FabSwingers.com forum: Is prison too easy these days?

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I do wonder if it gets more comfortable every decade with prisoners having TV’s food choices, gyms and we are on the verge of them getting the right to vote...well maybe. So the question I pose is do prisoners have it too easy and is it a scary deterrent anymore?

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

I'd rather not go if its all the same

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'll wave to you as they lock the cell door

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All it takes away from someone now is they are confined to one place in a controlled environment.

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By *ezebelWoman
over a year ago

North of The Wall - youll need your vest

Wont be when they have to give up the fags.

The ones you smoke btw.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I'd rather not go if its all the same"

I have no doubt you wouldn't however you didn't really answer if it was too easy or not.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Wont be when they have to give up the fags.

The ones you smoke btw."

That's part of why I put this up and some responses as to that question.

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

Irrelevant if they are too easy or too hard

Point is the people who get sent down are unable to commit crimes in the neighbourhoods

That is until they are releases !

Have u ever been to one?

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

"I'd rather not go if its all the same

I have no doubt you wouldn't however you didn't really answer if it was too easy or not. "

well if it was too easy I wouldn't mind going.

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

"All it takes away from someone now is they are confined to one place in a controlled environment. "

Many lose their home, their wife, contact with their kids, their health, their anal virginity, their job, their friends and more.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Irrelevant if they are too easy or too hard

Point is the people who get sent down are unable to commit crimes in the neighbourhoods

That is until they are releases !

Have u ever been to one? "

I have been inside a couple of prisons but not in the capacity of an inmate. Is it irrelevant? I would say not as part of the reason for a custodial term is as a deterrent and if the deterrent is mild it will be less effective. So have you ever been to one seeing I answered your question you can return the information.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I do wonder if it gets more comfortable every decade with prisoners having TV’s food choices, gyms and we are on the verge of them getting the right to vote...well maybe. So the question I pose is do prisoners have it too easy and is it a scary deterrent anymore?"

unless you have first hand experience, how can you answer this question?

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

unless you have first hand experience, how can you answer this question?"

If you take that point of _iew most people cannot really answer half the forum threads put up. If you take this point of _iew and you are not part of a couple you should not have posted an opinion on "Why do most couples profiles only show the female and not the guy?" thread or or the "young girls older men" if you haven't had sex with young girls or even put up your condom thread unless you have had sex within a prison walls. Being a nosy sort I wouldn't mind knowing if you have had sex within a prison walls.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think prisoners should be treat like shit. That way no one wants to go back.

Too much like Butlins these days

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

totally agree, seems more like butlins nowadays.

Tv, games consoles, chance to earn money, free education, 3 good meals a day (was on news they get better food than hospitals), gym, social time, some even get to have pets, visits from family/friends and even alone time with wife/gf.

Exactly how is any of that gonna put people off prison, a lot of the ones who end up there, might be homeless already. Seen programs where as soon as they come out, they reoffend to go back in because life is good and easier in there than having to pay bills, work 9-5, clean up after yourself etc.

I say small room, 4walls, basic bed, 3 basic meals, 1 hr a day out the room and thats it. Dont like it, dont commit the crime.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"chance to earn money, free education, 3 good meals a day (was on news they get better food than hospitals), gym, social time, some even get to have pets, visits from family/friends"

Usually people in hospitals are there for a few days, so their diet isn't that important.

A prisoner is usually there for months or years, so diet is important.

Education is vital in teaching skills, it may be the first time someone has the chance to learn, and be able to survive in the outside world.

It may be the first time someone has earnt a wage, and it teaches about priorities and how to manage.

Exercise is vital, especially if your confined.

Friends and family shouldn't be punished for someones mistakes or bad judgement.

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By *egasus NobMan
over a year ago

Merton

lol food choice

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I really do object that my hard earned tax is being spent on class a offenders in prison. I'm afraid if a child sex offender goes to jail. Kill the mother don't let him choose his frigin menu or let the bugger do a frigin degree which most of our kids end up in debt for.. Instant justice I say.... Rant over breathe

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Judging by suicide rates, especially in young offenders, probably not

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I always say this, but tent city in the US would stop anyone reoffending

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By *ce WingerMan
over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ

"I'd rather not go if its all the same

I have no doubt you wouldn't however you didn't really answer if it was too easy or not. "

How on earth could anyone actually answer that question honestly unless they had actually been interred themselves

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By *hocksandmissusCouple
over a year ago

Chester-ish

has any one thought about those that end up in prison when still innocent. fact is courts make mistakes as does every one else. for those ppl losing everything I am sure its not to soft or easy at all xxxxxxxx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

as a relative of a recent prisoner, i DO believe that GAOL these days is far too easy. Very much so. I dont wanna elaborate much but i sincerely believe that todays system is far too lenient and disgustingly easy for the offenders to ride.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's like a holiday camp Ffs, I've got past mates from my old life style in and out of prison like it comes with a revolving door and they don't care if they get sent down.

They see it as a break, they laugh about it and how easy it is.

My dads a screw (prison officer) and before we lost contact he used to say how easy they get it and how lack it is.

This country has got soft so no wonder people reoffend time after time.

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By *ce WingerMan
over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ

Fair enough Rusty, but surely most people would choose freedom over being locked in a cell, no matter how many "perks" they allegedly have. Some folk are on remand and are not actually proven guilty but have less opportunities to occupy their mind and keep active until judgement is passed

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Fair enough Rusty, but surely most people would choose freedom over being locked in a cell, no matter how many "perks" they allegedly have. Some folk are on remand and are not actually proven guilty but have less opportunities to occupy their mind and keep active until judgement is passed "

Yeah but my point is that most who have been inside are not affraid to go back.

Where's the fear???

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By *ce WingerMan
over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ

Dunno, but Mr Mackay would certainly drive the fear of god into me

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By *iss_tressWoman
over a year ago

London

"I'd rather not go if its all the same"

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By *uncpl2015Couple
over a year ago

Bridgend Area

unless you have first hand experience, how can you answer this question?"

quite simply because you only have to listen to some of the little shits when they come out who openly admit that its too hard out and much nicer and easier life inside so go out of their way to get back in.

Yet you ask someone in the military that has been to the glasshouse and they never want to go back.. so how come prison isnt like that as that wpuld correct all that are correctable.. simple too many wasters preaching human rights n crap.. you break the law you give up your human rights.

Its about time this country got a grip and stopped allowing these human rights preachers making sure criminals get an easier and better life than their victims do.

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By *tirling DarkCouple
over a year ago

Stirling

"I think prisoners should be treat like shit. That way no one wants to go back.

