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75% of Doctors who are struck off are Trained abroad

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Is this such a shock.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire

whats the source?

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By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman
over a year ago

evesham

Is tis a bonafide fact? What was the source?

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By *iewMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Angus & Findhorn

just goes to show how great our NHS based medical training is

if true

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

Statistics released by the GMC.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Over what period? Seems a very succinct point to take from what I assume is a large report.

Tried to get the report from the GMC but the download link is to a now closed survey.

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago


"Over what period? Seems a very succinct point to take from what I assume is a large report.

Tried to get the report from the GMC but the download link is to a now closed survey."

Does that really matter...

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By *exki11enWoman
over a year ago

Bristol


"Over what period? Seems a very succinct point to take from what I assume is a large report.

Tried to get the report from the GMC but the download link is to a now closed survey.

Does that really matter..."

Yes since you're making such a sweeping generalisation which is quite frankly borderline Xenophobic!

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow


"Is this such a shock."

I suppose it depends on the %age of doctors in the UK who were trained abroad.

IF, a big if, it's 75%, then 75% being struck off is about what you'd expect.

Without that info we've no way of knowing whether its a shock or not.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

More than 12 months ago Andrew Lansley, the-then health minister, said the Medical Act would be amended so that doctors must speak good English to practise in Britain. Did this happen?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

According to a tweet by James Ball who crunches numbers and assesses policy for the Guardian, so not exactly a Richard Littlejohn type: "36% of docs were trained abroad. Means foreign-trained docs roughly 4 times more likely to be struck off."

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By *nnyMan
over a year ago

Glasgow


"More than 12 months ago Andrew Lansley, the-then health minister, said the Medical Act would be amended so that doctors must speak good English to practise in Britain. Did this happen?"

If it was a Lansley promise it's unlikely to have happened. His track record on promises kept is poor.

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By *r and mrs sanddancerCouple
over a year ago

BOLDON COLLIERY

A friend of mine when admitted to maternity was asked if she had any other children

she told the doc that she had 2 adopted children

to be asked how long the labour was for them she demanded another doc and refused to have him look at her.

so this does not surprise me at all

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Actually I think that the figure is 63%, so less than 2 out of 3, rather than the 3 out of 4 that the OP implied.

Does anybody know the actual numbers involved rather than percentages?

And we should probably all remember that without immigrant workers there would be no health service in this country.

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead


"Is this such a shock."

love it.. its one of those daily mail "way to skew a statistic...

75% of those struck off were trained abroad...

number of people struck off last year in total... 39...

so you are talking about 29 doctors ......

so anyone know the amount of foreign trained doctors in the NHS?

in the same article there is these two paragraphs...

"According to the figures, the average number of Indian doctors in the UK since 2008 stood at 25,989, with 123 of those struck off or suspended.

The second worst country was Egypt, which 33 of its 2,957 doctors struck off or suspended in the same period, while Nigeria closely followed with 33 of its 3,564 doctors struck off or suspended."

so by my maths... 189 doctors in a grand total of 32,510 doctors.. and remember that are the worst offenders...

which is 0.006% of all foreign doctors...

but that wouldn't make headlines.....

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By *rightloonMan
over a year ago

Stafford

Firstly; "Doctoring" is part medicine and part how you handle people. We all make mistakes and so do doctors. Most of these are thankfully minor but if you handle them badly since you do not know the culture then this will probably have a snowball effect and tend to come out worse.

Secondly; Did you ever question why some of them left their previous country of residence? Perhaps they had to leave because of some slight malpractice?

I knew an African Gynecologist (expired now.. bless is soul) and he had to country hop a few times to cool off the heat.

I don't think he ever took advantage but this line of work does require absolute professionalism at all times (no...really).

He also spent a very lucrative spell in the Middle East repairing Arabic women's hymens before Marriage: I'm sure there's a book in that story somewhere...

Having said the above.... Many overseas trained doctors are extremely good at what they do. I would cite the Indians as a particular example and they have a superb medical system that is cost effective and broad in range.

The worst doctor I have ever experienced happened to be Scottish. His attempt at removing some stitches from my scrotum as a kid with a blunt pair of scissors did not endear me to him one bit.......

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

now that the OP's statistics have been shown in context, wonder if the OP would like to say anything?

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By *ovelybumCouple
over a year ago

Tunbridge Wells


"Actually I think that the figure is 63%, so less than 2 out of 3, rather than the 3 out of 4 that the OP implied.

Does anybody know the actual numbers involved rather than percentages?

And we should probably all remember that without immigrant workers there would be no health service in this country."

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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago

Kidderminster+ surrounding areas.


"Actually I think that the figure is 63%, so less than 2 out of 3, rather than the 3 out of 4 that the OP implied.

Does anybody know the actual numbers involved rather than percentages?

And we should probably all remember that without immigrant workers there would be no health service in this country. "

but surely they also make up the majority of patients?.

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By *amschwingerzCouple
over a year ago

West


"Is this such a shock."

