FabSwingers.com forum: Is immigration

By *lentyoffun40 OP Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

Good for Britain ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

yes

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This country is much the better off for me being here.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 24/11/13 10:17:11]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"yes"

Of course it is, we wouldn't have any doctors, nurses, corner shops or bus drivers, without it!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Legal immigration... Yes...!!!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Legal immigration... Yes...!!!"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

It was recently shown that immigrants bring a net financial benefit to the country, a mix of nationalities makes life diverse and culturally interesting for me immigration properly administered is a very good thing.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *eeBee67Man
over a year ago

Masked and Distant

Immigration is good if there are jobs too fill.

Immigration to take advantage of soft benefits system not good.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My family came here in 1948 and without it would have been dead, so in one respect immigration is a great thing. The problem comes when there's too few jobs and the public sector is already stretched too far to support the influx of new residents.

I'm far from racists but I think we've reached the point where its no longer a good thing.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If its legal yes but now its getting out of control !

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Of Course its good for Britain, after all most of us are descendants of Immigrants

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

yes and no.

yes, because its always nice to interact with people of other cultures and religions, however no, because we dont have the job sustainability some seem to think we do.

yes, if we need to bring in 'professionals' to fill positions we cant fill, while training up the next generation, then fine, but why are we bussing in nurses from other countries when those leaving medical college cant find employment?

if we do have an immigration policy, much like australia, then why have we got factories full of foreign workers doing the kind of jobs our unemployed should be doing?

so it has its good and bad, but personally, i can only see mostly bad for largescale immigration of the likes we have seen recently

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Legal immigration yes. However the problems arise when the infrastructure is not revamped.

More schools, better transport, GP Practices, the list is endless.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"My family came here in 1948 and without it would have been dead, so in one respect immigration is a great thing. The problem comes when there's too few jobs and the public sector is already stretched too far to support the influx of new residents.

I'm far from racists but I think we've reached the point where its no longer a good thing."

What if the UK had taken that stance 65 years ago. Many immigrants today are in fear of their lives too.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ichaelangelaCouple
over a year ago

notts

I can see both sides of this, however, in the freezing cold and bitter wind, pissing with rain, in the fields around us were loads of guys and women, cutting and picking the veg from the field, all quite happily toiling away, no toilet/fag breaks, no stopping for a cuppa, just kept at it from before dawn and still working after dark til well into the evening.

they were all Polish... can you see many of us british doing this???

i know i wouldnt, it would be get up, look out the window, back in bed to phone in to tell them i wouldnt be coming to work in this weather.

think the veg section at the supermarket would be very bare over christmas without them, or filled with expensive imported veg.

just my opinion

now where did i put that tin hat ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"yes"

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

Well considering most of us come from immigrant stock down the ages then it's a very good thing. There would be no Great Britain without it.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm far from racists but I think we've reached the point where its no longer a good thing.

What if the UK had taken that stance 65 years ago. Many immigrants today are in fear of their lives too.

And they're welcome to come here if it keeps them from harm. My point was aimed more at allowing pretty much anyone in than those escaping fear of persecution or harm. Although I think you knew that already.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Well considering most of us come from immigrant stock down the ages then it's a very good thing. There would be no Great Britain without it. "
those Romans what would we have done without them

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *horltzMan
over a year ago

heysham

"Well considering most of us come from immigrant stock down the ages then it's a very good thing. There would be no Great Britain without it. those Romans what would we have done without them "

Had bendier roads !!!!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *rivate auditionsMan
over a year ago

West Midlands

"yes

Of course it is, we wouldn't have any doctors, nurses, corner shops or bus drivers, without it!"

We had these doctors,nurses,corner shops & bus drivers before the immigrants came here didn't we?.

so it means in that case that they are only looking after the newly arrived immigrants which means they did not really come here to save the country i reckon!,there are no jobs being created theses days,the immigrants are taking the jobs at a cheaper rate of pay than the native british from what i have seen!,what of the kids at school,college,university?,we ought to be thinking about their future and how to provide jobs & housing for them surely?.

Even the asians in b'ham,bradford,sheffield,leicester etc are saying that immigration must be stopped as country is overflowing,no houses nor jobs are causing racial tension in our cities!.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

There is nothing wrong with having a sensible debate on immigration but I can't see that happening on here as the day progresses.

Yes, immigration has been a good thing for Britain.

What hasn't been good is for British people to think of some jobs as being better suited to immigrants and not good enough for them. Along with the corollary that some employers think it is acceptable to severely bend employment laws when employing migrants.

There is a great poem online about the maths of migration. I'll see if I can find it when I am on the 'puter.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hello Crystal Wheels,

"Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared."

Except, that in practice, it does not work which is why you see concentrations of one culture in areas, that is not integration.

Alec

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is a great poem online about the maths of migration. I'll see if I can find it when I am on the 'puter."

I know the one you mean.

Sadly I suspect it will be lost on many on here.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *illwill69uMan
over a year ago

moston

I would have to say a tipping point has been reached and although immigration has been very good for this country in the past that is no longer the case.

We are now a massively overcrowded country that has neither the jobs or housing stock to cope with our population as it is. Any more expansion of the population will only increase the problem.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I can see both sides of this, however, in the freezing cold and bitter wind, pissing with rain, in the fields around us were loads of guys and women, cutting and picking the veg from the field, all quite happily toiling away, no toilet/fag breaks, no stopping for a cuppa, just kept at it from before dawn and still working after dark til well into the evening.

they were all Polish... can you see many of us british doing this???

i know i wouldnt, it would be get up, look out the window, back in bed to phone in to tell them i wouldnt be coming to work in this weather.

think the veg section at the supermarket would be very bare over christmas without them, or filled with expensive imported veg.

just my opinion

now where did i put that tin hat ?"

And your happy that OTHER people are treated like that?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Hello Crystal Wheels,

"Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared."

Except, that in practice, it does not work which is why you see concentrations of one culture in areas, that is not integration.

Alec"

It's a two way thing and takes time. People go where they feel safe and welcome. That means communities congregate. When Trevor Phillips spoke of sleep walking into ghettos I got very angry. His description was when 60% is of one ethnicity: that is most of the country and that is white British.

When black and minority ethnic people do move out of their communities they are not always made welcome or feel safe, even today.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"There is a great poem online about the maths of migration. I'll see if I can find it when I am on the 'puter.

I know the one you mean.

Sadly I suspect it will be lost on many on here."

