FabSwingers.com forum: Religion

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

I personally do not believe in any gods across the thousands of different religions, very much "a non believer" as they say and I think the world would be a better place without it.(just my personal opinion)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You not believing in a God is a belief itself. Some nay say that's a religion of non belief.

So, you're statement may be a double whammy.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You not believing in a God is a belief itself. Some may say that's a religion of non belief.

So, you're statement may be a double whammy.

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By *ire_bladeMan
over a year ago

Manchester

"You not believing in a God is a belief itself. Some nay say that's a religion of non belief.

So, you're statement may be a double whammy.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"You not believing in a God is a belief itself. Some may say that's a religion of non belief.

So, you're statement may be a double whammy.

I also believe theres a tin of redbull sitting beside me, which there is, religion fundamentally means the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods, so your statement bears no meaning.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Some would believe in the power of the beard or clunge some people have to worship something.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I cant say that i dont believe in god, im open minded enough to accept that anything that cant be disproved remains a possibility.

When it comes to organised religion though im not a fan, there are two main issues for me the first is that all religions are based on mankinds interpretation of the word of god, which links nicely to the second and thats human nature, we are all subject to temptation and to negative emotions like greed, envy, jealousy and a lust for power, the result is that human beings can use the idea of god and/or religion to control or unduly influence others against their will.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I cant say that i dont believe in god, im open minded enough to accept that anything that cant be disproved remains a possibility.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If u wanna see god, look in the mirror

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Religion is the biggest con ever and causes the most problems

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If religion was to demise, ppl would just find icons to worship.. so no I don't think would make a blind bit of difference..

As a non believer myself, I believe religion breeds hatred, greed, power and most of all war. But saying that, It also brings peace, harmony, hope etc into many ppls lives.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

Hitler had a warped mind, clearly, just look back through history and see the catastrophic number of deaths caused by religion, its very clear to see and it makes Nazi Germanys death statistics look severely miniscule in comparison . This world would very much be a better place, shame people cant get on together in this world.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Religion is the biggest con ever and causes the most problems"

Don't you mean money?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I believe that many so called 'religious' wars had money/power at the very root of them; - probably the easiest way to get the masses onside!

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"If religion was to demise, ppl would just find icons to worship.. so no I don't think would make a blind bit of difference..

As a non believer myself, I believe religion breeds hatred, greed, power and most of all war. But saying that, It also brings peace, harmony, hope etc into many ppls lives."

Id rather have someone worship an "icon" rather than people believing in various gods and committing atrocities in the name of their gods. Yes religion does some good things for people, Hamas done some good things for people, does that make them good? NO.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Alongside religion, remove power, control, wealth, greed.

Religion is just the cover story, the masque

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

Yes he had a warped mind, but I wouldn't go as far to say his evil was mainly focused on religion. He wanted to wipe out all race but his own. Power, greed and control was his main focus IMHO.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to demise, ppl would just find icons to worship.. so no I don't think would make a blind bit of difference..

As a non believer myself, I believe religion breeds hatred, greed, power and most of all war. But saying that, It also brings peace, harmony, hope etc into many ppls lives.

Same thing as one persons icon would be deemed higher ranking than another. So you'll still have issues...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Alongside religion, remove power, control, wealth, greed.

Religion is just the cover story, the masque

This!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Alongside religion, remove power, control, wealth, greed.

Religion is just the cover story, the masque

If all of that were removed this world would be an even bleaker place than it already is.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all"

Hindus have also committed atrocities too, maybe not on the same scale as Islam and Christianity, there is nothing more valuable on this planet than a human life, shame people cant see or understand that.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Alongside religion, remove power, control, wealth, greed.

Religion is just the cover story, the masque

If all of that were removed this world would be an even bleaker place than it already is."

Why is that?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Alongside religion, remove power, control, wealth, greed.

Religion is just the cover story, the masque

If all of that were removed this world would be an even bleaker place than it already is.

Why is that?"

No control= no laws, there has to be some sort of controlled structure to maintain law and peoples rights.

I definitely would not want complete control over ourselves if that what you were referring too.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all"

this is true but its not that far back that there was a lot of violence between hindu, seikh and muslim, the amount of violence before, during and after Indian independance for example.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

Thats why i said hardly....

The 3 other religions are soo similar aswel, as in they share similar beliefs and practices, such, jesus, blessed meat, monotheism....can they not become one and live in harmony?

And when will india be allowed to become a hindu state? The christians have the vatican, jews have isreal, the muslims have all the middle east and are looking to take over other parts of the world now....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

this is true but its not that far back that there was a lot of violence between hindu, seikh and muslim, the amount of violence before, during and after Indian independance for example."

That violence was necessary....the british should not have turned up in india in the first place as they did not come to live in peace, they wanted to take over...when independance was gained, the muslims, as if they did not have enough land in the middle east already, wanted another state hence pakistan was carved out india....not only that, the muslims took another chunk out of india - bangladesh!

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

Thats why i said hardly....

The 3 other religions are soo similar aswel, as in they share similar beliefs and practices, such, jesus, blessed meat, monotheism....can they not become one and live in harmony?

I wish they all could live in harmony, shame they don't think like you, and by the sounds of it these days the Muslim extremists are looking to take control of the world entirely because they have a "peaceful" religion, what kind of horrific world would that lead to, I wouldn't even want to find out.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Oh yeah and god was a killer from the start, why do you think noah had to build his ark?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

Thats why i said hardly....

The 3 other religions are soo similar aswel, as in they share similar beliefs and practices, such, jesus, blessed meat, monotheism....can they not become one and live in harmony?

Not just muslim extremists pal, remember, all muslims read from the same holy book

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

this is true but its not that far back that there was a lot of violence between hindu, seikh and muslim, the amount of violence before, during and after Indian independance for example.

your right about the british, but dont buy into the propoganda about the different religions and what was behind the partition of india, the truth is always the same its mankinds greed and lust for power/control of others that is responsible, what you find throughout modern is that men hide these behind a veil of religion in order to justify their actions and this applies across all religions.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Oh yeah and god was a killer from the start, why do you think noah had to build his ark?"

That's why I believe in no god and I live my life happily and by doing the right thing, such as helping people in need and knowing right from wrong.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Nothing wrong with religion.

But there is something wrong with people's interpretation: reading what we want to read and hearing what we want to hear.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

Thats why i said hardly....

The 3 other religions are soo similar aswel, as in they share similar beliefs and practices, such, jesus, blessed meat, monotheism....can they not become one and live in harmony?

