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is it time to accept our beloved NHS has flatlined?

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By (user no longer on site) OP   
over a year ago

The number of patients paying for private treatment in the UK has risen by 39 per cent over the past two years - patients are bypassing their own GP completely to beat lengthy waits for treatment. Ambulances stacked outside EDs and patients receiving treatment in hospital corridors, as well as staff burnout and rates of pay failing to keep up with inflation.

I feel that we’re ominously approaching a two tier health system. Is it time to accept that the NHS has collapsed?

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By *idnight RamblerMan
over a year ago

Pershore

It's certainly time to fundamentally rethink our healthcare system for the 21st century. In it's present form, the NHS isn't fit for purpose and provides poor value for money. Provided we adhere to the principle of 'free at the point of need' I see no reason why provision cannot be broken down into smaller, efficient units. So what if some parts of healthcare are private? Who do we think develops drugs, designs scanners, manufactures dressings? Not the NHS!

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By *lephantisMan
over a year ago

Oxford

Private provision is the 3rd most important REASON for the collapse in the NHS (no proper social care funding and outright lack of funding are more important). Hundreds of millions, soon billions, going to private executive pay and shareholders via companies run by a friend of someone in the Cabinet.

But, as you can see in this thread already, the intent is clear, as with trains, Royal Mail,etc. Underfund, run it down, watch it collapse, say it's no longer viable, sell it off cheap. It's the oldest trick in the book.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Been having this discussion quite a bit lately and YES, the NHS is beyond resuscitation, it's kaput!

I would love to think that 'free at the point of care' will continue but don't think it will be financially possible.

There are other financial health models that could be used eg, the German model or how the French do it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Private provision is the 3rd most important REASON for the collapse in the NHS (no proper social care funding and outright lack of funding are more important). Hundreds of millions, soon billions, going to private executive pay and shareholders via companies run by a friend of someone in the Cabinet.

But, as you can see in this thread already, the intent is clear, as with trains, Royal Mail,etc. Underfund, run it down, watch it collapse, say it's no longer viable, sell it off cheap. It's the oldest trick in the book."

I wholeheartedly agree.

It's been a slow decline of basic services in this country, rail, water just about anything that could be sold was.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's certainly time to fundamentally rethink our healthcare system for the 21st century. In it's present form, the NHS isn't fit for purpose and provides poor value for money. Provided we adhere to the principle of 'free at the point of need' I see no reason why provision cannot be broken down into smaller, efficient units. So what if some parts of healthcare are private? Who do we think develops drugs, designs scanners, manufactures dressings? Not the NHS!"

Spot on

The trouble is the NHS is considered a sacred cow and to criticise it’s fundamental concept is a heresy.

Medicine has advanced so much since the inception of the NHS it’s been impossible for the service to keep pace with the advances and demand increases.

I can think of a prime example in my family. In 1966 my grandfather suffered a heart attack at 6am. The GP came out, diagnosed a heart attack and told him to rest in bed. 11 hours later he was dead. Nowadays he would have been rushed into hospital, had stents fitted and, in all probability, would have had another 20 years of life.

It’s a similar story with most illnesses. The trouble is these treatments have a financial cost and the current funding method does not work.

Of course that’s not all that’s wrong with the system, the care system is broken and I wonder how much of that is down to the breakdown of family support groups.

I don’t know what the answers are and if any one person says they do know the answer they are deluding themselves.

What is required is a Royal Commission to look at the future of health and social care provision in this country, a root and branch review ….. the question is will any political party have the balls to do it?

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By *lephantisMan
over a year ago

Oxford

All these 'fundamental issues' were true back in 2010, when the NHS was the most efficient healthcare system in the world. Since then, 1 party has been in power, funding is massively down, and life exlectancy is dropping for the first time since the 19th century.

Restore the NATIONAL Health Service, stop private money stealing our taxes, get rid of ridiculous internal markets, fund it at inflation+4% as it was from 2000-2009, train and bring in enough staff, and it will turn round.

Oh - and fund councils properly, or better yet link social and health funding, so the 33% of beds blocked by frail but OK old people who need a home, not a hospital,can be freed. Because of this ONE issue, the NHS is running at only 66% effective capacity.

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By *ellhungvweMan
over a year ago

Cheltenham

I think the way we approach health and care needs to be fundamentally rethought in this country. It is clear the current system doesn’t work. The NHS is the end of the line for many other issues and those need to be received first - the complete failure of the social care system is having a massive knock on effect on the provision of health services and solving that problem will have a huge benefit.

I also think that we need to focus on preventative health - if we can get people to become fitter and more active ( basic things like walking more will have a big impact for many) then we also reduce the need for health services.

Health provision needs to be free at the point of contact but we need to focus on the end goals - better health.

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By *ust PeachyWoman
over a year ago

Prestonish


"The number of patients paying for private treatment in the UK has risen by 39 per cent over the past two years - patients are bypassing their own GP completely to beat lengthy waits for treatment. Ambulances stacked outside EDs and patients receiving treatment in hospital corridors, as well as staff burnout and rates of pay failing to keep up with inflation.

I feel that we’re ominously approaching a two tier health system. Is it time to accept that the NHS has collapsed?

"

Tbh I’m getting the impression that this is a deliberate act (to some extent) on the part of the tories.

I think that’s over simplifying to some extent though - as well as being deliberately allowed to implode the NHS is overburdened with many millions of us who have illness due to lifestyle choices - obesity and diabetes, alcohol, cigarettes, drugs etc etc. Added to that a rapidly increasing number of mental health patients.

Put simply - no NHS in its current form can cope with that - and attempts to encourage us to take our health into our own hands and improve our own health appear to be failing.

Also - if the rich all pay for private care - as is now happening - then a two tier system is inevitable.

In a decade or so we’ll find that the mortality rates between the working classes and the wealthy have widened considerably - though id be surprised if anything is done about it.

By then we’ll have accepted that the poor among us have a right to ‘less’ in all aspects of life.

I’m saying that as one of those who can’t afford private health care, education etc btw.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's certainly time to fundamentally rethink our healthcare system for the 21st century. In it's present form, the NHS isn't fit for purpose and provides poor value for money. Provided we adhere to the principle of 'free at the point of need' I see no reason why provision cannot be broken down into smaller, efficient units. So what if some parts of healthcare are private? Who do we think develops drugs, designs scanners, manufactures dressings? Not the NHS!"

It's a broken model that gets as much public funding as much more efficient health services. The difference in Germany and France is that there is much more private investment and involvement.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

100%. The NHS has collapsed even now, too many vacancies, not enough staff, ambulance waiting time too much, people dying, unsafe conditions, waiting lists of years etc or just told to go private for certain treatments/diagnosis. It's just waiting on the official part to announce its fucked.

As someone above said,I believe this is the tories idea all along. Privatise it. Sell it off. But could be wrong...

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By *inaTitzTV/TS
over a year ago

Titz Towers, North Notts

This is all due to the tories making a political decision/

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"All these 'fundamental issues' were true back in 2010, when the NHS was the most efficient healthcare system in the world. Since then, 1 party has been in power, funding is massively down, and life exlectancy is dropping for the first time since the 19th century.

Restore the NATIONAL Health Service, stop private money stealing our taxes, get rid of ridiculous internal markets, fund it at inflation+4% as it was from 2000-2009, train and bring in enough staff, and it will turn round.

Oh - and fund councils properly, or better yet link social and health funding, so the 33% of beds blocked by frail but OK old people who need a home, not a hospital,can be freed. Because of this ONE issue, the NHS is running at only 66% effective capacity."

Nail. Head.

All of those issues could be solved. The problem is that it would take the desire to do so and the recognition that it won't make anyone any money.

Hence in the current environment, given the sitting government and their aims, it simply won't happen. If there's no profit to be made there's no reason for them to act.

A

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's been their plan all along. They have slowly been making the NHS unrecoverable so they can justify privatisation when the time comes. A private healthcare system is coming and the gap between the rich and the poor will become even more apparent.

This has nothing to do with immigration, people abusing the system or whatever narrative they are selling these days. It's broken and there's only one party to blame.

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

If this was happening in a south American country people would be claiming corruption in the government.

Obviously that would never happen in this so called civilised country??

#old boys network

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex


"If this was happening in a south American country people would be claiming corruption in the government.

Obviously that would never happen in this so called civilised country??

#old boys network "

Took the words out of my mouth. Are the govt still refusing to talk to anyone about it?

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By *arcus88Man
over a year ago

East London

TLDR

The answer is simply that the Tory’s have consciously underfunded it for the benefit of private interests

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By *ny1localMan
over a year ago

READING


"100%. The NHS has collapsed even now, too many vacancies, not enough staff, ambulance waiting time too much, people dying, unsafe conditions, waiting lists of years etc or just told to go private for certain treatments/diagnosis. It's just waiting on the official part to announce its fucked.

As someone above said,I believe this is the tories idea all along. Privatise it. Sell it off. But could be wrong..."
I'd love to see some investigative journalism looking at who has got invested interest within the government of private healthcare. I can't but feel that the NHS is being deliberately destroyed, I've obviously no proof, but the situation stinks of corruption.

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"TLDR

The answer is simply that the Tory’s have consciously underfunded it for the benefit of private interests "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Simple solution......who has the best health care model in the world? Then just copy it

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"Simple solution......who has the best health care model in the world? Then just copy it "

A simpler solution would be to adequately fund the one we’ve got, which is one of the best in the world.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Often we have presented the false dichotomy of NHS v US approach.

Clearly thats not the case.

We need to decide what is important to us (eg free at point of care) and work around that. Imo,that's the sacred cow for most and the fear is any movements away from the NHS is towards a pay as you use approach.

I'd also say we need to stop thinking of the NHS as being just GPs and hospitals. It's social care. And education.

We may also need to make some hard decisions what comes under "free" and if there is any personal responsibility that needs to be taken on if we have a cross subsidy approach.

Although I'm not sure that there is a correction between approach to health services and many morbidity issues. Otherwise the US would be super healthy !!

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"100%. The NHS has collapsed even now, too many vacancies, not enough staff, ambulance waiting time too much, people dying, unsafe conditions, waiting lists of years etc or just told to go private for certain treatments/diagnosis. It's just waiting on the official part to announce its fucked.

As someone above said,I believe this is the tories idea all along. Privatise it. Sell it off. But could be wrong...I'd love to see some investigative journalism looking at who has got invested interest within the government of private healthcare. I can't but feel that the NHS is being deliberately destroyed, I've obviously no proof, but the situation stinks of corruption. "

There's plenty of investigative journalism going on.

A fair fee links in this article. Most of what's happening isn't even being attempted to be hidden.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/may/03/government-pandemic-privatise-nhs-by-stealth

A

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By *teveanddebsCouple
over a year ago

Norwich


"This is all due to the tories making a political decision/"

Yeah cos the various PPI schemes under Labour had nothing to do with it.

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne

Very simple: if you earn over £40k you have to pay full whack as a private patient! No ifs or buts! If you don’t earn anything but have a house worth more than £500k you are forced to sell it in order to fund your care.

The NHS should only provide free care for people who will actually struggle to pay.

Otherwise, pay!

Then we should be able to pay doctors and nurses properly. Every doctor in the country should be on a minimum salary of £500k and every nurse on a minimum salary of £200k.

Also put up taxes to screw more money out of the private sector! It’s far too rich!

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By *host63Man
over a year ago

Bedfont Feltham


"It's certainly time to fundamentally rethink our healthcare system for the 21st century. In it's present form, the NHS isn't fit for purpose and provides poor value for money. Provided we adhere to the principle of 'free at the point of need' I see no reason why provision cannot be broken down into smaller, efficient units. So what if some parts of healthcare are private? Who do we think develops drugs, designs scanners, manufactures dressings? Not the NHS!"

It provides poor value for money because tories have financially and on staffing run it into the ground so people are forced to private healthcare healthcare and the mps from the Conservatives party can see an increase in shares.

You do know that in the USA health febt are the biggest course of bankruptcy

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"This is all due to the tories making a political decision/

Yeah cos the various PPI schemes under Labour had nothing to do with it."

I assume you mean PFI, not PPI as that relates to bank loans?

Yep. They weren't a good idea. But the cost of them (they're 25 year contracts) is dwarfed by Tory spending on PPE/track & trace alone, ignoring any other private initiatives the current government has introduced.

A

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"This is all due to the tories making a political decision/

Yeah cos the various PPI schemes under Labour had nothing to do with it."

