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PC gone Madder

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Just seen in the news that both Asda and Tesco have removed costumes from the Halloween fancy dress range and not only apologised but paid voluntary "fines" to MIND as the costumes were depicting insanity as something to be afraid of!

Mental Patient was blood spattered rags inhuman mask and a cleaver, psycho ward was an orange jump suit and jaw restraint (sounds like a rip off of Hannibal Lecter).

Now the names may be a tad insensitive... but public apology withdraw costumes (though after the key date!) and thousands of £ paid to charity by way of apology, seems a bit steep to me.

Am I wrong to feel they should have said go away and grow up?

Or should I be complaining that the Texas chainsaw massacre movie owes me millions in compensation for damages as I own two chainsaws and have only ever used them on trees???

and any publicity about the shoe bomber is harmful to the shoe industry or... etc...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think the fact that they had to remove it because people can't tell the distinction between the two is far worse.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge


"They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important. "

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By *oxy_minxWoman
over a year ago

Scotland - Aberdeen

It wasn't the costumes! It was the names applied to them, after all the work being done to remove the stigma of mental health issues.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important. "

Why?

Do you think that people are not sufficiently intelligent to distinguish a fancy dress costume based on multiple horror films from reality?

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By *wingerdelightCouple
over a year ago

eastliegh


"They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important.

Why?

Do you think that people are not sufficiently intelligent to distinguish a fancy dress costume based on multiple horror films from reality?things really are going to far. Its a costume ffs

"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important.

Why?

Do you think that people are not sufficiently intelligent to distinguish a fancy dress costume based on multiple horror films from reality?

"

It makes an unconscious link in your way of thinking ... Mentally ill = mental = psyco = I'm in danger of being hurt.

Which for most people with mental illness isn't true.

It's about removing the connotation that mental illness equals danger.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Which for most people with mental illness isn't true.

It's about removing the connotation that mental illness equals danger."

Again I question why, to any rational person the name and the costume design are entirely self explanatory, which would and should slide into obscurity on the 1st November.

As it happens we disapprove of Halloween being linked to horror, and see it in a very different light but don't feel the need to stop others from dressing up and scaring each other if they so choose.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge


"They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important.

Why?

Do you think that people are not sufficiently intelligent to distinguish a fancy dress costume based on multiple horror films from reality?

"

It's the name more than the image. My aunt was a 'mental patient' for more than 30 years. Thinking about the image those costumes portray is offensive. I also have a good friend who has had stints in psychiatric units. To convey the idea that such people are dangerous is wrong.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

they can afford to give money to MIND anyway and its a good charity. Maybe people will think a bit more in the future, about what is suitable for a halloween costume.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Absolutely mad.

Are we allowed to say that still?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Absolutely mad.

Are we allowed to say that still?"

The irony of the thread title has just struck me

I do understand the comments about removing stigma, and have had issues with depression myself as well as having friends who have more serious issues with mental health problems. however not one of them I am sure would suspect a cleaver wielding serial killer or a machete armed cannibalistic character from a movie to be sane, any more than they or I would expect them to be in the same category of mental health issues as ourselves.

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By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

Lots of mind games being played at the moment, Hitler, mental patients,twin towers,Boston marathon runners etc etc.

and its Halloween

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" Mental Patient was blood spattered rags inhuman mask and a cleaver "

That, to some, will give the impression that this is what a mental patient is like. Even if they don't think it, the image is there.

That isn't a movie character rip off.

Also, vulnerable people who have just come from, have friends and family in a psychiatric ward take what message from this? This is what the world thinks of you.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Lots of mind games being played at the moment, Hitler, mental patients,twin towers,Boston marathon runners etc etc.

and its Halloween "

Not sure what to say about the twin towers incident, something is wrong about it.. but can't decide if it's the club backing away fast and putting the blame on a contract DJ who will possibly lose his job, or the modern tendency to put everything on social networks so a small thing becomes a global incident, or even the poor judgement of the costumes... though there was a film made showing real people jumping from... oh shit this world is screwed up place!