Not just muslim extremists pal, remember, all muslims read from the same holy book"

Yea but not all Muslims are bad, a lot of them want to live a full filled happy life and integrate and contribute to society. But the extremists who miss interpret or who have been brained washed by other extremists are the problem.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

But India has at least 2000 years of bloody history with the Muslims from the north, infact, it was under Muslim rule when the Brits arrived.

& what will happen to Christian Kerala (my favourite state) if it becomes a Hindu state?

.......& then the different Hindu sects will quarrel with each other, & then.............

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

this is true but its not that far back that there was a lot of violence between hindu, seikh and muslim, the amount of violence before, during and after Indian independance for example.

Question: when will there be peace on earth?

Answer: when the earth falls to pieces

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

Thats why i said hardly....

The 3 other religions are soo similar aswel, as in they share similar beliefs and practices, such, jesus, blessed meat, monotheism....can they not become one and live in harmony?

Not just muslim extremists pal, remember, all muslims read from the same holy book"

i worry about the ill feeling towards Muslims that we are seeing just now, if i were Muslim i may well feel at risk or under threat and decide to strike first.

There is no excuse for blaming an entire race or religion for the actions of a minority, lets face it the christian west may well be taking the moral highground at the present time but much of the ill feeling among some of the islamic world is a result of our forefathers and they way they treated indigenous populations all over the world.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

this is true but its not that far back that there was a lot of violence between hindu, seikh and muslim, the amount of violence before, during and after Indian independance for example.

Question: when will there be peace on earth?

Answer: when the earth falls to pieces"

or when the apes rise up and take over, its gonna happen i seen it on tv

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Nothing wrong with religion.

But there is something wrong with people's interpretation: reading what we want to read and hearing what we want to hear."

^^^ This!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"But India has at least 2000 years of bloody history with the Muslims from the north, infact, it was under Muslim rule when the Brits arrived.

& what will happen to Christian Kerala (my favourite state) if it becomes a Hindu state?

.......& then the different Hindu sects will quarrel with each other, & then.............

Im sure hinduism has been around alot longer than islam....hinduism stretched as far as mecca, yet how have they ended being confined to india? Lol thats what im saying, i dont think india will ever become a hindu state because the children of mother india are free to choose their own path to nirvana. And the bloody war against muslims will continue forever for hindus....its what the jews and christians want aswel really, they are just too pc to admit it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?"

No, though I am not Christian or any main stream religion I do believe in the evolution of society as we know it today religion has played a major part.

Lets face it tribal wars have existed as long as humans have, many animals also work in tribes, packs, mobs etc. and show little mercy to any others trespassing on their territory.

Religion allowed the human tribe to expand to global levels, and most of the problems have been where one faction decided it didn't like the other faction of essentially the same religion, look at Iraq right now.

I think if you want peace then the only way is mass extermination of all living things, even plants have ways of killing each other.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 03/07/14 03:06:48]

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

No, though I am not Christian or any main stream religion I do believe in the evolution of society as we know it today religion has played a major part.

Lets face it tribal wars have existed as long as humans have, many animals also work in tribes, packs, mobs etc. and show little mercy to any others trespassing on their territory.

I think if you want peace then the only way is mass extermination of all living things, even plants have ways of killing each other.

Oh yes it has played a major part alright in the deaths of millions upon millions of people. " of essentially the same religion" you said it and you are disagreeing, religion is the clear cause of the vast amount of evil being committed in this world. Shame you cant really see that and if you believe the only way for people is the mass extermination of all living things I really do feel sorry for you.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What is the best religion to be practising right now if you wanna get along with everyone? Rastafarianism? Jedi? Buddhism? Would a jew share a plate of food with a muslim? Ive shared a plate of food with muslims, christians, atheists, sikhs, would share with a jew too but never had the pleasure of knowing any.....i find atheists the most reluctant to share a plate of food, and i found that in most cases the reason was down to skin colour and not religion, in fact, the cunts thought i was muslim lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Shame you cant really see that and if you believe the only way for people is the mass extermination of all living things I really do feel sorry for you."

I didn't say I didn't see it, but it wasn't / isn't the religion that killed all those people, it was / is people.

My point is that we kill for many reasons, the main one being greed, the white settlers in the USA didn't virtually exterminate the indigenous people because they were not Christian, it was because they were occupying land the settlers wanted. Genghis Khan, never set out on a religious crusade he did it because he could and he wanted the wealth and power that others had.

We basically are not peaceful sharing creatures, so lets not set about killing all religious practitioners in the name of peace just yet!

My religion has two key commandments:-

1 I am responsible for my actions, no unseen force made me do it.

2 Try to live well whilst not doing too much damage.

With that guidance I bump along quite happily.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Remember folks, to lose money, power, health, even life itself, is not such a loss

To lose faith, thats the greatest loss.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Shame you cant really see that and if you believe the only way for people is the mass extermination of all living things I really do feel sorry for you.

I didn't say I didn't see it, but it wasn't / isn't the religion that killed all those people, it was / is people.

We basically are not peaceful sharing creatures, so lets not set about killing all religious practitioners in the name of peace just yet!

My religion has two key commandments:-

1 I am responsible for my actions, no unseen force made me do it.

2 Try to live well whilst not doing too much damage.

With that guidance I bump along quite happily."

I said nothing about wiping out religious people, so im afraid you interpreted something wrong like "some religious people" do and kill because of it.

No one is saying that religion is the root cause of all evil, simply because it is not.

And I would like to think we have moved on since Genghis Khan graced this earth.

We are living in the 21st century and the vast majority of evil is committed in the name of religion.

In the 21st century I don't see how you wouldn't think the world would be a better without religion especially at this present time. I do find it odd and struggle to understand why you think it wouldnt be a better place. By no means am I saying it will be perfect without religion, but its a start. Each to their own opinions and all that.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Remember folks, to lose money, power, health, even life itself, is not such a loss

To lose faith, thats the greatest loss.

That's very true, I still have faith in people and that will never change just like you have your faith in your god.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

No one need force their opinion on others. There is no right or wrong answer. Religion will always be around regardless of who does and doesn't believe, so each to their own...

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"No one need force their opinion on others. There is no right or wrong answer. Religion will always be around regardless of who does and doesn't believe, so each to their own..."

Nobody here was asking how long it would be around, or right or wrong answers, and forcing opinions is extremely wrong as people eventually take it on board then their bound for Syria to join ISIS. All was asked was that " if religion was to fall of the face of the earth tomorrow would it be a better place".

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

If all religions disappeared tomorrow someone would invent a new religion the next day and 2 others would disagree on the meaning of the firsts message the day after they died thus laying the seeds for the first schism!