They did have something to do with it - but critical underfunding under the Tories since 2010 is the key issue that has put the NHS in the state it is today. PFI is insignificant by comparison.

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By *entleman of FortuneMan
over a year ago

Hull

It's not hard really,lots started going into private companies, middle manages that do basically nothing. We already fund it,but fund it properly, no private company give value of public, there is an extra layer of people and shareholders that need paying and only same amount of money. And if it's like railways, telecom, steel, energy - we still pay but get fleeced by the provider, so we pay through tax and bills, so very poor value for us. We have already built everything, have structure in place, anyone can run any business if it's already fully functional.

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham


"Been having this discussion quite a bit lately and YES, the NHS is beyond resuscitation, it's kaput!

I would love to think that 'free at the point of care' will continue but don't think it will be financially possible.

There are other financial health models that could be used eg, the German model or how the French do it.

"

Or like here in Dubai where employers must provide it to all staff and unlike the uk where I’d they do you get penalised for not using the NHS by paying £5,000 a year extra tax

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have nothing bad to say about my private healthcare. Its been phenomenal so far.

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By *ny1localMan
over a year ago

READING


"100%. The NHS has collapsed even now, too many vacancies, not enough staff, ambulance waiting time too much, people dying, unsafe conditions, waiting lists of years etc or just told to go private for certain treatments/diagnosis. It's just waiting on the official part to announce its fucked.

As someone above said,I believe this is the tories idea all along. Privatise it. Sell it off. But could be wrong...I'd love to see some investigative journalism looking at who has got invested interest within the government of private healthcare. I can't but feel that the NHS is being deliberately destroyed, I've obviously no proof, but the situation stinks of corruption.

There's plenty of investigative journalism going on.

A fair fee links in this article. Most of what's happening isn't even being attempted to be hidden.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/may/03/government-pandemic-privatise-nhs-by-stealth

A"
oh please not the guardian, they're as bad as all the others, some independent investigators would be good.

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham


"It's not hard really,lots started going into private companies, middle manages that do basically nothing. We already fund it,but fund it properly, no private company give value of public, there is an extra layer of people and shareholders that need paying and only same amount of money. And if it's like railways, telecom, steel, energy - we still pay but get fleeced by the provider, so we pay through tax and bills, so very poor value for us. We have already built everything, have structure in place, anyone can run any business if it's already fully functional."

You don’t really understand how private healthcare works. It can’t use the existing structures , staff & systems, in order to work it has to be completely redesigned to very high quality , service oriented , customer focussed and competitive with other providers that’s how you create high demand then people will choose to prioritise and pay for health just like no one bats and eyelid paying £4 for a coffee now.

Currently in the uk , health is like some free commodity - look around - people don’t value great health as long as it works and you don’t die and can’t get an appointment in a few weeks people are generally happy at not having to pay anything for it

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've been thinking about paying a monthly fee for private health care for our household. But don't know anything about it or where to start. Google is my friend I guess

Mrs C

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Very simple: if you earn over £40k you have to pay full whack as a private patient! No ifs or buts! If you don’t earn anything but have a house worth more than £500k you are forced to sell it in order to fund your care.

The NHS should only provide free care for people who will actually struggle to pay.

Otherwise, pay!

Then we should be able to pay doctors and nurses properly. Every doctor in the country should be on a minimum salary of £500k and every nurse on a minimum salary of £200k.

Also put up taxes to screw more money out of the private sector! It’s far too rich!

"
poes law here ... I can tell if you are serious.

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By *acey_RedWoman
over a year ago

Liverpool

I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money.

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. "

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. "

Exactly! It seems we're sitting back and fiddling while Rome burns

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. "
What is wrong with people wanting to manage their own healthcare instead of goverment ?

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"100%. The NHS has collapsed even now, too many vacancies, not enough staff, ambulance waiting time too much, people dying, unsafe conditions, waiting lists of years etc or just told to go private for certain treatments/diagnosis. It's just waiting on the official part to announce its fucked.

As someone above said,I believe this is the tories idea all along. Privatise it. Sell it off. But could be wrong...I'd love to see some investigative journalism looking at who has got invested interest within the government of private healthcare. I can't but feel that the NHS is being deliberately destroyed, I've obviously no proof, but the situation stinks of corruption.

There's plenty of investigative journalism going on.

A fair fee links in this article. Most of what's happening isn't even being attempted to be hidden.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/may/03/government-pandemic-privatise-nhs-by-stealth

Aoh please not the guardian, they're as bad as all the others, some independent investigators would be good. "

Did you look at the article?

It references several pieces.

If the same article was posted in the daily fail would you think it more credible?

It was reposted on several outlets including Reuters - I just picked that link.because it was behind a paywall to view.

But hey. If the fact its a guardian piece puts you off, rather than the information it provides then that's on you I'm afraid.

A

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

We should ask Cuba for advice

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. "

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By *acey_RedWoman
over a year ago

Liverpool


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. What is wrong with people wanting to manage their own healthcare instead of goverment ? "

People will never "manage their own healthcare". You're either in the hands of the government or private businesses.

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By *olymalelincsMan
over a year ago

nr southend


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. "

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By *batMan
over a year ago

Alicante, Spain. (Sometimes in Wales)

It's flatlining, ......

because the government is choking it.

Gbat

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. What is wrong with people wanting to manage their own healthcare instead of goverment ?

People will never "manage their own healthcare". You're either in the hands of the government or private businesses. "
yes you can you choose the level you want according to your needs. Have no issues with my private healthcare. Its has a HSA dental eye. Short term long term disability. To me its comparable to the NHS.Yes I have copays but my salary is 4 times higher compared to a person with the same profession there. That alone offsets the costs. If you plan correctly.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The number of patients paying for private treatment in the UK has risen by 39 per cent over the past two years -

patients are bypassing their own GP completely to beat lengthy waits for treatment.

Ambulances stacked outside EDs and patients receiving treatment in hospital corridors, as well as staff burnout and rates of pay failing to keep up with inflation.

I feel that we’re ominously approaching a two tier health system. Is it time to accept that the NHS has collapsed?

"

You stated people are bypassing their own GP's to beat lengthily waits !!

If you wish to go Private, You must first get a referral from your own GP

You approach your own GP doctor with your condition and if you want to go private you must first get a referral from your own NHS doctor. This is how it works.

I have had private medical cover for past 30 years and had various treatments and private operations but you still have to be referred by your nhs doctor.

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By *acey_RedWoman
over a year ago

Liverpool


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. What is wrong with people wanting to manage their own healthcare instead of goverment ?

People will never "manage their own healthcare". You're either in the hands of the government or private businesses. yes you can you choose the level you want according to your needs. Have no issues with my private healthcare. Its has a HSA dental eye. Short term long term disability. To me its comparable to the NHS.Yes I have copays but my salary is 4 times higher compared to a person with the same profession there. That alone offsets the costs. If you plan correctly."

Plan correctly to have 4 times our current salary? Interesting suggestion.

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By *ig1gaz1Man
over a year ago

bradford


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. "

these 2 vids provide more info

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kll-yYQwmuM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NvnOUcG-ZI

This is what all the mps in london want nhs turned into an americanised system.

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By *omerset1976Man
over a year ago

Burnham

Years of mismanagement, poor planning, bad decision making and no accountability

Can’t keep throwing money at something that needs a complete reset.

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By *ig1gaz1Man
over a year ago

bradford


"Years of mismanagement, poor planning, bad decision making and no accountability

Can’t keep throwing money at something that needs a complete reset."

its not that theres too many people at the top taking big wages for themselves.

management, accountants, admin staff per hospital.

now yes you need people to work out the costs and sort out whats needed to keep the hospitals running.

thats fair game but not paying extortion prices for this management its become gredy at the top within hospitals.

rightly so the staff at the lower end should be paid for there hard work and long hours why should that accountant be paid x3 or more than that nurse that does long hours and saves lives.

its 2 faced and an insult

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By *ehindHerEyesCouple
over a year ago

SomewhereOnlyWeKnow


"All these 'fundamental issues' were true back in 2010, when the NHS was the most efficient healthcare system in the world. Since then, 1 party has been in power, funding is massively down, and life exlectancy is dropping for the first time since the 19th century.

Restore the NATIONAL Health Service, stop private money stealing our taxes, get rid of ridiculous internal markets, fund it at inflation+4% as it was from 2000-2009, train and bring in enough staff, and it will turn round.

Oh - and fund councils properly, or better yet link social and health funding, so the 33% of beds blocked by frail but OK old people who need a home, not a hospital,can be freed. Because of this ONE issue, the NHS is running at only 66% effective capacity."

Our local authority has intervened and for this reason taken over several private care facilities in the area to try and free up beds from those that are there purely because they cannot afford private care and are waiting for NHS funded care homes

Tinder x

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By *irtysnapperMan
over a year ago

Bromsgrove

Deliberately so. Run it down, sell it off, make millions. Classic tory policy. The NHS was doing great in 2010. And now they’re trying to convince people privatisation is the way forward. Judging from this discussion, it’s working.

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By *irtysnapperMan
over a year ago

Bromsgrove


"It's been their plan all along. They have slowly been making the NHS unrecoverable so they can justify privatisation when the time comes. A private healthcare system is coming and the gap between the rich and the poor will become even more apparent.

This has nothing to do with immigration, people abusing the system or whatever narrative they are selling these days. It's broken and there's only one party to blame."

This.

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By *irtysnapperMan
over a year ago

Bromsgrove


"All these 'fundamental issues' were true back in 2010, when the NHS was the most efficient healthcare system in the world. Since then, 1 party has been in power, funding is massively down, and life exlectancy is dropping for the first time since the 19th century.

Restore the NATIONAL Health Service, stop private money stealing our taxes, get rid of ridiculous internal markets, fund it at inflation+4% as it was from 2000-2009, train and bring in enough staff, and it will turn round.

Oh - and fund councils properly, or better yet link social and health funding, so the 33% of beds blocked by frail but OK old people who need a home, not a hospital,can be freed. Because of this ONE issue, the NHS is running at only 66% effective capacity."

Spot on. Some people are blind to what’s been going on for the last 13 years. Murdoch has a lot to answer for.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. What is wrong with people wanting to manage their own healthcare instead of goverment ?

People will never "manage their own healthcare". You're either in the hands of the government or private businesses. yes you can you choose the level you want according to your needs. Have no issues with my private healthcare. Its has a HSA dental eye. Short term long term disability. To me its comparable to the NHS.Yes I have copays but my salary is 4 times higher compared to a person with the same profession there. That alone offsets the costs. If you plan correctly.

Plan correctly to have 4 times our current salary? Interesting suggestion. "
Hence why a lot of RN nurses are transferring here. Better salaries so they can plan better. We have a bunch here on H1 visas in my hospital. Explain your thoughts on why they are here.

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By *ehindHerEyesCouple
over a year ago

SomewhereOnlyWeKnow

In my line of work I see first hand how the NHS is under so much pressure, ops we refer for having 2 year+ waiting lists previously 6m max, simple procedures not being done as they're classed as cosmetic even if it causes a detriment to someone's life and having to pay for it to be done, or if lucky enough to manage to get a referral again 2 years+ to be seen. Urgent referrals that should be seen in 2 weeks taking months. The list goes on

(And this was happening pre covid before this affected it even more)

Tinder x

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By *ooking4othersMan
over a year ago

Here ...


"The number of patients paying for private treatment in the UK has risen by 39 per cent over the past two years -

patients are bypassing their own GP completely to beat lengthy waits for treatment.

Ambulances stacked outside EDs and patients receiving treatment in hospital corridors, as well as staff burnout and rates of pay failing to keep up with inflation.

I feel that we’re ominously approaching a two tier health system. Is it time to accept that the NHS has collapsed?

You stated people are bypassing their own GP's to beat lengthily waits !!

If you wish to go Private, You must first get a referral from your own GP

You approach your own GP doctor with your condition and if you want to go private you must first get a referral from your own NHS doctor. This is how it works.

I have had private medical cover for past 30 years and had various treatments and private operations but you still have to be referred by your nhs doctor."

You don't need an NHS Doctor to refer you ... I have BUPA and I have 24/7 access to GP's, Nurses, Pharmacists and others all of whom can refer me for private care if needed.

