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"haha I admire your persistence  "Thank you, just because people disagree does not make my points any less. I said from the start I was not having a go at anyone but cheats. They are braking the law, so ate we all abiding by law breakers on this site? My views about people claiming and doing something like volunteering, are a side line of my views, and yes I do think you should do. We should all be very grateful that we have such a wonderful benefits system, some country's don't. | |||
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"All I will say is, I don't know how they do it! A family member of mine has fallen on hard times (mental illness issues) And my god, she really has been put through the wringer, whilst others knows exactly how to do it! It pisses me off, but for genuine people, I am so glad we do have a system in place even if it isn't perfect "good point  | |||
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"Too busy watching Panorama on the Tax Dodgers.  "Got that on record will watch it later, but should be a good watch, that's the rich lot thinking there above the rest if us. And ripping the tax off every chance they get. | |||
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"what!?" What???? Not sure what you are asking what for?  | |||
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"haha I admire your persistence
Thank you, just because people disagree does not make my points any less.
I said from the start I was not having a go at anyone but cheats. They are braking the law, so ate we all abiding by law breakers on this site?
My views about people claiming and doing something like volunteering, are a side line of my views, and yes I do think you should do.
We should all be very grateful that we have such a wonderful benefits system, some country's don't.
"no disagreeing doesn't make your points any less but you have made your point already in a previous thread. Why do you think people are abiding by law breakers assuming you mean supporting them? You did mention before that you think people should volunteer for something in return for benefits but I missed the part where you said how this would work and why someone like me should volunteer for a benefit when I have paid into the system for 40 years. I think most people are grateful for the benefit system especially those who have had cause to use it, just as I am very grateful for the NHS that my tax and national insurance pays for. | |||
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"Too busy watching Panorama on the Tax Dodgers. "Me too. Hoping they'll do a programme soon on the relationship between Chief Execs and Directors of companies and NGO's benefiting from Government funding and MP's. Incestuous would be an understatement. | |||
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"what!? What???? Not sure what you are asking what for? "I don't understand why you're immediately posting the same thread, that's why I'm saying what. | |||
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"Too busy watching Panorama on the Tax Dodgers.
Me too.
Hoping they'll do a programme soon on the relationship between Chief Execs and Directors of companies and NGO's benefiting from Government funding and MP's. Incestuous would be an understatement."I detect a fellow reader of Private Eye or listener to Radio 4 and so offer them the secret handshake  | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma" the stigma of being a benefit claimant? Its threads like this that contribute to that. | |||
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"haha I admire your persistence
Thank you, just because people disagree does not make my points any less.
I said from the start I was not having a go at anyone but cheats. They are braking the law, so ate we all abiding by law breakers on this site?
My views about people claiming and doing something like volunteering, are a side line of my views, and yes I do think you should do.
We should all be very grateful that we have such a wonderful benefits system, some country's don't.
no disagreeing doesn't make your points any less but you have made your point already in a previous thread.
Why do you think people are abiding by law breakers assuming you mean supporting them?
You did mention before that you think people should volunteer for something in return for benefits but I missed the part where you said how this would work and why someone like me should volunteer for a benefit when I have paid into the system for 40 years.
I think most people are grateful for the benefit system especially those who have had cause to use it, just as I am very grateful for the NHS that my tax and national insurance pays for."See again I think your taking it personally. I'm not here to upset anyone, just because I have a view, does not mean I have all the answers. It's not my job to have the answers it's down to the wonderful government we put into power. Rather wide point but you don't go into a shop and get things for free so why should anything else be different, and as i said what do people do in other country's. | |||
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"Too busy watching Panorama on the Tax Dodgers.
Me too.
Hoping they'll do a programme soon on the relationship between Chief Execs and Directors of companies and NGO's benefiting from Government funding and MP's. Incestuous would be an understatement."Surely they will never allow that but let's hope. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma the stigma of being a benefit claimant? Its threads like this that contribute to that." Yeah that | |||
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"what!? What???? Not sure what you are asking what for?
I don't understand why you're immediately posting the same thread, that's why I'm saying what."Because it got full so people may want to discusses it further, like some our. I'm not keeping you here against your will, don't want to sound rude, but you can ignore and not read. | |||
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"Too busy watching Panorama on the Tax Dodgers.
Me too.
Hoping they'll do a programme soon on the relationship between Chief Execs and Directors of companies and NGO's benefiting from Government funding and MP's. Incestuous would be an understatement.
I detect a fellow reader of Private Eye or listener to Radio 4 and so offer them the secret handshake "Sssshhhh 
It is incredible how 'jobs for the boys' it is though. | |||
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"what!? What???? Not sure what you are asking what for?
I don't understand why you're immediately posting the same thread, that's why I'm saying what.
Because it got full so people may want to discusses it further, like some our.
I'm not keeping you here against your will, don't want to sound rude, but you can ignore and not read."neither you nor a pack of wild dogs could keep me here against my will but I reserve my right to contribute to a thread and ask questions. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma the stigma of being a benefit claimant? Its threads like this that contribute to that." Don't no if you have missed my point, but like i keep saying I don't claim im above anyone, im just person who works as a family, and live in a normal small house that we rent, don't even own it. So why would my thread contribute to stigma, my thread is aimed at benefit cheats, how many tome do I have to say this. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma" I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. | |||
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"what!? What???? Not sure what you are asking what for?