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By *radleyandRavenCouple
over a year ago

Herts

I'm just waiting for everything to be banned. Like many, I have my own issues with mental health but didn't give two fucks about the costumes. - I imagine all psychiatric horror films and Thorpe Park's "Asylum" maze will be targetted next.

So I assume we can also complain about the "sexy nurse" outfits as well since they're not an accurate portrayal of people working in the health care industry? And then all and any costumes worn by strippers right down to Joe Public.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Why?

Do you think that people are not sufficiently intelligent to distinguish a fancy dress costume based on multiple horror films from reality?

"

You are right, the worrying thing is the implication that people are too stupid to distinguish the difference. But unfortunately that belief runs right through the establishment/media in this country. Blame Jeremy Kyle.

Having suffered with mental health issues in the past I don't see it is offensive. I find it more offensive that I am viewed as too stupid to see it for what it is. A fancy dress costume.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm just waiting for everything to be banned. Like many, I have my own issues with mental health but didn't give two fucks about the costumes. - I imagine all psychiatric horror films and Thorpe Park's "Asylum" maze will be targetted next.

So I assume we can also complain about the "sexy nurse" outfits as well since they're not an accurate portrayal of people working in the health care industry? And then all and any costumes worn by strippers right down to Joe Public."

Student union have banned most costumes from there bar as they say they are racist including Mexican hats

Birmingham university btw

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm just waiting for everything to be banned. Like many, I have my own issues with mental health but didn't give two fucks about the costumes. - I imagine all psychiatric horror films and Thorpe Park's "Asylum" maze will be targetted next.

So I assume we can also complain about the "sexy nurse" outfits as well since they're not an accurate portrayal of people working in the health care industry? And then all and any costumes worn by strippers right down to Joe Public."

You mean nurses aren't sexy?

I remember seeing my wife in her uniform the first time. Far from sexy - until the shapeless trousers were removed..

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By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

[Removed by poster at 06/11/13 19:04:28]

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By *radleyandRavenCouple
over a year ago

Herts


"You mean nurses aren't sexy?

I remember seeing my wife in her uniform the first time. Far from sexy - until the shapeless trousers were removed.."

I'll admit that I probably worded that wrong in my rush to get the message posted before my train went into a tunnel. I'm not saying nurses aren't sexy but I imagine most like to go about their daily business without sexual harrassment.

Lets say I can't differentiate between nurse costumes and real nurses. I'll be wondering why I can't see cleavage, their skirts aren't shorter and they're not wearing white stockings, suspenders and heels...

I DEMAND ACTION!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Lets say I can't differentiate between nurse costumes and real nurses. I'll be wondering why I can't see cleavage, their skirts aren't shorter and they're not wearing white stockings, suspenders and heels...

I DEMAND ACTION!!!"

Exactly what I was wondering. I demanded action - down went the trousers and the top few buttons.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don't think they should have been taken off, its a sad world where everyone is to worried about being pc than alowing their children to have a bit of fun. Next they be blaming the screem films on why everyone is wary of the women dressed head to toe in black, ( sorry can't think of the name of it)

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By *opping_candyWoman
over a year ago

West Yorkshire

It didn't happen after the key date, this was in the news weeks ago when the costumes first went on sale.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's not the costume that's a problem, it's the advertising. It's not like people were dressing as the twin towers...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm all for destigmatising mental health, and the titles of the costumes should have been changed, but it seems a bit oversensitive

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 06/11/13 21:19:24]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The names were offensive and inappropriate. The costumes should have just been renamed. There is still a stigma to depression and that stigma increases with the severity of mental illness.

Physical illnesses will always get far more support that mental ones. No one ever gets told to leave their partner if they have cancer, but that was the advice I repeatedly received (not that I was asking for advice...) from many people when my then partner attempted suicide several years ago. That is the harsh reality of mental illness, many people see you as a liability, a danger, a potential problem...

Anything that helps remove the stigma is a good thing

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By * Busty HotwifeCouple
over a year ago

Bradford


"They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important.

Why?

Do you think that people are not sufficiently intelligent to distinguish a fancy dress costume based on multiple horror films from reality?

It makes an unconscious link in your way of thinking ... Mentally ill = mental = psyco = I'm in danger of being hurt.