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By *oxy jWoman
over a year ago

somerset

the problem with the nhs is money management alot of the problems of today were seeded by the blair/brown goverments as much as these in power today ..

the money is there its just being spent in the wrong areas ..

also agency is killing the nhs and social care

#justmyopinion

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. What is wrong with people wanting to manage their own healthcare instead of goverment ?

People will never "manage their own healthcare". You're either in the hands of the government or private businesses. yes you can you choose the level you want according to your needs. Have no issues with my private healthcare. Its has a HSA dental eye. Short term long term disability. To me its comparable to the NHS.Yes I have copays but my salary is 4 times higher compared to a person with the same profession there. That alone offsets the costs. If you plan correctly.

Plan correctly to have 4 times our current salary? Interesting suggestion. Hence why a lot of RN nurses are transferring here. Better salaries so they can plan better. We have a bunch here on H1 visas in my hospital. Explain your thoughts on why they are here. "
When hospitals here offering huge sign on bonuses to attract foreign healthcare professionals shouldn't the NHS do the same to keep retention?

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. What is wrong with people wanting to manage their own healthcare instead of goverment ?

People will never "manage their own healthcare". You're either in the hands of the government or private businesses. yes you can you choose the level you want according to your needs. Have no issues with my private healthcare. Its has a HSA dental eye. Short term long term disability. To me its comparable to the NHS.Yes I have copays but my salary is 4 times higher compared to a person with the same profession there. That alone offsets the costs. If you plan correctly.

Plan correctly to have 4 times our current salary? Interesting suggestion. Hence why a lot of RN nurses are transferring here. Better salaries so they can plan better. We have a bunch here on H1 visas in my hospital. Explain your thoughts on why they are here. "

I can't imagine having a worse healthcare system than the US. The NHS may be flawed but we don't have these stats to worry about:

The average age of a medical bankruptcy filer is 44.9 years old.

40% of Americans fear they won’t be able to afford health care in the upcoming year.

17% of adults with health care debt declared bankruptcy or lost their home because of it.

66.5% of bankruptcies are caused directly by medical expenses, making it the leading cause for bankruptcy.

As of April 2022, 14% of Americans with medical debt planned to declare bankruptcy later in the year because of it.

This is what the UK would be facing with a system akin to the US model, which seems a firm favourite idea of the Tory party.

A

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. What is wrong with people wanting to manage their own healthcare instead of goverment ?

People will never "manage their own healthcare". You're either in the hands of the government or private businesses. yes you can you choose the level you want according to your needs. Have no issues with my private healthcare. Its has a HSA dental eye. Short term long term disability. To me its comparable to the NHS.Yes I have copays but my salary is 4 times higher compared to a person with the same profession there. That alone offsets the costs. If you plan correctly.

Plan correctly to have 4 times our current salary? Interesting suggestion. Hence why a lot of RN nurses are transferring here. Better salaries so they can plan better. We have a bunch here on H1 visas in my hospital. Explain your thoughts on why they are here.

I can't imagine having a worse healthcare system than the US. The NHS may be flawed but we don't have these stats to worry about:

The average age of a medical bankruptcy filer is 44.9 years old.

40% of Americans fear they won’t be able to afford health care in the upcoming year.

17% of adults with health care debt declared bankruptcy or lost their home because of it.

66.5% of bankruptcies are caused directly by medical expenses, making it the leading cause for bankruptcy.

As of April 2022, 14% of Americans with medical debt planned to declare bankruptcy later in the year because of it.

This is what the UK would be facing with a system akin to the US model, which seems a firm favourite idea of the Tory party.

A"
Then raise taxes be more like Denmark's model. Cut peoples salaries even more to adjust for the costs and retention of healthcare professionals.

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By *ig1gaz1Man
over a year ago

bradford

if you was to go down the funding of the nhs instead of being gifted and sold to anyone.

Then its down to your data

Estimates suggest that, because of the unique position of the NHS, UK patient health data records could be worth £9.6 billion ($11.4 billion) a year to pharmaceutical and health tech companies.

you either say yes or you say no to the collection of your data.

there has been care data

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/aug/22/nhs-data-grab-on-hold-as-millions-opt-out

then came covid where many gifted away there data with no protection on there data.

The contracts show that the companies involved, including Faculty and Palantir, were originally granted intellectual property rights (including the creation of databases), and were allowed to train their models and profit off their unprecedented access to NHS data

info from this page cnbc

Britain gave Palantir access to sensitive medical records of Covid-19 patients in £1 deal

the register

UK government set to extract hospital data to Palantir system without patient consent

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/nov/13/controversial-360m-nhs-england-data-platform-lined-up-for-trump-backers-firm

since many provided there there covid injection data they now want your health records

over at foxglove

The government wants to collect the confidential health records of every GP patient in England and put them into one huge new data pool. It says “third parties” will be able to access this pool, including commercial companies, but won’t say who or how.

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By *agerMorganMan
over a year ago

Canvey Island

What doesn’t help is that GP’s are also encouraging those who can afford it to go private!

Both my GP’s said to go private, both at my expense (no insurance) and I can tell you now, it cost me £1.5k for each time I went private.

The NHS needs a deep review of its processes, spenditure etc, cut out the unnecessary spending on pointless back office staff and divert it to the front and on research and medical.

Has it flatlined? Not quite, but it’s in Resus fighting for its life and I feel it needs to be put out its misery and an updated system that’s fit for the 21st century brought in.

Private isn’t the way to go, and I personally vouch for that, but the difficult discussion about the NHS and it’s place in the 21st century needs to be had.

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"I really don't understand why it's a more appealing option to continue to pay what you already do for healthcare and then pay an additional fee to use private healthcare instead rather than just demand our government stop deliberately running the NHS into the ground. I can guarantee that if we shut down the NHS and all had to get private health insurance, they wouldn't lower your taxes in any way. You would just lose the service as well as the money. What is wrong with people wanting to manage their own healthcare instead of goverment ?

People will never "manage their own healthcare". You're either in the hands of the government or private businesses. yes you can you choose the level you want according to your needs. Have no issues with my private healthcare. Its has a HSA dental eye. Short term long term disability. To me its comparable to the NHS.Yes I have copays but my salary is 4 times higher compared to a person with the same profession there. That alone offsets the costs. If you plan correctly.

Plan correctly to have 4 times our current salary? Interesting suggestion. Hence why a lot of RN nurses are transferring here. Better salaries so they can plan better. We have a bunch here on H1 visas in my hospital. Explain your thoughts on why they are here.

I can't imagine having a worse healthcare system than the US. The NHS may be flawed but we don't have these stats to worry about:

The average age of a medical bankruptcy filer is 44.9 years old.

40% of Americans fear they won’t be able to afford health care in the upcoming year.

17% of adults with health care debt declared bankruptcy or lost their home because of it.

66.5% of bankruptcies are caused directly by medical expenses, making it the leading cause for bankruptcy.

As of April 2022, 14% of Americans with medical debt planned to declare bankruptcy later in the year because of it.

This is what the UK would be facing with a system akin to the US model, which seems a firm favourite idea of the Tory party.

A Then raise taxes be more like Denmark's model. Cut peoples salaries even more to adjust for the costs and retention of healthcare professionals."

But the Danish system is heavily funded by it's sovereign wealth fund. Which is obviously funded by oil. They weren't stupid enough to sell off their reserves to private investors. So that system can never be replicated.

As for raising taxes? That only works if you do it in the right places, which as has been repeatedly shown, doesn't happen with Tory governments. They've had ample opportunity to do so instead of driving years of austerity, grinding down wages and hitting the pocket of the average man on the street, yet still managing to generate tax cuts and huge profits for private companies, donors and the wealthy.

It's what brexit was designed to do.

A

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By *ig1gaz1Man
over a year ago

bradford

lets go down the drugs side of it.

to say uk is the leading part of drugs i cant see why we dont have an inhouse drug company.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jul/15/uk-drug-companies-fined-260m-overcharging-nhs

Extortionate increases in prices of 32 drugs a result of loophole in NHS pricing structure

they are using many peoples data nad yet we are being fleeced for it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The number of patients paying for private treatment in the UK has risen by 39 per cent over the past two years -

patients are bypassing their own GP completely to beat lengthy waits for treatment.

Ambulances stacked outside EDs and patients receiving treatment in hospital corridors, as well as staff burnout and rates of pay failing to keep up with inflation.

I feel that we’re ominously approaching a two tier health system. Is it time to accept that the NHS has collapsed?

You stated people are bypassing their own GP's to beat lengthily waits !!

If you wish to go Private, You must first get a referral from your own GP

You approach your own GP doctor with your condition and if you want to go private you must first get a referral from your own NHS doctor. This is how it works.

I have had private medical cover for past 30 years and had various treatments and private operations but you still have to be referred by your nhs doctor.

You don't need an NHS Doctor to refer you ... I have BUPA and I have 24/7 access to GP's, Nurses, Pharmacists and others all of whom can refer me for private care if needed."

Well that aint the case with any private cover I have been covered with including Bupa many years ago.

and certainly not the case with any spire hospital.

Plus all private operations and care is also reported back to your NHS doctor

All private hospitals I have used, usually the Murrayfield private hospital in Edinburgh and Shawfair Park request your NHS doctors details

I find it very strange you do not have NHS cover even if you dont use it, because private hospitals request this, including Bupa.

unless ofcourse you are talking shite.

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By *atricia ParnelWoman
over a year ago

In a town full of colours

Why is everyone so quick to jump on its just the government's fault...

We are also at fault and we need to take responsibility.

The amount of people being treated for

Obesity

Tobacco

Alcohol

Substance addiction

Is horrific

The missed appointments by people who can't be arsed to cancel is ridiculous

Just to name a few...

All are avoidable, we don't look after ourselves, we expect some one else to mop up afterwards

Just because it's free is no reason to misuse it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It’s a perfect scape goat . Underfund the NHS , watch it destroy itself and the White Knights of privatisation will ride into town .

Let’s not get things confused. The NHS has never been safe under the Tories .

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"Why is everyone so quick to jump on its just the government's fault...

We are also at fault and we need to take responsibility.

The amount of people being treated for

Obesity

Tobacco

Alcohol

Substance addiction

Is horrific

The missed appointments by people who can't be arsed to cancel is ridiculous

Just to name a few...

All are avoidable, we don't look after ourselves, we expect some one else to mop up afterwards

Just because it's free is no reason to misuse it."

Because the NHS would still be failing if no-one was obese, no-one smoked and no-one drank.

It is being critically underfunded, for which the government are to blame.

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By *lephantisMan
over a year ago

Oxford

Public health experts would not blame individuals for making poor lifestyle decisions, because they know those decisions take place against an appalling health environment which is enormously biased against poorer people.

Our country is far too car-focused, and there are far too many food deserts.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

By all the comments I'll stick with my private insurance and not be at the mercy of government controlled.Its much easier to switch insurance companies if dissatisfied. Can't always change who controls government.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It was bust years ago and needs to be dismantled but they’ll probably keep propping it up until todays casual obesity time-bomb finally explodes in 20 years or so.

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By *irexMan
over a year ago

Hertford

12 years of underfunding has taken its toll. Wasn’t there meant to be £350m a week invested in the system post Brexit, more lies from the government who are only interested in rewarding their sponsors including the private healthcare companies. The NHS saved my life 40 years ago, I’m sad that children today will die from the same disease because of this government.

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By *ornLordMan
over a year ago

Wiltshire and London


"It’s a perfect scape goat . Underfund the NHS , watch it destroy itself and the White Knights of privatisation will ride into town .

Let’s not get things confused. The NHS has never been safe under the Tories .

"

Exactly this.

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By *ornLordMan
over a year ago

Wiltshire and London


"12 years of underfunding has taken its toll. Wasn’t there meant to be £350m a week invested in the system post Brexit, more lies from the government who are only interested in rewarding their sponsors including the private healthcare companies. The NHS saved my life 40 years ago, I’m sad that children today will die from the same disease because of this government. "

Lying and lining their pockets and those of their cronies - pretty much all this government cares about. The NHS was always doomed as long as they stayed in power.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think so. I've been using a private physio for years. Recently I went to her for some back pain issues. She noticed some anomalies in my disc gaps in the lower spine.

Said I should see my GP to get a scan done. The GP wasn't interested. Only did a very casual visual and feel inspection and said i was it was normal.

Wanted to put me on pain killers. Which I refused, has the pain was only there when I tried to run, jump or lift something heavy. Not constant.

Said I didn't meet their criteria for a scan, has I was still mobile. When I suggested maybe I should go private, he seemed very happy.