Too much like Butlins these days "

And let's hope you don't end up in end up in one then. For example you could be driving, using mobile phone, have a RTC and seriously injure or kill someone. LO and behold you are jailed. Still want to be treated like shit?

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By *tirling DarkCouple
over a year ago

Stirling

unless you have first hand experience, how can you answer this question?

And how many

Its about time this country got a grip and stopped allowing these human rights preachers making sure criminals get an easier and better life than their victims do."

You will find Colchester and other military regional detention centres in the military have changed. Many didn't go back in because they were discharged from service after their sentence. They then probably went on and committed crimes in civvy street.

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By *iss_tressWoman
over a year ago

London

My sister is a psychiatric nurse who works in prisons. I remember her telling me she went to a category C prison for a meeting and struggled to find a parking space because of the prisoners cars. They went out to work during the day but slept in the prison!

In category A prison she does a lot of suicide watch as it's not a cushy environment at all. Category B, now these can appear like holiday camps: en suite facilities, Sky, education (rated good by Ofsted, higher than some schools), gym etc.

If you lived on the streets alone before being banged up I suppose for some being banged up is a holiday camp, but if you've a life, I can't see it being fun.

Like everything: some will see it as a deterrent and tough, others won't.

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By *iss_tressWoman
over a year ago

London

unless you have first hand experience, how can you answer this question?

Its about time this country got a grip and stopped allowing these human rights preachers making sure criminals get an easier and better life than their victims do."

Wow! You learn something new on here everyday: human right preachers set the laws and dictate the sentencing the judiciary hand out!

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By *iss_tressWoman
over a year ago

London

"I think prisoners should be treat like shit. That way no one wants to go back.

Too much like Butlins these days

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

unless you have first hand experience, how can you answer this question?"
+1

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"Judging by suicide rates, especially in young offenders, probably not"

Come on give me the figures ?

I think you will find that suicide rates amongst young offenders is extremely rare

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"I really do object that my hard earned tax is being spent on class a offenders in prison. I'm afraid if a child sex offender goes to jail. Kill the mother don't let him choose his frigin menu or let the bugger do a frigin degree which most of our kids end up in debt for.. Instant justice I say.... Rant over breathe "

Jeez talk about living in the dark ages !

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By *uncpl2015Couple
over a year ago

Bridgend Area

unless you have first hand experience, how can you answer this question?

And how many

Its about time this country got a grip and stopped allowing these human rights preachers making sure criminals get an easier and better life than their victims do.

it may have i wouldnt know.. but it shouldnt have... and for them not going back in.. i meant when they were asked they said never ever again.. not because they couldnt but because they hated it..

After all thats what its supposed to be them in prison for breaking the law..

Best thing we could do wpuld be to stick all repeat offenders on an island and leave em to it with no way off.. why should we pay for the lazy little sods.

If people were more affraid of prison alot less crime would take place.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Judging by suicide rates, especially in young offenders, probably not

Come on give me the figures ?

I think you will find that suicide rates amongst young offenders is extremely rare

57 inmates took their own life in English and welsh prisons in 2011. Out of 85.850. A small proportion but still 57 too many. Young offenders are 18 times more likely to commit suicide than adult prisoners

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon

Prison takes away control,freedom,dignity and self worth...you are merely a number. Is it easy in some aspects. in others it's mental torture. The prison system is easy as such it's the other people you are surrounded by that make it tough...you learn to live on your wits...they say 70% of those offenders will offend again....does prison work for some yes for others no...there are many that really don't need to be in prison but need to be in more specialist supported environment....you can easily crack inside that place if it don't kill you it makes you bloody strong that is for sure...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes we got burgled the lad got sent down with loads of previous taken into account the day he came put he was arrested for burgerly again

Think they all should do time in the forces instead bit like national service depending on the crime of course

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

Thankfully HMAF can pick and choose nowadays.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think prisoners should be treat like shit. That way no one wants to go back.

Too much like Butlins these days

if i was drivin and usin my mobile had a crash and killed someone i would deserve to go to prison because someone is dead as a result of me breakin the law!!! there is a consequence to my action!! And yes i would deserve to b treated like shit cos a poor family has lost some1 special to them that they will never get back!! whereas i can go to prison and do a degree (somethin i cant afford to do) and come out to b better off than when i went in!!

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By *G LanaTV/TS
over a year ago

Gosport

I am sure I am setting myself up as a target but sometimes I despair at the UKs attitude to crime and punishment. It seems a large proportion of the population want prisions to be solely about punishment and make no attempt at rehabilitation. Unless you want to lock people up indefinately for relatively minor crimes or accept the hugh costs involved in revolving door criminals, crime investigation/prosecution/incarceration/remand process then eductation in prisions is our best chance of reducing recidivism.

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By *rank_SimoneCouple
over a year ago

Bideford

The simple answer is Yes, just look at the number of reoffenders, this tells you its not a deterrent.

Have said when I reach retirement age I will commit a crime and get put inside. The government will always look after inmates better than pensioners.

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By *ackandkateCouple
over a year ago

Truro

To give a more balanced _iew we'd need to experience being imprisoned.

It's easy giving an opinion based on other peoples _iews, but it really counts for nothing till you do it yourself.

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

mostly you really only hear of the reoffenders, there will be many that learn a hard lesson, put their mistake behind them and move on with their lives.

I would rather invest in all and continue to try and rehabilitate them.

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By *hetalkingstoveMan
over a year ago

London

"The simple answer is Yes, just look at the number of reoffenders, this tells you its not a deterrent.

If you google for the Norweigan prison Bastoy, they have a re-offending rate that's tiny compared to ours (16% vs 70%)

And at this prison they treat the inmates extremely well and help them be ready to live lawfully on release.

So I'd say that worrying that prisons are too cushy is the wrong thing to be concerned about. Do we want prison to be places wholly aimed at punishment, whilst still not working as a deterrent, or do we want prison to reduce the number of criminals in society?

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By *hetalkingstoveMan
over a year ago

London

"I think prisoners should be treat like shit. That way no one wants to go back.

Too much like Butlins these days "

And when they get out, having been treated like shit, they're angry and feel hopeless, they don't have anyone to help them - and guess what, they go right back and commit more crimes.

People often commit crime because they don't think they have any other options. We need to help them find options, not treat them like scum and hope that they're scared into behaving, because it's not likely to work.

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By *riskynriskyCouple
over a year ago

Essex.

Let's stop the messing about. Once a person has served two prison sentences on the third one they get loads of medical tests if they pass they are harvested for their organs and the remains are composted.... If they fail the medicals they are just composted... If they pay £100 we'll put them down before we compost them....