If just one person gets their thoughts moving...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *atinaBabeCouple
over a year ago

casa caliente

Of course is Good for Britain mix the blood makes beautiful babies hahaha so one day Britain gona be full of gorgeous people lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Immigration is and always has been, a cynical way to manipulate the poor into accepting lower and lower wages. Formed a union? Fought for Health and safety, better hours, conditions? Better got some of those East Europeans over. They will work for peanuts!

The facts are these.

We do not have enough jobs to go round for the people we do have.

We cannot afford (apparently) our benefits bill.

We are throwing people off JSA after 6 months.

Is it logical (to the working classes) to keep bringing people in?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

they were all Polish... can you see many of us british doing this???

i know i wouldnt, it would be get up, look out the window, back in bed to phone in to tell them i wouldnt be coming to work in this weather.

think the veg section at the supermarket would be very bare over christmas without them, or filled with expensive imported veg.

just my opinion

now where did i put that tin hat ?"

Ah yes I remember those days before the poles mass shortages of veg in the super markets do you remember the veg riots

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Nothing like a fake memory to get people panicking!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It is, however I feel we should take a leaf out of Australia's book and be stricter, as well as insisting all immigrants comply with UK law and not promote their own faith or ideology...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *cldnCouple
over a year ago

watford

All the schools arround us have abouy a 60\40 split in favour of children who dont speak english, so the rest of the english children are not getting the suport they need and are being held back while the teachers try to teach basic english. This country is full to bursting. The govenment have no idea of the numbers due to illegal imigration but keep telling all who will listen that all is well.

Unemployed british workers are soft (not all) and if they can survive without they wont work. I know a woman who knows exactly how to play the system and get what she needs with out working and only does so because she can. Take that away and she would have to go to work.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"It is, however I feel we should take a leaf out of Australia's book and be stricter, as well as insisting all immigrants comply with UK law and not promote their own faith or ideology..."

What is British faith and ideology? The same one that saw the Puritans locked up in the Clink and deciding to sail across the ocean to set up new lives in America? The same one that saw Catholics hiding in priest holes? The same one that started wars against Islam? The ideology that split the world into pink bits? The ideology after WWI that arbitrarily divided up the Middle East and for which we are still paying the price? The ideology that if you can't get a job you must be a shirker? The ideology that foreign is a bad unless it comes with money?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

The Maths poem I mentioned early is on Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJX5XHnONTI

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Well considering most of us come from immigrant stock down the ages then it's a very good thing. There would be no Great Britain without it. those Romans what would we have done without them "

what have the Romans ever done for us

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It is, however I feel we should take a leaf out of Australia's book and be stricter, as well as insisting all immigrants comply with UK law and not promote their own faith or ideology...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *avidtealMan
over a year ago

Near Wakefield

immigration in itself is not a problem, its the freedom of movement within the European union which has caused mass immigration from the poorer eu countries to the richer nations.

mass immigration has driven down wages in the job market due to more people being available to fill those roles, furthermore the influx of immigrants pushes house prices up due to simple demand and supply of houses.

in addition to the idea of multicultural society, where mass immigration has occurred it has effectively split communities and as such places now have their own national communities which don't mix.

we will continue to see further problems come the 1st of January with the free movement off Romania and Bulgaria within the eu when yet another mass influx of immigrants make there way into this over populated country

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lentyoffun40 OP Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"immigration in itself is not a problem, its the freedom of movement within the European union which has caused mass immigration from the poorer eu countries to the richer nations.

in addition to the idea of multicultural society, where mass immigration has occurred it has effectively split communities and as such places now have their own national communities which don't mix.

Open door policy is just wrong . People coming here who can't speak the language and have no intention of learning

A lot of the minority groups near me don't want to integrate . It's as simple as that

If we had a policy like Australia where they welcome immigrants who have something to offer . Skills and a sponsor and financial Back up then its ok

To just say ok come in and we will worry about it next year is ridiculous !

Immigration might have been good for Britain in the past but now is the time to say we are full !

Train our young people to do the jobs needed . When we have a better employment rate for British citizens . Cuts from frontline services have stopped maybe then we could rethink !!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *exySwing3rsCouple
over a year ago

In Your Hearts

Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lackshadow7Man
over a year ago

Toronto

If we had a policy like Australia where they welcome immigrants who have something to offer . Skills and a sponsor and financial Back up then its ok "

You realise Britain does have a Highly Skilled Migrant Programme (i qualified under its points system) which is doubly used for those looking to settle right?

Anyway, i've left now, so one less mouth to feed, one less minority refusing to integrate and one less job being taken away

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population."

Or learn the language, live in the way of that country etc. But that's different, they are British after all.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Close the fucking borders and if they enter illegally then stick them in a row boat and let them paddle the fuck back across the channel

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lentyoffun40 OP Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population."

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

Controlled immigration yes, not the free for all it has been and will be

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

"immigration in itself is not a problem, its the freedom of movement within the European union which has caused mass immigration from the poorer eu countries to the richer nations.

in addition to the idea of multicultural society, where mass immigration has occurred it has effectively split communities and as such places now have their own national communities which don't mix.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

Or learn the language, live in the way of that country etc. But that's different, they are British after all.

"
being born in England don't make you English it makes you a brittish citizen. asians in India that are born their but with a white parent are Anglo Indian not Indian

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?"

A friend of mine moved to Ireland and now happily lives on benefits there.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Close the fucking borders and if they enter illegally then stick them in a row boat and let them paddle the fuck back across the channel "

That's a balanced and helpful _iewpoint

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You can put marmite in a bovril tub but its still marmite

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

A friend of mine moved to Ireland and now happily lives on benefits there. "

There is an Irish Forumite who frequently bemoans immigrants clogging up hopsitals and claiming benefits.

I think it is a popular misconception that Britain is a soft touch for immigrants in the same way as the benefits and perceived privileges are often misconceived.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You can put marmite in a bovril tub but its still marmite "

Sorry? I think I'm missing the point that you are making?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Controlled immigration yes, not the free for all it has been and will be"

How is immigration a free for all?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

A friend of mine moved to Ireland and now happily lives on benefits there. "
that is different he's gone from England to an English governed country so still in the UK not gone to India or Africa that's like me going to Scotland and saying hey I'm in a different E.U country

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

A friend of mine moved to Ireland and now happily lives on benefits there. that is different he's gone from England to an English governed country so still in the UK not gone to India or Africa that's like me going to Scotland and saying hey I'm in a different E.U country

I think you might find that Ireland is not governed by England...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I moved to the UK when I was 3 and I think I've bought a lot to this county, look at all you English men I've shagged, i'm doing my bit for Queen and country

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *exySwing3rsCouple
over a year ago

In Your Hearts

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

Erm...are you sure that Ireland is an English governed country!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lackshadow7Man
over a year ago

Toronto

"I moved to the UK when I was 3 and I think I've bought a lot to this county, look at all you English men I've shagged, i'm doing my bit for Queen and country

Hip hip huzzah!