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By *nnocentimesMan
over a year ago

over there by that tree

I fail to see how it’s underfunded….

£160 billion in funding every year, 45% of all government spending goes on the NHS.

The problem is that the money is completely mismanaged by the trusts.

While I don’t defend the the current shambles of a government, this isn’t just their problem. It’s everyone’s problem, from missed gp appointments to wasted trips to A&E to pissed up d*unks to cosmetic work being done.

The NHS was there to fix you if you were sick or broken, it’s now turned into something monstrous where everyone thinks their problem should be covered & if it’s not then they do a compo face to the papers saying how “outraged little Timmy can’t get a state of the art carbon blade for a leg at a cost of 100k” instead of an nhs 10k special that is nowhere near as trendy or athletic but would do the job.

If I was the government I would employ 3 of the top CEO’s & 2 accountancy firms to do a top to bottom audit - then cut the necrotic waste that’s devouring our NHS.

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By *riskynriskyCouple
over a year ago

Essex.

The NHS gets approximately £192 billion a year, hardly underfunded.

How about the mangers on £100k plus started taking some of the responsibility.

Any private industry and they would lose their jobs.

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"I fail to see how it’s underfunded….

£160 billion in funding every year, 45% of all government spending goes on the NHS.

The problem is that the money is completely mismanaged by the trusts.

While I don’t defend the the current shambles of a government, this isn’t just their problem. It’s everyone’s problem, from missed gp appointments to wasted trips to A&E to pissed up d*unks to cosmetic work being done.

The NHS was there to fix you if you were sick or broken, it’s now turned into something monstrous where everyone thinks their problem should be covered & if it’s not then they do a compo face to the papers saying how “outraged little Timmy can’t get a state of the art carbon blade for a leg at a cost of 100k” instead of an nhs 10k special that is nowhere near as trendy or athletic but would do the job.

If I was the government I would employ 3 of the top CEO’s & 2 accountancy firms to do a top to bottom audit - then cut the necrotic waste that’s devouring our NHS.

"

This government specifically broke up the NHS’ ability to purchase centrally, removing massive opportunities for savings.

They have no interest in audits, or the efficiency benefits they might find.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The plan was to financially break it and overload it.

Make it difficult for students to finance being a medical student.

Create a virus.

Place people in a fixed place

Let it brew for 2 to 3 years

Place a surge on death rates.

Create a shortage of staff.

Then release everybody and BANG.....

let's get private health companies to help out and make lodsa money.

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By *ove2pleaseseukMan
over a year ago

Hastings

Rebuild it

1. Look at assisted end of life.

2. Bring social care under the NHS trusts

3. Bring back free training and link it with 15 years of service.

4. In creace Bank / overtime rate to 1and a half.

All should help

The look at hospitals in sussex Hastings and Eastbourne are to old down grade both or scrap and build one in the middle would not be popular but would save money.

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"The NHS gets approximately £192 billion a year, hardly underfunded.

How about the mangers on £100k plus started taking some of the responsibility.

Any private industry and they would lose their jobs.

"

How about the government and MP's on £100k+ start taking responsibility?

In any private industry they would have lost their jobs long ago. Many of them aren't qualified to do the jobs they've been given anyway.

A

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By *nnocentimesMan
over a year ago

over there by that tree


"I fail to see how it’s underfunded….

£160 billion in funding every year, 45% of all government spending goes on the NHS.

The problem is that the money is completely mismanaged by the trusts.

While I don’t defend the the current shambles of a government, this isn’t just their problem. It’s everyone’s problem, from missed gp appointments to wasted trips to A&E to pissed up d*unks to cosmetic work being done.

The NHS was there to fix you if you were sick or broken, it’s now turned into something monstrous where everyone thinks their problem should be covered & if it’s not then they do a compo face to the papers saying how “outraged little Timmy can’t get a state of the art carbon blade for a leg at a cost of 100k” instead of an nhs 10k special that is nowhere near as trendy or athletic but would do the job.

If I was the government I would employ 3 of the top CEO’s & 2 accountancy firms to do a top to bottom audit - then cut the necrotic waste that’s devouring our NHS.

This government specifically broke up the NHS’ ability to purchase centrally, removing massive opportunities for savings.

They have no interest in audits, or the efficiency benefits they might find."

No that’s no correct - the trusts asked for more autonomy over what they spent their money on.

They can’t have it both ways.

The government CAN’T do anything as any changes will be seen by those who have the NHS on this god tier pedestal as selling off.

Can’t audit - selling off

Can’t mandate changes - selling off

It’s a massive poisoned chalice now that will never be able to be changed, not even labour will be able to steer the ship right.

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By *icolerobbieCouple
over a year ago

walsall

We will be alright, Elizabeth Holmes’s will be out of prison soon, we can put her in charge.

She’s probably more ethical than the shower in charge at the minute anyway.

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By *nnocentimesMan
over a year ago

over there by that tree


"The NHS gets approximately £192 billion a year, hardly underfunded.

How about the mangers on £100k plus started taking some of the responsibility.

Any private industry and they would lose their jobs.

How about the government and MP's on £100k+ start taking responsibility?

In any private industry they would have lost their jobs long ago. Many of them aren't qualified to do the jobs they've been given anyway.

A"

Absolutely this 100%

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By *irexMan
over a year ago

Hertford

Interesting that the funding went up from £160bn a year to £192bn in the space of 2 posts showing that figures are being plucked from thin air! I’m not progressing to know the real figure and the whole solution but NHS was working okay in 2010, what changed?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Interesting that the funding went up from £160bn a year to £192bn in the space of 2 posts showing that figures are being plucked from thin air! I’m not progressing to know the real figure and the whole solution but NHS was working okay in 2010, what changed? "
A pandemic.

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By *riskynriskyCouple
over a year ago

Essex.


"The NHS gets approximately £192 billion a year, hardly underfunded.

How about the mangers on £100k plus started taking some of the responsibility.

Any private industry and they would lose their jobs.

How about the government and MP's on £100k+ start taking responsibility?

In any private industry they would have lost their jobs long ago. Many of them aren't qualified to do the jobs they've been given anyway.

A"

MPs don't run the NHS.

MPs are voted in by the public, they arethen aided by researchers and then if they get a role in Cabinet they have advisers.

They then act on the advice given but obviously the advice given may reflect the political beliefs of the advisor not the MP.

Secondly most NHS hospitals are run by trusts with no direct input from the government.

I hope this helps.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The NHS gets approximately £192 billion a year, hardly underfunded.

How about the mangers on £100k plus started taking some of the responsibility.

Any private industry and they would lose their jobs.

How about the government and MP's on £100k+ start taking responsibility?

In any private industry they would have lost their jobs long ago. Many of them aren't qualified to do the jobs they've been given anyway.

A

MPs don't run the NHS.

MPs are voted in by the public, they arethen aided by researchers and then if they get a role in Cabinet they have advisers.

They then act on the advice given but obviously the advice given may reflect the political beliefs of the advisor not the MP.

Secondly most NHS hospitals are run by trusts with no direct input from the government.

I hope this helps."

Think it's bye bye this week... although I'm betting national insurance will still be taken

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"The NHS gets approximately £192 billion a year, hardly underfunded.

How about the mangers on £100k plus started taking some of the responsibility.

Any private industry and they would lose their jobs.

How about the government and MP's on £100k+ start taking responsibility?

In any private industry they would have lost their jobs long ago. Many of them aren't qualified to do the jobs they've been given anyway.

A

MPs don't run the NHS.

MPs are voted in by the public, they arethen aided by researchers and then if they get a role in Cabinet they have advisers.

They then act on the advice given but obviously the advice given may reflect the political beliefs of the advisor not the MP.

Secondly most NHS hospitals are run by trusts with no direct input from the government.

I hope this helps."

I'm pretty sure the government sets health policy, budgets and as seen during the pandemic, also likes to decide who gets billions of taxpayer money for healthcare related projects.

So yes.

The government does run the NHS.

A

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"The NHS gets approximately £192 billion a year, hardly underfunded.

How about the mangers on £100k plus started taking some of the responsibility.

Any private industry and they would lose their jobs.

How about the government and MP's on £100k+ start taking responsibility?

In any private industry they would have lost their jobs long ago. Many of them aren't qualified to do the jobs they've been given anyway.

A

MPs don't run the NHS.

MPs are voted in by the public, they arethen aided by researchers and then if they get a role in Cabinet they have advisers.

They then act on the advice given but obviously the advice given may reflect the political beliefs of the advisor not the MP.

Secondly most NHS hospitals are run by trusts with no direct input from the government.

I hope this helps.

I'm pretty sure the government sets health policy, budgets and as seen during the pandemic, also likes to decide who gets billions of taxpayer money for healthcare related projects.

So yes.

The government does run the NHS.

A"

And nearly forgot.

Decides how many new hospitals will be built.

Pretty sure they fibbed about that number though, but hey.......

A

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By *idnight RamblerMan
over a year ago

Pershore

As for private companies making a profit so what? That's how business works. On their profits (if any), companies must pay corporation tax and shareholders will pay dividend tax, the remainder is available for research of new drugs, technology etc and investment in new plant and machinery.

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By *irexMan
over a year ago

Hertford


"Interesting that the funding went up from £160bn a year to £192bn in the space of 2 posts showing that figures are being plucked from thin air! I’m not progressing to know the real figure and the whole solution but NHS was working okay in 2010, what changed? A pandemic."

An excuse, it was going downhill before then and some outrageously bad government decisions hastened its demise Still no sign of that £350m p/w written on the side of the bus.

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne


"Very simple: if you earn over £40k you have to pay full whack as a private patient! No ifs or buts! If you don’t earn anything but have a house worth more than £500k you are forced to sell it in order to fund your care.

The NHS should only provide free care for people who will actually struggle to pay.

Otherwise, pay!

Then we should be able to pay doctors and nurses properly. Every doctor in the country should be on a minimum salary of £500k and every nurse on a minimum salary of £200k.

Also put up taxes to screw more money out of the private sector! It’s far too rich!

poes law here ... I can tell if you are serious. "

Actually I’m deadly serious!

The only problem in the NHS is lack of money. Every person involved in the NHS should have 4 or 5 times their current salary. Only let it be free to those that really can’t afford it and screw the money out of the rest of the population. We shouldn’t be funding the NHS in the billions but in the trillions! Money is what if needs! If the NHS swallows up 50% of GDP we might start seeing a slight improvement!

What we need is a government which sees healthcare as the biggest priority in the country, far more important than stupid vanity projects like road or rail infrastructure or financial prudence. All that matters is that we have a healthy nation!

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By *irkby coupleCouple
over a year ago

Kirkby

The next council area to me have their hospital run by Virgin Health and it’s great. If we need anything we go there, 20 mins 1 direction to a NHS hospital or 20 mins in the opposite direction for a virgin health hospital that is better in every way and still free to use, but probably better managed.

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.


"The next council area to me have their hospital run by Virgin Health and it’s great. If we need anything we go there, 20 mins 1 direction to a NHS hospital or 20 mins in the opposite direction for a virgin health hospital that is better in every way and still free to use, but probably better managed. "

I do wonder if that's the way forward.

Have hospitals funded and staffed by NHS staff but run by private management who are there to make it easier and more productive.

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne


"The next council area to me have their hospital run by Virgin Health and it’s great. If we need anything we go there, 20 mins 1 direction to a NHS hospital or 20 mins in the opposite direction for a virgin health hospital that is better in every way and still free to use, but probably better managed. "

The irony: swingers treated by Virgin Health!

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By *irkby coupleCouple
over a year ago

Kirkby


"The irony: swingers treated by Virgin Health! "

I’m not a site supporter so I can’t do a laughing face, so wrote this instead

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By *irkby coupleCouple
over a year ago

Kirkby


"The next council area to me have their hospital run by Virgin Health and it’s great. If we need anything we go there, 20 mins 1 direction to a NHS hospital or 20 mins in the opposite direction for a virgin health hospital that is better in every way and still free to use, but probably better managed.

I do wonder if that's the way forward.

Have hospitals funded and staffed by NHS staff but run by private management who are there to make it easier and more productive.

"

My local NHS walk in is a disgrace. I’d guess they all got used to doing nothing during covid and now they are back at work, they only work to 50% capacity.