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon

"The simple answer is Yes, just look at the number of reoffenders, this tells you its not a deterrent.

If you google for the Norweigan prison Bastoy, they have a re-offending rate that's tiny compared to ours (16% vs 70%)

And at this prison they treat the inmates extremely well and help them be ready to live lawfully on release.

Prison is about rehabilitation and if that means giving people an education and possibly a foot up in life so they have choices and be able to get employment then I say use it....it's incredibly difficult to get employment with a criminal record so sometimes ex offenders, offenders want to work but can't. Employers have got a lot better and there are big chains that happily employ ex offenders...of course you get the PPO's and that is they are expensive to support often with multi agencies supporting them such as probation police and often supporting people funded projects.....it's worth it when you can change one persons way of thinking...

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

"Let's stop the messing about. Once a person has served two prison sentences on the third one they get loads of medical tests if they pass they are harvested for their organs and the remains are composted.... If they fail the medicals they are just composted... If they pay £100 we'll put them down before we compost them....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Prisons have always had gyms or exercise space its LAW!!, sometimes small tv's can be bought but from prisoners OWN wages..., they still have rights you know!

their punishment is their FREEDOM being taken away, not their human rights!

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

As I see it, part of the problem is that far too many see a prison sentence not so much as a punishment but either as a rite of passage, or as a substitute for certain facets of the welfare state, depending upon whether they're an offender or a politician making decisions about offenders.

The amenities available in prisons mean that incarceration is becoming less and less of a deterrent to those who see it as an occupational hazard (to quote Porridge). Access to well equipped gyms, television, games consoles and the internet mean that, not only do prisoners have the opportunity to carry on with many of the activities they enjoyed on the outside, but they are able to further learn more about the techniques pertaining to the crimes they might commit once they're released - and use the gyms to build themselves up to become more of a physical threat to members of the public. Not for nothing are some prisons known as crime academies.

My _iew is that, whilst access to very basic facilities to maintain an acceptable degree of physical fitness (a healthy diet and regular exercise) should still be a priority, televisions and games consoles in cells, internet access and gyms should be restricted and replaced with books and better access to further education. Physical activities should reflect the fact that inmates are there to repay a debt, either by performing tasks geared to repaying their victims or society in a manner that is appropriate and proportional to the crime they committed.

Having said that, this will never work within a system that _iews as imprisonable crimes many things that either of a entirely non-violent, victimless or ideological nature. There needs to be a reexamination of the threshold beyond which the justice system _iews incarceration as appropriate - so that we can be certain that we imprison only those who need to be.

There also needs to be a reexamination of what can reasonably be judged a crime - especially as our _iew of what constitutes a crime is so changeable over time. For example, Oscar Wilde served two years hard labour for being gay whereas, today, we understand that this was a grossly unjust judgment - an punishment which, today, would constitute a hate crime in itself.

Similarly, we know that growing and smoking marijuana isn't so much a crime against society as a threat to the profits of the very same alcohol and tobacco companies who make such large donations to the political parties who decide our laws - in other words, it's perfectly reasonable to take the _iew that locking someone up for smoking a natural plant that actually does less harm than other such legal drugs is, in itself, as much a crime as locking someone up for making a personal choice about their sexuality - it's just that our legal system is yet to recognize this fact... but I suppose that's a rant for another day.

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By *riskynriskyCouple
over a year ago

Essex.

It does make me wonder how many of the people sticking up for prisoners have been the victims of serious crime. I'm sorry but I think that people who spend 30 - 40 - 50 years in prison having been sent down 10 - 20 times have no rights. They don't care about the victims rights or the fact that some of the victims are mentaly scarred for life.

I truly believe that a civilised society can not cope with uncivilised people... If you cost the tax payer more than x amount in prison fees you should be shot. You are taking money from other people that need it and you will never pay it back in extra taxes...If some of that money was spent looking after people with mental health problems the prison population would drop saving more money.

This country did not need to sign up to the Human Rights Act due to it's laws. However a PM and his wife decided that it would be a good idea... Well it was for her... This has tied our hands in deciding our laws...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The problem with re-offending isnt that prison is easy or hard.

If first offenders got 10 years straight off.

Many would think twice before knicking a car etc.

Waiting till they are habitual criminals is the problem.

1st offense = 10 years

2nd offense = 25 years

3rd offense = 50 years.

No parole or early release.

How many would be habitual then.

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By *ENDAROOSCouple
over a year ago

South West London / Surrey

The punishment is the lost of their freedom, privacy, having no control even over the simplest of things. It chips away your dignity and self worth.

The atmosphere and tension in a prison is hard to explain but it hangs over everything. It often takes one small thing to kick things off. The hard part of prison is keeping mentally strong!

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

[Removed by poster at 21/09/13 11:54:44]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Cons don't have access to the internet! Unless of course its from a phone smuggled in. But not by the prison

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

The punishment is the lost of their freedom, privacy, having no control even over the simplest of things. It chips away your dignity and self worth.

The atmosphere and tension in a prison is hard to explain but it hangs over everything. It often takes one small thing to kick things off. The hard part of prison is keeping mentally strong!

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

"It does make me wonder how many of the people sticking up for prisoners have been the victims of serious crime. I'm sorry but I think that people who spend 30 - 40 - 50 years in prison having been sent down 10 - 20 times have no rights. They don't care about the victims rights or the fact that some of the victims are mentaly scarred for life.

An interesting point of _iew. But would you still feel the same if, in twenty years time, we found ourselves living in a much more authoritarian society in which swinging was an imprisonable crime - how happy would you be about the prospect of you (or your children, if they decide to swing) being shot because your incarceration was judge uneconomic?

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By *riskynriskyCouple
over a year ago

Essex.

If the law said I couldn't swing I wouldn't swing. I wouldn't agree with the laws but would obey them...

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"I am sure I am setting myself up as a target but sometimes I despair at the UKs attitude to crime and punishment. It seems a large proportion of the population want prisions to be solely about punishment and make no attempt at rehabilitation. Unless you want to lock people up indefinately for relatively minor crimes or accept the hugh costs involved in revolving door criminals, crime investigation/prosecution/incarceration/remand process then eductation in prisions is our best chance of reducing recidivism."

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

"If the law said I couldn't swing I wouldn't swing. I wouldn't agree with the laws but would obey them..."

That would be confusing law with justice - and that's one sure way to bring about exactly the kind of authoritarian regime I was hypothesizing about. After all, the freedoms you (and the rest of us) enjoy today was hard fought for by people who, at the time, were willing to take a stand to create a fairer world - even if it meant going to jail.