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Sorry mate your misinterpreting this, if "religion" was to fall of the face of the earth tomorrow there would be no religion, as its gone, all gone, no more.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yeah, I believe the poster who says religion is the cause of most wars.......

Take the conquistadors for example, - they pulled down all them Inca temples & built cathedrals on their incredible stone foundations & forced Catholicism upon them.

There, that is in favour of your argument.

...........except for the shiploads of stolen gold that returned back to Seville, of course!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No one need force their opinion on others. There is no right or wrong answer. Religion will always be around regardless of who does and doesn't believe, so each to their own...

You quoted.. if religion was to fall of the face of the earth. I simply replied it wouldn't, it will always be around.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Yeah, I believe the poster who says religion is the cause of most wars.......

Take the conquistadors for example, - they pulled down all them Inca temples & built cathedrals on their incredible stone foundations & forced Catholicism upon them.

There, that is in favour of your argument.

...........except for the shiploads of stolen gold that returned back to Seville, of course!!

Just aslong as you saw what I was meaning and referring too

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"No one need force their opinion on others. There is no right or wrong answer. Religion will always be around regardless of who does and doesn't believe, so each to their own...

You quoted.. if religion was to fall of the face of the earth. I simply replied it wouldn't, it will always be around."

Oh dear I hope you didn't take that literally ooops

I was speaking hypothetically if you didn't or couldnt understand.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No one need force their opinion on others. There is no right or wrong answer. Religion will always be around regardless of who does and doesn't believe, so each to their own...

Then my answer is a definite 'NO' - because greed for power & wealth is the biggest mass killer, especially over the last couple of thousand years, - IMHO, of course!!

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By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Sorry mate your misinterpreting this, if "religion" was to fall of the face of the earth tomorrow there would be no religion, as its gone, all gone, no more."

My point is/was that religion is a part of the human condition, it comes from the questions about out life we all ask at some point: 'Why am I here?' And, 'Is this all there is?' So therefore if all religion was gone we as a species would invent it all over again.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"No one need force their opinion on others. There is no right or wrong answer. Religion will always be around regardless of who does and doesn't believe, so each to their own...

Then my answer is a definite 'NO' - because greed for power & wealth is the biggest mass killer, especially over the last couple of thousand years, - IMHO, of course!!"

Mate, im talking about the present day, hence why I said " if it was to fall of the face of the earth tomorrow". Im not talking about thousands of years previously. Present im talking about, as in NOW.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No one need force their opinion on others. There is no right or wrong answer. Religion will always be around regardless of who does and doesn't believe, so each to their own...

Then my answer is a definite 'NO' - because greed for power & wealth is the biggest mass killer, especially over the last couple of thousand years, - IMHO, of course!!

I said OVER the last two thousand years, not two thousand years ago, - didn't I?

Now is exactly the same, - it's all about power & wealth as it always has been, can't you see that?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Sorry mate your misinterpreting this, if "religion" was to fall of the face of the earth tomorrow there would be no religion, as its gone, all gone, no more.

What, you think religion is apart of human condition, Im kind of speechless that you believe that. It would be a very sad day that id have to open a bible to see or ask why im here or is this all there is. Science is providing us an answer to some questions, universe etc...SOME...before people jump on the band wagon, if you want to believe in mohammed flying to heaven on a winged horse, believe away, I respect peoples religion, just not the people who commit evil of the back of it.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"No one need force their opinion on others. There is no right or wrong answer. Religion will always be around regardless of who does and doesn't believe, so each to their own...

Then my answer is a definite 'NO' - because greed for power & wealth is the biggest mass killer, especially over the last couple of thousand years, - IMHO, of course!!

I said OVER the last two thousand years, not two thousand years ago, - didn't I?

Now is exactly the same, - it's all about power & wealth as it always has been, can't you see that?"

Buddy, I think your getting confused, im not saying that wealth, power and control is not killing people. So like I said if religion was to fall of the face of the earth it would be a better place, due to less people being killed and massacred. HOW CAN YOU NOT SEE THAT. yes your going to have power hungry individuals nobodies disputing that.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Science is providing us with SOME answers, that's for sure. - but not necessarily the correct ones; theory isn't fact, in fact!

We're not even entirely sure what's a few hundred miles beneath our own feet on our own planet, let alone our own solar system, galaxy, outer galaxies, etc...........

We know Fuck all & in some ways it's far easier & less complicated to a actually believe in religion! Lol

I, personally have an open mind, - live & let live is my motto!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"In the 21st century I don't see how you wouldn't think the world would be a better without religion especially at this present time."

Ok explain it to me, why would the world be a better place without religion? My view is we have always had reason to harm each other, and I don't believe removing religion would help in any way whatsoever.

I was being factious in the "lets not set about killing all religious practitioners in the name of peace just yet" comment, never suggested you said it was a good plan... there was a very old joke in folk clubs many years ago, went something like "Kill the warmongers, smash violence, meet at the Uni this Friday man, we are having a PEACE riot"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Geez, white water, - you're not understanding me!!

On at least three occasions I've implied that I don't believe that religion is the biggest mass killer, - it's greed for power & wealth!!!

You with me now?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Science is providing us with SOME answers, that's for sure. - but not necessarily the correct ones; theory isn't fact, in fact!

We're not even entirely sure what's a few hundred miles beneath our own feet on our own planet, let alone our own solar system, galaxy, outer galaxies, etc...........

We know Fuck all & in some ways it's far easier & less complicated to a actually believe in religion! Lol

I, personally have an open mind, - live & let live is my motto!!"

Science has provided us with vast amounts of CORRECT information aswell, , world not being flat, orbiting the sun to name but a few, lots more than any religious book, Il stick to not believing and you stick to sitting on the fence. After all this was a thread about religion, believe what you want my friend or how science is poisoning our minds with lies.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"In the 21st century I don't see how you wouldn't think the world would be a better without religion especially at this present time.

It would be a better place because of less deaths.... That's the bare bones, Im sorry whoever thinks the world would not be a better place without less deaths ive no time for and will not reply further due to your ignorance.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Geez, white water, - you're not understanding me!!

On at least three occasions I've implied that I don't believe that religion is the biggest mass killer, - it's greed for power & wealth!!!

You with me now?"

I KNOW!!!!!!, im saying if religion went tomorrow it would be a better place, due to less people dying from religion. More lives saved, IS THAT NOT A GOOD THING?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I respect peoples religion, just not the people who commit evil of the back of it."