My daughter broke her hand (fighting in school) we went the walk in and was told to phone up someone else for an appointment. I asked why can’t you give us an appointment, I don’t know know if there is any available. To which I said your sat in front of a computer, you can look, then I was asked to leave.

Personally I think the NHS is a joke, yeah people are over worked, but I can imagine there are loads of free loaders not making the job any easier for the workers.

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By *ed MartinMan
over a year ago

Shefford

Make no mistake, the NHS has not died; it has been deliberately killed.

Anybody who thinks that letting even the smallest part of it be privatised should speak to an American diabetic and find out what it means to have to find a whole extra mortgage payment sized amount of cash just to find the insulin they literally rely on to stay alive.

Under privatised health care, just getting knocked off your pushbike will result in a £2k ambulance ride, being prescribed Paracetamol as pain relief is billed at more than £10 per tablet and if you want your cancer treated, you’d better have a spare £500,000. Be careful what you wish for.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Make no mistake, the NHS has not died; it has been deliberately killed.

Anybody who thinks that letting even the smallest part of it be privatised should speak to an American diabetic and find out what it means to have to find a whole extra mortgage payment sized amount of cash just to find the insulin they literally rely on to stay alive.

Under privatised health care, just getting knocked off your pushbike will result in a £2k ambulance ride, being prescribed Paracetamol as pain relief is billed at more than £10 per tablet and if you want your cancer treated, you’d better have a spare £500,000. Be careful what you wish for."

I guess you know most GPs have been private businesses since the NHS was founded ? Currently about 75% of GP practices are private companies which sell their services to the NHS.

Or that most European Health Services have much higher levels of private involvement and investment than in the UK ?

It's extraordinary that people believe the only alternative to the NHS is the US system, which no Government has ever even vaguely proposed here and which would be electoral suicide.

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By *uyForeLadiesMan
over a year ago

Grantham

Complete restructuring of the non-medical/non-operation management part of the NHS. Get rid of the pointless woke diversity consultants earning £100k+ a year for a start and take it from there.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"The next council area to me have their hospital run by Virgin Health and it’s great. If we need anything we go there, 20 mins 1 direction to a NHS hospital or 20 mins in the opposite direction for a virgin health hospital that is better in every way and still free to use, but probably better managed. "

Virgin Care hasn't existed for over a year. It was taken over by HCRG Care Group and if your location is accurate, this provider only provides very limited NHS services in West Lancashire - it does urgent care (aka Walk-in centres) and adult community care outside of hospital (e.g. district nurse services). It does not offer primary (GP) or secondary (hospital) care anywhere in the vicinity of Kirkby.

I would suggest what you can get from a private provider nearby is somewhat limited and you certainly won't be getting any private provider putting you back together after a major accident, or dealing with a heart attack or having you see any kind of specialist hospital consultant.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"Complete restructuring of the non-medical/non-operation management part of the NHS. Get rid of the pointless woke diversity consultants earning £100k+ a year for a start and take it from there."

How many of those work in the NHS?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The next council area to me have their hospital run by Virgin Health and it’s great. If we need anything we go there, 20 mins 1 direction to a NHS hospital or 20 mins in the opposite direction for a virgin health hospital that is better in every way and still free to use, but probably better managed.

Virgin Care hasn't existed for over a year. It was taken over by HCRG Care Group and if your location is accurate, this provider only provides very limited NHS services in West Lancashire - it does urgent care (aka Walk-in centres) and adult community care outside of hospital (e.g. district nurse services). It does not offer primary (GP) or secondary (hospital) care anywhere in the vicinity of Kirkby.

I would suggest what you can get from a private provider nearby is somewhat limited and you certainly won't be getting any private provider putting you back together after a major accident, or dealing with a heart attack or having you see any kind of specialist hospital consultant."

The mission statement and objectives of the NHS were defined in 1948. It’s time to overhaul the delivery of health care in line with an aging population advances in medical science and the requirements of the end user.

It would not be unreasonable to give tax incentives to those who procured private health care insurance policies. A nominal payment of £30 to see a GP or for all to contribute to primary prescription costs.

It’s no longer an option to throw more cash at a broken system. Times change!

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"The next council area to me have their hospital run by Virgin Health and it’s great. If we need anything we go there, 20 mins 1 direction to a NHS hospital or 20 mins in the opposite direction for a virgin health hospital that is better in every way and still free to use, but probably better managed.

Virgin Care hasn't existed for over a year. It was taken over by HCRG Care Group and if your location is accurate, this provider only provides very limited NHS services in West Lancashire - it does urgent care (aka Walk-in centres) and adult community care outside of hospital (e.g. district nurse services). It does not offer primary (GP) or secondary (hospital) care anywhere in the vicinity of Kirkby.

I would suggest what you can get from a private provider nearby is somewhat limited and you certainly won't be getting any private provider putting you back together after a major accident, or dealing with a heart attack or having you see any kind of specialist hospital consultant.

The mission statement and objectives of the NHS were defined in 1948. It’s time to overhaul the delivery of health care in line with an aging population advances in medical science and the requirements of the end user.

It would not be unreasonable to give tax incentives to those who procured private health care insurance policies. A nominal payment of £30 to see a GP or for all to contribute to primary prescription costs.

It’s no longer an option to throw more cash at a broken system. Times change!"

All that will do is exacerbate existing health inequalities. You reference £30 for a GP visit like it's no money at all. For many Brits, that's way beyond their means and would simply mean they didn't access healthcare at all.

The NHS was doomed from it's very conception. The doctors who are the key asset (family doctors/GPs and consultants) were largely unwilling to join the "new" NHS in 1947, necessitating a complete rethink on the contracts. This left far less money available than had been planned and by the 1950s, there were already massive staff shortages, shortages of equipment and decaying premises. Why do you think we needed to import so many doctors and nurses from Commonwealth countries in the post war period?

There's a very insightful BBC programme from 1955, which shows the issues at that time, most of which sound pretty contemporary. I would strongly recommend anyone who thinks the NHS has ever been well funded/planned watches it.

Here's the programme on YouTube: https://youtu.be/umxGpX0uOxA

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By *wingfellowMan
over a year ago

my own little sanctuary

Like most things OP it’s my belief that one of the biggest fundamental issues is mismanagement.

The majority of nhs staff are on a truly shit salary for the work they do. Because they aren’t given a fair wage they end up leaving the NHS and some will then become agency staff. So the nhs is then further short staffed and will turn to the agency to get cover, costing more money for the same people to step back into the hospital and do the same job. Only difference being is now there’s third parties taking a cut too!

Why not just increase wages in the first place?

I’m sure the issue is far more complex, but if something so blatant happens so frequently what else is being unnecessarily outsourced to benefit someone’s personal wealth when it needn’t be?

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By *irkby coupleCouple
over a year ago

Kirkby


"The next council area to me have their hospital run by Virgin Health and it’s great. If we need anything we go there, 20 mins 1 direction to a NHS hospital or 20 mins in the opposite direction for a virgin health hospital that is better in every way and still free to use, but probably better managed.

Virgin Care hasn't existed for over a year. It was taken over by HCRG Care Group and if your location is accurate, this provider only provides very limited NHS services in West Lancashire - it does urgent care (aka Walk-in centres) and adult community care outside of hospital (e.g. district nurse services). It does not offer primary (GP) or secondary (hospital) care anywhere in the vicinity of Kirkby.

I would suggest what you can get from a private provider nearby is somewhat limited and you certainly won't be getting any private provider putting you back together after a major accident, or dealing with a heart attack or having you see any kind of specialist hospital consultant."

Ormskirk hospital is a 20 minute drive from Kirkby. They have an A&E for kids, we have been loads of times. I have only used the walk centre myself and had far better service in a much quicker time then the pointless kirkby NHS walk in centre.

I have seen the Virgin Health sign on the wall and assumed the whole hospital was run by them. If we need a walk in or a hospital for my daughter, it’s always Ormskirk, rather then fazakerly hospital or Kirkby walk in.

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By *irkby coupleCouple
over a year ago

Kirkby


"The next council area to me have their hospital run by Virgin Health and it’s great. If we need anything we go there, 20 mins 1 direction to a NHS hospital or 20 mins in the opposite direction for a virgin health hospital that is better in every way and still free to use, but probably better managed.

Virgin Care hasn't existed for over a year. It was taken over by HCRG Care Group and if your location is accurate, this provider only provides very limited NHS services in West Lancashire - it does urgent care (aka Walk-in centres) and adult community care outside of hospital (e.g. district nurse services). It does not offer primary (GP) or secondary (hospital) care anywhere in the vicinity of Kirkby.

I would suggest what you can get from a private provider nearby is somewhat limited and you certainly won't be getting any private provider putting you back together after a major accident, or dealing with a heart attack or having you see any kind of specialist hospital consultant.

The mission statement and objectives of the NHS were defined in 1948. It’s time to overhaul the delivery of health care in line with an aging population advances in medical science and the requirements of the end user.

It would not be unreasonable to give tax incentives to those who procured private health care insurance policies. A nominal payment of £30 to see a GP or for all to contribute to primary prescription costs.

It’s no longer an option to throw more cash at a broken system. Times change!

All that will do is exacerbate existing health inequalities. You reference £30 for a GP visit like it's no money at all. For many Brits, that's way beyond their means and would simply mean they didn't access healthcare at all.

The NHS was doomed from it's very conception. The doctors who are the key asset (family doctors/GPs and consultants) were largely unwilling to join the "new" NHS in 1947, necessitating a complete rethink on the contracts. This left far less money available than had been planned and by the 1950s, there were already massive staff shortages, shortages of equipment and decaying premises. Why do you think we needed to import so many doctors and nurses from Commonwealth countries in the post war period?

There's a very insightful BBC programme from 1955, which shows the issues at that time, most of which sound pretty contemporary. I would strongly recommend anyone who thinks the NHS has ever been well funded/planned watches it.

Here's the programme on YouTube: https://youtu.be/umxGpX0uOxA"

I’m at going to assume you know a lot about hospital’s, NHS and do on.

How would you fix it?

It’s easy for us outsiders to say what’s wrong, but as an insider, it would be good to hear your thoughts.

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By *dd_soxMan
over a year ago

Suffolk

We want a first class health system, but we don't want to pay for it...

I'm no fan of the government, but wasn't the increase in NI to help fund improvements?

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By *wingfellowMan
over a year ago

my own little sanctuary


"We want a first class health system, but we don't want to pay for it...

I'm no fan of the government, but wasn't the increase in NI to help fund improvements?"

Wait until you find out that road tax doesn’t go on roads, and electric vehicles are heavier and more damaging to the roads than combustion engine counterparts

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne

We just need to throw trillions of pounds at it! Every NHS worker should be made a millionaire by the state! We need to be funding the NHS by at least £250 trillion per year. Remove everyone’s income over £30k per year to fund it! No more millionaire bankers or politicians: you’re only route to wealth in this country is being an NHS worker! Even if you’re just a humble cleaner!

This country has its priorities wrong! I give you my three priorities for my governent: health, health and health!

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By *ooking4othersMan
over a year ago

Here ...


"

You don't need an NHS Doctor to refer you ... I have BUPA and I have 24/7 access to GP's, Nurses, Pharmacists and others all of whom can refer me for private care if needed.

Well that aint the case with any private cover I have been covered with including Bupa many years ago.

and certainly not the case with any spire hospital.

Plus all private operations and care is also reported back to your NHS doctor

All private hospitals I have used, usually the Murrayfield private hospital in Edinburgh and Shawfair Park request your NHS doctors details

I find it very strange you do not have NHS cover even if you dont use it, because private hospitals request this, including Bupa.

unless ofcourse you are talking shite.

"

No need to be rude or bring up topics I didn't refer to.

24/7 GP is provided by BUPA via Babylon ... https://www.bupa.co.uk/health/health-insurance/anytime-healthline

I have their app and have used it to talk, via video call, to a GP about my daughter who then referred her for an operation which was completed without any referral from her GP.

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By *uby StarCouple
over a year ago

Durham

One of the problems is local GP's insisting on doing consultations over the phone. It's ridiculous.

We have needed appointments several times for varying different health issues. Everytime we asked to see a doctor, everytime we had to have a phone consultation, every time the doctor ended the call by saying we needed to go in and see them in person. So that's time wasted in doing the phone call. It's doubling the work load.

Common sense needs to start being used.

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By *ellinever70Woman
over a year ago

Ayrshire


"One of the problems is local GP's insisting on doing consultations over the phone. It's ridiculous.