(Sidenote, if i'd said the same, with roles reversed of course, i'm not sure the response would have been tame, lol)

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

"Controlled immigration yes, not the free for all it has been and will be

How is immigration a free for all? "

Where have you been since the EU opened its borders

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

That will be a surprise to the citizens of cork that they are still governed by the English.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *U1966Man
over a year ago

Devon

No it has made this country a lot less safe to live in but i am sure the country has benefitted from those that came here to work

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lentyoffun40 OP Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

Erm...are you sure that Ireland is an English governed country! "

My point was

how many ? One in Ireland is hardly a lot

Truth is it doesn't happen and can't happen

Only in Britain !!! Any wonder that when the door is held open its flooded

I'd love to go to Australia .. Fact is I can't !

If I could hop on a plane . Get there , claim benefits that Ensire I was 3 or 4 times better off than I was in uk .. I'd go tomorrow

I'm not blaming immigrants for trying but it's time for our government to stop it

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Controlled immigration yes, not the free for all it has been and will be

How is immigration a free for all?

Where have you been since the EU opened its borders

The EU hardly equates to a free for all. The vast majority of countries are not in the EU...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?"

depends where they move to

If they immigrate to a country that has state benefits and free health care they would get it the same as everyone else in the country so long as they had legal citizenship

The thing is not many countries do have a benefit system and free healthcare so you cant really expect to get what's not on offer to anyone else

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lentyoffun40 OP Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

depends where they move to

If they immigrate to a country that has state benefits and free health care they would get it the same as everyone else in the country so long as they had legal citizenship

The thing is not many countries do have a benefit system and free healthcare so you cant really expect to get what's not on offer to anyone else "

Exactly !!! That's why we are packed to the rafters !!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

I think you might find that Ireland is not governed by England...

He may be pining for the days of the empire.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 24/11/13 14:56:43]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

depends where they move to

If they immigrate to a country that has state benefits and free health care they would get it the same as everyone else in the country so long as they had legal citizenship

The thing is not many countries do have a benefit system and free healthcare so you cant really expect to get what's not on offer to anyone else

Exactly !!! That's why we are packed to the rafters !!"

but tell me if you came from a poor country where jobs, food and life's basics was in shortage and someone offered you the chance to get you and your kids away from it and you had the chance to give your children a better life you would turn it down

Of course people will come to countries that will give them money, a home and healthcare, can you blame them?

I'd do it for my kids

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ichaelangelaCouple
over a year ago

notts

they were all Polish... can you see many of us british doing this???

i know i wouldnt, it would be get up, look out the window, back in bed to phone in to tell them i wouldnt be coming to work in this weather.

think the veg section at the supermarket would be very bare over christmas without them, or filled with expensive imported veg.

just my opinion

now where did i put that tin hat ?

And your happy that OTHER people are treated like that?"

at what point did i say i was happy with the situation?? all i was pointing out was that they were doing a job that most brits would refuse to do in the situation they were in at the time and they were happy to do it.

please take more time to read posts more carefully before jumping to your own conclusions and start trying to be holier than thou to start some form of conflict

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

"Controlled immigration yes, not the free for all it has been and will be

How is immigration a free for all?

Where have you been since the EU opened its borders

The EU hardly equates to a free for all. The vast majority of countries are not in the EU...

And I assume they were let in through controlled immigration, applying for visas etc, which I have said I don't have a problem with, but the whole open door policy on the EU was a free for all.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lentyoffun40 OP Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

depends where they move to

If they immigrate to a country that has state benefits and free health care they would get it the same as everyone else in the country so long as they had legal citizenship

The thing is not many countries do have a benefit system and free healthcare so you cant really expect to get what's not on offer to anyone else

Exactly !!! That's why we are packed to the rafters !!

Of course people will come to countries that will give them money, a home and healthcare, can you blame them?

I'd do it for my kids "

Like I said in my last post . I don't blame them at all . I do it too .

Doesn't mean we turn a blind eye to what's happening here .

Get our own house in order before inviting guests over

It should be that simple

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *U1966Man
over a year ago

Devon

We should have the same immigration policy as the Australians now have

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We should have the same immigration policy as the Australians now have "

immigration has changed a lot, my parents came over in 1977 and back then you had to be able to support yourself to come in, they had to have home to move into, certain amount of money in the bank and proof of how they would support themselves before they even got in, I have no idea why these rules changed but they have over the years

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Absolutely 20000 Romanians can't be wrong

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I had perhaps the most fucked up argument a few weeks ago about this, a fella I know made a speech about immigrants coming into the country and taking jobs and undercutting wages. This from a guy who had lived his whole life in benefits because he had never wanted to work. And he couldn't see why his arguement was invalid. He said he had paid his "stamp"and I said yeah for about 18 months.

I've worked with Polish and romanian people and they are the hardest working people I have ever worked with. I was supervising a couple of Polish workers years ago and I had to tell them to take breaks. I have nothing against immigration as long as they are coming here to work and not taking advantage of the British benefit system, but there are enough British born people taking advantage of it already, that's why the immigrants get work so easily here

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lackshadow7Man
over a year ago

Toronto

"We should have the same immigration policy as the Australians now have

I had to, amongst other things, prove i had a certain amount of money to support myself, knowledge of UK life, grasp of the English language and a whole host of other criteria. And it cost in the thousands of pounds for an application.

I don't know what status people are applying for that these aren't asked. Most visas above student ones request these proofs.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

"I had perhaps the most fucked up argument a few weeks ago about this, a fella I know made a speech about immigrants coming into the country and taking jobs and undercutting wages. This from a guy who had lived his whole life in benefits because he had never wanted to work. And he couldn't see why his arguement was invalid. He said he had paid his "stamp"and I said yeah for about 18 months.

That's natural in any country, your surival techniques heighten.

As a Brit who has worked and lived around the world my techniques were the same.

And most employers would say the same.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

seeing as how we've had it for several hundred years then yes..

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *avidtealMan
over a year ago

Near Wakefield

to some extent i agree with you, some people never want to do a days work in there life and never want to better themselves sadly ther e isn't much that will change, and yes some immigrants are hard working but not all.

another point is that employers can afford to offer jobs at much lower salaries because they know they will have a mass of applicants from immigrants who don't care about been paid just the minimum wage, as this is more than they can earn at home. not to mention taking jobs which our ever growing unemployed youth could do.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *avidtealMan
over a year ago

Near Wakefield

"We should have the same immigration policy as the Australians now have

I don't know what status people are applying for that these aren't asked. Most visas above student ones request these proofs."

that's if you require a visa though, people from the eu do not require a visa to live in this country which is why we have mass immigration and will continue to do so unless the government decide to do something about it

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

"We should have the same immigration policy as the Australians now have

I don't know what status people are applying for that these aren't asked. Most visas above student ones request these proofs.