Now you are getting it... it's nothing to do with the religion, it's the people. So back to my first statement, No removing religion wouldn't help.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"That's the bare bones, Im sorry whoever thinks the world would not be a better place without less deaths ive no time for and will not reply further due to your ignorance."

Well that's hardly a fair debating tactic!

I don't think anyone has said the world wouldn't be improved by less killing, but people including me have said the killing wouldn't stop or even be reduced without religion.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I respect peoples religion, just not the people who commit evil of the back of it.

Now you are getting it... it's nothing to do with the religion, it's the people. So back to my first statement, No removing religion wouldn't help.

Live is the most valuable thing on this planet and without religion millions of people would still be alive. That's the bottom line, shame you haven't experienced effects of religion first hand, then my friend just then you'd have a different stance on things.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Science???

ancient mariners knew that the world wasn't flat & the Mayans knew that we orbit the sun when our ancestors were cave dwellers!!

Great argument for science, that!!

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"That's the bare bones, Im sorry whoever thinks the world would not be a better place without less deaths ive no time for and will not reply further due to your ignorance.

Well that's hardly a fair debating tactic!

I don't think anyone has said the world wouldn't be improved by less killing, but people including me have said the killing wouldn't stop or even be reduced without religion."

YESSSSSSSSSS FINALLY....."IMPROVED" MEANING THEREFORE BETTER.....about time something went in, bed time now that you understand

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"shame you haven't experienced effects of religion first hand, then my friend just then you'd have a different stance on things."

Sadly I have, but I am aware that the underlying reason is tribal not religion.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I sensing some people are not open to the fact others have their own difference of opinions too. What I'm seeing here is, if you don't agree with the OP he'll shoot you down.... Personally I prefer people that are open minded enough to let others speak their own words than have yours shuved down their throats. A case of my way or the highway really!!

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 03/07/14 05:02:56]

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"shame you haven't experienced effects of religion first hand, then my friend just then you'd have a different stance on things.

Sadly I have, but I am aware that the underlying reason is tribal not religion."

Ive been several times to the middle east, grew up in northern Ireland and im stating to you now it would be a better place. If you don't believe that that's fine, don't believe it. Bed time now night night

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

If belief in a supernatural God disappeared from the world I do think there may be some chaos, but also that the world could be a better place. People would be more self responsible and empowered to manage their own lives, rather than forfeit some of that externally, for example. People would also aim to get the best out of this life, rather than focus on paradise in the next - a big shift for millions. And religious wars would stop - a great thing.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"YESSSSSSSSSS FINALLY....."IMPROVED" MEANING THEREFORE BETTER.....about time something went in, bed time now that you understand

But I still disagree with you!

However goodnight and may your gods go with you

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"In the 21st century I don't see how you wouldn't think the world would be a better without religion especially at this present time.

Due to who's ignorance????

That sounds like;

"I refuse to argue with anyone who disagrees with me!"

......which so happens to be almost everyone who has posted on this thread!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

evolution or creation. both unbelievable as an explaination for the origin of life, but i think one is slightly more believable than the other.darwin gets my vote all day.sorry god.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"evolution or creation. both unbelievable as an explaination for the origin of life, but i think one is slightly more believable than the other.darwin gets my vote all day.sorry god."

What if Darwin was god

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I sensing some people are not open to the fact others have their own difference of opinions too. What I'm seeing here is, if you don't agree with the OP he'll shoot you down.... Personally I prefer people that are open minded enough to let others speak their own words than have yours shuved down their throats. A case of my way or the highway really!!

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By *aveyXMan
over a year ago

high wycombe

Morality, and immorality are indeed human conditions, but religion is the mechanism by which otherwise moral persons can be made to do very immoral things.

Genocide, slavery, infanticide, genital mutilation to name but a few.

I think few people would contemplate such atrocities unless they were brainwashed into thinking the consequences of not doing so were far worse than those of compliance. What greater tool of manipulation than the threat of an eternity (not a lifetime, an eternity) of punishment.

As you may have noticed, I tend to agree with the OP.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Morality, and immorality are indeed human conditions, but religion is the mechanism by which otherwise moral persons can be made to do very immoral things.

Is it not also the mechanism where immoral people can be made to do moral things?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If you were to get rid of one thing that would make the world a better place to live, it wouldn't be religion, it would be greed!!

.......there, full circle!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I am a cynical person, I don't believe that peace on earth is a possibility, and while I am not religious, I do like the fact that Billions on this planet have hope and joy from their chosen religion while unfortunately a few thousand seek death and destruction in the name of the same religions.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If you were to get rid of one thing that would make the world a better place to live, it wouldn't be religion, it would be greed!!

.......there, full circle!

I want more of that common sense, can't get enough of it... damn!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If you were to get rid of one thing that would make the world a better place to live, it wouldn't be religion, it would be greed!!

.......there, full circle!

I want more of that common sense, can't get enough of it... damn!!!

No, it's my ball & no one else is playing with it, so, there!!

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland

You need to get rid of

Religion

different currencies

Flags

Borders

n jazz music

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You need to get rid of

Religion

different currencies

Flags

Borders

n jazz music

And the common factor in all these perceived evils ? Mankind's application and interpretation of them.

Get real...religion doesn't force anyone to do anything it's the twisted individuals manipulating it to their advantage.

Most religions promote respect, love and tolerance....oooo dead evil stuff !!!

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By *aveyXMan
over a year ago

high wycombe

"Morality, and immorality are indeed human conditions, but religion is the mechanism by which otherwise moral persons can be made to do very immoral things.

Is it not also the mechanism where immoral people can be made to do moral things?

This may be so, but I would argue that the obverse is far more prevalent and insidious, therefore, on balance it is not a good thing.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Who said we shall fight them on the beaches?

who said there is nothing wrong with defeat?

Winnie Mandelas chiropodist !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There has been more wars and deaths in the name of religion than any other reason but without religion people would just find another reason to fight over, so no i don't think the world would be a better place, good people would still be good and bad people would just find something else to hide behind

just my humble opinion

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

religion has caused more death and suffering than any disease or illness ever will.to hate or even kill someone becauce they are of a different faith to yours is insane

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"religion has caused more death and suffering than any disease or illness ever will.to hate or even kill someone becauce they are of a different faith to yours is insane

While I strongly agree with your last sentence I don't agree with the first.

Although many people have been persecuted and killed because of religion and indeed lots of wars have been because of religion but it is not accurate to say most of the wars are because of religion. A little research will show that this is not the case at all.