Which for most people with mental illness isn't true.

It's about removing the connotation that mental illness equals danger."

It's all a load of rubbish, that's what it is and is so typical of the way our shit country tries to portray 'offence' at everything instead of just getting on with it. They're costumes, nothing more, withdrawing them isn't going to change any previously held stereotypes that people hold towards the mentally ill or 'mental patients'.

1 in 4 of us will suffer from a mental illness at some point and 1 in 3 women are on medication for mental problems. Which quite scarily means that 2 in 3 women aren't aware of their condition!'

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The names were offensive and inappropriate. The costumes should have just been renamed. There is still a stigma to depression and that stigma increases with the severity of mental illness.

Physical illnesses will always get far more support that mental ones. No one ever gets told to leave their partner if they have cancer, but that was the advice I repeatedly received (not that I was asking for advice...) from many people when my then partner attempted suicide several years ago. That is the harsh reality of mental illness, many people see you as a liability, a danger, a potential problem...

Anything that helps remove the stigma is a good thing"

While I don't disagree with your sentiments on Physical illness getting more support I do disagree that the best course of action was taken.

I have suffered very very badly in the past and still have my off days. Because of that and the understanding I have of the issues I have ended up with a team at work built of both sexes who have or have had similar problems and couldn't deal with normal duties. It happened gradually over the years. It is now a highly respected and efficient specialist technical team that is on call 24/7 for when the shit badly hits the fan. How have we done it? By what most "Experts" would call inappropriate behaviour and mickey taking that has led to a closeness and support that could not have happened if there was not that openness. The other areas we work with are all aware of our histories, it has never been hidden and we all laugh about it. Most importantly it allows everyone to be open when they are having a bad day and we deal with it and support together. And everyone is a hell of a lot better than when they joined us.

Sometimes pandering or taking the most PC line does the most damage. Sometime a laugh is the best medicine.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Sometime a laugh is the best medicine. "

That line deserves a topic all of it's own. When my daughter went through depression, I was ready for it, expected it a couple of years before actually. After she had tried all the Doctors routes and was at a turning point I simply told her what cured mine. It was the realisation that the one thing you should never say to someone with depression is "pull yourself together" but the only thing that will ever cure depression is "pulling yourself together". The catch 22 situation caused us to start laughing, the laughing started the cure. She and I are fine now.

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By *hite SnakeMan
over a year ago

leeds


"It's not the costume that's a problem, it's the advertising. It's not like people were dressing as the twin towers... "

Actually they were dressed as the twin towers won first prize too.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Sometime a laugh is the best medicine.

That line deserves a topic all of it's own. When my daughter went through depression, I was ready for it, expected it a couple of years before actually. After she had tried all the Doctors routes and was at a turning point I simply told her what cured mine. It was the realisation that the one thing you should never say to someone with depression is "pull yourself together" but the only thing that will ever cure depression is "pulling yourself together". The catch 22 situation caused us to start laughing, the laughing started the cure. She and I are fine now."

Exactly

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By *hetalkingstoveMan
over a year ago

London

"I'm just waiting for everything to be banned. Like many, I have my own issues with mental health but didn't give two fucks about the costumes. - I imagine all psychiatric horror films and Thorpe Park's "Asylum" maze will be targetted next."

You know it's not all about you, right? Just because you don't have an issue with it, doesn't mean no one else will.

This seem incredibly hard for people to understand when these topics come up.

Not everyone is the same. Maybe when someone says 'I find this offensive' we could say 'Oh, ok' and take the really small step to fix the problem, rather than being all 'that's ridiculous' and scoffing at the idea that language can be harmful.

And the 'everything will be banned!' stuff is just nonsense. We're talking about taking a little more care with how we talk about sensitive issues. No one is being locked up or losing anything from this kind of thing.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Maybe when someone says 'I find this offensive' we could say 'Oh, ok' and take the really small step to fix the problem, "

Um... No.