We have needed appointments several times for varying different health issues. Everytime we asked to see a doctor, everytime we had to have a phone consultation, every time the doctor ended the call by saying we needed to go in and see them in person. So that's time wasted in doing the phone call. It's doubling the work load.

Common sense needs to start being used."

Perhaps other phone consultations are negating the need for some patients visiting the surgery

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By *uby StarCouple
over a year ago

Durham


"One of the problems is local GP's insisting on doing consultations over the phone. It's ridiculous.

We have needed appointments several times for varying different health issues. Everytime we asked to see a doctor, everytime we had to have a phone consultation, every time the doctor ended the call by saying we needed to go in and see them in person. So that's time wasted in doing the phone call. It's doubling the work load.

Common sense needs to start being used.

Perhaps other phone consultations are negating the need for some patients visiting the surgery "

I can only go and my own personal family experience, and it works out that 100% of the time we need to see a GP.

That's 6 people. I can only assume on that high percentage that the same thing happens to many others.

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By *idnight RamblerMan
over a year ago

Pershore


"One of the problems is local GP's insisting on doing consultations over the phone. It's ridiculous.

We have needed appointments several times for varying different health issues. Everytime we asked to see a doctor, everytime we had to have a phone consultation, every time the doctor ended the call by saying we needed to go in and see them in person. So that's time wasted in doing the phone call. It's doubling the work load.

Common sense needs to start being used."

Agree, telephone diagnosing as gone on far too long and is becoming the norm. That said, can a GP diagnose much anyway? They have very few diagnostic tools at their immediate disposal. In other countries, Doctors are based in hospitals where immediate tests of urine, blood, MRI scans can support instant diagnosis and appropriate treatment.

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol

We’ve found phone consultations to be great - they’ve prevented the need for a GP visit on four occasions so far.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"We’ve found phone consultations to be great - they’ve prevented the need for a GP visit on four occasions so far."

Same. Blood test arranged in 24 hours rather than three weeks for GP then 24 hours - turnaround total of 72 hours for results. It's been a big improvement for me.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"We’ve found phone consultations to be great - they’ve prevented the need for a GP visit on four occasions so far.

Same. Blood test arranged in 24 hours rather than three weeks for GP then 24 hours - turnaround total of 72 hours for results. It's been a big improvement for me."

You can't book a blood test or GP consultation within 2 weeks at our surgery - be it telephone GP appts or in person. If you want to be seen sooner, you essentially need to be on death's door and persuade the receptionist that this is the case. Absolutely no chance of getting anything within a day or two.

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By *heVonMatterhornsCouple
over a year ago

Lincoln


"One of the problems is local GP's insisting on doing consultations over the phone. It's ridiculous.

We have needed appointments several times for varying different health issues. Everytime we asked to see a doctor, everytime we had to have a phone consultation, every time the doctor ended the call by saying we needed to go in and see them in person. So that's time wasted in doing the phone call. It's doubling the work load.

Common sense needs to start being used."

When I had a knee issue which got referred to physio, I had to have a phone consultation for them to "assess" me (Covid times)... I tried to point out how pointless that would be to the doctor and to the receptionist but that was how it's done apparently.

First thing the physio said on the phone was "I don't know why they've done this because I can't assess your knee over the phone, I'll book you in". So about three weeks of wasted time there

LvM

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"We’ve found phone consultations to be great - they’ve prevented the need for a GP visit on four occasions so far.

Same. Blood test arranged in 24 hours rather than three weeks for GP then 24 hours - turnaround total of 72 hours for results. It's been a big improvement for me.

You can't book a blood test or GP consultation within 2 weeks at our surgery - be it telephone GP appts or in person. If you want to be seen sooner, you essentially need to be on death's door and persuade the receptionist that this is the case. Absolutely no chance of getting anything within a day or two. "

Yeah. I'm sorry. I'm on the lucky side of the NHS lottery.

But before phone consultations, it would have been three weeks to see a doctor then another day or two for the blood test. With phone consultation, 2-3 days from enquiry to results

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The government has been preparing this for the privatisation of the NHS over many years. It has been systematically destroyed to persuade the public that the only way to save the NHS is to sell it off. It is a disgrace. Insurance will not cover you in the way the NHS has.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The government has been preparing this for the privatisation of the NHS over many years. It has been systematically destroyed to persuade the public that the only way to save the NHS is to sell it off. It is a disgrace. Insurance will not cover you in the way the NHS has."

So what’s your answer?

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

It's time to accept that the ruling party does not care about your health and life. And to make this clear and unacceptable

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?"

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *acey_RedWoman
over a year ago

Liverpool


"We’ve found phone consultations to be great - they’ve prevented the need for a GP visit on four occasions so far.

Same. Blood test arranged in 24 hours rather than three weeks for GP then 24 hours - turnaround total of 72 hours for results. It's been a big improvement for me.

You can't book a blood test or GP consultation within 2 weeks at our surgery - be it telephone GP appts or in person. If you want to be seen sooner, you essentially need to be on death's door and persuade the receptionist that this is the case. Absolutely no chance of getting anything within a day or two. "

For blood tests my GP just gives you the forms and we have a number of health centres where you can either take a ticket and sit and wait or book an appointment online.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My uncle had to wait around 8 hours for an ambulance. I can remember them turning up within 20 minutes before.

Why has it gone so bad!?

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By *acey_RedWoman
over a year ago

Liverpool


"My uncle had to wait around 8 hours for an ambulance. I can remember them turning up within 20 minutes before.

Why has it gone so bad!?"

I'm sorry to hear that. It's mostly because they decided to vastly reduce bed numbers in hospitals saying it would be picked up my community care (which doesn't make much sense and there's been zero investment in community care). That means that people who need admitting get stuck in A&E waiting for a bed so then A&E doesn't have space for people and that's when people end up waiting in ambulances outside which keeps the ambulances off the road. All this is compounded by staffing issues in both ambulance staff, A&E staff and ward staff.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *wingfellowMan
over a year ago

my own little sanctuary


"My uncle had to wait around 8 hours for an ambulance. I can remember them turning up within 20 minutes before.

Why has it gone so bad!?

I'm sorry to hear that. It's mostly because they decided to vastly reduce bed numbers in hospitals saying it would be picked up my community care (which doesn't make much sense and there's been zero investment in community care). That means that people who need admitting get stuck in A&E waiting for a bed so then A&E doesn't have space for people and that's when people end up waiting in ambulances outside which keeps the ambulances off the road. All this is compounded by staffing issues in both ambulance staff, A&E staff and ward staff. "

It’s bonkers some of the bright ideas that the higher ups come up with. My local hospital is having a multi million pound trauma centre being built… however, it no longer does surgeries at that hospital unless it’s via the trauma centre so as such a lot of the general surgeries are now done at other hospitals. This means that at times people are going to have to be transported via ambulance to another hospital to have surgery if it doesn’t fall within the parameters of the new trauma centre admissions.

It’s not solving problems as much as it’s just deferring them. The trauma centre will mean more ambulances are going to that hospital specifically, meaning less ambulance availability (especially for transfers) and as a result people waiting for simple operations will be stuck in hospital beds in the hospital awaiting transfer and there will be less turnover of patients in the hospital.

There may be some clever reasoning behind it but I’m just not seeing how it makes sense.

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?"

Of course! Nuclear weapons are pointless!

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A"

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"By all the comments I'll stick with my private insurance and not be at the mercy of government controlled.Its much easier to switch insurance companies if dissatisfied. Can't always change who controls government."

You can with a free election.

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By *JJ_6969Man
over a year ago

Aspull

The NHS isn't failing, it's BEING failed

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By *host63Man
over a year ago

Bedfont Feltham


"It's certainly time to fundamentally rethink our healthcare system for the 21st century. In it's present form, the NHS isn't fit for purpose and provides poor value for money. Provided we adhere to the principle of 'free at the point of need' I see no reason why provision cannot be broken down into smaller, efficient units. So what if some parts of healthcare are private? Who do we think develops drugs, designs scanners, manufactures dressings? Not the NHS!

Spot on

The trouble is the NHS is considered a sacred cow and to criticise it’s fundamental concept is a heresy.

Medicine has advanced so much since the inception of the NHS it’s been impossible for the service to keep pace with the advances and demand increases.

I can think of a prime example in my family. In 1966 my grandfather suffered a heart attack at 6am. The GP came out, diagnosed a heart attack and told him to rest in bed. 11 hours later he was dead. Nowadays he would have been rushed into hospital, had stents fitted and, in all probability, would have had another 20 years of life.

It’s a similar story with most illnesses. The trouble is these treatments have a financial cost and the current funding method does not work.

Of course that’s not all that’s wrong with the system, the care system is broken and I wonder how much of that is down to the breakdown of family support groups.

I don’t know what the answers are and if any one person says they do know the answer they are deluding themselves.

What is required is a Royal Commission to look at the future of health and social care provision in this country, a root and branch review ….. the question is will any political party have the balls to do it?"

My life was saved at the age of 4 when i caught meningitis I became deF hD hearing aids and then a cochlear implants when my residual hearing went at 33. Thus has helped me live a normal life work, learn to dance play music.

I have worked and lid my tax since I states work at 17. I am I e of many who the NHS has given a life to.

So you and your view can go fuck yourself. Say that even you need treatment and can't afford it snd trust me it's going to happen one day.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"My uncle had to wait around 8 hours for an ambulance. I can remember them turning up within 20 minutes before.

Why has it gone so bad!?

I'm sorry to hear that. It's mostly because they decided to vastly reduce bed numbers in hospitals saying it would be picked up my community care (which doesn't make much sense and there's been zero investment in community care). That means that people who need admitting get stuck in A&E waiting for a bed so then A&E doesn't have space for people and that's when people end up waiting in ambulances outside which keeps the ambulances off the road. All this is compounded by staffing issues in both ambulance staff, A&E staff and ward staff. "

Well whoever is running the show can see its not working. It should be sorted out ASAP.

But I think someone somewhere is benefiting from the circumstances financially. Their pockets come first and the health of the nation last.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne

The NHS is almost dead! It should be the one and only priority for the nation! Without good health we have no future as a country!

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By *ove2pleaseseukMan
over a year ago

Hastings


"We’ve found phone consultations to be great - they’ve prevented the need for a GP visit on four occasions so far.

Same. Blood test arranged in 24 hours rather than three weeks for GP then 24 hours - turnaround total of 72 hours for results. It's been a big improvement for me.

You can't book a blood test or GP consultation within 2 weeks at our surgery - be it telephone GP appts or in person. If you want to be seen sooner, you essentially need to be on death's door and persuade the receptionist that this is the case. Absolutely no chance of getting anything within a day or two. "

I don't even call my surgery 111 and go from there they trearge and sort it my surgery has to leave appointments for 111 so if you need one they allocate it.

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By *uby StarCouple
over a year ago

Durham


"One of the problems is local GP's insisting on doing consultations over the phone. It's ridiculous.

We have needed appointments several times for varying different health issues. Everytime we asked to see a doctor, everytime we had to have a phone consultation, every time the doctor ended the call by saying we needed to go in and see them in person. So that's time wasted in doing the phone call. It's doubling the work load.

Common sense needs to start being used.

When I had a knee issue which got referred to physio, I had to have a phone consultation for them to "assess" me (Covid times)... I tried to point out how pointless that would be to the doctor and to the receptionist but that was how it's done apparently.

First thing the physio said on the phone was "I don't know why they've done this because I can't assess your knee over the phone, I'll book you in". So about three weeks of wasted time there

LvM"

Madness isn't it.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!"

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Every time I go to collect medication from the chemist for my parents, they are a couple of medications short. There's always something missing.

They don't even do normag trays (cassette trays) anymore. I'm afraid my parents are going to kill them selves by taking each others tablets.

When I asked why they had stopped doing pre-sorted boxes the reply I had was..

"We haven't got time for anything like that anymore"

Ffs this is not acceptable at all.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A"
The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries."

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ove2pleaseseukMan
over a year ago

Hastings


"Every time I go to collect medication from the chemist for my parents, they are a couple of medications short. There's always something missing.

They don't even do normag trays (cassette trays) anymore. I'm afraid my parents are going to kill them selves by taking each others tablets.

When I asked why they had stopped doing pre-sorted boxes the reply I had was..

"We haven't got time for anything like that anymore"

Ffs this is not acceptable at all."