(I know you didn't mention war I'm replying generally to the myth that religion is the cause of most wars)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm a polytheist. Religion doesn't cause any problems, the supposed believers do that, Fundamentalists, be that Christian, Muslim, Hindu or any of the others. (although I've never heard of a Buddhist Fundamentalist come to that). On the contrary, I think religion has given us the moral fabric that society is built on and allowed the human race to flourish. Without a belief in something bigger, there's no reason for morality.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"(I know you didn't mention war I'm replying generally to the myth that religion is the cause of most wars)"

Also think you will find germs and disease kill more than religion, with mosquito's topping the high score chart killing more than all the pope's combined.

It's just because it's current hot topic that perception is skewed.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

No. We'd still be killing each other over something or other.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"(I know you didn't mention war I'm replying generally to the myth that religion is the cause of most wars)

Also think you will find germs and disease kill more than religion, with mosquito's topping the high score chart killing more than all the pope's combined.

It's just because it's current hot topic that perception is skewed."

The poor little mosquito always wrongly gets the blame for being the biggest mass murderer when it just isn't true, - it's the malarial parasite that lives upon the mosquito that's the culprit!

Awwwwwwe, poor widdle mozzywazzy!

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland

"You need to get rid of

Religion

different currencies

Flags

Borders

n jazz music

And the common factor in all these perceived evils ? Mankind's application and interpretation of them.

Get real...religion doesn't force anyone to do anything it's the twisted individuals manipulating it to their advantage.

Most religions promote respect, love and tolerance....oooo dead evil stuff !!!"

hold on...

what part of the above do i mention evil religion surly the word evil is a religious word...

in not "anti religion" if your small minded enough to put your life in a mythical being then atleast make it a good one...

i think without religion but just a solid respect for mankind then the world will be a massively better place...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"...... and I don't believe removing religion would help in any way whatsoever. "

Could you say that to the faces of all the parents of all the school girls that were kidnapped by Muslim extremists the other month, from their school & are STILL missing today. They were forced to convert to Islam & forced to recite verses from the Koran on TV. If there was NO religion, would they have still been kidnapped & converted? No religion would mean no Muslim extremists & nothing to convert to.

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland

"...... and I don't believe removing religion would help in any way whatsoever.

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By *ink magnolia s yorksWoman
over a year ago

south yorkshire

But the drove out and persecuted Jews, Jehovas Witness and others, so again,religion was a big part f it. x
"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Believing in a God stops most of the world doing bad things to each other,

Remove it and in my opinion it would get a lot worse

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"But the drove out and persecuted Jews, Jehovas Witness and others, so again,religion was a big part f it. xIf religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

It was ideology and not religion. The Jews and the Jehovah's weren't the only ones on the hitlist.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Believing in a God stops most of the world doing bad things to each other,

Remove it and in my opinion it would get a lot worse "

I thought laws did that.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Believing in a God stops most of the world doing bad things to each other,

Remove it and in my opinion it would get a lot worse

I thought laws did that."

The fear of God stops most believers

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm an animist, myself, -

Blessed are the slugs!

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By *hetalkingstoveMan
over a year ago

London

"Believing in a God stops most of the world doing bad things to each other,

Remove it and in my opinion it would get a lot worse "

Believing in a God seems to make an awful lot of people do bad things to each other too.

I don't think removing it would make much difference, though. People don't need much justification to be awful to each other.

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By *hetalkingstoveMan
over a year ago

London

The fear of God stops most believers "

That's just not true. Believers commit just as many crimes as non-believers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If there was a God, the good people would still be with us and the bad rotting in hell

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

When the best soldiers were accepted into the SS, they were given a ceremonial SS dagger and a belt with the inscription on the brass buckle -"Gott ist mitt uns" (God is with us).

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If religions were abolished or no longer existed, people would still find something fundamental to argue about and kill each other over - it could be football, skin colour, hair colour, those who favour cats or dogs etc. Humans just love to kill each other in the name of some belief or another.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religions were abolished or no longer existed, people would still find something fundamental to argue about and kill each other over - it could be football, skin colour, hair colour, those who favour cats or dogs etc. Humans just love to kill each other in the name of some belief or another."

More like oil and resources.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

More like oil and resources."

People will always fight over tangible, financial assets and territories - I was pointing more at mentally perceived differences.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Love is my religion

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

When the best soldiers were accepted into the SS, they were given a ceremonial SS dagger and a belt with the inscription on the brass buckle -"Gott ist mitt uns" (God is with us)."

But that doesn't mean they were religious, does it?

Was hitler religious?

like what was said before on this thread (it could have been me?), religion is a handy way of getting the masses onside before striving for the REAL goal, - power/wealth/greed!!

To me, it's so damn obvious - but just my opinion.

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By *rightonsteveMan
over a year ago

Brighton - even Hove!

Jedi

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?"

It depends what you mean by the word 'religion'. If you mean respect and reverence of life to the point of profound humility and love, which in my opinion is what 'religion' as a philosophical approach to life is... then obviously it's loss would be a dramatic loss for all of us...although I hasten to add that this is highly unlikely because this kind of loving humility is simply innate within all men and women and would only bubble up again somewhere along the line.

If you mean by 'religion' the various faiths and churches which have been erected in the name of religion...the various doctrines...the various rituals etc. Personally I don't think it would be a great loss...we'd just make up a bunch more. Although I'd hate to see great works like Mozart's Requiem and great paintings and buildings lost. We should try and preserve those.

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By *aucy3Couple
over a year ago

glasgow

In the absence of religion,

human nature,

will find a way.

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland

"Believing in a God stops most of the world doing bad things to each other,

Remove it and in my opinion it would get a lot worse "

so the world is crime free in a god loving utopia

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Religion is the biggest con ever and causes the most problems"

Couldn't agree more x

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

When the best soldiers were accepted into the SS, they were given a ceremonial SS dagger and a belt with the inscription on the brass buckle -"Gott ist mitt uns" (God is with us).

But that doesn't mean they were religious, does it?

Was hitler religious?

like what was said before on this thread (it could have been me?), religion is a handy way of getting the masses onside before striving for the REAL goal, - power/wealth/greed!!

To me, it's so damn obvious - but just my opinion.

what a load of Drivvle yes Adolf Hitler was very religious roman catholic he honestly thought "god" was on his side..

great advert for your golden idol

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

When the best soldiers were accepted into the SS, they were given a ceremonial SS dagger and a belt with the inscription on the brass buckle -"Gott ist mitt uns" (God is with us).

But that doesn't mean they were religious, does it?

Was hitler religious?

like what was said before on this thread (it could have been me?), religion is a handy way of getting the masses onside before striving for the REAL goal, - power/wealth/greed!!