For example, if the law said you had to hand over any Jewish neighbours to be sent to be gassed in a concentration camp, would you do that too?... or would you take a stand?

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

... a purely hypothetical question, by the way - before anyone accuses me of invoking Godwin's law.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Have you been to prison?

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

Not going to tell you my job on here

But anyone would like a conversation about this and my experience I'd be happy to chat privately about it !

Too many people talking sh1t about something they have no experience of

And frankly some if the comments are absolutely bewildering

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hate to go to jail. Would cry me eyes out, i would.

I dont think it would be to easy. Not for anyways.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Not going to tell you my job on here

But anyone would like a conversation about this and my experience I'd be happy to chat privately about it !

Too many people talking sh1t about something they have no experience of

And frankly some if the comments are absolutely bewildering "

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By *riskynriskyCouple
over a year ago

Essex.

Well I do think we are getting to extremes. Difficult question, would I sacrifice someone else to save my family? Hell yes...

Would I like to think we have learnt from history? Hell yes...

Being truthful I would make sure I was the policeman if it was a police state...

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

"Have you been to prison? "

Replied via PM

"Not going to tell you my job on here

But anyone would like a conversation about this and my experience I'd be happy to chat privately about it !

Too many people talking sh1t about something they have no experience of

And frankly some if the comments are absolutely bewildering "

Ditto.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Personally, I think sentences should be split into two parts. The first being punishment for the crime committed and then a move to another prison designed for rehabilitation and re-education.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Personally, I think sentences should be split into two parts. The first being punishment for the crime committed and then a move to another prison designed for rehabilitation and re-education."

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

"Well I do think we are getting to extremes. Difficult question, would I sacrifice someone else to save my family? Hell yes...

Would I like to think we have learnt from history? Hell yes...

Being truthful I would make sure I was the policeman if it was a police state..."

Difficult questions, sure, but not entirely irrelevant in my opinion.

For my part, would I also sacrifice someone else to save my family?... yes, though I would say I'd also be willing to sacrifice myself to save another's family.

On the other hand, I would NEVER allow myself to be a policeman in a police state... not ever.. because to do so would be to consolidate that police state's control over my children and grandchildren - and I'd rather die than take any part in forcing that upon them.

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

In relation to young offenders

Discuss this

Children who are looked after ( those in care) - less than 1 % of the population

Children in custody - around 25% are or have been looked after !

Shall we just add to their misery by locking them up forever with bread and water and no access to any sort of care or attention or a chance to learn ?

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By *G LanaTV/TS
over a year ago

Gosport

Its simple we don't have a civilised society, we have one inherently built on greed and there is nothing civilised about that.

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By *ngieandMrManCouple
over a year ago

hereford

Some hundreds of years ago society and the judicial system believed it was absolutely right to kill people having been found guilty of Witchcraft.

Not so many years ago most of society and the judicial system thought it was absolutely right to imprison men found guilty of practicing homosexual practices.

I wonder how our current laws and judicial system will look in say 100 years time?

I dare say not much different because history proves over and over that punishment doesn't work, it never has and it never will.

Perhaps more time and effort should be spent on addressing the causes of behaviours that are not in keeping with what the rest of society demands.

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

"Personally, I think sentences should be split into two parts. The first being punishment for the crime committed and then a move to another prison designed for rehabilitation and re-education."

I really like that idea

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"Personally, I think sentences should be split into two parts. The first being punishment for the crime committed and then a move to another prison designed for rehabilitation and re-education.

I really like that idea

It already happens

They are called DTO 's

Detention and training orders

Half the sentence in jail and half to be done in the community with support from yots to access education and training and employment

However with 1 million young people unemployed what chance have young people who have been sentenced got?

Answers on a postage stamp please

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So many opinions of how prisoners are treated, now unless you have been in prison how can you comment, ah the stories you read in the gutter press.

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

"So many opinions of how prisoners are treated, now unless you have been in prison how can you comment, ah the stories you read in the gutter press. "

So many opinions of how ignorant people are. Now unless you know for certain whether or not any given person commenting has been in prison how can you say they don't know what they're talking about?.. ah, the denial of cognitive dissonance.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So many opinions of how prisoners are treated, now unless you have been in prison how can you comment, ah the stories you read in the gutter press.

Ask the Q then see who admits it

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

You can comment if you've worked in the prison service or volunteered at one of the charities for ex offenders and their families.

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By *opinovMan
over a year ago

Point Nemo, Cumbria

"You can comment if you've worked in the prison service or volunteered at one of the charities for ex offenders and their families."

Indeed ... and if you've worked with YOs or the CPS or one of the Prison Commissions or actually been incarcerated, surely.

... or maybe even if you've got a brain and been able to educate yourself sufficient to engage in some kind of reasonable thought process on the subject.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

"You can comment if you've worked in the prison service or volunteered at one of the charities for ex offenders and their families.

Indeed ... and if you've worked with YOs or the CPS or one of the Prison Commissions or actually been incarcerated, surely.

... or maybe even if you've got a brain and been able to educate yourself sufficient to engage in some kind of reasonable thought process on the subject.

Indeed,

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 21/09/13 19:00:11]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Don't think its easy for them no freedom Tele off at 9 in some places some deserve it but prob no easy

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

don't believe all you read in the sun

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It floors me how many people have such dated opinions. I'm sure if left to these folk women would still be locked up for getting pregnant out of wedlock and pagans would be executed. :P

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By *ucy and CarlCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

"All it takes away from someone now is they are confined to one place in a controlled environment.

Many lose their home, their wife, contact with their kids, their health, their anal virginity, their job, their friends and more."
Bless their little cotton socks. Easy answer to that is don't commit crime. Who gives a shit about their homes which the vast majority are given to them anyway. Most don't have jobs, crime is their job. Most of their friends are with them inside anyway. They get better health care than law abiding citizens. Who I really care about are their victims and the misery they cause them. So yep take away the luxuries and make the low life scum bags pay. Before any people reply to this I am well in the know. I have to deal with these shits daily. Carl

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"All it takes away from someone now is they are confined to one place in a controlled environment.

Many lose their home, their wife, contact with their kids, their health, their anal virginity, their job, their friends and more. Bless their little cotton socks. Easy answer to that is don't commit crime. Who gives a shit about their homes which the vast majority are given to them anyway. Most don't have jobs, crime is their job. Most of their friends are with them inside anyway. They get better health care than law abiding citizens. Who I really care about are their victims and the misery they cause them. So yep take away the luxuries and make the low life scum bags pay. Before any people reply to this I am well in the know. I have to deal with these shits daily. Carl"

Wow ! When you say deal . I'm hoping that this is not in a professional way !

