My point is teachers do not work 13 hour days 5 hays a week that is a fabrication of facts don't tell me you believe they do those hours?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is the point you are making that teachers don't work long hours? I find that surprising from somebody that claims to have been a teacher.

My point is teachers do not work 13 hour days 5 hays a week that is a fabrication of facts don't tell me you believe they do those hours?"

To be fair though, she never once said ALL teachers work those hours. She said the teachers in one academy group do.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is the point you are making that teachers don't work long hours? I find that surprising from somebody that claims to have been a teacher.

My point is teachers do not work 13 hour days 5 hays a week that is a fabrication of facts don't tell me you believe they do those hours?"

For four years I left home at 6am, returned home at 6pm and would work from 8-10pm at least 2 days of the week, sometimes more. I would also work at least half a day at the weekend. This was without parents evenings, meetings, training, discos, performances.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is the point you are making that teachers don't work long hours? I find that surprising from somebody that claims to have been a teacher.

My point is teachers do not work 13 hour days 5 hays a week that is a fabrication of facts don't tell me you believe they do those hours?

Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" Unfortunately most of these threads are created by Trolls.

just because someone's point of view is not the same as yours that does not necessarily make the opposing argument a Troll... "

But having a different point if view and putting out wrong information are two different things.

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By *effrey45Man
over a year ago

Lytham

It's a reflection on a society that pays people more money to look after their money than to teach their children

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

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By *lassyandadventurousMan
over a year ago

England and Wales

Teachers....dont even start me on them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

The teachers union itself claims a secondary classroom teachers work up to a 55.7 hour week which at times they will but other times its far less even at the maximum the unions claim when you take out 7 of the 13 weeks holidays they get and training days where its a short day the average hours compared to a job which has 30 days holiday a year comes down to 46.8 hours which is a big difference to some a claimed 65 by some.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

I've never lived more than 30mins away from a school.

For someone who claims they were a teacher you seem very quick to argue against the rest of us who are. Odd.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

There is very little downtime in teaching, in or out of school.

The only exaggeration I see here is your teaching experience.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

I've never lived more than 30mins away from a school.

For someone who claims they were a teacher you seem very quick to argue against the rest of us who are. Odd."

I dislike bullshit and people claiming to be badly done to when in reality many teachers would struggle in other carers. Not every one is going to go Aww poor poor teachers just because they were once one.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

There is very little downtime in teaching, in or out of school.

The only exaggeration I see here is your teaching experience."

Actually that's not true but its good to keep up the pretense.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

In London it's a case of teachers can't afford to live where they teach.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

There is very little downtime in teaching, in or out of school.

The only exaggeration I see here is your teaching experience."

Bless you are grasping at straws when facts are presented its funny though you don't think a 46 yr old woman couldn't have spent 10 years out of her working life in teaching its obvious maths isn't your strong point.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

In London it's a case of teachers can't afford to live where they teach. "

Nobody can renting or buying there is just madness. On the location issue for teachers though very few live near the kids that go to their school they don't want to be seen out or be vulnerable though that's not really the right word.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

I've never lived more than 30mins away from a school.

For someone who claims they were a teacher you seem very quick to argue against the rest of us who are. Odd.

I never claimed to be badly done by. If I didn't want to teach then I wouldn't. I however dislike people telling me how easy it is, how short my hours are, how little work I do and basically how useless all teacher are, when I know how much time and effort I put into my job everyday.

Maybe you didn't read the first part of this thread where that was being thrown around... I don't know. But I would never disrespect another person in the same profession as myself knowing how hard they must work too.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

I've never lived more than 30mins away from a school.

For someone who claims they were a teacher you seem very quick to argue against the rest of us who are. Odd.

Is 55.7 hours a short week? Well it is for me in my line but I wouldn't say 55.7 is.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

I've never lived more than 30mins away from a school.

For someone who claims they were a teacher you seem very quick to argue against the rest of us who are. Odd.

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Reality check travelling time to work and back is not part of the working day not for teachers not for anyone.

So putting in figures like 6am to 6pm thats 12 hours you are insinuating those were hours worked which is deceive.

So lets start again in the real world exclude your travelling time and start again.

My journey time was 20 mins each way, sometimes 30. I had about 15 mins for lunch. Probably 4 pisses a day at 2-3 mins a time.

However you look at it it's all day, every day, bar the weekend, working.

Talking of reality check, what did you teach again?

20 mins to work thats incredibly short for a teacher most don't want to live where they teach!

THE FACTS! The real ones not exaggerated as you seem to want to portray.