To me, it's so damn obvious - but just my opinion.

what a load of Drivvle yes Adolf Hitler was very religious roman catholic he honestly thought "god" was on his side..

great advert for your golden idol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Me & god don't get along...religion breeds hate!..fact number..9996522168907632578

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Just buildings? FFS - lolz

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hitler was very religious roman catholic he honestly thought "god" was on his side.. great advert for yOu

Hitler was a Catholic?

Omg (scuse the pun) - this thread is becoming even more audacious by the minute, lolz

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Religions are man made social control mechanisms. Their primary aim is to sustain and if possible increase their influence by increasing the number of followers.

The main beneficiaries of this increased power are the non elected leaders of religions. A God or Gods will exist, or not, totally independently of any religion recognising it or them.

Since religions sponsor and sanction acts of inhumanity that would otherwise be abhorent to humans I believe the world would be better off without them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Years ago i was reading up on a alternative satanism cult/religion, it belived in no god or satan more just the opposite to religions like be good to each other regardless of skin colour, gay or straight and be the best person you can be but people who are stupid are frowned apon maybe because theres a joke somewhere that religious people are stupid lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Religion in itself is fine, & it is throughout the world - untill greedy bastards take advantage of them.

This, in my opinion is the biggest problem with religion - but hardly religious!!

Power & greed (same things, really) are thee worst problems & reason for colossal slaughter on this planet - but nothing ever changes!!!

Just my opinion, - you understand!!

When was the last massive religious war?

& when was the last 'greed' war?

........hmmmmmmmmmm!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Years ago i was reading up on a alternative satanism cult/religion, it belived in no god or satan more just the opposite to religions like be good to each other regardless of skin colour, gay or straight and be the best person you can be but people who are stupid are frowned apon maybe because theres a joke somewhere that religious people are stupid lol"
surprised it isnt as poplular as the others

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By *xpresMan
over a year ago

Elland

"Hitler was very religious roman catholic he honestly thought "god" was on his side.. great advert for yOu

Hitler was a Catholic?

Omg (scuse the pun) - this thread is becoming even more audacious by the minute, lolz

HOLD ON!!

you take a quote of my post... But out of context. just tring to make it look like i made a sweeping statement... When all I did was answer a question, the question was asked was hitler religious.. He was a roman catholic that's a fact i didn't say that all Catholics wer evil... But the Nazi party was based on highly religious protocol n ceremony

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

People's negative opinions on 'religion' are almost always misguided opinions on the various faiths that supposedly represent religion. Religion is neither limited to nor defined by any of the faiths. It existed before them and will persist after them. It is a way of approaching your own life and the life of the universe around you as a sacred thing. It is a way of coming to know God, The Divine Source, The Soul of the Universe, whatever you want to call it. This pathway of being is probably, imo, one of our greatest jewels. That we have the intuition to feel a deep connection with the cosmos. That's just wonderful and should be cherished by those who grasp it and striven for by those who have not yet found it.

Everything else...the costumes, the books, the rituals, the rules, the prejudices, the priesthoods, the holy rulers, the parables and morals...they're just add ons that got layered over it during the centuries...they're just human power games and human error. I agree that much of this stuff is a force for negativity and I'm as happy as the next humanist to see whatever is false and prejudiced in these things dismantled. But none of these things is religion imo...they're just human clubs for people who'd like to think they're religious but so frequently aren't.

I guess I just feel it's a bit unfair to write off 'religion' as a whole by pointing at a bunch of organisations which aren't really all that religious imo. I understand that a bunch of you see it this way. But I'd be lying if I agreed...and I'd feel like I hadn't stood by a good friend if I didn't speak out and say something positive on religion's behalf...albeit a more cosmic and self-made un-organised personal religion

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Only in ceremony - just ain't this thread - init!!

Scuse, I couldn't quote so I cut n pasted- my humblest apologies go out to both you & the pseudo nazi Catholics!!

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

Without the Flying Spaghetti Monster, the world will be plunged into the abyss... convert, ye blasphemers, and embrace the life of a Pastafarian while you have the chance!

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By *rofaneprofMan
over a year ago

Katy

I never cease to be amazed by the firm beliefs of superiority of one religion over another held by those who profess to believe in God. Almost every religion preaches eternal damnation for those who don't follow the teachings of that particular religion. If there were indeed only one God, why would He create 2 billion adherents and 4 billion non-adherents? Surely, we are all children of the same God, no matter what our faith is? How can we be so presumptuous to say that there is only one path to God and that is _________ ( fill in the blanks with the name of a religion). I think it is good to believe in some concept of virtue and to live a generally spiritual life. I do not believe any one religion has a monopoly on defining what virtue is.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I never cease to be amazed by the firm beliefs of superiority of one religion over another held by those who profess to believe in God. Almost every religion preaches eternal damnation for those who don't follow the teachings of that particular religion. If there were indeed only one God, why would He create 2 billion adherents and 4 billion non-adherents? Surely, we are all children of the same God, no matter what our faith is? How can we be so presumptuous to say that there is only one path to God and that is _________ ( fill in the blanks with the name of a religion). I think it is good to believe in some concept of virtue and to live a generally spiritual life. I do not believe any one religion has a monopoly on

defining what virtue is. "

Omg, where were you last night?

But I kind of agree - at least if there is a God, there's only one, - lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

In the beginning man created god and ever since she has been in charge and she holds the key to ecstasy!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

defining what virtue is.

Omg, where were you last night?

But I kind of agree - at least if there is a God, there's only one, - lol

There must be only one God, (if there is a God), because the strongest will have viciously and mercilessly destroyed the others by now.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

God is definitely a man, he made women soooooo perfect

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By *rofaneprofMan
over a year ago

Katy

We have one life to live - and we spend half of it arguing about what the Bible or the Koran or the Gita or the Torah say. They say the same thing, they are just interpretations of the same underlying principles. Let's focus on living the life that God gave us rather than wasting it trying to find a sense of moral superiority.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There are no gods. Not even Odin.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There are no gods. Not even Odin."

Don't be ridiculous!

Lemmy clearly exists.

Any fool can see this.

As for the OP, no.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

If humans dropped off the face of the earth...then, perhaps.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Watched program last nite the bible is full of contradictions , anybody know how many brothers and sisters Jesus had???

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

It would be refreshing to not have them but some cultures would need radical change once mind control stops.