Nope..not surprised, how many times do you pick up the papers and find a doctor has been stuck off who's name you can barely pronouce?..

Nothing to do with racism, or xenophobia..its reality.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Is this such a shock.

love it.. its one of those daily mail "way to skew a statistic...

75% of those struck off were trained abroad...

number of people struck off last year in total... 39...

so you are talking about 29 doctors ......

so anyone know the amount of foreign trained doctors in the NHS?

in the same article there is these two paragraphs...

"According to the figures, the average number of Indian doctors in the UK since 2008 stood at 25,989, with 123 of those struck off or suspended.

The second worst country was Egypt, which 33 of its 2,957 doctors struck off or suspended in the same period, while Nigeria closely followed with 33 of its 3,564 doctors struck off or suspended."

so by my maths... 189 doctors in a grand total of 32,510 doctors.. and remember that are the worst offenders...

which is 0.006% of all foreign doctors...

but that wouldn't make headlines.....

"

What a load of nonsense!!!

I'd hardly call it skewing a stat if the figures say that 75% of the doctors who were struck off last year were foreign! As you have said quite simply that means 29 of the 39 doctors struck off were non UK.

I would call it skewing stats when you start bringing the total amount of foreign doctors in the country into play!

In order to represent those numbers fairly you need to include the figure for the amount of UK docs struck off as a percentage of total UK doctors, then compare the 2.

I have a feeling they would be a massive correlative difference between the two numbers

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple
over a year ago

in Lancashire


"Actually I think that the figure is 63%, so less than 2 out of 3, rather than the 3 out of 4 that the OP implied.

Does anybody know the actual numbers involved rather than percentages?

And we should probably all remember that without immigrant workers there would be no health service in this country.

but surely they also make up the majority of patients?. "

are you saying that immigrants now make up the majority within the UK?

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By *phroditeWoman
over a year ago

(She/ her) in Sensualityland

I find it really difficult to believe that a doctor's nationality would havea correlation with his professional performance. I do concede that insufficient linguistic competence MAY lead to a greater risk in somebody's professional failure as communication between doctor and patient is one of the key ingredients in successful healing.

Stats can prove and disprove just about anything - I for one have had nothing but positive experience in the NHS, whether it was from native British or foreign staff.

And who is to say that the training in other countries is inferior? Failure as a professional may be down to factors outside the actual med school.

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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago

Kidderminster+ surrounding areas.


"Actually I think that the figure is 63%, so less than 2 out of 3, rather than the 3 out of 4 that the OP implied.

Does anybody know the actual numbers involved rather than percentages?

And we should probably all remember that without immigrant workers there would be no health service in this country.

but surely they also make up the majority of patients?.

are you saying that immigrants now make up the majority within the UK?"

am saying that in the recent visits to the maternity wards YES!,the immigrants did outnumber.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I find it really difficult to believe that a doctor's nationality would havea correlation with his professional performance. I do concede that insufficient linguistic competence MAY lead to a greater risk in somebody's professional failure as communication between doctor and patient is one of the key ingredients in successful healing.

Stats can prove and disprove just about anything - I for one have had nothing but positive experience in the NHS, whether it was from native British or foreign staff.

And who is to say that the training in other countries is inferior? Failure as a professional may be down to factors outside the actual med school. "

This has nothing to do with the thread. Nobody said anything about correlations between Nationality and performance. The OP stated that 75% of struck off doctors were foreign. Of the 39 doctors who were struck off in the UK last year, 29 were foreign. These are the facts and it has nothing to do with any doctors nationality,outside factors, other countrys' med school or skewing stats.

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By *phroditeWoman
over a year ago

(She/ her) in Sensualityland


"I find it really difficult to believe that a doctor's nationality would havea correlation with his professional performance. I do concede that insufficient linguistic competence MAY lead to a greater risk in somebody's professional failure as communication between doctor and patient is one of the key ingredients in successful healing.

Stats can prove and disprove just about anything - I for one have had nothing but positive experience in the NHS, whether it was from native British or foreign staff.

And who is to say that the training in other countries is inferior? Failure as a professional may be down to factors outside the actual med school.

This has nothing to do with the thread. Nobody said anything about correlations between Nationality and performance. The OP stated that 75% of struck off doctors were foreign. Of the 39 doctors who were struck off in the UK last year, 29 were foreign. These are the facts and it has nothing to do with any doctors nationality,outside factors, other countrys' med school or skewing stats. "

quote "According to the figures, the average number of Indian doctors in the UK since 2008 stood at 25,989, with 123 of those struck off or suspended.

The second worst country was Egypt, which 33 of its 2,957 doctors struck off or suspended in the same period, while Nigeria closely followed with 33 of its 3,564 doctors struck off or suspended."

Just one example where a correlation was made...(not by the poster incidentally)

Correct me if I am wrong... being"foreign" in my book means having a nationality differnet from that of the host nation, in this case British, would not you agree?

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