Sorry but a pharmacy is private not NHS charge pharmacy

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there."
Makes perfect sense. If you cut back on nukes who is going to be your umbrella?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there. Makes perfect sense. If you cut back on nukes who is going to be your umbrella? "

I rather think an umbrella will not be of much help in a nuclear exchange.

I really can’t be arsed reasoning with you as we are poles apart in terms of what we see as normal and sane behaviour.

But please don’t vote for trump again.........please!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"Every time I go to collect medication from the chemist for my parents, they are a couple of medications short. There's always something missing.

They don't even do normag trays (cassette trays) anymore. I'm afraid my parents are going to kill them selves by taking each others tablets.

When I asked why they had stopped doing pre-sorted boxes the reply I had was..

"We haven't got time for anything like that anymore"

Ffs this is not acceptable at all."

If the prescribing doctor specifies that cassette trays are required, they should do them. Failing that, you can get daily pill dispensers online, some with extra security features if needed.

My Dad has dementia but has to take different pills AM and PM. His are dispensed in daily blister packs.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"We’ve found phone consultations to be great - they’ve prevented the need for a GP visit on four occasions so far.

Same. Blood test arranged in 24 hours rather than three weeks for GP then 24 hours - turnaround total of 72 hours for results. It's been a big improvement for me.

You can't book a blood test or GP consultation within 2 weeks at our surgery - be it telephone GP appts or in person. If you want to be seen sooner, you essentially need to be on death's door and persuade the receptionist that this is the case. Absolutely no chance of getting anything within a day or two.

For blood tests my GP just gives you the forms and we have a number of health centres where you can either take a ticket and sit and wait or book an appointment online. "

We do not have this option here. You don't receive any kind of paperwork, the blood "forms" are on the computer and you have to have routine ones done at the GP. Anything more specialised might require a trip to the hospital but that's very rare. There's no taking a ticket and waiting or going beyond the GP surgery walls for bloods.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there. Makes perfect sense. If you cut back on nukes who is going to be your umbrella?

I rather think an umbrella will not be of much help in a nuclear exchange.

I really can’t be arsed reasoning with you as we are poles apart in terms of what we see as normal and sane behaviour.

But please don’t vote for trump again.........please!"

The USA is screwed whoever it votes for! The Nuclear deterrent has worked up till now but I don’t see it working for much longer. Putin will use nukes in just a matter of months, probably against every NATO country as he has the arsenal and the determination.

Our nuclear capability is so pathetic compared to his there is no point in it anymore! Put all the money into the NHS. Putin will blow us all up soon anyway so there’s honestly not a lot of point to much anyway!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Every time I go to collect medication from the chemist for my parents, they are a couple of medications short. There's always something missing.

They don't even do normag trays (cassette trays) anymore. I'm afraid my parents are going to kill them selves by taking each others tablets.

When I asked why they had stopped doing pre-sorted boxes the reply I had was..

"We haven't got time for anything like that anymore"

Ffs this is not acceptable at all.

Sorry but a pharmacy is private not NHS charge pharmacy "

Hospitals, pharmacies, doctors surgeries.. they've all gone down hill

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Every time I go to collect medication from the chemist for my parents, they are a couple of medications short. There's always something missing.

They don't even do normag trays (cassette trays) anymore. I'm afraid my parents are going to kill them selves by taking each others tablets.

When I asked why they had stopped doing pre-sorted boxes the reply I had was..

"We haven't got time for anything like that anymore"

Ffs this is not acceptable at all.

If the prescribing doctor specifies that cassette trays are required, they should do them. Failing that, you can get daily pill dispensers online, some with extra security features if needed.

My Dad has dementia but has to take different pills AM and PM. His are dispensed in daily blister packs. "

They have all stopped going them

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there. Makes perfect sense. If you cut back on nukes who is going to be your umbrella?

I rather think an umbrella will not be of much help in a nuclear exchange.

I really can’t be arsed reasoning with you as we are poles apart in terms of what we see as normal and sane behaviour.

But please don’t vote for trump again.........please!

The USA is screwed whoever it votes for! The Nuclear deterrent has worked up till now but I don’t see it working for much longer. Putin will use nukes in just a matter of months, probably against every NATO country as he has the arsenal and the determination.

Our nuclear capability is so pathetic compared to his there is no point in it anymore! Put all the money into the NHS. Putin will blow us all up soon anyway so there’s honestly not a lot of point to much anyway!"

Yes, but on the bright side........

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there. Makes perfect sense. If you cut back on nukes who is going to be your umbrella?

I rather think an umbrella will not be of much help in a nuclear exchange.

I really can’t be arsed reasoning with you as we are poles apart in terms of what we see as normal and sane behaviour.

But please don’t vote for trump again.........please!

The USA is screwed whoever it votes for! The Nuclear deterrent has worked up till now but I don’t see it working for much longer. Putin will use nukes in just a matter of months, probably against every NATO country as he has the arsenal and the determination.

Our nuclear capability is so pathetic compared to his there is no point in it anymore! Put all the money into the NHS. Putin will blow us all up soon anyway so there’s honestly not a lot of point to much anyway!

Yes, but on the bright side........"

Carl, smell the coffee… there is no bright side!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ove2pleaseseukMan
over a year ago

Hastings


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there. Makes perfect sense. If you cut back on nukes who is going to be your umbrella?

I rather think an umbrella will not be of much help in a nuclear exchange.

I really can’t be arsed reasoning with you as we are poles apart in terms of what we see as normal and sane behaviour.

But please don’t vote for trump again.........please!

The USA is screwed whoever it votes for! The Nuclear deterrent has worked up till now but I don’t see it working for much longer. Putin will use nukes in just a matter of months, probably against every NATO country as he has the arsenal and the determination.

Our nuclear capability is so pathetic compared to his there is no point in it anymore! Put all the money into the NHS. Putin will blow us all up soon anyway so there’s honestly not a lot of point to much anyway!

Yes, but on the bright side........"

On the bright side it will be warm for a bit

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there. Makes perfect sense. If you cut back on nukes who is going to be your umbrella?

I rather think an umbrella will not be of much help in a nuclear exchange.

I really can’t be arsed reasoning with you as we are poles apart in terms of what we see as normal and sane behaviour.

But please don’t vote for trump again.........please!

The USA is screwed whoever it votes for! The Nuclear deterrent has worked up till now but I don’t see it working for much longer. Putin will use nukes in just a matter of months, probably against every NATO country as he has the arsenal and the determination.

Our nuclear capability is so pathetic compared to his there is no point in it anymore! Put all the money into the NHS. Putin will blow us all up soon anyway so there’s honestly not a lot of point to much anyway!

Yes, but on the bright side........

On the bright side it will be warm for a bit "

That’s not the bright side… it’s global warming which threatens our existence! Try again!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there. Makes perfect sense. If you cut back on nukes who is going to be your umbrella?

I rather think an umbrella will not be of much help in a nuclear exchange.

I really can’t be arsed reasoning with you as we are poles apart in terms of what we see as normal and sane behaviour.

But please don’t vote for trump again.........please!"
aww trump made sense though america first. I seen the posts on the average UK thoughts on Americans. Well they are extremely enlightening.

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By *ixie BeanMan
over a year ago

Wallasey

Slightly irrelevant but one thing I'd say is the NHS need to stop ex-pats flying in to Britain just for the use of the NHS's free care and facilities only to get free treatment then disappear back to their foreign haunts (where they pay their taxes) and squirrel away their British earned savings.. just a thought .. I know plenty of people who fly in from abroad when they have medical situations or injuries that they don't want to pay medical fees for ..Spanish expats especially

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"Every time I go to collect medication from the chemist for my parents, they are a couple of medications short. There's always something missing.

They don't even do normag trays (cassette trays) anymore. I'm afraid my parents are going to kill them selves by taking each others tablets.

When I asked why they had stopped doing pre-sorted boxes the reply I had was..

"We haven't got time for anything like that anymore"

Ffs this is not acceptable at all.

If the prescribing doctor specifies that cassette trays are required, they should do them. Failing that, you can get daily pill dispensers online, some with extra security features if needed.

My Dad has dementia but has to take different pills AM and PM. His are dispensed in daily blister packs.

They have all stopped going them "

As I said, my Dad's medication is still dispensed in daily blister packs, this is prescribed by his doctor.

If for some reason, you cannot get the pharmacy to do it, then you or another family member can buy daily dispensing boxes online and can organise your parent's meds that way.

A pharmacy cannot ignore a GP prescription, so if your parents genuinely need medication to be dispensed in daily boxes, the GP can mandate this. Obviously, there would need to be a reason. In my Dad's case, the reason is dementia.

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By *ove2pleaseseukMan
over a year ago

Hastings


"Slightly irrelevant but one thing I'd say is the NHS need to stop ex-pats flying in to Britain just for the use of the NHS's free care and facilities only to get free treatment then disappear back to their foreign haunts (where they pay their taxes) and squirrel away their British earned savings.. just a thought .. I know plenty of people who fly in from abroad when they have medical situations or injuries that they don't want to pay medical fees for ..Spanish expats especially "

Healt tourists are a thing but ex is pats is different if they worked hear most of there life and paid tax. Surly more invited to someone how has never worked or a migrants coming in and only paid tax for a few months

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By *idnight RamblerMan
over a year ago

Pershore


"Slightly irrelevant but one thing I'd say is the NHS need to stop ex-pats flying in to Britain just for the use of the NHS's free care and facilities only to get free treatment then disappear back to their foreign haunts (where they pay their taxes) and squirrel away their British earned savings.. just a thought .. I know plenty of people who fly in from abroad when they have medical situations or injuries that they don't want to pay medical fees for ..Spanish expats especially

Healt tourists are a thing but ex is pats is different if they worked hear most of there life and paid tax. Surly more invited to someone how has never worked or a migrants coming in and only paid tax for a few months "

As a former ex-pat, I agree most do this. There is a rule for NHS entitlement (2 years I think), but it's never checked in my experience. On the other hand, most ex-pats either maintain NI payments and/or pay tax on residual savings, UK income, etc.

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By *ixie BeanMan
over a year ago

Wallasey


"Slightly irrelevant but one thing I'd say is the NHS need to stop ex-pats flying in to Britain just for the use of the NHS's free care and facilities only to get free treatment then disappear back to their foreign haunts (where they pay their taxes) and squirrel away their British earned savings.. just a thought .. I know plenty of people who fly in from abroad when they have medical situations or injuries that they don't want to pay medical fees for ..Spanish expats especially

Healt tourists are a thing but ex is pats is different if they worked hear most of there life and paid tax. Surly more invited to someone how has never worked or a migrants coming in and only paid tax for a few months

As a former ex-pat, I agree most do this. There is a rule for NHS entitlement (2 years I think), but it's never checked in my experience. On the other hand, most ex-pats either maintain NI payments and/or pay tax on residual savings, UK income, etc. "

I suppose that's fair enough . If you've contributed tax your entire working life to the NHS then it's totally understandable.but I think there's plenty of young people who haven't had the time to contribute as much who do this and also plenty of people who've never contributed because they've lived the majority of their lives working and paying tax abroad

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Every time I go to collect medication from the chemist for my parents, they are a couple of medications short. There's always something missing.

They don't even do normag trays (cassette trays) anymore. I'm afraid my parents are going to kill them selves by taking each others tablets.

When I asked why they had stopped doing pre-sorted boxes the reply I had was..

"We haven't got time for anything like that anymore"

Ffs this is not acceptable at all.

If the prescribing doctor specifies that cassette trays are required, they should do them. Failing that, you can get daily pill dispensers online, some with extra security features if needed.

My Dad has dementia but has to take different pills AM and PM. His are dispensed in daily blister packs.

They have all stopped going them

As I said, my Dad's medication is still dispensed in daily blister packs, this is prescribed by his doctor.

If for some reason, you cannot get the pharmacy to do it, then you or another family member can buy daily dispensing boxes online and can organise your parent's meds that way.

A pharmacy cannot ignore a GP prescription, so if your parents genuinely need medication to be dispensed in daily boxes, the GP can mandate this. Obviously, there would need to be a reason. In my Dad's case, the reason is dementia. "

I've tried. They can not get medication provided in daily boxes or whatever they're called. They stopped providing them for my parents when they moved house. I've inquired around all of the pharmacies and one said if I put their names down, they should be able yo get the meds provided in packs if someone else who is already getting them passes away and there are lots of people already infront of them on the waiting list.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"So would the forumites divert funding from our nuclear weapons program to the NHS?