I've never lived more than 30mins away from a school.

For someone who claims they were a teacher you seem very quick to argue against the rest of us who are. Odd.

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job."

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Get real.

I certainly am.

All those who say - don't like it leave teaching and get a 'proper job' - I say to you. If it is so easy - YOU DO IT!

I'd say two weeks before you realised you couldn't hack it."

its yer job, the one you wanted so just get on with it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Get real.

I certainly am.

All those who say - don't like it leave teaching and get a 'proper job' - I say to you. If it is so easy - YOU DO IT!

I'd say two weeks before you realised you couldn't hack it.

its yer job, the one you wanted so just get on with it"

They are getting on with it , they are just answering criticisms of their trade.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 18/07/14 01:27:46]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I never claimed to be badly done by. If I didn't want to teach then I wouldn't. I however dislike people telling me how easy it is, how short my hours are, how little work I do and basically how useless all teacher are, when I know how much time and effort I put into my job everyday.

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures."

Standards in state schools have fallen!

The introduction of the GCSE, modular examinations and coursework have improved results, but education has fallen as a result. Now, more than ever, the privately educated dominate every sphere of public influence because they have received an education that is far superior to what is being offered by the standard state school. You can not blame employers for wanting to employ the best qualified people.

The only reason why the politicians can get away with allowing standards in schools to keep on falling is because the teachers will not admit that it is happening. Therefore, those people that receive a state education are at a disadvantage and as a result will generally have fewer life opportunities.

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers."

I'm curious to know why you think a teacher would want your sympathy ?

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By *isexmistressWoman
over a year ago

Prestwich

My niece who has just started her first job as a teacher,went to view another job @ their invitation to `raise standards`

She said she would like to think about it,went back to work,told them she had been offered the position at the other school and got a £2.5k promotion on the spot so as not to lose her.!

And declining the offered position was told they would like her to consider it fir next year...

She is 23 only been in the job 3 months!

Basically,cream rises to the surface...Any kids taught by her are going to do well and THATS the shame with Gove going as who else is gonna take on the NUT,force thru change and raise standards ....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"My niece who has just started her first job as a teacher,went to view another job @ their invitation to `raise standards`

She said she would like to think about it,went back to work,told them she had been offered the position at the other school and got a £2.5k promotion on the spot so as not to lose her.!

And declining the offered position was told they would like her to consider it fir next year...

She is 23 only been in the job 3 months!

Basically,cream rises to the surface...Any kids taught by her are going to do well and THATS the shame with Gove going as who else is gonna take on the NUT,force thru change and raise standards ....

You seem to be implying that the NUT are making standards slip. Can you explain this ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

I'm curious to know why you think a teacher would want your sympathy ? "

Recently, the teachers went on strike regarding a dispute over pay, pensions and workload: they want a better offer from the Government. However, if the Government gives into their demands then the taxpayer will have to pay.

The reason why the teachers want my and every other taxpayers sympathy is because it is the taxpayer that will ultimately have to pay. If the public opinion is against the Unions then the Government will be in a strong position to defeat them. The teachers and Unions will only be successful if the public opinion is on their side. Therefore, they need my sympathy.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

I'm curious to know why you think a teacher would want your sympathy ?

After reading what you think about teachers I think they'd rather do without yours.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

I'm curious to know why you think a teacher would want your sympathy ?

After reading what you think about teachers I think they'd rather do without yours. "

That maybe the case.

Unfortunately for you and the teachers, public opinion seems to be with the Government. Therefore, the Unions and teachers will lose.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

I'm curious to know why you think a teacher would want your sympathy ?

After reading what you think about teachers I think they'd rather do without yours.

That maybe the case.

Unfortunately for you and the teachers, public opinion seems to be with the Government. Therefore, the Unions and teachers will lose."

Not necessarily old bean. Public support nor government support was ever with the RMT but they won a very high percentage of their disputes.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

I'm curious to know why you think a teacher would want your sympathy ?

After reading what you think about teachers I think they'd rather do without yours.

That maybe the case.

Unfortunately for you and the teachers, public opinion seems to be with the Government. Therefore, the Unions and teachers will lose.

Not necessarily old bean. Public support nor government support was ever with the RMT but they won a very high percentage of their disputes.

It's my personal opinion, if labour win the general election, the teachers will still not get what they want.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

I'm curious to know why you think a teacher would want your sympathy ?

After reading what you think about teachers I think they'd rather do without yours.

That maybe the case.

Unfortunately for you and the teachers, public opinion seems to be with the Government. Therefore, the Unions and teachers will lose.