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By *ucy and CarlCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

Why do you hope that?

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

Prison is about loss of liberty to be in society at large.

Anything other than that, it should be about treating people with respect and rehabilitating them, so that on their release the rest of society is not at greater risk.

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"Why do you hope that? "

"make the low life scum bags pay."

Kinda says quite a lot

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By *ucy and CarlCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

Says it as it is to be honest.

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"Says it as it is to be honest. "

So all people in jail are "low life scumbags"

Wow !

The amount of thoughtless posts that this thread has seen

Dismays me it really does !

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By *reelove1969Couple
over a year ago

bristol

no personal experience of prison life however did have a friend go down and on remand he was locked up for 23 hours a day ..never seen a gym or anything like that so I guess it varies from place to place ..seemed quite harsh to me as he hadn't actually been found guilty of anything

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By *arrior300676Man
over a year ago

cardiff

I've just finished doin 5 years prison is no picnic it's not a nice place

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

"I've just finished doin 5 years prison is no picnic it's not a nice place"

I hope your life takes a good road in the future, you have done your time in my book.

all the best

and I wish the best for any person impacted by anything you have done.

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By *riskynriskyCouple
over a year ago

Essex.

I was talking to a police officer about this the other day. He stated that a youngster well known to the police was stopped driving without a licence. He complained that the police stopping him was going to make him late for his driving lessons that his parole officer had arranged and that us the tax payer are funding... Apparently having a d/l will improve his chances of getting a job. More likely it will allow him to drive to his next victim without the fear of being stopped. An other day similar thing but the lad starts swearing at the police because it will stop him going rock climbing... I'm sure this will help make him a model citizen...

I notice none of the bleeding hearts on hear have come forward admitting being the victim of a serious crime... Let see you stick up for prisoners rights once your sister has been raped or your mother has had her fingers broken or cut off to get her rings or your son stabbed for his phone... I know prison isn't perfect but lets stop with the pretence that they are the victim of our cruel society. Punish them. Then educate them and if that doesn't work bury them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is it too easy nowadays ?? It was too easy in 1982 when I did as stint in Durham. If you kept your head down, kept your mouth shut - nobody bothered you. I found it a massive shock to the system because I had a good home life, nice standard of living, never been in bother before but I got involved in something that I shouldn't have and I got 18months. I ended up doing 9 in total including remand time.

Now on the other side of the coin, if you are a down and out, one of life's no hopers with nothing going on in your life, possibly even no home - prison is a blessing, it gives you 3 decent meals a day (and despite what people say - the food is ok), a warm bed, clothes which get washed regularly and a roof over your head. So it really depends upon your place in life before you hit prison whether it is too easy or not.

As they say "everything is relative"

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"I was talking to a police officer about this the other day. He stated that a youngster well known to the police was stopped driving without a licence. He complained that the police stopping him was going to make him late for his driving lessons that his parole officer had arranged and that us the tax payer are funding... Apparently having a d/l will improve his chances of getting a job. More likely it will allow him to drive to his next victim without the fear of being stopped. An other day similar thing but the lad starts swearing at the police because it will stop him going rock climbing... I'm sure this will help make him a model citizen...

I'm lost for words

Dear dear

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My gran got mugged last year the guy who did it had been to prison 5 times apparently and didn't see it as a threat as he had friends there and they had a laugh inside. It must be too easy if it didn't make him not want to go back again.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I always say this, but tent city in the US would stop anyone reoffending"

Why should it? Doesn't work there.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"All it takes away from someone now is they are confined to one place in a controlled environment.

In what capacity are you "well in the know"?

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By *ebsCoupleCouple
over a year ago

Orpington/london

Before i met p, i met an ex offender on another site (which i stopped using after meeting him)

He was completely honest about his history but only after we went back to his for coffee... No i didn't stay for more than coffee after i found out what he was convicted of!

Anyway he was in for a long stretch and he admitted life is too easy inside to the point he wanted to go back in because and i quote "my life is crap on the outside, inside i had everything a man needs apart from beer and birds"

He's meals were cooked, his washing and ironing were done for him etc.

All he needed to do was keep his room and himself clean.

He had access to a fully kitted out gym,if he wanted to he take courses ,arts and crafts classes etc.

The only things he missed were beer and women.

If you're sent to prison it should be hard. If a prisoner wants food they need to work for it (like us)

No access to luxuries like xboxs, the latest games or even sweets.

We should be more like the states, hard labour chain gangs working outside in all weathers.

Prisons should = punishment not an easy ride.

Didn't i hear somewhere they could sue if their cell is too cold or too hot? I think the same report mention one inmate developed a bad back coz his bed was too hard compared to his one at home??

Ria

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Its not if its easy or not its if it reforms them isn't it? I would say it doesn't seem like a huge deterrent thought to many.

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

Are the lock em up and throw away the key brigade prepared to contribute the additional taxes that'll be needed to build and run all the extra jails that'll be needed for this?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

the reason prisoners are give more is a ploy {a very old ploy] "conquere and divide"

Give you more to control you n fear of losing wots been given,

t.v's,gym,computers,quite con's less staff needed.conmarderie in prison has been broke by fear of losing priveledges

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By *winkletoes80Woman
over a year ago

redditch

"has any one thought about those that end up in prison when still innocent. fact is courts make mistakes as does every one else. for those ppl losing everything I am sure its not to soft or easy at all xxxxxxxx"

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

"the reason prisoners are give more is a ploy {a very old ploy] "conquere and divide"

Give you more to control you n fear of losing wots been given,

t.v's,gym,computers,quite con's less staff needed.conmarderie in prison has been broke by fear of losing priveledges

The reason there's any civilised conditions in any jails is because those who run jails know they only work with the consent of the inmates.

At any given time there's far more prisoners than staff and, if they chose, they could bring the establishment to a halt.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""chance to earn money, free education, 3 good meals a day (was on news they get better food than hospitals), gym, social time, some even get to have pets, visits from family/friends"

Usually people in hospitals are there for a few days, so their diet isn't that important.

A prisoner is usually there for months or years, so diet is important.

Education is vital in teaching skills, it may be the first time someone has the chance to learn, and be able to survive in the outside world.

It may be the first time someone has earnt a wage, and it teaches about priorities and how to manage.

Exercise is vital, especially if your confined.

Friends and family shouldn't be punished for someones mistakes or bad judgement."

Still doesnt give them the right to have better food, why should some who raped a child have better food than a child in hospital?