I don't understand why you're immediately posting the same thread, that's why I'm saying what.
Because it got full so people may want to discusses it further, like some our.
I'm not keeping you here against your will, don't want to sound rude, but you can ignore and not read.
neither you nor a pack of wild dogs could keep me here against my will but I reserve my right to contribute to a thread and ask questions."No by all means stay, i welcome your input, i just simply meant dint complain of a second thread if your self and other are commenting. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma the stigma of being a benefit claimant? Its threads like this that contribute to that. Yeah that "people don't think before they pass comment or judgement | |||
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"Bicouple, I believe what Nicecouple is saying is that your other thread is still open and didn't need a sequel" The other one is closed, and i believe myself and other still want to discuss this further. That I do believe its my right, just like it's yours to partake in this thread  | |||
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"Bicouple, I believe what Nicecouple is saying is that your other thread is still open and didn't need a sequel The other one is closed, and i believe myself and other still want to discuss this further. That I do believe its my right, just like it's yours to partake in this thread "Fine but it was still open just before I replied here | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma." I agree when I have claimed which has admittedly been a few times, i have come off them as soon as I have got on my feet. | |||
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"Like I said because it ended people may not of got to have there say. Any one who wishes to partake please feel free to read the whole of the first thread. But by all means don't post no one is forcing you to. Maybe let's twist it a bit, are there any workers out there who pay there taxes, and can't stand the fact that some of them go to people who defraud the DSS. Again this is not aimed at anyone but people who dishonestly claim, and cheat the system. So like i have been told 1% of all claims but still 1% amounts to a lot, of our taxes, and it's still braking the law. Are people these days not bothered by laws?? "Benefit fraud, tax cheats. Same thing in my eyes and it does make my blood boil and if I caught someone doing it and had evidence. I would report them. Don't even have to think about it. No mate of mine would do it either as they have morals like I do. | |||
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"Bicouple, I believe what Nicecouple is saying is that your other thread is still open and didn't need a sequel The other one is closed, and i believe myself and other still want to discuss this further. That I do believe its my right, just like it's yours to partake in this thread
Fine but it was still open just before I replied here"It was not I assure you, peaches hot it closed lol. Before I opened this thread, that's why i opened this one. Nice couple if you was under the same understanding, im sorry if that's what you meant, but i can assure you it was closed when I posted here. | |||
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"Too busy watching Panorama on the Tax Dodgers.
Got that on record will watch it later, but should be a good watch, that's the rich lot thinking there above the rest if us. And ripping the tax off every chance they get."I've just watched it! Here we have the govt being virtually complicit in assisting big companies to avoid tax n the annual tax that was once 25% is now only 5%! The 1% of Benefit fraud is a drop in the ocean compared to the actively aggressive measures companies employ to evade tax. 'legal' maybe but defo NOT moral. I'm truth we all know soooo little of how our country really runs | |||
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"Some things in life are bad They can really make you mad Other things just make you swear and curse When you're chewing on life's gristle Don't grumble, give a whistle And this'll help things turn out for the best And... Always look on the bright side of life (whistle) Always look on the light side of life (whistle) If life seems jolly rotten There's something you've forgotten And that's to laugh and smile and dance and sing When you're feeling in the dumps Don't be silly chumps Just purse your lips and whistle - that's the thing And... Always look on the bright side of life... (whistle) Come on! Always look on the bright side of life... (whistle) For life is quite absurd And death's the final word You must always face the curtain with a bow Forget about your sin - give the audience a grin Enjoy it - it's your last chance anyhow So always look on the bright side of death (whistle) Just before you draw your terminal breath (whistle) Life's a piece of shit When you look at it Life's a laugh and death's a joke, it's true You'll see it's all a show Keep 'em laughing as you go Just remember that the last laugh is on you And always look on the bright side of life Always look on the right side of life (whistle) Always look on the bright side of life (whistle) Always look on the bright side of life (whistle)" love that song and so true, I do always try to look on bright side. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma." motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. | |||
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"You dont have the choice as soon as you're on your feet, as soon as you've got a new full time job, you have two weeks Jobseekers (if they let you) to make sure you keep the job if you need it and then you're gone. " slightly disagree. They give me two week extra and x4 weeks council tax and hosing benefit Evan after I hot back to work, and let me tell you it come in so useful. And I really was grateful. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are." | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are." I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose." but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused  | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are." I agree, dome people get knock back to much and it gets them down, so that we're I thing doing a bit if voluntary work will keep your spirits up. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused "Thank you Nicecouple
If the Stigma serves anyone at all, it serves the people that want to pigeonhole me as somebody they wouldnt employ, somebody that doesnt want to work, somebody with no self esteem and somebody with no standards.
That is very much the feeling I get from a lot of employers both younger and older than me. I dont even get feedback from these people because I'm clearly not that important. I went a whole year without a fucking offer to an interview for cryin out loud.