Not necessarily old bean. Public support nor government support was ever with the RMT but they won a very high percentage of their disputes.

It's my personal opinion, if labour win the general election, the teachers will still not get what they want."

Is your personal opinion still that I live in an expensive house in a leafy village ? Because you got that wrong as well.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There does seem to be some misconception that public sector get free pensions. They pay for them.

There's elements of society who make no plans for their old age or perhaps can't afford to. We all help pay for that.

There are some perks to being a Teacher I'm sure, but it's certainly not the walk in the park some would have you believe.

How about supporting them ? After all they are instrumental in our countries future and our children's.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

"It's a reflection on a society that pays people more money to look after their money than to teach their children"

Well said!

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

"Recently, the teachers went on strike regarding a dispute over pay, pensions and workload: they want a better offer from the Government. However, if the Government gives into their demands then the taxpayer will have to pay.

There does seem to be some misconception that public sector get free pensions. They pay for them.

There's elements of society who make no plans for their old age or perhaps can't afford to. We all help pay for that.

There are some perks to being a Teacher I'm sure, but it's certainly not the walk in the park some would have you believe.

How about supporting them ? After all they are instrumental in our countries future and our children's.

And again well said!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This is reminiscent of a monty python sketch.

Teachers, teachers. Don't talk to me about teachers. Those lollipop men / women get my goat work two hours a day, then have the nerve to take 6 weeks off in the summer!!! Splitters....

If you are clever enough you can do any job you like, so don't complain about what others do, if its good train up and do it yourself. Personally I could never stand in front of a room full of kids every day. Holidays would not make that easier.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think some people clearly had a difficult time at school and now feel resentful, and a fair few coukd really do with going back.

It's interesting how negative some ex-teachers are on here too which makes me suspect they struggled with doing the job. Like any profession there are good and bad but the arguments about declining standards are nonsense and based only on right wing tabloid rubbish.

We have one of the best education systems in the world. That didn't happen by accident.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Jealousy is a terrible trait in people! If you think it's easy you grow some balls and go and get all the qualifications needed to become a teacher. Sounds like you are in a dull job and think the grass is greener on the other side. Well if you think it's that good you try it. Or do you not have the balls!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers."

I didn't ask for your sympathy. I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive about people in a profession you clearly know nothing about. There is a difference that I'm already sure you can't see.

But I shall take comfort knowing the people who left school with a C in GCSE maths, who are now teaching GCSE maths in the wealthy suburban leafy village of Walthamstow are laughing at your ignorance.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If it's that cushy and that easy....you do it......

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

Is this the same real world that's populated by the much discussed real women?

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By *athnBobCouple
over a year ago

sandwell

Sad fact of todays society is that the "have nots" (in this case people with crap jobs and short holidays) would rather spend their time trying to drag everybody down to their level rather than getting off their arses and finding themselves a better job.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Unfortunately for you and the teachers, public opinion seems to be with the Government. Therefore, the Unions and teachers will lose."

For evidence of this look no further than the prime minister's overwhelming support of Michael Gove.

oh...

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

If it's that cushy and that easy....you do it...... "

You'll need 5years training. Hm who will you turn to for that?

Teachers?

Because teacher trainers were or are teachers. Those same people who taught you how to read, write, add, subtract, etc.

Or maybe you just absorbed these skills by some kind of osmosis (look it up- it's on the science curriculum).

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Teachers pay is hardly like bankers, the summer holiday they get is fair in relation to hours and expectation, in addition to their wages etc.

Go and pick on the 'real world' you bloody haters....

They work hard and deserve a break, in short. They're teaching our tomorrow etc, lets at least acknowledge that.

Happy Friday too!

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By *alandNitaCouple
over a year ago

Scunthorpe

You do really have to have some sympathy for the P.E. teachers though.... Most of them need retraining after a week off, they'll not remember their names after 6

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"On the location issue for teachers though very few live near the kids that go to their school they don't want to be seen out or be vulnerable though that's not really the right word."

Based on what? Only a couple of teachers at both my previous schools lived any more than 30 mins away.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

"On the location issue for teachers though very few live near the kids that go to their school they don't want to be seen out or be vulnerable though that's not really the right word.

Based on what? Only a couple of teachers at both my previous schools lived any more than 30 mins away."

I've known teachers targeted by local youngsters who went to the schools they worked at. Two had to move house it was so bad.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"On the location issue for teachers though very few live near the kids that go to their school they don't want to be seen out or be vulnerable though that's not really the right word.

Based on what? Only a couple of teachers at both my previous schools lived any more than 30 mins away.