Cameron is suggesting the 3 months before you can claim benefits be extended to 12 months.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"yes

Of course it is, we wouldn't have any doctors, nurses, corner shops or bus drivers, without it!"

Or the nhs

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ollie_JCouple
over a year ago

London

I have said it many times.

Does anybody really have a probleit with ripped Polish lads and Amazonian polish blondes (if that is not an serious geographic oxymoron)

I will forgive them their bleached ripped jeans dress sense ..

The reason why..

Its not like the peterborough gene pool needs a serious kick up the arse.. I am suprised the first floor of the Queensgate shopping centre doesn't collapse on saturday lunchtimes.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *UNCHBOXMan
over a year ago

folkestone

Controlled immigration i have no problem with, but ive yet to hear a valid arguement why we allow people to travel thousands of miles to claim asylum and pass through and over many countries to come here, when they can just go to the nearest safe country.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville

Yes and No.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's a good thing, otherwise all those mingers who don't fancy working for a living (God bless them) would have to do all the menial crap jobs that the immigrants do for us. Cleaning up after us,working in fields for us etc.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Its been prooved we are a "nation of mongrels" as in...made up of nearly every nation going....

The problem today is that our infrastructure can not cope with the influx of migrants and so people quickly turn on those they think cause the problem.

Its those in power who caused the problem and unfortunately, those trying to survive who have to bear the brunt

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its been prooved we are a "nation of mongrels" as in...made up of nearly every nation going....

The problem today is that our infrastructure can not cope with the influx of migrants and so people quickly turn on those they think cause the problem.

Its those in power who caused the problem and unfortunately, those trying to survive who have to bear the brunt

My ex mother-in-law was a mongrel...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is a great poem online about the maths of migration. I'll see if I can find it when I am on the 'puter.

I know the one you mean.

Sadly I suspect it will be lost on many on here."

I found it. Fabulous. Thanks for mentioning it

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

Bloody hell

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *UNCHBOXMan
over a year ago

folkestone

"There is a great poem online about the maths of migration. I'll see if I can find it when I am on the 'puter.

I know the one you mean.

Sadly I suspect it will be lost on many on here."

Interesting line in your profile about no tories and no sun readers; not sure if your being serious or not, but if you are, nice to see your being open minded!.

As for the maths of immigration, im sure many would have learnt the line at school ' there are lies, dammned lies and statistics!'. The left wing press will spin it one way, and the right wing press will spin the other way, it's up to the voters, from their own experiences to make a balanced decision for themselves.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ezebelWoman
over a year ago

North of The Wall - youll need your vest

Ive removed posts. Please dont use the forums to insult people, whether its intended to be funny or not

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Interesting line in your profile about no tories and no sun readers; not sure if your being serious or not, but if you are, nice to see your being open minded!.

Whether I am being serious or not (and as the sentence also includes no Coldplay fans why not have a guess), I fail to see why the contents of my profile are in anyway relevant to the debate?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

"Well considering most of us come from immigrant stock down the ages then it's a very good thing. There would be no Great Britain without it. those Romans what would we have done without them "

And the Picts, the Jutes, the Angles, the Celts, the Saxons.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is a two way street. Not all British citizens who have migrated want to integrate with the indigenous population.

How many Brits who immigrate do we think are allowed to claim state benefits and get free healthcare?

give it a couple of years and you might be able to

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Good for Britain ?"

No as if we can't offer jobs or even support the people who live here already. How can we support or offer jobs to others

On the other hand if they come into this country self employed and with a trade, etc. It can benefit us.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lackshadow7Man
over a year ago

Toronto

"Bloody hell

. "

Yuuuup!!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Well considering most of us come from immigrant stock down the ages then it's a very good thing. There would be no Great Britain without it. those Romans what would we have done without them

And the Picts, the Jutes, the Angles, the Celts, the Saxons."

here now, dont leave out the vikings or we will be facing claims of discrimination from scandinavia

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

"Good for Britain ?

No as if we can't offer jobs or even support the people who live here already. How can we support or offer jobs to others

On the other hand if they come into this country self employed and with a trade, etc. It can benefit us. "

By undercutting existing plumbers, builders etc ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *himanMan
over a year ago

chichester

Sensible immigration policy via ukip

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

of course

with limits though

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Good for Britain ?

No as if we can't offer jobs or even support the people who live here already. How can we support or offer jobs to others

On the other hand if they come into this country self employed and with a trade, etc. It can benefit us.

By undercutting existing plumbers, builders etc ?

They will fight it out for low prices, etc. so the money the customer saves they can spend more in the things they want/need.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

"Good for Britain ?

No as if we can't offer jobs or even support the people who live here already. How can we support or offer jobs to others

On the other hand if they come into this country self employed and with a trade, etc. It can benefit us.

By undercutting existing plumbers, builders etc ?

They will fight it out for low prices, etc. so the money the customer saves they can spend more in the things they want/need."

And if it puts plumbers firms out of business, plumbers on the dole, reduces NI / tax income etc- that's OK?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *UNCHBOXMan
over a year ago

folkestone

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared. "

Always enjoy reading about people who are always willing to look at both sides of the argument!

Some people would say jumping out of an aeroplane is something that should be embraced not feared, but im sure a large proportion of the uk population still wouldn't do it.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

"
in the right way yes, but not where cultures are destroyed.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sensible immigration policy via ukip"

ukip, honestly ??

do they really have much support, i was under the impression they were made up of secret oswald moseley supporters.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

in the right way yes, but not where cultures are destroyed.

What culture has been, or is in danger of being destroyed?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

Always enjoy reading about people who are always willing to look at both sides of the argument!

Some people would say jumping out of an aeroplane is something that should be embraced not feared, but im sure a large proportion of the uk population still wouldn't do it. "

I'll happily look at both sides of the argument. Problem is that those that are anti=immigration inevitably cloud their own stance with ill informed scaremongering.

Your parachuting analogy is a good one. Most people would fear it, But they would almost certainly come to no harm and thoroughly enjoy the experience of they tried it

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Good for Britain ?

No as if we can't offer jobs or even support the people who live here already. How can we support or offer jobs to others

On the other hand if they come into this country self employed and with a trade, etc. It can benefit us.