So if this Stigma is meant to serve me, I'd like to know how you think that works. Because my neverending motivation to get out of this shithole clearly doesnt make me the man for the job! | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused "For the people who don't feel it? That they should - nobody capable of working (and that's pretty much everybody) should be happy to receive handouts. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
For the people who don't feel it? That they should - nobody capable of working (and that's pretty much everybody) should be happy to receive handouts."Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"? Fuck this debate, I'm done. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused "I think the point he was trying to make was that there is a little self shame in claiming and any genuine person feels it. And in most cases its that tied with stigma that give you the push you need, but that based on people looking for work not the ones that can't work. In other words people who are cheats have no shame, so don't feel it like us law abiding people. | |||
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"Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"? Fuck this debate, I'm done. " Couldn't care less if you shout it from the rooftops or harbour it privately but I do have a problem with people that have no shame in living off benefits - with the rare exception of those that really can't help themselves. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
For the people who don't feel it? That they should - nobody capable of working (and that's pretty much everybody) should be happy to receive handouts.
Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"?
Fuck this debate, I'm done. "Now but by what you say your genuinely looking for work, so this us not aimed at you. I would rather rake on someone of the dole who really wanted the job, because they prob want it mire than someone who thinks they can do the job better. They would tend to be cocky, were the dole guy will try his best to proove him self. | |||
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"Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"? Fuck this debate, I'm done. Couldn't care less if you shout it from the rooftops or harbour it privately but I do have a problem with people that have no shame in living off benefits - with the rare exception of those that really can't help themselves." some make comments on here just to antagonise  | |||
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"Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"? Fuck this debate, I'm done. Couldn't care less if you shout it from the rooftops or harbour it privately but I do have a problem with people that have no shame in living off benefits - with the rare exception of those that really can't help themselves. some make comments on here just to antagonise "Stating my opinion in response to a question. Works better than posting irrelevant tosh like a child having a tantrum in the corner because it doesn't like what's being debated. | |||
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"This 'debate' is a feckin farce! If you don't agree with the op, she/he blames you of 'picking at holes'! Well, to tell the truth, i'd rather sit here and pick my hole than listen to this drivel!" I asked you on last lot, stand up and show what you accused me of, show me the threads. Have a debate by all means, but font pick holes just debate, Also out if curiosity, are you on dole? I'm not getting personal, just put a fact to the opposition. | |||
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"Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"? Fuck this debate, I'm done. Couldn't care less if you shout it from the rooftops or harbour it privately but I do have a problem with people that have no shame in living off benefits - with the rare exception of those that really can't help themselves. some make comments on here just to antagonise "He is not antagonising in my opinion, and im just saving that because he is technically backing my debate. He has a point, and you are jumping on him, now if you say I have upset people then fair enough, but he is simply had an opinion. | |||
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"This 'debate' is a feckin farce! If you don't agree with the op, she/he blames you of 'picking at holes'! Well, to tell the truth, i'd rather sit here and pick my hole than listen to this drivel! I asked you on last lot, stand up and show what you accused me of, show me the threads. Have a debate by all means, but font pick holes just debate, Also out if curiosity, are you on dole? I'm not getting personal, just put a fact to the opposition." Lol. What the feck does it have to do with you whether or not i'm on the dole? And i've still to see even one fact from you regarding your original post. All you sdm to state is 'make cheats work for their money'! But you have still not said how YOU would implement this! | |||
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"People on benefits are NOT scroungers... If there is someone receiving any sort of lifestyle, paid for from public funds, they have the right to do so granted by law and successive governments.... The remaining rhetoric is uncalled for.... UNLESS... the someone is fraudulently claiming monies which they do not have rights to... Those people "alone" deserve to be treated as criminals and stopped on every occasion...!!!" I agree with that too - except there are some scroungers. I'm related to one! | |||
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"Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"? Fuck this debate, I'm done. Couldn't care less if you shout it from the rooftops or harbour it privately but I do have a problem with people that have no shame in living off benefits - with the rare exception of those that really can't help themselves. some make comments on here just to antagonise
Stating my opinion in response to a question.
Works better than posting irrelevant tosh like a child having a tantrum in the corner because it doesn't like what's being debated."My point why can't people debate, without getting personal. I gave had same problem tho on other threads, but i only attacked when people made personal remarks. But I have not learnt from that. And it was nice to see, that although most disagree with me, you have not attacked my spelling, so much appreciated. I'm getting better. | |||
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"This 'debate' is a feckin farce! If you don't agree with the op, she/he blames you of 'picking at holes'! Well, to tell the truth, i'd rather sit here and pick my hole than listen to this drivel!" | |||
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"People on benefits are NOT scroungers... If there is someone receiving any sort of lifestyle, paid for from public funds, they have the right to do so granted by law and successive governments.... The remaining rhetoric is uncalled for.... UNLESS... the someone is fraudulently claiming monies which they do not have rights to... Those people "alone" deserve to be treated as criminals and stopped on every occasion...!!!" I agree but sea s lot of people seem to want to turn a blind eye, like I have been quoted is only 1% so not as bad as other things. Yes not as bad but still a crime all the same. | |||
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"People on benefits are NOT scroungers... If there is someone receiving any sort of lifestyle, paid for from public funds, they have the right to do so granted by law and successive governments.... The remaining rhetoric is uncalled for.... UNLESS... the someone is fraudulently claiming monies which they do not have rights to... Those people "alone" deserve to be treated as criminals and stopped on every occasion...!!!" | |||
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"This 'debate' is a feckin farce! If you don't agree with the op, she/he blames you of 'picking at holes'! Well, to tell the truth, i'd rather sit here and pick my hole than listen to this drivel! I asked you on last lot, stand up and show what you accused me of, show me the threads. Have a debate by all means, but font pick holes just debate, Also out if curiosity, are you on dole? I'm not getting personal, just put a fact to the opposition. Lol. What the feck does it have to do with you whether or not i'm on the dole? And i've still to see even one fact from you regarding your original post. All you sdm to state is 'make cheats work for their money'! But you have still not said how YOU would implement this!" I'm not here to state how to only meant this, im simply saying something needs to be done, and throwing it out fir discussion, that's what a debate is. Also I have made comments on what's it could be done, go have a look at threads. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
I think the point he was trying to make was that there is a little self shame in claiming and any genuine person feels it. And in most cases its that tied with stigma that give you the push you need, but that based on people looking for work not the ones that can't work. In other words people who are cheats have no shame, so don't feel it like us law abiding people.