I've known teachers targeted by local youngsters who went to the schools they worked at. Two had to move house it was so bad."

I've lived in a school I worked at. Doesn't mean I assumed everybody else did.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This thread has made me feel quite angry. Yes teachers have 'long' holidays but are not able to just have a day off when they want or need one. Their holiday periods are the most expensive time of year to go away anywhere. They cope with a heavy workload day in day out. They cant discipline the children because the parents are likely to sue them. They have to put up with challenging behaviours, antisocial behaviour , disgruntled kids, mardy parents and pressure from Senior Management and Government to produce results from kids who are thick and lazy. Oh yes...they might just get stabbed or shot on the job as well.

They now have to work til they are 67. Their pension contributions have increased but their pensions have been cut. In academies, the Head can decide what to pay them.

Get off their backs and give them the support they deserve.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Some more good news for teachers, that obnoxious little fucker down the road from us has just left school.

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By *UNCHBOXMan
over a year ago

folkestone

"I think some people clearly had a difficult time at school and now feel resentful, and a fair few coukd really do with going back.

We have one of the best education systems in the world. That didn't happen by accident."

My only gripe with teachers is the recycling of crap ones to different schools. How many teachers a year actually get sacked because they aren't up to it?. By all means increase the pay for the best, but it does no service wasting money keeping rubbish ones.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Don't be angry... It's a bit of ignorance mixed with a pinch of trolling.

It's the same rhetoric as in the previous thread...

The pensions issue is simple: The Government needs to conduct a valuation for the sustainability of the scheme. So far they have refused to.

Since 1923 they've made £40bn from the teachers' pension scheme...they clearly want to make more...

As far as 'standards'....international league tables suggest we're ahead of all European countries except Finland.

The unions have repeatedly cited the Finnish model as one we ought to look at, and try to replicate.

Gove chose to ignore this... He's promoted a narrower curriculum vis a vis the ebacc...

Claims to want to enhance rigour, but OFQUAL has simply moved grade boundaries...so it's just as easy/hard to get the same grade as before...

In fact much of his changes are superficial and simply require memorisation as opposed to application/analysis/synthesis (see Bloom's taxonomy)

He's relabelled coursework to controlled assessments...

He ignores the conflict of interest of year 6 teachers invigilating their own classes' exams.

He ignores the conflict of interest of secondary teachers invigilating and marking their own classes' controlled assessments.

He did add computer science to the curriculum...years after most other countries (including Scotland) had.

He replaced national curriculum levels with....well, most likely, levels.

He replaced grades a*-g, with numbers 0-9...

Seriously??

At least Ofsted removed the gradings for observations after realising it was a pointless and inaccurate exercise.

Nicky Morgan ...be better please.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think some people clearly had a difficult time at school and now feel resentful, and a fair few coukd really do with going back.

We have one of the best education systems in the world. That didn't happen by accident."

You claim :'the arguments about declining standards are nonsense and based only on right wing tabloid rubbish.'

Just out of curiosity, Have you ever compared an old O level paper to a modern GCSE one?

The GCSE used to have 3 tiers: Advanced, Intermediate and Foundation level. For whatever reason, The GCSE changed and became a two tier system: Advanced and Foundation level. In my personal opinion, the modern Advanced level tier is largely based upon the discontinued intermediate tier. The modern GCSE is inferior to the original GCSE of 1988!

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By *UNCHBOXMan
over a year ago

folkestone

"Don't be angry... It's a bit of ignorance mixed with a pinch of trolling.

It's the same rhetoric as in the previous thread...

The pensions issue is simple: The Government needs to conduct a valuation for the sustainability of the scheme. So far they have refused to.

Since 1923 they've made £40bn from the teachers' pension scheme...they clearly want to make more...

As far as 'standards'....international league tables suggest we're ahead of all European countries except Finland.

The unions have repeatedly cited the Finnish model as one we ought to look at, and try to replicate.

Gove chose to ignore this... He's promoted a narrower curriculum vis a vis the ebacc...

Claims to want to enhance rigour, but OFQUAL has simply moved grade boundaries...so it's just as easy/hard to get the same grade as before...

In fact much of his changes are superficial and simply require memorisation as opposed to application/analysis/synthesis (see Bloom's taxonomy)

He's relabelled coursework to controlled assessments...

He ignores the conflict of interest of year 6 teachers invigilating their own classes' exams.

He ignores the conflict of interest of secondary teachers invigilating and marking their own classes' controlled assessments.

He did add computer science to the curriculum...years after most other countries (including Scotland) had.