By undercutting existing plumbers, builders etc ?

They will fight it out for low prices, etc. so the money the customer saves they can spend more in the things they want/need.

And if it puts plumbers firms out of business, plumbers on the dole, reduces NI / tax income etc- that's OK?"

That won't happen. Towns/cities are always crying out for them. No matter how many there are in the area.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

Always enjoy reading about people who are always willing to look at both sides of the argument!

Some people would say jumping out of an aeroplane is something that should be embraced not feared, but im sure a large proportion of the uk population still wouldn't do it. "

The bit that's seldom mentioned is the condition of the aeroplane.

Lots of people insist they'd never jump out of a perfectly serviceable aeroplane. A plane that's about to crash is a different matter.

BTW. Did you know they now make parachutes for aircraft?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

in the right way yes, but not where cultures are destroyed.

What culture has been, or is in danger of being destroyed?"

Lol you like picking don't you.

When you move to a different culture or country, you adapt to their culture.hence your original culture is lost and evolved

You really need to get out more

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *UNCHBOXMan
over a year ago

folkestone

"Sensible immigration policy via ukip

ukip, honestly ??

do they really have much support, i was under the impression they were made up of secret oswald moseley supporters."

They do have support, but only because the main 3 parties haven't listened to their voters. If successive government's had actually properly had a debate, listened to voters _iews, and made a clear and concise policy on immigration, then i expect most people would _iew them as being on the same level as the raving mad looney party. That many don't is because they feel disenfranchised with the main party's over immigration.

Don't underestimate the impact UKIP can have on the next election in 2015. If they choose their seats wisely they could split the vote of the major party's in the key marginals that will decide who wins the next election.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *UNCHBOXMan
over a year ago

folkestone

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

Always enjoy reading about people who are always willing to look at both sides of the argument!

Some people would say jumping out of an aeroplane is something that should be embraced not feared, but im sure a large proportion of the uk population still wouldn't do it.

The bit that's seldom mentioned is the condition of the aeroplane.

Lots of people insist they'd never jump out of a perfectly serviceable aeroplane. A plane that's about to crash is a different matter.

BTW. Did you know they now make parachutes for aircraft?"

I think that is a given that you would be wearing a parachute.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

in the right way yes, but not where cultures are destroyed.

What culture has been, or is in danger of being destroyed?

Lol you like picking don't you.

When you move to a different culture or country, you adapt to their culture.hence your original culture is lost and evolved

You really need to get out more"

Destroyed is not the same as evolved.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

".....

With a bit of luck, UKIP will split the Tory vote, especially with that large donation they got two weeks ago.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *UNCHBOXMan
over a year ago

folkestone

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

Always enjoy reading about people who are always willing to look at both sides of the argument!

Some people would say jumping out of an aeroplane is something that should be embraced not feared, but im sure a large proportion of the uk population still wouldn't do it.

I'll happily look at both sides of the argument. Problem is that those that are anti=immigration inevitably cloud their own stance with ill informed scaremongering.

Your parachuting analogy is a good one. Most people would fear it, But they would almost certainly come to no harm and thoroughly enjoy the experience of they tried it"

Which is why this sort of debate(not this one but one involving more clever people than me), back in the last century when labour first came to power. There were too many people in power who were more interested in ideology around immigration, than actually what the impact of the people who were living here.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

in the right way yes, but not where cultures are destroyed.

What culture has been, or is in danger of being destroyed?

Lol you like picking don't you.

When you move to a different culture or country, you adapt to their culture.hence your original culture is lost and evolved

You really need to get out more

Destroyed is not the same as evolved.

Well there is the food of course and that's it

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sensible immigration policy via ukip

ukip, honestly ??

do they really have much support, i was under the impression they were made up of secret oswald moseley supporters.

This is interesting to me as they have pretty much zero support up here. The problem with a vote in this way is that there is a risk of catching a dose of something nasty.

the people of germany,italy and spain are among those who found that out the hard way. Its worth remembering that the initial support for franco, mussolini and hitler came about because the other relevant authorities appeared to not be listening. No judgement on ukip but it must be sensible to consider the risks involved.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

Although they are bang to rights on the EU. Ukip are not a party to be trusted.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Bottom line.

Immigrants as a whole put more into the economy than they take out. Fact.

Why do many who are against immigration often go silent on this point?

People blame economic reasons for being against immigration, the facts show that argument to be a lazy one at best.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

Always enjoy reading about people who are always willing to look at both sides of the argument!

Some people would say jumping out of an aeroplane is something that should be embraced not feared, but im sure a large proportion of the uk population still wouldn't do it.

I'll happily look at both sides of the argument. Problem is that those that are anti=immigration inevitably cloud their own stance with ill informed scaremongering.

Your parachuting analogy is a good one. Most people would fear it, But they would almost certainly come to no harm and thoroughly enjoy the experience of they tried it

You mean post war when this country desperately needed people to help us rebuild?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Immigration is and always has been, a cynical way to manipulate the poor into accepting lower and lower wages. Formed a union? Fought for Health and safety, better hours, conditions? Better got some of those East Europeans over. They will work for peanuts!

The facts are these.

We do not have enough jobs to go round for the people we do have.

We cannot afford (apparently) our benefits bill.

We are throwing people off JSA after 6 months.

Is it logical (to the working classes) to keep bringing people in?"

There are plenty of jobs, unfortunately the british people don't want them , because they are not a perfect job, or they are better of on benefits.

I have an interest in a large hotel, we cant get local staff, so employ people from eec, who understand work ethics, and customer service.

They are paid the same as local staff, plus we find accommodation for them, so it costs us more,

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

".....

With a bit of luck, UKIP will split the Tory vote, especially with that large donation they got two weeks ago."

The Black and Minority Ethnic vote is the one to look at for the next election and I suspect many will vote Tory.

Immigration isn't one question, it's at least 3: what do we do about immigrants here now?; what do we need and have capacity to accept?; what will future policy look like?

I am not including asylum in any of this. Britain has rightly had a good past history on the treatment of asylum seekers. Recent history has been a little more varied.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lackshadow7Man
over a year ago

Toronto

"yes

And really there is nothing else to say on the subject.

Multiculturalism is an amazing thing that should be embraced not feared.

in the right way yes, but not where cultures are destroyed.

What culture has been, or is in danger of being destroyed?

Lol you like picking don't you.

When you move to a different culture or country, you adapt to their culture.hence your original culture is lost and evolved

You really need to get out more"

I don't know where to begin with this tripe...holy shit!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

The facts are these.

We do not have enough jobs to go round for the people we do have.

We cannot afford (apparently) our benefits bill.

