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"we can choose who we love" sort of - sometimes you fall for a person you wouldnt choose | |||
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"we can choose who we love" can we? Really? don't think I have ever chosen who to love, I love my family unconditionally but I have no choice in the matter and I love my husband the same way but it isn't a choice I couldn't choose not to love him either. | |||
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"we can choose who we love" Or fall for the one you can't have  | |||
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"we can choose who we love can we? Really? don't think I have ever chosen who to love, I love my family unconditionally but I have no choice in the matter and I love my husband the same way but it isn't a choice I couldn't choose not to love him either. " I would go along with that.  | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? " Choices made of free will, free of social conditioning and expectations...I doubt it. But within those constraints there are still areas where we may choose to an extent, where to go on holiday, what to eat to an extent what to wear. I saw an older guy yesterday in a pink velvet suit with an eye mask on and people were really staring it took real guts to make that choice and most of us would stick within what society expects us to wear I think . | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? " I always choose to read your threads as they are unfailingly interesting  | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? " We have genuine choices in most parts of our lives - it's just up to us to be wise enough to make the choice and strong enough to fight to make it happen.... | |||
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"we can choose who we love Or fall for the one you can't have "yup  | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? I always choose to read your threads as they are unfailingly interesting "Aw thanks - I am blushing - I cannot help it, I have no choice | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? We have genuine choices in most parts of our lives - it's just up to us to be wise enough to make the choice and strong enough to fight to make it happen...." So would you argue that we have those choices in many ways but sometimes choose not to see, acknowledge or realise them? | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? We have genuine choices in most parts of our lives - it's just up to us to be wise enough to make the choice and strong enough to fight to make it happen....So would you argue that we have those choices in many ways but sometimes choose not to see, acknowledge or realise them?" I'd like to choose a good life over the petty drama I see every day - people making mountains out of molehills because that's their idea of progress - but the drama chooses me lol | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? We have genuine choices in most parts of our lives - it's just up to us to be wise enough to make the choice and strong enough to fight to make it happen....So would you argue that we have those choices in many ways but sometimes choose not to see, acknowledge or realise them?" I would argue that we have very limited actual choice that is free from outside influence. Everything we do is informed by our upbringing, religion, society, class, education so that any choice we make doesn't come from our own free will but from an amalgamation of the influences on our life, we think we are making choices but they are not free choices. | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? We have genuine choices in most parts of our lives - it's just up to us to be wise enough to make the choice and strong enough to fight to make it happen....So would you argue that we have those choices in many ways but sometimes choose not to see, acknowledge or realise them? I would argue that we have very limited actual choice that is free from outside influence. Everything we do is informed by our upbringing, religion, society, class, education so that any choice we make doesn't come from our own free will but from an amalgamation of the influences on our life, we think we are making choices but they are not free choices." That was exactly what I was thinking when I put up this thread. How "free" are we really... | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society "Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions | |||
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"we have more choices than.ever before...which is really unfortunate as it s far too easy to make the wrong ones "I actually find that the more liberties and equality we have acquired over the years, it has given the powerful a handle on how to treat us all equally awfully. Racism no longer exists as a national problem, we're all as worthless as each other in David Cameron's eyes... Who wants a spare bedroom btw? | |||
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" Racism no longer exists as a national problem, we're all as worthless as each other in David Cameron's eyes... " Now that made me chuckle | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? We have genuine choices in most parts of our lives - it's just up to us to be wise enough to make the choice and strong enough to fight to make it happen....So would you argue that we have those choices in many ways but sometimes choose not to see, acknowledge or realise them? I would argue that we have very limited actual choice that is free from outside influence. Everything we do is informed by our upbringing, religion, society, class, education so that any choice we make doesn't come from our own free will but from an amalgamation of the influences on our life, we think we are making choices but they are not free choices.That was exactly what I was thinking when I put up this thread. How "free" are we really..." I don't think we're "free" in the sense you mean at all. I no longer wear bootcut jeans despite having two pairs with a lot of wear left in them, I chose to stop wearing them becasue of fashion's influence on me not because I exercised my free will to make that choice and although that is a fairly shallow example I think you can apply it to almost all areas of life. | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? " Yes all the time xx | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions"We can choose but it's very difficult to choose not to conform. I often find myself in a minority of one and it isn't comfortable. | |||
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"We can choose to eat, but we can't choose not to eat horse meat." Must confess that really made me angry. Perhaps nobody came to harm... who knows. But we should be able to choose what we eat and trust the labels. | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions
We can choose but it's very difficult to choose not to conform. I often find myself in a minority of one and it isn't comfortable. "100% agreed | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions
We can choose but it's very difficult to choose not to conform. I often find myself in a minority of one and it isn't comfortable. "I can think of groups of people that choose not to conform to what most of Society expect  | |||
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"We can choose to eat, but we can't choose not to eat horse meat.Must confess that really made me angry. Perhaps nobody came to harm... who knows. But we should be able to choose what we eat and trust the labels. "perhaps we wont know for quite some time as the horses were pumped with drugs that shouldnt really enter the human food chain .. time will tell ! | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions
We can choose but it's very difficult to choose not to conform. I often find myself in a minority of one and it isn't comfortable.
I can think of groups of people that choose not to conform to what most of Society expect "And you would , of course include...?  | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions
We can choose but it's very difficult to choose not to conform. I often find myself in a minority of one and it isn't comfortable.
I can think of groups of people that choose not to conform to what most of Society expect "That's true but they tend to conform within their group and make choices based on the group's code rather than their individual thinking. | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? " I chose a different profile pic tonight cos someone I'm talking to didn't like the 'steves face in a pussy' one. Thoughtful, eh? | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions
We can choose but it's very difficult to choose not to conform. I often find myself in a minority of one and it isn't comfortable.
I can think of groups of people that choose not to conform to what most of Society expect
That's true but they tend to conform within their group and make choices based on the group's code rather than their individual thinking."DO you think that some genuinely speak out for themselves, for what they believe in? | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions
We can choose but it's very difficult to choose not to conform. I often find myself in a minority of one and it isn't comfortable.
I can think of groups of people that choose not to conform to what most of Society expect
That's true but they tend to conform within their group and make choices based on the group's code rather than their individual thinking."very true but they have made choices to do what they do | |||
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"I would say that in any so called free society its pretty hard to opt out without establishment interference. "Interference begins the moment you are given your birth 'berth' certificate. I have been looking in to the FMOTL approach for years, but you either need a masters degree in law or be able to recite the Magna Carta off by heart  | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions
We can choose but it's very difficult to choose not to conform. I often find myself in a minority of one and it isn't comfortable.
I can think of groups of people that choose not to conform to what most of Society expect
That's true but they tend to conform within their group and make choices based on the group's code rather than their individual thinking.DO you think that some genuinely speak out for themselves, for what they believe in? "Yes Malala Yousufzai is one and I think a lot of us do in our day to day lives when we challenge casual rascism, step in when someone is being bullied things like that. But we are all influenced by external factors so that a true free thinker who makes choices based entirely on original thought is not likely to exist in my opinion | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? I chose a different profile pic tonight cos someone I'm talking to didn't like the 'steves face in a pussy' one. Thoughtful, eh? " well i personally quite liked the steve s face in a pussy one...but the white stuff was a bit weird...  | |||
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"We can choose whether we conform to the expectations of Society Absolutely - and tbh I actually quite adore those that have the genuine courage of their convictions
We can choose but it's very difficult to choose not to conform. I often find myself in a minority of one and it isn't comfortable.
I can think of groups of people that choose not to conform to what most of Society expect
That's true but they tend to conform within their group and make choices based on the group's code rather than their individual thinking.DO you think that some genuinely speak out for themselves, for what they believe in?
Yes Malala Yousufzai is one and I think a lot of us do in our day to day lives when we challenge casual rascism, step in when someone is being bullied things like that. But we are all influenced by external factors so that a true free thinker who makes choices based entirely on original thought is not likely to exist in my opinion "Yes, Malala is truly amazing - I agree | |||
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"true freedom? well that would exist when u have ur own universe to manipulate with no consequences of ur actions...much in the way psychopaths feel..they are masters of destiny and the more people are connected with each other, the more information is shared..its an easy way to become written in history, its more a lookatme/lookwhatIvedone rather than look at who I have ended I rarely remember the victims, always the perpetrator and thats the sad part I think..as in the end its served their twisted purpose" Are you saying the more poeple get connected... the less the freedom and freedom of choices? If you are then that would echo my thoughts on things like Facebook (hate it) | |||
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"the original post asked whether there were areas in life where we have genuine choices, we all seem to have become embroiled in the point of all areas rather than just some areas where we have choice ........... just saying "Thanks for bringing us back in line | |||
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"the original post asked whether there were areas in life where we have genuine choices, we all seem to have become embroiled in the point of all areas rather than just some areas where we have choice ........... just saying "one choice make many freedom grasshoppa! | |||
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"I choose my individuality" Question: Is that a genujine choice or is it not sometimes defined by simply being the opposite of what the norm is? Does that make sense what I am trying to say? | |||
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"the original post asked whether there were areas in life where we have genuine choices, we all seem to have become embroiled in the point of all areas rather than just some areas where we have choice ........... just saying
one choice make many freedom grasshoppa!"oy, one of my all time fav programs  | |||
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"true freedom? well that would exist when u have ur own universe to manipulate with no consequences of ur actions...much in the way psychopaths feel..they are masters of destiny and the more people are connected with each other, the more information is shared..its an easy way to become written in history, its more a lookatme/lookwhatIvedone rather than look at who I have ended I rarely remember the victims, always the perpetrator and thats the sad part I think..as in the end its served their twisted purposeAre you saying the more poeple get connected... the less the freedom and freedom of choices? If you are then that would echo my thoughts on things like Facebook (hate it) " You mean because people become conditioned to do the things the heard approve of (freedom socially constrained) and not neccessarily what the individual wants in order to score points, or develop a hive mind when it comes to posting habits - now that could be a dangerous thing that could be exploited in many ways. Wolf | |||
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"the original post asked whether there were areas in life where we have genuine choices, we all seem to have become embroiled in the point of all areas rather than just some areas where we have choice ........... just saying
one choice make many freedom grasshoppa!oy, one of my all time fav programs "AssO!  | |||
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"I would say that in any so called free society its pretty hard to opt out without establishment interference.
Interference begins the moment you are given your birth 'berth' certificate. I have been looking in to the FMOTL approach for years, but you either need a masters degree in law or be able to recite the Magna Carta off by heart "Its not a way of life I’d conform too (pardon the pun) , but I totally get why it would appeal to many people,,,,,, | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? " If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice "that's deep Wolf
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"grrr finding it hard to quote long messages from my phone. the example of the boot cut jeans to me is the perfect example of too much choice. if that s what people have to worry about nowadays i worry. although i do get society is putting crazy pressure on people to conform...it s also people's choice to conform..surely? or do.i live in dreamland? (quite possible!)" You prove a massive point with that. Its true that vanity shrinks our understandings of real freedom and naturally distracts us from what we naturally have a responsibility to. Small minds make for small lives and little lives leave little choice | |||
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"true freedom? well that would exist when u have ur own universe to manipulate with no consequences of ur actions...much in the way psychopaths feel..they are masters of destiny and the more people are connected with each other, the more information is shared..its an easy way to become written in history, its more a lookatme/lookwhatIvedone rather than look at who I have ended I rarely remember the victims, always the perpetrator and thats the sad part I think..as in the end its served their twisted purposeAre you saying the more poeple get connected... the less the freedom and freedom of choices? If you are then that would echo my thoughts on things like Facebook (hate it) " well the more connected we are the less need there is to witness it...rather than being horrified at horrific events now..ppl get the mobile out to take a snap...and they arent even doing it for greed...just to share it everything has its upwards and downwards effect..the internet,facebook, etc etc...but bearing in mind...its technology in its infancy and the closer we inspect how other people think we effectively change their behavior (ie big brother), then there is the other aspect of remotely watching people without their consent...it ends up spiraling inwards and outwards to the extremes if (more a when in my opinion)it gets to a point where we can share or steal memories dreams..u'll see the beauty of things..and also the horrors oops Ive went of track...done by choice..so up urs | |||
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"grrr finding it hard to quote long messages from my phone. the example of the boot cut jeans to me is the perfect example of too much choice. if that s what people have to worry about nowadays i worry. although i do get society is putting crazy pressure on people to conform...it s also people's choice to conform..surely? or do.i live in dreamland? (quite possible!) You prove a massive point with that. Its true that vanity shrinks our understandings of real freedom and naturally distracts us from what we naturally have a responsibility to. Small minds make for small lives and little lives leave little choice" Thumbs up to you both...personally while I like dressing up, looking ok and wearing a little make up - I dont actually follow fashion as such. I have a kind of classic style and feel more comfy with that. | |||
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"grrr finding it hard to quote long messages from my phone. the example of the boot cut jeans to me is the perfect example of too much choice. if that s what people have to worry about nowadays i worry. although i do get society is putting crazy pressure on people to conform...it s also people's choice to conform..surely? or do.i live in dreamland? (quite possible!)" I used the example of boot cut jeans to illustrate how choices are influenced, I personally don't "worry" about whether my jeans are boot cut or straight I have many more important things to concern me | |||
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"true freedom? well that would exist when u have ur own universe to manipulate with no consequences of ur actions...much in the way psychopaths feel..they are masters of destiny and the more people are connected with each other, the more information is shared..its an easy way to become written in history, its more a lookatme/lookwhatIvedone rather than look at who I have ended I rarely remember the victims, always the perpetrator and thats the sad part I think..as in the end its served their twisted purposeAre you saying the more poeple get connected... the less the freedom and freedom of choices? If you are then that would echo my thoughts on things like Facebook (hate it) well the more connected we are the less need there is to witness it...rather than being horrified at horrific events now..ppl get the mobile out to take a snap...and they arent even doing it for greed...just to share it everything has its upwards and downwards effect..the internet,facebook, etc etc...but bearing in mind...its technology in its infancy and the closer we inspect how other people think we effectively change their behavior (ie big brother), then there is the other aspect of remotely watching people without their consent...it ends up spiraling inwards and outwards to the extremes if (more a when in my opinion)it gets to a point where we can share or steal memories dreams..u'll see the beauty of things..and also the horrors oops Ive went of track...done by choice..so up urs" Hey stroppy -lol- I was only asking a question... and tbh that kind of world will not be for me. I have a choice of not having facebook and twitter and whatever lese accounts and I can even choose to disconnect from the net if it becomes ever more invasive? | |||
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"grrr finding it hard to quote long messages from my phone. the example of the boot cut jeans to me is the perfect example of too much choice. if that s what people have to worry about nowadays i worry. although i do get society is putting crazy pressure on people to conform...it s also people's choice to conform..surely? or do.i live in dreamland? (quite possible!) I used the example of boot cut jeans to illustrate how choices are influenced, I personally don't "worry" about whether my jeans are boot cut or straight I have many more important things to concern me "I took your comment as just one example of choice vs non choice | |||
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"true freedom? well that would exist when u have ur own universe to manipulate with no consequences of ur actions...much in the way psychopaths feel..they are masters of destiny and the more people are connected with each other, the more information is shared..its an easy way to become written in history, its more a lookatme/lookwhatIvedone rather than look at who I have ended I rarely remember the victims, always the perpetrator and thats the sad part I think..as in the end its served their twisted purposeAre you saying the more poeple get connected... the less the freedom and freedom of choices? If you are then that would echo my thoughts on things like Facebook (hate it) well the more connected we are the less need there is to witness it...rather than being horrified at horrific events now..ppl get the mobile out to take a snap...and they arent even doing it for greed...just to share it everything has its upwards and downwards effect..the internet,facebook, etc etc...but bearing in mind...its technology in its infancy and the closer we inspect how other people think we effectively change their behavior (ie big brother), then there is the other aspect of remotely watching people without their consent...it ends up spiraling inwards and outwards to the extremes if (more a when in my opinion)it gets to a point where we can share or steal memories dreams..u'll see the beauty of things..and also the horrors oops Ive went of track...done by choice..so up ursHey stroppy -lol- I was only asking a question... and tbh that kind of world will not be for me. I have a choice of not having facebook and twitter and whatever lese accounts and I can even choose to disconnect from the net if it becomes ever more invasive? "u can say that when we're floating head to head in simpsons style head jars x | |||
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" u can say that when we're floating head to head in simpsons style head jars x" I can think of nothing sexier than that xx | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? " Depends on what you would call a genuine choice. I make choices about many different things, but others may say I am being swayed by society... or (like another quote further up) that I am choosing to rebel against conformity. | |||
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"It's the price of freedom in the western world , we open the door an walk in , and there it is before my eyes , rows and rows of CHOCOLATE SWEETS ! Mars bars, fudge, toffee crisp , marathon, chocolate covered peanuts, lion bars, milky way, caramel bars, curly wurlys ooooooo the choice is endless "Love it.... although some would argue we don t have a choice anymore the moment our eyes see chocolate as we start to salivate...;-) | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? Depends on what you would call a genuine choice. I make choices about many different things, but others may say I am being swayed by society... or (like another quote further up) that I am choosing to rebel against conformity. " I was kind of curious whether people generally felt that we have choices... in whatever way. | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? Depends on what you would call a genuine choice. I make choices about many different things, but others may say I am being swayed by society... or (like another quote further up) that I am choosing to rebel against conformity. I was kind of curious whether people generally felt that we have choices... in whatever way. "Then yes, I do.
I think some people would say that they don't have choices... often the people that don't take responsibility for their own lives. | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? Depends on what you would call a genuine choice. I make choices about many different things, but others may say I am being swayed by society... or (like another quote further up) that I am choosing to rebel against conformity. I was kind of curious whether people generally felt that we have choices... in whatever way.
Then yes, I do.
I think some people would say that they don't have choices... often the people that don't take responsibility for their own lives. "That is such a good point - sometimes it is just easier to think that one does not have a choice rather than taking positive action. It is probably a human trait to do that... | |||
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"That is such a good point - sometimes it is just easier to think that one does not have a choice rather than taking positive action. It is probably a human trait to do that... "That may be a by-product of being taught to conform since birth. When your parents stop telling you what not to do, you carry on yourself. When my dad died I started to bully myself in his absence and couldn't stop even though i was aware of it. Some people would sooner keep themselves in check than be seen being dragged to the grown up naughty step?! Goddamn love being a rebel after school hours me lol | |||
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"That is such a good point - sometimes it is just easier to think that one does not have a choice rather than taking positive action. It is probably a human trait to do that...
That may be a by-product of being taught to conform since birth. When your parents stop telling you what not to do, you carry on yourself. When my dad died I started to bully myself in his absence and couldn't stop even though i was aware of it. Some people would sooner keep themselves in check than be seen being dragged to the grown up naughty step?! Goddamn love being a rebel after school hours me lol"You sound rebellious but for me rebellious means intelligent and able to question and challenge so for me it is a quality | |||
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"That is such a good point - sometimes it is just easier to think that one does not have a choice rather than taking positive action. It is probably a human trait to do that...
That may be a by-product of being taught to conform since birth. When your parents stop telling you what not to do, you carry on yourself. When my dad died I started to bully myself in his absence and couldn't stop even though i was aware of it. Some people would sooner keep themselves in check than be seen being dragged to the grown up naughty step?! Goddamn love being a rebel after school hours me lol
You sound rebellious but for me rebellious means intelligent and able to question and challenge so for me it is a quality "Aww shucks ma'am haha they actually say nowadays that those who rebel and question authority are better off in mind and smarter than those that do as they're told and therefore dont think for themselves...
WELL NO SHIT!!! lol I could have told them that a long time ago | |||
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"There are 3 things you are slave to in this era. 1.) Your own decisiions and their outcomes. Non-committment to what you do not care for is frowned upon by society, despite the fact it should not be able to dictate the outcome of your choices, but often does. " As long as i m legal they can frown away. " 2.) The government says that you pay taxes or do not have the right to freedom despite the fact that slavery to tax is not freedom. If you dont work enough to pay tax, you dont work enough to afford to live. " hate to hear some people complain how they just can t afford to live and they have to work more...yet they live in nice houses, drive fancy cars and have nice hols. people should learn to live within their means... taxes though are a necessary evil in developed countries...how else are the roads going to ve built and rubbish collected? " 3.) The media distracts you and keeps you rooted to the spot and always craving the new products and gadgets so you may seem happy but are always in debt and wanting more more more... " i have a very easy way to deal with that...never read the papers or mags nor watch the news..i m.perfectly aware how bad things are in.this world without being told everyday and i have no idea how inadequate my fashion sense or way of life might be. and frankly i don t feel too bad for it 
the only people i.feel real.bad for is parents. unfortunately kids will be kids and the playground pressure can t be helped. they have to conform.to some extent so.their kids fit in...
" If you can cheat at least two of these systems (and yes I will screw this country over at any clever opportunity for a better life), then you are freer than probably 2 thirds of the rest of the developed world " | |||
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"I mean are there still areas in life where we have genuine choices? " Yes you can - but sometimes you are better off with a Lucky Dip... | |||
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