He replaced national curriculum levels with....well, most likely, levels.

He replaced grades a*-g, with numbers 0-9...

Seriously??

At least Ofsted removed the gradings for observations after realising it was a pointless and inaccurate exercise.

Nicky Morgan ...be better please.

You a union rep by any chance?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

'Let us go back and distinguish between the two things that we want to do; for we want to do two things in modern society.

We want one class of persons to have a liberal education, and we want another class of persons, a very much larger class, of necessity, in every society, to forego the privileges of a liberal education and fit themselves to perform specific difficult manual tasks. '

Woodrow Wilson

Maybe it's me, but sometimes I feel our education system is divided into two and is purposefully designed to fit the agenda above, as painted by Mr Wilson.. I fear academisation will further stratify society and amplify the effects of the two tier system that teachers' unions are trying to fight against, in favour of, believe it or not, a high class education for all..not just the few.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You a union rep by any chance?"

He'll no, you need to be an employment law expert to do that, particularly these days!!

I do often read the 'education' section of news sites though..

I have a baby boy and his future to think about.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You claim :'the arguments about declining standards are nonsense and based only on right wing tabloid rubbish.'

Just out of curiosity, Have you ever compared an old O level paper to a modern GCSE one?

Yet despite OFQUAL and the DoE's best efforts, we're still rather high up in international league tables!!

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By *eavenNhellCouple
over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

On the previous thread, there were many people being rude and aggressive towards Michael Gove, but I did not see you defend him. That is rather strange behaviour for someone that does not 'appreciate' people being rude and aggressive.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

Typically, people that have a grade C in GCSE mathematics should not be allowed to teach mathematics, surely. They would not be employed by a private school so why should they be employed by a state school? Maybe, that is another problem with the state education system you choose to defend.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

It is my understanding that you don't you don't need any formal qualifications to teach in a private school. So you could fail your maths GCSE and still work in a private school.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sad fact of todays society is that the "have nots" (in this case people with crap jobs and short holidays) would rather spend their time trying to drag everybody down to their level rather than getting off their arses and finding themselves a better job. "

If someone leaves school illiterate and innumerate then how can they get a better job? Most likely, they will endure poverty all their life because the state education system failed them.

What is wrong with trying to fix an education system that is clearly dysfunctional and is not internationally competitive?

why should the British people accept a second rate state education system given that our Government spends more money on it than most countries?

why should the privately educated be allowed to dominate every sphere of public influence because of falling standards in state schools?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Typically, people that have a grade C in GCSE mathematics should not be allowed to teach mathematics, surely. They would not be employed by a private school so why should they be employed by a state school? Maybe, that is another problem with the state education system you choose to defend."

You have that the wrong way round, UNQUALIFIED teachers can be employed by academy and private schools, but not by state schools.

Bottom line is IF you have kids you have choices of where to send them, you also have choices of how involved you will be in their education.

Teachers can teach whatever they know, so a grade C GCSE pass may be enough to teach 6 year old children maths but not much use at university level.

As for being mean to Michael Gove, he is a politician, he deserves it. Some of his ideas had value but few were thought through properly.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If someone leaves school illiterate and innumerate then how can they get a better job? Most likely, they will endure poverty all their life because the state education system failed them.

No, they failed to learn. Teachers can only put it out there, if parents don't give a toss then they help to condemn their children. I have seen children taught by the same teacher graduate from Oxford with honours, while others from the same class failed to learn the basics.

Same teachers, same system, differences are...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

It is my understanding that you don't you don't need any formal qualifications to teach in a private school. So you could fail your maths GCSE and still work in a private school. "

You do not need any formal 'teaching' qualifications to work in a private school. Given that the average tuition fee for a private school is £12,000 a year, somehow, I do not think the parents would be happy if the mathematics teacher had a grade C in GCSE mathematics. Typically, in order to work at a private school, you have to be very well educated. Unfortunately, the same can't be said about the state schools.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

It is my understanding that you don't you don't need any formal qualifications to teach in a private school. So you could fail your maths GCSE and still work in a private school.

You are wrong. Check your facts. You do not need any maths qualificafactions to teach maths in a private school.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" Typically, in order to work at a private school, you have to be very well educated. Unfortunately, the same can't be said about the state schools."

To work in a state school you need a degree and a teaching qualification.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

You CAN'T teach secondary maths in a state school with only a C at GCSE. This was one of your wild claims. I and several others then pointed out you were wrong and that you need a maths degree and a maths teaching qualification. Surprisingly you never responded to any of those posts or acknowledged your error.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

" Typically, in order to work at a private school, you have to be very well educated. Unfortunately, the same can't be said about the state schools.