We are throwing people off JSA after 6 months.

Is it logical (to the working classes) to keep bringing people in?

There are plenty of jobs, unfortunately the british people don't want them , because they are not a perfect job, or they are better of on benefits.

I have an interest in a large hotel, we cant get local staff, so employ people from eec, who understand work ethics, and customer service.

They are paid the same as local staff, plus we find accommodation for them, so it costs us more, "

Lol never heard so much tosh, have you tried training your staff, rewarding them??

promoting them??

Cop out

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

The facts are these.

We do not have enough jobs to go round for the people we do have.

We cannot afford (apparently) our benefits bill.

We are throwing people off JSA after 6 months.

Is it logical (to the working classes) to keep bringing people in?

There are plenty of jobs, unfortunately the british people don't want them , because they are not a perfect job, or they are better of on benefits.

I have an interest in a large hotel, we cant get local staff, so employ people from eec, who understand work ethics, and customer service.

They are paid the same as local staff, plus we find accommodation for them, so it costs us more, "

Even with the sanctions Job Centre Plus still reports persistent refusals for some types of jobs. Employers stop bothering to try and get the unemployed into their workforce and go and find those that will do the job.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

".....

With a bit of luck, UKIP will split the Tory vote, especially with that large donation they got two weeks ago.

The Black and Minority Ethnic vote is the one to look at for the next election and I suspect many will vote Tory.

......

You'd think so, wouldn't you yet many 'immigrant' areas return Labour members or those to the left (like GeorgeGalloway).

Dominic Grieves outburst re fiddled votes in Pakistani households won't have pleased them.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

".....

With a bit of luck, UKIP will split the Tory vote, especially with that large donation they got two weeks ago.

The Black and Minority Ethnic vote is the one to look at for the next election and I suspect many will vote Tory.

......

You'd think so, wouldn't you yet many 'immigrant' areas return Labour members or those to the left (like GeorgeGalloway).

Dominic Grieves outburst re fiddled votes in Pakistani households won't have pleased them."

Settled immigrant communities have drawn up the drawbridge and now claim there are too many foreigners in the country. 2015 will be a year to watch to see how the voting patterns change.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

immigratio is good for employers. my experience is they prefer experienced workers, and if that means dumping brits they will!

great for top politicians and their rich business mates, bad news for working class people trying to get a job

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"immigratio is good for employers. my experience is they prefer experienced workers, and if that means dumping brits they will!

great for top politicians and their rich business mates, bad news for working class people trying to get a job"

There are more ways of getting experience other than a paid job. I have taken unemployed people on and trained them up but the ones I have taken have agreed to develop themselves at the same time.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

forgot to say in the old days, employers had no option bur to invest in training. now they can dump brits on the dole and fly in preskilled foreigners.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The facts are these.

We do not have enough jobs to go round for the people we do have.

We cannot afford (apparently) our benefits bill.

We are throwing people off JSA after 6 months.

Is it logical (to the working classes) to keep bringing people in?

There are plenty of jobs, unfortunately the british people don't want them , because they are not a perfect job, or they are better of on benefits.

I have an interest in a large hotel, we cant get local staff, so employ people from eec, who understand work ethics, and customer service.

They are paid the same as local staff, plus we find accommodation for them, so it costs us more, "

That made me laugh! You pay for workers accommodation?? Really?? Well its all dreams or inept management as all the companies know about who bring staff in from abroad charge them for accommodation.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I feel very fortunate to live in such a desirable country through nothing more than the accident of birth.

How lucky I am to be able to choose to leave too if I so wish.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *avidtealMan
over a year ago

Near Wakefield

"forgot to say in the old days, employers had no option bur to invest in training. now they can dump brits on the dole and fly in preskilled foreigners."

and pay them less than they would a British person too

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *avidtealMan
over a year ago

Near Wakefield

"Bottom line.

Immigrants as a whole put more into the economy than they take out. Fact.

Why do many who are against immigration often go silent on this point?

People blame economic reasons for being against immigration, the facts show that argument to be a lazy one at best. "

is this true?

as Im pretty sure millions of pounds leave this country every week to families of immigrants in eastern Europe, Pakistan, India to name a few.

furthermore if that is the case then surely we would find class sizes at schools to be smaller, hospital waiting times to be shorter, and public services to be improved due to larger budgets.. in the simple way that more people contributing brings in more revenue in tax which could be spent on public services?

see if the money made here stayed in the country rather than farmed out of this country then i could see the benefit, but sadly this doesn't happen and whilst other countries benefit and develop from this sadly we will all suffer as a result

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ollie_JCouple
over a year ago

London

I seemed to have missed out, I paid for my own training, lived in a shit hole studied hard and worked my ass off...

Shame some indignuous people around my area don't think to do the same thing if they fancy a decent salary

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Bottom line.

Immigrants as a whole put more into the economy than they take out. Fact.

Why do many who are against immigration often go silent on this point?

People blame economic reasons for being against immigration, the facts show that argument to be a lazy one at best.

is this true?

as Im pretty sure millions of pounds leave this country every week to families of immigrants in eastern Europe, Pakistan, India to name a few.

how would you apply this in terms of business ownership ?

The reason i ask is that the number of business interests where the profit leaves the uk continues to grow and takes more money out of the country than migration does.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"see if the money made here stayed in the country rather than farmed out of this country then i could see the benefit, but sadly this doesn't happen and whilst other countries benefit and develop from this sadly we will all suffer as a result "

This country is in debt. Massive debt. The money made here barely scrapes the interest.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The facts are these.

We do not have enough jobs to go round for the people we do have.

We cannot afford (apparently) our benefits bill.

We are throwing people off JSA after 6 months.

Is it logical (to the working classes) to keep bringing people in?

There are plenty of jobs, unfortunately the british people don't want them , because they are not a perfect job, or they are better of on benefits.

I have an interest in a large hotel, we cant get local staff, so employ people from eec, who understand work ethics, and customer service.

They are paid the same as local staff, plus we find accommodation for them, so it costs us more,

That made me laugh! You pay for workers accommodation?? Really?? Well its all dreams or inept management as all the companies know about who bring staff in from abroad charge them for accommodation. "

It suits us , being in an isolated area, and suits the staff, accommodation is one thing we have plenty of.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

The facts are these.

We do not have enough jobs to go round for the people we do have.

We cannot afford (apparently) our benefits bill.

We are throwing people off JSA after 6 months.

Is it logical (to the working classes) to keep bringing people in?

There are plenty of jobs, unfortunately the british people don't want them , because they are not a perfect job, or they are better of on benefits.

