FabSwingers.com forum: Commander Martin McGuinness

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

...... to give 'Peace Lecture' in Warrington.

WTF?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Next week Gary Glitters doing a talk about keeping children safe on the Internet.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"...... to give 'Peace Lecture' in Warrington.

WTF?"

I know where you're coming from, but sometimes those who've looked at life from both sides can offer something ? It was in consultation with the parent of one of the victims too. Remarkable if its sincere

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Now here's a topic i won't touch. N. Ireland politics

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

I'm just curious. If it was any of your former prime ministers, or anyone who had ever served in your armed forces, would there be the same reaction?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"I'm just curious. If it was any of your former prime ministers, or anyone who had ever served in your armed forces, would there be the same reaction? "

What reaction?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"I'm just curious. If it was any of your former prime ministers, or anyone who had ever served in your armed forces, would there be the same reaction?

What reaction?"

Your reaction.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

MY reaction would probably get me banned and put even higher on the IRA hitlist.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"MY reaction would probably get me banned and put even higher on the IRA hitlist."

It must be lonely back there in the past.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"MY reaction would probably get me banned and put even higher on the IRA hitlist.

It must be lonely back there in the past. "

I think there's quite a lot of us who haven't forgotten.

I'm reminded every time I order pizza.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

thank our lord that some people move on cause if they didn't this world would be a sorry place to live in

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

I'm sure Tim Parry and Jonathan Ball would love to move on with their lives.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

I'm sure Tim Parry and Jonathan Ball would love to move on with their lives.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"I'm sure Tim Parry and Jonathan Ball would love to move on with their lives."

Do you want to compare lists of innocent victims? You do realise that it was Colin Parry who organised this, don't you? It's not so long ago that British governments were telling Irish republicans to get involved in politics and stop living in the past. It appears that you, however, would prefer to go back to the past. Living in the past isn't going to get us anywhere, but learning from the past will, and they're not the same thing.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm sure Tim Parry and Jonathan Ball would love to move on with their lives.

well said

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"I'm sure Tim Parry and Jonathan Ball would love to move on with their lives.

You do realise that it was Colin Parry who organised this, don't you? ....... "

Yes, and I know why.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"MY reaction would probably get me banned and put even higher on the IRA hitlist.

It must be lonely back there in the past.

I think there's quite a lot of us who haven't forgotten.

I'm reminded every time I order pizza."
Seriously? Pick your knuckles off the floor.. Your on the ras hitlist? LOL

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

well said"

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *aucy3Couple
over a year ago

glasgow

"I'm sure Tim Parry and Jonathan Ball would love to move on with their lives.

You do realise that it was Colin Parry who organised this, don't you? .......

Yes, and I know why.

Reveal all,before they get you.lol

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If we always did what we've always done, we'll always get what we've always got.

Having him speak doesn't mean we have to like him, but speaking is so much safer than where we were before the peace accord.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm sure Tim Parry and Jonathan Ball would love to move on with their lives.

You do realise that it was Colin Parry who organised this, don't you? .......

Yes, and I know why.

Go on then

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"MY reaction would probably get me banned and put even higher on the IRA hitlist."

Was this from your days in "the regiment"?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"I'm sure Tim Parry and Jonathan Ball would love to move on with their lives.

You do realise that it was Colin Parry who organised this, don't you? .......

Yes, and I know why.

Go on then"

You wouldn't expect me to steal his thunder, especially on his Big Day, would you?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"MY reaction would probably get me banned and put even higher on the IRA hitlist.

Was this from your days in "the regiment"?"

For the avoidance of doubt, I have never served in any branch of the British Army.

Not having been a sodjer doesn't always make you less of a target.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *iker ladMan
over a year ago

Hinckley

They were not an army, he was not a commander, he was & therefore still is a cowardly murdering scumbag who should only be invited to a spot 6 feet under!

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"They were not an army, he was not a commander, he was & therefore still is a cowardly murdering scumbag who should only be invited to a spot 6 feet under! "

This may well be true, but we've got to stop somewhere, otherwise we will keep killing and keep killing and never stop.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"They were not an army, he was not a commander, he was & therefore still is a cowardly murdering scumbag who should only be invited to a spot 6 feet under! "

I can see that you've studied Irish history quite closely, so I won't dare get into a debate with you about who created the whole mess in the first place.

"Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise"

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

its opinions like those expressed on this thread that make N Ireland a place that i both want to visit, and hope to steer well clear of.

the past is the past.

if we move forward with the same hatred and bigotry that we have always had then we will be in a shit awful state forever more.

lets not forget, the British forces were hardly whiter than white during the troubles, and we did invade the bleedin country in the first place, its just the irish were closer to fight back where we are than the africans/indians/americans when we invaded their countries

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I served in northern Ireland. Did I understand the politics & history and the true feelings of all involved ? No. I just tried to look after my mate's and my own skin.

In reflection I welcome anything that brings peace, even if it puts noses out of joint. Mine included.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"...... to give 'Peace Lecture' in Warrington.

WTF?"

Would you have the same WTF reaction if it was Nelson Mandela? The history / life stories are not so different

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"They were not an army, he was not a commander, he was & therefore still is a cowardly murdering scumbag who should only be invited to a spot 6 feet under!

This may well be true, but we've got to stop somewhere, otherwise we will keep killing and keep killing and never stop."

So, who's been killing who since the so called cease fire?

Who didn't decommission all their weapons as promised?

Who plays alphabet soup with their organisation's initials just so they can claim 'it wisnae us'?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"They were not an army, he was not a commander, he was & therefore still is a cowardly murdering scumbag who should only be invited to a spot 6 feet under!

This may well be true, but we've got to stop somewhere, otherwise we will keep killing and keep killing and never stop."

says The lady with a dagger in her hand

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" I served in northern Ireland. Did I understand the politics & history and the true feelings of all involved ? No. I just tried to look after my mate's and my own skin.

In reflection I welcome anything that brings peace, even if it puts noses out of joint. Mine included. "

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *oantrimcpl2010Couple
over a year ago

Lisburn

"...... to give 'Peace Lecture' in Warrington.

WTF?

Would you have the same WTF reaction if it was Nelson Mandela? The history / life stories are not so different"

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *irty RascalMan
over a year ago

Sutton Coldfield

"...... to give 'Peace Lecture' in Warrington.

WTF?

Would you have the same WTF reaction if it was Nelson Mandela? The history / life stories are not so different"

You beat me to it, well said.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"its opinions like those expressed on this thread that make N Ireland a place that i both want to visit, and hope to steer well clear of.

the past is the past.

if we move forward with the same hatred and bigotry that we have always had then we will be in a shit awful state forever more.

Well said

I lived in south Armagh from birth until 1989 and have lived with and seen it all so know what I'm talking about and I for one want to move on an stop living in the past! Yes nobody's saying forget the past, wrong doings were done on both sides but the hatred has to stop! It's 2013 let's learn from the past and not live in it

Billy

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"...... to give 'Peace Lecture' in Warrington.

WTF?

Would you have the same WTF reaction if it was Nelson Mandela? The history / life stories are not so different"

You mean McG is a black man, brought up in poverty in South Africa and who spent years on an island prison camp?

I never knew.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"They were not an army, he was not a commander, he was & therefore still is a cowardly murdering scumbag who should only be invited to a spot 6 feet under!

This may well be true, but we've got to stop somewhere, otherwise we will keep killing and keep killing and never stop.

So, who's been killing who since the so called cease fire?

Who didn't decommission all their weapons as promised?

Who plays alphabet soup with their organisation's initials just so they can claim 'it wisnae us'?"

Pretty much everyone has done this but there's far less killing and kneecapping than there was. Once all the dinosaurs who don't want peace of to move on and make things better have fucked off then NI will be a much better place.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *iker ladMan
over a year ago

Hinckley

"They were not an army, he was not a commander, he was & therefore still is a cowardly murdering scumbag who should only be invited to a spot 6 feet under!

I can see that you've studied Irish history quite closely, so I won't dare get into a debate with you about who created the whole mess in the first place.

"Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise""

Obviously I'm too ignorant to care about your opinion, it's quite clear that you are/were pro IRA, I do understand that the Irish population was decimated by the so called "spud famine" back in 1500 & whatever & that said famine was actually English landlords etc.

I'm sure that in your opinion those two kids & many like them deserved to die for the actions of those that caused the ira to come into being.

So....... I've got an axe to grind, maybe I should put a bomb in a bin or on a train & blow innocent folks up & then I can pop round & stand in front of them & tell them that the reason I didn't stand up & fight like a man, the reason I furtively hid a bomb & killed their wives/children isn't because I'm a lowlife cowardly turd! No! It's because I was seeking peace!

