FabSwingers.com forum: Charity run prisons

By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Guy Opperman, Conservative backbencher, has suggested that charities should be allowed to run prisons. His argument is that the school marketplace now has private, state, charity and free schools. Prisons are currently just state or privately run.

Apart from the rehabilitation elements, punishment is not a charitable activity. Setting that aside do you think that charities should be allowed to run prisons?

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By *inaTitzTV/TS
over a year ago

Titz Towers, North Notts

No, I'm more in favour of state ownership of a fair few things.

Tina and her nationalised Titz

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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"No, I'm more in favour of state ownership of a fair few things.

Tina and her nationalised Titz

Tina's Titz for the nation - they are big enough.

I'm not happy about the private sector prisons. There is something not quite right about making a profit from people committing crimes.

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By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman
over a year ago

evesham

Are the free schools and academy schools etc working without issue? If not I'd say my vote is a big no!

Private sector prisons and even state run prisons aren't perfect but I think adding more variables to maintaining order and discipline is a dangerous thing!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Charities should be allowed to run death row, then they will have a plentiful supply of clothes for the shops....

I need new Shoes

Gimp

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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Charities should be allowed to run death row, then they will have a plentiful supply of clothes for the shops....

I need new Shoes

Gimp"

You can borrow mine.

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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Are the free schools and academy schools etc working without issue? If not I'd say my vote is a big no!

Private sector prisons and even state run prisons aren't perfect but I think adding more variables to maintaining order and discipline is a dangerous thing!"

The private ones keep losing people en route too.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Charities should be allowed to run death row, then they will have a plentiful supply of clothes for the shops....

I need new Shoes

Gimp

You can borrow mine.

Are they Red, I only wear Red to match my Eyes

Gimp

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No, I'm more in favour of state ownership of a fair few things.

Tina and her nationalised Titz

If we could run 'some' things centrally but using capitalist principles, would we be better off ?

I.e. make them profitable but with all the profits going back into the public purse (rather than just the taxes the business cough up)

I am no economist (and it probably shows) but surely some industries / sectors would benefit ?

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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"No, I'm more in favour of state ownership of a fair few things.

Tina and her nationalised Titz

If we could run 'some' things centrally but using capitalist principles, would we be better off ?

I.e. make them profitable but with all the profits going back into the public purse (rather than just the taxes the business cough up)

I am no economist (and it probably shows) but surely some industries / sectors would benefit ?"

The privately run prisons here and in the USA have to make a profit. That's the nature of private business. The money comes from the State and the profit goes into their pockets.

If the State pays and runs the prison how can it make a profit? Someone else will have to pay. Prisoners used to have to pay for being in prison - sometimes going out to work and returning.

Companies already run businesses in prisons (envelope stuffing was a popular one a while back). Prisoners are paid a small amount of money for their time on these activities.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No, I'm more in favour of state ownership of a fair few things.

Tina and her nationalised Titz

If we could run 'some' things centrally but using capitalist principles, would we be better off ?

I.e. make them profitable but with all the profits going back into the public purse (rather than just the taxes the business cough up)

I am no economist (and it probably shows) but surely some industries / sectors would benefit ?

The privately run prisons here and in the USA have to make a profit. That's the nature of private business. The money comes from the State and the profit goes into their pockets.

If the State pays and runs the prison how can it make a profit? Someone else will have to pay. Prisoners used to have to pay for being in prison - sometimes going out to work and returning.

Companies already run businesses in prisons (envelope stuffing was a popular one a while back). Prisoners are paid a small amount of money for their time on these activities."

I had digressed away from prisons

, but if the private sector can do it 'cheaper' then why can't the state and without the need to turn a profit. I guess it's more of a 'saving' to the public purse as opposed to profit generation.

Did we turn over nationalised industries to the private sector just to get out of union agreements ? Or to line the pockets of those in government ? Or both ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If we could run 'some' things centrally but using capitalist principles, would we be better off ?

I.e. make them profitable but with all the profits going back into the public purse (rather than just the taxes the business cough up)"

The income to the private run companies comes from the state paying them to house the prisoners. By doing centrally as a state run business they can't make a profit, but could keep the portion that the private companies give to share holders.

More to the point the money for tagging dead or incarcerated prisoners would not go to Group 4, and the taxes would not go to Luxembourg.

The only justification for privatising is to make the 5 year term of serving government look better, as long term debt is hidden in the accounting process.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Deutsche Bahn : a public limited company but with all shares held by the German Government.

Turns a profit which are then ee-invested back into the railways.

It works : or appears to anyway from a consumers POV

Cheap, regular, efficient public transport owned by the state and essentially run by a state owned business.

They own several holdings in the UK too but with the £ going back to Germany to subsidise their national 'business'.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

* re-invested

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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"No, I'm more in favour of state ownership of a fair few things.

Tina and her nationalised Titz

If we could run 'some' things centrally but using capitalist principles, would we be better off ?

I.e. make them profitable but with all the profits going back into the public purse (rather than just the taxes the business cough up)

I am no economist (and it probably shows) but surely some industries / sectors would benefit ?

The privately run prisons here and in the USA have to make a profit. That's the nature of private business. The money comes from the State and the profit goes into their pockets.

If the State pays and runs the prison how can it make a profit? Someone else will have to pay. Prisoners used to have to pay for being in prison - sometimes going out to work and returning.

Companies already run businesses in prisons (envelope stuffing was a popular one a while back). Prisoners are paid a small amount of money for their time on these activities.

I had digressed away from prisons

, but if the private sector can do it 'cheaper' then why can't the state and without the need to turn a profit. I guess it's more of a 'saving' to the public purse as opposed to profit generation.

Did we turn over nationalised industries to the private sector just to get out of union agreements ? Or to line the pockets of those in government ? Or both ?"

One of the ways that the costs are reduced is by cutting terms and conditions of staff. The biggest cost.

The private run prisons aren't bearing the full costs either as the buildings are often still owned and maintained by the State. The models don't stack up.

On the schools front - the private sector/charity puts up £2m and the State bungs in £28m. The private sector/charity gets to determine what happens and has control.

The most recent national privatisation is Royal Mail. I wonder who made a profit there?

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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Deutsche Bahn : a public limited company but with all shares held by the German Government.

Turns a profit which are then ee-invested back into the railways.

It works : or appears to anyway from a consumers POV

Cheap, regular, efficient public transport owned by the state and essentially run by a state owned business.

They own several holdings in the UK too but with the £ going back to Germany to subsidise their national 'business'."

And EDF is owned by the French Government. You have to have something you can sell on. Prisoners are difficult to sell (except in the States).

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