I have an interest in a large hotel, we cant get local staff, so employ people from eec, who understand work ethics, and customer service.

They are paid the same as local staff, plus we find accommodation for them, so it costs us more,

That made me laugh! You pay for workers accommodation?? Really?? Well its all dreams or inept management as all the companies know about who bring staff in from abroad charge them for accommodation.

It suits us , being in an isolated area, and suits the staff, accommodation is one thing we have plenty of."

Do you ever advertise in hospitality websites? Locally now???

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

we have a good, efficient team and a happy ship, and plenty of good re_iews. so no need to advertise.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This country is in debt. Massive debt. The money made here barely scrapes the interest.

It doesn't help we are giving money to other countries when we can't even afford to find our own country. Secondly phone/gas/tv companies are more greedy by the day. Let alone the retailers. Even though it will be hard. I am sure once these get sorted a lot of people will be more stabilised in their finances.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It doesn't help we are giving money to other countries when we can't even afford to find our own country. Secondly phone/gas/tv companies are more greedy by the day. Let alone the retailers. Even though it will be hard. I am sure once these get sorted a lot of people will be more stabilised in their finances."

All meaningless.

I'm thankful that I can hope to live to an old age and not expect my children to die as infants or starve to death.

I 'earned' this by nothing more than having the fortune of my parents happening to have given birth to me in this country.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

the thing that isn't always recognised is that immigrants often do the jobs that the local population aren't prepared to do for minimum wage... so as much as the jobs may or may not be there, part of the issue is that some people aren't prepared to look for a job that doesn't pay "x"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"the thing that isn't always recognised is that immigrants often do the jobs that the local population aren't prepared to do for minimum wage... so as much as the jobs may or may not be there, part of the issue is that some people aren't prepared to look for a job that doesn't pay "x"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

All meaningless.

I'm thankful that I can hope to live to an old age and not expect my children to die as infants or starve to death.

I 'earned' this by nothing more than having the fortune of my parents happening to have given birth to me in this country.

And you can say the same for not bring the king of England

Don't get your point

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ollie_JCouple
over a year ago

London

As proved by a TV programme down our way near Wisbech. The locals didn't touch the jobs as they were low paid and menial.

I reiterate .. I did those jobs and took extra ones at the same time and studied..

Some people think a decent wage is a right.. It's not.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All meaningless.

I'm thankful that I can hope to live to an old age and not expect my children to die as infants or starve to death.

I 'earned' this by nothing more than having the fortune of my parents happening to have given birth to me in this country.

And you can say the same for not bring the king of England

Don't get your point"

Apparently you do.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lubPartyPeepsCouple
over a year ago

London

All meaningless.

I'm thankful that I can hope to live to an old age and not expect my children to die as infants or starve to death.

I 'earned' this by nothing more than having the fortune of my parents happening to have given birth to me in this country.

Here here. Just got really lucky when the cards were dealt.

Visa Immigration, we can tell you, is a nightmare.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

All meaningless.

I'm thankful that I can hope to live to an old age and not expect my children to die as infants or starve to death.

I 'earned' this by nothing more than having the fortune of my parents happening to have given birth to me in this country.

Here here. Just got really lucky when the cards were dealt.

Visa Immigration, we can tell you, is a nightmare. "
but its up to you how you define your life no matter where you live, sometimes I wish I was born on a Thai island.

And if I wanted to I can go live there.

Nothing to do with where I was born

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lackshadow7Man
over a year ago

Toronto

As proved by a TV programme down our way near Wisbech. The locals didn't touch the jobs as they were low paid and menial.

I reiterate .. I did those jobs and took extra ones at the same time and studied..

Some people think a decent wage is a right.. It's not."

Boom! Of course, some will try and rubbish this.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All meaningless.

I'm thankful that I can hope to live to an old age and not expect my children to die as infants or starve to death.

I 'earned' this by nothing more than having the fortune of my parents happening to have given birth to me in this country.

Here here. Just got really lucky when the cards were dealt.

Visa Immigration, we can tell you, is a nightmare. but its up to you how you define your life no matter where you live, sometimes I wish I was born on a Thai island.

And if I wanted to I can go live there.

Nothing to do with where I was born "

Your prospects in life have EVERYTHING to do with your accident of birth.

Sadly a free education isn't a guarantee of non ignorance.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

But, since we're constantly being told claimants are being sanctioned for failing to apply for or failing to accept jobs - the jobs these 'immigrants' ARE taking - are you suggesting there's some sort of con or fiddle going on?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lubPartyPeepsCouple
over a year ago

London

All meaningless.

I'm thankful that I can hope to live to an old age and not expect my children to die as infants or starve to death.

I 'earned' this by nothing more than having the fortune of my parents happening to have given birth to me in this country.

Here here. Just got really lucky when the cards were dealt.

Visa Immigration, we can tell you, is a nightmare. but its up to you how you define your life no matter where you live, sometimes I wish I was born on a Thai island.

And if I wanted to I can go live there.

Nothing to do with where I was born "

As are the choices of us all.

I think the point someone was making, is some people get better odds than others, depending on where they are.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *igSuki81Man
over a year ago

Retirement Village

Just sitting on the fence on this topic - there's pros and cons to this issue though we tend too see more cons than pros

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

" but its up to you how you define your life no matter where you live, sometimes I wish I was born on a Thai island.

And if I wanted to I can go live there.

Nothing to do with where I was born "

On that basis immigrants are just exercising the same desire. Instead of choosing a Thai island they are choosing here.

The difference is that being born here gives you access to more places of choice and more ability to exercise that choice. If you are born in a shack in a village with no access to water or schools let alone air flight you might find that choice and chance narrows a fair bit.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Does the UK still own any nice sunny islands we can move to? Or at least spend the winter there!?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

" but its up to you how you define your life no matter where you live, sometimes I wish I was born on a Thai island.

And if I wanted to I can go live there.

Nothing to do with where I was born

On that basis immigrants are just exercising the same desire. Instead of choosing a Thai island they are choosing here.

Well that is just your perspective on that.

And yes I could have been born in a slum in india or prince william.

No country is perfect, I think its easier if you have Wealth though and millions in the UK are not born into that either.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There are good and bad points.

Someine said earlier that brits dont integrate when they emigrate. Thats probably true and does not make it any better. The problem in when people come to Britain and cant find work or a better life and then gets stuck in the benefits system along with all british citizens. The country us fucked as it is and it is an extra burden to an already crumbling country.

I worked in holland and when my job ended i couldn't claim benefits.Had to get a job or go home which is fair enough.