Why should a murder,rapist,etc get FREE education to better themselves, when someone who has studied so hard, never done anything in their life, have to pay and be in debt £50grand+

Why should they get to earn money, when there are tons of people on benefits already needing work.

So basically when these people get released, they have a better chance at life than those who are struggling to pay off their debt from education etc.

Of course friends/family shouldnt but they shouldnt be allowed any Alone time, i personally think it should be part of the punishment, commit a crime, very limited family time. If they killed someone, that family never get to see that person again so why should that murder get to see his.

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

Despite the fact not all citizens are civilised, the UK is still predominantly a civilised society.

If people would prefer a society where prisoners are treated badly, there's no shortage of dictatorships around the world who'll accept your immigration request.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

Personally I wouldn't like to say having never been to prison. I think only those who have experience as prisoners could say with any authority. All the rest is supposition supported by the crap printed in the media. Words are cheap. The reality is most likely something else and probably not easily put into writing though I am sure there are plenty of 'experts' here who will attempt to argue that they know the 'truth'.

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By *riskynriskyCouple
over a year ago

Essex.

"Despite the fact not all citizens are civilised, the UK is still predominantly a civilised society.

If people would prefer a society where prisoners are treated badly, there's no shortage of dictatorships around the world who'll accept your immigration request."

I don't need to emigrate as I am quite happy to live by the laws of this land. It's the uncivilised people that need to be sent to somewhere harsh...

I also understand that the courts don't always get it right and that some people make a mistake once and never go back. It's the ones that go away time after time that need to be punished very harshly...

I also think if you move to this country and break the laws, you serve your time and get kicked out... No ifs ands or buts...

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By *ucy and CarlCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

"All it takes away from someone now is they are confined to one place in a controlled environment.

In what capacity are you "well in the know"?

"
a capacity to know what these people are like. Let's just leave it there.

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"All it takes away from someone now is they are confined to one place in a controlled environment.

In what capacity are you "well in the know"?

a capacity to know what these people are like. Let's just leave it there. "

One size fits all

Tar with the same brush

Your _iews are quite disturbing for someone who claims to work with offenders

Is it any wonder people re offend if those who are employed to help them have an attitude like yours

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By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

"Are the lock em up and throw away the key brigade prepared to contribute the additional taxes that'll be needed to build and run all the extra jails that'll be needed for this?"
Oh God yes. Happy to pay more in tax to keep scum off the streets and therefore keep decent people safe.

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By *ucy and CarlCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

"All it takes away from someone now is they are confined to one place in a controlled environment.

In what capacity are you "well in the know"?

a capacity to know what these people are like. Let's just leave it there.

One size fits all

Tar with the same brush

Your _iews are quite disturbing for someone who claims to work with offenders

Is it any wonder people re offend if those who are employed to help them have an attitude like yours"

Trust me I'm not employed to help them. I'm employed to help put them where they belong. Your attitude would probably change if you became a repeat victim of theirs. One size fits all? Tar with the same brush? Well they are all in prison. This is what this thread is about. Making their prison life a walk in the park certainly is not helping them.

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By *ucy and CarlCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

"Personally, I think sentences should be split into two parts. The first being punishment for the crime committed and then a move to another prison designed for rehabilitation and re-education.

Liking this

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

"Personally, I think sentences should be split into two parts. The first being punishment for the crime committed and then a move to another prison designed for rehabilitation and re-education.

Liking this"

Isn't this how it does, or should, work at the moment.

Closed prisons with harsh regimes followed by time in Open regime? Education all the way through but external opportunities in the Open system.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

my work occasionally takes me into prisons , and even as a contractor going for the day it scares the hell out of me as we have to hand over all possesions and keys phone ect , I feel very uncomfortable and cant wait to leave ,

however prison is supposed to be a punishment and deterant and nowadays I think they have far to many priveleges

if you don't want the harse conditions you shouldn't cross the the line simples , so its yes to easy for me

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Having beeen inside i can categorically tell you it is far from easy.

Yes tv in cells and this has to be earned by working in various roles within the system.

The regime you soon learn to understand but fact you get only minimum time outside the cell makes life hard or it did for me.

Worst part is fact i was unable to speak to and see my family so for all the folk that say it is easy you are wrong and not to read all you see in the press.

Reality is different.

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By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

I can't understand people who show more concern for prisoners than their victims.Maybe they should talk to the victims of rape and those who have had loved ones murdered. Surely they are in a better position to judge who should or shouldn't have cushy lives in the holiday camps we call prisons.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Having beeen inside i can categorically tell you it is far from easy.

Yes tv in cells and this has to be earned by working in various roles within the system.

The regime you soon learn to understand but fact you get only minimum time outside the cell makes life hard or it did for me.

Worst part is fact i was unable to speak to and see my family so for all the folk that say it is easy you are wrong and not to read all you see in the press.

Reality is different."

so what your saying is you don't want to go back inside , I hope you don't

but what about the repeat offenders who quite clearly don't give a damn about others in society, who commit the same crimes again the moment they are released

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By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

"Having beeen inside i can categorically tell you it is far from easy.

Yes tv in cells and this has to be earned by working in various roles within the system.

The regime you soon learn to understand but fact you get only minimum time outside the cell makes life hard or it did for me.

Worst part is fact i was unable to speak to and see my family so for all the folk that say it is easy you are wrong and not to read all you see in the press.

Reality is different.

so what your saying is you don't want to go back inside , I hope you don't

but what about the repeat offenders who quite clearly don't give a damn about others in society, who commit the same crimes again the moment they are released"
Like the murderers who are released to murder again. What a bloody disgrace.

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

Can't speak for adult prisons

And my opinion of adult prisoners is different to those of young offenders

A challenge anyone to spend some time in yoi 's

Speak to the lads , find out their history and their lives outside jail at present

Get to know them

Before you judge them

See what goes on inside to help them

See the success stories

And stop beleiving the sun newspaper bullshit headlines

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

See the success stories

And stop beleiving the sun newspaper bullshit headlines

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

"...........

but what about the repeat offenders who quite clearly don't give a damn about others in society, who commit the same crimes again the moment they are released"

If we treat them like shit while they're inside, it's hardly surprising if they behave badly on release.

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By *ucy and CarlCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs

The do gooders should do some time with the victims and listen to their misery. When you have done that progress to the repeat victims. 20 odd years ago a friend of mine was killed by one of these scum. Not just my friend but two others as well. Since that time the scum bag has been in and out of prison. Was even in custody the other day. The family of the deceased go through living hell everyday. Wonder what your opinions would be if these people burgled your house, beat your granny for a bit of drug money. I admit some learn from their mistake and I believe one has posted on this thread so i applaud them. The other repeat offenders send them where they belong.

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

I suppose it all comes down to what you believe the penal system is for.

If it's for revenge - by all means do whatever you can to make their lives as miserable as their victims or their victims' relatives.

Halve the rations - let them fight for the food. Charge right-wingers to watch the fights and make a few bob that way.

Do they need water? They can drink their own piss.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"...........

but what about the repeat offenders who quite clearly don't give a damn about others in society, who commit the same crimes again the moment they are released

If we treat them like shit while they're inside, it's hardly surprising if they behave badly on release."

life has treated me badly over the years money wise and health problems ect,

so you would be ok if I came and burgled your house sometime and while im there make me a coffee and and give me sympathy ,I don't think so

we all have bad times its no excuse to commit crime and cause misery to others in the process

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

"...........

but what about the repeat offenders who quite clearly don't give a damn about others in society, who commit the same crimes again the moment they are released

If we treat them like shit while they're inside, it's hardly surprising if they behave badly on release.

life has treated me badly over the years money wise and health problems ect,

so you would be ok if I came and burgled your house sometime and while im there make me a coffee and and give me sympathy ,I don't think so

we all have bad times its no excuse to commit crime and cause misery to others in the process "

That suggests you have read all, perhaps even any, of the previous posts.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It pisses me off when people who label me as a "do gooder" when I suggest that there is a better way. You may want to hang draw and quarter people but that doesn't stop crime and never has, prison is always going to fail because politically if you try to properly rehabilitate prisoners by training them rather than punishing them into being productive members of society then people go on about prison being too soft and do gooders. Punishing

People harshly has never worked as a deterrent, even when they used

To cut the hands off thrives in the Middle East people still stole. Salt mines didn't work chain gangs didn't work and executions don't work. Let's try something more Radical shall we.

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By *isscheekychopsWoman
over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon

well i think i turned out ok....

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

lots of people will always be more interested in retribution and revenge rather than rehabilitation.

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow

Criminals keep committing crimes because it never enters their heads they'll get caught.

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By *oxerjoshleeMan
over a year ago

Sheffield

"I think prisoners should be treat like shit. That way no one wants to go back.

Too much like Butlins these days "

I've been to Prison and Butlins and to be fair I preferred prison - better class of people.

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

Think I'd rather be _iewed as a do-gooder than the opposite. Nothing wrong with doing good or thinking good.

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By *oxerjoshleeMan
over a year ago

Sheffield

"It pisses me off when people who label me as a "do gooder" when I suggest that there is a better way. You may want to hang draw and quarter people but that doesn't stop crime and never has, prison is always going to fail because politically if you try to properly rehabilitate prisoners by training them rather than punishing them into being productive members of society then people go on about prison being too soft and do gooders. Punishing

People harshly has never worked as a deterrent, even when they used

To cut the hands off thrives in the Middle East people still stole. Salt mines didn't work chain gangs didn't work and executions don't work. Let's try something more Radical shall we."

x 1000000000000000000

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Criminals keep committing crimes because it never enters their heads they'll get caught."

Same with lying,cheating etc people don't think they'll get caught therefore the punishment route doesn't work.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

People harshly has never worked as a deterrent, even when they used

To cut the hands off thrives in the Middle East people still stole. Salt mines didn't work chain gangs didn't work and executions don't work. Let's try something more Radical shall we."

Such as?

I think prisoners should be treated with basic courtesy and politeness. They should be kept safe. They should have opportunities to educate themselves.

But they shouldn't be kept in comfort or extended luxuries, particularly at tax payers expense.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What do you mean by extended luxuries or comfort? Because having worked in a couple of secure facilities the "luxury" doesn't exist

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I mean cigarettes, televisions, wearing designer trainers, chocolates, posters on the wall...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I mean cigarettes, televisions, wearing designer trainers, chocolates, posters on the wall..."

To be honest I don't think anyone should be allowed to smoke, however, all the rest are normally done as priveledges for good behaviour, it's called positive reinforcement. They're both given and taken away from prisoners depending on what type of prison and what type of behaviour

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By *oxerjoshleeMan
over a year ago

Sheffield

"I mean cigarettes, televisions, wearing designer trainers, chocolates, posters on the wall..."

They ban posters on the wall ever since Shaw Shank Redemption

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I mean cigarettes, televisions, wearing designer trainers, chocolates, posters on the wall...

They're unnecessary luxuries. The reward for good behaviour is staying out of prison. Once you're in you should be given plenty of time and opportunity to reflect and educate yourself. The rest can be earned on release.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I mean cigarettes, televisions, wearing designer trainers, chocolates, posters on the wall...

Can you identify anyone where no short term incentives work? As much as you may despise them they are human and what your saying may feel great as it teaches them a lesson but will only breed more resentment and won't improve behaviours in anyone. It's like telling a child they're at school to learn so they'll get the reward of a good job when they graduate and until then we aren't going to praise you at all.

They've done wrong that's fine that's why they've had their liberty removed now if I want them to stay away I need to improve their lives so their outside world is Better than the inside one.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You can provide all the schemes of support you want for those that have offended but not sent to prison.

For those sent to prison I can see no good argument for wasting money on them other than allowing them to read and gain a better education.

I don't understand what you're asking about short term incentives but it bothers me not the least bit if prisoners resent being in prison.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You can provide all the schemes of support you want for those that have offended but not sent to prison.

For those sent to prison I can see no good argument for wasting money on them other than allowing them to read and gain a better education.

I don't understand what you're asking about short term incentives but it bothers me not the least bit if prisoners resent being in prison."

In any human being if the goal or reward is too far away without anything before then we don't try as hard. So having small rewards along the way keeps us focused. Now if you're expecting prisoners to not be the same as the rest of the human race then you'll have huge problems. If you want someone to behave in a certain way their always has to be an incentive to change which is visual,obtainable and fairly soon, otherwise it's not likely that you'll drive people in the direction we need.

The problem is that resentment is not what will drive people in a positive direction. However if you don't care and just want to keep locking people up then we will always get what we've always had. You're dealing with human beings and they need to be treated as such or don't be surprised if they just keep coming back.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You can provide all the schemes of support you want for those that have offended but not sent to prison.

For those sent to prison I can see no good argument for wasting money on them other than allowing them to read and gain a better education.

I don't understand what you're asking about short term incentives but it bothers me not the least bit if prisoners resent being in prison.

I guess the declining prison population stands testament to that theory.

Oh...

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"I mean cigarettes, televisions, wearing designer trainers, chocolates, posters on the wall...