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *eakcoupleCouple
over a year ago

peak district

"Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)"

Wouldn't it be tragic though if we were still where we were in the 70's. That was getting on for 40 years ago. We need to move on. Dwelling on the past will only leave us in the past.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"You mean McG is a black man, brought up in poverty in South Africa and who spent years on an island prison camp?

I never knew."

No I mean that Nelson Mandela was a terrorist locked up for killing, who then turned politician for peace and reconstruction.

Vengeance is a powerful motivation but never for good, is any violent conflict be it a war of occupation, attack or defence innocents get killed for just being there, it's never a good thing.

How many on this thread who are condemning Martin McGuinness have worked at all on bringing a peaceful solution to the problems in Ireland over the last 15 years, let alone serving the country at minister level alongside his former enemies. I don't approve of what he is accused of and probably did in the late 60's / early 70's. but I think he has been doing a lot more to bring peace and hope to Northern Ireland than any on this thread, myself included.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"They were not an army, he was not a commander, he was & therefore still is a cowardly murdering scumbag who should only be invited to a spot 6 feet under!

I can see that you've studied Irish history quite closely, so I won't dare get into a debate with you about who created the whole mess in the first place.

"Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise"

I'm sure that in your opinion those two kids & many like them deserved to die for the actions of those that caused the ira to come into being.

Your comment on so called spud famine displays either moronic ignorance or total disregard for over a million people who starved to death on an island that your country governed. It's not even worthy of comment. As for the tactics of Republican paramilitary groups, well, I'm not here to defend them, but your own armed forces established, funded, armed, and directed loyalist paramilitary groups who blew Dublin City and Monaghan town apart, as well as taking out some meddling lawyers, and more than their fair share of innocent civilians. Would you prefer to be back in those days again? I think we've advanced a hell of a long way from there.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"They were not an army, he was not a commander, he was & therefore still is a cowardly murdering scumbag who should only be invited to a spot 6 feet under!

I can see that you've studied Irish history quite closely, so I won't dare get into a debate with you about who created the whole mess in the first place.

"Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise"

I'm sure that in your opinion those two kids & many like them deserved to die for the actions of those that caused the ira to come into being.

saved me typing too much, so thank you.

there was murder of innocents on both sides.

NO politician, on either side, hasnt got blood on their hands, so its time to let it all go.

its the dinosaurs that keep it alive, and are filling the younger generations heads with hatred they need not feel.

being with an irish woman i have heard stories that make my toes curl of what they were subjected to at the time.

having only heard the british side of things it is very much an eye opener.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"....... Would you prefer to be back in those days again? I think we've advanced a hell of a long way from there.

I'm not so sure we have.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"....... Would you prefer to be back in those days again? I think we've advanced a hell of a long way from there.

I'm not so sure we have."

YOU may not have

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"....... Would you prefer to be back in those days again? I think we've advanced a hell of a long way from there.

I'm not so sure we have."

I'm not sure what planet your on then, but lives saved obviously don't mean anything to you. Out of interest, what is it that makes you think we haven't advanced from where we were?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *uckyinlustMan
over a year ago

manchester

Sorry for interupting this debate

But .............................

People do change, we all change , our experiences make us what we are .........

There are good and bad in every society no matter where.................

But what worries me is that .............during the "parades" this summer the level of violence was unbelievable and so so many young people were involved

These young people are indoctrinated into the past and believe that the parades are for religious and historical purposes

The hippocrites who encourage and continue this indoctrination have other motives for doing so ...................Money

The gangs of Northern Ireland are a ruthlessly effective form of indoctrination and will continue to be while they control the drugs, the prostitution, the money laundering, the lawyers , journalists, police ...............

Religion ha.................

History ha ...................

What can we do ??????????

What can anyone do ???????????

Violence is a very compelling catalyst

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *irty RascalMan
over a year ago

Sutton Coldfield

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)"

It's amazing how many experts worked for the army in intelligence during the troubles. An old work colleague tried to convince the rest of us that The Corrs and U2 we're funding the IRA, because his superiors in intelligence told him so. And they never, ever lied of course

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)

They may have funded Irish political parties but if they'd funded the IRA I'd be amazed.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)

They may have funded Irish political parties but if they'd funded the IRA I'd be amazed."

i dunno, someone has to be buying U2 albums!!!!!

much like the IRA they havent done anything worthwhile for 20 years lol

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)

Wouldn't it be tragic though if we were still where we were in the 70's. That was getting on for 40 years ago. We need to move on. Dwelling on the past will only leave us in the past."

In 2 words

Marching Season!

Two sides who delight annually in marching up and down the oppositions turf wearing bowler hats or other stupid uniforms, blowing penny whistles and the like and glorifying past conquests over the other religion!

That's dwelling in the bloody past and it will take a good few more generations to breed that kind of in bred hatred out..

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm from Warrington and the people don't want him here

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"............

much like the IRA they havent done anything worthwhile for 20 years lol"

You could argue they've never done anything worthwhile.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"I'm from Warrington and the people don't want him here"

Colin Parry needs a publicity boost.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)

Wouldn't it be tragic though if we were still where we were in the 70's. That was getting on for 40 years ago. We need to move on. Dwelling on the past will only leave us in the past.

In 2 words

Marching Season!

That's dwelling in the bloody past and it will take a good few more generations to breed that kind of in bred hatred out.."

I agree

Parades which are predominantly Protestant but there are republican ones as well are a surreal harking back to the past whose main aim seems to annoy everyone else.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"In simple terms, you make peace with your enemies, not with your friends."

Colin Parry

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)

Wouldn't it be tragic though if we were still where we were in the 70's. That was getting on for 40 years ago. We need to move on. Dwelling on the past will only leave us in the past.

In 2 words

Marching Season!

That's dwelling in the bloody past and it will take a good few more generations to breed that kind of in bred hatred out..

I agree

Parades which are predominantly Protestant but there are republican ones as well are a surreal harking back to the past whose main aim seems to annoy everyone else. "

Predominantly, clucking bell both sides rail the shite out of each other on a yearly basis, always have done and quite likely always will do.

There is hatred on both sides in NI which will quite possibly never die out so condemning one or two on here for their views is just a tad hypocritical IMHO

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

""In simple terms, you make peace with your enemies, not with your friends."

Colin Parry"

Anyone asked Wilf Ball or Marie Comerford for a snappy quote recently?

I guess not. The reason why is obvious.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""In simple terms, you make peace with your enemies, not with your friends."

Colin Parry

Anyone asked Wilf Ball or Marie Comerford for a snappy quote recently?

I guess not. The reason why is obvious."
is his suffering different to theirs? Is his wanting to move in mean he's got to stay in the past to make you happy?

It's not a "snappy quote" it's an obvious statement. If you want peace then you have to make peace with those you disagree with or spend the rest of your life at war.

Knock yourself and live in the past

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)

Wouldn't it be tragic though if we were still where we were in the 70's. That was getting on for 40 years ago. We need to move on. Dwelling on the past will only leave us in the past.

In 2 words

Marching Season!

That's dwelling in the bloody past and it will take a good few more generations to breed that kind of in bred hatred out..

I agree

Parades which are predominantly Protestant but there are republican ones as well are a surreal harking back to the past whose main aim seems to annoy everyone else.

Predominantly, clucking bell both sides rail the shite out of each other on a yearly basis, always have done and quite likely always will do.

There is hatred on both sides in NI which will quite possibly never die out so condemning one or two on here for their views is just a tad hypocritical IMHO

One or two? Nope I condemn all dinosaurs who live in the past and hate the other side because of something the other side did to their great great grand dad. Hatred is a wasted emotion and achieves little apart from more hatred.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 18/09/13 20:16:18]

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *U1966Man
over a year ago

Devon

Long drop short rope

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)

Wouldn't it be tragic though if we were still where we were in the 70's. That was getting on for 40 years ago. We need to move on. Dwelling on the past will only leave us in the past.

In 2 words

Marching Season!

That's dwelling in the bloody past and it will take a good few more generations to breed that kind of in bred hatred out..

I agree

Parades which are predominantly Protestant but there are republican ones as well are a surreal harking back to the past whose main aim seems to annoy everyone else.

Predominantly, clucking bell both sides rail the shite out of each other on a yearly basis, always have done and quite likely always will do.

There is hatred on both sides in NI which will quite possibly never die out so condemning one or two on here for their views is just a tad hypocritical IMHO

So just to clarify you have equal condemnation for all those that march each year celebrating stuff from the 1500's as you do for the one or two on here who find Warrington et al still a bitter pill to swallow?

Feel free to write my words for me at any time.

Without going into too much detail, I've had my issues with both the security forces and the republican movement in my life. People who refuse to move forward and look to the future are blocking progress not enabling it. Can people have a "bitter pill" about Warrington or Omagh or harrods or Hyde park or Belfast or one of many tragedies on both sides of the troubles, of course they can and many do, but the ones preventing us from moving forward are the ones who use it as a reason for not moving forward. Dwell in the past and that's what you'll get, the past.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"Long drop short rope"

For McGuinness?

After being kneecapped and then buried amongst the disappeared of NI?

Too bloody good for him.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol East

"As I walked out the door toward the gate that would lead to my freedom, I knew if I did not leave my bitterness and hatred behind I would still be in prison"

- Nelson Mandela

Wise words

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously."

That would be because your armed forces lied after murdering 14 innocent civilians, and then a senior member of your judiciary, on behalf of your government assisted in the cover up by having them officially labelled as gunmen. It wasn't specifically republicans who spent years pointing that out though, as most of the population of Ireland, and quite a few civil and human rights organisations alsocampaigned on behalf of the victims.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously."

I also think you're foolish if you believe that nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. I wouldn't be so sure that McGuiness doesn't give them a thought either, although I don't expect too many to believe me on that.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *rivate auditionsMan
over a year ago

West Midlands

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously."

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously.

This'll be the 'your atrocities are worse than our atrocities' argument, eh?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously.

This'll be the 'your atrocities are worse than our atrocities' argument, eh?"

That'll be an answer to the question posed just above.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *otlovefun42Couple
over a year ago

Costa Blanca Spain...

""Commander"? IRA Navy? Murdering b* would be nearer the mark.

(Opinion based on 3 tours on Internal Security duties in NI in the 70s)

Wouldn't it be tragic though if we were still where we were in the 70's. That was getting on for 40 years ago. We need to move on. Dwelling on the past will only leave us in the past.

In 2 words

Marching Season!

That's dwelling in the bloody past and it will take a good few more generations to breed that kind of in bred hatred out.."

I wasn't going to comment on this one, but that is so true. If re-enacting the battle of the bloody Boyne every year isn't living in the past I don't know what is.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously.

This'll be the 'your atrocities are worse than our atrocities' argument, eh?"

Not what he said.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously.

This'll be the 'your atrocities are worse than our atrocities' argument, eh?

That'll be an answer to the question posed just above. "

D'ye want to 'phone a friend?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

I wasn't going to comment on this one, but that is so true. If re-enacting the battle of the bloody Boyne every year isn't living in the past I don't know what is."

..and there are approximately 3500 of those every year

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"............

I wasn't going to comment on this one, but that is so true. If re-enacting the battle of the bloody Boyne every year isn't living in the past I don't know what is."

It's an opportunity to wear your male parent's upper lip facial hair.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously.

This'll be the 'your atrocities are worse than our atrocities' argument, eh?

That'll be an answer to the question posed just above.

D'ye want to 'phone a friend?"

Gimme your number then

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"............

I wasn't going to comment on this one, but that is so true. If re-enacting the battle of the bloody Boyne every year isn't living in the past I don't know what is.

It's an opportunity to wear your male parent's upper lip facial hair."

lol, as opposed to your female parents upper lip hair

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"...........

D'ye want to 'phone a friend?

Gimme your number then

Are you THAT short of friends?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously.

This'll be the 'your atrocities are worse than our atrocities' argument, eh?

Not what he said.

There were massive failings on both sides of the divide. Killing of innocents happened on both sides. The biggest recruitment for the IRA was 2Para for many years due to the way they treated the local population, that doesn't make bombings right but no one was innocent in this."
So our IRA apologist thinks only outrages committed by the British Armed Forces are worthy of thorough investigation not the "Irish Republican Armed Forces"? Isn't that rather lopsided?Are Irish innocents more important than British innocents? I can see exactly where he is coming from.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously.

This'll be the 'your atrocities are worse than our atrocities' argument, eh?

Not what he said.

There were massive failings on both sides of the divide. Killing of innocents happened on both sides. The biggest recruitment for the IRA was 2Para for many years due to the way they treated the local population, that doesn't make bombings right but no one was innocent in this.So our IRA apologist thinks only outrages committed by the British Armed Forces are worthy of thorough investigation not the "Irish Republican Armed Forces"? Isn't that rather lopsided?Are Irish innocents more important than British innocents? I can see exactly where he is coming from."

I'm an apologist? Get a grip. Having spent time in the province with people checking under my car, looking over my shoulder and hitting the apex of country roads at way over the speed limit with a driver tooled to the eyeballs, I'm not apologising for anyone's behaviour. There were atrocities on both sides, if you don't think the IRA weren't investigated, you've clearly missed a meeting.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously.

This'll be the 'your atrocities are worse than our atrocities' argument, eh?

Not what he said.

There were massive failings on both sides of the divide. Killing of innocents happened on both sides. The biggest recruitment for the IRA was 2Para for many years due to the way they treated the local population, that doesn't make bombings right but no one was innocent in this.So our IRA apologist thinks only outrages committed by the British Armed Forces are worthy of thorough investigation not the "Irish Republican Armed Forces"? Isn't that rather lopsided?Are Irish innocents more important than British innocents? I can see exactly where he is coming from.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

Weren't the RUC investigating IRA killings for years ?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

"Weren't the RUC investigating IRA killings for years ?

"
I am making the point that the British Armed Forces investigated the Bloody Sunday atrocity. So to keep things equal shouldn't The Irish Republican Army have investigated the B'ham bombings?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So the IRA did investigate their won outrage? "

I don't understand the sentence?

The RUC, 14 Intelligence Company and more all investigated, prosecuted and imprisoned many people for their crimes.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is this the corrsct place to ask where tf have you hidden Shergar all these years?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is this the corrsct place to ask where tf have you hidden Shergar all these years?

He was scrumptious

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

Right to make it clear.Atrocity committed by British Armed Forces investigated by British Armed Forces into their own men. Surely the same applies to the IRA. Why didn't they investigate their own men?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"Weren't the RUC investigating IRA killings for years ?

I am making the point that the British Armed Forces investigated the Bloody Sunday atrocity. So to keep things equal shouldn't The Irish Republican Army have investigated the B'ham bombings?"

The British armed forces most certainly did not investigate the bloody Sunday murders, nor any other murder. The Saville inquiry investigated it.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

Is this the corrsct place to ask where tf have you hidden Shergar all these years?

Tesco. Frozen food aisle

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

"Weren't the RUC investigating IRA killings for years ?

I am making the point that the British Armed Forces investigated the Bloody Sunday atrocity. So to keep things equal shouldn't The Irish Republican Army have investigated the B'ham bombings?

The British armed forces most certainly did not investigate the bloody Sunday murders, nor any other murder. The Saville inquiry investigated it. "
So no British soldiers were called to give evidence at the 2 enquiries(Widgery being the first)? Of course they did. Now what enquiry did the IRA set up?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Weren't the RUC investigating IRA killings for years ?

I am making the point that the British Armed Forces investigated the Bloody Sunday atrocity. So to keep things equal shouldn't The Irish Republican Army have investigated the B'ham bombings?

The British armed forces most certainly did not investigate the bloody Sunday murders, nor any other murder. The Saville inquiry investigated it. "

As a rule, The Army do not do their own investigations on that kind of scale, they'll investigate individual things, but when it's big they have to be independent of the army/navy/RAF.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

The Irish have closure for their deaths. The people of B'ham don't and nobody cares.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Weren't the RUC investigating IRA killings for years ?

I am making the point that the British Armed Forces investigated the Bloody Sunday atrocity. So to keep things equal shouldn't The Irish Republican Army have investigated the B'ham bombings?

The British armed forces most certainly did not investigate the bloody Sunday murders, nor any other murder. The Saville inquiry investigated it. So no British soldiers were called to give evidence at the 2 enquiries(Widgery being the first)? Of course they did. Now what enquiry did the IRA set up?"

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *obbygggMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

"Weren't the RUC investigating IRA killings for years ?

I am making the point that the British Armed Forces investigated the Bloody Sunday atrocity. So to keep things equal shouldn't The Irish Republican Army have investigated the B'ham bombings?

The Inquiry was set up to find out whether or not the Army had lied about the people in the march having fired first/having guns. What would the IRA inquiry be about? They claimed the bombings as a rule, they didn't deny them but tried to justify them. It was part of their role to "terrorise", so denying it would have been counter productive."
The IRA have never admitted to the Bham when bombings. Ever.When the question was put they only said it was regrettable. That is not an admission of guilt.That also sticks in Bham people's throats. NO APOLOGY.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Oh how I do love a good politics debate.

A Belfast girl myself, from one of the most affected areas, I have seen and been affected personally by the atrocities that have happened over the years.

History will always be relevant. History will never be forgotten.

History makes us who we are

As for the marches many of you have belittled, those are an integral part of the culture and history, for both sides of the divide. As for them going through the 'opposite' sides territory, yes, they do, because that territory wasn't always the 'other sides', and they choose to move there and then kick up a stink about a long standing tradition.

So so much to say, but biting my tongue as I don't want to give the uneducated and ignorant a chance to try and make themselves look even more stupid. But Martin McGuinness can rot in hell with his IRA cronies. They have no interest in peace and progression unless it involves getting their own way in politics, which will, in turn, start the whole circle of violence again.

I'm out.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *irty RascalMan
over a year ago

Sutton Coldfield

"So why did the Republicans not leave Bloody Sunday in the past for nearly 40 years? Nobody cares about the 21 murdered in B'ham. Tell us who did that McGuiness and then I'll take you seriously."

The IRA always said that the men arrested for the Birmingham bombings were not involved with their organisation and had nothing to do with it. The Balcombe Street siege gang when finally arrested had members who owned up to the Birmingham bombings and gave detailed descriptions of where they planted the bombs in both pubs, details only the REAL bombers could have known, but the authorities didn't want to know as it meant admitting they made a mistake when locking up innocent men, as was

proved later.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *irty RascalMan
over a year ago

Sutton Coldfield

"The IRA have never admitted to the Bham when bombings. Ever.When the question was put they only said it was regrettable. That is not an admission of guilt.That also sticks in Bham people's throats. NO APOLOGY."

Wrong, see previous.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *uckyinlustMan
over a year ago

manchester

"Sorry for interupting this debate

But .............................

People do change, we all change , our experiences make us what we are .........

There are good and bad in every society no matter where.................

But what worries me is that .............during the "parades" this summer the level of violence was unbelievable and so so many young people were involved

These young people are indoctrinated into the past and believe that the parades are for religious and historical purposes

The hippocrites who encourage and continue this indoctrination have other motives for doing so ...................Money

Religion ha.................

History ha ...................

What can we do ??????????

What can anyone do ???????????

Violence is a very compelling catalyst

The same thing is happening all over the world right now .......................

Syria is very popular at the moment

Just another fucking soap opera

Don't you see .....................

No-one gives a fuck ..................

Who lives ..................

Who dies ......................

Who fucking cares ................no-one

Power and money will always be the prime objectives

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

Wrong, see previous."

Would they settle for an apology?

A lynching might be more appropriate.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My last post on this thread though long ago, first page, still rings true. N. Ireland politics, wouldn't touch it with a barge pole

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *uckyinlustMan
over a year ago

manchester

"My last post on this thread though long ago, first page, still rings true. N. Ireland politics, wouldn't touch it with a barge pole "

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Funniest thread ever! A forum user on the IRA to 20 hit list I love it thanks so much it made me laugh so much I spilt my tea.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"Funniest thread ever! A forum user on the IRA to 20 hit list I love it thanks so much it made me laugh so much I spilt my tea.

Who mentioned 20?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *anny PepperoniMan
over a year ago

Matlock

What we need to remember is that for peace to come to any conflict it has to come from and between those who are the bitterest of enemies and therefore often those who find it hardest to make that peace. Maybe they have more understanding of what that means than we might assume.

I'll get me coat!

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

So maybe the early release of convicted IRA murderers wasn't such a bright idea?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *utzzCouple
over a year ago

wrexham

What we need is an alternative Ulster

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Funniest thread ever! A forum user on the IRA to 20 hit list I love it thanks so much it made me laugh so much I spilt my tea.

Who mentioned 20?"

That's right you don't get numbers in dreams highly amusing non the less. I hope you have fed nessie tonight btw.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"So maybe the early release of convicted IRA murderers wasn't such a bright idea?"

Explain?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *nny OP Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"So maybe the early release of convicted IRA murderers wasn't such a bright idea?

Explain? "

Are the words too long?

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By *ichael McCarthyMan
over a year ago

Lucan

"So maybe the early release of convicted IRA murderers wasn't such a bright idea?

Explain?

Are the words too long?"

I just thought you might like to enlighten me as to how you came to that conclusion, since your use of the word "so" would suggest that you were basing it on something you read in the thread somewhere. To be honest, you've probably given me enough food for thought for one day with your insightful, not to mention educated, political comment.

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What we need is an alternative Ulster

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"What we need is an alternative Ulster

Grab it n change it your,s !

(thread closed by moderator)

Reply privately