The other fallicy about it beneficial is on shaky ground. The polish workers at my work all say they come here to work all hours,save up,they rarely go out and socialise at home within the polish community. They send money home and set themselves up here before going back home. Who can blame them for that? Not me and we would all do the same but that doesn't mean that it is a good thing. Pretty sure they got all the tax back too but not certain on that.

The aussies have it sorted and sensible. All welcome but respect the heritage and culture of the country as after all you wanted to come here so adapt and embrace it whilst retaining your own identity. Easy really

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Apologies for the grammar. My fat thumbs on the phone keypad

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

they were all Polish... can you see many of us british doing this???

i know i wouldnt, it would be get up, look out the window, back in bed to phone in to tell them i wouldnt be coming to work in this weather.

think the veg section at the supermarket would be very bare over christmas without them, or filled with expensive imported veg.

just my opinion

now where did i put that tin hat ?

And your happy that OTHER people are treated like that?

please take more time to read posts more carefully before jumping to your own conclusions and start trying to be holier than thou to start some form of conflict"

There are plenty of British people that would do this work, that don't even get a look in, because the employer knows he can pay less than the national wage and break long fought for employment rights.

Your happy to allow foreigners to do "the dirty work" because you said you would not be prepared to do it. That sounds like someone happy with them being abused.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The facts are these.

We do not have enough jobs to go round for the people we do have.

We cannot afford (apparently) our benefits bill.

We are throwing people off JSA after 6 months.

Is it logical (to the working classes) to keep bringing people in?

There are plenty of jobs, unfortunately the british people don't want them , because they are not a perfect job, or they are better of on benefits.

I have an interest in a large hotel, we cant get local staff, so employ people from eec, who understand work ethics, and customer service.

They are paid the same as local staff, plus we find accommodation for them, so it costs us more, "

So bring more people in and keep the lazy ones on benefits??? That is just the most fucked up logic I can think of. People are being forced off benefits constantly. If they have no benefits to claim, they are going to need those jobs.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The facts are these.

We do not have enough jobs to go round for the people we do have.

We cannot afford (apparently) our benefits bill.

We are throwing people off JSA after 6 months.

Is it logical (to the working classes) to keep bringing people in?

There are plenty of jobs, unfortunately the british people don't want them , because they are not a perfect job, or they are better of on benefits.

I have an interest in a large hotel, we cant get local staff, so employ people from eec, who understand work ethics, and customer service.

They are paid the same as local staff, plus we find accommodation for them, so it costs us more,

I was out of work for over 18 months. No JSA or anything after 6 months, just a reduction in council tax. I applied for hundreds of jobs, supermarkets, catering, hotels, cleaning, labouring...anything. Not one place would even inter_iew me because I was overqualified. They no doubt thought I would be a little bit truculent when it came to refusing to be abused because I know about employment rights and the law. You want cheap labour who won't stand up for themselves because they are too scared to.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Does the UK still own any nice sunny islands we can move to? Or at least spend the winter there!?"

lets see now, theres a small selection :

Diego Garcia where we kicked the locals out to turn it into a military base.

Ascencion but thats just a big lump of rock used as a refueling point when we go to war with the argies again.

St. Helena but its 95% rain forest and the only way to get there is a 2 week trip on the post office boat from cape town.

South Georgia but its not sunny and inhabited by a plague of rats that are eating penguin and puffin eggs.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *igSuki81Man
over a year ago

Retirement Village

"... There is nothing wrong with having a sensible debate on immigration but I can't see that happening on here as the day progresses... "

There are so many _iews on this topic each holding their own merit but having read alot of this thread the above partially quoted lickety post summed up the debate on here very early on

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We have had migrants move to these shores for hundreds and hundreds of years. In general that's why we are as diverse and have prospered as we have. With some form of control it should continue as the majority help move the country onwards.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Even Jack Straw admitted they fucked up. They seriously underestimated how popular this country was going to be, compared to some of the other countries.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

I have applied for supermarket and other jobs too and I don't make the shortlist. Having been a CEO probably makes them think I am overqualified. But I also know that they have a lot of choice and in their position I might make the same decision.

I am self-employed and entitled to nothing. If I don't have work I don't have recourse to benefits until I reach the point of having to sell my home. I don't think immigration has anything to do with it though. It's about an ideology and decisions how to spend the money available in this country.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *lackshadow7Man
over a year ago

Toronto

"... There is nothing wrong with having a sensible debate on immigration but I can't see that happening on here as the day progresses...

There are so many _iews on this topic each holding their own merit but having read alot of this thread the above partially quoted lickety post summed up the debate on here very early on

Yeah, i give up. Some bone headed responses to the thread.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"Even Jack Straw admitted they fucked up. They seriously underestimated how popular this country was going to be, compared to some of the other countries."

Do people understand why this is really? Most people learn some English. This happens across the world. It makes sense to aim for somewhere you have a bit of the language.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

But immigration is used as a tool to beat the poor and jobless of this country. The line about "brits won't do these jobs as they consider it beneath them" is just complete arsewash.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Only good if they have money a job. All illegal immigrants should be sent back immediately or locked up in prison!! and not given money and housing!!!!! Every day they steal from my country and other EU countries. Just see what you would get if you turned up in their countries illegally..most of them you would be locked up or deported!!

Rant over

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

But immigration is used as a tool to beat the poor and jobless of this country. The line about "brits won't do these jobs as they consider it beneath them" is just complete arsewash. "

I wish that were true. I am not saying all Brits consider those jobs beneath them but I have spent a lot of my career in education, skills and employment. The reports when I met with Job Centre Plus on how many jobs on their books they could not get people to take was staggering. The placements I took that would refuse the job I offered unless I upped the salary (and I was paying at London Living Wage and higher long before that was a trend) or refused to do parts of the jobs they felt was too boring to do every day.

The parts of the country I have visited where I have been told that those jobs aren't worth doing...

I want British people, young people particularly, to have the jobs and have the skills to do the work that is here. But they have to turn up and get real. Now even I am beginning to sound right wing.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *igSuki81Man
over a year ago

Retirement Village

"... There is nothing wrong with having a sensible debate on immigration but I can't see that happening on here as the day progresses...

There are so many _iews on this topic each holding their own merit but having read alot of this thread the above partially quoted lickety post summed up the debate on here very early on

Yeah, i give up. Some bone headed responses to the thread."

not bone headed responses at all, there was a lovely post early on about closing borders and putting people on a row boat across the channel. That really added to the complexity and reasoned arguments of this thread

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Illegal immigrants are not given money and housing. Undocumented migrants scrape by. It's not an easy ride being here without documents. Get the facts straight.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Always write a CV for a specific job, you apply for, you don't have to tell people everything.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately