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Nich Clegg IS the Kingmaker then

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By *ickmeallover OP   Woman
over a year ago

a very plush appartment off junt 7 M5

He supposedly holds all the cards to keep Brown or Cameron in power

Funny old world really

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By *ickmeallover OP   Woman
over a year ago

a very plush appartment off junt 7 M5

oops

Nick even lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Looks like Annabel Goldie might have to do some grovelling

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By *aucy3Couple
over a year ago

glasgow


"He supposedly holds all the cards to keep Brown or Cameron in power

Funny old world really "

king for a year.in the political wilderness,for the next 12.the loser in this one.could really work out,a massive winner.

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By (user no longer on site)
Forum Mod
over a year ago

We said the same last night,It could be the best thing ever for his career

What a position to find himself in

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By *ickmeallover OP   Woman
over a year ago

a very plush appartment off junt 7 M5


"He supposedly holds all the cards to keep Brown or Cameron in power

Funny old world really

king for a year.in the political wilderness,for the next 12.the loser in this one.could really work out,a massive winner. "

unless they actually do a good job!

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By *ickmeallover OP   Woman
over a year ago

a very plush appartment off junt 7 M5


"We said the same last night,It could be the best thing ever for his career

What a position to find himself in "

I think he will do a super job

Why would people assume that he would do anything less?

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By *i 1 Get 1 FreeCouple (MM)
over a year ago

birmingham


"He supposedly holds all the cards to keep Brown or Cameron in power

Funny old world really

king for a year.in the political wilderness,for the next 12.the loser in this one.could really work out,a massive winner. "

We should have another General election None of them have been given an outright mandate to govern

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By *ickmeallover OP   Woman
over a year ago

a very plush appartment off junt 7 M5


"He supposedly holds all the cards to keep Brown or Cameron in power

Funny old world really

king for a year.in the political wilderness,for the next 12.the loser in this one.could really work out,a massive winner.

We should have another General election None of them have been given an outright mandate to govern "

why will a coalition be a negative thing tho, its worked well in germany to name one?

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By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

It could also be a very bad thing for Nicky Boy... after all, he's already been negotiating which of his pre-election policies he'll give up as part of the deal... don't you just love a man who sticks to his values and principles when there is a whiff of power floating about in the air.

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By *i 1 Get 1 FreeCouple (MM)
over a year ago

birmingham


"He supposedly holds all the cards to keep Brown or Cameron in power

Funny old world really

king for a year.in the political wilderness,for the next 12.the loser in this one.could really work out,a massive winner.

We should have another General election None of them have been given an outright mandate to govern

why will a coalition be a negative thing tho, its worked well in germany to name one? "

UK parties don't have common ground which to build on, I fear it will create to much in party squabbling, the end result being, a general election.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It could also be a very bad thing for Nicky Boy... after all, he's already been negotiating which of his pre-election policies he'll give up as part of the deal... don't you just love a man who sticks to his values and principles when there is a whiff of power floating about in the air."

I'd have thought you of all people would realise that without a majority compromise becomes the order of the day. Cameron must compromise his party's policies and Clegg must do the same. If he holds out for full PR then he's going to be disappointed and have to go to Brown. Labour can form a majority government but he'll need most of the other parties to do it. That slithering snake of a man Alex Salmond has gathered up Plaid Cymru and added them to the SNP's tally to provide 9 seats. Add to that: 3 SDLP seats and the 1 Alliance MP - who is allied to the LibDems already - giving a total of 328, with the LibDems 57 added to Labour's 258 seats.

That leaves 5 Sinn Fein seats but they can be discounted as they never attend parliament and do not swear allegiance to the Queen, 8 DUP seats which Cameron can pretty much bank on, 1 Green and 1 Independant, and then there is the 1 seat that hasn't voted yet due to the death of it's MP but it is a safe Tory seat.

Cameron can expect a total of 317 seats against Brown/Clegg's 328 'Rainbow Coalition' - but who would really want this garish scenario where all of the nationlist parties will demand exemption from the dreaded cuts that are around the corner in return for their support. Brown would be a fool to guarantee exemption to the nationalists, and from what I've seen of him, I don't think he would. This hodgepodge of assorted parties with very different agendas would be an extemely fragile coalition and as soon as Cameron sensed a chance to motion a vote of no confidence we'd be heading for another election. Brown knows it, and so does Clegg.

No, the right deal to do is a Lib-Con Coalition government. Cameron is no fool and if he doesn't put it to the country to decide if we want PR or not then he's basically saying that he knows best and we don't count, but a referendum could take up to two years to sort out and that's one helluva long time in politics, Clegg will need a cast iron guarantee of a referendum on PR.