Sorry you can also fix the problem by explaining that normal human interaction happens some of which you don't like and need to turn a blind eye to, As I said somewhere about 1 mile up this thread we both abhor the hijacking of Halloween as a time of horror and sick costumes. It is actually offensive to us, but it's what society does these days so we ignore it and let the world do it's own thing, whilst we place food and drink in the hearth, for the spirits who wish to visit, and take a walk in the wood wishing the trees a gentle sleep.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important. "

So we are not allowed to think that some mentally people are murderous and criminal. Some of them are, the same as some sane people are killers and criminals. But it they don't really make good costumes. Think about most of your high profile (and a fair amount of non headline grabbing) killers. They were nearly all suffering from some form of mental illness. To not allow someone to sell costumes because it COULD make SOME people (highly suggestible people) think all mentally ill people are killers, is complete overkill.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Until real psychos start killing people dressed in supermarket halloween costumes, no its not okay to fear for your life. Pull yourself together. If we mental health basket cases can, so can you!

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By *ixson-BallsMan
over a year ago

Blackpool

[Removed by poster at 07/11/13 01:03:45]

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By *ixson-BallsMan
over a year ago

Blackpool

jeez....these type of threads make me so fooking depressed....lol

please ....please take the above statement in the humorous way it was intended...

if not......fook off....lol

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By *tirling DarkCouple
over a year ago

Stirling


"They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important.

Why?

Do you think that people are not sufficiently intelligent to distinguish a fancy dress costume based on multiple horror films from reality?

Sadly not everyone is as enlightened as you are. Many with mental health issues still feel stigmatised by their illness.

Would the bring out a blood splattered Burka costume and call it "halloban"?

"

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By *radleyandRavenCouple
over a year ago

Herts


""I'm just waiting for everything to be banned. Like many, I have my own issues with mental health but didn't give two fucks about the costumes. - I imagine all psychiatric horror films and Thorpe Park's "Asylum" maze will be targetted next."

You know it's not all about you, right? Just because you don't have an issue with it, doesn't mean no one else will.

This seem incredibly hard for people to understand when these topics come up.

Not everyone is the same. Maybe when someone says 'I find this offensive' we could say 'Oh, ok' and take the really small step to fix the problem, rather than being all 'that's ridiculous' and scoffing at the idea that language can be harmful.

And the 'everything will be banned!' stuff is just nonsense. We're talking about taking a little more care with how we talk about sensitive issues. No one is being locked up or losing anything from this kind of thing."

Hold the fucking phone... You're saying that it's NOT all about me?

Well what's the point in it?!

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By *lackshadow7Man
over a year ago

Toronto

The amount of false equivalence on display in this thread is staggering.

And a great example of why such steps are taken by those with a bit of awareness of wider issues like this one.

The whole "soon they'll ban everything" argument reeks of laziness, entitlement, privilege and a titanic shift in the established order.

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By *radleyandRavenCouple
over a year ago

Herts

[Removed by poster at 07/11/13 08:57:30]

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By *radleyandRavenCouple
over a year ago

Herts


"[Removed by poster at 07/11/13 08:57:30]"

FFS. Deleted it by accident and can't be asked to type it again.

Oh well, guess that suits my lazy attitude.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Until real psychos start killing people dressed in supermarket halloween costumes, no its not okay to fear for your life. Pull yourself together. If we mental health basket cases can, so can you!"

If I want to fear for my life, thats MY prerogative. A few of my family have had mental health problems, ranging from Manic depression with paranoid schizophrenia (as it was called in the seventies)to mild depression, and all points inbetween. I have been visiting people on mental wards in Bolton general and Prestwich hospital (that place was like a victorian asylum). I still don't see why people musty have choices taken from them.

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By * Busty HotwifeCouple
over a year ago

Bradford


"Until real psychos start killing people dressed in supermarket halloween costumes, no its not okay to fear for your life. Pull yourself together. If we mental health basket cases can, so can you!

If I want to fear for my life, thats MY prerogative. A few of my family have had mental health problems, ranging from Manic depression with paranoid schizophrenia (as it was called in the seventies)to mild depression, and all points inbetween. I have been visiting people on mental wards in Bolton general and Prestwich hospital (that place was like a victorian asylum). I still don't see why people musty have choices taken from them."