"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. | |||
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"This 'debate' is a feckin farce! If you don't agree with the op, she/he blames you of 'picking at holes'! Well, to tell the truth, i'd rather sit here and pick my hole than listen to this drivel! I asked you on last lot, stand up and show what you accused me of, show me the threads. Have a debate by all means, but font pick holes just debate, Also out if curiosity, are you on dole? I'm not getting personal, just put a fact to the opposition. Lol. What the feck does it have to do with you whether or not i'm on the dole? And i've still to see even one fact from you regarding your original post. All you sdm to state is 'make cheats work for their money'! But you have still not said how YOU would implement this! I'm not here to state how to only meant this, im simply saying something needs to be done, and throwing it out fir discussion, that's what a debate is. Also I have made comments on what's it could be done, go have a look at threads. " Do you actually know the difference between a cheat and a so called 'lazy scrounger' by the way? I'm just asking because you seem to use both titles in your posts. | |||
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"Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"? Fuck this debate, I'm done. Couldn't care less if you shout it from the rooftops or harbour it privately but I do have a problem with people that have no shame in living off benefits - with the rare exception of those that really can't help themselves." You really have a problem with people who have no shame in claiming benefits. I have no desire to go into the circumstances that I'm all too familiar with but shame is something reserved for people who have done something wrong. | |||
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"This 'debate' is a feckin farce! If you don't agree with the op, she/he blames you of 'picking at holes'! Well, to tell the truth, i'd rather sit here and pick my hole than listen to this drivel! I asked you on last lot, stand up and show what you accused me of, show me the threads. Have a debate by all means, but font pick holes just debate, Also out if curiosity, are you on dole? I'm not getting personal, just put a fact to the opposition. Lol. What the feck does it have to do with you whether or not i'm on the dole? And i've still to see even one fact from you regarding your original post. All you sdm to state is 'make cheats work for their money'! But you have still not said how YOU would implement this! I'm not here to state how to only meant this, im simply saying something needs to be done, and throwing it out fir discussion, that's what a debate is. Also I have made comments on what's it could be done, go have a look at threads. Do you actually know the difference between a cheat and a so called 'lazy scrounger' by the way? I'm just asking because you seem to use both titles in your posts." Of course I no the difference, but in my opinion there both the same, because a cheat well us a cheat, and a lazy son gets is not abiding by the rules so the fire make that a cheat also. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
For the people who don't feel it? That they should - nobody capable of working (and that's pretty much everybody) should be happy to receive handouts.
Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"?
Fuck this debate, I'm done.
Now but by what you say your genuinely looking for work, so this us not aimed at you. I would rather rake on someone of the dole who really wanted the job, because they prob want it mire than someone who thinks they can do the job better.
They would tend to be cocky, were the dole guy will try his best to proove him self. "But you said that anyone who claimed benefits would feel ashamed | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
I think the point he was trying to make was that there is a little self shame in claiming and any genuine person feels it. And in most cases its that tied with stigma that give you the push you need, but that based on people looking for work not the ones that can't work. In other words people who are cheats have no shame, so don't feel it like us law abiding people.
and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. "Give it a few minutes and he/she will agree with you. (with a 'but' added on). | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. " What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
I think the point he was trying to make was that there is a little self shame in claiming and any genuine person feels it. And in most cases its that tied with stigma that give you the push you need, but that based on people looking for work not the ones that can't work. In other words people who are cheats have no shame, so don't feel it like us law abiding people.
and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. "I'm not saying I never said that, but i was trying to use the word loosely, i don't mean it's shamefully, i mean you tend to feel a little shame. Well I personally do any way, I don't shout it from the rooftops im on the dole, and im sure you don't either. | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable." Bollocks. | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks." And why would that be? | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
For the people who don't feel it? That they should - nobody capable of working (and that's pretty much everybody) should be happy to receive handouts.
Hold on a sec? Does that mean we should openly display our remorse and guilt for being in that situation in order to get the "handout"?
Fuck this debate, I'm done.
Now but by what you say your genuinely looking for work, so this us not aimed at you. I would rather rake on someone of the dole who really wanted the job, because they prob want it mire than someone who thinks they can do the job better.
They would tend to be cocky, were the dole guy will try his best to proove him self.
But you said that anyone who claimed benefits would feel ashamed "I never said ashamed a said feels a little shame, different words, and meant on different terms. I have just explained my opinion on the little shame stigma 
But please don't put words in my mouth, that's not fair. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
I think the point he was trying to make was that there is a little self shame in claiming and any genuine person feels it. And in most cases its that tied with stigma that give you the push you need, but that based on people looking for work not the ones that can't work. In other words people who are cheats have no shame, so don't feel it like us law abiding people.
and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame.
Give it a few minutes and he/she will agree with you. (with a 'but' added on)."lets just leave them both to it and they can pontificate till it reaches its end | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks." Go on,you think its bullocks, that your opinion. But do state way it's bullocks the poster as asked you. Like you have done with me you state your fact with words but never follow it up. Apart from hitting a different angle. | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be?" Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable." Hmm. Fluffy crap eh....good counter argument. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
I think the point he was trying to make was that there is a little self shame in claiming and any genuine person feels it. And in most cases its that tied with stigma that give you the push you need, but that based on people looking for work not the ones that can't work. In other words people who are cheats have no shame, so don't feel it like us law abiding people.
and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame.
Give it a few minutes and he/she will agree with you. (with a 'but' added on).
lets just leave them both to it and they can pontificate till it reaches its end "funny how because we're on the same wave length with out agreement you want to leave, like I said you no were the back button is. It's strange because because of my problem with words I sometimes use words to loosely, but this guy nows what's he us talking about and using the correct words but you still find him Bollocks, funny that | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you?" So there actually are people without that pride? Kind of illustrates my point really! | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you?" Elaborate what you think is Bollocks, and font just say the statment. Refer to the points. | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. Go on,you think its bullocks, that your opinion. But do state way it's bullocks the poster as asked you. Like you have done with me you state your fact with words but never follow it up. Apart from hitting a different angle. " To be honest, and i hope you don't take this personally, i would love to debate with you, but you have the upper hand due to the fact that i can't make sense of most of your posts. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
I think the point he was trying to make was that there is a little self shame in claiming and any genuine person feels it. And in most cases its that tied with stigma that give you the push you need, but that based on people looking for work not the ones that can't work. In other words people who are cheats have no shame, so don't feel it like us law abiding people.
and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame.
Give it a few minutes and he/she will agree with you. (with a 'but' added on).
lets just leave them both to it and they can pontificate till it reaches its end funny how because we're on the same wave length with out agreement you want to leave, like I said you no were the back button is.
It's strange because because of my problem with words I sometimes use words to loosely, but this guy nows what's he us talking about and using the correct words but you still find him Bollocks, funny that "see. thats where the problems begin....your quoting me yet i havent mentioned bollox at all. | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Elaborate what you think is Bollocks, and font just say the statment. Refer to the points. "Bollocks are the two hard balls located in the scrotum. | |||
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"Only thing that pisses me off is the stigma I've only been unemployed once but I remember hating it. But then there's your motivation to get out of it. The issue is more about those who don't feel any stigma. motivation is one thing but the reality of lengthy unemployment can make it very difficult to maintain. I think that someone who hasn't experienced knock back after knock back, rejection after rejection and the worry that comes with unemployment can't possibly imagine what its like to hear people saying that all it takes to get back into work is motivation...believe me if that was the case unemployment would be at an all time low. There simply aren't jobs and there are certain people who will find it very difficult to get what jobs there are. I think they possibly can imagine! That wasn't my point - my point was that perhaps the stigma serves a purpose. but you said that the issue was with people who don't feel the stigma, so what purpose does it serve? I'm confused
I think the point he was trying to make was that there is a little self shame in claiming and any genuine person feels it. And in most cases its that tied with stigma that give you the push you need, but that based on people looking for work not the ones that can't work. In other words people who are cheats have no shame, so don't feel it like us law abiding people.
and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame.
Give it a few minutes and he/she will agree with you. (with a 'but' added on).
lets just leave them both to it and they can pontificate till it reaches its end funny how because we're on the same wave length with out agreement you want to leave, like I said you no were the back button is.
It's strange because because of my problem with words I sometimes use words to loosely, but this guy nows what's he us talking about and using the correct words but you still find him Bollocks, funny that
see. thats where the problems begin....your quoting me yet i havent mentioned bollox at all. "Was not referring to you, and was not a mistake. This was just general sing to the gate you are mostly showing | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Elaborate what you think is Bollocks, and font just say the statment. Refer to the points.
Bollocks are the two hard balls located in the scrotum."Child like, to save on van or getting thread closed, i will again rake a step back from debating with you. I would not want you to receive a ban. Rake care | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Elaborate what you think is Bollocks, and font just say the statment. Refer to the points.
Bollocks are the two hard balls located in the scrotum.
Child like, to save on van or getting thread closed, i will again rake a step back from debating with you. I would not want you to receive a ban. Rake care "Eh? | |||
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"* hate "im showing no hate what so ever, to anyone....just incredulity | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you?" Actually, whilst I equally heartilly disagree with the posters premis, a bisylabic expletive says more about a person rather than the clarity of their intellectual capacity to debate.... Which doesnt help either way... | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Actually, whilst I equally heartilly disagree with the posters premis, a bisylabic expletive says more about a person rather than the clarity of their intellectual capacity to debate.... Which doesnt help either way... "true but fluffy crap isn't much of an argument either | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Actually, whilst I equally heartilly disagree with the posters premis, a bisylabic expletive says more about a person rather than the clarity of their intellectual capacity to debate.... Which doesnt help either way... "Lol. And i would have obliged the poster with a more precise explanation. But to be honest, i just couldn't be fecked trying to explain just how wrong his statement was. | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Actually, whilst I equally heartilly disagree with the posters premis, a bisylabic expletive says more about a person rather than the clarity of their intellectual capacity to debate.... Which doesnt help either way... "totally agree my lovely furtler....dont know what the hell ya mean...but i do agree | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Actually, whilst I equally heartilly disagree with the posters premis, a bisylabic expletive says more about a person rather than the clarity of their intellectual capacity to debate.... Which doesnt help either way...
Lol. And i would have obliged the poster with a more precise explanation. But to be honest, i just couldn't be fecked trying to explain just how wrong his statement was."as have I this thread. Gave up on the last one | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Actually, whilst I equally heartilly disagree with the posters premis, a bisylabic expletive says more about a person rather than the clarity of their intellectual capacity to debate.... Which doesnt help either way...
Lol. And i would have obliged the poster with a more precise explanation. But to be honest, i just couldn't be fecked trying to explain just how wrong his statement was."And to be honest... Whilst a prosaic clarification would have been intellectually the higher moral ground... I believe your concise approach has probably explained, with equal efficacity, my response to the post in question....
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Actually, whilst I equally heartilly disagree with the posters premis, a bisylabic expletive says more about a person rather than the clarity of their intellectual capacity to debate.... Which doesnt help either way...
Lol. And i would have obliged the poster with a more precise explanation. But to be honest, i just couldn't be fecked trying to explain just how wrong his statement was.
And to be honest... Whilst a prosaic clarification would have been intellectually the higher moral ground... I believe your concise approach has probably explained, with equal efficacity, my response to the post in question....
" | |||
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" Also I have made comments on what's it could be done, go have a look at threads. Do you actually know the difference between a cheat and a so called 'lazy scrounger' by the way? I'm just asking because you seem to use both titles in your posts. Of course I no the difference, but in my opinion there both the same, because a cheat well us a cheat, and a lazy son gets is not abiding by the rules so the fire make that a cheat also. "A benefits cheat claims something he is not entitled to. A lazy scrounger gets benefits by default (no income). These two maybe as bad as each other but they're not the same, and they will be treated by the law differently (as only one is illegal). The latter term suggests there are people who are work shy but perhaps this is where the labels/prejudices/stigmas come into play. The gov't is currently rolling out their new tax credit system to make it harder for people to "cheat" the system. Will it work or will it penalise those who need the benefit system? | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Actually, whilst I equally heartilly disagree with the posters premis, a bisylabic expletive says more about a person rather than the clarity of their intellectual capacity to debate.... Which doesnt help either way...
Lol. And i would have obliged the poster with a more precise explanation. But to be honest, i just couldn't be fecked trying to explain just how wrong his statement was.
And to be honest... Whilst a prosaic clarification would have been intellectually the higher moral ground... I believe your concise approach has probably explained, with equal efficacity, my response to the post in question....
"I'll just let you answer him next time then. Maybe 'bollocks' was a tad strong. I should have said what you said but i didn't have my thesaurus handy. | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why." Blimey! I couldn't be further from high minded but you clearly have a problem with me arguing with your point of view . None of your statements make me feel uncomfortable I simply don't agree with them and I have considered why I don't quite carefully and still disagree. Literary acrobatics....I'm flattered and yes I do know it wasn't a compliment | |||
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" Also I have made comments on what's it could be done, go have a look at threads. Do you actually know the difference between a cheat and a so called 'lazy scrounger' by the way? I'm just asking because you seem to use both titles in your posts. Of course I no the difference, but in my opinion there both the same, because a cheat well us a cheat, and a lazy son gets is not abiding by the rules so the fire make that a cheat also.
A benefits cheat claims something he is not entitled to. A lazy scrounger gets benefits by default (no income). These two maybe as bad as each other but they're not the same, and they will be treated by the law differently (as only one is illegal). The latter term suggests there are people who are work shy but perhaps this is where the labels/prejudices/stigmas come into play.
The gov't is currently rolling out their new tax credit system to make it harder for people to "cheat" the system. Will it work or will it penalise those who need the benefit system?"I think you will find although I have used the word crime else ware, this post was stated as cheat, so think you will find the rules of job seekers allowance are seeking work, the lazy ones don't don't this so they don't follow the rules do think you will find that a a cheat both exactly the same. On the grounds of crime they are different, but that was not the question asked. It was the difference between a cheat and a lazy scrounger. So am i not right? | |||
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"Well its getting late and despite what some people think, i also have to get up early... i always wave bye bye at those going to work "snort. I am going to have to go to bed as I have to get up so you can wave me off | |||
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"Now...........would everyone like a nice cuppa tea n a gypsy cream? "God you and your teapot, I'll have Horlicks and a slice of Victoria sponge please..buttercream and jam | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why." This but explained better they I could | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why." Of course it makes me feel uncomfortable. Mainly because i don't like kicking people when they are already down. What does it say about society when people feel they have the right to label others as 'scroungers' when they fall on hard times! | |||
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"and that is patronising and insulting. No one who is genuinely in need of benefits should feel shame. What beautifully fluffy crap. The shame derives from having pride to pay your own way in life. For those that have that pride the shame of living off handouts from others is inevitable. Bollocks. And why would that be? Because your statement is utter bollocks. Hence, i said, bollocks. Hope that helped clear it up for you? Actually, whilst I equally heartilly disagree with the posters premis, a bisylabic expletive says more about a person rather than the clarity of their intellectual capacity to debate.... Which doesnt help either way...
Lol. And i would have obliged the poster with a more precise explanation. But to be honest, i just couldn't be fecked trying to explain just how wrong his statement was.
And to be honest... Whilst a prosaic clarification would have been intellectually the higher moral ground... I believe your concise approach has probably explained, with equal efficacity, my response to the post in question....
I'll just let you answer him next time then. Maybe 'bollocks' was a tad strong. I should have said what you said but i didn't have my thesaurus handy. "Bugger...!!! Just had to websearch "thesaurus"... | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why." or to think about it another way .....after paying tax for over 20 years when I lost my job I claimed benefits. I still lost my house, savings and had to sell belongings to get by. However I felt no shame claiming as I was entitled to help whilst I found work. I dont believe I should of felt shame as my ethic led me to fund retraining and get another job. Just food for thought I know your not bashing benefits. | |||
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"Mine and many others peoples MP's have told us that benifit fraud is taking money that they shouldn't . As long as all those honest people who are in charge are showing us how to be good honest law abiding citizens by example then .........." Agree, here there just as bad at the top but two wrongs don't make a right. | |||
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"Well its getting late and despite what some people think, i also have to get up early... i always wave bye bye at those going to work
snort. I am going to have to go to bed as I have to get up so you can wave me off "Im the one in the white dressing gown....next door is blue and next to them is multicoloured ... | |||
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"Now...........would everyone like a nice cuppa tea n a gypsy cream?
God you and your teapot, I'll have Horlicks and a slice of Victoria sponge please..buttercream and jam "I'm not a bloody cafe ya know! now do ya want a nice cuppa tea n a sodding gypsy cream or don't ya? Tut. Bloody women  | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why. or to think about it another way .....after paying tax for over 20 years when I lost my job I claimed benefits. I still lost my house, savings and had to sell belongings to get by. However I felt no shame claiming as I was entitled to help whilst I found work. I dont believe I should of felt shame as my ethic led me to fund retraining and get another job. Just food for thought I know your not bashing benefits. " I don't believe you should have either. | |||
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"Now...........would everyone like a nice cuppa tea n a gypsy cream? "can i have sa milky coffee and a rich tea please | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why. Of course it makes me feel uncomfortable. Mainly because i don't like kicking people when they are already down. What does it say about society when people feel they have the right to label others as 'scroungers' when they fall on hard times!" Look you got the spoon out again twisting words. Who said people who fall on hard times are scroungers, i never??? I said people who defraud are system are scroungers, if your going to quote me at least get it right please | |||
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" Also I have made comments on what's it could be done, go have a look at threads. Do you actually know the difference between a cheat and a so called 'lazy scrounger' by the way? I'm just asking because you seem to use both titles in your posts. Of course I no the difference, but in my opinion there both the same, because a cheat well us a cheat, and a lazy son gets is not abiding by the rules so the fire make that a cheat also.
A benefits cheat claims something he is not entitled to. A lazy scrounger gets benefits by default (no income). These two maybe as bad as each other but they're not the same, and they will be treated by the law differently (as only one is illegal). The latter term suggests there are people who are work shy but perhaps this is where the labels/prejudices/stigmas come into play.
The gov't is currently rolling out their new tax credit system to make it harder for people to "cheat" the system. Will it work or will it penalise those who need the benefit system?
I think you will find although I have used the word crime else ware, this post was stated as cheat, so think you will find the rules of job seekers allowance are seeking work, the lazy ones don't don't this so they don't follow the rules do think you will find that a a cheat both exactly the same. On the grounds of crime they are different, but that was not the question asked.
It was the difference between a cheat and a lazy scrounger.
So am i not right? "No you're not right. They both "cheat" the system but they are different. You summarised them as being the same. | |||
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"Now...........would everyone like a nice cuppa tea n a gypsy cream?
God you and your teapot, I'll have Horlicks and a slice of Victoria sponge please..buttercream and jam
I'm not a bloody cafe ya know! now do ya want a nice cuppa tea n a sodding gypsy cream or don't ya? Tut. Bloody women "oh alright but I want redbush tea and a chocolate digestive | |||
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lol | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why. Of course it makes me feel uncomfortable. Mainly because i don't like kicking people when they are already down. What does it say about society when people feel they have the right to label others as 'scroungers' when they fall on hard times! Look you got the spoon out again twisting words. Who said people who fall on hard times are scroungers, i never??? I said people who defraud are system are scroungers, if your going to quote me at least get it right please "Eh? What quote in the above post is yours? (apart frm the last one where you've just jumped into). | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why. Of course it makes me feel uncomfortable. Mainly because i don't like kicking people when they are already down. What does it say about society when people feel they have the right to label others as 'scroungers' when they fall on hard times! Look you got the spoon out again twisting words. Who said people who fall on hard times are scroungers, i never??? I said people who defraud are system are scroungers, if your going to quote me at least get it right please
Eh? What quote in the above post is yours? (apart frm the last one where you've just jumped into)."what ever post you want to call mine sweet Pea
Loved the way you said bollocks before it was do masculine | |||
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"we have had this problem all bloody nite "Well look forward to it again tomorrow, i will already, thinking about it. See you tomorrow, loving are little chats now. | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why. Of course it makes me feel uncomfortable. Mainly because i don't like kicking people when they are already down. What does it say about society when people feel they have the right to label others as 'scroungers' when they fall on hard times! Look you got the spoon out again twisting words. Who said people who fall on hard times are scroungers, i never??? I said people who defraud are system are scroungers, if your going to quote me at least get it right please
Eh? What quote in the above post is yours? (apart frm the last one where you've just jumped into). what ever post you want to call mine sweet Pea
Loved the way you said bollocks before it was do masculine "Yeah! You should hear me say twat then! That'll really get you off! | |||
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"The 'fluffy crap' referred to the nice fluffy people need help in all situations statement which ignores that many people benefit from a kick in the arse from time to time. It was followed by a statement explaining my view which I find staggering people can disagree with, but because it didn't fit well with those more hung up on the people talking rather than what's being said, was ignored - other than the response 'bollocks'. You can now play literary acrobatics to attempt to demonstrate how high minded you actually are - but that won't explain how you can disagree that most people do have pride in paying their own way in life. Those that don't - are scroungers. If that makes you feel uncomfortable maybe consider why. Of course it makes me feel uncomfortable. Mainly because i don't like kicking people when they are already down. What does it say about society when people feel they have the right to label others as 'scroungers' when they fall on hard times! Look you got the spoon out again twisting words. Who said people who fall on hard times are scroungers, i never??? I said people who defraud are system are scroungers, if your going to quote me at least get it right please
Eh? What quote in the above post is yours? (apart frm the last one where you've just jumped into). what ever post you want to call mine sweet Pea
Loved the way you said bollocks before it was do masculine
Yeah! You should hear me say twat then! That'll really get you off!"Wow gone week at the knees now, please do come back tomorrow, you certainly know how to please. | |||
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"Good morning..... Now Would ANYBODY like a nice cuppa tea N a chocolate finger? "Good morning I'll have one but be quick about I've got a taxi ordered to take me to the job centre to sign on via the off licence to get my white lightning and cigs. Chocolate finger, gypsy cream are these some sort of hideous euphemism? | |||
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"Good morning..... Now Would ANYBODY like a nice cuppa tea N a chocolate finger?
Good morning I'll have one but be quick about I've got a taxi ordered to take me to the job centre to sign on via the off licence to get my white lightning and cigs.
Chocolate finger, gypsy cream are these some sort of hideous euphemism?"Right I'll use tea bag in a cup for an express cuppa (NOT my usual standard u understand but as ya gotta taxi ordered I'll chop chop) If ya going to the food bank after jobcentre etc could u try n cadge a packet of tea as we're running lowwwww?? | |||
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"My taxes go towards many things I'm not happy with. I know if I fell on hard times, even after 32 years of working, most of it paying higher rate tax, I'd get less assistance than someone who's never worked. If I think about it, it's galling. I don't mind paying into a system I might benefit from in the future or help those genuinely in need. Sadly, the workshy benefit from that." This and a question posed by the OP in the previous Benefits thread has given me an idea | |||
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"Haven't read anything but the thing I'm most concerned about is money being robbed out of my hard earned wages (taken out as tax) being spent on bombs to drop on innocent people half way round the world "There's people in this country getting money out of your taxes to spend on bombs and intend/or have used them on innocent people in this country never mind halfway across the world. | |||
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"I've just bored myself silly reading the CNS thread. What joy "Bored me to, see people defending them self's, fir what was stated as cheats/law brakers only. It's as almost as if people, agree to law braking as long as it's only a few pound from DSS. Wake up call people, it's still a crime, and i do hope the government start to punish them on a manner they deserve. | |||
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"My taxes go towards many things I'm not happy with. I know if I fell on hard times, even after 32 years of working, most of it paying higher rate tax, I'd get less assistance than someone who's never worked. If I think about it, it's galling. I don't mind paying into a system I might benefit from in the future or help those genuinely in need. Sadly, the workshy benefit from that." Can't agree more, i don't mind helping any one in need, i do it ever day in my life. But I will not be happy giving my hard earned wages to people who do not deserve it. | |||
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"My taxes go towards many things I'm not happy with. I know if I fell on hard times, even after 32 years of working, most of it paying higher rate tax, I'd get less assistance than someone who's never worked. If I think about it, it's galling. I don't mind paying into a system I might benefit from in the future or help those genuinely in need. Sadly, the workshy benefit from that. This and a question posed by the OP in the previous Benefits thread has given me an idea "What idea would that be? Please Tell me you don't agree with the workshy cheating criminals. | |||
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"My taxes go towards many things I'm not happy with. I know if I fell on hard times, even after 32 years of working, most of it paying higher rate tax, I'd get less assistance than someone who's never worked. If I think about it, it's galling. I don't mind paying into a system I might benefit from in the future or help those genuinely in need. Sadly, the workshy benefit from that. This and a question posed by the OP in the previous Benefits thread has given me an idea
What idea would that be? Please Tell me you don't agree with the workshy cheating criminals."New thread in the forum. | |||
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"My taxes go towards many things I'm not happy with. I know if I fell on hard times, even after 32 years of working, most of it paying higher rate tax, I'd get less assistance than someone who's never worked. If I think about it, it's galling. I don't mind paying into a system I might benefit from in the future or help those genuinely in need. Sadly, the workshy benefit from that. This and a question posed by the OP in the previous Benefits thread has given me an idea
What idea would that be? Please Tell me you don't agree with the workshy cheating criminals.
New thread in the forum."I no just seen great thread, it just gets further to the point why should are government pay people to live there life, we as human being should sting for our own life. But that said keep a pot fir people who can't or genuinely need help. | |||
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