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By *ensualtouch15Man
over a year ago

ashby de la zouch

I would prefer if religions were not so powerful that they create sheeple

That said they are more a lens I'd suggest bringing out both the best and worst human animal traits

I'd sadly suggest religion is usually a very negative form of tribalism

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By *ensualtouch15Man
over a year ago

ashby de la zouch

I would prefer if religions were not so powerful that they create sheeple

That said they are more a lens I'd suggest bringing out both the best and worst human animal traits

I'd sadly suggest religion is usually a very negative form of tribalism

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I would prefer if religions were not so powerful that they create sheeple

That said they are more a lens I'd suggest bringing out both the best and worst human animal traits

I'd sadly suggest religion is usually a very negative form of tribalism

True to some degree I guess, but the tribalism exists religion or no religion. Whilst religion would advocate preaching to others it's existence, the non believers will scorn the religious blaming them for war and conflict.

Essentially most of us want belong to something and think we're worth something. Truth is most of us are insignificant, it's our acts that are worthy of note.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It has always struck me as profoundly ironic that if; hypothetically, the existence of a God or Gods could be proven, we would no longer have any need for religion.

Personally, I take the view (like Einstein) that religion is a childish, primitive way of understanding what is ultimately the actual way the universe works. I strongly suspect (as Einstein, Niels Bohr and Heisenburg did) that, as the laws of physics are fixed and immutable under normal conditions, that there is some kind of intelligence behind the way the universe works. Whether you want to call that 'God' (I see no other appropriate term for it), I don't know.

Einstein considered the profound feelings of awe and wonder that many physicists and other scientists get when considering the vastness of the universe and the incredible way in which it works to be the same as a religious person gets when contemplating God; it's just that the religious response is a more primitive, primal, childlike way of considering the actual truth about the universe. Einstein considered the scientific approach, whilst on the same lines, to be a more rational but at the same time more profound way of understanding what was to him essentially the same thing.

My own interpretation is that the ideas _xpressed about the universe by religion are not 'wrong' as such, they are just primitive. I look at religion to science (in particular the physical sciences) to be like alchemy ultimately became to chemistry: it wasn't that the basic ideas that alchemy was all about were wrong, it was just that the way alchemy investigated these phenomena lacked the empiricism and rational application chemistry later had, and, just in the same way chemistry took the discoveries that were actually made by alchemy and incorporated them into itself-chemistry 'swallowed' alchemy, likewise I think once we get to the bottom of things as to how the universe works science will 'swallow' religion.

Without getting ridiculously cosmic about things, I don't see the central tenets of religion in itself to be wrong or inherently bad-as I find the ideas of awe at the complexity and vastness of the universe and in particular the idea there is something behind the fixed laws of the universe to be right, based on the evidence. However, it is the tribalistic, irrational, and above all emotional response to the way some humans apply religion-and it goes just the same to other non-religious philosophies too-that is the problem. Religion in itself is not bad (merely primitive), it is only when it is tacked to ideas of nationalism, racism, prejudice, xenophobia, sectarianism and any form of hatred for fellow human beings that it becomes a bad thing. It is not religion that needs to be done away with, it is these attitudes.

As for atheism, personally I think that will just be one of those philosophies, like communism, that will be shown to be wrong. That said, I would like to point out that the idea there is a personal God, one who cares about what you do with your daily life, who cares about sin, who answers prayer and who cares about where you stick your genitals or what rituals you perform or what meat you eat on a given day-the God who interferes with the laws of physics rather than bring responsible for them-that God is impossible. We are not talking about some old dude sat on a cloud with a big beard. But likewise, I do not think we are alone and the universe is as meaningless as some would have us believe. The truth is, I suspect, as it all too often is, somewhere inbetween the two extremes-those of religion and atheism in this case.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You not believing in a God is a belief itself. Some nay say that's a religion of non belief.

So, you're statement may be a double whammy.

A non belief is just that. A non belief. It cannot be defined as a religion, by the definition of what a religion is.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

Oh it was. You just had to make sure you believed in their peculiar strand.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Alongside religion, remove power, control, wealth, greed.

Religion is just the cover story, the masque

If all of that were removed this world would be an even bleaker place than it already is.

Why is that?

No control= no laws, there has to be some sort of controlled structure to maintain law and peoples rights.

I definitely would not want complete control over ourselves if that what you were referring too."

You don't need a magic sky fairy to tell you how to live. Confucios tells us that, in roundabout way.

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By *risky_MareWoman
over a year ago

...Up on the Downs

"You not believing in a God is a belief itself. Some nay say that's a religion of non belief.

So, you're statement may be a double whammy.

A non belief is just that. A non belief. It cannot be defined as a religion, by the definition of what a religion is."

No, you and the OP miss the point that Popeye originally made - Atheism is indeed a faith, a belief system, the only truly neutral position is agnosticism, saying 'I do not believe you know and I don't either'.

As soon as a person says 'Your world view is wrong and mine is right' they have made a decisions, chosen to believe something, formed an opinion, and then they extrapolate based on their faith.

If you wiped out formal religion you would still be left with a myriad of faiths and belief systems. And people don't kill because of religion - they just use religion as another excuse to kill. They'd simply find other excuses - like tribalism, racism, terratorialism.....

Men kill because it is part of human nature to err.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

Oh it was. You just had to make sure you believed in their peculiar strand."

Apart from the fact that that Hitler aimed to eliminate all christian denominations within Germany after a German victory in what he called the 'church struggle' or 'kirchenkampf'.All religion was viewed as a potential alternative authority opposed to Nazism, something Hitler ultimately would not tolerate.

Any mention of God in Hitler's speeches was pure rhetoric: Hitler may have had some quasi-deist notion of 'providence' but he certainly had no time for christianity and the notions of meekness and humility. And there were members of the higher echelons of the Nazi hierachy; such as Goebbels, Rosenburg and Bormann, who were even more scathing of christianity than Hitle

r was.

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By *ensualtouch15Man
over a year ago

ashby de la zouch

"It has always struck me as profoundly ironic that if; hypothetically, the existence of a God or Gods could be proven, we would no longer have any need for religion.

Sounds like creationism to me

If it is suggested there is an intelligence behind the universe , which is not evidenced , because stuff seems to the mind "too complex " to just exist and evolve the intelligence itself By default will all ways be equally or more complex than the complex stuff it is fudged to explain

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By *octor DeleriumMan
over a year ago

Wellingborough

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Yes; the affiliation to religion has, possibly, cased more wars and deaths than political connection

I am, effectively, an atheist, but I have very close friend who are Catholic and Muslim

I do not interfere with their faith, but we will go out of or way to support each other, and our neighbours.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

Thats why i said hardly....

The 3 other religions are soo similar aswel, as in they share similar beliefs and practices, such, jesus, blessed meat, monotheism....can they not become one and live in harmony?

And what of the Sikhs?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You not believing in a God is a belief itself. Some nay say that's a religion of non belief.

So, you're statement may be a double whammy.

A non belief is just that. A non belief. It cannot be defined as a religion, by the definition of what a religion is."

Not a religion, but it is ultimately the same as religion in the sense it has no proof to prove what it is saying. Like religion, in the absense of proof; it is still basically people making up stuff without proof.

Do you have proof a God (or Gods) does not exist? Thought not.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It wouldn't bother me as I don't believe in religion as I am a non believer lol.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Alongside religion, remove power, control, wealth, greed.

Religion is just the cover story, the masque

If all of that were removed this world would be an even bleaker place than it already is.

Why is that?

No control= no laws, there has to be some sort of controlled structure to maintain law and peoples rights.

I definitely would not want complete control over ourselves if that what you were referring too.

You don't need a magic sky fairy to tell you how to live. Confucios tells us that, in roundabout way."

Apart from that Confucius believed that man needs belief in the Gods in order to be moral.

I don't agree with him btw, but that is what he wrote in the Analects.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Imagine there's no heaven

It's easy if you try

No hell below us

Above us only sky

Imagine all the people

Living for today...

Imagine there's no countries

It isn't hard to do

Nothing to kill or die for

And no religion too

Imagine all the people

Living life in peace...

You may say I'm a dreamer

But I'm not the only one

I hope someday you'll join us

And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions

I wonder if you can

No need for greed or hunger

A brotherhood of man

Imagine all the people

Sharing all the world...

You may say I'm a dreamer

But I'm not the only one

I hope someday you'll join us

And the world will live as one

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Hinduism, the worlds oldest religion and still goin strong....why do we always hear of muslims, jews and christians kicking off?? Hinduism hardly gets mentioned....peace and love to all

Thats why i said hardly....

The 3 other religions are soo similar aswel, as in they share similar beliefs and practices, such, jesus, blessed meat, monotheism....can they not become one and live in harmony?

Not just muslim extremists pal, remember, all muslims read from the same holy book

i worry about the ill feeling towards Muslims that we are seeing just now, if i were Muslim i may well feel at risk or under threat and decide to strike first.

Don't blame me for the sins of our fathers. That's old testament bollocks.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It has always struck me as profoundly ironic that if; hypothetically, the existence of a God or Gods could be proven, we would no longer have any need for religion.

A good post but I remain unconvinced (I appreciate your aim is not to necessarily convince me). Whether a primitive follower of religion or a genius at the level of Einstein, the moment individuals blame a 'God' is that moment of awe. The moment the reality is beyond their comprehension.

Einstein proved primitive religious thinking to be just that but, in my opinion, was no closer to understanding 'awe'.

In time a genius will come along and make Einstein seem primitive.

The question still remains, does awe = god? I am not convinced it does.

Just because we don't understand something doesn't mean we have to make up an 'intelligent designer'.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Yes; the affiliation to religion has, possibly, cased more wars and deaths than political connection

I am, effectively, an atheist, but I have very close friend who are Catholic and Muslim

I do not interfere with their faith, but we will go out of or way to support each other, and our neighbours.

DN"

Only most wars since the adoption of the Westphalian system of international diplomacy have been about nationalism or ideology rather than religion.

The Napoleonic wars, the American and French revolutionary wars, the American Civil War and both World Wars were most certainly NOT anything to do with religion.

'Religion causes all wars' has to be one of the biggest cliches ever.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It has always struck me as profoundly ironic that if; hypothetically, the existence of a God or Gods could be proven, we would no longer have any need for religion.

Einstein proved primitive religious thinking to be just that but, in my opinion, was no closer to understanding 'awe'.

In time a genius will come along and make Einstein seem primitive.

The question still remains, does awe = god? I am not convinced it does.

Just because we don't understand something doesn't mean we have to make up an 'intelligent designer'."

But Einstein did not consider 'God' as he concieved of it to have created the universe, he was of the opinion that 'God' or whatever you wish to call it *is* the universe.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You not believing in a God is a belief itself. Some nay say that's a religion of non belief.

So, you're statement may be a double whammy.

A non belief is just that. A non belief. It cannot be defined as a religion, by the definition of what a religion is.

As soon as a person says 'Your world view is wrong and mine is right' they have made a decisions, chosen to believe something, formed an opinion, and then they extrapolate based on their faith.

Men kill because it is part of human nature to err."

Until their is a scintilla of an iota of proof, then my default position is it doesn't exist, much like Bertrand's Teapot. Lack of proof of non existence is the straw that deists cling to.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

...Said John Lennon in his multi-million pound mansion.

Need I point out that Lennon wasn't an atheist and also was on record as saying that what he was saying in 'imagine' was not that religion should be done away with, nor countries per se, but the sectarian divisions between ourselves we create.

Do you want the quote?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Nazi Germany didn't seem overly religious either!

Oh it was. You just had to make sure you believed in their peculiar strand.

r was."

But not in public. That's what mattered.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You not believing in a God is a belief itself. Some nay say that's a religion of non belief.

So, you're statement may be a double whammy.

A non belief is just that. A non belief. It cannot be defined as a religion, by the definition of what a religion is.

Do you have proof a God (or Gods) does not exist? Thought not."

Bertrands teapot.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Alongside religion, remove power, control, wealth, greed.

Religion is just the cover story, the masque

If all of that were removed this world would be an even bleaker place than it already is.

Why is that?

No control= no laws, there has to be some sort of controlled structure to maintain law and peoples rights.

I definitely would not want complete control over ourselves if that what you were referring too.

You don't need a magic sky fairy to tell you how to live. Confucios tells us that, in roundabout way.

Apart from that Confucius believed that man needs belief in the Gods in order to be moral.

I don't agree with him btw, but that is what he wrote in the Analects."

But he didn't pass down a god given moral code,that only he could access.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Religion is/was a control thing but its waning now if it wasn't there there would be another way of achieving the same effect spring up to fill the gap.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Right so a regime that aimed to eliminate religion altogether and had many senior members who were very, very anti-religion is in some way religious? Regardless of outward statements I find that baffling.

The Soviet constitution likewise provided for freedom of belief. Didn't mean you wouldn't get thrown in a frozen gulag or get put in a mental asylum for being a believer. Of what consequence is rhetoric when the reality was different?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If religion was to drop of the face of the earth tomorrow do you think the world would be a better place?

Religion is/was a control thing but its waning now if it wasn't there there would be another way of achieving the same effect spring up to fill the gap."

It might be waning in the western world but it certainly isn't world wide. Particularly not in China, Eastern Europe and Africa.

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