Because some whining, bleeding heart liberal will take offence and because we 'offend' a minority or an over sensitive minority,then it has to be banned....

Personally, after living with some potentially serious issues for a few years, I think it's a Halloween costume rendered for a bit if fun. Not to humiliate. Not to make the statement that people with mental issues are all knife-wielding maniacs. Just a costume for a party that'll get stained and binned. And forgotten about. And if someone does decide to murder people whilst dressed as a mental patient, I think we'll find it more likely inspired by some cheap horror flick of yesteryear, or even last year. Not a fancy dress costume!!

People really should lighten up and stop looking to make themselves feel important by being 'offended'.

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By *rivate auditionsMan
over a year ago

West Midlands


"Until real psychos start killing people dressed in supermarket halloween costumes, no its not okay to fear for your life. Pull yourself together. If we mental health basket cases can, so can you!

If I want to fear for my life, thats MY prerogative. A few of my family have had mental health problems, ranging from Manic depression with paranoid schizophrenia (as it was called in the seventies)to mild depression, and all points inbetween. I have been visiting people on mental wards in Bolton general and Prestwich hospital (that place was like a victorian asylum). I still don't see why people musty have choices taken from them.

Because some whining, bleeding heart liberal will take offence and because we 'offend' a minority or an over sensitive minority,then it has to be banned....

Personally, after living with some potentially serious issues for a few years, I think it's a Halloween costume rendered for a bit if fun. Not to humiliate. Not to make the statement that people with mental issues are all knife-wielding maniacs. Just a costume for a party that'll get stained and binned. And forgotten about. And if someone does decide to murder people whilst dressed as a mental patient, I think we'll find it more likely inspired by some cheap horror flick of yesteryear, or even last year. Not a fancy dress costume!!

People really should lighten up and stop looking to make themselves feel important by being 'offended'. "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The amount of false equivalence on display in this thread is staggering.

And a great example of why such steps are taken by those with a bit of awareness of wider issues like this one.

The whole "soon they'll ban everything" argument reeks of laziness, entitlement, privilege and a titanic shift in the established order."

For every expression of disdain for The Sun and other papers of that ilk, there are many more cheers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Until real psychos start killing people dressed in supermarket halloween costumes, no its not okay to fear for your life. Pull yourself together. If we mental health basket cases can, so can you!

If I want to fear for my life, thats MY prerogative. A few of my family have had mental health problems, ranging from Manic depression with paranoid schizophrenia (as it was called in the seventies)to mild depression, and all points inbetween. I have been visiting people on mental wards in Bolton general and Prestwich hospital (that place was like a victorian asylum). I still don't see why people musty have choices taken from them."

No, I agree. I have a history of mental health problems and I wouldnt be offended or want those choices taken away. But I studied media and most correct ethics there lie in how the product is sold, not what the product is.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

whoever is working in the 'fun' marketing sections of these superstores is a fucking idiot,

the costume itself isnt the issue so much, title of mental patient IS

I worked in psychiatry for a good 10yrs, so can see the funny side of things...but not really the ones that play on the stigma of the crazy schizo killer

and remember, they also had pole dancing kits for young girls ffs

if I'm off my head with PCness I dont give a fuck

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"whoever is working in the 'fun' marketing sections of these superstores is a fucking idiot,

the costume itself isnt the issue so much, title of mental patient IS

I worked in psychiatry for a good 10yrs, so can see the funny side of things...but not really the ones that play on the stigma of the crazy schizo killer

and remember, they also had pole dancing kits for young girls ffs

if I'm off my head with PCness I dont give a fuck"

I agree, I used to love my horror films and halloween too. Just another distraction to dampen spirits.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They were right to do so, removing stigma from mental illness is important.

Why?

Do you think that people are not sufficiently intelligent to distinguish a fancy dress costume based on multiple horror films from reality?

Sadly many are not and it does have a very real and very negative effect on disabled people who are only trying to go about their day-to-day lives.

I wish I was wrong and hopefully one day it will be different but atm I'm really struggling to see how you can credit people with being sufficiency intelligent to make the distinctions you speak of

"

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