Yes.

I'd also scrap HS2.

And ask Serco for a refund for the waste of space track and trace.

A

Yes, everything must be cut in order to fund the NHS. Downgrade all national security - it’s useless anyway, get rid of schools - education’s pointless, abolish the armed services, get rid of government altogether and just have one really well-funded NHS. The NHS should be given all the county’s assets because life without health is worthless!

Nope. And nobody has said that.

You only need a couple of nukes. The concept of MAD has meant no country has ever been stupid enough to launch one and we have this super special relationship with the USA (apparently) so they'll always look after us and the have loads of missiles.

HS2 is a pointless vanity project that's gone way over budget and has already had cuts made to planned routes. It's not good value for money for 99% of the population.

As for track and trace? I don't think that needs an explanation really does it.

A The USA should cut back on our defense spending and use it for the people not protecting other countries.

You are not making any sense. So nothing new there. Makes perfect sense. If you cut back on nukes who is going to be your umbrella?

I rather think an umbrella will not be of much help in a nuclear exchange.

I really can’t be arsed reasoning with you as we are poles apart in terms of what we see as normal and sane behaviour.

But please don’t vote for trump again.........please!"
. Trump 2024.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"Every time I go to collect medication from the chemist for my parents, they are a couple of medications short. There's always something missing.

They don't even do normag trays (cassette trays) anymore. I'm afraid my parents are going to kill them selves by taking each others tablets.

When I asked why they had stopped doing pre-sorted boxes the reply I had was..

"We haven't got time for anything like that anymore"

Ffs this is not acceptable at all.

If the prescribing doctor specifies that cassette trays are required, they should do them. Failing that, you can get daily pill dispensers online, some with extra security features if needed.

My Dad has dementia but has to take different pills AM and PM. His are dispensed in daily blister packs.

They have all stopped going them

As I said, my Dad's medication is still dispensed in daily blister packs, this is prescribed by his doctor.

If for some reason, you cannot get the pharmacy to do it, then you or another family member can buy daily dispensing boxes online and can organise your parent's meds that way.

A pharmacy cannot ignore a GP prescription, so if your parents genuinely need medication to be dispensed in daily boxes, the GP can mandate this. Obviously, there would need to be a reason. In my Dad's case, the reason is dementia.

I've tried. They can not get medication provided in daily boxes or whatever they're called. They stopped providing them for my parents when they moved house. I've inquired around all of the pharmacies and one said if I put their names down, they should be able yo get the meds provided in packs if someone else who is already getting them passes away and there are lots of people already infront of them on the waiting list. "

So if you're concerned about your parents taking the wrong meds, you can purchase (inexpensively) daily medicine dispenser pots and you or another family member can put them out on a weekly or monthly basis. Buy a different colour for each parent etc. Although again, if a doctor prescribes something to be dispensed specifically, a pharmacy cannot refuse or change the prescription. Speak with the doctor (not the pharmacy) about prescribing in blister packs.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes. Easier said than done.

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By *iamondsmiles.Woman
over a year ago

little house on the praire


"Every time I go to collect medication from the chemist for my parents, they are a couple of medications short. There's always something missing.

They don't even do normag trays (cassette trays) anymore. I'm afraid my parents are going to kill them selves by taking each others tablets.

When I asked why they had stopped doing pre-sorted boxes the reply I had was..

"We haven't got time for anything like that anymore"

Ffs this is not acceptable at all.

If the prescribing doctor specifies that cassette trays are required, they should do them. Failing that, you can get daily pill dispensers online, some with extra security features if needed.

My Dad has dementia but has to take different pills AM and PM. His are dispensed in daily blister packs.

They have all stopped going them

As I said, my Dad's medication is still dispensed in daily blister packs, this is prescribed by his doctor.

If for some reason, you cannot get the pharmacy to do it, then you or another family member can buy daily dispensing boxes online and can organise your parent's meds that way.

A pharmacy cannot ignore a GP prescription, so if your parents genuinely need medication to be dispensed in daily boxes, the GP can mandate this. Obviously, there would need to be a reason. In my Dad's case, the reason is dementia.

I've tried. They can not get medication provided in daily boxes or whatever they're called. They stopped providing them for my parents when they moved house. I've inquired around all of the pharmacies and one said if I put their names down, they should be able yo get the meds provided in packs if someone else who is already getting them passes away and there are lots of people already infront of them on the waiting list. "
zi get my medication in dosset boxes have done for years. They've never mentioned it stopping

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I just think that instead of all the NHS management getting their bonuses the money should be put back into the system all NHS should receive a payment for all the selfless work they do

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By *RANDMRSJAECouple
over a year ago

chester


"The number of patients paying for private treatment in the UK has risen by 39 per cent over the past two years -

patients are bypassing their own GP completely to beat lengthy waits for treatment.

Ambulances stacked outside EDs and patients receiving treatment in hospital corridors, as well as staff burnout and rates of pay failing to keep up with inflation.

I feel that we’re ominously approaching a two tier health system. Is it time to accept that the NHS has collapsed?

You stated people are bypassing their own GP's to beat lengthily waits !!

If you wish to go Private, You must first get a referral from your own GP

You approach your own GP doctor with your condition and if you want to go private you must first get a referral from your own NHS doctor. This is how it works.

I have had private medical cover for past 30 years and had various treatments and private operations but you still have to be referred by your nhs doctor.

You don't need an NHS Doctor to refer you ... I have BUPA and I have 24/7 access to GP's, Nurses, Pharmacists and others all of whom can refer me for private care if needed.

Well that aint the case with any private cover I have been covered with including Bupa many years ago.

and certainly not the case with any spire hospital.

Plus all private operations and care is also reported back to your NHS doctor

All private hospitals I have used, usually the Murrayfield private hospital in Edinburgh and Shawfair Park request your NHS doctors details

I find it very strange you do not have NHS cover even if you dont use it, because private hospitals request this, including Bupa.

unless ofcourse you are talking shite.

"

No, I have BUPA through work and the last treatment I had through them 3 years ago I wasted lots of time waiting for a GP appointment. You can self refer to BUPA, we are going through that process currently for my husband at the Spire (although self funding). There is no requirement for a GP referral

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I just think that instead of all the NHS management getting their bonuses the money should be put back into the system all NHS should receive a payment for all the selfless work they do "

I think all the doctors, nurses and cleaning staff would agree. Highly paid wasters.

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By *oeofsussexMan
over a year ago

Eastbourne


"I just think that instead of all the NHS management getting their bonuses the money should be put back into the system all NHS should receive a payment for all the selfless work they do

I think all the doctors, nurses and cleaning staff would agree. Highly paid wasters. "

Noooooo! Managers are essential in every walk of life! Every organisation has to have a team of bastards doing fuck all except keeping everybody else in their place!

Take away managers and no-one would do anything!

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By *queakyclean69erCouple
over a year ago

Torquay / Fleet


"All these 'fundamental issues' were true back in 2010, when the NHS was the most efficient healthcare system in the world. Since then, 1 party has been in power, funding is massively down, and life exlectancy is dropping for the first time since the 19th century.

Restore the NATIONAL Health Service, stop private money stealing our taxes, get rid of ridiculous internal markets, fund it at inflation+4% as it was from 2000-2009, train and bring in enough staff, and it will turn round.

Oh - and fund councils properly, or better yet link social and health funding, so the 33% of beds blocked by frail but OK old people who need a home, not a hospital,can be freed. Because of this ONE issue, the NHS is running at only 66% effective capacity."

Another party political broadcast from a labour voter!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The number of patients paying for private treatment in the UK has risen by 39 per cent over the past two years -

patients are bypassing their own GP completely to beat lengthy waits for treatment.

Ambulances stacked outside EDs and patients receiving treatment in hospital corridors, as well as staff burnout and rates of pay failing to keep up with inflation.

I feel that we’re ominously approaching a two tier health system. Is it time to accept that the NHS has collapsed?

You stated people are bypassing their own GP's to beat lengthily waits !!

If you wish to go Private, You must first get a referral from your own GP

You approach your own GP doctor with your condition and if you want to go private you must first get a referral from your own NHS doctor. This is how it works.

I have had private medical cover for past 30 years and had various treatments and private operations but you still have to be referred by your nhs doctor.

You don't need an NHS Doctor to refer you ... I have BUPA and I have 24/7 access to GP's, Nurses, Pharmacists and others all of whom can refer me for private care if needed.

Well that aint the case with any private cover I have been covered with including Bupa many years ago.

and certainly not the case with any spire hospital.

Plus all private operations and care is also reported back to your NHS doctor

All private hospitals I have used, usually the Murrayfield private hospital in Edinburgh and Shawfair Park request your NHS doctors details

I find it very strange you do not have NHS cover even if you dont use it, because private hospitals request this, including Bupa.

unless ofcourse you are talking shite.

No, I have BUPA through work and the last treatment I had through them 3 years ago I wasted lots of time waiting for a GP appointment. You can self refer to BUPA, we are going through that process currently for my husband at the Spire (although self funding). There is no requirement for a GP referral "

That must be a new thing with Bupa then as I have had private cover for past 30 years with various companies including Bupa.

When everyone thinks of private medical insurance they always tend to think of BUPA which is really a company of the past which makes me wonder how many actually have medical insurance on here or are just saying it.

Most oil companies for the North Sea initially started off with Bupa back in the 80's but most moved away from them.

I am presently with AXA PPP but even when I was with Bupa, the hospital and specialist insisted on a referral.

over past 30 years this has been using spire Murrayfield Hospital and Shawfair Park.

If you phone them up as a pay and go patient, they will still ask for a GP referral.

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"It's certainly time to fundamentally rethink our healthcare system for the 21st century. In it's present form, the NHS isn't fit for purpose and provides poor value for money. Provided we adhere to the principle of 'free at the point of need' I see no reason why provision cannot be broken down into smaller, efficient units. So what if some parts of healthcare are private? Who do we think develops drugs, designs scanners, manufactures dressings? Not the NHS!"

Exactly this. Something fit for today and tomorrow

. Not 50 years ago. And most importantly.. That actually works and saves love. Our nhs is dangerous right now.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The number of patients paying for private treatment in the UK has risen by 39 per cent over the past two years -

patients are bypassing their own GP completely to beat lengthy waits for treatment.

Ambulances stacked outside EDs and patients receiving treatment in hospital corridors, as well as staff burnout and rates of pay failing to keep up with inflation.

I feel that we’re ominously approaching a two tier health system. Is it time to accept that the NHS has collapsed?

You stated people are bypassing their own GP's to beat lengthily waits !!

If you wish to go Private, You must first get a referral from your own GP

You approach your own GP doctor with your condition and if you want to go private you must first get a referral from your own NHS doctor. This is how it works.

I have had private medical cover for past 30 years and had various treatments and private operations but you still have to be referred by your nhs doctor.

You don't need an NHS Doctor to refer you ... I have BUPA and I have 24/7 access to GP's, Nurses, Pharmacists and others all of whom can refer me for private care if needed.

Well that aint the case with any private cover I have been covered with including Bupa many years ago.

and certainly not the case with any spire hospital.

Plus all private operations and care is also reported back to your NHS doctor

All private hospitals I have used, usually the Murrayfield private hospital in Edinburgh and Shawfair Park request your NHS doctors details

I find it very strange you do not have NHS cover even if you dont use it, because private hospitals request this, including Bupa.

unless ofcourse you are talking shite.

No, I have BUPA through work and the last treatment I had through them 3 years ago I wasted lots of time waiting for a GP appointment. You can self refer to BUPA, we are going through that process currently for my husband at the Spire (although self funding). There is no requirement for a GP referral

That must be a new thing with Bupa then as I have had private cover for past 30 years with various companies including Bupa.

When everyone thinks of private medical insurance they always tend to think of BUPA which is really a company of the past which makes me wonder how many actually have medical insurance on here or are just saying it.

Most oil companies for the North Sea initially started off with Bupa back in the 80's but most moved away from them.

I am presently with AXA PPP but even when I was with Bupa, the hospital and specialist insisted on a referral.

over past 30 years this has been using spire Murrayfield Hospital and Shawfair Park.

If you phone them up as a pay and go patient, they will still ask for a GP referral."
bupa is still the largest. It's also a bit of a "hoover" company... So I wonder how many with comonay say Bupa when it isnt. For me it's always been BUPA and AXA PPP and any of the others (even Aviva) are newbies.

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