They've done wrong that's fine that's why they've had their liberty removed now if I want them to stay away I need to improve their lives so their outside world is Better than the inside one. "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You can provide all the schemes of support you want for those that have offended but not sent to prison.

For those sent to prison I can see no good argument for wasting money on them other than allowing them to read and gain a better education.

I don't understand what you're asking about short term incentives but it bothers me not the least bit if prisoners resent being in prison.

I guess the declining prison population stands testament to that theory.

Oh..."

Which theory? We provide fuck all for prisoners to motivate them properly as the daily mail readership want them properly punished. Punishment based prisons haven't worked ever and we have never tried the alternatives

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Where did I advocate punishments?

I suggested courtesy, safety and education.

Currently they live in considerably more luxury than many in the world.

Perhaps if they were to experience living on a basic healthy diet, in a basic room, with regulated hours of work and with opportunities for the rest of the time to take advantage of educational opportunities and reading that might be easier to adjust to when released.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Where did I advocate punishments?

I suggested courtesy, safety and education.

Currently they live in considerably more luxury than many in the world.

I think we both agree on that bit, I think where we differ perhaps on methodology. As for punishment, I certainly didn't feel you were specifically talking about beatings or some such.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You can provide all the schemes of support you want for those that have offended but not sent to prison.

For those sent to prison I can see no good argument for wasting money on them other than allowing them to read and gain a better education.

I don't understand what you're asking about short term incentives but it bothers me not the least bit if prisoners resent being in prison.

I guess the declining prison population stands testament to that theory.

Oh...

You don't like being labeled a "do gooder"

Yet you label Dailey Mail

Readers

Can't you do better than the Dailey mail bull shit to put across your _iew point it's been done to death and boring !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You can provide all the schemes of support you want for those that have offended but not sent to prison.

For those sent to prison I can see no good argument for wasting money on them other than allowing them to read and gain a better education.

I don't understand what you're asking about short term incentives but it bothers me not the least bit if prisoners resent being in prison.

I guess the declining prison population stands testament to that theory.

Oh...

You don't like being labeled a "do gooder"

Yet you label Dailey Mail

Readers

Can't you do better than the Dailey mail bull shit to put across your _iew point it's been done to death and boring !"

That's all you got from that conversation. Can I do better? Probably but then perhaps a contribution would help the quite interesting discussion so far rather than a personal attack

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Where did I advocate punishments?

I suggested courtesy, safety and education.

Currently they live in considerably more luxury than many in the world.

I think we both agree on that bit, I think where we differ perhaps on methodology. As for punishment, I certainly didn't feel you were specifically talking about beatings or some such. "

In terms of methodology my attitude is the opportunity to receive an education is a far better reward than fags or chocolate.

Millions of children and their families believe this around the world. But in this country we have somehow reached a point where education is considered a chore that requires incentives.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Where did I advocate punishments?

I suggested courtesy, safety and education.

Currently they live in considerably more luxury than many in the world.

I think we both agree on that bit, I think where we differ perhaps on methodology. As for punishment, I certainly didn't feel you were specifically talking about beatings or some such.

In terms of methodology my attitude is the opportunity to receive an education is a far better reward than fags or chocolate.

Millions of children and their families believe this around the world. But in this country we have somehow reached a point where education is considered a chore that requires incentives."

I think that as a process Edication is a chore for lots of people- creating a better way of educating would be a step forward but I suspect that it would require such a monumentally seismic shift that we might get stuck with posters and chocolate

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

For sure. Although culture and attitude are equally to blame as educational processes. Both need tackling and I don't believe pandering tackles anything. Least of all those who end up in prison.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes they are having it way to easy. Being back the old days I say.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"For sure. Although culture and attitude are equally to blame as educational processes. Both need tackling and I don't believe pandering tackles anything. Least of all those who end up in prison."

There's a difference though between pandering and motivating someone.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"For sure. Although culture and attitude are equally to blame as educational processes. Both need tackling and I don't believe pandering tackles anything. Least of all those who end up in prison.

There's a difference though between pandering and motivating someone. "

As I said before, education should be the motivation.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Prison now a days is way to Easy it is a sign of The times when The older generation Prefer and find it cheaper to go to prison in The winter rather struggle to heat their homes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"For sure. Although culture and attitude are equally to blame as educational processes. Both need tackling and I don't believe pandering tackles anything. Least of all those who end up in prison.

There's a difference though between pandering and motivating someone.

As I said before, education should be the motivation."

It is for some certainly but we have to acknowledge that for some we need to encourage in other ways as well.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Teach more practical subjects and bring back national service simple

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If you have to ask the answers always yes !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"All it takes away from someone now is they are confined to one place in a controlled environment.

Ooo...so your one of the lovelies that "MY TAX" goes to pay your wages... to make sure my son doesn't get raped every day??

ooft...well at least he's in safe hands eh..?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"For sure. Although culture and attitude are equally to blame as educational processes. Both need tackling and I don't believe pandering tackles anything. Least of all those who end up in prison.

There's a difference though between pandering and motivating someone.

As I said before, education should be the motivation.

It is for some certainly but we have to acknowledge that for some we need to encourage in other ways as well."

Those 'others' will always be a problem. Nothing will change them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Teach more practical subjects and bring back national service simple "

Did national service did you?....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Teach more practical subjects and bring back national service simple

Did national service did you?...."

no But there was very little disapline in school I think listening to The old boys that done national service How it Gave The young lads structure that would set them on The Right road in life

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Teach more practical subjects and bring back national service simple

Did national service did you?....

no But there was very little disapline in school I think listening to The old boys that done national service How it Gave The young lads structure that would set them on The Right road in life"

That's right because we've only had crime since the end of national service

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

"Teach more practical subjects and bring back national service simple

Did national service did you?....

no But there was very little disapline in school I think listening to The old boys that done national service How it Gave The young lads structure that would set them on The Right road in life

That's right because we've only had crime since the end of national service "

Lol!

The Kray twins did national service and look what fine upstanding citizens they were

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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

Some very medieval thinking on here. Have to keep reminding myself what century we are in.

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By *lentyoffun40Couple
over a year ago

Lancashire

"Some very medieval thinking on here. Have to keep reminding myself what century we are in."

Well said

It beggars belief

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Some very medieval thinking on here. Have to keep reminding myself what century we are in.

Well said

It beggars belief "

Some very medieval thinking but also some mainstream thinking as well which often has the same desired outcomes but different concepts (not always mutually compatible) of how to get there. I'm learning to ignore the "the past was brilliant and today's generation" bollocks as there's people of every generation who think the past was perfect.

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