To work in a state school you need a degree and a teaching qualification. "

Come now, let's not allow facts to get in the way.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You have that the wrong way round, UNQUALIFIED teachers can be employed by academy and private schools, but not by state schools.

Bottom line is IF you have kids you have choices of where to send them, you also have choices of how involved you will be in their education.

Teachers can teach whatever they know, so a grade C GCSE pass may be enough to teach 6 year old children maths but not much use at university level.

As for being mean to Michael Gove, he is a politician, he deserves it. Some of his ideas had value but few were thought through properly."

If someone graduates from Oxford University then for most private schools that will be good enough. However, the way I understand it, that is not good enough for a state school because they have to have a teaching qualification as well. The Oxford graduate maybe 'unqualified' because he does not have a teaching qualification, but many parents would like their children taught by him/her. There are many so called 'qualified' teachers working in the state schools that do not have the sufficient qualifications to get a teaching job at a private school.

Would you want your kids being taught mathematics by a teacher that had a grade C in GCSE mathematics? It does not happen at a private schools because the parents paying £12,000+ would be very unhappy.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

" Typically, in order to work at a private school, you have to be very well educated. Unfortunately, the same can't be said about the state schools.

To work in a state school you need a degree and a teaching qualification.

Come now, let's not allow facts to get in the way.

Sounds like a modern marking method.

As OP, for the record, i loved school, did OK and above AND i loved the holidays. Win, win.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

Bloomin eck,, repeating the same thing over and over again doesn't make it right you know.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I doubt teachers need be too concerned about the views shown! Enjoy your holidays all

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You have that the wrong way round, UNQUALIFIED teachers can be employed by academy and private schools, but not by state schools.

Bottom line is IF you have kids you have choices of where to send them, you also have choices of how involved you will be in their education.

Teachers can teach whatever they know, so a grade C GCSE pass may be enough to teach 6 year old children maths but not much use at university level.

As for being mean to Michael Gove, he is a politician, he deserves it. Some of his ideas had value but few were thought through properly.

Jesus H. I'm not quite sure how else to word it.

YOU CANT TEACH MATHS WITHOUT A MATHS DEGREE AND MATHS PGCE.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

It is my understanding that you don't you don't need any formal qualifications to teach in a private school. So you could fail your maths GCSE and still work in a private school.

You are wrong. Check your facts. You do not need any maths qualificafactions to teach maths in a private school. "

Yes you do not need any.

However, that does not happen because no parent would pay £12,000+ a year in tuition for a school that did not have teachers that went to GOOD Universities.

Parents are willing to pay all that money because the class sizes are smaller and the teachers are very well educated.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Bloomin eck,, repeating the same thing over and over again doesn't make it right you know."

Well back in the glory days of O Levels, teachers clearly didn't push enough useless subjects like PSE... They have a whole module on admitting you made a mistake.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

supa.wimp, you have proven why a teaching qualification is required by state schools.

Myself and several others have completely failed to teach you the simple fact that a state school teacher needs a much higher level of ability and training than a private school teacher.

In neither case would a grade C be acceptable, but the fact remains that it is possible for unqualified i.e. NO GCSE or any other qualification to work in private schools but NOT possible in state schools.

Bottom line is YOU ARE WRONG!

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

Going to a good university does not make a person a good teacher.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Serious question.

If Finland lead the world standard for education, and send their kids to school from say 6/7 years old

then why aren't the teachers/teachers unions ( in the best possible interest of the child and education) not campaigning that the UK does the same, rather than this idiotic (IMO) starting the National Curriculum at Nursery from the age of what these days 2 or 3?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

lets say there are two teachers.

one went to Oxford university and studied mathematics and got a first class honours. The other went to a university that used to be a polytechnic and got a lower second class honours, 2:2.

The oxford university graduate could get a job working at a private school, but not one at a state school because he/she does not have a teaching qualification.

The one that went to the 'rubbish' university could not get a job, even with a teaching qualification, at a private school because he/she went to a rubbish university.

not all universities are the same are they!!!!! there are people teaching at state schools that will never be able to get a job working for a private school.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

lets say there are two teachers.

one went to Oxford university and studied mathematics and got a first class honours. The other went to a university that used to be a polytechnic and got a lower second class honours, 2:2.

The oxford university graduate could get a job working at a private school, but not one at a state school because he/she does not have a teaching qualification.