Like I said, compromise is the foundation of a hung parliament and they better get used to it as three-party politics is here to stay.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

That’s all well and good wishy but remember a lot of lib dem voters voted lib dems in the first place, because they wanted change, and didn’t want a Tory government, so while it might be the right thing for the country excluding a re-election, it might well be the wrong thing for his supporters, Cameron has everything to gain, with clegg having everything to loss. So with all that said and done I doubt Clegg will move very much on what he’s promised his supporters, the first statement he made after the election slightly confirms this.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"That’s all well and good wishy but remember a lot of lib dem voters voted lib dems in the first place, because they wanted change, and didn’t want a Tory government, so while it might be the right thing for the country excluding a re-election, it might well be the wrong thing for his supporters, Cameron has everything to gain, with clegg having everything to loss. So with all that said and done I doubt Clegg will move very much on what he’s promised his supporters, the first statement he made after the election slightly confirms this."

Clegg only secured 23% of the vote so PR isn't high on the list of importance for the rest of us. Clegg has to remember that if the majority of the electorate wanted PR we would have voted for the Liberals. Gordon Brown is only making noises about Pr now because he needs Clegg's support to enable him to cling to power, but Labour have been long time opponents of PR, as have the Tories. There are sevral methods of reforming politics to include some sort of notional PR without embracing the Liberals all encompassing version of it - % of votes = % of seats.

Let's say we had that version of PR and the Liberals got 23% of the votes which enabled them to 23% of the seats. That would equate to roughly 150 Liberal MPs. Which Conservative and Labour MPs are told although they won their constituency but unfortunately under PR they cannot have a place in the House of Commons becasue the Liberals have claimed more MPs than seats they actually won outright? It makes it pointless to stand in some marginal seats because if you win it, you may still not get a seat in Parliament.

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By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


" I'd have thought you of all people would realise that without a majority compromise becomes the order of the day. "

Oh indeed..... and only time will tell how compromising the compromise (hence the "could").

We all have our different reasons for who we support (or not) and for some people the difference is based on policies of the party. Blur those lines and may be even throw/give away the differential and what are you left with?

Should it turn out that he goes soft on some of the policies which attracted people to the party, will some not question his commitment to live up to his pre-election promises in the future?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Absolutely hon. And remember all that pontificating on the TV debates.. now it's all about deals or no deals. Which is why Clegg cannot go to the Tories and demand full PR in return for his support. A watered down version of it maybe but as I said in my post above, which MPs get told that they can't go to Westminster even though they won their constituency. This is PR's fundamental flaw.

The only way I can see to make PR work is to vote for the party you want to govern. Liberal, Labour, Conservative etc.. no local names at all. Once it's over the parties decide which MPs will represent which areas.

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By *he_original_poloWoman
over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester


"

The only way I can see to make PR work is to vote for the party you want to govern. Liberal, Labour, Conservative etc.. no local names at all. Once it's over the parties decide which MPs will represent which areas."

This is my concern.... I don’t like the idea of a Midlands constituency being a majority win for one party (whichever party) and yet could get lumbered with an MP from another party to represent the local issues… just because there were more voters in a couple of constituencies in Buckinghamshire or Essex or wherever.

Within the cries for PR aren’t we really kissing goodbye to our current right to democratically selecting the person and the party we wish to represent us locally.

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By *etitesaraTV/TS
over a year ago

rochdale

That would involve a complete reconstruction of the British Electoral system - something i'm not sure there is any appetite for at the moment.

Currently we do NOT elect a Govt, regardless of what the papers tell us. We elect an MP - it is then the job of the 650 elected MP's to form a Govt. Of course nowadays it is always along party lines but that hasn't always been the case.

Personally i think we will end up with a minority Tory Govt & another election within 6 months as Cameron proves unable to carry the Commons along with his policies.

The Lib Dems have (IMHO) rather more to lose than to gain in the medium-to-long term by climing into bed with the Cons.

Much of the LibDem support is soft & unreliable, if those people see the LibDem leadership allying too closely to the Tories they will desert, most probably flocking back to Labour as they usually cannot stomach voting Tory.

We shall see though, whether Nick Clegg's lust for power is stronger than his principles - having said that, he needs to carry his party with him as he cannot do this alone. I think that will be the sticking point. Many LibDem members see siding with the Tories as something to do at a distance whilst holding their collective noses.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It does seem that only the losers in an election, or those that have little chance of achieving a majority, are in favour of PR. The paradox is that if a party won a majority under the First Past The Post system they would be very reluctant to switch to system like PR that may prevent them ever holding that majority again.

It begs the question: If the LibDems had won an outright majority, would they still want PR?

Labour promised a referendum on PR on coming to power in 1997, ostensibly as a result of an agreement with the Liberal Democrats, but nothing has since come about. So how can Brown be believed he will not do the same thing again? Or Cameron, for that matter.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It does seem that only the losers in an election, or those that have little chance of achieving a majority, are in favour of PR. The paradox is that if a party won a majority under the First Past The Post system they would be very reluctant to switch to system like PR that may prevent them ever holding that majority again.

It begs the question: If the LibDems had won an outright majority, would they still want PR?

Labour promised a referendum on PR on coming to power in 1997, ostensibly as a result of an agreement with the Liberal Democrats, but nothing has since come about. So how can Brown be believed he will not do the same thing again? Or Cameron, for that matter."

I like it But as the L/D's have been after this for years i doubt they would change. It does seem fairer though dont you think?

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