The one that went to the 'rubbish' university could not get a job, even with a teaching qualification, at a private school because he/she went to a rubbish university.

not all universities are the same are they!!!!! there are people teaching at state schools that will never be able to get a job working for a private school."

That is not true. A public school can employ anybody it wishes, including the person that went to a 'rubbish university'. In fact they'd be quite likely to if that same person happened to have played sport for England.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

lets say there are two teachers.

one went to Oxford university and studied mathematics and got a first class honours. The other went to a university that used to be a polytechnic and got a lower second class honours, 2:2.

The oxford university graduate could get a job working at a private school, but not one at a state school because he/she does not have a teaching qualification.

The one that went to the 'rubbish' university could not get a job, even with a teaching qualification, at a private school because he/she went to a rubbish university.

not all universities are the same are they!!!!! there are people teaching at state schools that will never be able to get a job working for a private school."

So you acknowledge you were wrong about state schools requiring more than a GCSE to teach maths?

The person who went to the rubbish university may be a much better teacher. Getting a top grade in a subject does not automatically mean you will be able to teach it.

All you are doing with your posts is making is abundantly clear that you know nothing about teaching.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

lets say there are two teachers.

one went to Oxford university and studied mathematics and got a first class honours. The other went to a university that used to be a polytechnic and got a lower second class honours, 2:2.

The oxford university graduate could get a job working at a private school, but not one at a state school because he/she does not have a teaching qualification.

The one that went to the 'rubbish' university could not get a job, even with a teaching qualification, at a private school because he/she went to a rubbish university.

not all universities are the same are they!!!!! there are people teaching at state schools that will never be able to get a job working for a private school.

Private school can employ anyone BUT THEY DO NOT because they receive a lot money in tuition fees!!!!!!!!

I have heard from a good source, if you want to get a job teaching at the £35,000 a year Eton College boarding school you need a Phd.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

lets say there are two teachers.

one went to Oxford university and studied mathematics and got a first class honours. The other went to a university that used to be a polytechnic and got a lower second class honours, 2:2.

The oxford university graduate could get a job working at a private school, but not one at a state school because he/she does not have a teaching qualification.

The one that went to the 'rubbish' university could not get a job, even with a teaching qualification, at a private school because he/she went to a rubbish university.

not all universities are the same are they!!!!! there are people teaching at state schools that will never be able to get a job working for a private school.

Private school can employ anyone BUT THEY DO NOT because they receive a lot money in tuition fees!!!!!!!!

I have heard from a good source, if you want to get a job teaching at the £35,000 a year Eton College boarding school you need a Phd."

You can take it from that is not true. Eton - yes. Other public schools, no.

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Bloomin eck,, repeating the same thing over and over again doesn't make it right you know."

It reinforces it until you can believe it is true. That crease in the page. That learning by rote.

A close family member went to a public school and did well enough. He doesn't think the education he got is patch on what I got in the state system as a rounded education (in the true sense of the word). He is also very happy with the teaching and success of that teaching his children get in the state system.

What worries me is that we lose the very best young teachers after just two or three years due to the hours and stresses of the role. It's expensive to train a teacher and to lose them because they can do financially and socially better, get more respect and have a less stressful life by leaving teaching is very sad.

Being a teacher used to be a well respected career and now we talk about them in such derogatory ways that you have to be drawn to the vocation to choose this and remain with it.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

For those who say you cannot teach in a state school without the minimum degree and teaching qualification, then why are so many unqualified schoolroom assistants teaching classes/children?

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Serious question.

If Finland lead the world standard for education, and send their kids to school from say 6/7 years old

Some have. The reason we don't is a mixture of tradition and now ideology.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yer six weeks HOLIDAYS start tomorrow, if they haven't already done so. "

Also for other members of the school working life. can't wait for Wednesday afternoon

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

For those who say you cannot teach in a state school without the minimum degree and teaching qualification, then why are so many unqualified schoolroom assistants teaching classes/children?

They are not supposed to teach but assist. They are allowed to supervise a class in some situations.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

For those who say you cannot teach in a state school without the minimum degree and teaching qualification, then why are so many unqualified schoolroom assistants teaching classes/children?

They're not supposed to but there are many shortages. Teachers will still have done the planning.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Bloomin eck,, repeating the same thing over and over again doesn't make it right you know.

It reinforces it until you can believe it is true. That crease in the page. That learning by rote.

Being a teacher used to be a well respected career and now we talk about them in such derogatory ways that you have to be drawn to the vocation to choose this and remain with it.

Have you got that the wrong way round?

Didn't it used to be that those whose vocation it was to teach became teachers?

Now many, though not all, just see it as a cushy career choice and good remuneration and yet are not up to the actual job itself? It is no longer a vocation for most.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

lets say there are two teachers.

one went to Oxford university and studied mathematics and got a first class honours. The other went to a university that used to be a polytechnic and got a lower second class honours, 2:2.

The oxford university graduate could get a job working at a private school, but not one at a state school because he/she does not have a teaching qualification.

The one that went to the 'rubbish' university could not get a job, even with a teaching qualification, at a private school because he/she went to a rubbish university.

not all universities are the same are they!!!!! there are people teaching at state schools that will never be able to get a job working for a private school.

So you acknowledge you were wrong about state schools requiring more than a GCSE to teach maths?

The person who went to the rubbish university may be a much better teacher. Getting a top grade in a subject does not automatically mean you will be able to teach it.

All you are doing with your posts is making is abundantly clear that you know nothing about teaching."

What I mean is that a grade C at GCSE is good enough for a state school, but not good enough for a private school!

Yes, typically, to teach in a stae school you need a university degree, I know that. I just talking about GCSE's because they are not as good as the O level.

You talk about universities like they are all the same, they are not. I do not think that a parent would want their kids being taught by someone that had grades C at GCSE and a rubbish university degree, even if they did have a so called teaching qualification.

LOL, the teachers have better than grade C for at a private school.

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Bloomin eck,, repeating the same thing over and over again doesn't make it right you know.

It reinforces it until you can believe it is true. That crease in the page. That learning by rote.

Being a teacher used to be a well respected career and now we talk about them in such derogatory ways that you have to be drawn to the vocation to choose this and remain with it.

Have you got that the wrong way round?

Didn't it used to be that those whose vocation it was to teach became teachers?

Now many, though not all, just see it as a cushy career choice and good remuneration and yet are not up to the actual job itself? It is no longer a vocation for most. "

Teaching has been sold to graduates as a career choice, not a vocation, for at least the last 20 years.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really?

From what I remember, a lot of people were criticising Michael Gove and celebrating that he lost his job.

well most of your posts ended with something about how us useless teachers are ruining children's futures.

Standards in state schools have fallen!

Please do not expect me or anyone else to have any sympathy for teachers.

Really?

You claim: 'I simply don't appreciate you, and others, being unnecessarily rude and aggressive'.

Interestingly, does suggesting that there has been a general decline in the standard of education in schools really qualify as being rude and aggressive? You speak like a true socialist.

lets say there are two teachers.

one went to Oxford university and studied mathematics and got a first class honours. The other went to a university that used to be a polytechnic and got a lower second class honours, 2:2.

The oxford university graduate could get a job working at a private school, but not one at a state school because he/she does not have a teaching qualification.

The one that went to the 'rubbish' university could not get a job, even with a teaching qualification, at a private school because he/she went to a rubbish university.

not all universities are the same are they!!!!! there are people teaching at state schools that will never be able to get a job working for a private school.

Private school can employ anyone BUT THEY DO NOT because they receive a lot money in tuition fees!!!!!!!!

I have heard from a good source, if you want to get a job teaching at the £35,000 a year Eton College boarding school you need a Phd.

You can take it from that is not true. Eton - yes. Other public schools, no."

I am not suggesting that all private school require the teacher to have a Phd. However, all the academic members of staff would have gone to a good University - like the Russell Group.

To get into a Russell Group University you need better than grade C at GCSE.

Are all the teachers employed at a state school educated at a Russell Group University? Somehow I do not think so.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I can't see what point you're arguing?

Do you expect people to say Oxford is crap or just rise to the bait of your derogatory comments about other universities.

One thing I am confident of is that you didn't attend one of the good ones.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Bloomin eck,, repeating the same thing over and over again doesn't make it right you know.

It reinforces it until you can believe it is true. That crease in the page. That learning by rote.

Being a teacher used to be a well respected career and now we talk about them in such derogatory ways that you have to be drawn to the vocation to choose this and remain with it.

If teachers want respect perhaps they should tell the truth about falling standards in schools. The modern GCSE is inferior to the GCSE of 1988. Also, the GCSE, modern and 1988, is inferior to the O level.

You do not need teacher training in the private sector, just get rid of it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You do not need teacher training in the private sector, just get rid of it."

You do know that most public schools actually require teachers to have QTS?

Your arguments are becoming increasingly absurd.

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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

The regional school debates I judge give me hope that we have young people with excellent educational attainment. They at least understand how to argue their points, adapting the text rather than just repeating the same statements over and over.

The private school pupils don't do any better than the state school ones that I have judged.